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CNN Crossfire
Bush Wins: Now What?
Aired November 03, 2004 - 16:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: CROSSFIRE. On the left, James Carville and Paul Begala; on the right, Robert Novak and Tucker Carlson.
In the CROSSFIRE: President Bush wins four more years, reelected after a cliffhanger in the Buckeye State. Where does he go from here?
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: America has spoken, and I'm humbled by the trust and the confidence of my fellow citizens.
ANNOUNCER: Senator Kerry concedes, unable to put enough blue on the map to unseat the incumbent.
SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: There won't be enough outstanding votes for us to be able to win Ohio. And, therefore, we cannot win this election.
ANNOUNCER: How did the president put together his big win?
Today on CROSSFIRE.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: Live from the George Washington University, Paul Begala and Tucker Carlson.
(APPLAUSE)
TUCKER CARLSON, CO-HOST: Welcome to the post-election CROSSFIRE.
If you're seeing red today, it is a good thing. President Bush wins the popular vote, the electoral vote, says he'll work to bring to America together. John Kerry, meanwhile, graciously conceded this afternoon. For a moment, though, it looked like we were heading for yet another 2000 Florida recount.
PAUL BEGALA, CO-HOST: But that was not to be. And for the first time in 16 years, a Republican actually got more votes than a Democrat running for president. And President Bush did so despite voters' anxiety about both the war in Iraq and the economy here at home, an impressive feat.
So, how will our president lead in his second term and how will the Democrats regroup? These issues and more in the CROSSFIRE today in our post-election summary. CARLSON: Well, as Paul just said, nobody has done it since 1988. The president wins reelection with a majority of the vote. It is a mandate. What will he do with it now?
For the answers to that and other things, we go to CNN's John King, who is at the White House.
John, I know it's a little early to ask questions like this, but what do you think President Bush is going to do with this mandate?
JOHN KING, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: The first thing he's going to do is rest, Tucker. The White House has said the president will try to relax the rest of the afternoon, after being up most of the night.
What will he do with the mandate? The first thing the president tried to do today is reach out to the other party, the Democrats. Mr. Bush ran a campaign that was aimed squarely at the Republican base. They say they proved that was the right campaign because of the record Republican turnout. But soon after Senator Kerry conceded, President Bush giving a speech -- you see here it here -- at the Ronald Reagan Building in Washington, saying that, in a second term, he needed, wanted, and very much would try to earn the support of Democrats.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: I want to speak to every person who voted for my opponent.
To make this nation stronger and better, I will need your support and I will work to earn it. I will do all I can do to deserve your trust.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: But make no mistake about it. This Bush administration will seek bipartisanship on its terms.
The vice president said the victory in the popular vote, the Republican gains in Congress made clear that this administration had a mandate. As the president promises to reach out to Democrats, he also is working on a second-term agenda that has a number of partisan collisions in it.
He promises tax simplification. The Democrats don't like his ideas. He has health care reform ideas the Democrats don't like. He promises to revamp Social Security. The Democrats say his plan would ruin Social Security, so a partisan flash point there. Even perhaps more so a partisan collision ahead, many senior Republicans, including in this White House, believe, within a matter of weeks, if not days, the chief justice of the United States Supreme Court could resign, so the president promising bipartisanship, working on a second-term agenda.
We'll see if, when the Congress convenes in January, all this talk of cooperation results in cooperation -- Tucker and Paul. BEGALA: Well, John, let me follow up with one thing. In addition to the potential vacancy on the Supreme Court, I know you're nosing around and harassing those good people working in the White House, the way you harassed me when I was worked there. And I'm sure you're finding a few of them dusting off their resumes. Any hints yet about shakeups either in the Cabinet or the senior White House staff, John?
KING: We expect wholesale changes, but not immediately. You will not have everyone turning in their resignations. Loyalty has been a trademark of this administration. Many senior staffers here at the White House have said it is time for them to move on. Many members of the Cabinet have signaled they plan to move on very early in a second term.
The chief of staff, Andy Card, will now try to organize all that, telling everybody, don't leave all at once. Let's do this together one at a time. So they do expect a lot of turnover. They just think it will happen in small doses, if you will, over the next two to three months, not all at once.
BEGALA: John King, covering the White House, one of the best in the business, thanks for your time, John.
Well, John Kerry today gave up any plans to challenge the vote in Ohio. And after calling President Bush to concede the race, Senator Kerry spoke to the faithful at Boston's Faneuil Hall this afternoon, saying that he had wished things had turned out a little differently.
Frank Buckley is now live in Boston with more on the Kerry concession.
Frank, what's the mood there, I guess pretty down?
FRANK BUCKLEY, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Oh, yes.
We just saw some of the campaign staffers walking by and saying goodbye to them, still very emotional, still very raw for the folks here on the Kerry side. That was the mood inside Faneuil Hall as well, as Senator Kerry and Senator Edwards came in to a standing ovation, a great deal of emotion in here today.
Senator Kerry calling for unity, asking President Bush to find common ground, to bring the nation together after this bitter campaign. Senator Kerry also explaining to his supporters here why he made the decision to call President Bush and to concede.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KERRY: I would not give up this fight if there was a chance that we would prevail. But it is now clear that even when all the provisional ballots are counted, which they will be, there won't be enough outstanding votes for us to be able to win Ohio. And, therefore, we cannot win this election.
(END VIDEO CLIP) BUCKLEY: And the campaign staffers given some insight, Paul, as to how the decision came down.
As you know, late in the day, the exit polling showing Senator Kerry in a very strong position. And then as Bob Shrum said to us a little while ago, it just sort of slid away slowly. And they were just shell-shocked at a certain point. Overnight, Senator Kerry finally got to bed sometime after 2:00 in the morning. There was a big meeting this morning with the lawyers at around 8:00.
They looked at Ohio. They finally presented the facts to Senator Kerry. We're told that the attorneys for the Kerry team wanted to challenge this, wanted to get into court this morning in Ohio, and Senator Kerry said, no, he didn't want to put the country through that. And a few minutes after that, he picked up the phone and called President Bush -- Paul.
BEGALA: CNN's Frank Buckley, as always, on top of the story -- thanks for joining us from Boston, Frank.
Well, the president won yesterday by successfully dividing the country on issues ranging from war and peace to gay rights and abortion. But now he says he wants to be a uniter. Sound familiar?
Today in the CROSSFIRE to debate the Bush second term and the Bush election victory, Republican consultant Tony Fabrizio, Democratic strategist Steve McMahon.
Gentlemen, good to see you.
(APPLAUSE)
(CROSSTALK)
CARLSON: Steve, condolences on the loss of Kerry -- Kerry's loss. Congratulations on the defeat of lawyers. That's a good thing for America, that they didn't enter into the process. Amen.
Tell me, what do you think happened? If there was ever a Republican incumbent who Democrats and some Republicans thought could be beaten, it was President Bush. And they thought Kerry was the man. He had the money. He didn't have -- Ralph Nader was not a factor. Why do you think Kerry lost?
STEVE MCMAHON, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Well, first of all, I think we ought to give credit where credit is due.
The Republicans, President Bush, Karl Rove, they ran a great campaign. It was disciplined. It was effective. The president was on message. And when you start off with the advantage of the incumbency at a time of war, and you run a good campaign, it's like a triple-play. It's very, very hard to overcome. And, you know, I think Senator Kerry ran a great campaign.
And particularly at the end, he was -- you know, he was tough and ferocious and he was out there. And I actually did think he was going to win. But you've got to give credit to President Bush.
CARLSON: But -- I agree with that.
But, on the other hand, the -- Kerry's case was, essentially, the country is out of control. George W. Bush has done real harm to our country, not just that he's not as good as he ought to be, but that he's actively bad. And it's a pretty straightforward message. And not enough people bought it in the end. Was that a failure of the messenger? Was it that the message isn't true? What do you think the problem was?
MCMAHON: Again, I think, certainly, the message is true.
I don't think you can measure it in terms of Kerry failing. The president is the president of the United States. Defeating an incumbent president, as Paul knows, is one of the most difficult things to do in politics. Defeating an incumbent president during a time of war is almost impossible. And when you put that together with the fact that they really did run a very good campaign -- I don't think they ran a particularly honest campaign.
I don't think that what Senator Kerry was saying was untrue at all. I think most people believed it. But they did a good job. And they got their vote out, partly by, you know, qualifying discriminatory ballot initiatives that go after gay people. But, you know, they did what they needed to do and they won.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: We are going to come back to that in just a second.
TONY FABRIZIO, REPUBLICAN CONSULTANT: Oh, wait a minute. I want to wipe the tears away from my eyes.
BEGALA: We appreciate your tears. First, congratulations to you and your party on really a remarkable victory.
FABRIZIO: Congratulations goes to the president and Karl Rove and his team.
BEGALA: It does, and it should, very good point. And it should. And they have my heartiest congratulations on a remarkable job.
And let me point out why I think it was so remarkable, is that Steve is right. No wartime incumbent president has ever been defeated. And that continues today. But I've -- very rarely, I can't think of a time that an incumbent president, particularly one in trouble, has succeeded while expanding turnout; 120 million ballots were cast in this election. And the president did a remarkable job of bringing more Republicans, people who have never voted before in the Republican side, to the polls.
Now, you know, there's a story that, at the Little Bighorn, Custer said, where did all those Indians come from? Well, just tell me, where did all those Republicans come from?
FABRIZIO: Well, they were always there.
I mean, I think one of the things, one of the great untold stories about this election so far is, you know, we spent a lot of time as, you know, the pundits, talking about all these new voters that the Democrats were registering. Well, they were the myth. The real new voters came from...
(CROSSTALK)
MCMAHON: ... campaign, too, by the way.
FABRIZIO: That's right.
The real new voters came from voters that were...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Well, turnout was up among Democrats and independents as well, but more so by Republicans, right?
FABRIZIO: Republicans matched voter for voter.
(CROSSTALK)
FABRIZIO: If you look at the 12 or 13 battleground states, turnout increased by five million voters. And that five million was split almost evenly Bush-Kerry votes.
And that was the key difference. In Florida alone, you had 900,000 more Bush voters and 500,000 more Kerry voters. Guess what? the president won Florida by 400,000 votes. They're no mystery here. They hid all of this, Karl and Mehlman and all of them, they said they had a turnout operation. They said it wasn't going to be second to anybody. And they said the voters were there.
And, you know, I was probably one of those people that kind of wasn't always believing that it was true. Now I'm a firm believer, because they did it, and they delivered, vote for vote.
BEGALA: Well put, Tony. Keep your seat.
And Steve, keep yours as well. We're going to come back for more.
And, of course, President Bush has earned four more years as our president in the White House. The question is, where will he lead our country and where will he take his party?
And then later, what do you think about the election results? We'll ask members of our audience here at George Washington University for their reaction.
Stay with us.
(APPLAUSE) ANNOUNCER: Join Carville, Begala, Carlson and Novak in the CROSSFIRE. For free tickets to CROSSFIRE at the George Washington University, call 202-994-8CNN or visit our Web site. Now you can step into the CROSSFIRE.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: A new term is a new opportunity to reach out to the whole nation. We have one country, one Constitution, and one future that binds us.
KERRY: Today, I hope that we can begin the healing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CARLSON: Welcome back.
Well, except for some urban areas on the coast, the United States is looking more and more like a one-party country, at least in national elections. Will a second Bush term build on that strength?
Still with us, Steve McMahon, Democratic strategist, and also Tony Fabrizio, a Republican consultant.
Steve, this is -- a there's a deeper problem here. I mean, Democrats have elected one Democratic president in the last quarter- century. And it seems to me, one of the main reasons is, Democrats have lost the South, with the exception for Florida. What's the plan for getting it back?
MCMAHON: Well, I don't think you can look at it geographically.
I think what you need to do is look at the individual voters and figure out what it is you want to do for them and how it is you communicate it most effectively. I mean, one of the reasons I think President Clinton was so successful is because he was willing to take a look at new ideas that didn't fit any kind of rigid party ideology. And, frankly, when President Bush was first elected, he appeared he was willing to do that, too.
CARLSON: But different regions have things in common culturally. Howard Dean, who you worked for, for a long time, said as much when he said, we need to win the guys in pickup trucks with the Confederate flag stickers.
MCMAHON: Right.
CARLSON: The idea that the Democratic Party cannot cede the entire South to the Republicans in national election after national election, every Democrat knows that. And I just want to know, do you have any idea how Democrats might win back, say, Alabama, Mississippi, South Carolina?
MCMAHON: Well, one of the things you can do is, you can do what Karl Rove just did, and you can identify your base voters who are going to turn out and vote Democratic, if they turn out at all, and then increase turnout.
The other thing you can do is, you can give them a reason to come and vote for Democratic candidates. And, frankly, it's probably a failing on our part, all of our part in the party, that we haven't adequately convinced them that their economic interests are aligned with the Democratic Party and not with the Republican Party.
And the president's done a very good job. Going around and giving away tax cuts to everybody and convincing middle-class voters that they got their share, if you can do it, is going to work for you. But, at some point, people are going to figure it out.
BEGALA: Let me ask the reverse challenge for President Bush. There are almost 60 million Americans who stood in line to vote against him, to reject him. And it really was about him. I suspect most of them did not love John Kerry.
And, as the Democrats are dead today in the South, the Republicans are dead on the West Coast. They're dead on the East Coast. So what does the president do now? It's his job. He's the president of the whole country. And he says today he wants to reunite us. I have to say, I think it's a load of horse hockey. I think he has no intention. I can't imagine a single issue on his agenda that he would really use to reunite the country.
Can you suggest one?
(APPLAUSE)
FABRIZIO: Yes, tax reform.
BEGALA: Democrats are for that?
FABRIZIO: Well, why wouldn't they be?
(CROSSTALK)
FABRIZIO: Why wouldn't the Democrats be getting rid of the IRS and making filing taxes simpler? Why wouldn't you be for that?
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
FABRIZIO: It's just common sense.
BEGALA: Is that all?
FABRIZIO: No, Social Security reform, protecting young workers.
BEGALA: So, basically, if Democrats come to the president's point of view, then that's cooperation. He's not going to move at all. He doesn't have to. He won. He has the right.
(CROSSTALK)
(APPLAUSE)
FABRIZIO: If the Democrats are going to stick to what obviously has been rejected, which is John Kerry's position of expanding the government to give everybody health care, instead of finding free market solutions, and expand the role of government in everybody's life, well, then no.
I think the problem the Democrats have is, is that one of the other untold stories in this election, as you look at states like New Jersey, you look at states like Michigan, you look at states like Pennsylvania and you see President Bush doing better in those states this past election than he did in other elections. So the Democrats should be looking over their shoulders at both coasts and watch the Republicans coming for them.
(APPLAUSE)
CARLSON: Steve, as you know, the issue cited more than any other by voters for why they went out to vote was moral values, sort of a catchall phrase.
It seems to me the Democratic position, the litmus test Democrats impose on the subject of abortion hurts Democrats in national races. Do you think there will be any move within your party to allow other voices, maybe voices that aren't as enthusiastic about legal abortion, to rise to the top of your party? Because they can't now, as you know.
MCMAHON: Well, I think -- I don't think that there's any natural impediment to them doing so.
Our party is a party of a big tent. The Republicans talk about it a lot. We actually...
CARLSON: That's not true on the subject, and you know it.
MCMAHON: Well, you know what? There are a lot of people in the Senate and in the House right now who, for instance, are -- have voted in favor of bans on partial-birth abortion.
There are still members of the Democratic Party in good standing. They still are supported by the party leadership. There's obviously a range of views in our party. There's a predominance on the side of pro-choice. But there's no litmus test.
CARLSON: OK.
Unfortunately, we're completely out of time. Thanks very much, Tony Fabrizio, Steve McMahon. Thank you.
(CROSSTALK)
CARLSON: Appreciate it.
Next, reaction to the president's reelection victory from those who voted for and even those who voted against him. We'll be right back.
(APPLAUSE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Wolf Blitzer, reporting from New York.
Coming up at the top of the hour, President Bush declares victory and gets ready for his second term in office. Why were the early exit polls so far off?
Defeats in races for the White House, the Senate and the House of Representatives. What's wrong with the Democratic Party? We'll ask House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi. Also, Democratic Senator Chris Dodd will announce on our program whether he will seek his party's leadership in the U.S. Senate.
And U.S. Marines in Iraq wait for the final assault order on Fallujah.
All those stories, much more, only minutes away on "WOLF BLITZER REPORTS."
Now back to CROSSFIRE.
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: Thank you, Wolf. Appreciate that update. We look forward to your show at the top of the hour.
But here on CROSSFIRE, time now for "Fireback." You -- 120 million of you spoke yesterday, but we're not tired of listening to you. Tell me what you think about the election.
Ma'am, first, tell me your name and where you're from.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My name is Angie (ph) and I'm from Hagerstown, Maryland.
And I'm very pleased with the outcome of the election, because I feel that President Bush has our best interests at heart, whereas I didn't feel that John Kerry did, so four more years.
BEGALA: What was the biggest reason you voted for President Bush?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because of the war on terror. I feel that he's very strong. And I didn't feel that John Kerry was as strong as President Bush on that issue.
CARLSON: Nice to hear a Maryland voter say that.
(LAUGHTER)
(CROSSTALK)
(APPLAUSE)
CARLSON: Thank you.
All right, next up, yes? Tell us your name and what you think.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hello. I'm Courtney (ph) from Eatonville, Washington.
And I'm scared about my future, and I feel betrayed by my country.
CARLSON: Betrayed by your country?
(APPLAUSE)
CARLSON: Why do you feel betrayed by your country? Yes, tell me why you feel betrayed by your country. The person you didn't vote for won. Why is that a betrayal?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, I just feel that -- well, obviously, we were lied to at beginning. And I don't understand how people can look past that and just let it go. Why wasn't it addressed more?
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: Well, Courtney, thanks. Strong feelings.
CARLSON: I hope you feel better, Courtney.
(LAUGHTER)
CARLSON: Everything's going to be OK.
All right, we'll take a break.
BEGALA: It may or may not be, but the system works.
CARLSON: Yes, it does work.
Then we'll ask, what really happened in this campaign? Paul and I, both acting on about 45 minutes of sleep apiece, we'll attempt to debate it anyway.
We'll be right back.
BEGALA: Consecutively.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(APPLAUSE)
CARLSON: Welcome back to CROSSFIRE. Paul and I haven't slept much, but that does not prevent us from having some pretty deep thoughts about the election. Paul, here's mine.
I hope that the fact that the president won the majority of the popular vote, something I was hoping for no matter who won, will lower the tone a little bit and the Michael Moore people and the George Soros -- I'm serious. I'm not trying to be mean, but the people who are comparing Bush to Hitler and all that will settle down a little bit, if only because they can't deny he's the legitimate president.
BEGALA: They can't. No one should deny he's the legitimate president once he's sworn in, in January.
But, no, I hope Democrats fight like hell for what they believe in.
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: So I don't have a problem with it. I want more fighting.
But I do owe the president and his team a personal congratulations. I have banged on him every day for four years. And I went on national television and confidently predicted that turnout would up and, because of that, Kerry would win by five points. I was off by 6.5. So...
CARLSON: Well, I have to say, I have to say...
BEGALA: But congratulations to the president, to Karl Rove, Mark McKinnon, Matthew Dowd, all my friends in that campaign. And they are my friends.
CARLSON: And you weren't the only one.
BEGALA: They did a great job.
CARLSON: I wouldn't vote for John Kerry if my life depended on it. But I thought he was going to...
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: You know what? It might have.
CARLSON: I thought he was going to win. I actually thought Kerry was going to win.
(CROSSTALK)
CARLSON: I assumed, as a lot of people who cover politics assume, that huge turnout hurts the incumbent, because they only people that motivated are ones who want a radical change. And that turned out to be wrong.
And, boy, it's an impressive win. It's a big win. I don't -- I'm so tired, it's hard to see how big it is. But, tomorrow, it will be clearer. BEGALA: No, that's the thing that is most interesting, is that the Republicans changed the composition of the electorate. The Democrats now will decide whether they want to do, I think, the stupid, easy thing and take potshots at John Kerry or his team, which is unhelpful, or really reassess.
CARLSON: But fun.
BEGALA: But fun.
But really reassess the party, which is what I hope the Democrats do, have a serious conversation...
(CROSSTALK)
CARLSON: But there ought to be a circular firing squad to sort of start it off.
(LAUGHTER)
BEGALA: From the left, I am Paul Begala. That's it for CROSSFIRE.
CARLSON: And from the right, I'm Tucker Carlson. Happy post- Election Day. We will see you tomorrow.
"WOLF BLITZER REPORTS" is right now.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
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Aired November 3, 2004 - 16:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: CROSSFIRE. On the left, James Carville and Paul Begala; on the right, Robert Novak and Tucker Carlson.
In the CROSSFIRE: President Bush wins four more years, reelected after a cliffhanger in the Buckeye State. Where does he go from here?
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: America has spoken, and I'm humbled by the trust and the confidence of my fellow citizens.
ANNOUNCER: Senator Kerry concedes, unable to put enough blue on the map to unseat the incumbent.
SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: There won't be enough outstanding votes for us to be able to win Ohio. And, therefore, we cannot win this election.
ANNOUNCER: How did the president put together his big win?
Today on CROSSFIRE.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: Live from the George Washington University, Paul Begala and Tucker Carlson.
(APPLAUSE)
TUCKER CARLSON, CO-HOST: Welcome to the post-election CROSSFIRE.
If you're seeing red today, it is a good thing. President Bush wins the popular vote, the electoral vote, says he'll work to bring to America together. John Kerry, meanwhile, graciously conceded this afternoon. For a moment, though, it looked like we were heading for yet another 2000 Florida recount.
PAUL BEGALA, CO-HOST: But that was not to be. And for the first time in 16 years, a Republican actually got more votes than a Democrat running for president. And President Bush did so despite voters' anxiety about both the war in Iraq and the economy here at home, an impressive feat.
So, how will our president lead in his second term and how will the Democrats regroup? These issues and more in the CROSSFIRE today in our post-election summary. CARLSON: Well, as Paul just said, nobody has done it since 1988. The president wins reelection with a majority of the vote. It is a mandate. What will he do with it now?
For the answers to that and other things, we go to CNN's John King, who is at the White House.
John, I know it's a little early to ask questions like this, but what do you think President Bush is going to do with this mandate?
JOHN KING, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: The first thing he's going to do is rest, Tucker. The White House has said the president will try to relax the rest of the afternoon, after being up most of the night.
What will he do with the mandate? The first thing the president tried to do today is reach out to the other party, the Democrats. Mr. Bush ran a campaign that was aimed squarely at the Republican base. They say they proved that was the right campaign because of the record Republican turnout. But soon after Senator Kerry conceded, President Bush giving a speech -- you see here it here -- at the Ronald Reagan Building in Washington, saying that, in a second term, he needed, wanted, and very much would try to earn the support of Democrats.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: I want to speak to every person who voted for my opponent.
To make this nation stronger and better, I will need your support and I will work to earn it. I will do all I can do to deserve your trust.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: But make no mistake about it. This Bush administration will seek bipartisanship on its terms.
The vice president said the victory in the popular vote, the Republican gains in Congress made clear that this administration had a mandate. As the president promises to reach out to Democrats, he also is working on a second-term agenda that has a number of partisan collisions in it.
He promises tax simplification. The Democrats don't like his ideas. He has health care reform ideas the Democrats don't like. He promises to revamp Social Security. The Democrats say his plan would ruin Social Security, so a partisan flash point there. Even perhaps more so a partisan collision ahead, many senior Republicans, including in this White House, believe, within a matter of weeks, if not days, the chief justice of the United States Supreme Court could resign, so the president promising bipartisanship, working on a second-term agenda.
We'll see if, when the Congress convenes in January, all this talk of cooperation results in cooperation -- Tucker and Paul. BEGALA: Well, John, let me follow up with one thing. In addition to the potential vacancy on the Supreme Court, I know you're nosing around and harassing those good people working in the White House, the way you harassed me when I was worked there. And I'm sure you're finding a few of them dusting off their resumes. Any hints yet about shakeups either in the Cabinet or the senior White House staff, John?
KING: We expect wholesale changes, but not immediately. You will not have everyone turning in their resignations. Loyalty has been a trademark of this administration. Many senior staffers here at the White House have said it is time for them to move on. Many members of the Cabinet have signaled they plan to move on very early in a second term.
The chief of staff, Andy Card, will now try to organize all that, telling everybody, don't leave all at once. Let's do this together one at a time. So they do expect a lot of turnover. They just think it will happen in small doses, if you will, over the next two to three months, not all at once.
BEGALA: John King, covering the White House, one of the best in the business, thanks for your time, John.
Well, John Kerry today gave up any plans to challenge the vote in Ohio. And after calling President Bush to concede the race, Senator Kerry spoke to the faithful at Boston's Faneuil Hall this afternoon, saying that he had wished things had turned out a little differently.
Frank Buckley is now live in Boston with more on the Kerry concession.
Frank, what's the mood there, I guess pretty down?
FRANK BUCKLEY, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Oh, yes.
We just saw some of the campaign staffers walking by and saying goodbye to them, still very emotional, still very raw for the folks here on the Kerry side. That was the mood inside Faneuil Hall as well, as Senator Kerry and Senator Edwards came in to a standing ovation, a great deal of emotion in here today.
Senator Kerry calling for unity, asking President Bush to find common ground, to bring the nation together after this bitter campaign. Senator Kerry also explaining to his supporters here why he made the decision to call President Bush and to concede.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KERRY: I would not give up this fight if there was a chance that we would prevail. But it is now clear that even when all the provisional ballots are counted, which they will be, there won't be enough outstanding votes for us to be able to win Ohio. And, therefore, we cannot win this election.
(END VIDEO CLIP) BUCKLEY: And the campaign staffers given some insight, Paul, as to how the decision came down.
As you know, late in the day, the exit polling showing Senator Kerry in a very strong position. And then as Bob Shrum said to us a little while ago, it just sort of slid away slowly. And they were just shell-shocked at a certain point. Overnight, Senator Kerry finally got to bed sometime after 2:00 in the morning. There was a big meeting this morning with the lawyers at around 8:00.
They looked at Ohio. They finally presented the facts to Senator Kerry. We're told that the attorneys for the Kerry team wanted to challenge this, wanted to get into court this morning in Ohio, and Senator Kerry said, no, he didn't want to put the country through that. And a few minutes after that, he picked up the phone and called President Bush -- Paul.
BEGALA: CNN's Frank Buckley, as always, on top of the story -- thanks for joining us from Boston, Frank.
Well, the president won yesterday by successfully dividing the country on issues ranging from war and peace to gay rights and abortion. But now he says he wants to be a uniter. Sound familiar?
Today in the CROSSFIRE to debate the Bush second term and the Bush election victory, Republican consultant Tony Fabrizio, Democratic strategist Steve McMahon.
Gentlemen, good to see you.
(APPLAUSE)
(CROSSTALK)
CARLSON: Steve, condolences on the loss of Kerry -- Kerry's loss. Congratulations on the defeat of lawyers. That's a good thing for America, that they didn't enter into the process. Amen.
Tell me, what do you think happened? If there was ever a Republican incumbent who Democrats and some Republicans thought could be beaten, it was President Bush. And they thought Kerry was the man. He had the money. He didn't have -- Ralph Nader was not a factor. Why do you think Kerry lost?
STEVE MCMAHON, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Well, first of all, I think we ought to give credit where credit is due.
The Republicans, President Bush, Karl Rove, they ran a great campaign. It was disciplined. It was effective. The president was on message. And when you start off with the advantage of the incumbency at a time of war, and you run a good campaign, it's like a triple-play. It's very, very hard to overcome. And, you know, I think Senator Kerry ran a great campaign.
And particularly at the end, he was -- you know, he was tough and ferocious and he was out there. And I actually did think he was going to win. But you've got to give credit to President Bush.
CARLSON: But -- I agree with that.
But, on the other hand, the -- Kerry's case was, essentially, the country is out of control. George W. Bush has done real harm to our country, not just that he's not as good as he ought to be, but that he's actively bad. And it's a pretty straightforward message. And not enough people bought it in the end. Was that a failure of the messenger? Was it that the message isn't true? What do you think the problem was?
MCMAHON: Again, I think, certainly, the message is true.
I don't think you can measure it in terms of Kerry failing. The president is the president of the United States. Defeating an incumbent president, as Paul knows, is one of the most difficult things to do in politics. Defeating an incumbent president during a time of war is almost impossible. And when you put that together with the fact that they really did run a very good campaign -- I don't think they ran a particularly honest campaign.
I don't think that what Senator Kerry was saying was untrue at all. I think most people believed it. But they did a good job. And they got their vote out, partly by, you know, qualifying discriminatory ballot initiatives that go after gay people. But, you know, they did what they needed to do and they won.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: We are going to come back to that in just a second.
TONY FABRIZIO, REPUBLICAN CONSULTANT: Oh, wait a minute. I want to wipe the tears away from my eyes.
BEGALA: We appreciate your tears. First, congratulations to you and your party on really a remarkable victory.
FABRIZIO: Congratulations goes to the president and Karl Rove and his team.
BEGALA: It does, and it should, very good point. And it should. And they have my heartiest congratulations on a remarkable job.
And let me point out why I think it was so remarkable, is that Steve is right. No wartime incumbent president has ever been defeated. And that continues today. But I've -- very rarely, I can't think of a time that an incumbent president, particularly one in trouble, has succeeded while expanding turnout; 120 million ballots were cast in this election. And the president did a remarkable job of bringing more Republicans, people who have never voted before in the Republican side, to the polls.
Now, you know, there's a story that, at the Little Bighorn, Custer said, where did all those Indians come from? Well, just tell me, where did all those Republicans come from?
FABRIZIO: Well, they were always there.
I mean, I think one of the things, one of the great untold stories about this election so far is, you know, we spent a lot of time as, you know, the pundits, talking about all these new voters that the Democrats were registering. Well, they were the myth. The real new voters came from...
(CROSSTALK)
MCMAHON: ... campaign, too, by the way.
FABRIZIO: That's right.
The real new voters came from voters that were...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Well, turnout was up among Democrats and independents as well, but more so by Republicans, right?
FABRIZIO: Republicans matched voter for voter.
(CROSSTALK)
FABRIZIO: If you look at the 12 or 13 battleground states, turnout increased by five million voters. And that five million was split almost evenly Bush-Kerry votes.
And that was the key difference. In Florida alone, you had 900,000 more Bush voters and 500,000 more Kerry voters. Guess what? the president won Florida by 400,000 votes. They're no mystery here. They hid all of this, Karl and Mehlman and all of them, they said they had a turnout operation. They said it wasn't going to be second to anybody. And they said the voters were there.
And, you know, I was probably one of those people that kind of wasn't always believing that it was true. Now I'm a firm believer, because they did it, and they delivered, vote for vote.
BEGALA: Well put, Tony. Keep your seat.
And Steve, keep yours as well. We're going to come back for more.
And, of course, President Bush has earned four more years as our president in the White House. The question is, where will he lead our country and where will he take his party?
And then later, what do you think about the election results? We'll ask members of our audience here at George Washington University for their reaction.
Stay with us.
(APPLAUSE) ANNOUNCER: Join Carville, Begala, Carlson and Novak in the CROSSFIRE. For free tickets to CROSSFIRE at the George Washington University, call 202-994-8CNN or visit our Web site. Now you can step into the CROSSFIRE.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: A new term is a new opportunity to reach out to the whole nation. We have one country, one Constitution, and one future that binds us.
KERRY: Today, I hope that we can begin the healing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CARLSON: Welcome back.
Well, except for some urban areas on the coast, the United States is looking more and more like a one-party country, at least in national elections. Will a second Bush term build on that strength?
Still with us, Steve McMahon, Democratic strategist, and also Tony Fabrizio, a Republican consultant.
Steve, this is -- a there's a deeper problem here. I mean, Democrats have elected one Democratic president in the last quarter- century. And it seems to me, one of the main reasons is, Democrats have lost the South, with the exception for Florida. What's the plan for getting it back?
MCMAHON: Well, I don't think you can look at it geographically.
I think what you need to do is look at the individual voters and figure out what it is you want to do for them and how it is you communicate it most effectively. I mean, one of the reasons I think President Clinton was so successful is because he was willing to take a look at new ideas that didn't fit any kind of rigid party ideology. And, frankly, when President Bush was first elected, he appeared he was willing to do that, too.
CARLSON: But different regions have things in common culturally. Howard Dean, who you worked for, for a long time, said as much when he said, we need to win the guys in pickup trucks with the Confederate flag stickers.
MCMAHON: Right.
CARLSON: The idea that the Democratic Party cannot cede the entire South to the Republicans in national election after national election, every Democrat knows that. And I just want to know, do you have any idea how Democrats might win back, say, Alabama, Mississippi, South Carolina?
MCMAHON: Well, one of the things you can do is, you can do what Karl Rove just did, and you can identify your base voters who are going to turn out and vote Democratic, if they turn out at all, and then increase turnout.
The other thing you can do is, you can give them a reason to come and vote for Democratic candidates. And, frankly, it's probably a failing on our part, all of our part in the party, that we haven't adequately convinced them that their economic interests are aligned with the Democratic Party and not with the Republican Party.
And the president's done a very good job. Going around and giving away tax cuts to everybody and convincing middle-class voters that they got their share, if you can do it, is going to work for you. But, at some point, people are going to figure it out.
BEGALA: Let me ask the reverse challenge for President Bush. There are almost 60 million Americans who stood in line to vote against him, to reject him. And it really was about him. I suspect most of them did not love John Kerry.
And, as the Democrats are dead today in the South, the Republicans are dead on the West Coast. They're dead on the East Coast. So what does the president do now? It's his job. He's the president of the whole country. And he says today he wants to reunite us. I have to say, I think it's a load of horse hockey. I think he has no intention. I can't imagine a single issue on his agenda that he would really use to reunite the country.
Can you suggest one?
(APPLAUSE)
FABRIZIO: Yes, tax reform.
BEGALA: Democrats are for that?
FABRIZIO: Well, why wouldn't they be?
(CROSSTALK)
FABRIZIO: Why wouldn't the Democrats be getting rid of the IRS and making filing taxes simpler? Why wouldn't you be for that?
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
FABRIZIO: It's just common sense.
BEGALA: Is that all?
FABRIZIO: No, Social Security reform, protecting young workers.
BEGALA: So, basically, if Democrats come to the president's point of view, then that's cooperation. He's not going to move at all. He doesn't have to. He won. He has the right.
(CROSSTALK)
(APPLAUSE)
FABRIZIO: If the Democrats are going to stick to what obviously has been rejected, which is John Kerry's position of expanding the government to give everybody health care, instead of finding free market solutions, and expand the role of government in everybody's life, well, then no.
I think the problem the Democrats have is, is that one of the other untold stories in this election, as you look at states like New Jersey, you look at states like Michigan, you look at states like Pennsylvania and you see President Bush doing better in those states this past election than he did in other elections. So the Democrats should be looking over their shoulders at both coasts and watch the Republicans coming for them.
(APPLAUSE)
CARLSON: Steve, as you know, the issue cited more than any other by voters for why they went out to vote was moral values, sort of a catchall phrase.
It seems to me the Democratic position, the litmus test Democrats impose on the subject of abortion hurts Democrats in national races. Do you think there will be any move within your party to allow other voices, maybe voices that aren't as enthusiastic about legal abortion, to rise to the top of your party? Because they can't now, as you know.
MCMAHON: Well, I think -- I don't think that there's any natural impediment to them doing so.
Our party is a party of a big tent. The Republicans talk about it a lot. We actually...
CARLSON: That's not true on the subject, and you know it.
MCMAHON: Well, you know what? There are a lot of people in the Senate and in the House right now who, for instance, are -- have voted in favor of bans on partial-birth abortion.
There are still members of the Democratic Party in good standing. They still are supported by the party leadership. There's obviously a range of views in our party. There's a predominance on the side of pro-choice. But there's no litmus test.
CARLSON: OK.
Unfortunately, we're completely out of time. Thanks very much, Tony Fabrizio, Steve McMahon. Thank you.
(CROSSTALK)
CARLSON: Appreciate it.
Next, reaction to the president's reelection victory from those who voted for and even those who voted against him. We'll be right back.
(APPLAUSE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Wolf Blitzer, reporting from New York.
Coming up at the top of the hour, President Bush declares victory and gets ready for his second term in office. Why were the early exit polls so far off?
Defeats in races for the White House, the Senate and the House of Representatives. What's wrong with the Democratic Party? We'll ask House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi. Also, Democratic Senator Chris Dodd will announce on our program whether he will seek his party's leadership in the U.S. Senate.
And U.S. Marines in Iraq wait for the final assault order on Fallujah.
All those stories, much more, only minutes away on "WOLF BLITZER REPORTS."
Now back to CROSSFIRE.
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: Thank you, Wolf. Appreciate that update. We look forward to your show at the top of the hour.
But here on CROSSFIRE, time now for "Fireback." You -- 120 million of you spoke yesterday, but we're not tired of listening to you. Tell me what you think about the election.
Ma'am, first, tell me your name and where you're from.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My name is Angie (ph) and I'm from Hagerstown, Maryland.
And I'm very pleased with the outcome of the election, because I feel that President Bush has our best interests at heart, whereas I didn't feel that John Kerry did, so four more years.
BEGALA: What was the biggest reason you voted for President Bush?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because of the war on terror. I feel that he's very strong. And I didn't feel that John Kerry was as strong as President Bush on that issue.
CARLSON: Nice to hear a Maryland voter say that.
(LAUGHTER)
(CROSSTALK)
(APPLAUSE)
CARLSON: Thank you.
All right, next up, yes? Tell us your name and what you think.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hello. I'm Courtney (ph) from Eatonville, Washington.
And I'm scared about my future, and I feel betrayed by my country.
CARLSON: Betrayed by your country?
(APPLAUSE)
CARLSON: Why do you feel betrayed by your country? Yes, tell me why you feel betrayed by your country. The person you didn't vote for won. Why is that a betrayal?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, I just feel that -- well, obviously, we were lied to at beginning. And I don't understand how people can look past that and just let it go. Why wasn't it addressed more?
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: Well, Courtney, thanks. Strong feelings.
CARLSON: I hope you feel better, Courtney.
(LAUGHTER)
CARLSON: Everything's going to be OK.
All right, we'll take a break.
BEGALA: It may or may not be, but the system works.
CARLSON: Yes, it does work.
Then we'll ask, what really happened in this campaign? Paul and I, both acting on about 45 minutes of sleep apiece, we'll attempt to debate it anyway.
We'll be right back.
BEGALA: Consecutively.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(APPLAUSE)
CARLSON: Welcome back to CROSSFIRE. Paul and I haven't slept much, but that does not prevent us from having some pretty deep thoughts about the election. Paul, here's mine.
I hope that the fact that the president won the majority of the popular vote, something I was hoping for no matter who won, will lower the tone a little bit and the Michael Moore people and the George Soros -- I'm serious. I'm not trying to be mean, but the people who are comparing Bush to Hitler and all that will settle down a little bit, if only because they can't deny he's the legitimate president.
BEGALA: They can't. No one should deny he's the legitimate president once he's sworn in, in January.
But, no, I hope Democrats fight like hell for what they believe in.
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: So I don't have a problem with it. I want more fighting.
But I do owe the president and his team a personal congratulations. I have banged on him every day for four years. And I went on national television and confidently predicted that turnout would up and, because of that, Kerry would win by five points. I was off by 6.5. So...
CARLSON: Well, I have to say, I have to say...
BEGALA: But congratulations to the president, to Karl Rove, Mark McKinnon, Matthew Dowd, all my friends in that campaign. And they are my friends.
CARLSON: And you weren't the only one.
BEGALA: They did a great job.
CARLSON: I wouldn't vote for John Kerry if my life depended on it. But I thought he was going to...
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: You know what? It might have.
CARLSON: I thought he was going to win. I actually thought Kerry was going to win.
(CROSSTALK)
CARLSON: I assumed, as a lot of people who cover politics assume, that huge turnout hurts the incumbent, because they only people that motivated are ones who want a radical change. And that turned out to be wrong.
And, boy, it's an impressive win. It's a big win. I don't -- I'm so tired, it's hard to see how big it is. But, tomorrow, it will be clearer. BEGALA: No, that's the thing that is most interesting, is that the Republicans changed the composition of the electorate. The Democrats now will decide whether they want to do, I think, the stupid, easy thing and take potshots at John Kerry or his team, which is unhelpful, or really reassess.
CARLSON: But fun.
BEGALA: But fun.
But really reassess the party, which is what I hope the Democrats do, have a serious conversation...
(CROSSTALK)
CARLSON: But there ought to be a circular firing squad to sort of start it off.
(LAUGHTER)
BEGALA: From the left, I am Paul Begala. That's it for CROSSFIRE.
CARLSON: And from the right, I'm Tucker Carlson. Happy post- Election Day. We will see you tomorrow.
"WOLF BLITZER REPORTS" is right now.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
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