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Condoleezza Rice Expected to be Named Secretary of State; Incident Caught on Video in Falluja Has Marine Being Investigated
Aired November 16, 2004 - 07:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice broadening her horizons, expected to be named the secretary of state as soon as today.
A new battle opens up against insurgents in Iraq, U.S. forces going on the offensive in Mosul.
While an incident caught on video in Falluja has one Marine investigated for why he pulled the trigger.
And in California, the award for the biggest audience fistfight goes to the Vibe Awards, an all out melee, on this AMERICAN MORNING.
ANNOUNCER: From the CNN Broadcast Center in New York, this is AMERICAN MORNING, with Soledad O'Brien and Bill Hemmer.
COLLINS: Good Tuesday morning, everybody. I'm Heidi Collins, in for Soledad today.
RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Rick Sanchez, sitting in for Bill.
We're going to take a good look at the changes in the president's cabinet this morning. We're also going to be looking at the shakeup over at the CIA. The operative previously known as "anonymous," critical of the U.S. strategy to fight terror, up is with us this morning. Michael Shore (ph) will tell us about the mood inside the CIA and what he expects next Osama bin Laden as well.
COLLINS: Also, did Merck put knowingly put lives at risk, holding on to information about the drug Vioxx. Some new charges out this week. We'll get the company's response when we talk to the chairman. That's coming up in just a few minutes.
In the meantime, Jack Cafferty here now. Good morning.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: What's that old Johnny Paycheck tune, "Take This Job and Shove It," remember that?
COLLINS: I think that's the one.
CAFFERTY: The cabinet members in the Bush administration are dashing off those notes to the nation's chief executive like there's some sort of contagious disease going around Washington. We'll take a look in a few minutes to how you think things might be different with Condoleezza Rice as the new secretary of state. COLLINS: All right, Jack, thank you very much.
SANCHEZ: Flurry of those notes yesterday. Let's check on the stories now in the news with Daryn Kagan.
She's at the CNN Center in Atlanta.
Hi, Daryn.
DARYN KAGAN, CNN ANCHOR: Rick, good morning to you.
Now in the news, U.S. and Iraqi security forces have launched a new offensive in Mosul. There are reports of sporadic fighting this morning as the Iraqi city remains under curfew.
Meanwhile, the U.S. military says Falluja is now secure. Multinational forces there have been pounding insurgent targets both on the ground and in the air. U.S. warplanes dropped a new round of bombs overnight.
To Washington now, antiabortion protesters are expected to take to the streets today to show opposition to Pennsylvania Senator Arlen Specter. Specter had been expected to assume the chairmanship of the Senate Judiciary Committee, but some social conservatives say he's too liberal on abortion right. Specter says his comments have been taken out of context, and he has no litmus test for judicial nominees. He meets with colleagues behind closed doors today to make his case.
On a health note, long hours in front of a computer screen may be linked to eye disease. A Japanese study found that those who sat in front of a computer for more than eight hours a day are twice as likely to have glaucoma. The research also showed a link between computer stress and users who are shortsighted.
And NASA will be feeling the need for speed today, after a test flight for its scramjet had to be scrubbed yesterday. Electrical problems grounded the hypersonic X-43A aircraft. It was expected to travel more than 7,000 miles per hour over the Pacific Ocean. That, by the way, is 10 times the speed of sound. The unnamed mission is set to launch today. They're hoping one day, Heidi, to have these hypersonic jets that would cross the continent in one hour. Not bad.
COLLINS: It's important to mention, too, nobody inside. That would be a little difficult to ride that fast, as a human.
KAGAN: Yes, strap in.
COLLINS: Exactly. All right, Daryn, thanks. We'll check back a little bit later on.
In the meantime, White House officials say President Bush will name one of his closest advisers, Condoleezza Rice, to succeed Colin Powell as secretary of state. That announcement could come today.
Suzanne Malveaux is live at the White House now this morning with the very latest. Suzanne, good morning.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, good morning, Heidi.
This is really a clear sign that this is A State department that is going to be much more aligned with President Bush's thinking. Dr. Rice is considered one of the president's closest confidantes, advisers, even one of the family. She was introduced to the Bush family when she was working as adviser to President Bush's father, when she was preparing him for a nuclear summit with Soviet Union's Mikhael Gorbachev. She's a former provost at Stanford University, a Russian expert, and she started as this president's tutor in foreign affairs. She's a fierce loyalist. She supported him in the runup to the Iraq war, often served as a referee between Secretarys Rumsfeld and Powell over debates over the Iraq war.
Now Rice does face confirmation hearings. Democrats believe that she will pass those hearings and win over the Democrats. But it is not without some criticism and some tough questions about her abilities in vetting faulty intelligence that the president used leading up to the Iraq war.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LAWRENCE EAGLEBURGER, FMR. SECY. OF STATE: Everybody is going to speak the same language, talk the same things. I think that what that means whatever influence Colin Powell had is going to be much less under these new circumstances. It is not that I dislike Condoleezza Rice. I think, however, she is not the person for that job.
RICHARD HASS, FMR. STATE DEPT. DIR. OF PLANNING: She's been national security adviser for four years. Before that, she was the principal adviser before the campaign. Before that, she had been an academic, and she had also worked on the National Security Council in the previous Bush administration. So yes, she has plenty of experience.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MALVEAUX: And it's expected today that the president will also announce that Deputy National Security Adviser Steve Hadley will be named Rice's successor. And of course, Heidi, still other questions about cabinet members remains, Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of Health and Human Services Tommy Thompson, among some others -- Heidi.
COLLINS: A lot going on. All right, Suzanne Malveaux, thanks so much for that.
Kiron Skinner has known Condoleezza Rice for more than 20 years now. She's a professor of international relations at Carnegie Mellon University, and author of a new book on President Reagan's writings. It's called "Reagan's Path to Victory."
Kiron Skinner is joining us now to talk about the likelihood of Condoleezza Rice being nominated. Now as we said, you guys have been friends for quite some time. You know her very well. Is this something that she wanted?
KIRON SKINNER, CARNEGIE MELLON UNIVERSITY: You know, I've been asked that so many times in the last 24 hours. And I -- at various points in her career, because, as you know, she's moved up so quickly over her professional life. And my sense is that she has never really gone after a position. She's focused more on being prepared. And I think she's probably one of the most qualified public figures at this time to be secretary of state.
Well before her 40th birthday, she was involved in a very important diplomatic mission. That was to help Germany become unified as a Democratic country within NATO. That helped in the Cold War. And so I think her earlier experience just really bode well for the future for her. So this is not unexpected, but I don't think it was something she was really kind of...
COLLINS: Rallying for.
SKINNER: Rallying for at this time. I think her -- the level of preparation is just stunning in her case.
COLLINS: So you say she brings an awful lot to the table. And there are other reports that actually say that President Bush and Condoleezza Rice are just really tight. I mean, they exercise together, they watch sporting events together, Camp David together. Some even say she has the ability to finish his sentences if she has to. What do you make of that relationship?
SKINNER: Well, you know, I have not seen it up close. But what I can say is I think there is a kind of intellectual synergy between them that will make her post at the State Department very effective. I think it will be much like the Reagan-Schultz relationship, where they agreed on kind of first principles about America's role of the world.
COLLINS: And then, that being said, does it translate into disagreement about foreign policy. In fact, listen to former Secretary of State, if you would, Lawrence Eagleburger for just a moment. I'll get you comment on the backside about it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
EAGLEBURGER: My point is this -- she's very bright, very capable. I do not believe that you should have in the secretary of state someone who has spent their last four years in the White House next to the president. I do believe you need some tension between the State Department, the Defense Department, and the National Security Council. And if the rumors prove correct and her deputy becomes National Security Council adviser, what you've got there is, you know, everybody is going to speak the same language, talk the same things.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: Is speaking the same language and talking the same way a good thing or a bad thing?
SKINNER: Well, I don't see it quite the way that Mr. Eagleburger sees it. I think that Dr. Rice is very much her own person, and she has served the president well as national security adviser. I think we will hear more from her as a kind of theorist of international relations and as a diplomat in the post of secretary of state. I think that's somewhat of an unknown, and so I think he's not giving credit for the special position that the national security adviser is. And we have a precedent for national security advisers becoming secretary of state. Henry Kissinger, for example, and that worked very effectively, I think, in the Nixon years.
COLLINS: But quickly, before we let you go here, something that nobody else can really answer. How has she changed in the last four years, politically, worldly, her thoughts personally?
SKINNER: My sense is she has become much more comprehensive in her understanding of the international system. You know, she started as a scholar of international relations. But now, I think she really has moved so much around the globe. She's been to the Middle East a couple of times. She want to the African continent on a mission with the president. I think she understands the whole globe in a way perhaps she couldn't have as a scholar at Stanford.
COLLINS: Kiron Skinner, we appreciate your insights on all of this and your good friend, Condoleezza Rice.
SKINNER: Thank you.
COLLINS: Thanks so much for being here -- Rick.
SKINNER: Thanks.
SANCHEZ: A story with video that's being very much talked about all over the country, the actions of a U.S. marine who shot and killed a wounded and apparently unarmed Iraqi prisoner are now under investigation.
Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr is joining us now from Washington with more on this story.
Good morning, Barbara.
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you, Rick.
Well, overnight an official statement from the commanding general of the Marines in Iraq, the 1st Marines Division; yes, an official investigation, a criminal investigation, is under way into the apparent shooting death of a wounded Iraqi insurgent prisoner last Saturday in Falluja, by a U.S. Marine, who has now been removed from duty.
The incident, Rick, was captured on videotape by a reporter traveling with the Marines. They entered a mosque, they found some wounded Iraqis that had been left behind. We're going to show you the videotape, but we want to warn our viewers, it is very disturbing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There marines in there?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, they're on the far right, far right.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Coming around the back.
Hey, who's in here?
What (EXPLETIVE DELETED) you doing in here?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (EXPLETIVE DELETED) Got shot by tanks.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Us?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
You guys almost got shot up by tanks.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They told us to come in here.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The tanks did?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. They told us there were people in here, and tell us to come in here.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, we had two in there.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You shoot them?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They have any weapons on them?
Same guys from yesterday?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yep.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: These are the ones from yesterday.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: These are the wounded that they never picked up.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's (EXPLETIVE DELETED) faking he's dead.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's breathing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's faking (EXPLETIVE DELETED).
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Dead now.
(END VIDEO CLIP) STARR: Now, Rick, of course, CNN has chosen not to show the rest of this videotape of the man apparently being shot in the head by the U.S. Marine due to the explicit nature of the video. The investigation is under way. If this Marine is found to be guilty, it would be a violation of the laws of armed conflict -- Rick.
SANCHEZ: How worried are Pentagon officials about this particular video, the release of it, and could this action by this Marine constitute a war crime?
STARR: Rick, they are very concerned about this. Of course, they are concerned about how this will play in the Arab world, on Arab TV news channels. They also concerned about the impact in Falluja itself, whether it will encourage insurgents to go on fighting, whether it may keep Iraqis from surrendering to the coalition forces because they are afraid of being shot.
At the moment, there is no good news, they tell us, about this tape, as the investigation continues. As to whether it is technically a war crime, we are told that is something the lawyers and the military justice system will decide, but it is a violation of military law, international laws of armed conflict, of course, to shoot a wounded prisoner, who poses no threat -- Rick.
SANCHEZ: CNN's Barbara Starr, following that story for us from the Pentagon.
We thank you, Barbara.
Heidi, over to you.
(WEATHER REPORT)
SANCHEZ: Still to come, six months is a long time to spend with just one other person, especially if you're in outer space. We're going to talk to an astronaut and cosmonaut, the two of them together, who just came home this weekend, find out what it's like to live aboard the International Space Station.
COLLINS: Are they fighting over food there?
Also, Porter Goss shakes up things at the CIA. What does it mean to security? A former CIA operative talks to us about that.
SANCHEZ: And up Merck is under fire because of Vioxx. How does the company's chairman respond? We're going ask him live, ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: What did pharmaceutical giant Merck know about the heart risks from Vioxx, and when did they know it? A Senator hearing Thursday will examine whether the popular arthritis drug should have been pulled from the market earlier because of safety concerns.
Merck chairman, president and CEO Raymond Gilmartin will testify, and he is with us here this morning.
Good morning to you, Mr. Gilmartin. Thanks for being with us.
RAYMOND GILMARTIN, MERCK CHAIRMAN, PRESIDENT & CEO: Good morning.
COLLINS: Reports over the weekend may have caused new concern at Merck. They're saying that there were concerns about this drug in May of 2000. But as you well know, and as we reported here, as it happened, the drug was not pulled until September of 2004. What did you know about the potential dangers of Vioxx?
GILMARTIN: In may of 2000, we had 28,000 patients on large trials that were randomized, controlled clinical trials that showed no difference between Vioxx and placebo, and no difference between Vioxx and other insades (ph), such as Ibuprofen. The first time we had a confirmed risk of Vioxx against placebo was when we got a call from the outside investigator on September 23rd, that said that he had seen -- or the safety monitoring board had seen a high risk of cardiovascular events that had developed beginning after 18 months, and they recommended we end the clinical trial.
After we looked at the data, within less than a week, we withdrew the drug voluntarily.
COLLINS: So you feel perfectly confident, that with this letter, you acted as quickly as you possibly could have?
GILMARTIN: Yes, in fact, back -- this was a three-year trial that revealed this difference in cardiovascular risk, and it was only eight weeks before the end of the trial before this data showed that there was a significant risk. And we started this trial in February of 2000, and designed it and added other trials to it in order to explore specifically whether or not there was a cardiovascular risk associated with Vioxx. And we pre-specified and endpoint to find that out. And this is a trial that we did that demonstrated that. And remarkably, for the first 18 months, there was no difference, so it was consistent with all our other data. But at 18 months, the risk started to build, and once we saw the data, we withdrew the drug.
COLLINS: OK, so as you say, you acknowledge that there were risks, you pulled the drugs, and yet there are around 400 lawsuits now that could potentially be filed here. How will you handle these lawsuits, and how do you handle the people with these claims?
GILMARTIN: Well, I think it's important to keep in perspective here that the risk began only after 18 months of continuous use. And as the FDA pointed out in their press release on the day they announced we were voluntarily withdrawing the drug, that the risk for any one individual for a heart attack or stroke was very small. And the heart attacks and strokes occurred generally throughout the population for a variety of risk factors, and because someone is taking Vioxx doesn't mean that Vioxx caused that event.
COLLINS: But can you understand the public outcry when there are reports that say there were -- like in "The Wall Street Journal," this came up about two weeks ago, that said Merck got these red flags that were coming to them about the potential dangers of Vioxx as far back as mid 1990s? I mean, why did it take so long for Merck to recall Vioxx?
GILMARTIN: Well, because we had studied the drug extensively. We had all these trials, 28,000 patients, as I said earlier.
COLLINS: And as that information comes in, and if it is alarming -- or maybe that's too strong of a word -- if it is different than what the expectation was, can the process not begin, as far as being better safe than sorry, or as safe as possible, to start going in the direction of, you know, considering its disbursement.
GILMARTIN: Well, understand that we began a study in 2000 that was a three-year study that took over a year to enroll the patients, as it typically does. And this finding, this surprising finding, did not show up until almost the end of the study, which is almost three years later.
So we -- the first confirmed data that we had that there was a risk against placebo was arrived at, at probably the earliest possible time, and it was arrived at because we did the trial to find it out.
COLLINS: Well, as we mentioned, the lawsuits are there. How will the company -- I mean, is there a certain amount of money set aside that could potentially be paid out to these people, or will Merck survive? I mean, this is a heck of a lot of money. We're talking about possibly $15 billion here.
GILMARTIN: Well, we can't speculate what the outcome of any of these trials are going to be. That's pure speculation. We can't speculate on that.
But the thing to keep in mind, is that Merck is very financially strong. We have a very conservative balance sheet. We have strong cash flows. We have strong franchises, in terms of existing other products that will continue to show strength in the marketplace. So we're very strong financially.
COLLINS: Will you stay?
GILMARTIN: Absolutely. I'm scheduled to retire in 2006. That's our policy. We've got a succession plan under way that's been under way for some time and it's proceeding according to the schedule laid out.
COLLINS: Raymond Gilmartin, from Merck, we appreciate your time today.
GILMARTIN: Thank you.
COLLINS: Thanks -- Rick.
SANCHEZ: Skill to come, what turned an awards show into a rumble. A look at what went down at the Vibe Awards. Here's some of the video. We've got more ahead on AMERICAN MORNING. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: And welcome back to AMERICAN MORNING. Time for Mr. Cafferty and the Question of the Day.
CAFFERTY: Thank you, Mr. Sanchez.
Gone is what man who many consider the voice of reason in the Bush administration, Colin Powell out as secretary of state, a loyal soldier to the end in more ways than one; a class act who never embarrassed his boss, despite disagreeing strongly with him on issues such as the war on terror and the invasion of Iraq. His departure represents a victory of sorts for the hawks in the administration -- Don Rumsfeld, Dick Cheney and the rest.
He'll be replaced by Condoleezza Rice, the national security adviser, and the person probably closer to President Bush than anybody except his wife, Laura. She will have her hands full -- the Middle East, Iraq, Iran, North Korea. I want to see the meeting between Condoleezza Rice and that weird little dude that runs North Korea. I want to be in that room.
Here's the question, how will U.S. diplomacy be different with Powell out and Rice in. You can e-mail us your thoughts, am@CNN.com. We're getting a lot of e-mail already because we post the question on the Web site. And so far, out of maybe 50 letters that I've just quickly scanned, there are none -- none that say, gee, this is a great idea. The early exit poll, could change, results could change.
COLLINS: We've seen that happen before with exit polls.
CAFFERTY: Yes, we have.
SANCHEZ: And folks like Powell, 70 percent approval rating.
CAFFERTY: The guy should have been president of the United States. He was just too smart to take the job.
COLLINS: All right, Jack, we'll check in a bit little later on. Thanks.
Still to come this morning, has Porter Goss' CIA shakeup made the U.S. less safe? We'll talk with a former CIA operative and authority on Osama bin Laden.
And a little bit later, meet two men who ushered in a new era of Russian and U.S. cooperation in space. They're just back from the International Space Station. We have them here, on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
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Aired November 16, 2004 - 07:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice broadening her horizons, expected to be named the secretary of state as soon as today.
A new battle opens up against insurgents in Iraq, U.S. forces going on the offensive in Mosul.
While an incident caught on video in Falluja has one Marine investigated for why he pulled the trigger.
And in California, the award for the biggest audience fistfight goes to the Vibe Awards, an all out melee, on this AMERICAN MORNING.
ANNOUNCER: From the CNN Broadcast Center in New York, this is AMERICAN MORNING, with Soledad O'Brien and Bill Hemmer.
COLLINS: Good Tuesday morning, everybody. I'm Heidi Collins, in for Soledad today.
RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Rick Sanchez, sitting in for Bill.
We're going to take a good look at the changes in the president's cabinet this morning. We're also going to be looking at the shakeup over at the CIA. The operative previously known as "anonymous," critical of the U.S. strategy to fight terror, up is with us this morning. Michael Shore (ph) will tell us about the mood inside the CIA and what he expects next Osama bin Laden as well.
COLLINS: Also, did Merck put knowingly put lives at risk, holding on to information about the drug Vioxx. Some new charges out this week. We'll get the company's response when we talk to the chairman. That's coming up in just a few minutes.
In the meantime, Jack Cafferty here now. Good morning.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: What's that old Johnny Paycheck tune, "Take This Job and Shove It," remember that?
COLLINS: I think that's the one.
CAFFERTY: The cabinet members in the Bush administration are dashing off those notes to the nation's chief executive like there's some sort of contagious disease going around Washington. We'll take a look in a few minutes to how you think things might be different with Condoleezza Rice as the new secretary of state. COLLINS: All right, Jack, thank you very much.
SANCHEZ: Flurry of those notes yesterday. Let's check on the stories now in the news with Daryn Kagan.
She's at the CNN Center in Atlanta.
Hi, Daryn.
DARYN KAGAN, CNN ANCHOR: Rick, good morning to you.
Now in the news, U.S. and Iraqi security forces have launched a new offensive in Mosul. There are reports of sporadic fighting this morning as the Iraqi city remains under curfew.
Meanwhile, the U.S. military says Falluja is now secure. Multinational forces there have been pounding insurgent targets both on the ground and in the air. U.S. warplanes dropped a new round of bombs overnight.
To Washington now, antiabortion protesters are expected to take to the streets today to show opposition to Pennsylvania Senator Arlen Specter. Specter had been expected to assume the chairmanship of the Senate Judiciary Committee, but some social conservatives say he's too liberal on abortion right. Specter says his comments have been taken out of context, and he has no litmus test for judicial nominees. He meets with colleagues behind closed doors today to make his case.
On a health note, long hours in front of a computer screen may be linked to eye disease. A Japanese study found that those who sat in front of a computer for more than eight hours a day are twice as likely to have glaucoma. The research also showed a link between computer stress and users who are shortsighted.
And NASA will be feeling the need for speed today, after a test flight for its scramjet had to be scrubbed yesterday. Electrical problems grounded the hypersonic X-43A aircraft. It was expected to travel more than 7,000 miles per hour over the Pacific Ocean. That, by the way, is 10 times the speed of sound. The unnamed mission is set to launch today. They're hoping one day, Heidi, to have these hypersonic jets that would cross the continent in one hour. Not bad.
COLLINS: It's important to mention, too, nobody inside. That would be a little difficult to ride that fast, as a human.
KAGAN: Yes, strap in.
COLLINS: Exactly. All right, Daryn, thanks. We'll check back a little bit later on.
In the meantime, White House officials say President Bush will name one of his closest advisers, Condoleezza Rice, to succeed Colin Powell as secretary of state. That announcement could come today.
Suzanne Malveaux is live at the White House now this morning with the very latest. Suzanne, good morning.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, good morning, Heidi.
This is really a clear sign that this is A State department that is going to be much more aligned with President Bush's thinking. Dr. Rice is considered one of the president's closest confidantes, advisers, even one of the family. She was introduced to the Bush family when she was working as adviser to President Bush's father, when she was preparing him for a nuclear summit with Soviet Union's Mikhael Gorbachev. She's a former provost at Stanford University, a Russian expert, and she started as this president's tutor in foreign affairs. She's a fierce loyalist. She supported him in the runup to the Iraq war, often served as a referee between Secretarys Rumsfeld and Powell over debates over the Iraq war.
Now Rice does face confirmation hearings. Democrats believe that she will pass those hearings and win over the Democrats. But it is not without some criticism and some tough questions about her abilities in vetting faulty intelligence that the president used leading up to the Iraq war.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LAWRENCE EAGLEBURGER, FMR. SECY. OF STATE: Everybody is going to speak the same language, talk the same things. I think that what that means whatever influence Colin Powell had is going to be much less under these new circumstances. It is not that I dislike Condoleezza Rice. I think, however, she is not the person for that job.
RICHARD HASS, FMR. STATE DEPT. DIR. OF PLANNING: She's been national security adviser for four years. Before that, she was the principal adviser before the campaign. Before that, she had been an academic, and she had also worked on the National Security Council in the previous Bush administration. So yes, she has plenty of experience.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MALVEAUX: And it's expected today that the president will also announce that Deputy National Security Adviser Steve Hadley will be named Rice's successor. And of course, Heidi, still other questions about cabinet members remains, Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of Health and Human Services Tommy Thompson, among some others -- Heidi.
COLLINS: A lot going on. All right, Suzanne Malveaux, thanks so much for that.
Kiron Skinner has known Condoleezza Rice for more than 20 years now. She's a professor of international relations at Carnegie Mellon University, and author of a new book on President Reagan's writings. It's called "Reagan's Path to Victory."
Kiron Skinner is joining us now to talk about the likelihood of Condoleezza Rice being nominated. Now as we said, you guys have been friends for quite some time. You know her very well. Is this something that she wanted?
KIRON SKINNER, CARNEGIE MELLON UNIVERSITY: You know, I've been asked that so many times in the last 24 hours. And I -- at various points in her career, because, as you know, she's moved up so quickly over her professional life. And my sense is that she has never really gone after a position. She's focused more on being prepared. And I think she's probably one of the most qualified public figures at this time to be secretary of state.
Well before her 40th birthday, she was involved in a very important diplomatic mission. That was to help Germany become unified as a Democratic country within NATO. That helped in the Cold War. And so I think her earlier experience just really bode well for the future for her. So this is not unexpected, but I don't think it was something she was really kind of...
COLLINS: Rallying for.
SKINNER: Rallying for at this time. I think her -- the level of preparation is just stunning in her case.
COLLINS: So you say she brings an awful lot to the table. And there are other reports that actually say that President Bush and Condoleezza Rice are just really tight. I mean, they exercise together, they watch sporting events together, Camp David together. Some even say she has the ability to finish his sentences if she has to. What do you make of that relationship?
SKINNER: Well, you know, I have not seen it up close. But what I can say is I think there is a kind of intellectual synergy between them that will make her post at the State Department very effective. I think it will be much like the Reagan-Schultz relationship, where they agreed on kind of first principles about America's role of the world.
COLLINS: And then, that being said, does it translate into disagreement about foreign policy. In fact, listen to former Secretary of State, if you would, Lawrence Eagleburger for just a moment. I'll get you comment on the backside about it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
EAGLEBURGER: My point is this -- she's very bright, very capable. I do not believe that you should have in the secretary of state someone who has spent their last four years in the White House next to the president. I do believe you need some tension between the State Department, the Defense Department, and the National Security Council. And if the rumors prove correct and her deputy becomes National Security Council adviser, what you've got there is, you know, everybody is going to speak the same language, talk the same things.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: Is speaking the same language and talking the same way a good thing or a bad thing?
SKINNER: Well, I don't see it quite the way that Mr. Eagleburger sees it. I think that Dr. Rice is very much her own person, and she has served the president well as national security adviser. I think we will hear more from her as a kind of theorist of international relations and as a diplomat in the post of secretary of state. I think that's somewhat of an unknown, and so I think he's not giving credit for the special position that the national security adviser is. And we have a precedent for national security advisers becoming secretary of state. Henry Kissinger, for example, and that worked very effectively, I think, in the Nixon years.
COLLINS: But quickly, before we let you go here, something that nobody else can really answer. How has she changed in the last four years, politically, worldly, her thoughts personally?
SKINNER: My sense is she has become much more comprehensive in her understanding of the international system. You know, she started as a scholar of international relations. But now, I think she really has moved so much around the globe. She's been to the Middle East a couple of times. She want to the African continent on a mission with the president. I think she understands the whole globe in a way perhaps she couldn't have as a scholar at Stanford.
COLLINS: Kiron Skinner, we appreciate your insights on all of this and your good friend, Condoleezza Rice.
SKINNER: Thank you.
COLLINS: Thanks so much for being here -- Rick.
SKINNER: Thanks.
SANCHEZ: A story with video that's being very much talked about all over the country, the actions of a U.S. marine who shot and killed a wounded and apparently unarmed Iraqi prisoner are now under investigation.
Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr is joining us now from Washington with more on this story.
Good morning, Barbara.
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you, Rick.
Well, overnight an official statement from the commanding general of the Marines in Iraq, the 1st Marines Division; yes, an official investigation, a criminal investigation, is under way into the apparent shooting death of a wounded Iraqi insurgent prisoner last Saturday in Falluja, by a U.S. Marine, who has now been removed from duty.
The incident, Rick, was captured on videotape by a reporter traveling with the Marines. They entered a mosque, they found some wounded Iraqis that had been left behind. We're going to show you the videotape, but we want to warn our viewers, it is very disturbing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There marines in there?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, they're on the far right, far right.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Coming around the back.
Hey, who's in here?
What (EXPLETIVE DELETED) you doing in here?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (EXPLETIVE DELETED) Got shot by tanks.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Us?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
You guys almost got shot up by tanks.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They told us to come in here.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The tanks did?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. They told us there were people in here, and tell us to come in here.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, we had two in there.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You shoot them?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They have any weapons on them?
Same guys from yesterday?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yep.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: These are the ones from yesterday.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: These are the wounded that they never picked up.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's (EXPLETIVE DELETED) faking he's dead.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's breathing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's faking (EXPLETIVE DELETED).
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Dead now.
(END VIDEO CLIP) STARR: Now, Rick, of course, CNN has chosen not to show the rest of this videotape of the man apparently being shot in the head by the U.S. Marine due to the explicit nature of the video. The investigation is under way. If this Marine is found to be guilty, it would be a violation of the laws of armed conflict -- Rick.
SANCHEZ: How worried are Pentagon officials about this particular video, the release of it, and could this action by this Marine constitute a war crime?
STARR: Rick, they are very concerned about this. Of course, they are concerned about how this will play in the Arab world, on Arab TV news channels. They also concerned about the impact in Falluja itself, whether it will encourage insurgents to go on fighting, whether it may keep Iraqis from surrendering to the coalition forces because they are afraid of being shot.
At the moment, there is no good news, they tell us, about this tape, as the investigation continues. As to whether it is technically a war crime, we are told that is something the lawyers and the military justice system will decide, but it is a violation of military law, international laws of armed conflict, of course, to shoot a wounded prisoner, who poses no threat -- Rick.
SANCHEZ: CNN's Barbara Starr, following that story for us from the Pentagon.
We thank you, Barbara.
Heidi, over to you.
(WEATHER REPORT)
SANCHEZ: Still to come, six months is a long time to spend with just one other person, especially if you're in outer space. We're going to talk to an astronaut and cosmonaut, the two of them together, who just came home this weekend, find out what it's like to live aboard the International Space Station.
COLLINS: Are they fighting over food there?
Also, Porter Goss shakes up things at the CIA. What does it mean to security? A former CIA operative talks to us about that.
SANCHEZ: And up Merck is under fire because of Vioxx. How does the company's chairman respond? We're going ask him live, ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
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COLLINS: What did pharmaceutical giant Merck know about the heart risks from Vioxx, and when did they know it? A Senator hearing Thursday will examine whether the popular arthritis drug should have been pulled from the market earlier because of safety concerns.
Merck chairman, president and CEO Raymond Gilmartin will testify, and he is with us here this morning.
Good morning to you, Mr. Gilmartin. Thanks for being with us.
RAYMOND GILMARTIN, MERCK CHAIRMAN, PRESIDENT & CEO: Good morning.
COLLINS: Reports over the weekend may have caused new concern at Merck. They're saying that there were concerns about this drug in May of 2000. But as you well know, and as we reported here, as it happened, the drug was not pulled until September of 2004. What did you know about the potential dangers of Vioxx?
GILMARTIN: In may of 2000, we had 28,000 patients on large trials that were randomized, controlled clinical trials that showed no difference between Vioxx and placebo, and no difference between Vioxx and other insades (ph), such as Ibuprofen. The first time we had a confirmed risk of Vioxx against placebo was when we got a call from the outside investigator on September 23rd, that said that he had seen -- or the safety monitoring board had seen a high risk of cardiovascular events that had developed beginning after 18 months, and they recommended we end the clinical trial.
After we looked at the data, within less than a week, we withdrew the drug voluntarily.
COLLINS: So you feel perfectly confident, that with this letter, you acted as quickly as you possibly could have?
GILMARTIN: Yes, in fact, back -- this was a three-year trial that revealed this difference in cardiovascular risk, and it was only eight weeks before the end of the trial before this data showed that there was a significant risk. And we started this trial in February of 2000, and designed it and added other trials to it in order to explore specifically whether or not there was a cardiovascular risk associated with Vioxx. And we pre-specified and endpoint to find that out. And this is a trial that we did that demonstrated that. And remarkably, for the first 18 months, there was no difference, so it was consistent with all our other data. But at 18 months, the risk started to build, and once we saw the data, we withdrew the drug.
COLLINS: OK, so as you say, you acknowledge that there were risks, you pulled the drugs, and yet there are around 400 lawsuits now that could potentially be filed here. How will you handle these lawsuits, and how do you handle the people with these claims?
GILMARTIN: Well, I think it's important to keep in perspective here that the risk began only after 18 months of continuous use. And as the FDA pointed out in their press release on the day they announced we were voluntarily withdrawing the drug, that the risk for any one individual for a heart attack or stroke was very small. And the heart attacks and strokes occurred generally throughout the population for a variety of risk factors, and because someone is taking Vioxx doesn't mean that Vioxx caused that event.
COLLINS: But can you understand the public outcry when there are reports that say there were -- like in "The Wall Street Journal," this came up about two weeks ago, that said Merck got these red flags that were coming to them about the potential dangers of Vioxx as far back as mid 1990s? I mean, why did it take so long for Merck to recall Vioxx?
GILMARTIN: Well, because we had studied the drug extensively. We had all these trials, 28,000 patients, as I said earlier.
COLLINS: And as that information comes in, and if it is alarming -- or maybe that's too strong of a word -- if it is different than what the expectation was, can the process not begin, as far as being better safe than sorry, or as safe as possible, to start going in the direction of, you know, considering its disbursement.
GILMARTIN: Well, understand that we began a study in 2000 that was a three-year study that took over a year to enroll the patients, as it typically does. And this finding, this surprising finding, did not show up until almost the end of the study, which is almost three years later.
So we -- the first confirmed data that we had that there was a risk against placebo was arrived at, at probably the earliest possible time, and it was arrived at because we did the trial to find it out.
COLLINS: Well, as we mentioned, the lawsuits are there. How will the company -- I mean, is there a certain amount of money set aside that could potentially be paid out to these people, or will Merck survive? I mean, this is a heck of a lot of money. We're talking about possibly $15 billion here.
GILMARTIN: Well, we can't speculate what the outcome of any of these trials are going to be. That's pure speculation. We can't speculate on that.
But the thing to keep in mind, is that Merck is very financially strong. We have a very conservative balance sheet. We have strong cash flows. We have strong franchises, in terms of existing other products that will continue to show strength in the marketplace. So we're very strong financially.
COLLINS: Will you stay?
GILMARTIN: Absolutely. I'm scheduled to retire in 2006. That's our policy. We've got a succession plan under way that's been under way for some time and it's proceeding according to the schedule laid out.
COLLINS: Raymond Gilmartin, from Merck, we appreciate your time today.
GILMARTIN: Thank you.
COLLINS: Thanks -- Rick.
SANCHEZ: Skill to come, what turned an awards show into a rumble. A look at what went down at the Vibe Awards. Here's some of the video. We've got more ahead on AMERICAN MORNING. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: And welcome back to AMERICAN MORNING. Time for Mr. Cafferty and the Question of the Day.
CAFFERTY: Thank you, Mr. Sanchez.
Gone is what man who many consider the voice of reason in the Bush administration, Colin Powell out as secretary of state, a loyal soldier to the end in more ways than one; a class act who never embarrassed his boss, despite disagreeing strongly with him on issues such as the war on terror and the invasion of Iraq. His departure represents a victory of sorts for the hawks in the administration -- Don Rumsfeld, Dick Cheney and the rest.
He'll be replaced by Condoleezza Rice, the national security adviser, and the person probably closer to President Bush than anybody except his wife, Laura. She will have her hands full -- the Middle East, Iraq, Iran, North Korea. I want to see the meeting between Condoleezza Rice and that weird little dude that runs North Korea. I want to be in that room.
Here's the question, how will U.S. diplomacy be different with Powell out and Rice in. You can e-mail us your thoughts, am@CNN.com. We're getting a lot of e-mail already because we post the question on the Web site. And so far, out of maybe 50 letters that I've just quickly scanned, there are none -- none that say, gee, this is a great idea. The early exit poll, could change, results could change.
COLLINS: We've seen that happen before with exit polls.
CAFFERTY: Yes, we have.
SANCHEZ: And folks like Powell, 70 percent approval rating.
CAFFERTY: The guy should have been president of the United States. He was just too smart to take the job.
COLLINS: All right, Jack, we'll check in a bit little later on. Thanks.
Still to come this morning, has Porter Goss' CIA shakeup made the U.S. less safe? We'll talk with a former CIA operative and authority on Osama bin Laden.
And a little bit later, meet two men who ushered in a new era of Russian and U.S. cooperation in space. They're just back from the International Space Station. We have them here, on AMERICAN MORNING.
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