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American Morning

CIA Turmoil; Interview With Senator Saxby Chambliss; Space Odyssey

Aired November 16, 2004 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: And welcome back, everyone. It's just about half past the hour here on AMERICAN MORNING. Bill and Soledad are off. I'm Rick Sanchez.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Heidi Collins. In just a few minutes, we're going to get an insider's perspective on whether the CIA is right now an agency in turmoil. Michael Scheuer, who left the CIA just last week, is with us. He's going to talk about these changes and there actually might increase the risk to America and its security.

SANCHEZ: A lot of talk there. Also this half-hour, some guys that have just finished a very tough job, a long way from home, to say the very least. Two crewmen from the International Space Station are with us. They're going to talk about their six months of life in space and some of the very risky work that came with their particular mission.

COLLINS: Right now, though, we want to get another check on what's happening "Now in the News" with Daryn Kagan at the CNN center. Straight to the secretary of state possibility.

DARYN KAGAN, CNN ANCHOR: Heidi, "Now in the News."

Condoleezza Rice looks to replace outgoing Colin Powell as secretary of state. Senior administration officials say that President Bush has tapped Rice for the post. Announcement of her nomination could come as early as today. Rice's top deputy, Stephen Hadley, will take over as national security adviser.

Former President Bill Clinton is kicking off a volunteer youth service program in Little Rock, Arkansas today. It is part of a weeklong celebration, leading up to the opening of Clinton's presidential library. Thousands are expected to be on hand for the dedication ceremony on Thursday. Planners say one part of the $165 million library and museum will focus on Clinton's impeachment, and Monica Lewinsky will also be mentioned.

To health news now. It is the battle of low-fat versus low-carb. A new study suggesting that Atkins-style plans add on pounds in the long run. How about that? Researchers at the Brown Medical School say people who kept weight off limited their fat intake, not their carbs. A spokesman for Atkins says the study did not follow the plan guidelines.

And to Nevada, we want to show you these pictures, the remaining building of the Desert Inn. They came tumbling down a few hours ago. The Desert Inn, say bye-bye, has been part of the Vegas Strip more than 50 years; 233 pounds of explosives were used to bring the building down. It's all to make room for the second phase of the new Wynn Resort. Wynn as in W-Y-N-N, Wynn, not like win, like win a lot of money -- Heidi.

COLLINS: Yes...

(CROSSTALK)

KAGAN: Yes.

COLLINS: Right? All right, Daryn, thanks so much.

More turbulence at the CIA. Two of the nation's top spies resigned yesterday, the latest in a high-level shakeup by new Director Porter Goss.

Michael Scheuer, who ran the CIA's bin Laden unit, left last week, and he also wrote the book, "Imperial Humis -- Hubris" that is, under the name "Anonymous.. Michael Scheuer has emerged from the shadows now. He's joining from Washington this morning to talk more about the agency's overhaul.

Thanks for being here. I want to directly get to this question about the resignation of these two gentlemen, Stephen Cappas (ph) and Michael Sulick (ph). Where do you think this puts the United States in terms of safety and security at this point?

MICHAEL SCHEUER, AUTHOR, "IMPERIAL HUBRIS": Heidi, I think -- frankly, I don't know Mr. Sulick (ph) that well, but my association with Mr. Cappas (ph) leads me to conclude that the nation is poorer for the loss of his services. He's a first-rate officer, a very straight shooter, and will be missed by the clandestine service.

COLLINS: But are we not as safe?

SCHEUER: I think people underestimate the dedication and the talent resident in the Central Intelligence Agency. And I think the people doing the work on the ground will move ahead, as they have in the past. The real danger to the CIA at the moment is just the congressional committee, the Goss-Shelby committee and the 9/11 Commission, which scapegoated really the agency for intelligence failures that were really non-existent.

COLLINS: Intelligence failures that were really non-existent.

SCHEUER: Yes.

COLLINS: Explain.

SCHEUER: If you read the 9/11 Commission report, for example, objectively, it recounts at least 10 occasions on which our government had the opportunity to either capture Osama bin Laden or to provide precise locational information for the military to fire either cruise missiles or an airstrike against him. You know, intelligence failures seldom come from a lack of intelligence. What they come from is a lack of action on that intelligence. And on each of those 10 occasions, the people in our government decided that it was more important not to offend European opinion or not to offend Muslims or, in one case, not to take the chance of possibly killing an Arab prince. All of those things...

COLLINS: Well, it sounds to me a little bit...

SCHEUER: All of those things...

COLLINS: Pardon the interruption.

SCHEUER: ... were more important than protecting Americans.

COLLINS: Well, pardon the interruption, sir.

SCHEUER: Sure.

COLLINS: But isn't that a little bit about what we have already heard about Porter Goss? You talk about risk-taking. And he's been described as this person who is very committed to a more aggressive, more risk-taking-type of CIA.

SCHEUER: I think...

COLLINS: Is that the right approach?

SCHEUER: Yes, it certainly is. There are people within the CIA who are constitutionally risk-adverse and have been for a decade. Our leadership over the past decade, especially at the directorate of operations level has not been terrific. But the scapegoating of the men and women who actually risk their lives to protect the United States is really unconscionable.

And I've just been surprised that the American people haven't been more outraged by the 9/11 Commission report after learning that we had a chance to take care of the bin Laden problem in the 1990s.

COLLINS: Let's listen for just a moment to Peter Hoekstra, of course, Porter Goss' replacement as House Intelligence Committee chairman. He says this about the changes at the CIA:

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

REP. PETER HOEKSTRA (R), MICHIGAN: I think what we're seeing is that Porter is putting his own footprint and imprint on the CIA. That's fully expected. It's not unusual that when an organization will get new leadership, that that leadership will also change a number of the other people within that department.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: It's a question we've debated a couple of days. Your take on whether or not cleaning house really needs to happen. SCHEUER: I think that Mr. Goss needs to set up his own ship. I hope the changes that are being made are not partisan in nature. I certainly support removing officers or asking officers to retire who have proven to be risk-adverse, and there's many of them. But that's a senior-level problem. And I think Mr. Goss is addressing that. But certainly, you don't want to see more partisanship injected into the CIA.

COLLINS: Well, as we mentioned, you resigned from the CIA yourself last week. You were in charge of the hunt for al Qaeda, the hunt for Osama bin Laden. Osama bin Laden is still out there. How do you leave now?

SCHEUER: How do I leave, ma'am?

COLLINS: Yes.

SCHEUER: It came down to the choice between being a good employee or a good citizen. And I've watched over the last three or four years a kind of an effort to denigrate the activities of the clandestine service of the United States. And I decided that it was time to be a good citizen rather than to be a good employee. And the men and women of the clandestine service are at the front line of what is done to protect America.

COLLINS: But quickly, sir, do you know more about what Osama bin Laden may have in store for the United States than anybody else?

SCHEUER: Do I know more? I doubt that. I know the target very well, and I certainly know what he intends to do, and that's to destroy a good number of Americans and to further impact our economy in a negative way. There is no doubt about that. He is going to do that at a time of his choosing.

COLLINS: Michael Scheuer, we appreciate your time here this morning. Thank you.

SCHEUER: Thank you very kindly, ma'am.

COLLINS: And Senator Saxby Chambliss supports the new CIA director's efforts to revamp the agency. The Georgia Republican and member of the Senate Intelligence Committee is with us now this morning from Capitol Hill.

Senator Chambliss, thanks so much for being with us also.

SEN. SAXBY CHAMBLISS (R), GEORGIA: Sure. Good morning, Heidi.

COLLINS: You just heard Michael Scheuer say that the CIA lost two top guys; that they're going to be missed. Do you think that Porter Goss is going about putting his people into the intelligence agency and going about it the right way?

CHAMBLISS: Well, Heidi, what you have to remember is that the CIA is made up of hard-working, professional, dedicated people all around the world. And Porter Goss came into the agency with his No. 1 priority being to rebuild our humit (ph) or our gathering of intelligence through human assets around the world. This is a deficiency that we know has existed at the CIA. It's been well- documented. And the people who were in charge of that program simply weren't getting the job done.

Now, I don't know whether Porter asked for resignations or whether these people decided to retire or whatever. But the fact of the matter is that anybody who comes in to head an agency, or head a company for that matter, is always going to make changes, because he does need to get his people in place and the people who have his philosophy relative to the issue at hand, not the political issue, but the issue of running that agency. So he's...

COLLINS: Well, listen to this, Senator Chambliss, if you would, listen to what Representative Jane Harman had to say was; of course, the Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee. Listen to this:

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JANE HARMAN (D), CALIFORNIA: Porter Goss is entitled to put his imprint -- I hope not footprint -- on the CIA. And that that's why the president nominated him. And I support that. He was nominated and confirmed by the Senate, and that's appropriate. However, the way he is going about it, through a highly-partisan, quite inexperienced management team is very worrisome.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: But you say the CIA is not political.

CHAMBLISS: Well, no, it's not political. And Jane is my dear friend, and she and I simply disagree about the staff that's in place there and the kind of job they're doing. I don't see any partisan politics being played here.

What I see is that a man is making key decisions about how to best gather intelligence, which will protect Americans for generations to come. And if it means moving people around then, by gosh, we've got to do it. He's got do what he thinks is in the best interests of the intelligence-gatherers around the world, who are going to provide our war fighters with the kind of information they need.

So, Heidi, it's just a matter of putting the best people in place who he thinks are going to do the best job.

COLLINS: Senator Saxby Chambliss, thanks so much. Nice to see you again.

CHAMBLISS: Sure. Same here.

COLLINS: Rick.

SANCHEZ: There was a fistfight and a stabbing at the last night's taping of the Vibe awards. Hip-hop legend Dr. Dre was apparently in the middle of the brawl. One report says that he was attacked. The chair-throwing melee lasted for 10 minutes. One person was stabbed and is said to be in stable condition. There it is. It's not clear if the stabbing was part of the fight at the second annual Vibe magazine awards on urban music. Dr. Dre was just about to receive an award when this fight, this melee, suddenly broke out.

(WEATHER REPORT)

SANCHEZ: Still to come on AMERICAN MORNING, prices at the pump have reached a milestone. And for once, it's good news. Andy is going to be "Minding Your Business."

COLLINS: And next, they're back on Earth after six months alone on the International Space Station. So what was it like? We're going to ask them after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back to AMERICAN MORNING. This is a great segment. Talk about your big picture, guys. Our next guests are just back from a six-month mission on board the International Space Station, Russian commander Gennady Padalka and also American flight engineer Mike Fincke. They returned to Earth on October 23 in Kazakhstan no less, and they returned back to the United States just this last Sunday. They join us now from the Johnson Space Center in Houston.

Gentlemen, as a citizen of Earth, I welcome you both back.

MIKE FINCKE, FLIGHT ENGINEER, INTL. SPACE STATIONS: Thank you. It's really great to be back, and we have a beautiful planet and it's really good to be home.

SANCHEZ: It's interesting you say we have a beautiful planet. What do you now know after being in space and looking back at us that most of us probably don't know or have never figured out?

FINCKE: Oh, boy. There are so many things to -- ways to answer that question. Our planet is really small and fragile and yet incredibly beautiful and diverse. We've seen all of the continents, and every one is different. We don't see any national borders, the atmosphere is kind of thin, and yet there is life everywhere. It's ubiquitous.

SANCHEZ: Do you change...

FINCKE: It's a beautiful planet.

SANCHEZ: Do you change -- and, Gennady, if you'd like, go ahead and get in this. Do you change when you're in space for six months? And if so, how? How do you change? How are you different men today than you were on the day you left?

GENNADY PADALKA, CMDR., INTL. SPACE STATION: It seems to me we don't change, because when were on board the space station we missed our planet, we missed our family and friends. But honestly, on board the space station everyday was a beautiful day for us. And it was very interesting for us to be on board the space station. We conducted a lot of science experiments, and we conducted some spacewalks. And so we were associated with (UNINTELLIGIBLE) space station and to fix some problems.

SANCHEZ: Hey, Gennady, let me ask you this. What was it like living with an American for six months? Did you guys ever argue about anything?

PADALKA: We worked like one team. I don't feel like Mike is American and I'm a Russian. And we started to talk to prepare for a flight. Four years ago, it was Mike, and our assignment was very spontaneous for us. And we worked like one team.

SANCHEZ: Mike, he said you were just...

PADALKA: And there were no borders on board the space station.

SANCHEZ: Mike, he says you're just one team. I bet you he's not delivering the goods here. You guys had to have at least a couple of interesting circumstances up there. I mean, living in cramped quarters with one person for six months, even if you're the best of friends in the world, right?

FINCKE: Well, you know, I thought we would have our moments, too. But to be honest, Gennady is such a great commander, he saw any situation developing and it diffused before it ever became a problem. We really enjoyed every day. We enjoyed each other's company the whole time. And I know that's a little bit rare and a little bit strange, but we honestly enjoyed our work aboard the space station all the time.

SANCHEZ: Job well done, gentlemen. We're proud of both of you. Thanks for being with us. And, Mike, congratulations. I understand you came back and your wife had a surprise for you, something you didn't have when you left.

FINCKE: Yes, my family got bigger. My daughter was born almost five months ago. I wasn't here for that. A lot of servicemen out there who are serving their country miss their families, getting bigger when they're gone, too. But it was really extra special for me when I came back from my spaceflight to have a new little bundle of joy, a little star waiting for me when I came home.

SANCHEZ: Well, good for you, dad. And thanks so much for being with us, Mike. And, Gennady, you as well.

PADALKA: Thank you.

FINCKE: Thank you. It was pleasure.

SANCHEZ: All right, nice wave. There you go.

COLLINS: Oh, a nice little star. That's so cute.

All right, still to come, the reason why it's not as painful at the pump anymore. Andy Serwer is "Minding Your Business" here on AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COLLINS: Plunging oil prices. But will those lower prices show up at the gas pump? Well, with that and a preview of today's Wall Street action, Andy Serwer is "Minding Your Business."

It's a great question.

ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: And the good news is yes.

COLLINS: Well, good.

SERWER: Gas prices have fallen quite a bit, Heidi, over the past couple of weeks. Now finally down below $2 a gallon nationally, $1.96. Still 47 cents above where they were last year.

And as you mentioned, Heidi, falling oil prices have everything to do with that. We're now down 46 and change for a barrel of oil, down from $55 a couple of weeks ago. And I would look for gas prices to continue falling this fall.

You know, we had sort of a perfect storm with the hurricanes and with the problems in Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Nigeria and Norway, and now some of those problems have cleared up. So I think we're going to be looking at some lower -- plus, there are a lot of speculators in the market that are driving the price up.

The lower oil prices is a proximate cause for the markets yesterday to rise. The Dow was up 11 points, you can see here. The S&P off a little bit. But let's not worry about that. The market is up 8 percent since October 25th. We don't want to worry about it, Jack. I mean, well, maybe, you know, I don't know.

JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Smile and be happy.

SERWER: Yes, that's it.

CAFFERTY: Yes.

SERWER: And what's going to be happening today? Wal-Mart just reported earnings. And get this: The world's largest company, profits in the third quarter, do you know how much money they made? $2.29 billion. That's profits. That's not revenues.

CAFFERTY: Man!

SERWER: 2.29 billion, that's after they paid everyone and paid for all of the stuff, and that's a lot of money.

CAFFERTY: Wow!

COLLINS: Good for Wal-Mart.

SERWER: Isn't it?

COLLINS: That is amazing.

CAFFERTY: That's how that family got to be worth all of that money that you wrote about in "Fortune" magazine.

SERWER: Yes, indeed, that's right, a little bit of that.

CAFFERTY: Yes.

SANCHEZ: It's good to be a Walton.

SERWER: Yes, it is.

SANCHEZ: There you go. Well, Jack?

CAFFERTY: Sir.

SANCHEZ: You've been looking into the president's cabinet.

CAFFERTY: No, no. I mean, that sounds good, but I would never do that. Even if I was alone in the room I wouldn't do that.

Secretary of State Colin Powell resigned yesterday. Officials say that he will be replaced by the president's longtime friend and colleague, National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, who is perhaps closer to the president than anyone except his wife.

She will have her hands full, assuming she's confirmed by the Senate. You've got the Middle East. You've got Iraq. You've got Iran. You've got North Korea. Just a few of the issues that will be demanding her attention.

The question is: How will U.S. diplomacy be different with Powell out and Rice in?

Shirley in Dunedin, Florida: "What little wisdom and dignity Powell was able to slip past Bush will be replaced by un-tempered stupidity." This is harsh. "I just can't understand why a woman with that kind of brains and talent would want to be the pretend secretary of state."

Tony in New York: "Losing Colin Powell is one of the worst things that could have happened. Now we have three people in charge with no military experience, no diplomatic skills and no clue. Bush now wants Rice in so she can 'yes' him to death and do whatever he wants."

Jeffery in Montreal: "With Rice in and Powell out, American diplomacy will be much more straight-forward, no wishy-washy attitudes and certainly no more watered-down versions of what the president wants. With Rice in, what Bush wants, Bush gets. She's an extension of him."

And Jaclyn in Ohio: "It's scary. Bush is making yet another monumental mistake. We're going from having an internationally- respected man to the woman who can't even smile. The world needs to begin bracing for a long, cold four years." Finally, Buck in Charlottesville, Virginia: "Just what we need, a clone of Donald Rumsfeld in the State Department. It could have been worse, though. It might have been John Ashcroft."

SERWER: Well, you know, say what you want about Condoleezza Rice. Following Colin Powell is a very tough act.

COLLINS: Yes.

CAFFERTY: Absolutely.

SERWER: I mean, that is a challenge.

COLLINS: And it will be interesting to see where she goes next. As you mentioned, the Middle East, Iran, Iraq, North Korea. She comes to us as a Russian expert.

CAFFERTY: Well, the philosophical discussion that will be had all over this country is whether or not it's healthy to have an opinion besides yours present in the meetings when these issues are being discussed.

SERWER: Right.

CAFFERTY: Colin Powell represented, often in terms of foreign affairs, an opinion that was different than the president's.

SANCHEZ: Right.

CAFFERTY: A lot of people would suggest that's healthy and that it's not so healthy not to have that when you're having those meetings.

SANCHEZ: Right. Should the cabinet be something other than a mutual admiration society?

CAFFERTY: Yes.

COLLINS: We'll have to see.

SANCHEZ: Yes. In a moment, a look at today's top stories. In fact, we're going to be delving into this some more, Condoleezza Rice's apparent move as secretary of state. What policy changes could she have in store? We're going to talk to former White House David Gergen. He's going to weigh in on this. Stay with us. This is AMERICAN MORNING.

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Aired November 16, 2004 - 07:30   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: And welcome back, everyone. It's just about half past the hour here on AMERICAN MORNING. Bill and Soledad are off. I'm Rick Sanchez.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Heidi Collins. In just a few minutes, we're going to get an insider's perspective on whether the CIA is right now an agency in turmoil. Michael Scheuer, who left the CIA just last week, is with us. He's going to talk about these changes and there actually might increase the risk to America and its security.

SANCHEZ: A lot of talk there. Also this half-hour, some guys that have just finished a very tough job, a long way from home, to say the very least. Two crewmen from the International Space Station are with us. They're going to talk about their six months of life in space and some of the very risky work that came with their particular mission.

COLLINS: Right now, though, we want to get another check on what's happening "Now in the News" with Daryn Kagan at the CNN center. Straight to the secretary of state possibility.

DARYN KAGAN, CNN ANCHOR: Heidi, "Now in the News."

Condoleezza Rice looks to replace outgoing Colin Powell as secretary of state. Senior administration officials say that President Bush has tapped Rice for the post. Announcement of her nomination could come as early as today. Rice's top deputy, Stephen Hadley, will take over as national security adviser.

Former President Bill Clinton is kicking off a volunteer youth service program in Little Rock, Arkansas today. It is part of a weeklong celebration, leading up to the opening of Clinton's presidential library. Thousands are expected to be on hand for the dedication ceremony on Thursday. Planners say one part of the $165 million library and museum will focus on Clinton's impeachment, and Monica Lewinsky will also be mentioned.

To health news now. It is the battle of low-fat versus low-carb. A new study suggesting that Atkins-style plans add on pounds in the long run. How about that? Researchers at the Brown Medical School say people who kept weight off limited their fat intake, not their carbs. A spokesman for Atkins says the study did not follow the plan guidelines.

And to Nevada, we want to show you these pictures, the remaining building of the Desert Inn. They came tumbling down a few hours ago. The Desert Inn, say bye-bye, has been part of the Vegas Strip more than 50 years; 233 pounds of explosives were used to bring the building down. It's all to make room for the second phase of the new Wynn Resort. Wynn as in W-Y-N-N, Wynn, not like win, like win a lot of money -- Heidi.

COLLINS: Yes...

(CROSSTALK)

KAGAN: Yes.

COLLINS: Right? All right, Daryn, thanks so much.

More turbulence at the CIA. Two of the nation's top spies resigned yesterday, the latest in a high-level shakeup by new Director Porter Goss.

Michael Scheuer, who ran the CIA's bin Laden unit, left last week, and he also wrote the book, "Imperial Humis -- Hubris" that is, under the name "Anonymous.. Michael Scheuer has emerged from the shadows now. He's joining from Washington this morning to talk more about the agency's overhaul.

Thanks for being here. I want to directly get to this question about the resignation of these two gentlemen, Stephen Cappas (ph) and Michael Sulick (ph). Where do you think this puts the United States in terms of safety and security at this point?

MICHAEL SCHEUER, AUTHOR, "IMPERIAL HUBRIS": Heidi, I think -- frankly, I don't know Mr. Sulick (ph) that well, but my association with Mr. Cappas (ph) leads me to conclude that the nation is poorer for the loss of his services. He's a first-rate officer, a very straight shooter, and will be missed by the clandestine service.

COLLINS: But are we not as safe?

SCHEUER: I think people underestimate the dedication and the talent resident in the Central Intelligence Agency. And I think the people doing the work on the ground will move ahead, as they have in the past. The real danger to the CIA at the moment is just the congressional committee, the Goss-Shelby committee and the 9/11 Commission, which scapegoated really the agency for intelligence failures that were really non-existent.

COLLINS: Intelligence failures that were really non-existent.

SCHEUER: Yes.

COLLINS: Explain.

SCHEUER: If you read the 9/11 Commission report, for example, objectively, it recounts at least 10 occasions on which our government had the opportunity to either capture Osama bin Laden or to provide precise locational information for the military to fire either cruise missiles or an airstrike against him. You know, intelligence failures seldom come from a lack of intelligence. What they come from is a lack of action on that intelligence. And on each of those 10 occasions, the people in our government decided that it was more important not to offend European opinion or not to offend Muslims or, in one case, not to take the chance of possibly killing an Arab prince. All of those things...

COLLINS: Well, it sounds to me a little bit...

SCHEUER: All of those things...

COLLINS: Pardon the interruption.

SCHEUER: ... were more important than protecting Americans.

COLLINS: Well, pardon the interruption, sir.

SCHEUER: Sure.

COLLINS: But isn't that a little bit about what we have already heard about Porter Goss? You talk about risk-taking. And he's been described as this person who is very committed to a more aggressive, more risk-taking-type of CIA.

SCHEUER: I think...

COLLINS: Is that the right approach?

SCHEUER: Yes, it certainly is. There are people within the CIA who are constitutionally risk-adverse and have been for a decade. Our leadership over the past decade, especially at the directorate of operations level has not been terrific. But the scapegoating of the men and women who actually risk their lives to protect the United States is really unconscionable.

And I've just been surprised that the American people haven't been more outraged by the 9/11 Commission report after learning that we had a chance to take care of the bin Laden problem in the 1990s.

COLLINS: Let's listen for just a moment to Peter Hoekstra, of course, Porter Goss' replacement as House Intelligence Committee chairman. He says this about the changes at the CIA:

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

REP. PETER HOEKSTRA (R), MICHIGAN: I think what we're seeing is that Porter is putting his own footprint and imprint on the CIA. That's fully expected. It's not unusual that when an organization will get new leadership, that that leadership will also change a number of the other people within that department.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: It's a question we've debated a couple of days. Your take on whether or not cleaning house really needs to happen. SCHEUER: I think that Mr. Goss needs to set up his own ship. I hope the changes that are being made are not partisan in nature. I certainly support removing officers or asking officers to retire who have proven to be risk-adverse, and there's many of them. But that's a senior-level problem. And I think Mr. Goss is addressing that. But certainly, you don't want to see more partisanship injected into the CIA.

COLLINS: Well, as we mentioned, you resigned from the CIA yourself last week. You were in charge of the hunt for al Qaeda, the hunt for Osama bin Laden. Osama bin Laden is still out there. How do you leave now?

SCHEUER: How do I leave, ma'am?

COLLINS: Yes.

SCHEUER: It came down to the choice between being a good employee or a good citizen. And I've watched over the last three or four years a kind of an effort to denigrate the activities of the clandestine service of the United States. And I decided that it was time to be a good citizen rather than to be a good employee. And the men and women of the clandestine service are at the front line of what is done to protect America.

COLLINS: But quickly, sir, do you know more about what Osama bin Laden may have in store for the United States than anybody else?

SCHEUER: Do I know more? I doubt that. I know the target very well, and I certainly know what he intends to do, and that's to destroy a good number of Americans and to further impact our economy in a negative way. There is no doubt about that. He is going to do that at a time of his choosing.

COLLINS: Michael Scheuer, we appreciate your time here this morning. Thank you.

SCHEUER: Thank you very kindly, ma'am.

COLLINS: And Senator Saxby Chambliss supports the new CIA director's efforts to revamp the agency. The Georgia Republican and member of the Senate Intelligence Committee is with us now this morning from Capitol Hill.

Senator Chambliss, thanks so much for being with us also.

SEN. SAXBY CHAMBLISS (R), GEORGIA: Sure. Good morning, Heidi.

COLLINS: You just heard Michael Scheuer say that the CIA lost two top guys; that they're going to be missed. Do you think that Porter Goss is going about putting his people into the intelligence agency and going about it the right way?

CHAMBLISS: Well, Heidi, what you have to remember is that the CIA is made up of hard-working, professional, dedicated people all around the world. And Porter Goss came into the agency with his No. 1 priority being to rebuild our humit (ph) or our gathering of intelligence through human assets around the world. This is a deficiency that we know has existed at the CIA. It's been well- documented. And the people who were in charge of that program simply weren't getting the job done.

Now, I don't know whether Porter asked for resignations or whether these people decided to retire or whatever. But the fact of the matter is that anybody who comes in to head an agency, or head a company for that matter, is always going to make changes, because he does need to get his people in place and the people who have his philosophy relative to the issue at hand, not the political issue, but the issue of running that agency. So he's...

COLLINS: Well, listen to this, Senator Chambliss, if you would, listen to what Representative Jane Harman had to say was; of course, the Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee. Listen to this:

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JANE HARMAN (D), CALIFORNIA: Porter Goss is entitled to put his imprint -- I hope not footprint -- on the CIA. And that that's why the president nominated him. And I support that. He was nominated and confirmed by the Senate, and that's appropriate. However, the way he is going about it, through a highly-partisan, quite inexperienced management team is very worrisome.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: But you say the CIA is not political.

CHAMBLISS: Well, no, it's not political. And Jane is my dear friend, and she and I simply disagree about the staff that's in place there and the kind of job they're doing. I don't see any partisan politics being played here.

What I see is that a man is making key decisions about how to best gather intelligence, which will protect Americans for generations to come. And if it means moving people around then, by gosh, we've got to do it. He's got do what he thinks is in the best interests of the intelligence-gatherers around the world, who are going to provide our war fighters with the kind of information they need.

So, Heidi, it's just a matter of putting the best people in place who he thinks are going to do the best job.

COLLINS: Senator Saxby Chambliss, thanks so much. Nice to see you again.

CHAMBLISS: Sure. Same here.

COLLINS: Rick.

SANCHEZ: There was a fistfight and a stabbing at the last night's taping of the Vibe awards. Hip-hop legend Dr. Dre was apparently in the middle of the brawl. One report says that he was attacked. The chair-throwing melee lasted for 10 minutes. One person was stabbed and is said to be in stable condition. There it is. It's not clear if the stabbing was part of the fight at the second annual Vibe magazine awards on urban music. Dr. Dre was just about to receive an award when this fight, this melee, suddenly broke out.

(WEATHER REPORT)

SANCHEZ: Still to come on AMERICAN MORNING, prices at the pump have reached a milestone. And for once, it's good news. Andy is going to be "Minding Your Business."

COLLINS: And next, they're back on Earth after six months alone on the International Space Station. So what was it like? We're going to ask them after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back to AMERICAN MORNING. This is a great segment. Talk about your big picture, guys. Our next guests are just back from a six-month mission on board the International Space Station, Russian commander Gennady Padalka and also American flight engineer Mike Fincke. They returned to Earth on October 23 in Kazakhstan no less, and they returned back to the United States just this last Sunday. They join us now from the Johnson Space Center in Houston.

Gentlemen, as a citizen of Earth, I welcome you both back.

MIKE FINCKE, FLIGHT ENGINEER, INTL. SPACE STATIONS: Thank you. It's really great to be back, and we have a beautiful planet and it's really good to be home.

SANCHEZ: It's interesting you say we have a beautiful planet. What do you now know after being in space and looking back at us that most of us probably don't know or have never figured out?

FINCKE: Oh, boy. There are so many things to -- ways to answer that question. Our planet is really small and fragile and yet incredibly beautiful and diverse. We've seen all of the continents, and every one is different. We don't see any national borders, the atmosphere is kind of thin, and yet there is life everywhere. It's ubiquitous.

SANCHEZ: Do you change...

FINCKE: It's a beautiful planet.

SANCHEZ: Do you change -- and, Gennady, if you'd like, go ahead and get in this. Do you change when you're in space for six months? And if so, how? How do you change? How are you different men today than you were on the day you left?

GENNADY PADALKA, CMDR., INTL. SPACE STATION: It seems to me we don't change, because when were on board the space station we missed our planet, we missed our family and friends. But honestly, on board the space station everyday was a beautiful day for us. And it was very interesting for us to be on board the space station. We conducted a lot of science experiments, and we conducted some spacewalks. And so we were associated with (UNINTELLIGIBLE) space station and to fix some problems.

SANCHEZ: Hey, Gennady, let me ask you this. What was it like living with an American for six months? Did you guys ever argue about anything?

PADALKA: We worked like one team. I don't feel like Mike is American and I'm a Russian. And we started to talk to prepare for a flight. Four years ago, it was Mike, and our assignment was very spontaneous for us. And we worked like one team.

SANCHEZ: Mike, he said you were just...

PADALKA: And there were no borders on board the space station.

SANCHEZ: Mike, he says you're just one team. I bet you he's not delivering the goods here. You guys had to have at least a couple of interesting circumstances up there. I mean, living in cramped quarters with one person for six months, even if you're the best of friends in the world, right?

FINCKE: Well, you know, I thought we would have our moments, too. But to be honest, Gennady is such a great commander, he saw any situation developing and it diffused before it ever became a problem. We really enjoyed every day. We enjoyed each other's company the whole time. And I know that's a little bit rare and a little bit strange, but we honestly enjoyed our work aboard the space station all the time.

SANCHEZ: Job well done, gentlemen. We're proud of both of you. Thanks for being with us. And, Mike, congratulations. I understand you came back and your wife had a surprise for you, something you didn't have when you left.

FINCKE: Yes, my family got bigger. My daughter was born almost five months ago. I wasn't here for that. A lot of servicemen out there who are serving their country miss their families, getting bigger when they're gone, too. But it was really extra special for me when I came back from my spaceflight to have a new little bundle of joy, a little star waiting for me when I came home.

SANCHEZ: Well, good for you, dad. And thanks so much for being with us, Mike. And, Gennady, you as well.

PADALKA: Thank you.

FINCKE: Thank you. It was pleasure.

SANCHEZ: All right, nice wave. There you go.

COLLINS: Oh, a nice little star. That's so cute.

All right, still to come, the reason why it's not as painful at the pump anymore. Andy Serwer is "Minding Your Business" here on AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COLLINS: Plunging oil prices. But will those lower prices show up at the gas pump? Well, with that and a preview of today's Wall Street action, Andy Serwer is "Minding Your Business."

It's a great question.

ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: And the good news is yes.

COLLINS: Well, good.

SERWER: Gas prices have fallen quite a bit, Heidi, over the past couple of weeks. Now finally down below $2 a gallon nationally, $1.96. Still 47 cents above where they were last year.

And as you mentioned, Heidi, falling oil prices have everything to do with that. We're now down 46 and change for a barrel of oil, down from $55 a couple of weeks ago. And I would look for gas prices to continue falling this fall.

You know, we had sort of a perfect storm with the hurricanes and with the problems in Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Nigeria and Norway, and now some of those problems have cleared up. So I think we're going to be looking at some lower -- plus, there are a lot of speculators in the market that are driving the price up.

The lower oil prices is a proximate cause for the markets yesterday to rise. The Dow was up 11 points, you can see here. The S&P off a little bit. But let's not worry about that. The market is up 8 percent since October 25th. We don't want to worry about it, Jack. I mean, well, maybe, you know, I don't know.

JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Smile and be happy.

SERWER: Yes, that's it.

CAFFERTY: Yes.

SERWER: And what's going to be happening today? Wal-Mart just reported earnings. And get this: The world's largest company, profits in the third quarter, do you know how much money they made? $2.29 billion. That's profits. That's not revenues.

CAFFERTY: Man!

SERWER: 2.29 billion, that's after they paid everyone and paid for all of the stuff, and that's a lot of money.

CAFFERTY: Wow!

COLLINS: Good for Wal-Mart.

SERWER: Isn't it?

COLLINS: That is amazing.

CAFFERTY: That's how that family got to be worth all of that money that you wrote about in "Fortune" magazine.

SERWER: Yes, indeed, that's right, a little bit of that.

CAFFERTY: Yes.

SANCHEZ: It's good to be a Walton.

SERWER: Yes, it is.

SANCHEZ: There you go. Well, Jack?

CAFFERTY: Sir.

SANCHEZ: You've been looking into the president's cabinet.

CAFFERTY: No, no. I mean, that sounds good, but I would never do that. Even if I was alone in the room I wouldn't do that.

Secretary of State Colin Powell resigned yesterday. Officials say that he will be replaced by the president's longtime friend and colleague, National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, who is perhaps closer to the president than anyone except his wife.

She will have her hands full, assuming she's confirmed by the Senate. You've got the Middle East. You've got Iraq. You've got Iran. You've got North Korea. Just a few of the issues that will be demanding her attention.

The question is: How will U.S. diplomacy be different with Powell out and Rice in?

Shirley in Dunedin, Florida: "What little wisdom and dignity Powell was able to slip past Bush will be replaced by un-tempered stupidity." This is harsh. "I just can't understand why a woman with that kind of brains and talent would want to be the pretend secretary of state."

Tony in New York: "Losing Colin Powell is one of the worst things that could have happened. Now we have three people in charge with no military experience, no diplomatic skills and no clue. Bush now wants Rice in so she can 'yes' him to death and do whatever he wants."

Jeffery in Montreal: "With Rice in and Powell out, American diplomacy will be much more straight-forward, no wishy-washy attitudes and certainly no more watered-down versions of what the president wants. With Rice in, what Bush wants, Bush gets. She's an extension of him."

And Jaclyn in Ohio: "It's scary. Bush is making yet another monumental mistake. We're going from having an internationally- respected man to the woman who can't even smile. The world needs to begin bracing for a long, cold four years." Finally, Buck in Charlottesville, Virginia: "Just what we need, a clone of Donald Rumsfeld in the State Department. It could have been worse, though. It might have been John Ashcroft."

SERWER: Well, you know, say what you want about Condoleezza Rice. Following Colin Powell is a very tough act.

COLLINS: Yes.

CAFFERTY: Absolutely.

SERWER: I mean, that is a challenge.

COLLINS: And it will be interesting to see where she goes next. As you mentioned, the Middle East, Iran, Iraq, North Korea. She comes to us as a Russian expert.

CAFFERTY: Well, the philosophical discussion that will be had all over this country is whether or not it's healthy to have an opinion besides yours present in the meetings when these issues are being discussed.

SERWER: Right.

CAFFERTY: Colin Powell represented, often in terms of foreign affairs, an opinion that was different than the president's.

SANCHEZ: Right.

CAFFERTY: A lot of people would suggest that's healthy and that it's not so healthy not to have that when you're having those meetings.

SANCHEZ: Right. Should the cabinet be something other than a mutual admiration society?

CAFFERTY: Yes.

COLLINS: We'll have to see.

SANCHEZ: Yes. In a moment, a look at today's top stories. In fact, we're going to be delving into this some more, Condoleezza Rice's apparent move as secretary of state. What policy changes could she have in store? We're going to talk to former White House David Gergen. He's going to weigh in on this. Stay with us. This is AMERICAN MORNING.

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