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American Morning

Did U.S. Assault in Falluja Do Anything to Help Cripple Insurgency?; Trying to Get to Bottom of Vioxx Recall

Aired November 19, 2004 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Is it victory or more futility? Did the U.S. assault in Falluja do anything to help cripple the insurgency in Iraq?
Trying to get to the bottom of the Vioxx recall. An FDA insider testifies before the Senate and lists five more drugs that he says are dangerous.

And are up putting off a trip to the dentist? If so, reconsider today. The latest high tech tool to take away all that pain on this AMERICAN MORNING.

ANNOUNCER: From the CNN broadcast center in New York, this is AMERICAN MORNING with Bill Hemmer and Soledad O'Brien.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning.

Welcome back, everybody.

Some of the other stories that we're looking at this morning, we're going to take a look at those further comments from Secretary of State Powell about Iran's nuclear weapons program. Did he cite legitimate evidence and what is the real story about that country's nuclear ambitions?

More on that this morning.

HEMMER: Also, this power struggle in Washington that pits Republicans against Republicans, it might be over. Or is it just beginning? A look at the signals sent in the fight over a key assignment for Senator Arlen Specter. We'll get to that this hour, as well.

O'BRIEN: That's putting it to use. It might be over, or not.

HEMMER: That's right.

O'BRIEN: We've got more.

Good morning -- Jack.

JACK CAFFERTY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: What's the deal with Tom DeLay? He's facing a possible indictment in Texas so they change the rules so in case he gets indicted, he can still between the majority leader? Did they do that?

O'BRIEN: They did.

HEMMER: They did that this week.

CAFFERTY: I mean that's just mind boggling. So if you're an -- coming up in the "Cafferty File," we have pictures of the kissing bandit in the White House, the latest scheme to separate you from your tax dollars and the dumbest schoolteacher in all of England.

HEMMER: Ooh.

CAFFERTY: We're chock full of tasty little tidbits.

HEMMER: Did you have to go far for that one?

CAFFERTY: For what one?

HEMMER: The school teacher?

CAFFERTY: To England.

O'BRIEN: To England.

HEMMER: Yes.

CAFFERTY: See, it says right here, the dumbest school teacher...

HEMMER: How far did you have to look?

CAFFERTY: ... in England.

How far did I have to look?

O'BRIEN: England.

CAFFERTY: Casey Fisher is to blame for these.

HEMMER: That's right.

CAFFERTY: If they're successful, if you like them, they were my idea. If they die a miserable death here on the studio floor, Casey Fisher is the name to remember, right?

O'BRIEN: Spoken like an angry man. You go.

All right, Jack, thanks.

HEMMER: Thank you, Jack.

O'BRIEN: The headlines now.

Heidi Collins at the news desk -- good morning.

HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning to you and good morning, everybody.

Now in the news this morning, Santiago, Chile under tight security this morning. About 4,000 police officers are patrolling ahead of President Bush's arrival for the Asia-Pacific summit. Anti- globalization demonstrators are expected to take to the streets. More than 200 protesters have been detained and released this week.

Meanwhile, President Bush set to approve a new limit on the national debt. The House yesterday approved an $800 billion boost to how much the government can borrow. The move will raise the current debt to $8.2 trillion. A White House official says the president will sign the bill into law on Monday.

The U.S. Department of Agriculture looking into a possible case of mad cow disease. The agency says it is sending tissue samples to a national laboratory for more testing. Officials stress the American beef supply is safe. The animal in question never entered the food supply. Final results, though, expected within the week.

And frustrated by spam, unwanted e-mails trying to sell you everything from lotions to life insurance? Well, match your in box up against Bill Gates'. The Microsoft chairman reportedly gets four million e-mails a day. His CEO says he's probably the most spammed person in the world. Spammed or damned? I'm not quite sure.

O'BRIEN: Well, so that puts it all in perspective.

COLLINS: Yes.

O'BRIEN: So I won't feel so bad about what I get.

COLLINS: Who are we complaining about?

O'BRIEN: Exactly.

All right, thanks, Heidi.

COLLINS: All right.

O'BRIEN: The latest evidence of Iran's nuclear ambitions may not be that solid. Secretary of State Colin Powell said on Wednesday that Iran was working on a delivery system for nuclear weapons. But according to today's "Washington Post," the intelligence Secretary Powell was talking about comes from a single source. Intelligence officers are still, in fact, checking it out.

It's the kind of so-called walk in evidence that led to mistakes about Iraq's weapons of mass destruction.

David Ensor reports now on what is quickly becoming one of the Bush administration's most pressing problems.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

DAVID ENSOR, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): At issue is whether Iran is already working on designs for a nuclear warhead that could sit on top of this, the new Shahab-3 missile, tested in October and designed to hit targets within 2,000 kilometers, or about 1,200 miles. On his way to Chile, Secretary of State Colin Powell told reporters he has seen new intelligence suggesting Iran may be working not only on how to enrich uranium to bomb grade, but also "on delivery systems."

"I'm talking," said Powell, "about information that says that they not only had these missiles, but I'm aware of information that suggests they were working hard as to how to put the two together."

ADAM ERELI, STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESMAN: That's another piece of the puzzle. It is -- it deals with the issue of not necessarily the development of weapons of mass destruction, but the development of delivery systems.

DAVID ALBRIGHT, INSTITUTE FOR SCIENCE AND INTERNATIONAL SECURITY: You'd have to do a lot of engineering feats in order to be at the point of making a missile carry a nuclear warhead.

ENSOR: The problem for the Bush administration, though, is credibility. After sending Powell to the U.N. with intelligence on Iraq's weapons, much of which now appears to have been wrong, will the world take what it is saying seriously this time?

ALBRIGHT: The United States has been accusing Iran of having an active nuclear weapons program for years, and the information often has been ambiguous, or, in some cases, not very good. And so I think that if this information is actionable and is credible, then I would use it to confront the Iranians, not to just walk away from the deal.

ENSOR: The deal in question is the one agreed in principle by three European governments and Iran. Iran would suspend uranium enrichment and allow inspections in exchange for trade and respectability.

(on camera): Many U.S. officials are highly suspicious that Iran would simply use the deal to buy time to make nuclear weapons.

David Ensor, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEO TAPE)

O'BRIEN: U.S. intelligence believes Iran is capable of enriching uranium. But in two years of inspections, the U.N. has not found evidence that Iran is conducting a nuclear weapons program -- Bill.

HEMMER: It's about six minutes past the hour, Soledad.

There's an FDA scientist who says his agcy is not capable of protecting Americans from another Vioxx and that there are five other drugs that should be given a much closer look.

A Senate committee yesterday heard testimony about Vioxx, the pain killer found to increase the risk of heart attack or stroke.

Dr. David Graham described the failure to respond to early indications of the dangers, telling senators in Washington that systematic problems within the FDA are putting Americans in danger.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. DAVID GRAHAM, FDA ASSOCIATE DIRECTOR FOR DRUG SAFETY: Today in 2004, we are faced with what may be the single greatest drug safety catastrophe in the history of this country. I strongly believe that this should have been and largely could have been avoided, but it wasn't. And over 100,000 Americans have paid dearly for this failure. In my opinion, the FDA has let the American people down.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HEMMER: Now the other drugs that Dr. Graham cited as potentially dangerous include the weight loss drug Meridia, the cholesterol lowering drug Crestor, the acne drug Accutane, the pain killer Bextra, the asthma treatment Seravin. The makers of all of these drugs say they are safe when used properly.

Now, several witnesses back Dr. Graham's claims. But one colleague dismissed his research as "junk science." Another administrator testified that the dysfunction described by Dr. Graham was "not the FDA that I know."

Dr. John Abramson, author of "Overdosed America," has been critical of the FDA's relationship with drug companies.

He's here in New York to talk about this topic this morning.

Nice to see you, doctor.

DR. JOHN ABRAMSON, AUTHOR, "OVERDOSED AMERICA": Nice to be with you.

HEMMER: Good morning to you.

I think that quote that's getting the most attention is what we just heard, 100,000 Americans have paid a strong price for that. That is a very strong charge.

ABRAMSON: It is very strong and it's of great concern. We don't know what, exactly what the number is. But certainly tens of thousands of people were exposed to Vioxx to the -- and had heart attacks or sudden death after Merck and the FDA were aware that Vioxx was a significantly more dangerous drug than Naproxen, or Aleve, sold over the counter.

HEMMER: We went into this hearing thinking we were going to hear about Vioxx, but now we have the five others that were mentioned, as well. Initially, it did not appear that that doctor wanted to give up the names of those drugs. He was pushed on it and then they came out.

What are we to take away from this; and for the public, really, for that matter, too?

ABRAMSON: Well, I think the question of Vioxx tells the problem, because there's -- the system is failing. It's not protecting people. The issue is that Merck and the FDA knew about the dangers. The FDA analysts did a wonderful job looking at Merck's data from 2000. The problem is that even though the FDA analysts found that there were significant risks of heart attacks, strokes and blood clots, that information didn't get out of the FDA. It was as if the analysts were working in a soundproof room.

So that the doctors didn't know that there was an increased risk. Docs were prescribing Vioxx thinking they were giving their patients a safer drug when, in fact, it was more dangerous.

HEMMER: Help me understand, if the FDA is found to be complicit with a major drug company, what does the FDA get out of that?

ABRAMSON: Well, the problem is that the division of the FDA that approves new drugs, more than half of its budget comes from the drug companies, comes from user fees from the drug companies. And the part of the FDA that oversees drug safety is within that division. So there's a structural problem. There's not enough separation in the FDA from the drug companies.

HEMMER: So you would conclude the same thing we heard yesterday, that the system is broken.

ABRAMSON: I think the system is broken and the American people deserve a better system, that independently oversees the safety of their drugs. And I think the most important thing is that the American people deserve a system where doctors have access to the best information available.

HEMMER: Is that -- is it that simple, to make it an independent agency? Is that what would get the job done?

ABRAMSON: That'll play a major role. But one of the big problems with Vioxx is that the article in the "New England Journal of Medicine" that reported the results of the Merck study failed to include the key data that Vioxx is significantly more dangerous than Naproxen.

HEMMER: Here's what the FDA says in a statement. "It has a well-documented, longstanding commitment to openness and transparency in its review of marketed drugs that is evidence that the system is working."

That's from the FDA.

"Wall Street Journal" today, Merck has a major push out today, two full page ads today, "For 100 Years, Patients First" and another one, "Our Future, Our Strength."

Can Merck defend itself at this point, based on what we've heard so far?

ABRAMSON: Well, I think Merck has a reasonable point, that they did turn their data over to the FDA. I think the -- in 2000. And the FDA analysts saw that Vioxx was a more dangerous drug.

The problem is that Merck did not get -- make sure that that information was communicated to doctors in a way that doctors understood that Vioxx was a more dangerous drug.

HEMMER: Now, you just mentioned 2000, but yesterday we heard again from the CEO, who was on our program three days ago, who said as soon as they knew about it, and that was a week before the drug was pulled off the markets. That was the first time the company knew about it.

ABRAMSON: That was when the most recent study, the approved study results, became available. But that study from 2000 clearly shows that even in people without a predisposing risk, there was double the risk of heart attacks, strokes and blood clots in the people who took Vioxx compared to the people who took Aleve.

HEMMER: Thank you, doctor.

The story continues.

John Abramson, the author of "Overdosed America."

ABRAMSON: A pleasure to be with you.

HEMMER: Nice to see you.

All right -- and Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Weather now and Chad Myers at the CNN Center for us.

Hey, Chad -- good morning, again.

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Good morning, Soledad.

(WEATHER REPORT)

O'BRIEN: Howard Stern gave away thousands of radios yesterday. A huge crowd came out for the promotion. They blocked traffic in downtown New York. They listened to the controversial radio host talk about his battles with the FCC over decency. That's the reason he's leaving broadcast radio for pay satellite radio.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HOWARD STERN, RADIO PERSONALITY: I want you to experience radio the way I think it should be -- the future of radio, Sirius Satellite Radio will dominate the medium. It is the death of FM radio, the death of the FCC interference. The death of the FCC. Down with the FCC! They have ruined commercial broadcasting.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: You don't hear that a lot, "Down with the FCC!"

Howard Stern is going to hook up with his old boss, Mel Karmazin, when he gets to Sirius. The company yesterday, in fact, confirmed that the former Viacom president will head Sirius Satellite Radio.

Still to come this morning, why you don't have to be afraid of the dentist anymore. Here's one reason -- no more needles. We're "Paging Dr. Gupta."

HEMMER: I like that.

Also ahead, some critics say Arlen Specter sold out to get his gig as head of the Senate Judiciary Committee. The "Gimme A Minute" panel tackles that issue this morning, explaining why, they believe.

O'BRIEN: And coming up next, one reporter says the kidnappings and murders will continue even after the U.S. controls Falluja.

That's ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HEMMER: From Iraq again today, U.S. military officials in Falluja say that town is secure, but still dangerous. Troops are in a search and clear phase, to try and purge the city of any insurgent holdouts planning to disrupt the rebuilding process that will begin some time shortly.

Since the offensive began about two weeks ago, 51 U.S. and eight Iraqi troops have died. Hundreds of others have been injured. It's also estimated that 1,200 insurgents have been killed. Humanitarian and reconstruction operations getting ready now. The interim government working to restore the water and the sewage and the power quickly so residents can go home.

American and Iraqi troops also working to restore order in the northern town of Mosul. Militants there have been targeting police stations and government buildings and health officials say that in the past 10 days 29 have died there. More than 80 others have been injured. That's in Mosul. Iraqi insurgents also threatening in other areas. And for more on that, here is Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Iraqi insurgents, in fact, threatening voters and candidates. They say anyone who runs for office in the upcoming Iraqi elections will be considered infidels and "punished in the name of god."

My next guest, Mark Bowden, is the national correspondent for the "Atlantic Monthly" magazine.

He's been writing about events in Iraq.

His latest book, "Roadwork," is a collection of his writings.

Nice to see you, Mark.

Thanks for being back with us.

Appreciate it.

MARK BOWDEN, "THE ATLANTIC MONTHLY": Thank you, Soledad.

O'BRIEN: We've heard from a senior U.S. commander in Iraq who said that the back of the insurgency, in fact, has been broken.

If that is, in fact, true, do you think that we're going to very soon see the violence come to an end across Iraq?

BOWDEN: No. I don't think that we are. I think that's kind of an overstatement. The insurgency in Iraq is obviously a national movement. It's an urban based guerrilla organization. They will continue to thrive, I think, underground. Taking Falluja back has definitely hurt them and it's, I think it was an essential thing for the United States to do. But it's not going to make them go away.

O'BRIEN: So then you think the phrase "broken the back of the insurgency," in fact, is just not accurate?

BOWDEN: Yes, I think that that -- I suspect that the person who said it, if he was asked again, would probably backtrack from it, because I doubt that you've seen the end of insurgent attacks, even in Falluja. So it's not going to go away this easily.

O'BRIEN: Well, if you're not going to see the end of attacks across Iraq and you're not going to even see the end of insurgent attacks in Falluja, is it fair to say that the operation in Falluja is not a success?

BOWDEN: No, it's not. I think it's an important accomplishment. You know, we're involved in a battle in that country to try to create a democratically elected government and a stable civil society. And these insurgents are determined to disrupt that.

If they continue to occupy whole cities in Iraq, it gives the rather strong impression that they're a much more powerful organization and that it's even potentially possible that they could defeat the United States and the occupation authority and ultimately prevail.

I think that if you leave that city in the hands of insurgents, you fuel that perception and it undermines what we're trying to accomplish.

O'BRIEN: So you say that's essentially the battle for the hearts and minds.

You've said that the U.S. military is -- forces aren't just targeting the terrorists, they're targeting the vast majority of sort of middle class Iraqis, as well. But when you see the devastation of Falluja -- I mean the town, the city is, in many places, just rubble -- hasn't that battle for hearts and minds been lost, to a great degree?

BOWDEN: I don't think so, no. I think that the Iraqi people, as I have understood it, were looking for a strong leader, are fed up with insurgent attacks and frankly are waiting to see, I think, which side in this struggle is going to prevail. I don't think anybody's so naive to think that one side or the other is going to prevail without real fighting at this point. And as long as Falluja remained in the hands of these insurgents, it certainly lent credence to the idea that this whole American led effort in Iraq is ultimately going to fail, which means that people would be less likely to support it, would be less likely to vote, run for office, the kind of things we would like them to do.

O'BRIEN: We mentioned a moment ago the threats, the not so veiled threats from the insurgents about any Iraqis who support American forces, U.S. forces, or coalition forces right now.

Do you think those threats work as well as, say, a car bomb that's parked in front of a police station?

What do Iraqis make of those threats?

BOWDEN: I think they take them very seriously and as long as these attacks continue to happen, it creates -- it makes it very difficult to convince people to come out and vote, to run for office, to report for work, to do the kind of things that we need to have happen to make Iraq, you know, get back on its feet.

But I think by driving this insurgency underground, by refusing to allow them to have safe havens like Falluja, we do make it more difficult for them and I think ultimately that's what we need to do in order to win.

O'BRIEN: Mark Bowden, the national correspondent for the "Atlantic Monthly" magazine.

Nice to see you.

Thanks for coming back to talk to us.

We appreciate it.

BOWDEN: Thank you, Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Bill.

HEMMER: About 21 past the hour.

In a moment here, the president reaching across the aisle to find a Democrat for his cabinet. Democrats, however, think there might be some ulterior motives at play here. We'll explain that when we continue in a moment after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: This is just in to CNN this morning.

A car bomb apparently targeting an Iraqi police convoy has exploded in central Baghdad. We are told that there are many casualties. Nothing further than that, though.

Another indication, really, that the violence is continuing there in spite of efforts to clear out the insurgency in Falluja and across Baghdad. And, of course, another sign that Iraqis being targeted more than ever by these insurgents.

We're going to have more on this, a car bomb exploding in central Baghdad, targeting Iraqis, as soon as we get more information from there -- Bill.

HEMMER: Let's move from Iraq now to Iran and back to Jack and the Question of the Day.

CAFFERTY: Thank you, Bill.

Outgoing Secretary of State Colin Powell says fresh intelligence suggests Iran is working on a program to put a nuclear warhead on a missile. The "Washington Post" quotes two officials in the government who claim that Powell's information is based on a single unvetted source. Iran claims its nuclear program is all about energy, nothing more. Britain, France and Germany are suggesting diplomacy is the best approach to Iran. And the "New York Times" called the whole thing "an eerie repetition of the prelude to the Iraq war."

The question is this -- what should be done about Iran's nuclear program?

The answers are as follows.

Dana, Santi, California: "Iran's nuclear program should be watched very closely for any signs of misleading the IAEA for its intended purpose. If its purpose is for nuclear weapons, then it should not be allowed to continue at all and should be taken out by any means necessary."

George in Chicago: "The last time Powell warned us about a Muslim nation having weapons of mass destruction we invaded a country that didn't have any. Mr. Powell has lost any credibility."

This from Peter in Houston, Texas: "What in god's name are we waiting for? Take out the nuclear facilities immediately and if they resist, take out their oil facilities. No invasion necessary."

And finally, Terry in Fayetteville, North Carolina: 'The best time to intercept a missile is before it leaves the ground, from Vladimir Putin, the current leader of Russia.'"

O'BRIEN: Good point.

All right, thanks, Jack.

The unveiling of Bill Clinton's presidential library had late show host David Letterman joking about all the hoopla and the current president, too.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP FROM "THE LATE SHOW WITH DAVID LETTERMAN, COURTESY CBS/WORLDWIDE PANTS)

DAVID LETTERMAN, HOST: Well, I guess we all know what happened earlier today down there in Little Rock, Arkansas, the opening of the Clinton Presidential Library. Did you hear about this? A big, big event down there. President Bush was actually there. It was a good day for him. He raised $6.5 million. President Bush actually was very excited to be there because, you know, he'd never been to a library before.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: A little catty.

Still to come this morning, did Arlen Specter give up too much to get his Senate chairmanship? We're going to take a look at that.

Plus, have you gone to the dentist lately?

HEMMER: I'm due in a month.

O'BRIEN: Oh, you see. Well, it's not as scary, apparently, as it used to be. We are paging the good doctor, Sanjay Gupta, to find out why.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HEMMER: Welcome back, everybody.

On a Friday, it's 8:30.

Good morning again.

Senate Republicans giving Arlen Specter their nod of approval to chair the powerful Judiciary Committee. But it's a nod that did not come easily. We'll look at an important struggle between some powerful factions that could signal more fights to come down there on Capitol Hill.

O'BRIEN: Also this morning, what's new from the land of pain. Millions of Americans are afraid of going to the dentist. Are they living in the past?

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com


Aired November 19, 2004 - 08:00   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Is it victory or more futility? Did the U.S. assault in Falluja do anything to help cripple the insurgency in Iraq?
Trying to get to the bottom of the Vioxx recall. An FDA insider testifies before the Senate and lists five more drugs that he says are dangerous.

And are up putting off a trip to the dentist? If so, reconsider today. The latest high tech tool to take away all that pain on this AMERICAN MORNING.

ANNOUNCER: From the CNN broadcast center in New York, this is AMERICAN MORNING with Bill Hemmer and Soledad O'Brien.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning.

Welcome back, everybody.

Some of the other stories that we're looking at this morning, we're going to take a look at those further comments from Secretary of State Powell about Iran's nuclear weapons program. Did he cite legitimate evidence and what is the real story about that country's nuclear ambitions?

More on that this morning.

HEMMER: Also, this power struggle in Washington that pits Republicans against Republicans, it might be over. Or is it just beginning? A look at the signals sent in the fight over a key assignment for Senator Arlen Specter. We'll get to that this hour, as well.

O'BRIEN: That's putting it to use. It might be over, or not.

HEMMER: That's right.

O'BRIEN: We've got more.

Good morning -- Jack.

JACK CAFFERTY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: What's the deal with Tom DeLay? He's facing a possible indictment in Texas so they change the rules so in case he gets indicted, he can still between the majority leader? Did they do that?

O'BRIEN: They did.

HEMMER: They did that this week.

CAFFERTY: I mean that's just mind boggling. So if you're an -- coming up in the "Cafferty File," we have pictures of the kissing bandit in the White House, the latest scheme to separate you from your tax dollars and the dumbest schoolteacher in all of England.

HEMMER: Ooh.

CAFFERTY: We're chock full of tasty little tidbits.

HEMMER: Did you have to go far for that one?

CAFFERTY: For what one?

HEMMER: The school teacher?

CAFFERTY: To England.

O'BRIEN: To England.

HEMMER: Yes.

CAFFERTY: See, it says right here, the dumbest school teacher...

HEMMER: How far did you have to look?

CAFFERTY: ... in England.

How far did I have to look?

O'BRIEN: England.

CAFFERTY: Casey Fisher is to blame for these.

HEMMER: That's right.

CAFFERTY: If they're successful, if you like them, they were my idea. If they die a miserable death here on the studio floor, Casey Fisher is the name to remember, right?

O'BRIEN: Spoken like an angry man. You go.

All right, Jack, thanks.

HEMMER: Thank you, Jack.

O'BRIEN: The headlines now.

Heidi Collins at the news desk -- good morning.

HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning to you and good morning, everybody.

Now in the news this morning, Santiago, Chile under tight security this morning. About 4,000 police officers are patrolling ahead of President Bush's arrival for the Asia-Pacific summit. Anti- globalization demonstrators are expected to take to the streets. More than 200 protesters have been detained and released this week.

Meanwhile, President Bush set to approve a new limit on the national debt. The House yesterday approved an $800 billion boost to how much the government can borrow. The move will raise the current debt to $8.2 trillion. A White House official says the president will sign the bill into law on Monday.

The U.S. Department of Agriculture looking into a possible case of mad cow disease. The agency says it is sending tissue samples to a national laboratory for more testing. Officials stress the American beef supply is safe. The animal in question never entered the food supply. Final results, though, expected within the week.

And frustrated by spam, unwanted e-mails trying to sell you everything from lotions to life insurance? Well, match your in box up against Bill Gates'. The Microsoft chairman reportedly gets four million e-mails a day. His CEO says he's probably the most spammed person in the world. Spammed or damned? I'm not quite sure.

O'BRIEN: Well, so that puts it all in perspective.

COLLINS: Yes.

O'BRIEN: So I won't feel so bad about what I get.

COLLINS: Who are we complaining about?

O'BRIEN: Exactly.

All right, thanks, Heidi.

COLLINS: All right.

O'BRIEN: The latest evidence of Iran's nuclear ambitions may not be that solid. Secretary of State Colin Powell said on Wednesday that Iran was working on a delivery system for nuclear weapons. But according to today's "Washington Post," the intelligence Secretary Powell was talking about comes from a single source. Intelligence officers are still, in fact, checking it out.

It's the kind of so-called walk in evidence that led to mistakes about Iraq's weapons of mass destruction.

David Ensor reports now on what is quickly becoming one of the Bush administration's most pressing problems.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

DAVID ENSOR, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): At issue is whether Iran is already working on designs for a nuclear warhead that could sit on top of this, the new Shahab-3 missile, tested in October and designed to hit targets within 2,000 kilometers, or about 1,200 miles. On his way to Chile, Secretary of State Colin Powell told reporters he has seen new intelligence suggesting Iran may be working not only on how to enrich uranium to bomb grade, but also "on delivery systems."

"I'm talking," said Powell, "about information that says that they not only had these missiles, but I'm aware of information that suggests they were working hard as to how to put the two together."

ADAM ERELI, STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESMAN: That's another piece of the puzzle. It is -- it deals with the issue of not necessarily the development of weapons of mass destruction, but the development of delivery systems.

DAVID ALBRIGHT, INSTITUTE FOR SCIENCE AND INTERNATIONAL SECURITY: You'd have to do a lot of engineering feats in order to be at the point of making a missile carry a nuclear warhead.

ENSOR: The problem for the Bush administration, though, is credibility. After sending Powell to the U.N. with intelligence on Iraq's weapons, much of which now appears to have been wrong, will the world take what it is saying seriously this time?

ALBRIGHT: The United States has been accusing Iran of having an active nuclear weapons program for years, and the information often has been ambiguous, or, in some cases, not very good. And so I think that if this information is actionable and is credible, then I would use it to confront the Iranians, not to just walk away from the deal.

ENSOR: The deal in question is the one agreed in principle by three European governments and Iran. Iran would suspend uranium enrichment and allow inspections in exchange for trade and respectability.

(on camera): Many U.S. officials are highly suspicious that Iran would simply use the deal to buy time to make nuclear weapons.

David Ensor, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEO TAPE)

O'BRIEN: U.S. intelligence believes Iran is capable of enriching uranium. But in two years of inspections, the U.N. has not found evidence that Iran is conducting a nuclear weapons program -- Bill.

HEMMER: It's about six minutes past the hour, Soledad.

There's an FDA scientist who says his agcy is not capable of protecting Americans from another Vioxx and that there are five other drugs that should be given a much closer look.

A Senate committee yesterday heard testimony about Vioxx, the pain killer found to increase the risk of heart attack or stroke.

Dr. David Graham described the failure to respond to early indications of the dangers, telling senators in Washington that systematic problems within the FDA are putting Americans in danger.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. DAVID GRAHAM, FDA ASSOCIATE DIRECTOR FOR DRUG SAFETY: Today in 2004, we are faced with what may be the single greatest drug safety catastrophe in the history of this country. I strongly believe that this should have been and largely could have been avoided, but it wasn't. And over 100,000 Americans have paid dearly for this failure. In my opinion, the FDA has let the American people down.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HEMMER: Now the other drugs that Dr. Graham cited as potentially dangerous include the weight loss drug Meridia, the cholesterol lowering drug Crestor, the acne drug Accutane, the pain killer Bextra, the asthma treatment Seravin. The makers of all of these drugs say they are safe when used properly.

Now, several witnesses back Dr. Graham's claims. But one colleague dismissed his research as "junk science." Another administrator testified that the dysfunction described by Dr. Graham was "not the FDA that I know."

Dr. John Abramson, author of "Overdosed America," has been critical of the FDA's relationship with drug companies.

He's here in New York to talk about this topic this morning.

Nice to see you, doctor.

DR. JOHN ABRAMSON, AUTHOR, "OVERDOSED AMERICA": Nice to be with you.

HEMMER: Good morning to you.

I think that quote that's getting the most attention is what we just heard, 100,000 Americans have paid a strong price for that. That is a very strong charge.

ABRAMSON: It is very strong and it's of great concern. We don't know what, exactly what the number is. But certainly tens of thousands of people were exposed to Vioxx to the -- and had heart attacks or sudden death after Merck and the FDA were aware that Vioxx was a significantly more dangerous drug than Naproxen, or Aleve, sold over the counter.

HEMMER: We went into this hearing thinking we were going to hear about Vioxx, but now we have the five others that were mentioned, as well. Initially, it did not appear that that doctor wanted to give up the names of those drugs. He was pushed on it and then they came out.

What are we to take away from this; and for the public, really, for that matter, too?

ABRAMSON: Well, I think the question of Vioxx tells the problem, because there's -- the system is failing. It's not protecting people. The issue is that Merck and the FDA knew about the dangers. The FDA analysts did a wonderful job looking at Merck's data from 2000. The problem is that even though the FDA analysts found that there were significant risks of heart attacks, strokes and blood clots, that information didn't get out of the FDA. It was as if the analysts were working in a soundproof room.

So that the doctors didn't know that there was an increased risk. Docs were prescribing Vioxx thinking they were giving their patients a safer drug when, in fact, it was more dangerous.

HEMMER: Help me understand, if the FDA is found to be complicit with a major drug company, what does the FDA get out of that?

ABRAMSON: Well, the problem is that the division of the FDA that approves new drugs, more than half of its budget comes from the drug companies, comes from user fees from the drug companies. And the part of the FDA that oversees drug safety is within that division. So there's a structural problem. There's not enough separation in the FDA from the drug companies.

HEMMER: So you would conclude the same thing we heard yesterday, that the system is broken.

ABRAMSON: I think the system is broken and the American people deserve a better system, that independently oversees the safety of their drugs. And I think the most important thing is that the American people deserve a system where doctors have access to the best information available.

HEMMER: Is that -- is it that simple, to make it an independent agency? Is that what would get the job done?

ABRAMSON: That'll play a major role. But one of the big problems with Vioxx is that the article in the "New England Journal of Medicine" that reported the results of the Merck study failed to include the key data that Vioxx is significantly more dangerous than Naproxen.

HEMMER: Here's what the FDA says in a statement. "It has a well-documented, longstanding commitment to openness and transparency in its review of marketed drugs that is evidence that the system is working."

That's from the FDA.

"Wall Street Journal" today, Merck has a major push out today, two full page ads today, "For 100 Years, Patients First" and another one, "Our Future, Our Strength."

Can Merck defend itself at this point, based on what we've heard so far?

ABRAMSON: Well, I think Merck has a reasonable point, that they did turn their data over to the FDA. I think the -- in 2000. And the FDA analysts saw that Vioxx was a more dangerous drug.

The problem is that Merck did not get -- make sure that that information was communicated to doctors in a way that doctors understood that Vioxx was a more dangerous drug.

HEMMER: Now, you just mentioned 2000, but yesterday we heard again from the CEO, who was on our program three days ago, who said as soon as they knew about it, and that was a week before the drug was pulled off the markets. That was the first time the company knew about it.

ABRAMSON: That was when the most recent study, the approved study results, became available. But that study from 2000 clearly shows that even in people without a predisposing risk, there was double the risk of heart attacks, strokes and blood clots in the people who took Vioxx compared to the people who took Aleve.

HEMMER: Thank you, doctor.

The story continues.

John Abramson, the author of "Overdosed America."

ABRAMSON: A pleasure to be with you.

HEMMER: Nice to see you.

All right -- and Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Weather now and Chad Myers at the CNN Center for us.

Hey, Chad -- good morning, again.

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Good morning, Soledad.

(WEATHER REPORT)

O'BRIEN: Howard Stern gave away thousands of radios yesterday. A huge crowd came out for the promotion. They blocked traffic in downtown New York. They listened to the controversial radio host talk about his battles with the FCC over decency. That's the reason he's leaving broadcast radio for pay satellite radio.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HOWARD STERN, RADIO PERSONALITY: I want you to experience radio the way I think it should be -- the future of radio, Sirius Satellite Radio will dominate the medium. It is the death of FM radio, the death of the FCC interference. The death of the FCC. Down with the FCC! They have ruined commercial broadcasting.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: You don't hear that a lot, "Down with the FCC!"

Howard Stern is going to hook up with his old boss, Mel Karmazin, when he gets to Sirius. The company yesterday, in fact, confirmed that the former Viacom president will head Sirius Satellite Radio.

Still to come this morning, why you don't have to be afraid of the dentist anymore. Here's one reason -- no more needles. We're "Paging Dr. Gupta."

HEMMER: I like that.

Also ahead, some critics say Arlen Specter sold out to get his gig as head of the Senate Judiciary Committee. The "Gimme A Minute" panel tackles that issue this morning, explaining why, they believe.

O'BRIEN: And coming up next, one reporter says the kidnappings and murders will continue even after the U.S. controls Falluja.

That's ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HEMMER: From Iraq again today, U.S. military officials in Falluja say that town is secure, but still dangerous. Troops are in a search and clear phase, to try and purge the city of any insurgent holdouts planning to disrupt the rebuilding process that will begin some time shortly.

Since the offensive began about two weeks ago, 51 U.S. and eight Iraqi troops have died. Hundreds of others have been injured. It's also estimated that 1,200 insurgents have been killed. Humanitarian and reconstruction operations getting ready now. The interim government working to restore the water and the sewage and the power quickly so residents can go home.

American and Iraqi troops also working to restore order in the northern town of Mosul. Militants there have been targeting police stations and government buildings and health officials say that in the past 10 days 29 have died there. More than 80 others have been injured. That's in Mosul. Iraqi insurgents also threatening in other areas. And for more on that, here is Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Iraqi insurgents, in fact, threatening voters and candidates. They say anyone who runs for office in the upcoming Iraqi elections will be considered infidels and "punished in the name of god."

My next guest, Mark Bowden, is the national correspondent for the "Atlantic Monthly" magazine.

He's been writing about events in Iraq.

His latest book, "Roadwork," is a collection of his writings.

Nice to see you, Mark.

Thanks for being back with us.

Appreciate it.

MARK BOWDEN, "THE ATLANTIC MONTHLY": Thank you, Soledad.

O'BRIEN: We've heard from a senior U.S. commander in Iraq who said that the back of the insurgency, in fact, has been broken.

If that is, in fact, true, do you think that we're going to very soon see the violence come to an end across Iraq?

BOWDEN: No. I don't think that we are. I think that's kind of an overstatement. The insurgency in Iraq is obviously a national movement. It's an urban based guerrilla organization. They will continue to thrive, I think, underground. Taking Falluja back has definitely hurt them and it's, I think it was an essential thing for the United States to do. But it's not going to make them go away.

O'BRIEN: So then you think the phrase "broken the back of the insurgency," in fact, is just not accurate?

BOWDEN: Yes, I think that that -- I suspect that the person who said it, if he was asked again, would probably backtrack from it, because I doubt that you've seen the end of insurgent attacks, even in Falluja. So it's not going to go away this easily.

O'BRIEN: Well, if you're not going to see the end of attacks across Iraq and you're not going to even see the end of insurgent attacks in Falluja, is it fair to say that the operation in Falluja is not a success?

BOWDEN: No, it's not. I think it's an important accomplishment. You know, we're involved in a battle in that country to try to create a democratically elected government and a stable civil society. And these insurgents are determined to disrupt that.

If they continue to occupy whole cities in Iraq, it gives the rather strong impression that they're a much more powerful organization and that it's even potentially possible that they could defeat the United States and the occupation authority and ultimately prevail.

I think that if you leave that city in the hands of insurgents, you fuel that perception and it undermines what we're trying to accomplish.

O'BRIEN: So you say that's essentially the battle for the hearts and minds.

You've said that the U.S. military is -- forces aren't just targeting the terrorists, they're targeting the vast majority of sort of middle class Iraqis, as well. But when you see the devastation of Falluja -- I mean the town, the city is, in many places, just rubble -- hasn't that battle for hearts and minds been lost, to a great degree?

BOWDEN: I don't think so, no. I think that the Iraqi people, as I have understood it, were looking for a strong leader, are fed up with insurgent attacks and frankly are waiting to see, I think, which side in this struggle is going to prevail. I don't think anybody's so naive to think that one side or the other is going to prevail without real fighting at this point. And as long as Falluja remained in the hands of these insurgents, it certainly lent credence to the idea that this whole American led effort in Iraq is ultimately going to fail, which means that people would be less likely to support it, would be less likely to vote, run for office, the kind of things we would like them to do.

O'BRIEN: We mentioned a moment ago the threats, the not so veiled threats from the insurgents about any Iraqis who support American forces, U.S. forces, or coalition forces right now.

Do you think those threats work as well as, say, a car bomb that's parked in front of a police station?

What do Iraqis make of those threats?

BOWDEN: I think they take them very seriously and as long as these attacks continue to happen, it creates -- it makes it very difficult to convince people to come out and vote, to run for office, to report for work, to do the kind of things that we need to have happen to make Iraq, you know, get back on its feet.

But I think by driving this insurgency underground, by refusing to allow them to have safe havens like Falluja, we do make it more difficult for them and I think ultimately that's what we need to do in order to win.

O'BRIEN: Mark Bowden, the national correspondent for the "Atlantic Monthly" magazine.

Nice to see you.

Thanks for coming back to talk to us.

We appreciate it.

BOWDEN: Thank you, Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Bill.

HEMMER: About 21 past the hour.

In a moment here, the president reaching across the aisle to find a Democrat for his cabinet. Democrats, however, think there might be some ulterior motives at play here. We'll explain that when we continue in a moment after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: This is just in to CNN this morning.

A car bomb apparently targeting an Iraqi police convoy has exploded in central Baghdad. We are told that there are many casualties. Nothing further than that, though.

Another indication, really, that the violence is continuing there in spite of efforts to clear out the insurgency in Falluja and across Baghdad. And, of course, another sign that Iraqis being targeted more than ever by these insurgents.

We're going to have more on this, a car bomb exploding in central Baghdad, targeting Iraqis, as soon as we get more information from there -- Bill.

HEMMER: Let's move from Iraq now to Iran and back to Jack and the Question of the Day.

CAFFERTY: Thank you, Bill.

Outgoing Secretary of State Colin Powell says fresh intelligence suggests Iran is working on a program to put a nuclear warhead on a missile. The "Washington Post" quotes two officials in the government who claim that Powell's information is based on a single unvetted source. Iran claims its nuclear program is all about energy, nothing more. Britain, France and Germany are suggesting diplomacy is the best approach to Iran. And the "New York Times" called the whole thing "an eerie repetition of the prelude to the Iraq war."

The question is this -- what should be done about Iran's nuclear program?

The answers are as follows.

Dana, Santi, California: "Iran's nuclear program should be watched very closely for any signs of misleading the IAEA for its intended purpose. If its purpose is for nuclear weapons, then it should not be allowed to continue at all and should be taken out by any means necessary."

George in Chicago: "The last time Powell warned us about a Muslim nation having weapons of mass destruction we invaded a country that didn't have any. Mr. Powell has lost any credibility."

This from Peter in Houston, Texas: "What in god's name are we waiting for? Take out the nuclear facilities immediately and if they resist, take out their oil facilities. No invasion necessary."

And finally, Terry in Fayetteville, North Carolina: 'The best time to intercept a missile is before it leaves the ground, from Vladimir Putin, the current leader of Russia.'"

O'BRIEN: Good point.

All right, thanks, Jack.

The unveiling of Bill Clinton's presidential library had late show host David Letterman joking about all the hoopla and the current president, too.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP FROM "THE LATE SHOW WITH DAVID LETTERMAN, COURTESY CBS/WORLDWIDE PANTS)

DAVID LETTERMAN, HOST: Well, I guess we all know what happened earlier today down there in Little Rock, Arkansas, the opening of the Clinton Presidential Library. Did you hear about this? A big, big event down there. President Bush was actually there. It was a good day for him. He raised $6.5 million. President Bush actually was very excited to be there because, you know, he'd never been to a library before.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: A little catty.

Still to come this morning, did Arlen Specter give up too much to get his Senate chairmanship? We're going to take a look at that.

Plus, have you gone to the dentist lately?

HEMMER: I'm due in a month.

O'BRIEN: Oh, you see. Well, it's not as scary, apparently, as it used to be. We are paging the good doctor, Sanjay Gupta, to find out why.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HEMMER: Welcome back, everybody.

On a Friday, it's 8:30.

Good morning again.

Senate Republicans giving Arlen Specter their nod of approval to chair the powerful Judiciary Committee. But it's a nod that did not come easily. We'll look at an important struggle between some powerful factions that could signal more fights to come down there on Capitol Hill.

O'BRIEN: Also this morning, what's new from the land of pain. Millions of Americans are afraid of going to the dentist. Are they living in the past?

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