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American Morning
Iran's Nuclear Threat; Osama bin Laden's Power; Vioxx Hearing; Interview With Sir Bob Geldof
Aired November 19, 2004 - 08:58 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: U.S. troops discover an al Qaeda command post in Falluja. What's the state of the al Qaeda commanders?
And investigation into Vioxx on Capitol Hill opening up serious questions for the FDA. Does the agency protect consumers or drug companies?
And two 13-year-old girls in shackles, accused of feeding classmates a poison cake. Was it all just a foolish prank? The case continues on this AMERICAN MORNING.
ANNOUNCER: From the CNN broadcast center in New York, this is AMERICAN MORNING with Soledad O'Brian and Bill Hemmer.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: It's 9:00 in New York. Good morning, everybody. It's Friday also.
O'BRIEN: Whew-hoo, I think is what you're trying to say.
HEMMER: Yes, that was a capital "F."
O'BRIEN: Yes.
HEMMER: We like that.
O'BRIEN: Yes, we do.
HEMMER: Other stories this hour. Have you heard what's happening in the state of Washington? 2.8 million ballots were cast for governor this year. Amazingly, the candidates less than 300 votes apart. We'll talk about the recount and all they're saying out there in the American West with a reporter from "The Seattle Times" this morning.
O'BRIEN: Also this morning, Sir Bob Geldof. Can it really be 20 years since Band Aid recorded the hit song, "Do They Know It's Christmas" to help Africans? We're going to him about the anniversary and also what he's doing now to help all of those again. Twenty years, it's hard to believe.
HEMMER: Yes, 20 years it is. And a new effort has been launched, too, a long way from the Boomtown Rats.
Here's Jack Cafferty. Good morning.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: I'll tell you what's scary. I interviewed him 20 years ago when this thing started. I really did, across the street at Channel 4 here in New York. I'm so old.
O'BRIEN: Oh.
CAFFERTY: Intelligence reports that Iran may be knee-deep in a nuclear weapons program, trying to figure out how to arm missiles with nuclear warheads. What should be done about that if it's true? AM@CNN.com is the e-mail address.
HEMMER: All right, thanks, Jack.
Back to Heidi Collins, top of the hour here with the news and the headlines. And there is news breaking out of Iraq this morning again.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: That's right, Bill. In fact, within the past hour, a suicide car bomb attack in Baghdad. The blast apparently targeting Iraqi police at a checkpoint in eastern Baghdad. Officials say there are many casualties.
President Bush heading to Chile this hour for the annual Asia Pacific Economic Cooperation Summit. The president will spend the weekend arguing for new measures to open world trade. He's also expected to talk about the fight against terrorism.
Meanwhile, security is being beefed up throughout Santiago. Anti-globalization protesters are expected to take to the city streets tonight.
Congress sending President Bush a boost in the federal borrowing limit. The House OK'd an $800 billion raise to the nation's debt ceiling. It passed narrowly by a vote of 208-204. The move raises the federal borrowing limit to nearly $8.2 trillion. President Bush is expected to sign the bill into law on Monday.
And a Texas radio host is trying to terminate a recent campaign to change the U.S. Constitution. It's a response to a group supporting California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger for a potential future White House bid. The group wants an amendment to allow non- U.S.-born citizens to run for the presidency. The radio host criticizes Schwarzenegger and says he should not be eligible to run for the commander-in-chief post.
Lots of (UNINTELLIGIBLE) on that one.
HEMMER: They're getting an early start on that, too huh?
COLLINS: Yes. Come one.
HEMMER: Here we have a constitutional amendment still to get through, right, people?
COLLINS: (UNINTELLIGIBLE) started, right.
HEMMER: Thanks, Heidi.
O'BRIEN: Controversy continues over comments that Secretary of State Colin Powell made about Iran's nuclear potential. Powell warning Wednesday that intelligence showed Iran was working on a missile that could be armed with a nuclear warhead.
But this morning "The Washington Post" reports that two U.S. officials say that intelligence has not been verified. That topic could come up at this weekend's APEC economic summit in Chile. And that is where President Bush is heading today. He leaves in about half an hour.
White House correspondent Suzanne Malveaux joins us with more on that.
Good morning to you -- Suzanne.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, good morning, Soledad.
As you know, of course, conflicting reports on that intelligence. White House press secretary Scott McClellan saying it's intelligence that they had seen before.
But the bottom line here, it's all about U.S. credibility. There are some concerns about talking about intelligence publicly, just how much detail used, and whether or not it's verifiable.
And the case that was made for Iraq, that it had weapons of mass destruction when, in fact, they did not have those weapons. So, that is essentially what the bottom line of that argument.
But insiders say that really the president here is going to face perhaps one of his toughest challenges in foreign policy, dealing with the nuclear ambitions not only of Iran, but also, of course, North Korea. Secretary of State Colin Powell is in Santiago Chile, right now, and President Bush will be joining him shortly, later in the day. It is expected, of course, that that is going to come up.
They're going to deal with a number of issues at this economic summit. They're going to be talking about terrorism, as well as trade.
But the bottom line here is that they are trying to get support from Asian allies on trying to re-engage, have North Korea re-engage in talks to abandon its nuclear ambitions. Those six-party talks essentially were abandoned back in September. That is when Kim Jong- il said that he wanted one-on-one talks with the Bush administration, and U.S. officials saying that they were simply waiting for the U.S. elections to be completed before they decided whether or not the administration was going to change its policy.
The Bush administration saying there's no change in policy. That is why it is so critical that they get those other allies, those countries, involved in pushing North Korea to disarm -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: Suzanne Malveaux for us at the White House this morning. Suzanne, thanks.
HEMMER: A few moments ago, we mentioned this suicide car bomb attack in Baghdad targeting police there. Iraqis say there are many casualties.
Elsewhere there, in Falluja, U.S. military officials there are saying the city is now secure but still dangerous. Troops there are in the search-and-clear phase to purge the city of any insurgent holdouts planning to disrupt the rebuilding process that will begin soon.
Now, since the offensive began about two weeks ago, 51 U.S. and 8 Iraqi troops have died. Hundreds of others have been injured. It's also estimated that 1,200 insurgents have been killed.
Now, the humanitarian and reconstruction operations are getting ready. The interim government working to restore the power and the sewage, and also the power quickly so residents can go back home again.
American and Iraqi troops also working to restore order in the northern town of Mosul. Militants there have been targeting police stations and government buildings. And health officials say that over the past 10 days, 29 have died in Mosul. More than 80 others have been wounded.
Also, a top U.S. military official is saying that Osama bin Laden is too weak to run al Qaeda and too disconnected as well. Is that the case? And if so, what does this all mean?
Retired Army Brigadier General James Marks is here with us now from Washington to talk about this.
And, General, welcome. And good morning to you.
BRIG. GEN. JAMES MARKS (RET.), U.S. ARMY: Good morning, Bill.
HEMMER: When we hear a top commander say Osama bin Laden can't command his network, how do we interpret that?
MARKS: Well, what he's really saying -- first of all, he speaks for Central Command. Lieutenant General Smith's comments represent those of the command and greater Defense Department. And what he's really saying is that Osama bin Laden, at this point in the eastern regions of Pakistan, is really too isolated to make any type of daily impact, have any type of daily impact on the operations of al Qaeda. He's still, however, as you know, has an inspirational leadership role and can continue to motivate. But he is isolated, and General Smith made that very clear.
HEMMER: Do you believe he's still there? Two hours ago, we had a guest on here out of London suggesting that with the health condition of Osama bin Laden being so poor, they believe that there is no way he can stand to live in the mountain region of western Pakistan.
MARKS: Well, if he's not there, he would have had, obviously, have been transited someplace. And by doing that you've got to activate a network, and it would have been very likely that that network would have been intercepted, and that we might have a better feel for it. So the latest information I would say, Bill, is that, yes, he is in that region.
HEMMER: Back to the original question. Is it smart to essentially telegraph what you believe the condition the al Qaeda network is today?
MARKS: Well, that's a great question. I would tell you what this statement, it was clearly intended to poke Osama bin Laden in the eye. And by doing that, you get -- you can get a number of results. One is he gets busy. He gets aggressive. He wants to demonstrate how -- quote -- "irrelevant" he is. And he might be trying to plan an operation. And by doing that he's got to activate his network. By doing that he becomes vulnerable.
The other result could be is that he gets lazy. Don't anticipate the latter. I would anticipate that he might feel that he's been poked and he's going to try to demonstrate that he truly is not irrelevant. But by doing that he becomes vulnerable.
HEMMER: Let's move away from Osama bin Laden and put our focus back on Falluja. A top commander there is saying the insurgents' back is now broken in Iraq. Do you agree with that statement? Or is that statement too strong at this point?
MARKS: I think it's too strong, Bill. Clearly, a tremendous result has come from the operations in Falluja in terms of the coalition forces being able to roust the insurgents out of that city. The insurgents will make every effort to come back in, and that's why it's critical that they maintain the hold on that city. But operations elsewhere within the Sunni Triangle will continue to grow.
HEMMER: There is a famous quote given years ago that trying to put down an insurgency, whether it's in Iraq or anywhere in the world, is trying to eat soup with a knife.
MARKS: Right.
HEMMER: Do you see that as a reality in Iraq today?
MARKS: Well, I do. I mean, that was from World War I experience in the Mideast. You really have very, very difficult challenges in a counter-insurgency. And in this century there's only one real model for how to handle a counter-insurgency, and that was the British experience in Malaysia. But there were circumstances there that provided the success that the British had, but primary among them is the British were there for close to 15 years. So there is a very long commitment in order to make that happen.
HEMMER: But if that's the case then and if all of this is true, how do you win this?
MARKS: Well, you have to stay the course. You've got to be able to take the fight back to the insurgents. You've got to go toward their center of gravity, Bill, which is the urban areas. It's not Zarqawi. It's not the leadership, I would argue. It's where they can continue to grow and fester and execute some degree of coalescing and elements of control. HEMMER: Yes.
MARKS: You've got to get them out of the cities.
HEMMER: Thank you. Come back, OK? Brigadier General James Marks there in D.C.
MARKS: Thanks, Bill.
HEMMER: Nice to chat with you -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: The recall of Vioxx is the largest drug recall in this company's history. The safety record of the arthritis drug was examined yesterday on Capitol Hill. The Senate Finance Committee grilling the drug-maker's CEO and doctors from the FDA.
Chris Huntington has this report from the hearings.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What do we do about what we find?
CHRIS HUNTINGTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): FDA scientist David Graham testified that he estimates Vioxx caused more than 100,000 heart attacks, 30 to 40 percent of them fatal. But Graham told members of the Senate Finance Committee that his FDA superiors ridiculed him and insisted on changes.
DR. DAVID GRAHAM, ASSOCIATE DIRECTOR FOR SCIENCE FDA: I was pressured to change my conclusions and recommendations. One drug safety manager recommended that I should be barred from presenting the poster at the meeting and also noted that Merck needed to know our study results.
HUNTINGTON: Graham offered a blistering condemnation of the FDA's drug safety program, saying that the system is broken and often overlooks the dangers of drug side effects.
GRAHAM: The FDA as currently configured is incapable of protecting America against another Vioxx.
HUNTINGTON: A senior FDA official responsible for evaluating new drugs flatly dismissed Graham's assessment and rejected his contention that several drugs still on the market, including Bextra, a Cox-II inhibitor from Pfizer, are dangerous and should be recalled.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you agree with Dr. Graham that five drugs he mentioned pose a significant safety risk to Americans?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, I do not.
HUNTINGTON: Testifying via satellite, a former Merck consultant told lawmakers that the company refused his request for data on Vioxx- related heart attacks. And another doctor disputed Merck's central points that heart attacks occurred only in those who took the drug for more than 18 months. DR. BRUCE PSATY, UNIVERSITY OF WASHINGTON: Merck lacked information to know when the risk occurred, and you cannot say with confidence given the available data.
HUNTINGTON: Merck Chairman and CEO Ray Gilmartin presented a well-honed defense of his company and Vioxx, insisting that the first time Merck saw clinical evidence of heart attacks linked to Vioxx was just a week before the drug was pulled from the market in late September.
DR. RAYMOND GILMARTIN, CHAIRMAN, PRESIDENT AND CEO, MERCK: Merck believed wholeheartedly in Vioxx. I believed wholeheartedly in Vioxx. In fact, my wife was taking Vioxx, using Vioxx up until the day we withdrew it from the market.
HUNTINGTON (on camera): While there were heated disagreements in the hearing about the way that Merck and the FDA handled the Vioxx situation, there was consensus that in the future all available information about a drug must be made public, particularly the negative findings.
Chris Huntington, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
O'BRIEN: In addition to Bextra, other drugs that Dr. David Graham singled out as potentially dangerous are the weight-loss pill, Meridia, the cholesterol-lowering drug, Crestor, the acne drug, Accutane, and the asthma treatment, Serevent. The makers of those drugs say they're all safe if they're used properly.
(WEATHER REPORT)
O'BRIEN: Still to come this morning, two students who saved their teacher's life, defending her from a knife-wielding attacker. It's a pretty amazing story. We're going to talk with the kids and their teacher coming up.
HEMMER: Also, Howard Stern finds a novel way to ensure that he'll -- he always finds novel ways, does he not? Trying to ensure that he'll still have lots of listeners when he switches jobs. We'll explain that. He was on the streets of New York this week.
O'BRIEN: And coming up next, 20 years after the landmark recording, Band Aid is back with a message of giving this holiday season. We're going to talk to the man behind it, Sir Bob Geldof. That's next on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: The year was 1984. Now 20 years later, after some of music's biggest stars came together to record the song, "Do They Know It's Christmas," are raising millions for famine relief in Africa, specifically Ethiopia.
Now two decades later, another generation of rock royalty with a new version of that song are trying again to focus the attention of the world on the crisis in Africa.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GROUP (singing): Feed the world, let them know it's Christmastime. Feed the world, let them know it's Christmastime.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HEMMER: 2004, the man behind it all then and now, musician and humanitarian Sir Bob Geldof is with us this morning live in New York City.
It's great to see you and great to have you, Sir Bob. Good morning to you.
SIR BOB GELDOF, MUSICIAN, HUMANITARIAN: Good morning. I was a bit alarmed that Jude Law was the sexiest man alive.
HEMMER: Oh, yes?
GELDOF: Hello? You know...
HEMMER: You guys could be separated at birth, could you not?
GELDOF: Yes. Hey, what can I say?
HEMMER: Listen, I want to get into all of the matters of what's happening in Sudan in a moment here.
GELDOF: Yes.
HEMMER: Who's on the list this time in 2004 who signed up for this project?
GELDOF: Well, we've got the oldies, of course. We've got McCartney and Bono, reprising his role in 1984, Coldplay , Radiohead, Travis, Dido, Robbie Williams, all of the new British kids on the block, you know.
HEMMER: Yes. What can you say, Bob, now, two decades later, that -- what did Live Aid do in 1984 that still helps the people of Ethiopia today?
GELDOF: Well, I think in 1984, I mean, you know, I just -- I saw something on tele (ph) and I just wanted to do something about it personally. And then it became a phenomenon, led to USA For Africa. That in turn led to Live Aid, and that really addressed the issue to of poverty in Africa on a political level. I mean, yes, we got $144 million from that. And that kept immense numbers of people alive.
But more to the point, it drove the issue of Africa to the top of the political agenda. And that was necessary, because there were millions of people dying of want in a world of surplus, and I just thought that was ridiculous. And as it happened, so did the rest of the world. But it's taken 20 years for us to take that from an idea of charity to one of political justice. And next year, Tony Blair, who watched Live Aid all day, who is the same age as me, he's hosting the G8. It's the seven richest countries in the world plus Russia. And he's also pressing the European Union (UNINTELLIGIBLE) he won his own election, which he will win. So it makes him very politically influential around the world.
And he really is as one with myself and Bono on this issue. And I persuaded him to do this commission for Africa, which is why I'm in America this morning to deal with the U.S. end of that.
HEMMER: You know, I would say also, Sir Bob, that in 20 years' time, a lot's changed on this planet.
GELDOF: Yes.
HEMMER: And for that matter a lot has stayed the same as well.
GELDOF: Yes, you're absolutely right.
HEMMER: You know, I'm curious, has technology helped make awareness better for people globally? Because if you think back to 1984, the only people who truly became aware of your movement was when you did the live concerts.
GELDOF: I think that's true. But you see, you remember back in '84 very few people had mobile phones, very few had fax. Only important people had answering machines. The common form of international communication was telex. And we didn't realize that there were satellites everywhere. CNN was very new. MTV was very new.
HEMMER: Yes.
GELDOF: And so we started talking to each other simultaneously. Within two years, the Cold War had collapsed. You had globalization. You had computerization with 24/7 money. And the world changed. And we're dealing with those consequences now. But the same -- what you're correct about is that the one constant that remains in decline of all the continents is Africa.
HEMMER: Listen, I want to wish you the best of luck. I know the focus 20 years ago was...
GELDOF: You didn't sound very interested (UNINTELLIGIBLE), OK.
HEMMER: Not at all. Not at all. I've very interested. Listen, I'm very honored to talk with you today, too.
GELDOF: Thanks a lot, man.
HEMMER: I've been looking forward to this interview all week.
GELDOF: I can tell.
HEMMER: No, it is true. And I want to wish you lots of luck.
GELDOF: Thank you.
HEMMER: And I know the focus 20 years ago was Ethiopia; now it's Sudan. And, Jude Law, eat your heart out, OK?
GELDOF: What can I say?
HEMMER: Sir Bob Geldof...
GELDOF: Thank you.
HEMMER: You got it. Good luck -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: Still to come this morning, a bad prank or a plot to commit murder? Two teens in serious trouble for a cake they served up in school. That's ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O'BRIEN: Howard Stern gave away thousands of satellite radios and subscriptions yesterday, a huge crowd coming out for the promotion. They blocked traffic in downtown New York City, which I was stuck in. They listened to the controversial radio host talk about his battles with the FCC over decency, the reason he's leaving broadcast radio for pay satellite radio.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HOWARD STERN, SHOCK JOCK: I want you to experience radio the way I think it should be, the future of radio. Sirius Satellite Radio will dominate the medium. It is the death of FM radio, the death of the FCC interference, the death of the FCC. Down with the FCC! They have ruined commercial radio!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: Howard Stern is hooking up with his old boss, Mel Karmazin, when he gets to Sirius. The company confirming yesterday that the former Viacom president will head Sirius Satellite Radio.
HEMMER: How do you think he really feels?
O'BRIEN: Yes, you never hear that a lot. Down with the FCC.
HEMMER: Death to the FCC.
What's happening, Jack?
CAFFERTY: I read in the paper that Karmazin is going to get $120 million.
O'BRIEN: That's what they say.
CAFFERTY: Huh?
O'BRIEN: That's a nice payday.
CAFFERTY: Man!
O'BRIEN: It's kind of what you make, right?
CAFFERTY: Yes, yes, yes.
O'BRIEN: Being on AMERICAN MORNING?
CAFFERTY: Secretary of State Colin Powell says fresh intelligence suggests that Iran is working on a program to arm a missile with a nuclear warhead. "The Washington Post" quotes government officials saying that the claim by Powell is based on a single unvetted source. So, they're questioning the intelligence.
Iran says its nuclear program is all about nuclear power plants. Britain, France and Germany say diplomacy is the best approach here. But you guys ultimately have the best answers to what should be done about Iran's nuclear program.
Patrick writes: "If the Iranians continue to pursue nuclear anything, I don't believe we'll have to worry about it much. Harkin back to the mid 1980s, a nuclear plant in the sand in Iraq. Israel doesn't like that kind of thing."
Patrick in Long Island: "It's amazing to me they start to sound the drums of war. Iran has done nothing illegal. Having nuclear power plants isn't illegal. Enriching uranium for these power plants is also not illegal. Hmm, I wonder how much oil they have?"
Marsha in Tampa, Florida: "It may be too late for diplomacy. Iran knows what to expect from this president and will not stop preparing to defend itself. Can you blame them?"
And Doug in Alturas, California: "Everyone's here for a purpose, even if it's only to serve as an example to everyone else. When I say 'example,' I'm envisioning a large, glowing hole in the Iranian desert. Yes, that kind of example."
O'BRIEN: Wow! A tough crowd today in these e-mails.
HEMMER: So Powell came out. He made this statement based on one report, right? Then they came back and said it wasn't verified, because they need a second source. Is that how it went down?
CAFFERTY: They're questioning this latest statement by Powell. But the rumors and the accusations and the reports of Iran monkeying around with enriched uranium go back a lot farther than this week.
HEMMER: That's right.
CAFFERTY: It's been around a long time. And, you know...
O'BRIEN: In the IAEA's findings themselves, in their, whatever, 30-odd page report, said we can't find -- everything that they've accounted for we've accounted for. And, of course, that's the big question.
HEMMER: That's right. And before the war with Iraq broke out, we had Mohammad ElBaradei on the air from Vienna, Austria. And back then they were running into problems getting the access to the areas of Iran that they were looking for.
CAFFERTY: Yes.
HEMMER: And that continues. Thanks, Jack.
O'BRIEN: Jack, thanks.
Still to come this morning, get your weekend started early with some "90-Second Pop."
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Aired November 19, 2004 - 08:58 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: U.S. troops discover an al Qaeda command post in Falluja. What's the state of the al Qaeda commanders?
And investigation into Vioxx on Capitol Hill opening up serious questions for the FDA. Does the agency protect consumers or drug companies?
And two 13-year-old girls in shackles, accused of feeding classmates a poison cake. Was it all just a foolish prank? The case continues on this AMERICAN MORNING.
ANNOUNCER: From the CNN broadcast center in New York, this is AMERICAN MORNING with Soledad O'Brian and Bill Hemmer.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: It's 9:00 in New York. Good morning, everybody. It's Friday also.
O'BRIEN: Whew-hoo, I think is what you're trying to say.
HEMMER: Yes, that was a capital "F."
O'BRIEN: Yes.
HEMMER: We like that.
O'BRIEN: Yes, we do.
HEMMER: Other stories this hour. Have you heard what's happening in the state of Washington? 2.8 million ballots were cast for governor this year. Amazingly, the candidates less than 300 votes apart. We'll talk about the recount and all they're saying out there in the American West with a reporter from "The Seattle Times" this morning.
O'BRIEN: Also this morning, Sir Bob Geldof. Can it really be 20 years since Band Aid recorded the hit song, "Do They Know It's Christmas" to help Africans? We're going to him about the anniversary and also what he's doing now to help all of those again. Twenty years, it's hard to believe.
HEMMER: Yes, 20 years it is. And a new effort has been launched, too, a long way from the Boomtown Rats.
Here's Jack Cafferty. Good morning.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: I'll tell you what's scary. I interviewed him 20 years ago when this thing started. I really did, across the street at Channel 4 here in New York. I'm so old.
O'BRIEN: Oh.
CAFFERTY: Intelligence reports that Iran may be knee-deep in a nuclear weapons program, trying to figure out how to arm missiles with nuclear warheads. What should be done about that if it's true? AM@CNN.com is the e-mail address.
HEMMER: All right, thanks, Jack.
Back to Heidi Collins, top of the hour here with the news and the headlines. And there is news breaking out of Iraq this morning again.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: That's right, Bill. In fact, within the past hour, a suicide car bomb attack in Baghdad. The blast apparently targeting Iraqi police at a checkpoint in eastern Baghdad. Officials say there are many casualties.
President Bush heading to Chile this hour for the annual Asia Pacific Economic Cooperation Summit. The president will spend the weekend arguing for new measures to open world trade. He's also expected to talk about the fight against terrorism.
Meanwhile, security is being beefed up throughout Santiago. Anti-globalization protesters are expected to take to the city streets tonight.
Congress sending President Bush a boost in the federal borrowing limit. The House OK'd an $800 billion raise to the nation's debt ceiling. It passed narrowly by a vote of 208-204. The move raises the federal borrowing limit to nearly $8.2 trillion. President Bush is expected to sign the bill into law on Monday.
And a Texas radio host is trying to terminate a recent campaign to change the U.S. Constitution. It's a response to a group supporting California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger for a potential future White House bid. The group wants an amendment to allow non- U.S.-born citizens to run for the presidency. The radio host criticizes Schwarzenegger and says he should not be eligible to run for the commander-in-chief post.
Lots of (UNINTELLIGIBLE) on that one.
HEMMER: They're getting an early start on that, too huh?
COLLINS: Yes. Come one.
HEMMER: Here we have a constitutional amendment still to get through, right, people?
COLLINS: (UNINTELLIGIBLE) started, right.
HEMMER: Thanks, Heidi.
O'BRIEN: Controversy continues over comments that Secretary of State Colin Powell made about Iran's nuclear potential. Powell warning Wednesday that intelligence showed Iran was working on a missile that could be armed with a nuclear warhead.
But this morning "The Washington Post" reports that two U.S. officials say that intelligence has not been verified. That topic could come up at this weekend's APEC economic summit in Chile. And that is where President Bush is heading today. He leaves in about half an hour.
White House correspondent Suzanne Malveaux joins us with more on that.
Good morning to you -- Suzanne.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, good morning, Soledad.
As you know, of course, conflicting reports on that intelligence. White House press secretary Scott McClellan saying it's intelligence that they had seen before.
But the bottom line here, it's all about U.S. credibility. There are some concerns about talking about intelligence publicly, just how much detail used, and whether or not it's verifiable.
And the case that was made for Iraq, that it had weapons of mass destruction when, in fact, they did not have those weapons. So, that is essentially what the bottom line of that argument.
But insiders say that really the president here is going to face perhaps one of his toughest challenges in foreign policy, dealing with the nuclear ambitions not only of Iran, but also, of course, North Korea. Secretary of State Colin Powell is in Santiago Chile, right now, and President Bush will be joining him shortly, later in the day. It is expected, of course, that that is going to come up.
They're going to deal with a number of issues at this economic summit. They're going to be talking about terrorism, as well as trade.
But the bottom line here is that they are trying to get support from Asian allies on trying to re-engage, have North Korea re-engage in talks to abandon its nuclear ambitions. Those six-party talks essentially were abandoned back in September. That is when Kim Jong- il said that he wanted one-on-one talks with the Bush administration, and U.S. officials saying that they were simply waiting for the U.S. elections to be completed before they decided whether or not the administration was going to change its policy.
The Bush administration saying there's no change in policy. That is why it is so critical that they get those other allies, those countries, involved in pushing North Korea to disarm -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: Suzanne Malveaux for us at the White House this morning. Suzanne, thanks.
HEMMER: A few moments ago, we mentioned this suicide car bomb attack in Baghdad targeting police there. Iraqis say there are many casualties.
Elsewhere there, in Falluja, U.S. military officials there are saying the city is now secure but still dangerous. Troops there are in the search-and-clear phase to purge the city of any insurgent holdouts planning to disrupt the rebuilding process that will begin soon.
Now, since the offensive began about two weeks ago, 51 U.S. and 8 Iraqi troops have died. Hundreds of others have been injured. It's also estimated that 1,200 insurgents have been killed.
Now, the humanitarian and reconstruction operations are getting ready. The interim government working to restore the power and the sewage, and also the power quickly so residents can go back home again.
American and Iraqi troops also working to restore order in the northern town of Mosul. Militants there have been targeting police stations and government buildings. And health officials say that over the past 10 days, 29 have died in Mosul. More than 80 others have been wounded.
Also, a top U.S. military official is saying that Osama bin Laden is too weak to run al Qaeda and too disconnected as well. Is that the case? And if so, what does this all mean?
Retired Army Brigadier General James Marks is here with us now from Washington to talk about this.
And, General, welcome. And good morning to you.
BRIG. GEN. JAMES MARKS (RET.), U.S. ARMY: Good morning, Bill.
HEMMER: When we hear a top commander say Osama bin Laden can't command his network, how do we interpret that?
MARKS: Well, what he's really saying -- first of all, he speaks for Central Command. Lieutenant General Smith's comments represent those of the command and greater Defense Department. And what he's really saying is that Osama bin Laden, at this point in the eastern regions of Pakistan, is really too isolated to make any type of daily impact, have any type of daily impact on the operations of al Qaeda. He's still, however, as you know, has an inspirational leadership role and can continue to motivate. But he is isolated, and General Smith made that very clear.
HEMMER: Do you believe he's still there? Two hours ago, we had a guest on here out of London suggesting that with the health condition of Osama bin Laden being so poor, they believe that there is no way he can stand to live in the mountain region of western Pakistan.
MARKS: Well, if he's not there, he would have had, obviously, have been transited someplace. And by doing that you've got to activate a network, and it would have been very likely that that network would have been intercepted, and that we might have a better feel for it. So the latest information I would say, Bill, is that, yes, he is in that region.
HEMMER: Back to the original question. Is it smart to essentially telegraph what you believe the condition the al Qaeda network is today?
MARKS: Well, that's a great question. I would tell you what this statement, it was clearly intended to poke Osama bin Laden in the eye. And by doing that, you get -- you can get a number of results. One is he gets busy. He gets aggressive. He wants to demonstrate how -- quote -- "irrelevant" he is. And he might be trying to plan an operation. And by doing that he's got to activate his network. By doing that he becomes vulnerable.
The other result could be is that he gets lazy. Don't anticipate the latter. I would anticipate that he might feel that he's been poked and he's going to try to demonstrate that he truly is not irrelevant. But by doing that he becomes vulnerable.
HEMMER: Let's move away from Osama bin Laden and put our focus back on Falluja. A top commander there is saying the insurgents' back is now broken in Iraq. Do you agree with that statement? Or is that statement too strong at this point?
MARKS: I think it's too strong, Bill. Clearly, a tremendous result has come from the operations in Falluja in terms of the coalition forces being able to roust the insurgents out of that city. The insurgents will make every effort to come back in, and that's why it's critical that they maintain the hold on that city. But operations elsewhere within the Sunni Triangle will continue to grow.
HEMMER: There is a famous quote given years ago that trying to put down an insurgency, whether it's in Iraq or anywhere in the world, is trying to eat soup with a knife.
MARKS: Right.
HEMMER: Do you see that as a reality in Iraq today?
MARKS: Well, I do. I mean, that was from World War I experience in the Mideast. You really have very, very difficult challenges in a counter-insurgency. And in this century there's only one real model for how to handle a counter-insurgency, and that was the British experience in Malaysia. But there were circumstances there that provided the success that the British had, but primary among them is the British were there for close to 15 years. So there is a very long commitment in order to make that happen.
HEMMER: But if that's the case then and if all of this is true, how do you win this?
MARKS: Well, you have to stay the course. You've got to be able to take the fight back to the insurgents. You've got to go toward their center of gravity, Bill, which is the urban areas. It's not Zarqawi. It's not the leadership, I would argue. It's where they can continue to grow and fester and execute some degree of coalescing and elements of control. HEMMER: Yes.
MARKS: You've got to get them out of the cities.
HEMMER: Thank you. Come back, OK? Brigadier General James Marks there in D.C.
MARKS: Thanks, Bill.
HEMMER: Nice to chat with you -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: The recall of Vioxx is the largest drug recall in this company's history. The safety record of the arthritis drug was examined yesterday on Capitol Hill. The Senate Finance Committee grilling the drug-maker's CEO and doctors from the FDA.
Chris Huntington has this report from the hearings.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What do we do about what we find?
CHRIS HUNTINGTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): FDA scientist David Graham testified that he estimates Vioxx caused more than 100,000 heart attacks, 30 to 40 percent of them fatal. But Graham told members of the Senate Finance Committee that his FDA superiors ridiculed him and insisted on changes.
DR. DAVID GRAHAM, ASSOCIATE DIRECTOR FOR SCIENCE FDA: I was pressured to change my conclusions and recommendations. One drug safety manager recommended that I should be barred from presenting the poster at the meeting and also noted that Merck needed to know our study results.
HUNTINGTON: Graham offered a blistering condemnation of the FDA's drug safety program, saying that the system is broken and often overlooks the dangers of drug side effects.
GRAHAM: The FDA as currently configured is incapable of protecting America against another Vioxx.
HUNTINGTON: A senior FDA official responsible for evaluating new drugs flatly dismissed Graham's assessment and rejected his contention that several drugs still on the market, including Bextra, a Cox-II inhibitor from Pfizer, are dangerous and should be recalled.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you agree with Dr. Graham that five drugs he mentioned pose a significant safety risk to Americans?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, I do not.
HUNTINGTON: Testifying via satellite, a former Merck consultant told lawmakers that the company refused his request for data on Vioxx- related heart attacks. And another doctor disputed Merck's central points that heart attacks occurred only in those who took the drug for more than 18 months. DR. BRUCE PSATY, UNIVERSITY OF WASHINGTON: Merck lacked information to know when the risk occurred, and you cannot say with confidence given the available data.
HUNTINGTON: Merck Chairman and CEO Ray Gilmartin presented a well-honed defense of his company and Vioxx, insisting that the first time Merck saw clinical evidence of heart attacks linked to Vioxx was just a week before the drug was pulled from the market in late September.
DR. RAYMOND GILMARTIN, CHAIRMAN, PRESIDENT AND CEO, MERCK: Merck believed wholeheartedly in Vioxx. I believed wholeheartedly in Vioxx. In fact, my wife was taking Vioxx, using Vioxx up until the day we withdrew it from the market.
HUNTINGTON (on camera): While there were heated disagreements in the hearing about the way that Merck and the FDA handled the Vioxx situation, there was consensus that in the future all available information about a drug must be made public, particularly the negative findings.
Chris Huntington, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
O'BRIEN: In addition to Bextra, other drugs that Dr. David Graham singled out as potentially dangerous are the weight-loss pill, Meridia, the cholesterol-lowering drug, Crestor, the acne drug, Accutane, and the asthma treatment, Serevent. The makers of those drugs say they're all safe if they're used properly.
(WEATHER REPORT)
O'BRIEN: Still to come this morning, two students who saved their teacher's life, defending her from a knife-wielding attacker. It's a pretty amazing story. We're going to talk with the kids and their teacher coming up.
HEMMER: Also, Howard Stern finds a novel way to ensure that he'll -- he always finds novel ways, does he not? Trying to ensure that he'll still have lots of listeners when he switches jobs. We'll explain that. He was on the streets of New York this week.
O'BRIEN: And coming up next, 20 years after the landmark recording, Band Aid is back with a message of giving this holiday season. We're going to talk to the man behind it, Sir Bob Geldof. That's next on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: The year was 1984. Now 20 years later, after some of music's biggest stars came together to record the song, "Do They Know It's Christmas," are raising millions for famine relief in Africa, specifically Ethiopia.
Now two decades later, another generation of rock royalty with a new version of that song are trying again to focus the attention of the world on the crisis in Africa.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GROUP (singing): Feed the world, let them know it's Christmastime. Feed the world, let them know it's Christmastime.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HEMMER: 2004, the man behind it all then and now, musician and humanitarian Sir Bob Geldof is with us this morning live in New York City.
It's great to see you and great to have you, Sir Bob. Good morning to you.
SIR BOB GELDOF, MUSICIAN, HUMANITARIAN: Good morning. I was a bit alarmed that Jude Law was the sexiest man alive.
HEMMER: Oh, yes?
GELDOF: Hello? You know...
HEMMER: You guys could be separated at birth, could you not?
GELDOF: Yes. Hey, what can I say?
HEMMER: Listen, I want to get into all of the matters of what's happening in Sudan in a moment here.
GELDOF: Yes.
HEMMER: Who's on the list this time in 2004 who signed up for this project?
GELDOF: Well, we've got the oldies, of course. We've got McCartney and Bono, reprising his role in 1984, Coldplay , Radiohead, Travis, Dido, Robbie Williams, all of the new British kids on the block, you know.
HEMMER: Yes. What can you say, Bob, now, two decades later, that -- what did Live Aid do in 1984 that still helps the people of Ethiopia today?
GELDOF: Well, I think in 1984, I mean, you know, I just -- I saw something on tele (ph) and I just wanted to do something about it personally. And then it became a phenomenon, led to USA For Africa. That in turn led to Live Aid, and that really addressed the issue to of poverty in Africa on a political level. I mean, yes, we got $144 million from that. And that kept immense numbers of people alive.
But more to the point, it drove the issue of Africa to the top of the political agenda. And that was necessary, because there were millions of people dying of want in a world of surplus, and I just thought that was ridiculous. And as it happened, so did the rest of the world. But it's taken 20 years for us to take that from an idea of charity to one of political justice. And next year, Tony Blair, who watched Live Aid all day, who is the same age as me, he's hosting the G8. It's the seven richest countries in the world plus Russia. And he's also pressing the European Union (UNINTELLIGIBLE) he won his own election, which he will win. So it makes him very politically influential around the world.
And he really is as one with myself and Bono on this issue. And I persuaded him to do this commission for Africa, which is why I'm in America this morning to deal with the U.S. end of that.
HEMMER: You know, I would say also, Sir Bob, that in 20 years' time, a lot's changed on this planet.
GELDOF: Yes.
HEMMER: And for that matter a lot has stayed the same as well.
GELDOF: Yes, you're absolutely right.
HEMMER: You know, I'm curious, has technology helped make awareness better for people globally? Because if you think back to 1984, the only people who truly became aware of your movement was when you did the live concerts.
GELDOF: I think that's true. But you see, you remember back in '84 very few people had mobile phones, very few had fax. Only important people had answering machines. The common form of international communication was telex. And we didn't realize that there were satellites everywhere. CNN was very new. MTV was very new.
HEMMER: Yes.
GELDOF: And so we started talking to each other simultaneously. Within two years, the Cold War had collapsed. You had globalization. You had computerization with 24/7 money. And the world changed. And we're dealing with those consequences now. But the same -- what you're correct about is that the one constant that remains in decline of all the continents is Africa.
HEMMER: Listen, I want to wish you the best of luck. I know the focus 20 years ago was...
GELDOF: You didn't sound very interested (UNINTELLIGIBLE), OK.
HEMMER: Not at all. Not at all. I've very interested. Listen, I'm very honored to talk with you today, too.
GELDOF: Thanks a lot, man.
HEMMER: I've been looking forward to this interview all week.
GELDOF: I can tell.
HEMMER: No, it is true. And I want to wish you lots of luck.
GELDOF: Thank you.
HEMMER: And I know the focus 20 years ago was Ethiopia; now it's Sudan. And, Jude Law, eat your heart out, OK?
GELDOF: What can I say?
HEMMER: Sir Bob Geldof...
GELDOF: Thank you.
HEMMER: You got it. Good luck -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: Still to come this morning, a bad prank or a plot to commit murder? Two teens in serious trouble for a cake they served up in school. That's ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O'BRIEN: Howard Stern gave away thousands of satellite radios and subscriptions yesterday, a huge crowd coming out for the promotion. They blocked traffic in downtown New York City, which I was stuck in. They listened to the controversial radio host talk about his battles with the FCC over decency, the reason he's leaving broadcast radio for pay satellite radio.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HOWARD STERN, SHOCK JOCK: I want you to experience radio the way I think it should be, the future of radio. Sirius Satellite Radio will dominate the medium. It is the death of FM radio, the death of the FCC interference, the death of the FCC. Down with the FCC! They have ruined commercial radio!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: Howard Stern is hooking up with his old boss, Mel Karmazin, when he gets to Sirius. The company confirming yesterday that the former Viacom president will head Sirius Satellite Radio.
HEMMER: How do you think he really feels?
O'BRIEN: Yes, you never hear that a lot. Down with the FCC.
HEMMER: Death to the FCC.
What's happening, Jack?
CAFFERTY: I read in the paper that Karmazin is going to get $120 million.
O'BRIEN: That's what they say.
CAFFERTY: Huh?
O'BRIEN: That's a nice payday.
CAFFERTY: Man!
O'BRIEN: It's kind of what you make, right?
CAFFERTY: Yes, yes, yes.
O'BRIEN: Being on AMERICAN MORNING?
CAFFERTY: Secretary of State Colin Powell says fresh intelligence suggests that Iran is working on a program to arm a missile with a nuclear warhead. "The Washington Post" quotes government officials saying that the claim by Powell is based on a single unvetted source. So, they're questioning the intelligence.
Iran says its nuclear program is all about nuclear power plants. Britain, France and Germany say diplomacy is the best approach here. But you guys ultimately have the best answers to what should be done about Iran's nuclear program.
Patrick writes: "If the Iranians continue to pursue nuclear anything, I don't believe we'll have to worry about it much. Harkin back to the mid 1980s, a nuclear plant in the sand in Iraq. Israel doesn't like that kind of thing."
Patrick in Long Island: "It's amazing to me they start to sound the drums of war. Iran has done nothing illegal. Having nuclear power plants isn't illegal. Enriching uranium for these power plants is also not illegal. Hmm, I wonder how much oil they have?"
Marsha in Tampa, Florida: "It may be too late for diplomacy. Iran knows what to expect from this president and will not stop preparing to defend itself. Can you blame them?"
And Doug in Alturas, California: "Everyone's here for a purpose, even if it's only to serve as an example to everyone else. When I say 'example,' I'm envisioning a large, glowing hole in the Iranian desert. Yes, that kind of example."
O'BRIEN: Wow! A tough crowd today in these e-mails.
HEMMER: So Powell came out. He made this statement based on one report, right? Then they came back and said it wasn't verified, because they need a second source. Is that how it went down?
CAFFERTY: They're questioning this latest statement by Powell. But the rumors and the accusations and the reports of Iran monkeying around with enriched uranium go back a lot farther than this week.
HEMMER: That's right.
CAFFERTY: It's been around a long time. And, you know...
O'BRIEN: In the IAEA's findings themselves, in their, whatever, 30-odd page report, said we can't find -- everything that they've accounted for we've accounted for. And, of course, that's the big question.
HEMMER: That's right. And before the war with Iraq broke out, we had Mohammad ElBaradei on the air from Vienna, Austria. And back then they were running into problems getting the access to the areas of Iran that they were looking for.
CAFFERTY: Yes.
HEMMER: And that continues. Thanks, Jack.
O'BRIEN: Jack, thanks.
Still to come this morning, get your weekend started early with some "90-Second Pop."
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