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American Morning
Peterson Sentencing to Begin; Avoiding Holiday Pounds
Aired November 22, 2004 - 08:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back everybody. Just about half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING.
The Scott Peterson murder trial resuming this morning with the beginning of the penalty phase, the jury deciding between life in prison and the death penalty.
The jurors will not get to work until the judge makes one crucial decision. We'll get a report on that.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Also Sanjay joins us in a moment here talking about the week that is upcoming here. Thanksgiving Day. What you might be thankful for and what you might be sorry for if you don't get a serious grip on your appetite. Sanjay is talking about restraint in a few moments, so we'll get to the good doctor.
O'BRIEN: I have an eating strategy on Thanksgiving Day. I'll share it with you later.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Oh, I want to know it now.
HEMMER: Yes, can we?
O'BRIEN: I skip the turkey; I don't really like turkey. I go with the stuffing and the gravy.
COSTELLO: The fattening stuff.
O'BRIEN: Yes.
COSTELLO: Of course.
O'BRIEN: And then clear the way for more dessert.
HEMMER: This segment is perfect for you.
O'BRIEN: Yes it is -- and we can talk about it more later. But first the headlines. Carol Costello is in for us at our news desk. Good morning.
(NEWSBREAK)
O'BRIEN: The penalty phase of Scott Peterson's case is scheduled to start this morning in Redwood City, California, but not before the judge makes one critical decision.
CNN's Rusty Dornin live for us with the very latest -- hey Rusty. Good morning.
RUSTY DORNIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Soledad it's such a critical decision he may decide not to even make it today, delaying the penalty phase.
At issue is Scott Peterson's fate, whether it should be decided by different people in a different place.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DORNIN (voice-over): A new jury taken to a different county to decide Scott Peterson's fate? Before the penalty phase begins Monday morning the judge will consider defense attorney Mark Geragos' motions to replace the jury that convicted Peterson and move away from Redwood City for the remaining testimony.
The judge denied both requests earlier in the trial. Legal observers say the removal of two jurors just days before the verdict will likely be part of the defense argument.
Could there be good reason for juror misconduct or a tainted jury to change juries now?
CHUCK SMITH, FMR. SAN MATEO CO. PROSECUTOR: No. They really can't, because if there was juror misconduct in the decision to find him guilty, that will be dealt with on appeal and the verdict of guilt will be overturned.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Find the defendant Scott Lee Peterson guilty of the crime of murder.
DORNIN: This scene after the verdict may also have the defense claiming there is a bloodthirsty mob here that wants Peterson to die.
Should the penalty phase go forward, two words are often used to describe it: gut-wrenching. It's when Laci Peterson's family and friends will spell out the anguish, the loss, the anger, the grief.
The defendant's family will then likely plead for his life. Peterson has no previous criminal past.
Legal analysts say because there was no murder weapon, no cause of death, and no evidence of a crime scene, Mark Geragos could argue to the jury the concept of lingering doubt.
SMITH: Mark Geragos very directly can say to that jury I acknowledge that you found Scott Peterson guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, but in your heart of hearts you can't be sure enough of your decision to condemn him to die.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
DORNIN: Now if the penalty phase does go forward and this jury does sentence Scott Peterson to death in California the judge can actually overturn that and give him a life sentence instead. Now on the other hand, if the jury sentences him to life, the judge cannot elevate that to death, nor can he reduce that life sentence -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: So then with his client's life on the line, Rusty, what do you expect we're going to see from Mark Geragos when he comes back into the courtroom? A different tone?
DORNIN: Very different tone. Geragos can often be somewhat flamboyant, a little bit cocky. He of course was not here on the day that Scott Peterson's verdict was delivered. In some cases legal analysts say that an attorney like that may take the background. He may have his co-counsel, Pat Harris, really take charge of this case and he'll sort of be in the background because the -- Pat Harris may in this case have more credibility than Geragos does.
O'BRIEN: Rusty Dornin for us this morning watching this case. Rusty, thanks.
HEMMER: About 37 minutes now past the hour. There is a developing story out of Houston, Texas just getting information on it now.
South of Houston's Hobby Airport by about a mile and a half, a private jet has gone down earlier today. Happened about 6:15 a.m. local time which would have been about an hour and 20 minutes ago on the clock.
No word on injuries or other details of this but Beltway Eight, which is a major area for morning commuters, heavily traveled, closed near the crash site. That flight originated back in Dallas at Love Field.
Not much more information other than to know that a Gulf Stream, private jet, went down south of the runway by about a mile and a half near Houston's Hobby Airport. More when we get it out of Texas.
In the meantime, though, let's turn our attention back to Washington and this bill for a massive overhaul of U.S. intelligence failing over the weekend; part of it loaded with controversial immigration rules.
Two topics today for Democratic consultant Victor Kamber -- Vic good morning to you.
VICTOR KAMBER, THE KAMBER GROUP: Good morning, Bill, how are you?
HEMMER: I'm doing fine thank you. Former RNC Communications Director Cliff May also in D.C. to talk about these topics. And Cliff, good morning to you as well.
CLIFFORD MAY, FMR. RNC COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: Good morning.
HEMMER: I want to start with you, Cliff -- 9/11 and the reforms that did not pass -- what's holding this up and why?
MAY: Well there are some members in Congress who think the bill is not as good as it should be and I don't think that's necessarily a terrible thing.
Look, Bill, for a long time on this show and others we've heard people say its not enough for President Bush to have yes men around him. You need some people who will say no, tell him when he's wrong. Well a few members of Congress, a co-equal branch of government are saying you know what, Mr. President, we think you are wrong on some of these things, we think this bill can be stronger.
Now let me say I think this is probably a good bill. President Bush is behind it, Senator Joe Lieberman is behind it, it has good bipartisan support, but its not a terrible thing if a few of these differences are aired and if it takes a little longer.
Keep in mind that Porter Goss is at the CIA; he's making important changes and by executive order, the president has made important changes as well.
HEMMER: You're on the record -- let's get Victor on the record now. What do you think?
KAMBER: Well, first of all, I think that Cliff mischaracterizes. This isn't about some think -- people thinking that they could make it stronger. This is totally about a turf war between different groups within the Republican Party. Some who support the Pentagon, some who just want to fall in line with the president.
Obviously it looks like -- we don't know for sure -- but it looks like the president's own people, the Pentagon itself, maybe Don Rumsfeld has campaigned against this bill or the president didn't go far enough in supporting it.
One of the problems the president has after this election -- he has political capital, he says he wants to use it for the good of the country. He's got a party that's not in sync 100 percent with him. I don't disagree with Cliff in terms of legislation shouldn't be shoved through but we've had this 9/11 Commission Report, we've had this bill -- we have the speaker in support of it, the Senate passed it overwhelmingly, the White House is for it.
It should have passed two barons, two barons within the House of Representatives decided they weren't going to pass it and they didn't even get a vote on it. The party is split.
HEMMER: Let me get back to Cliff on this. You said you can make it stronger or some people believe it should be made stronger or should be made better rather. In what way? How would you do that, Cliff?
MAY: There are two things that are being objected to. One is a question of battlefield intelligence, intelligence about what is taking place on the battlefield in a place like Iraq.
The Pentagon I think wants, or I should say the congressmen want, to make sure that it is the Pentagon that has that information first and fully, not through a process. The second has to do with immigration. There is a fear that there could be immigrants coming through who are not really -- they're here to work, we've heard about this a lot, they could be al Qaeda -- it wants to make sure that we control our borders in a way that we have not.
Some people are saying leave that for another bill, they're saying no; let's put it in this bill now. We're worried about people, terrorists, and materials (UNINTELLIGIBLE).
HEMMER: Let's move on to issue number two and that is the issue of immigration, not necessarily what you mentioned, Cliff, but apparently the talks that are taking place now between Vicente Fox, the leader of Mexico and President Bush about hundreds of thousands of illegals working here in the U.S. and Victor I want you to start us off on this. That they may be granted asylum or possibly even the right to work here and not be sent back to Mexico if the employer agrees to keep them and if they have, let's say, an upstanding record.
If that's the case, and you're going to do this for hundreds and thousands here, how does the U.S. win on this deal?
KAMBER: Well, the U.S. wins because we will one, have workers filling jobs that frankly we cannot fill any other way. Two we'll be collecting taxes from these workers because they will be legitimate in the sense of being -- not having to hide and run away. Three hopefully we'll stop recalcitrant employers from exploiting people. They'll get decent wages and decent conditions, which helps communities.
I think it's a great step forward.
(CROSSTALK)
MAY: (UNINTELLIGIBLE)
KAMBER: Well, I think you would if you could fill those jobs. You can't fill them. We're not talking about anchors on television or doctors or teachers. We're talking about jobs that basically we're not finding the ability to fill by the American workforce today.
MAY: I'm always glad to see Vic support President Bush and so I congratulate him on that. But let me take the other point of view then.
I think we have to be very careful. Before 9/11 illegal immigration we didn't treat seriously. I think now we have to. Anything that rewards people who are breaking our laws is going to encourage other people to break the laws I'm afraid and say oh, I'm sure they'll give me a break later on as well.
I think -- look, I think we should have a guest worker program but I do think people who are in this country from other countries, they should be welcomed, they should be guests, they should be here legally. That has to be what we insist on.
KAMBER: And this will be again why the Republican Party will be split right down the middle... MAY: You know, Victor, I just have to say to you when you say split I -- people like you, including you, were arguing that just a little while ago why does Bush only want yes men -- shouldn't' there be somebody who says no -- but that...
KAMBER: That's the other party -- that's the other party, Cliff.
MAY: But you want -- no, no. You want somebody at the State Department and the CIA who would say no.
KAMBER: I want people...
MAY: You can't have Democrats in the cabinet of the president. You understand that, don't you?
KAMBER: Cliff, I agree with you that we want a debate. I'm not suggesting to you that the Republican Party is a monolith. I am saying to you there are going to be differences of opinion. But I'm saying on this issue, they're going to be split.
MAY: There are going to be differences, there's going to be a debate within the Republican Party and the Democratic Party and that's good.
HEMMER: Oh, Cliff.
MAY: Sorry, sorry.
HEMMER: Cliff May, Victor Kamber, thanks guys.
KAMBER: Thanks, Bill.
MAY: Thanks, Bill.
HEMMER: OK, Soledad.
O'BRIEN: Little chilly there. Let's check in on the weather.
(WEATHER REPORT)
HEMMER: In a moment here, why things are not so sweet at Krispy Kreme. Andy has that in a moment. We'll get to it.
O'BRIEN: And keeping your waistline in mind as you enjoy that Thanksgiving meal. Dr. Sanjay Gupta is up next. Stay with us, you're watching AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O'BRIEN: And we are "Paging Dr. Gupta" this morning about holiday stuffing and we're not talking about the kind that goes inside the turkey. We're talking about our own waistlines and how you can avoid those extra pounds you put on over the holiday. Hey, Sanjay, good morning.
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN SR. MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Soledad. Yes, that's one way of putting it for sure.
We eat more than we ever did before but it may not entirely be our faults. If you look at portion sizes, everybody knows this; they've been increasing over the last 20 years.
From about the late 1970s to the mid-1990s, portion sizes on average grew by about 60 percent.
Let me give you a couple of examples here. First of all when it comes to Coke -- soft drink products, for example. Early part of the last century it used to be 6.5 ounce bottles. We couldn't even find one of those any more so an 8 ounce bottle here about 97 calories.
That is what you used to get most commonly. You get the 12-ounce cans. This looks like less than the bottle but actually four ounces more. Hundred and forty calories. And now one of the most common sizes actually these 20 ounces Coca-Colas, 250 calories. You get all kinds of different soft drinks in those various sizes.
Also the 44 ounce; you've seen these as well. By the way in case you're wondering no one threw this at me -- this actually was handed to me. The 44 ounces over 500 calories as well.
Soledad though let me make this point. There's actually a quiz you can take looking at portion sizes. This is on the National Heart Lung and Blood Institute's Web site. Specifically looking at three different types of foods here.
I think we have the Web site here. Cheeseburger -- I don't know if you can read that, Soledad.
O'BRIEN: Yes, I can read it.
GUPTA: Cheeseburger on the left 20 years ago, 333 calories. Look at the cheeseburger on the right. Your choices of calories, 590, 620, or 700. What do you think?
O'BRIEN: Seven-hundred.
GUPTA: And the answer is -- actually it's only 590. But still a lot more than it was before.
O'BRIEN: Well, you know what, the one on the right looks so much better than the one on the left, Sanjay.
GUPTA: That's right. But let's try one more. Bill, I know you're a coffee drinker so let's try this coffee one here for example. Twenty years ago coffee sizes about eight ounces. You can see that on the left, 45 calories. Now on the right your choices: 100, 350, or 450.
HEMMER: How many ounces is on the right?
GUPTA: Let's see -- it doesn't actually say.
O'BRIEN: Much bigger. HEMMER: Much bigger.
O'BRIEN: And it's a mocha.
HEMMER: Three-fifty.
GUPTA: Three-fifty. And Bill is correct.
O'BRIEN: Cause he has like five of them every day. That's how he knows.
GUPTA: Now you know how many calories you're getting, Bill, right.
HEMMER: That's right.
GUPTA: Let's do one healthy one, Soledad, because this is important. People think salads. I'll just eat as much salad as I possibly can. Chicken Caesar salad on the left, 390 calories, cup and a half. The one on the right, what do you think -- 790, 520, or 650.
O'BRIEN: Six-fifty.
GUPTA: Seven-ninety, 790 calories in that salad so I mean that's just a couple of examples of how the portion sizes have definitely increased and it's working against us as it turns out.
O'BRIEN: OK, then as you go into Thanksgiving what should you be looking for? A little teeny bit of turkey or a little itty-bitty bit of stuffing?
GUPTA: Yes, you know obviously you want to try and control portion sizes but its hard for people to get a sense of how much is too much when you're going to the buffet line for example and actually serving yourself. So here's some quick easy tips.
If you're thinking about the turkey or the meat for example a deck of cards in size, think of a deck of cards. That's how much turkey you want to get. Not very much, about four ounces.
Stuffing and mashed potatoes, about a tennis ball in size. Brown gravy and cranberry sauce -- only a golf ball.
O'BRIEN: Oh!
GUPTA: I know. And if you're going to eat that dessert, pumpkin pie should fit on the size of a computer disk.
O'BRIEN: Please.
(LAUGHTER)
O'BRIEN: OK, doctor. Not a problem.
HEMMER: Sanjay, you're not coming to my house, pal.
O'BRIEN: Exactly.
GUPTA: Come on.
O'BRIEN: All right, Sanjay.
HEMMER: You know, Sanjay is from Michigan, by the way so you might want to watch it with that cup in his hand.
GUPTA: I know, I know, I'm telling you.
O'BRIEN: Thanks, Sanjay.
HEMMER: In a moment here, Apple Computer has reason to smile. In fact, many, many reasons to smile. Back in a moment with that after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: All right, welcome back everyone.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Perhaps the solution to Krispy Kreme's problems might lie in considering a change of product lines. They should start selling IPods. Andy Serwer is here with that story and some more stuff "Minding Your Business."
ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: For sure. We'll talk about that in a second. Let's talk about the market first of all, Jack. Last week a bit of a set back for stocks. You can see here retreating after that post-election rally we had.
Nothing real serious although this morning I've got to tell you stocks are not looking good at all. The price of oil is backing up toward $50 and futures are way weaker so expect a decline at least at the outset this morning.
Jack you know the Web site hot or not? Not sure if you do know that.
CAFFERTY: No, I don't.
SERWER: OK, well it's -- OK. Let's talk about two companies, one hot, one not. Hot: Apple Computer. We've been talking about this for a while because it just keeps getting hotter. This morning Piper Jaffrey brokerage firm upping its stock price to $100 and the stock is about $55 now. Look at that.
And it's all about the IPod. The stock is up, listen to this, $3 in pre-market trading from $55 to $58. I've just found out they're expecting to sell 3.5 million of those babies for this Christmas season.
CAFFERTY: What's the average price? Like $300?
SERWER: Three or four hundred -- there's a $300 model and a $400 -- 3.5 million, so that's over a billion in sales that no one ever expected say even just a year ago. Not hot? Krispy Kreme, and they haven't been hot for a while. They're getting cooler. Those donuts are getting cooler. This morning the company coming out and saying they have a loss for the quarter, $3 million. A loss. How can you have a loss selling donuts? Hard to imagine. Last year at this time they had a profit of $14.5 -- that's a not chart.
See if you put the other chart next to it. Well, it makes a lot of sense. Apples, a lot healthier than donuts.
CAFFERTY: Well thank you Andy.
SERWER: That's the business lesson.
CAFFERTY: Borrowing a page from Dr. Gupta.
SERWER: Paging Dr. Serwer, yes.
CAFFERTY: The award -- on to the "Cafferty File." The award for the most tasteless Internet game ever goes to the creators of the game that allows players to assassinate JFK. Just in time to mark the 41st anniversary of Kennedy's assassination.
Traffic Management of Scotland's game allows players to take aim at the president through Lee Harvey Oswald's riflescope. Isn't this cute? The company claims this is providing a public service.
They're even offering a $100,000 prize to the player who most accurately recreates the three shots fired by Oswald. Come on.
The games include tips on how to be a better shot, detailed ballistics reports, and the ability to add gruesome blood effects. The company's owner says he sent a letter to Senator Edward Kennedy explaining that he means no disrespect.
SERWER: That's a Scottish company?
CAFFERTY: Yes.
SERWER: Maybe they do a Lockerbie thing and recreate -- never mind.
CAFFERTY: Shopping is not without its repercussions. Are you listening Cafferty women? An Iranian woman went out and bought a $450 pair of boots.
O'BRIEN: That's a nice pair of boots.
CAFFERTY: That's a nice pair of boots. Her husband and his other two wives, though, were not amused. The wives were jealous, the other two -- they didn't get any new shoes. There was a huge fight and then all three wives attempted suicide together. They took an overdose of drugs. That didn't work and they're all in stable condition at the hospital where nobody gets to wear the $450 boots.
Men in Iran can legally have up to four wives. So based on this story this gentleman may decide to stop at three. Quite enough.
SERWER: Yes.
CAFFERTY: Model Jerry Hall told a British newspaper yesterday she would keep wearing bikinis until she was 80. The 48-year-old ex- wife of Rolling Stone Mick Jagger said she would continue modeling as long as she gets paid adding, "I think it's amazing how I've looked so good for so long and how they keep paying me to be a model."
O'BRIEN: She does look good. She looks good.
CAFFERTY: Hall did promise, however, that she would grow old gracefully in public and disgracefully in private. Jerry if you're going to wear a bikini, just stay in the house and keep the blinds drawn.
O'BRIEN: I think she looks good. I think she'd look good in a bikini at 80. You go, girl. I got your back.
SERWER: What does Mick have to say about all this?
CAFFERTY: Well he checked out of that situation a long time ago.
(CROSSTALK)
O'BRIEN: He doesn't get a vote.
SERWER: Well he still has an opinion. He doesn't have a vote but he does have an opinion.
O'BRIEN: An opinion but no vote.
HEMMER: She's eating apples, obviously.
SERWER: Not donuts.
HEMMER: All right, break here. In a moment, we'll get back to our top stories. Also the Department of Homeland Security -- new ads launched today hit Americans where they live and Tom Ridge, Secretary of Homeland Security joins us live to talk about them.
We'll get to that right after this on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
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Aired November 22, 2004 - 08:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back everybody. Just about half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING.
The Scott Peterson murder trial resuming this morning with the beginning of the penalty phase, the jury deciding between life in prison and the death penalty.
The jurors will not get to work until the judge makes one crucial decision. We'll get a report on that.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Also Sanjay joins us in a moment here talking about the week that is upcoming here. Thanksgiving Day. What you might be thankful for and what you might be sorry for if you don't get a serious grip on your appetite. Sanjay is talking about restraint in a few moments, so we'll get to the good doctor.
O'BRIEN: I have an eating strategy on Thanksgiving Day. I'll share it with you later.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Oh, I want to know it now.
HEMMER: Yes, can we?
O'BRIEN: I skip the turkey; I don't really like turkey. I go with the stuffing and the gravy.
COSTELLO: The fattening stuff.
O'BRIEN: Yes.
COSTELLO: Of course.
O'BRIEN: And then clear the way for more dessert.
HEMMER: This segment is perfect for you.
O'BRIEN: Yes it is -- and we can talk about it more later. But first the headlines. Carol Costello is in for us at our news desk. Good morning.
(NEWSBREAK)
O'BRIEN: The penalty phase of Scott Peterson's case is scheduled to start this morning in Redwood City, California, but not before the judge makes one critical decision.
CNN's Rusty Dornin live for us with the very latest -- hey Rusty. Good morning.
RUSTY DORNIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Soledad it's such a critical decision he may decide not to even make it today, delaying the penalty phase.
At issue is Scott Peterson's fate, whether it should be decided by different people in a different place.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DORNIN (voice-over): A new jury taken to a different county to decide Scott Peterson's fate? Before the penalty phase begins Monday morning the judge will consider defense attorney Mark Geragos' motions to replace the jury that convicted Peterson and move away from Redwood City for the remaining testimony.
The judge denied both requests earlier in the trial. Legal observers say the removal of two jurors just days before the verdict will likely be part of the defense argument.
Could there be good reason for juror misconduct or a tainted jury to change juries now?
CHUCK SMITH, FMR. SAN MATEO CO. PROSECUTOR: No. They really can't, because if there was juror misconduct in the decision to find him guilty, that will be dealt with on appeal and the verdict of guilt will be overturned.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Find the defendant Scott Lee Peterson guilty of the crime of murder.
DORNIN: This scene after the verdict may also have the defense claiming there is a bloodthirsty mob here that wants Peterson to die.
Should the penalty phase go forward, two words are often used to describe it: gut-wrenching. It's when Laci Peterson's family and friends will spell out the anguish, the loss, the anger, the grief.
The defendant's family will then likely plead for his life. Peterson has no previous criminal past.
Legal analysts say because there was no murder weapon, no cause of death, and no evidence of a crime scene, Mark Geragos could argue to the jury the concept of lingering doubt.
SMITH: Mark Geragos very directly can say to that jury I acknowledge that you found Scott Peterson guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, but in your heart of hearts you can't be sure enough of your decision to condemn him to die.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
DORNIN: Now if the penalty phase does go forward and this jury does sentence Scott Peterson to death in California the judge can actually overturn that and give him a life sentence instead. Now on the other hand, if the jury sentences him to life, the judge cannot elevate that to death, nor can he reduce that life sentence -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: So then with his client's life on the line, Rusty, what do you expect we're going to see from Mark Geragos when he comes back into the courtroom? A different tone?
DORNIN: Very different tone. Geragos can often be somewhat flamboyant, a little bit cocky. He of course was not here on the day that Scott Peterson's verdict was delivered. In some cases legal analysts say that an attorney like that may take the background. He may have his co-counsel, Pat Harris, really take charge of this case and he'll sort of be in the background because the -- Pat Harris may in this case have more credibility than Geragos does.
O'BRIEN: Rusty Dornin for us this morning watching this case. Rusty, thanks.
HEMMER: About 37 minutes now past the hour. There is a developing story out of Houston, Texas just getting information on it now.
South of Houston's Hobby Airport by about a mile and a half, a private jet has gone down earlier today. Happened about 6:15 a.m. local time which would have been about an hour and 20 minutes ago on the clock.
No word on injuries or other details of this but Beltway Eight, which is a major area for morning commuters, heavily traveled, closed near the crash site. That flight originated back in Dallas at Love Field.
Not much more information other than to know that a Gulf Stream, private jet, went down south of the runway by about a mile and a half near Houston's Hobby Airport. More when we get it out of Texas.
In the meantime, though, let's turn our attention back to Washington and this bill for a massive overhaul of U.S. intelligence failing over the weekend; part of it loaded with controversial immigration rules.
Two topics today for Democratic consultant Victor Kamber -- Vic good morning to you.
VICTOR KAMBER, THE KAMBER GROUP: Good morning, Bill, how are you?
HEMMER: I'm doing fine thank you. Former RNC Communications Director Cliff May also in D.C. to talk about these topics. And Cliff, good morning to you as well.
CLIFFORD MAY, FMR. RNC COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: Good morning.
HEMMER: I want to start with you, Cliff -- 9/11 and the reforms that did not pass -- what's holding this up and why?
MAY: Well there are some members in Congress who think the bill is not as good as it should be and I don't think that's necessarily a terrible thing.
Look, Bill, for a long time on this show and others we've heard people say its not enough for President Bush to have yes men around him. You need some people who will say no, tell him when he's wrong. Well a few members of Congress, a co-equal branch of government are saying you know what, Mr. President, we think you are wrong on some of these things, we think this bill can be stronger.
Now let me say I think this is probably a good bill. President Bush is behind it, Senator Joe Lieberman is behind it, it has good bipartisan support, but its not a terrible thing if a few of these differences are aired and if it takes a little longer.
Keep in mind that Porter Goss is at the CIA; he's making important changes and by executive order, the president has made important changes as well.
HEMMER: You're on the record -- let's get Victor on the record now. What do you think?
KAMBER: Well, first of all, I think that Cliff mischaracterizes. This isn't about some think -- people thinking that they could make it stronger. This is totally about a turf war between different groups within the Republican Party. Some who support the Pentagon, some who just want to fall in line with the president.
Obviously it looks like -- we don't know for sure -- but it looks like the president's own people, the Pentagon itself, maybe Don Rumsfeld has campaigned against this bill or the president didn't go far enough in supporting it.
One of the problems the president has after this election -- he has political capital, he says he wants to use it for the good of the country. He's got a party that's not in sync 100 percent with him. I don't disagree with Cliff in terms of legislation shouldn't be shoved through but we've had this 9/11 Commission Report, we've had this bill -- we have the speaker in support of it, the Senate passed it overwhelmingly, the White House is for it.
It should have passed two barons, two barons within the House of Representatives decided they weren't going to pass it and they didn't even get a vote on it. The party is split.
HEMMER: Let me get back to Cliff on this. You said you can make it stronger or some people believe it should be made stronger or should be made better rather. In what way? How would you do that, Cliff?
MAY: There are two things that are being objected to. One is a question of battlefield intelligence, intelligence about what is taking place on the battlefield in a place like Iraq.
The Pentagon I think wants, or I should say the congressmen want, to make sure that it is the Pentagon that has that information first and fully, not through a process. The second has to do with immigration. There is a fear that there could be immigrants coming through who are not really -- they're here to work, we've heard about this a lot, they could be al Qaeda -- it wants to make sure that we control our borders in a way that we have not.
Some people are saying leave that for another bill, they're saying no; let's put it in this bill now. We're worried about people, terrorists, and materials (UNINTELLIGIBLE).
HEMMER: Let's move on to issue number two and that is the issue of immigration, not necessarily what you mentioned, Cliff, but apparently the talks that are taking place now between Vicente Fox, the leader of Mexico and President Bush about hundreds of thousands of illegals working here in the U.S. and Victor I want you to start us off on this. That they may be granted asylum or possibly even the right to work here and not be sent back to Mexico if the employer agrees to keep them and if they have, let's say, an upstanding record.
If that's the case, and you're going to do this for hundreds and thousands here, how does the U.S. win on this deal?
KAMBER: Well, the U.S. wins because we will one, have workers filling jobs that frankly we cannot fill any other way. Two we'll be collecting taxes from these workers because they will be legitimate in the sense of being -- not having to hide and run away. Three hopefully we'll stop recalcitrant employers from exploiting people. They'll get decent wages and decent conditions, which helps communities.
I think it's a great step forward.
(CROSSTALK)
MAY: (UNINTELLIGIBLE)
KAMBER: Well, I think you would if you could fill those jobs. You can't fill them. We're not talking about anchors on television or doctors or teachers. We're talking about jobs that basically we're not finding the ability to fill by the American workforce today.
MAY: I'm always glad to see Vic support President Bush and so I congratulate him on that. But let me take the other point of view then.
I think we have to be very careful. Before 9/11 illegal immigration we didn't treat seriously. I think now we have to. Anything that rewards people who are breaking our laws is going to encourage other people to break the laws I'm afraid and say oh, I'm sure they'll give me a break later on as well.
I think -- look, I think we should have a guest worker program but I do think people who are in this country from other countries, they should be welcomed, they should be guests, they should be here legally. That has to be what we insist on.
KAMBER: And this will be again why the Republican Party will be split right down the middle... MAY: You know, Victor, I just have to say to you when you say split I -- people like you, including you, were arguing that just a little while ago why does Bush only want yes men -- shouldn't' there be somebody who says no -- but that...
KAMBER: That's the other party -- that's the other party, Cliff.
MAY: But you want -- no, no. You want somebody at the State Department and the CIA who would say no.
KAMBER: I want people...
MAY: You can't have Democrats in the cabinet of the president. You understand that, don't you?
KAMBER: Cliff, I agree with you that we want a debate. I'm not suggesting to you that the Republican Party is a monolith. I am saying to you there are going to be differences of opinion. But I'm saying on this issue, they're going to be split.
MAY: There are going to be differences, there's going to be a debate within the Republican Party and the Democratic Party and that's good.
HEMMER: Oh, Cliff.
MAY: Sorry, sorry.
HEMMER: Cliff May, Victor Kamber, thanks guys.
KAMBER: Thanks, Bill.
MAY: Thanks, Bill.
HEMMER: OK, Soledad.
O'BRIEN: Little chilly there. Let's check in on the weather.
(WEATHER REPORT)
HEMMER: In a moment here, why things are not so sweet at Krispy Kreme. Andy has that in a moment. We'll get to it.
O'BRIEN: And keeping your waistline in mind as you enjoy that Thanksgiving meal. Dr. Sanjay Gupta is up next. Stay with us, you're watching AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O'BRIEN: And we are "Paging Dr. Gupta" this morning about holiday stuffing and we're not talking about the kind that goes inside the turkey. We're talking about our own waistlines and how you can avoid those extra pounds you put on over the holiday. Hey, Sanjay, good morning.
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN SR. MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Soledad. Yes, that's one way of putting it for sure.
We eat more than we ever did before but it may not entirely be our faults. If you look at portion sizes, everybody knows this; they've been increasing over the last 20 years.
From about the late 1970s to the mid-1990s, portion sizes on average grew by about 60 percent.
Let me give you a couple of examples here. First of all when it comes to Coke -- soft drink products, for example. Early part of the last century it used to be 6.5 ounce bottles. We couldn't even find one of those any more so an 8 ounce bottle here about 97 calories.
That is what you used to get most commonly. You get the 12-ounce cans. This looks like less than the bottle but actually four ounces more. Hundred and forty calories. And now one of the most common sizes actually these 20 ounces Coca-Colas, 250 calories. You get all kinds of different soft drinks in those various sizes.
Also the 44 ounce; you've seen these as well. By the way in case you're wondering no one threw this at me -- this actually was handed to me. The 44 ounces over 500 calories as well.
Soledad though let me make this point. There's actually a quiz you can take looking at portion sizes. This is on the National Heart Lung and Blood Institute's Web site. Specifically looking at three different types of foods here.
I think we have the Web site here. Cheeseburger -- I don't know if you can read that, Soledad.
O'BRIEN: Yes, I can read it.
GUPTA: Cheeseburger on the left 20 years ago, 333 calories. Look at the cheeseburger on the right. Your choices of calories, 590, 620, or 700. What do you think?
O'BRIEN: Seven-hundred.
GUPTA: And the answer is -- actually it's only 590. But still a lot more than it was before.
O'BRIEN: Well, you know what, the one on the right looks so much better than the one on the left, Sanjay.
GUPTA: That's right. But let's try one more. Bill, I know you're a coffee drinker so let's try this coffee one here for example. Twenty years ago coffee sizes about eight ounces. You can see that on the left, 45 calories. Now on the right your choices: 100, 350, or 450.
HEMMER: How many ounces is on the right?
GUPTA: Let's see -- it doesn't actually say.
O'BRIEN: Much bigger. HEMMER: Much bigger.
O'BRIEN: And it's a mocha.
HEMMER: Three-fifty.
GUPTA: Three-fifty. And Bill is correct.
O'BRIEN: Cause he has like five of them every day. That's how he knows.
GUPTA: Now you know how many calories you're getting, Bill, right.
HEMMER: That's right.
GUPTA: Let's do one healthy one, Soledad, because this is important. People think salads. I'll just eat as much salad as I possibly can. Chicken Caesar salad on the left, 390 calories, cup and a half. The one on the right, what do you think -- 790, 520, or 650.
O'BRIEN: Six-fifty.
GUPTA: Seven-ninety, 790 calories in that salad so I mean that's just a couple of examples of how the portion sizes have definitely increased and it's working against us as it turns out.
O'BRIEN: OK, then as you go into Thanksgiving what should you be looking for? A little teeny bit of turkey or a little itty-bitty bit of stuffing?
GUPTA: Yes, you know obviously you want to try and control portion sizes but its hard for people to get a sense of how much is too much when you're going to the buffet line for example and actually serving yourself. So here's some quick easy tips.
If you're thinking about the turkey or the meat for example a deck of cards in size, think of a deck of cards. That's how much turkey you want to get. Not very much, about four ounces.
Stuffing and mashed potatoes, about a tennis ball in size. Brown gravy and cranberry sauce -- only a golf ball.
O'BRIEN: Oh!
GUPTA: I know. And if you're going to eat that dessert, pumpkin pie should fit on the size of a computer disk.
O'BRIEN: Please.
(LAUGHTER)
O'BRIEN: OK, doctor. Not a problem.
HEMMER: Sanjay, you're not coming to my house, pal.
O'BRIEN: Exactly.
GUPTA: Come on.
O'BRIEN: All right, Sanjay.
HEMMER: You know, Sanjay is from Michigan, by the way so you might want to watch it with that cup in his hand.
GUPTA: I know, I know, I'm telling you.
O'BRIEN: Thanks, Sanjay.
HEMMER: In a moment here, Apple Computer has reason to smile. In fact, many, many reasons to smile. Back in a moment with that after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: All right, welcome back everyone.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Perhaps the solution to Krispy Kreme's problems might lie in considering a change of product lines. They should start selling IPods. Andy Serwer is here with that story and some more stuff "Minding Your Business."
ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: For sure. We'll talk about that in a second. Let's talk about the market first of all, Jack. Last week a bit of a set back for stocks. You can see here retreating after that post-election rally we had.
Nothing real serious although this morning I've got to tell you stocks are not looking good at all. The price of oil is backing up toward $50 and futures are way weaker so expect a decline at least at the outset this morning.
Jack you know the Web site hot or not? Not sure if you do know that.
CAFFERTY: No, I don't.
SERWER: OK, well it's -- OK. Let's talk about two companies, one hot, one not. Hot: Apple Computer. We've been talking about this for a while because it just keeps getting hotter. This morning Piper Jaffrey brokerage firm upping its stock price to $100 and the stock is about $55 now. Look at that.
And it's all about the IPod. The stock is up, listen to this, $3 in pre-market trading from $55 to $58. I've just found out they're expecting to sell 3.5 million of those babies for this Christmas season.
CAFFERTY: What's the average price? Like $300?
SERWER: Three or four hundred -- there's a $300 model and a $400 -- 3.5 million, so that's over a billion in sales that no one ever expected say even just a year ago. Not hot? Krispy Kreme, and they haven't been hot for a while. They're getting cooler. Those donuts are getting cooler. This morning the company coming out and saying they have a loss for the quarter, $3 million. A loss. How can you have a loss selling donuts? Hard to imagine. Last year at this time they had a profit of $14.5 -- that's a not chart.
See if you put the other chart next to it. Well, it makes a lot of sense. Apples, a lot healthier than donuts.
CAFFERTY: Well thank you Andy.
SERWER: That's the business lesson.
CAFFERTY: Borrowing a page from Dr. Gupta.
SERWER: Paging Dr. Serwer, yes.
CAFFERTY: The award -- on to the "Cafferty File." The award for the most tasteless Internet game ever goes to the creators of the game that allows players to assassinate JFK. Just in time to mark the 41st anniversary of Kennedy's assassination.
Traffic Management of Scotland's game allows players to take aim at the president through Lee Harvey Oswald's riflescope. Isn't this cute? The company claims this is providing a public service.
They're even offering a $100,000 prize to the player who most accurately recreates the three shots fired by Oswald. Come on.
The games include tips on how to be a better shot, detailed ballistics reports, and the ability to add gruesome blood effects. The company's owner says he sent a letter to Senator Edward Kennedy explaining that he means no disrespect.
SERWER: That's a Scottish company?
CAFFERTY: Yes.
SERWER: Maybe they do a Lockerbie thing and recreate -- never mind.
CAFFERTY: Shopping is not without its repercussions. Are you listening Cafferty women? An Iranian woman went out and bought a $450 pair of boots.
O'BRIEN: That's a nice pair of boots.
CAFFERTY: That's a nice pair of boots. Her husband and his other two wives, though, were not amused. The wives were jealous, the other two -- they didn't get any new shoes. There was a huge fight and then all three wives attempted suicide together. They took an overdose of drugs. That didn't work and they're all in stable condition at the hospital where nobody gets to wear the $450 boots.
Men in Iran can legally have up to four wives. So based on this story this gentleman may decide to stop at three. Quite enough.
SERWER: Yes.
CAFFERTY: Model Jerry Hall told a British newspaper yesterday she would keep wearing bikinis until she was 80. The 48-year-old ex- wife of Rolling Stone Mick Jagger said she would continue modeling as long as she gets paid adding, "I think it's amazing how I've looked so good for so long and how they keep paying me to be a model."
O'BRIEN: She does look good. She looks good.
CAFFERTY: Hall did promise, however, that she would grow old gracefully in public and disgracefully in private. Jerry if you're going to wear a bikini, just stay in the house and keep the blinds drawn.
O'BRIEN: I think she looks good. I think she'd look good in a bikini at 80. You go, girl. I got your back.
SERWER: What does Mick have to say about all this?
CAFFERTY: Well he checked out of that situation a long time ago.
(CROSSTALK)
O'BRIEN: He doesn't get a vote.
SERWER: Well he still has an opinion. He doesn't have a vote but he does have an opinion.
O'BRIEN: An opinion but no vote.
HEMMER: She's eating apples, obviously.
SERWER: Not donuts.
HEMMER: All right, break here. In a moment, we'll get back to our top stories. Also the Department of Homeland Security -- new ads launched today hit Americans where they live and Tom Ridge, Secretary of Homeland Security joins us live to talk about them.
We'll get to that right after this on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
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