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American Morning

BTK Serial Killer May Have Left Another Message; 'Paging Dr. Gupta'

Aired February 17, 2005 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back, everybody. Just about half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING. More on the election results in Iraq in a moment. Also police investigating another possible message sent by the BTK serial killer. The latest letter says the killer wants to help the media and help the police. We're going to talk this morning with a Wichita broadcaster about the latest clue.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Also this hour, forget about hockey this year, it's over, finished. The league and players union unable to find a number between 42 and 49 they could agree on. And they really didn't talk about it much either. We'll talk about that, though, with a senior writer for "Sports Illustrated," Mike Farber. He's standing by, and we'll about his thoughts for the future for this sport and the business, and what the players, and fans, too, missing out on an entire season -- Soledad.

O'BRIEN: First, though, Heidi Collins has got a check of what's making news at this hour.

Good morning.

HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning. And good morning to you, everybody.

Now in the news this morning, final results from Iraq's election set to be certified any moment now. The official announcement expected to come from officials in Baghdad. You're looking at a live picture. In fact Some folks going to microphone there, speaking Arabic, though. So we're going to figure out what they're saying and bring it live to you just as soon as it happens.

Meanwhile, here in the United States, may soon learn who President Bush has tapped to be the new national intelligence director. Sources say the president could announce a nomination as early as today. The job was created as part of the intelligence reform bill signed into law in December. The president will pick -- excuse me, the president's pick will need Senate approval of course.

And on a health note, childbirth could be a lot less painful for some mothers to be. A new study shows women can be given a type of epidural to relieve pain in the early stages of labor without increasing the odds of having a caesarean section. Some doctors have worried in the past, the numbing effect may interfere with labor. Details on this appear in today's "New England Journal of Medicine." And listen up if your a seafood lover, lobsters from Maine to Long Island are at risk for a quickly spreading shell disease. None of the lobsters we're showing you here are affected, but researchers say some 30 percent of the crustaceans in the New England waters are sick. The bacteria does not affect the lobster's meat, just the shell, but there are fears of a possible shortage.

So no hockey and no lobster. What are we going to do?

O'BRIEN: In Boston, they're just...

COLLINS: They're bumming.

O'BRIEN: Exactly.

Thanks, Heidi.

HEMMER: Thirty percent a good number, too.

Heidi, thanks.

The BTK serial killer may have left another message. This time a different TV station in Wichita, Kansas has received a package. That's KSAS. It's the ninth such message in the past year. Eight unsolved murders attributed to the killer. BTK stands for "bind, torture and kill," and KWCH Television produces the newscast for KSAS, and KWCH anchor is Roger Cornish. He's my guest in Wichita.

Roger, good morning to you out there in Kansas.

ROGER CORNISH, KWCH ANCHOR: Good morning, Bill.

HEMMER: What was in the package you received yesterday?

CORNISH: Well, it contained a letter with some notes about BTK, saying he wanted to help the media and police. It also contained a picture and a piece of jewelry, and in cooperation with Wichita Police, we're not describing what that piece of jewelry was. They've asked us not to identify that, and also keep some of the contents of the letter secret. In the letter, he claims this is his 11th communication since he resurfaced in March of last year.

HEMMER: How do you know this is tied to the killer, and not possibly a fake, Roger.

CORNISH: That's always the concern. Police have told us they believe it may be legitimate, but as with their other communications, they won't know for sure until they send it onto the FBI. So their analysis and profilers can look at it and come to a conclusion whether it is really From BTK. But they do say it's pretty much consistent with the other communications that have surfaced in the last 11 months.

HEMMER: Part of the message reads like this, and I read it for our viewers, quoting now, "I feel that they are beginning to feel singled out because of me," referring to previous KAKE, the other television station letter sent there. "Let's help the news media and the Wichita Police by using this package as a start." What are we to make of that, Roger?

CORNISH: Well, some people of course assume he's trying to get caught. Of course we have no idea of knowing if that's true or not. The obvious way for him to get caught would be to turn himself in. But if he is providing clues, then maybe he is wanting to get at least the notoriety again for the crimes that began more than 30 years ago, and he apparently disappeared for a long time, for more than two decades, and then resurfaced a year ago.

HEMMER: You know, Roger, all this coverage gives him attention, and one would assume he's watching it, because the different messages have given police an indication he's following up on how you people report the story.

How do you as television groups in Wichita discuss the attention and you attention you give this? Right, Bill, that's a good point. We of course have discussed among themselves, would it be better not to broadcast any of this. But police tell us they want him to keep communicating. So they've been the least open with us about that. They want the communication lines open with hopes of eventually catching him.

But you're right, we have to be very careful about copycat people who might send packages, or hoaxes. That's why we're relying what the police tell us about that, and they do want him to keep communicating.

Good luck finding him, Roger. Roger, thanks. Roger Cornish is an anchor with KWCH there in Wichita, Kansas. That story continues yet again today.

Here's Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Testimony from an FDA whistle-blower expected to be heard at hearings on pain medications in Washington, D.C. David Graham caused a stir when he accused the agency of allowing 100,000 people to be injured. His revelation about Vioxx and the risk of heart attacks led to this week's review of pain medication. An official from Merck, the maker of Vioxx, told the FDA yesterday that he now believes that competitor arthritis drugs Celebrex and Bextra, pose the same ricks.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta has been looking into pain and just how it's treated.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Flex your muscle.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): From the prick of a needle to a broken bone, physical pain it familiar to all of us. But what happens when pain can't be measured?

ASHLEY TAYLOR, PAIN PATIENT: Walking around is very difficult, and it usually takes just a few minutes before I get very tired and I have to rest. And even when I do rest, I don't feel better.

GUPTA: Since the age of 10, Ashley Taylor has felt pain in her neck, shoulders, back and legs. Now 20 years old, she's seeing neurologists, rheumatologists, even psychiatrists. In all, Ashley has been to more than 20 different doctors in just the past few years.

TAYLOR: Doctors don't know. I've had X-rays done and MRIs, and numerous blood tests and a spinal tap. And everything is negative. Everything is OK. And no doctor can tell me what's going on.

GUPTA: It's more than discomfort. She takes up to seven pain pills a day, including Celebrex and Vicodin, and had to drop out of school last semester.

DR. MICHAEL DUBOIS, NYU PAIN MANAGEMENT CENTER: A young lady who obviously is in -- you expect to be in perfect health who is going through a critical time of her life with a major handicap. Our role is to try to help her going through this phase.

GUPTA: Despite all the advances of modern medicine, when doctors measure pain, they rely primarily on the verbal analogue scale.

DUBOIS: What number would you put to your pain, if 0 is no pain and 10 is the maximum possible.

TAYLOR: Now it's about 6.

GUPTA: A complicated name for a simple test. How much does it hurt on a scale from 0-10?

DUBOIS: (INAUDIBLE) a subjective measurement based only of the patient's feedback, you can imagine situations where the patient is not truthful when he reports his or her pain.

GUPTA: And there are variations. What one person calls a nine could easily be a four for another. While there is no reliable way to gauge honesty in these tests, the pain is very real to patients like Ashley.

TAYLOR: Right now, I just have to learn to live with the pain as best I can because it's not going away anytime soon.

GUPTA: A somewhat immeasurable price for a frustratingly immeasurable pain.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: The FDA has announced its going to establish a drug safety oversight board that will monitor drugs that have already been approved and are in use -- Bill.

HEMMER: This just in. Suzanne Malveaux at the White House working her sources down in D.C., we are now learning that at 10:00 a.m. Eastern Time, about an hour and 22 minutes from, President Bush will announce his choice to be the national intelligence director. This person needs Senate approval. We should get a name possibly before 10:00. If not we'll hear from the White House firsthand at 10:00 a.m. Eastern Time.

(WEATHER REPORT)

O'BRIEN: A shopping mall is going to make some big plans to offer everything under one big roof, sporting goods, electronics and casino gambling. Andy explains. He's "Minding Your Business."

Also the arenas will stay empty. Hockey season, we know, will not happen. Can the sport recover? A senior writer for "Sports Illustrated" our guest live in a moment as we continue right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HEMMER: The National Hockey League has canceled its season, unable to resolve a five-month player lockout. It is now the first major pro sports league in all of North America to cancel a full season because of a labor dispute. The commissioner of the NHL, Gary Bettman, made that announcement just yesterday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GARY BETTMAN, NHL COMMISSIONER: It is my sad duty to announce that because the solution has not yet been attained, it is no longer practical to conduct even an abbreviated season. Accordingly, I have no choice but to announce the formal cancellation of play for 2004- 2005.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HEMMER: So then what now and what is the future for this sport? Michael Farber is a senior writer for "Sports Illustrated." He's my guest now live in Montreal.

Michael, good morning to you.

And listen, I know as a person who covers the sport so well, this is not good news from yesterday. Can you say who loses the most? Is it the owners, the players or the fans? do you divide it one-third, one-third, one-third, Michael?

MICHAEL FARBER, SR. WRITER, "SPORTS ILLUSTRATED": Well, I think the players lose the most. They've lost a season. Now they may lose more than that, Bill. The fans seem to be getting used to it. By all the polls that we see, the fans have put the NHL aside, which I think is very, very scary for the owners and would indicate that perhaps the NHL stands at the yawn of a new era.

HEMMER: The yawn of a new era. It is February 17th now on the calendar, Michael. You know that. You also know in June there will be a draft. That's only four month away. Can they get a deal done to keep next season from falling into peril? FARBER: There are two ways to do that. One, the best way in my opinion is continue the collective-bargaining process, to negotiate it. A scarier way would be the NHL declaring an impasse, implementing its work rules, and then all hell could break loose, presumably the players association would fight that in front of the NLRB. It could increasingly get ugly for a sport that doesn't need any more bad publicity.

HEMMER: Try and find the feeling for us. Was this greed? Was this selfishness? Was it insecurity? What did the league in?

FARBER: The league and the players association has a history of animus that dates back to previous manifestations of the P.A. and the way they work, and there's been great distrust between these sides. The NHL thought it was schooled by the old collective-bargaining agreement, which we must add, was extended twice by the league. So if you add that enmity long-term, you add differing philosophical views of the problem until just the very end, that's where the problem arose.

HEMMER: I want to get the reaction from Canada, where you are, in Montreal, in a moment here. But let's focus on the southeastern part of the U.S. here. This is a league that was making enormous inroads in markets where it had not been before -- Carolina, Atlanta Florida -- and these relations with fans are very tender. What happens to the clubs still trying to draft a fan base with a season that has now been wiped out.

FARBER: The club there's clearly have a lot of work to do. The best thing the NHL has going for it, are its fans are very adhesive. Kind of like being in the mob, either you're in or you're out. There are not very many casual hockey fans, and hockey fans, the true hockey fans, great passionate people, will stick with it.

The NHL's problem of course has been there aren't enough of these people. And these franchises, the ones without a long tradition, have to work extra hard at rebuilding trust.

HEMMER: What has been reaction there in Canada? And is it different from the U.S.?

FARBER: Well, in Canada, in most places, hockey is a spiritual necessity, and I think people feel it in their souls. But we go back to a January poll that said 77 percent of sports fans do not miss the NHL, and that is a very frightening figure. I'm not sure if that's anger talking or not, but we've not seen the visceral anger, even in Canada, that accompanied the baseball strike in 1994 in the United States.

HEMMER: Isn't that interesting, too? You wonder how that will play out when hockey begins again at some point.

Michael, thanks. Michael Farber from "Sports Illustrated," from Montreal, nice to chat with you today.

FARBER: Thank you. HEMMER: All right, here's Soledad.

O'BRIEN: What do you think hitting the slot machines next time you hit the shopping mall? it could happen. Andy's "Minding Your Business," up next on AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: A reminder that at 10:00 this morning, President Bush is going to announce his choice for the newly created post of director of national intelligence. Administration sources have that word for CNN. We're going to bring that to you live when it happens.

Before that though, much more to cover, let's get right to Jack.

JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Owners of America's biggest mall gambling on a major expansion. With that and a Wall Street preview, including some earnings that came out that are kind of interesting for reasons Andy will explain, here's Andy Serwer "Minding Your Business."

ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: I think I know what you're talking about. The mall -- HP, the mall of America we're going to be talking about in a second here.

Yes, Hewlett-Packard came out with numbers last night that were actually pretty good. Ironic, of course, because their CEO Carly Fiorina just stepped down just days ago. So interesting to see how Wall Street responds to that.

Also, Wal-Mart had a solid number out this morning, too. Both of those stocks should be active.

As far as yesterday goes, sit on your hands. Not a whole lot going on here. You can see a little upsie, a little downsie there. Maybe the yawn of a new era as Mike Farber said. I love that. Wasn't that I cute line? Very good. Those "Sports Illustrated" guys are terrific.

HEMMER: How about he said that even the Canadians don't care about hockey? Wow.

SERWER: That's very interesting. Jobless claims down this morning to 302,000, so that's pretty good stuff, too.

Now the Mall of Americas is the biggest mall in the country. It's in Bloomington, outside of the Twin Cities there, 4.2 million square feet. The developer wants to double up, double it, make it twice as big, a billion, a billion -- excuse me -- with a 'b,' billion dollar expansion. Here's what he wants to put in there, Jack, a casino, naturally, wants to work with the Indian tribes, a 6,000 foot concert haul.

And here's a good bit of timing. He wants to put in an NHL-sized ice rink. The wild already have a rink up there. So I don't know, now you're going to have two NHL rinks with no teams. He says, very quickly, you won't have to fly to Rodeo Drive, or New York City or Italy, you can stay right there. And of course, there's the Minnetonka that you don't have to go to St. Paul either. The casino will be called the "Palle Dujour (ph)," which means the "house of games," I think or something like that.

CAFFERTY: It means we'll pick you like a chicken.

SERWER: In American. In American it, means we'll pick you like a chicken.

CAFFERTY: That's right, we'll pluck you like a chicken, come on in.

SERWER: Biggest mall in North America is the West Edmonton one. But this would be a bigger

CAFFERTY: All right, it's time for the file, learn English or lose your child. A Tennessee judge told some immigrant mothers charged with child abuse and neglect to learn English. Wilson County Judge Barry Tatum instructed an 18-year-old woman from Mexico to learn English and use birth control after failing to immunize her child or show up for appointments with the Department of Children's Services. The ACLU, of course, says that these orders are discriminatory and unconstitutional. Tatum defends his actions, saying that he gave the orders in hopes the parents would make a greater effort to assimilate into American society, thus opening more opportunities for their children. This would be filed under 'W' for wisdom.

Will New York become "the world's second home," New York City? The city has filed an application to trademark the slogan "the world's second home giving New York exclusive rights to use the slogan to promote business and tourism. The new slogan is part of the city's push to try and land the 2012 Summer Olympics, which I desperately hope don't come here.

If the application is accepted, the city could attach the phrase to 200 different products and services from theatrical productions and parades to postcard and beach sandals. That's in the release, "beach sandals."

SERWER: What's the world's first home?

HEMMER: Planet Earth.

SERWER: Go ahead, sorry. I apologize.

CAFFERTY: That's all right. Jump in. It's an open forum here. The "File" welcomes all comers.

New York's famous red-tail hawks, Pale Mail (ph) and Lola, are back and they're getting busy. Last December, the birds, as you recall, were thrown out of their 12-year-old next on a luxury upper- eastside building by the building's co-op board.

The residents at 74th and Fifth didn't expect the huge outcry that followed, and they eventually agreed to build a custom platform on which Pale Mail and Lola can rebuild their nest, which they're currently doing.

The couple is hard at work starting a family. Last Saturday, the two birds were seen doing an X-rated performance on a TV antenna near their building, which no doubt will delight the co-op board that threw them out. Baby hawks on the way in the spring. They were mad because hawks sometimes little things would drop down on the sidewalk. Now there going to have a whole brood of them little devils.

SERWER: A little cooing and sounds.

HEMMER: Maybe the saffron brought them back. You know, you the Central Park action there.

CAFFERTY: Is that what they're calling those bed sheets they hung up in central park? He said he spent, what was it, $20 million?

SERWER: The city didn't spend money.

HEMMER: Private cash.

CAFFERTY: There's a great expenditure of 20 million bucks.

SERWER: I agree with you that it's not a good expenditure, but the city didn't do it.

CAFFERTY: We couldn't feed AIDS patients or vaccinate children. No, let's hang sheets in central park and spend $20 million to do it.

SERWER: I agree with you on that one.

CAFFERTY: That's a real bright idea there.

SERWER: I'm with you.

CAFFERTY: That's all I got here this morning.

We're watching this developing story out of the White House at this hour, too. In about an hour from now, we should get the president's announcement, his pick to become the first intelligence director in the U.S. We'll go live to the White House in a moment here, as we continue top of the hour on AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Still to come this morning, an explosive lesson in chemistry. Students say that their teacher showed them how to make a bomb. Find out why police don't think it was an innocent experiment. That's ahead this morning on AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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Aired February 17, 2005 - 08:30   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back, everybody. Just about half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING. More on the election results in Iraq in a moment. Also police investigating another possible message sent by the BTK serial killer. The latest letter says the killer wants to help the media and help the police. We're going to talk this morning with a Wichita broadcaster about the latest clue.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Also this hour, forget about hockey this year, it's over, finished. The league and players union unable to find a number between 42 and 49 they could agree on. And they really didn't talk about it much either. We'll talk about that, though, with a senior writer for "Sports Illustrated," Mike Farber. He's standing by, and we'll about his thoughts for the future for this sport and the business, and what the players, and fans, too, missing out on an entire season -- Soledad.

O'BRIEN: First, though, Heidi Collins has got a check of what's making news at this hour.

Good morning.

HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning. And good morning to you, everybody.

Now in the news this morning, final results from Iraq's election set to be certified any moment now. The official announcement expected to come from officials in Baghdad. You're looking at a live picture. In fact Some folks going to microphone there, speaking Arabic, though. So we're going to figure out what they're saying and bring it live to you just as soon as it happens.

Meanwhile, here in the United States, may soon learn who President Bush has tapped to be the new national intelligence director. Sources say the president could announce a nomination as early as today. The job was created as part of the intelligence reform bill signed into law in December. The president will pick -- excuse me, the president's pick will need Senate approval of course.

And on a health note, childbirth could be a lot less painful for some mothers to be. A new study shows women can be given a type of epidural to relieve pain in the early stages of labor without increasing the odds of having a caesarean section. Some doctors have worried in the past, the numbing effect may interfere with labor. Details on this appear in today's "New England Journal of Medicine." And listen up if your a seafood lover, lobsters from Maine to Long Island are at risk for a quickly spreading shell disease. None of the lobsters we're showing you here are affected, but researchers say some 30 percent of the crustaceans in the New England waters are sick. The bacteria does not affect the lobster's meat, just the shell, but there are fears of a possible shortage.

So no hockey and no lobster. What are we going to do?

O'BRIEN: In Boston, they're just...

COLLINS: They're bumming.

O'BRIEN: Exactly.

Thanks, Heidi.

HEMMER: Thirty percent a good number, too.

Heidi, thanks.

The BTK serial killer may have left another message. This time a different TV station in Wichita, Kansas has received a package. That's KSAS. It's the ninth such message in the past year. Eight unsolved murders attributed to the killer. BTK stands for "bind, torture and kill," and KWCH Television produces the newscast for KSAS, and KWCH anchor is Roger Cornish. He's my guest in Wichita.

Roger, good morning to you out there in Kansas.

ROGER CORNISH, KWCH ANCHOR: Good morning, Bill.

HEMMER: What was in the package you received yesterday?

CORNISH: Well, it contained a letter with some notes about BTK, saying he wanted to help the media and police. It also contained a picture and a piece of jewelry, and in cooperation with Wichita Police, we're not describing what that piece of jewelry was. They've asked us not to identify that, and also keep some of the contents of the letter secret. In the letter, he claims this is his 11th communication since he resurfaced in March of last year.

HEMMER: How do you know this is tied to the killer, and not possibly a fake, Roger.

CORNISH: That's always the concern. Police have told us they believe it may be legitimate, but as with their other communications, they won't know for sure until they send it onto the FBI. So their analysis and profilers can look at it and come to a conclusion whether it is really From BTK. But they do say it's pretty much consistent with the other communications that have surfaced in the last 11 months.

HEMMER: Part of the message reads like this, and I read it for our viewers, quoting now, "I feel that they are beginning to feel singled out because of me," referring to previous KAKE, the other television station letter sent there. "Let's help the news media and the Wichita Police by using this package as a start." What are we to make of that, Roger?

CORNISH: Well, some people of course assume he's trying to get caught. Of course we have no idea of knowing if that's true or not. The obvious way for him to get caught would be to turn himself in. But if he is providing clues, then maybe he is wanting to get at least the notoriety again for the crimes that began more than 30 years ago, and he apparently disappeared for a long time, for more than two decades, and then resurfaced a year ago.

HEMMER: You know, Roger, all this coverage gives him attention, and one would assume he's watching it, because the different messages have given police an indication he's following up on how you people report the story.

How do you as television groups in Wichita discuss the attention and you attention you give this? Right, Bill, that's a good point. We of course have discussed among themselves, would it be better not to broadcast any of this. But police tell us they want him to keep communicating. So they've been the least open with us about that. They want the communication lines open with hopes of eventually catching him.

But you're right, we have to be very careful about copycat people who might send packages, or hoaxes. That's why we're relying what the police tell us about that, and they do want him to keep communicating.

Good luck finding him, Roger. Roger, thanks. Roger Cornish is an anchor with KWCH there in Wichita, Kansas. That story continues yet again today.

Here's Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Testimony from an FDA whistle-blower expected to be heard at hearings on pain medications in Washington, D.C. David Graham caused a stir when he accused the agency of allowing 100,000 people to be injured. His revelation about Vioxx and the risk of heart attacks led to this week's review of pain medication. An official from Merck, the maker of Vioxx, told the FDA yesterday that he now believes that competitor arthritis drugs Celebrex and Bextra, pose the same ricks.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta has been looking into pain and just how it's treated.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Flex your muscle.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): From the prick of a needle to a broken bone, physical pain it familiar to all of us. But what happens when pain can't be measured?

ASHLEY TAYLOR, PAIN PATIENT: Walking around is very difficult, and it usually takes just a few minutes before I get very tired and I have to rest. And even when I do rest, I don't feel better.

GUPTA: Since the age of 10, Ashley Taylor has felt pain in her neck, shoulders, back and legs. Now 20 years old, she's seeing neurologists, rheumatologists, even psychiatrists. In all, Ashley has been to more than 20 different doctors in just the past few years.

TAYLOR: Doctors don't know. I've had X-rays done and MRIs, and numerous blood tests and a spinal tap. And everything is negative. Everything is OK. And no doctor can tell me what's going on.

GUPTA: It's more than discomfort. She takes up to seven pain pills a day, including Celebrex and Vicodin, and had to drop out of school last semester.

DR. MICHAEL DUBOIS, NYU PAIN MANAGEMENT CENTER: A young lady who obviously is in -- you expect to be in perfect health who is going through a critical time of her life with a major handicap. Our role is to try to help her going through this phase.

GUPTA: Despite all the advances of modern medicine, when doctors measure pain, they rely primarily on the verbal analogue scale.

DUBOIS: What number would you put to your pain, if 0 is no pain and 10 is the maximum possible.

TAYLOR: Now it's about 6.

GUPTA: A complicated name for a simple test. How much does it hurt on a scale from 0-10?

DUBOIS: (INAUDIBLE) a subjective measurement based only of the patient's feedback, you can imagine situations where the patient is not truthful when he reports his or her pain.

GUPTA: And there are variations. What one person calls a nine could easily be a four for another. While there is no reliable way to gauge honesty in these tests, the pain is very real to patients like Ashley.

TAYLOR: Right now, I just have to learn to live with the pain as best I can because it's not going away anytime soon.

GUPTA: A somewhat immeasurable price for a frustratingly immeasurable pain.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: The FDA has announced its going to establish a drug safety oversight board that will monitor drugs that have already been approved and are in use -- Bill.

HEMMER: This just in. Suzanne Malveaux at the White House working her sources down in D.C., we are now learning that at 10:00 a.m. Eastern Time, about an hour and 22 minutes from, President Bush will announce his choice to be the national intelligence director. This person needs Senate approval. We should get a name possibly before 10:00. If not we'll hear from the White House firsthand at 10:00 a.m. Eastern Time.

(WEATHER REPORT)

O'BRIEN: A shopping mall is going to make some big plans to offer everything under one big roof, sporting goods, electronics and casino gambling. Andy explains. He's "Minding Your Business."

Also the arenas will stay empty. Hockey season, we know, will not happen. Can the sport recover? A senior writer for "Sports Illustrated" our guest live in a moment as we continue right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HEMMER: The National Hockey League has canceled its season, unable to resolve a five-month player lockout. It is now the first major pro sports league in all of North America to cancel a full season because of a labor dispute. The commissioner of the NHL, Gary Bettman, made that announcement just yesterday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GARY BETTMAN, NHL COMMISSIONER: It is my sad duty to announce that because the solution has not yet been attained, it is no longer practical to conduct even an abbreviated season. Accordingly, I have no choice but to announce the formal cancellation of play for 2004- 2005.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HEMMER: So then what now and what is the future for this sport? Michael Farber is a senior writer for "Sports Illustrated." He's my guest now live in Montreal.

Michael, good morning to you.

And listen, I know as a person who covers the sport so well, this is not good news from yesterday. Can you say who loses the most? Is it the owners, the players or the fans? do you divide it one-third, one-third, one-third, Michael?

MICHAEL FARBER, SR. WRITER, "SPORTS ILLUSTRATED": Well, I think the players lose the most. They've lost a season. Now they may lose more than that, Bill. The fans seem to be getting used to it. By all the polls that we see, the fans have put the NHL aside, which I think is very, very scary for the owners and would indicate that perhaps the NHL stands at the yawn of a new era.

HEMMER: The yawn of a new era. It is February 17th now on the calendar, Michael. You know that. You also know in June there will be a draft. That's only four month away. Can they get a deal done to keep next season from falling into peril? FARBER: There are two ways to do that. One, the best way in my opinion is continue the collective-bargaining process, to negotiate it. A scarier way would be the NHL declaring an impasse, implementing its work rules, and then all hell could break loose, presumably the players association would fight that in front of the NLRB. It could increasingly get ugly for a sport that doesn't need any more bad publicity.

HEMMER: Try and find the feeling for us. Was this greed? Was this selfishness? Was it insecurity? What did the league in?

FARBER: The league and the players association has a history of animus that dates back to previous manifestations of the P.A. and the way they work, and there's been great distrust between these sides. The NHL thought it was schooled by the old collective-bargaining agreement, which we must add, was extended twice by the league. So if you add that enmity long-term, you add differing philosophical views of the problem until just the very end, that's where the problem arose.

HEMMER: I want to get the reaction from Canada, where you are, in Montreal, in a moment here. But let's focus on the southeastern part of the U.S. here. This is a league that was making enormous inroads in markets where it had not been before -- Carolina, Atlanta Florida -- and these relations with fans are very tender. What happens to the clubs still trying to draft a fan base with a season that has now been wiped out.

FARBER: The club there's clearly have a lot of work to do. The best thing the NHL has going for it, are its fans are very adhesive. Kind of like being in the mob, either you're in or you're out. There are not very many casual hockey fans, and hockey fans, the true hockey fans, great passionate people, will stick with it.

The NHL's problem of course has been there aren't enough of these people. And these franchises, the ones without a long tradition, have to work extra hard at rebuilding trust.

HEMMER: What has been reaction there in Canada? And is it different from the U.S.?

FARBER: Well, in Canada, in most places, hockey is a spiritual necessity, and I think people feel it in their souls. But we go back to a January poll that said 77 percent of sports fans do not miss the NHL, and that is a very frightening figure. I'm not sure if that's anger talking or not, but we've not seen the visceral anger, even in Canada, that accompanied the baseball strike in 1994 in the United States.

HEMMER: Isn't that interesting, too? You wonder how that will play out when hockey begins again at some point.

Michael, thanks. Michael Farber from "Sports Illustrated," from Montreal, nice to chat with you today.

FARBER: Thank you. HEMMER: All right, here's Soledad.

O'BRIEN: What do you think hitting the slot machines next time you hit the shopping mall? it could happen. Andy's "Minding Your Business," up next on AMERICAN MORNING.

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O'BRIEN: A reminder that at 10:00 this morning, President Bush is going to announce his choice for the newly created post of director of national intelligence. Administration sources have that word for CNN. We're going to bring that to you live when it happens.

Before that though, much more to cover, let's get right to Jack.

JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Owners of America's biggest mall gambling on a major expansion. With that and a Wall Street preview, including some earnings that came out that are kind of interesting for reasons Andy will explain, here's Andy Serwer "Minding Your Business."

ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: I think I know what you're talking about. The mall -- HP, the mall of America we're going to be talking about in a second here.

Yes, Hewlett-Packard came out with numbers last night that were actually pretty good. Ironic, of course, because their CEO Carly Fiorina just stepped down just days ago. So interesting to see how Wall Street responds to that.

Also, Wal-Mart had a solid number out this morning, too. Both of those stocks should be active.

As far as yesterday goes, sit on your hands. Not a whole lot going on here. You can see a little upsie, a little downsie there. Maybe the yawn of a new era as Mike Farber said. I love that. Wasn't that I cute line? Very good. Those "Sports Illustrated" guys are terrific.

HEMMER: How about he said that even the Canadians don't care about hockey? Wow.

SERWER: That's very interesting. Jobless claims down this morning to 302,000, so that's pretty good stuff, too.

Now the Mall of Americas is the biggest mall in the country. It's in Bloomington, outside of the Twin Cities there, 4.2 million square feet. The developer wants to double up, double it, make it twice as big, a billion, a billion -- excuse me -- with a 'b,' billion dollar expansion. Here's what he wants to put in there, Jack, a casino, naturally, wants to work with the Indian tribes, a 6,000 foot concert haul.

And here's a good bit of timing. He wants to put in an NHL-sized ice rink. The wild already have a rink up there. So I don't know, now you're going to have two NHL rinks with no teams. He says, very quickly, you won't have to fly to Rodeo Drive, or New York City or Italy, you can stay right there. And of course, there's the Minnetonka that you don't have to go to St. Paul either. The casino will be called the "Palle Dujour (ph)," which means the "house of games," I think or something like that.

CAFFERTY: It means we'll pick you like a chicken.

SERWER: In American. In American it, means we'll pick you like a chicken.

CAFFERTY: That's right, we'll pluck you like a chicken, come on in.

SERWER: Biggest mall in North America is the West Edmonton one. But this would be a bigger

CAFFERTY: All right, it's time for the file, learn English or lose your child. A Tennessee judge told some immigrant mothers charged with child abuse and neglect to learn English. Wilson County Judge Barry Tatum instructed an 18-year-old woman from Mexico to learn English and use birth control after failing to immunize her child or show up for appointments with the Department of Children's Services. The ACLU, of course, says that these orders are discriminatory and unconstitutional. Tatum defends his actions, saying that he gave the orders in hopes the parents would make a greater effort to assimilate into American society, thus opening more opportunities for their children. This would be filed under 'W' for wisdom.

Will New York become "the world's second home," New York City? The city has filed an application to trademark the slogan "the world's second home giving New York exclusive rights to use the slogan to promote business and tourism. The new slogan is part of the city's push to try and land the 2012 Summer Olympics, which I desperately hope don't come here.

If the application is accepted, the city could attach the phrase to 200 different products and services from theatrical productions and parades to postcard and beach sandals. That's in the release, "beach sandals."

SERWER: What's the world's first home?

HEMMER: Planet Earth.

SERWER: Go ahead, sorry. I apologize.

CAFFERTY: That's all right. Jump in. It's an open forum here. The "File" welcomes all comers.

New York's famous red-tail hawks, Pale Mail (ph) and Lola, are back and they're getting busy. Last December, the birds, as you recall, were thrown out of their 12-year-old next on a luxury upper- eastside building by the building's co-op board.

The residents at 74th and Fifth didn't expect the huge outcry that followed, and they eventually agreed to build a custom platform on which Pale Mail and Lola can rebuild their nest, which they're currently doing.

The couple is hard at work starting a family. Last Saturday, the two birds were seen doing an X-rated performance on a TV antenna near their building, which no doubt will delight the co-op board that threw them out. Baby hawks on the way in the spring. They were mad because hawks sometimes little things would drop down on the sidewalk. Now there going to have a whole brood of them little devils.

SERWER: A little cooing and sounds.

HEMMER: Maybe the saffron brought them back. You know, you the Central Park action there.

CAFFERTY: Is that what they're calling those bed sheets they hung up in central park? He said he spent, what was it, $20 million?

SERWER: The city didn't spend money.

HEMMER: Private cash.

CAFFERTY: There's a great expenditure of 20 million bucks.

SERWER: I agree with you that it's not a good expenditure, but the city didn't do it.

CAFFERTY: We couldn't feed AIDS patients or vaccinate children. No, let's hang sheets in central park and spend $20 million to do it.

SERWER: I agree with you on that one.

CAFFERTY: That's a real bright idea there.

SERWER: I'm with you.

CAFFERTY: That's all I got here this morning.

We're watching this developing story out of the White House at this hour, too. In about an hour from now, we should get the president's announcement, his pick to become the first intelligence director in the U.S. We'll go live to the White House in a moment here, as we continue top of the hour on AMERICAN MORNING.

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O'BRIEN: Still to come this morning, an explosive lesson in chemistry. Students say that their teacher showed them how to make a bomb. Find out why police don't think it was an innocent experiment. That's ahead this morning on AMERICAN MORNING.

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