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American Morning
Atlanta Shooting Victim Remembered; More Twists in Jackson Trial
Aired March 15, 2005 - 08:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Murder suspect Brian Nichols back in court this morning, but not on murder charges just yet. We'll explain.
Learning more about former hostage Ashley Smith, her childhood, her husband's murder and where she gets her courage. Her story is ahead.
And a showdown coming for Congress and major league baseball. The league's former commissioner watching for a steroids bombshell on this AMERICAN MORNING.
ANNOUNCER: From the CNN broadcast center in New York, this is AMERICAN MORNING with Soledad O'Brien and Bill Hemmer.
O'BRIEN: Good morning, everybody.
Bill Hemmer has got the day off today.
Jack Cafferty helping us out, though.
We appreciate that.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: I'm just here to serve.
O'BRIEN: Well, thank you very much.
CAFFERTY: Yes.
O'BRIEN: Other stories we're looking at this morning, the boy who is accusing Michael Jackson of molestation is back on the stand today for more grueling cross-examination. Jeff Toobin takes a look at whether Jackson's lawyer is managing to poke some big holes in that boy's story.
CAFFERTY: Also, a huge ruling from a judge saying that California's ban on same-sex marriage is illegal. The battle lines are being drawn as we speak. We'll look at where the fight goes now.
Carol Costello is handling the question du jour.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: I am handling the question du jour and it has to do with Halliburton this morning. Halliburton overcharging the U.S. government $100 million for work in Iraq. That's according to a Pentagon ordered audit. This information has not come to light, even though Congress has requested it. But Halliburton continues to do work in Iraq, continues to spend money, continues to make a lot of money.
So our question this morning, should Halliburton give up its government contracts in Iraq? E-mail us at am@cnn.com.
O'BRIEN: All right, Carol, thank you very much.
Let's get right to the headlines now.
Kelly Wallace helping us out this morning -- good morning.
KELLY WALLACE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Thanks, Soledad.
Good morning, everyone.
Here are some of the stories now in the news.
Philippine officials say they are bracing for an attack this morning in retaliation for police gunning down some top members of Abu Sayyaf, a group linked to al Qaeda. It all happened just hours ago at this maximum security facility in Manila. Police stormed the building following a stand-off, killing more than 20 inmates. Five officers were also wounded in that raid.
More details now about that amber alert in Alabama we told you about just a half hour ago. Amber Danielle Shelton -- she goes by the name Danielle -- is believed to have been abducted by a man she met on the Internet. They are apparently traveling in a four door maroon 1995 Blazer with Alabama license plates. Anyone with information is asked to call the Oneonta Police Department or the Alabama Department of Public Safety.
President Bush set to meet today with one of the United States' closest Arab allies. Jordan's King Abdullah will be at the White House in just a couple of hours. Topping the agenda for the two leaders? Work on the Middle East peace process and calls for Syrian troops to leave Lebanon.
And finally, Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan, he is on Capitol Hill this morning. Mr. Greenspan will give his view on the future of Social Security before a special Senate committee on aging. He is expected to tell law makers the minimum age for retirement benefits should be raised. Everyone always listens to Alan Greenspan, but that is a controversial position he is taking.
CAFFERTY: Indeed, it is.
O'BRIEN: Thanks.
Well, Brian Nichols, the suspect in the Atlanta courthouse killings, is expected to have a status hearing in just about two hours from now. He's being held under maximum security at the Fulton County jail, suspected of killing four people, including a judge, a court reporter, a deputy and a U.S. Immigration and Customs agent.
That agent, David Wilhelm, was killed late Friday night when he was working alone on his new home. Wilhelm's body taken to his hometown of Salisbury, North Carolina for a funeral on Thursday. Police and mourners lined Interstate 85 as the hearse passed by them on Monday.
Wilhelm was special agent -- Deputy Smith -- deputy. And Special Agent Smith joins us this morning from Atlanta.
Nice to see you.
Thank you very much for talking about us and some of your memories of David Wilhelm.
KENNETH SMITH, SPECIAL AGENT, U.S. IMMIGRATION AND CUSTOMS: Good morning.
O'BRIEN: More is coming out about the circumstances of his death now. It's believed, in fact, he was killed around 11:00 p.m. on Friday evening.
Do you know more about what happened?
SMITH: At this time, I don't. We do believe that the incident occurred between 10:30 and 11:00 on Friday and of course Dave's body was discovered early Saturday morning.
O'BRIEN: You were a friend and a colleague, as well. We're told he was working on his house that late at night.
Was that something typical or usual for him?
SMITH: Dave was a very accomplished builder and he and his wife Candy were finishing a home. They were getting ready to close on and move into. And Dave was doing the stone work in the house. And it wasn't unusual for Dave to work late into the night in -- to finish up their project.
O'BRIEN: He was working on this, of course, because he had gotten a promotion and had moved to Atlanta after getting this promotion. Talk a little bit about his professional career. He'd worked in this capacity for 18 years.
SMITH: He did. And David Wilhelm was one of the most unique individuals I've ever had the opportunity to meet. He truly was one of the best that this country had. He was a true professional. He was dedicated in everything that he did, dedicated to his wife Candy, to his mom and dad, and his brothers and to his coworkers. He was dedicated to his career and he was just simply the best we have.
We're very fortunate that he chose law enforcement as his line of work because Dave would have been the best in whatever he chose to do.
O'BRIEN: He really sounded like a tremendous person.
We're told now that Dave -- that Brian Nichols asked directions, allegedly, to Buckhead, which, of course, is where this took place.
Any idea on why he would do that? SMITH: No idea at all. I think this whole incident is so hard to explain, why he went to that location and how he ended up in the same house with David Wilhelm, I think, is something we'll just never know.
O'BRIEN: I know that you're close to the family. As you mentioned, they were working on a house because his wife was coming to move into the house.
How is his wife doing?
SMITH: She's a wonderful lady and she's just doing remarkably well. The whole Wilhelm family is just something to behold. They're doing very well.
O'BRIEN: Kenneth Smith, special agent in charge, talking to us this morning.
Thanks for your time.
We appreciate it.
SMITH: Thanks.
If I could, on behalf of the Wilhelm family and my agency, I would just like to thank the community for the outpouring of support they've shown us over the last several days and send our sympathies to the families of Judge Barnes and the two Fulton County deputies who were also killed on Friday.
O'BRIEN: Thank you very much.
I'm sure they appreciate that.
O'BRIEN: Jack.
CAFFERTY: All right, here's a touch of class. Brian Nichols' former hostage, Ashley Smith, says she's not the hero in the courthouse killing case, the victims are.
Here's CNN's Tony Harris with more about the woman who single- handedly stopped a Saint Patrick's Day killer.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TONY HARRIS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Ashley Smith came face-to-face with an accused killer. The man on the run had run into a woman toughened by adversity. Life had always been a challenge for Ashley. Her grandparents had raised her after her father had run off when she was a baby.
ANN MACHOVEC, GRANDMOTHER: There was just so much going on there in the house. And I pretty much thought, poor Ashley. And then I thought, well, she'll be able to take care of herself. And she has a level head. HARRIS: Her grandfather had been headmaster at Augusta Christian School. That's where she went. She was on the drill team and played sports and developed an independent spirit.
But life after high school was no easier. Ashley was convicted for shoplifting. Then she got married early, had a baby with her husband, Mack Smith, after dropping out of college. Four years ago at this apartment complex, in a case that remains unsolved, Mack Smith was part of a brawl. He was stabbed. Ashley, who was across the parking lot, tried to get him to a hospital, but he died in her arms.
LARRY CROFT, STEPFATHER: I still have the pickup truck that they were in that was, you know -- he fell back and into her arms in the back of that truck. And he died right there in her arms, right there in her arms. And I got on the scene about -- oh, gosh, they hadn't even taken him away yet. And she was just -- she was just -- of course. I mean, it was just -- it was horrible.
HARRIS: Ashley decided to make a new start in suburban Atlanta, but had trouble holding a job. Her daughter stayed back in Augusta and Ashley saw her once a week.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She says papa and mama, believe me, I'm going to do something that's going to make you proud of me.
HARRIS: Ashley had just moved into the Bridgewater apartment complex and took a break to go out and buy cigarettes when Brian Nichols showed up. Ashley's grandfather, indeed, all of her relatives, say they thought she was capable of doing something amazing, that her life and faith had made her ready. And that's what they say this young woman did this past Saturday.
Tony Harris, CNN, Augusta, Georgia.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CAFFERTY: Amazing, indeed.
Smith is now asking for privacy so she can get some rest, continue helping authorities with the investigation. It's expected she will be called as a witness against Nichols -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: In the Michael Jackson case, Jackson's accuser back on the stand today for more cross-examination. The 15-year-old boy faced some tough questioning from Jackson's attorney on Monday.
Well, just how tough?
CNN's senior legal analyst Jeff Toobin joins us to talk about that -- good morning.
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Hi.
O'BRIEN: Really, an attack, I think it's fair to say, by Thomas Mesereau. Many people thought he'd be ginger with this kid and he's not been. TOOBIN: Well, I mean, I think we throw around the term bombshell, but this was really a big deal, what happened yesterday in this trial, because you had Jackson's accuser admitting on the witness stand that twice he had been asked by a school dean about whether there had been any misbehavior by Michael Jackson toward him and twice he denied that anything went wrong. That's a big deal in a case like this.
O'BRIEN: Wouldn't you expect, though, the prosecution has a zillion witnesses who will say children who've been molested will deny it, or change their story, that that's not that unusual?
TOOBIN: Well, that may be, but it's still a big deal in a case where the credibility of the accuser is essentially the whole case. Plus, it's significant because the defense here is that the mother put him up to it and the chronology fits well with that theory, if it's true, as it apparently is, that he denied to the school dean that he -- that anything went wrong.
O'BRIEN: So it's not only the information itself, but also it sort of fitting in this pattern?
TOOBIN: Exactly.
O'BRIEN: Let's talk about Jay Leno, as well, because that seemed to establish another inconsistency. And it seems like if Jay Leno is on the stand explaining this whole thing in the way that we've heard it at least said, it could be another bombshell.
TOOBIN: Absolutely. I mean Jay Leno was going to be an important witness all along. Now he looms as an even more important witness because the accuser yesterday said I never spoke to Jay Leno.
In Thomas Mesereau's opening statement, he said that Jay Leno will testify that the boy called him and said, you know, tried to ingratiate himself and Leno said he got the feeling he was being shaken down for money.
Now we have the situation, not only do we have the sort of shaken down for money, which is, of course, part of the defense, but, you know, the accuser's credibility of why would he lie about whether he spoke to Jay Leno?
O'BRIEN: If Jay Leno gets on the stand and says yes, I talked to the kid, he didn't -- the boy says he left a voice-mail message. But if Jay Leno gets on the stand and says no, I had a conversation and can convince the jury that that boy is lying, is the Michael Jackson part of the case done, it's over?
TOOBIN: I don't think so. I don't. You know, jurors judge kids by different standards. Jurors sometimes say look, he was a kid, he was confused, he's nervous, he doesn't -- so sometimes they cut children who are witnesses slack. But sometimes they don't. It's very hard to know how they're going to react.
Clearly, this is not good for the prosecution. I don't know if it's fatal. What's especially interesting is the prosecution met with the witness over the weekend when some of this disclosure about the statement to the dean came out. It's very unusual for prosecutors to meet with a witness during his cross-examination. It's...
O'BRIEN: Meaning they didn't know about it?
TOOBIN: Apparently not. I mean there did seem to be some panic over the weekend. It's considered very bad form to meet with a witness while he's on cross-examination. That's an illustration of how much trouble the prosecution thinks it's in.
O'BRIEN: Let's weigh in again on the assessment of the case -- defense, prosecution. You originally said the prosecution was weak from the get go.
TOOBIN: It's still looking like a problematic case. The only witnesses against Jackson so far are the accuser, the brother and the sister of the accuser. They all have issues with bias, with inconsistencies. But they are all children and the jury may say look, we believe them.
O'BRIEN: That's still up in the air.
All right, Jeff Toobin, as always, thanks.
TOOBIN: OK.
O'BRIEN: Jack.
CAFFERTY: Time to check on the weather now.
Chad Myers is at the CNN Center with the latest forecast -- good morning, Chad.
CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Good morning, Jack.
(WEATHER REPORT)
O'BRIEN: Ahead this morning, much more on that best-selling book that may have helped save Ashley Smith's life. We'll take a look at the role that "The Purpose Driven Life" played in the 26-year-old hostage's survival.
CAFFERTY: There's been a new development in the fight over same- sex marriage. We'll tell you why one side's court victory might turn out to be a loss.
O'BRIEN: And the big battle brewing over baseball and steroids. We'll talk with former baseball commissioner, Fay Vincent, just ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CAFFERTY: Once again our government working late into the night to protect us. This infamous Monday night towel dropping in the football locker room scene is in the clear. ABC got some complaints last November when it aired, showing desperate housewife Nicolette Sheridan exposing herself to Philadelphia Eagles wide receiver Terrell Owens. The FCC has ruled there was nothing indecent about it. You can all rest easier knowing that.
To a more serious subject. Baseball Commissioner Bud Selig is going to talk to Congress about steroids. And that's a turnaround for the commissioner of baseball. Several star players are still fighting subpoenas to appear before the House Government Reform Committee on Thursday.
Former baseball commissioner Fay Vincent is weighing in on this subject now.
He joins us live from Vero Beach, Florida.
Mr. Vincent, welcome to the program.
FAY VINCENT, FORMER MLB COMMISSIONER: Good morning, Jack.
CAFFERTY: Is this something Congress ought to be doing to begin with?
VINCENT: Well, that's a difficult question, isn't it? I think Congress has every right to look into this issue. They say there may be 500,000 kids who are taking steroids. I think they want to know why baseball didn't jump on the steroid issue over the last 10 years. So, I think baseball is wise to go down and try to co-opt Congress and see if they can't work together.
CAFFERTY: Do you have any thoughts on why baseball didn't jump on this issue over the last 10 years?
VINCENT: Well, I was there at the beginning in the early '90s and I think we believed that steroid was a football issue. We didn't think that bulking up and getting muscle bound was a baseball -- was a benefit in baseball. We thought it was a football issue. And we were wrong and, you know, I think baseball has every right to tell people they tried to deal with steroids, but they haven't been that successful, largely because the union would not permit drug testing.
CAFFERTY: Is Bud Selig making the right decision, in your opinion, to agree to go down there and testify?
VINCENT: Absolutely. The mistake was for him to say he wouldn't go. I think some of us urged them to go, me publicly, and he decided to go. That's a good decision.
CAFFERTY: What about the players? The players are fighting this, saying they don't want to appear. And I guess you can understand part of their reasoning, the potential damage to the image of the sport from a Mark McGwire or a Sammy Sosa sitting there answering tough questions put forth by this Congressional committee, not insignificant.
But what about the players? What should they be doing? VINCENT: Well, they're in a very difficult spot. I don't know how they get out of it. I think if Congress pushes it, the players are stuck. I mean they have to take the fifth amendment, some of them. That would ruin their careers in terms of commercial exploitation.
So I think the players have got a very difficult hand to play and I don't know how they play it.
CAFFERTY: Earlier, we quoted you as saying that baseball could take a lesson in the steroids investigation from Pete Rose.
What did you mean by that?
VINCENT: Well, I think my point was that baseball needs to come clean and I think the players need to come clean. I think that, as Justice Brandeis wrote once, "sunlight is the best disinfectant." And I think if people tell the truth and told the American public exactly what they had been doing, they would come out very well.
You take Mr. Nixon and Mr. Clinton and Mr. Rose, who lied, when it comes out that they've been lying, I think they're hurt well beyond what they would have been hurt had they told the truth from the beginning.
So I really think it's in the interests of all these people to say what they did, why they did it, if they're sorry, they're sorry, and let's go on. But I think Congress has a right to push them toward that end.
CAFFERTY: Appreciate your time this morning.
Fay Vincent, former major league baseball commissioner, joining us from Florida.
Thank you, sir, very much.
O'BRIEN: Well, the golden age of disco is alive and well.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
GLORIA GAYNOR: Just turn around now, because you're not welcome anymore. Weren't you the one...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: The rage boogies on through a grooving new exhibit with disco diva Gloria Gaynor just ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
GAYNOR: Oh no not I. I will survive. For as long as...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) CAFFERTY: Time to check in now with Carol Costello, who has the Question of the Day.
COSTELLO: Oh, people miss you doing the Question of the Day, Jack.
O'BRIEN: Are you writing this out there?
CAFFERTY: I doubt that very seriously.
COSTELLO: They are. They're saying get that woman out of here.
O'BRIEN: No.
COSTELLO: No, they're not. Just thought I'd make Jack feel better.
CAFFERTY: Thank you.
COSTELLO: I can only say people are very hot over Halliburton. Word is it may have overcharged the U.S. $100 million by doing things like charging $27 million to deliver $82,000 worth of petroleum gas from Kuwait to Iraq.
So here's our question. Should Halliburton give up its government contracts in Iraq?
Let's start with Pamela, shall we, from Michigan? "Not only should Halliburton give up its contract with the government, they should be prosecuted, fined and required to pay back with interest the money they swindled out of the g."
This is from Johnny from Vicksburg, Mississippi. I'm telling you, they're hot. "If the U.S. seriously wants to demonstrate renewed goodwill with the rest of the world, these contracts should be awarded to comparable industries in other countries. I'm not holding my breath and I don't think George Bush is either."
This is from Wistar from Flowery Branch, Georgia: "Halliburton should give up its Iraq contracts as part of their plea bargain that should include jail time for all officials."
And this is from Jonathan from Washington: "To suggest that the debate is whether Halliburton is good or evil, should stay or go, is either sponsored by Dick Cheney not, is hopelessly simplistic."
That's too deep for me this morning.
O'BRIEN: Well, I'm following that.
CAFFERTY: Yes.
O'BRIEN: I mean at the end of the day, Halliburton says that it's not over charging, it's adding a tax, essentially, for the fact that their workers are risking their lives, right? COSTELLO: Yes, but the only problem is a Pentagon audit found that payment for the petroleum gas from Kuwait illogical. I think that's pretty damning.
O'BRIEN: The numbers don't work.
COSTELLO: And I think they need to answer the questions. And I think that audit probably should go to Congress, so the Congress should look it over. But it's not doing it.
O'BRIEN: But if Halliburton says it's not going to do it, let's say they say OK, fine, we'll pull out, I mean who takes over? It's not like there's -- I would imagine there's not a lot of companies lined up to, you know, take on that work.
COSTELLO: Hey, if there's money to be made, there will be companies lined up.
O'BRIEN: You are sounding more like Jack Cafferty every moment.
CAFFERTY: But it occurs to me, Carol, that you're not quite surly enough to be me. And I'm probably not perky enough to be Bill Hemmer, OK, so...
COSTELLO: Oh, Bill Hemmer and perky.
CAFFERTY: So maybe this all doesn't fit so well.
O'BRIEN: No, I think it's going very smoothly.
Thank you, Carol.
Appreciate it.
COSTELLO: Sure.
O'BRIEN: Well, let's talk about this book that may have saved Ashley Smith's life. It's called "The Purpose Driven Life." We're going to take a look this morning at how the best-seller made such a big impact on both the hostage and the hostage taker.
That's what's next on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
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Aired March 15, 2005 - 08:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Murder suspect Brian Nichols back in court this morning, but not on murder charges just yet. We'll explain.
Learning more about former hostage Ashley Smith, her childhood, her husband's murder and where she gets her courage. Her story is ahead.
And a showdown coming for Congress and major league baseball. The league's former commissioner watching for a steroids bombshell on this AMERICAN MORNING.
ANNOUNCER: From the CNN broadcast center in New York, this is AMERICAN MORNING with Soledad O'Brien and Bill Hemmer.
O'BRIEN: Good morning, everybody.
Bill Hemmer has got the day off today.
Jack Cafferty helping us out, though.
We appreciate that.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: I'm just here to serve.
O'BRIEN: Well, thank you very much.
CAFFERTY: Yes.
O'BRIEN: Other stories we're looking at this morning, the boy who is accusing Michael Jackson of molestation is back on the stand today for more grueling cross-examination. Jeff Toobin takes a look at whether Jackson's lawyer is managing to poke some big holes in that boy's story.
CAFFERTY: Also, a huge ruling from a judge saying that California's ban on same-sex marriage is illegal. The battle lines are being drawn as we speak. We'll look at where the fight goes now.
Carol Costello is handling the question du jour.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: I am handling the question du jour and it has to do with Halliburton this morning. Halliburton overcharging the U.S. government $100 million for work in Iraq. That's according to a Pentagon ordered audit. This information has not come to light, even though Congress has requested it. But Halliburton continues to do work in Iraq, continues to spend money, continues to make a lot of money.
So our question this morning, should Halliburton give up its government contracts in Iraq? E-mail us at am@cnn.com.
O'BRIEN: All right, Carol, thank you very much.
Let's get right to the headlines now.
Kelly Wallace helping us out this morning -- good morning.
KELLY WALLACE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Thanks, Soledad.
Good morning, everyone.
Here are some of the stories now in the news.
Philippine officials say they are bracing for an attack this morning in retaliation for police gunning down some top members of Abu Sayyaf, a group linked to al Qaeda. It all happened just hours ago at this maximum security facility in Manila. Police stormed the building following a stand-off, killing more than 20 inmates. Five officers were also wounded in that raid.
More details now about that amber alert in Alabama we told you about just a half hour ago. Amber Danielle Shelton -- she goes by the name Danielle -- is believed to have been abducted by a man she met on the Internet. They are apparently traveling in a four door maroon 1995 Blazer with Alabama license plates. Anyone with information is asked to call the Oneonta Police Department or the Alabama Department of Public Safety.
President Bush set to meet today with one of the United States' closest Arab allies. Jordan's King Abdullah will be at the White House in just a couple of hours. Topping the agenda for the two leaders? Work on the Middle East peace process and calls for Syrian troops to leave Lebanon.
And finally, Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan, he is on Capitol Hill this morning. Mr. Greenspan will give his view on the future of Social Security before a special Senate committee on aging. He is expected to tell law makers the minimum age for retirement benefits should be raised. Everyone always listens to Alan Greenspan, but that is a controversial position he is taking.
CAFFERTY: Indeed, it is.
O'BRIEN: Thanks.
Well, Brian Nichols, the suspect in the Atlanta courthouse killings, is expected to have a status hearing in just about two hours from now. He's being held under maximum security at the Fulton County jail, suspected of killing four people, including a judge, a court reporter, a deputy and a U.S. Immigration and Customs agent.
That agent, David Wilhelm, was killed late Friday night when he was working alone on his new home. Wilhelm's body taken to his hometown of Salisbury, North Carolina for a funeral on Thursday. Police and mourners lined Interstate 85 as the hearse passed by them on Monday.
Wilhelm was special agent -- Deputy Smith -- deputy. And Special Agent Smith joins us this morning from Atlanta.
Nice to see you.
Thank you very much for talking about us and some of your memories of David Wilhelm.
KENNETH SMITH, SPECIAL AGENT, U.S. IMMIGRATION AND CUSTOMS: Good morning.
O'BRIEN: More is coming out about the circumstances of his death now. It's believed, in fact, he was killed around 11:00 p.m. on Friday evening.
Do you know more about what happened?
SMITH: At this time, I don't. We do believe that the incident occurred between 10:30 and 11:00 on Friday and of course Dave's body was discovered early Saturday morning.
O'BRIEN: You were a friend and a colleague, as well. We're told he was working on his house that late at night.
Was that something typical or usual for him?
SMITH: Dave was a very accomplished builder and he and his wife Candy were finishing a home. They were getting ready to close on and move into. And Dave was doing the stone work in the house. And it wasn't unusual for Dave to work late into the night in -- to finish up their project.
O'BRIEN: He was working on this, of course, because he had gotten a promotion and had moved to Atlanta after getting this promotion. Talk a little bit about his professional career. He'd worked in this capacity for 18 years.
SMITH: He did. And David Wilhelm was one of the most unique individuals I've ever had the opportunity to meet. He truly was one of the best that this country had. He was a true professional. He was dedicated in everything that he did, dedicated to his wife Candy, to his mom and dad, and his brothers and to his coworkers. He was dedicated to his career and he was just simply the best we have.
We're very fortunate that he chose law enforcement as his line of work because Dave would have been the best in whatever he chose to do.
O'BRIEN: He really sounded like a tremendous person.
We're told now that Dave -- that Brian Nichols asked directions, allegedly, to Buckhead, which, of course, is where this took place.
Any idea on why he would do that? SMITH: No idea at all. I think this whole incident is so hard to explain, why he went to that location and how he ended up in the same house with David Wilhelm, I think, is something we'll just never know.
O'BRIEN: I know that you're close to the family. As you mentioned, they were working on a house because his wife was coming to move into the house.
How is his wife doing?
SMITH: She's a wonderful lady and she's just doing remarkably well. The whole Wilhelm family is just something to behold. They're doing very well.
O'BRIEN: Kenneth Smith, special agent in charge, talking to us this morning.
Thanks for your time.
We appreciate it.
SMITH: Thanks.
If I could, on behalf of the Wilhelm family and my agency, I would just like to thank the community for the outpouring of support they've shown us over the last several days and send our sympathies to the families of Judge Barnes and the two Fulton County deputies who were also killed on Friday.
O'BRIEN: Thank you very much.
I'm sure they appreciate that.
O'BRIEN: Jack.
CAFFERTY: All right, here's a touch of class. Brian Nichols' former hostage, Ashley Smith, says she's not the hero in the courthouse killing case, the victims are.
Here's CNN's Tony Harris with more about the woman who single- handedly stopped a Saint Patrick's Day killer.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TONY HARRIS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Ashley Smith came face-to-face with an accused killer. The man on the run had run into a woman toughened by adversity. Life had always been a challenge for Ashley. Her grandparents had raised her after her father had run off when she was a baby.
ANN MACHOVEC, GRANDMOTHER: There was just so much going on there in the house. And I pretty much thought, poor Ashley. And then I thought, well, she'll be able to take care of herself. And she has a level head. HARRIS: Her grandfather had been headmaster at Augusta Christian School. That's where she went. She was on the drill team and played sports and developed an independent spirit.
But life after high school was no easier. Ashley was convicted for shoplifting. Then she got married early, had a baby with her husband, Mack Smith, after dropping out of college. Four years ago at this apartment complex, in a case that remains unsolved, Mack Smith was part of a brawl. He was stabbed. Ashley, who was across the parking lot, tried to get him to a hospital, but he died in her arms.
LARRY CROFT, STEPFATHER: I still have the pickup truck that they were in that was, you know -- he fell back and into her arms in the back of that truck. And he died right there in her arms, right there in her arms. And I got on the scene about -- oh, gosh, they hadn't even taken him away yet. And she was just -- she was just -- of course. I mean, it was just -- it was horrible.
HARRIS: Ashley decided to make a new start in suburban Atlanta, but had trouble holding a job. Her daughter stayed back in Augusta and Ashley saw her once a week.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She says papa and mama, believe me, I'm going to do something that's going to make you proud of me.
HARRIS: Ashley had just moved into the Bridgewater apartment complex and took a break to go out and buy cigarettes when Brian Nichols showed up. Ashley's grandfather, indeed, all of her relatives, say they thought she was capable of doing something amazing, that her life and faith had made her ready. And that's what they say this young woman did this past Saturday.
Tony Harris, CNN, Augusta, Georgia.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CAFFERTY: Amazing, indeed.
Smith is now asking for privacy so she can get some rest, continue helping authorities with the investigation. It's expected she will be called as a witness against Nichols -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: In the Michael Jackson case, Jackson's accuser back on the stand today for more cross-examination. The 15-year-old boy faced some tough questioning from Jackson's attorney on Monday.
Well, just how tough?
CNN's senior legal analyst Jeff Toobin joins us to talk about that -- good morning.
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Hi.
O'BRIEN: Really, an attack, I think it's fair to say, by Thomas Mesereau. Many people thought he'd be ginger with this kid and he's not been. TOOBIN: Well, I mean, I think we throw around the term bombshell, but this was really a big deal, what happened yesterday in this trial, because you had Jackson's accuser admitting on the witness stand that twice he had been asked by a school dean about whether there had been any misbehavior by Michael Jackson toward him and twice he denied that anything went wrong. That's a big deal in a case like this.
O'BRIEN: Wouldn't you expect, though, the prosecution has a zillion witnesses who will say children who've been molested will deny it, or change their story, that that's not that unusual?
TOOBIN: Well, that may be, but it's still a big deal in a case where the credibility of the accuser is essentially the whole case. Plus, it's significant because the defense here is that the mother put him up to it and the chronology fits well with that theory, if it's true, as it apparently is, that he denied to the school dean that he -- that anything went wrong.
O'BRIEN: So it's not only the information itself, but also it sort of fitting in this pattern?
TOOBIN: Exactly.
O'BRIEN: Let's talk about Jay Leno, as well, because that seemed to establish another inconsistency. And it seems like if Jay Leno is on the stand explaining this whole thing in the way that we've heard it at least said, it could be another bombshell.
TOOBIN: Absolutely. I mean Jay Leno was going to be an important witness all along. Now he looms as an even more important witness because the accuser yesterday said I never spoke to Jay Leno.
In Thomas Mesereau's opening statement, he said that Jay Leno will testify that the boy called him and said, you know, tried to ingratiate himself and Leno said he got the feeling he was being shaken down for money.
Now we have the situation, not only do we have the sort of shaken down for money, which is, of course, part of the defense, but, you know, the accuser's credibility of why would he lie about whether he spoke to Jay Leno?
O'BRIEN: If Jay Leno gets on the stand and says yes, I talked to the kid, he didn't -- the boy says he left a voice-mail message. But if Jay Leno gets on the stand and says no, I had a conversation and can convince the jury that that boy is lying, is the Michael Jackson part of the case done, it's over?
TOOBIN: I don't think so. I don't. You know, jurors judge kids by different standards. Jurors sometimes say look, he was a kid, he was confused, he's nervous, he doesn't -- so sometimes they cut children who are witnesses slack. But sometimes they don't. It's very hard to know how they're going to react.
Clearly, this is not good for the prosecution. I don't know if it's fatal. What's especially interesting is the prosecution met with the witness over the weekend when some of this disclosure about the statement to the dean came out. It's very unusual for prosecutors to meet with a witness during his cross-examination. It's...
O'BRIEN: Meaning they didn't know about it?
TOOBIN: Apparently not. I mean there did seem to be some panic over the weekend. It's considered very bad form to meet with a witness while he's on cross-examination. That's an illustration of how much trouble the prosecution thinks it's in.
O'BRIEN: Let's weigh in again on the assessment of the case -- defense, prosecution. You originally said the prosecution was weak from the get go.
TOOBIN: It's still looking like a problematic case. The only witnesses against Jackson so far are the accuser, the brother and the sister of the accuser. They all have issues with bias, with inconsistencies. But they are all children and the jury may say look, we believe them.
O'BRIEN: That's still up in the air.
All right, Jeff Toobin, as always, thanks.
TOOBIN: OK.
O'BRIEN: Jack.
CAFFERTY: Time to check on the weather now.
Chad Myers is at the CNN Center with the latest forecast -- good morning, Chad.
CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Good morning, Jack.
(WEATHER REPORT)
O'BRIEN: Ahead this morning, much more on that best-selling book that may have helped save Ashley Smith's life. We'll take a look at the role that "The Purpose Driven Life" played in the 26-year-old hostage's survival.
CAFFERTY: There's been a new development in the fight over same- sex marriage. We'll tell you why one side's court victory might turn out to be a loss.
O'BRIEN: And the big battle brewing over baseball and steroids. We'll talk with former baseball commissioner, Fay Vincent, just ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CAFFERTY: Once again our government working late into the night to protect us. This infamous Monday night towel dropping in the football locker room scene is in the clear. ABC got some complaints last November when it aired, showing desperate housewife Nicolette Sheridan exposing herself to Philadelphia Eagles wide receiver Terrell Owens. The FCC has ruled there was nothing indecent about it. You can all rest easier knowing that.
To a more serious subject. Baseball Commissioner Bud Selig is going to talk to Congress about steroids. And that's a turnaround for the commissioner of baseball. Several star players are still fighting subpoenas to appear before the House Government Reform Committee on Thursday.
Former baseball commissioner Fay Vincent is weighing in on this subject now.
He joins us live from Vero Beach, Florida.
Mr. Vincent, welcome to the program.
FAY VINCENT, FORMER MLB COMMISSIONER: Good morning, Jack.
CAFFERTY: Is this something Congress ought to be doing to begin with?
VINCENT: Well, that's a difficult question, isn't it? I think Congress has every right to look into this issue. They say there may be 500,000 kids who are taking steroids. I think they want to know why baseball didn't jump on the steroid issue over the last 10 years. So, I think baseball is wise to go down and try to co-opt Congress and see if they can't work together.
CAFFERTY: Do you have any thoughts on why baseball didn't jump on this issue over the last 10 years?
VINCENT: Well, I was there at the beginning in the early '90s and I think we believed that steroid was a football issue. We didn't think that bulking up and getting muscle bound was a baseball -- was a benefit in baseball. We thought it was a football issue. And we were wrong and, you know, I think baseball has every right to tell people they tried to deal with steroids, but they haven't been that successful, largely because the union would not permit drug testing.
CAFFERTY: Is Bud Selig making the right decision, in your opinion, to agree to go down there and testify?
VINCENT: Absolutely. The mistake was for him to say he wouldn't go. I think some of us urged them to go, me publicly, and he decided to go. That's a good decision.
CAFFERTY: What about the players? The players are fighting this, saying they don't want to appear. And I guess you can understand part of their reasoning, the potential damage to the image of the sport from a Mark McGwire or a Sammy Sosa sitting there answering tough questions put forth by this Congressional committee, not insignificant.
But what about the players? What should they be doing? VINCENT: Well, they're in a very difficult spot. I don't know how they get out of it. I think if Congress pushes it, the players are stuck. I mean they have to take the fifth amendment, some of them. That would ruin their careers in terms of commercial exploitation.
So I think the players have got a very difficult hand to play and I don't know how they play it.
CAFFERTY: Earlier, we quoted you as saying that baseball could take a lesson in the steroids investigation from Pete Rose.
What did you mean by that?
VINCENT: Well, I think my point was that baseball needs to come clean and I think the players need to come clean. I think that, as Justice Brandeis wrote once, "sunlight is the best disinfectant." And I think if people tell the truth and told the American public exactly what they had been doing, they would come out very well.
You take Mr. Nixon and Mr. Clinton and Mr. Rose, who lied, when it comes out that they've been lying, I think they're hurt well beyond what they would have been hurt had they told the truth from the beginning.
So I really think it's in the interests of all these people to say what they did, why they did it, if they're sorry, they're sorry, and let's go on. But I think Congress has a right to push them toward that end.
CAFFERTY: Appreciate your time this morning.
Fay Vincent, former major league baseball commissioner, joining us from Florida.
Thank you, sir, very much.
O'BRIEN: Well, the golden age of disco is alive and well.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
GLORIA GAYNOR: Just turn around now, because you're not welcome anymore. Weren't you the one...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: The rage boogies on through a grooving new exhibit with disco diva Gloria Gaynor just ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
GAYNOR: Oh no not I. I will survive. For as long as...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) CAFFERTY: Time to check in now with Carol Costello, who has the Question of the Day.
COSTELLO: Oh, people miss you doing the Question of the Day, Jack.
O'BRIEN: Are you writing this out there?
CAFFERTY: I doubt that very seriously.
COSTELLO: They are. They're saying get that woman out of here.
O'BRIEN: No.
COSTELLO: No, they're not. Just thought I'd make Jack feel better.
CAFFERTY: Thank you.
COSTELLO: I can only say people are very hot over Halliburton. Word is it may have overcharged the U.S. $100 million by doing things like charging $27 million to deliver $82,000 worth of petroleum gas from Kuwait to Iraq.
So here's our question. Should Halliburton give up its government contracts in Iraq?
Let's start with Pamela, shall we, from Michigan? "Not only should Halliburton give up its contract with the government, they should be prosecuted, fined and required to pay back with interest the money they swindled out of the g."
This is from Johnny from Vicksburg, Mississippi. I'm telling you, they're hot. "If the U.S. seriously wants to demonstrate renewed goodwill with the rest of the world, these contracts should be awarded to comparable industries in other countries. I'm not holding my breath and I don't think George Bush is either."
This is from Wistar from Flowery Branch, Georgia: "Halliburton should give up its Iraq contracts as part of their plea bargain that should include jail time for all officials."
And this is from Jonathan from Washington: "To suggest that the debate is whether Halliburton is good or evil, should stay or go, is either sponsored by Dick Cheney not, is hopelessly simplistic."
That's too deep for me this morning.
O'BRIEN: Well, I'm following that.
CAFFERTY: Yes.
O'BRIEN: I mean at the end of the day, Halliburton says that it's not over charging, it's adding a tax, essentially, for the fact that their workers are risking their lives, right? COSTELLO: Yes, but the only problem is a Pentagon audit found that payment for the petroleum gas from Kuwait illogical. I think that's pretty damning.
O'BRIEN: The numbers don't work.
COSTELLO: And I think they need to answer the questions. And I think that audit probably should go to Congress, so the Congress should look it over. But it's not doing it.
O'BRIEN: But if Halliburton says it's not going to do it, let's say they say OK, fine, we'll pull out, I mean who takes over? It's not like there's -- I would imagine there's not a lot of companies lined up to, you know, take on that work.
COSTELLO: Hey, if there's money to be made, there will be companies lined up.
O'BRIEN: You are sounding more like Jack Cafferty every moment.
CAFFERTY: But it occurs to me, Carol, that you're not quite surly enough to be me. And I'm probably not perky enough to be Bill Hemmer, OK, so...
COSTELLO: Oh, Bill Hemmer and perky.
CAFFERTY: So maybe this all doesn't fit so well.
O'BRIEN: No, I think it's going very smoothly.
Thank you, Carol.
Appreciate it.
COSTELLO: Sure.
O'BRIEN: Well, let's talk about this book that may have saved Ashley Smith's life. It's called "The Purpose Driven Life." We're going to take a look this morning at how the best-seller made such a big impact on both the hostage and the hostage taker.
That's what's next on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
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