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American Morning
Interview With Congressman Chris Shays; Behind the Robert Blake Verdict; March Madness
Aired March 17, 2005 - 07:29 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back, everybody. It's just about half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING. Bill Hemmer has got the day off, but Rob Marciano has been kind enough to fill in.
Nice to see you. Thanks for joining us.
ROB MARCIANO, CNN ANCHOR: Happy to be here.
O'BRIEN: Thank you very much.
Let's show some you pictures we're just getting into CNN. This is obviously Scott Peterson being led away in handcuffs. He's being transferred to San Quentin prison. This is where he will now be on death row. Obviously, appeals will be filed. It should take a while before he is finally executed, if that does, indeed, happen. But those are the latest pictures of Scott Peterson out in California this morning.
Ahead on AMERICAN MORNING, congressional hearings on steroids in baseball. That's coming up in just a few hours. We're going to talk this morning, though, with one member of the committee about just what he wants to hear today.
MARCIANO: Also, Jeff Toobin, just a few minutes ago, saying he's stunned by the verdict in the Robert Blake trial. Next, four members of the jury join us live to explain why it was their only choice.
O'BRIEN: First, though, let's get right to the steroids showdown on Capitol Hill. Members of a House committee will grill baseball executives, past and present players and health professionals today over the use of steroids in the sport. The committee will also look at some of baseball steroid policies that they say contain disturbing loopholes.
Connecticut Republican Chris Shays, he is the committee's vice chairman, joins us from the Capitol this morning.
Nice to see you, Congressman. Thank you very much for being with us.
REP. CHRIS SHAYS, VICE CHAIRMAN (R), GOVT. REFORM COMMITTEE: It's nice to be with you. Thank you.
O'BRIEN: Some new information has come out about these loopholes. And I guess it's because politicians have kind of gotten around to reading the fine print in what Major League Baseball has been negotiating with the players. Here is what they've said. There are now fines can be replaced for actual suspensions. Strictly confidential will be the results of the testing. The policy can be suspended, in fact, if the government starts doing any kind of investigation. And four steroids were actually left off the list.
When this was discovered in the reading of the fine print, how did you feel? Do you feel like you were duped by Major League Baseball in some way?
SHAYS: Well, it's just a continuation of the arrogance of Major League Baseball. I mean, when we said we were going to have this hearing, I was modestly interested until I started to hear the response of Major League Baseball that said, how dare you.
You know, they're exempt from antitrust laws. They're not exempt from the laws. We're talking about players that are revered, worshipped, adored by our kids, respected by adults. And the bottom line, we're talking about drugs.
These folks said they had a policy to deal with the issue. And I had a problem with 10 days first time, 30 days the second, 60 the third, a year the fourth, and only then, the fifth time, were you out. And then we learn, well, that's just -- you know, it's even worse than that, as you just described.
O'BRIEN: So what's the conclusion, then? They're not serious at all about cleaning up steroids in baseball, and now Congress has to go to get involved?
SHAYS: Well, I mean, the bottom line is, thank goodness we are getting involved. In the end, we may put it back on their shoulders. But you may ultimately see a uniform policy about drugs in major league sports as a result of this. You know this wouldn't be the decision of our committee. We're an investigative committee. But I think you're going to see strong action on the part of Congress.
O'BRIEN: But why are you talking to the players and not the owners? I mean, if you're outraged by all of the loopholes and the inaction, why not haul the owners in front of Congress and not the players?
SHAYS: Well, I think we have the commissioner in. And we'll sure have some interesting questions for him. And so we'll see.
O'BRIEN: At this point, anybody been offered immunity?
SHAYS: I don't think so, and I hope we don't do that.
O'BRIEN: So then...
SHAYS: But let me just say this to you. We also don't want them to exercise their Fifth Amendment rights. In other words, we don't want to put them in a position they feel they have to. So, I'm not interested in knowing if each individual player took steroids. I would like them to voluntarily say what they've done. You know, they perhaps could do that in their opening statement. But I'm not interested in it, and I don't think most of the members are interested in getting somebody.
O'BRIEN: So, if they don't voluntarily mention that they've used steroids, you don't have an interest in knowing the answer to the big question: When you broke all of the records, were you on steroids? That seems like an important question to ask.
SHAYS: No. You know what? No, there are a lot of important questions to ask, and maybe that question will be asked at a later date. If we down go down that route, you know, we're in danger of the players exercising their Fifth Amendment right, which they have a right to do obviously. But then we can't ask them any other questions. You can't selectively use their Fifth Amendment rights.
We'd like to know their attitude. We'd like to know what impact they think drugs have. We'd like to know if other players, not specific names, but if they think this is widely used. A lot of questions.
O'BRIEN: Congressman Chris Shays is joining us this morning. Of course, we're going to be watching this hearing. It begins at 10:00 Eastern Time. And CNN is going to keep you up to date as the testimony progresses throughout the day.
It's time to check in with the other stories that are making headlines this morning with Carol Costello.
Good morning.
MARCIANO: Hi, Carol.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning. Good morning to you both. Good morning, everyone.
"Now in the News."
The first phase of serious withdrawal from Lebanon is apparently over. A senior Lebanese army officer says Syria's army and intelligence officers have redeployed closer to their country's border. Syria's president has promised to bring all of his country's troops home in the second phase. No word on exactly when that will begin, though.
In Miami a grand jury has indicted a caregiver for the murder of a little girl more than four years ago. Geralyn Graham is in prison for an unrelated conviction. That's where she apparently confessed to the killing of Rilya Wilson (ph), according to a state attorney. Authorities suspect she beat and suffocated the little girl in December of 2000, almost two years before the child was officially cited as missing. Graham now denies those claims.
Martha Stewart is fighting to clear her name. The homemaking diva will head back to court today. Lawyers are scheduled to appeal her criminal conviction before a three-judge panel in New York. The court can either uphold her guilty verdict or order a new trial. An opinion is not expected for several months. And March Madness is kicking off today. Sixteen games are scheduled in the NCAA basketball tournament for this afternoon and tonight. Among them, the nation's top-ranked team, Illinois, is taking on Fairleigh Dickinson in Indianapolis. If you still haven't filled out your bracket, time is running out. The first tip-off is at 12:20 Eastern. And by the way, Illinois is favored by, what, 26.5 points?
MARCIANO: Well, they lost a whole one game, so they are a tough team to beat this year.
COSTELLO: To Ohio State, I think.
MARCIANO: Hey, Ohio State.
COSTELLO: Yes. It's good, isn't it?
MARCIANO: Congrats.
O'BRIEN: All right, Carol, thanks.
Well, Robert Blake is a free man this morning. A jury found him not guilty in the 2001 murder of his wife.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We, the jury in the above-entitled action, find the defendant, Robert Blake, not guilty of the crime of first- degree murder of Bonny Lee Bakely.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: The verdict on Wednesday brought Blake to tears. Four members of that jury are with us this morning from Valencia in California. Thomas Nicholson, the jury foreman, along with the jurors Cecilia Moldonado, Lorie Moore and Chuck Safco.
It's nice to see you all. Thank you very much for talking with us.
Let's start with the jury foreman, Mr. Nicholson. You deliberated for quite a long time. Give me a sense of what it was like in the jury room. Was there much argument?
THOMAS NICHOLSON, JURY FOREMAN: Argument isn't the right word. A lot of discussion. As you've got to recall, the jury panel consisted of an age group ranging from mid-20s to late-70s. So, the amount of discussion that was made was very, very full. Each and every person had a full discussion about every issue that was in the testimony, the evidence, everything. Argument? No, I don't think it was really argument.
O'BRIEN: So, Cecilia, when Thomas says there was lots of discussion but not necessarily argument, was it just discussion because of clarification? Everyone was sort of in agreement that you didn't think that he was guilty? CECILIA MOLDONADO, JUROR: Everyone was not in agreement right away. So, what we did was, we had to go through all of the facts. And, yes, we did have our discussions. It was a complete discussion. Everyone put in their opinions. We all answered any questions. We dissected the evidence. We dissected the testimony, went through everything, and came back with the fair decision.
O'BRIEN: Lori, the stuntmen said that Robert Blake hired them to kill his wife. Why did you guys not believe their testimony?
LORIE MOORE, JUROR: Because in the preliminary hearing, he lied and said that he -- oh, I lost my train of thought. He lied and said that he did.
O'BRIEN: That there was a conflict between what he said in the preliminary hearing...
MOORE: Right, right.
O'BRIEN: ... and what he then later said. And so, was it essentially that they just seemed like liars, the stuntmen who claimed that they had been hired by Robert Blake? They just didn't seem like they were honest people to you? Was that the issue?
MOORE: That's the issue. That's what I was trying to say. Sorry.
O'BRIEN: It's early in the morning, I hear you, Lorie. Don't worry about it.
MOORE: Very early. It is.
O'BRIEN: Let's go to Chuck. What did you think was the prosecution's weakest part of the case? I mean, did you think that they just put on a bad case? Or did you think that Robert Blake was an innocent guy?
CHUCK SAFCO, JUROR: I felt Robert Blake was an innocent guy. I think the prosecution did the best job that they could do with what they had. They didn't really have a lot to go on. I mean, that's one reason why we had a circumstantial case.
O'BRIEN: At the same time, Cecilia, you were deadlocked on solicitation of one of the stuntmen. Explain that for me and how it came to be deadlocked and what you discussed about that in the jury room.
MOLDONADO: Well, the juror that was -- the final juror that was deadlocked explained the reasoning. And so we went back and re- reviewed all of the evidence that we needed to regarding Hamilton. And once that -- we did not pressure. Nobody ever pressured anyone. It was a respected opinion. So if that's the decision the juror made, we respected it, and that's how we came back hung. But there were just flaws in the testimony, and the juror had opinions, and we respected them. O'BRIEN: Cecilia, I've got a final question for you, and actually any of you guys can jump in and answer this. Bonny Lee Bakley was the victim, terrible circumstances of her death. But at the end of the day, she had a terrible reputation. Person after person testified about her background, which was unseemly in many, many ways. How much of a role did that play in how you thought about this case?
MOORE: It didn't play much of a role in my opinion.
MOLDONADO: She was a human being.
MOORE: Yes.
NICHOLSON: Yes, the manner in how she died was brutal, regardless of who and what she was previous to her death. It didn't, in my mind, play that big of a role. We were discussing a brutal murder. Irrespective of the fact that it was Robert Blake or Bonny Lee Bakley or whoever, it was a murder and it was brutally done. And she didn't deserve that.
O'BRIEN: The jurors in the Robert Blake murder trial. I thank you all for joining us. We certainly appreciate it. I know you've been busy over many days. You haven't had a chance to spend a lot of time with your families. And we appreciate you getting up very early to talk to us as well. Thank you.
MOLDONADO: You're welcome.
MOORE: Thank you.
NICHOLSON: Thank you.
SAFCO: Thank you.
O'BRIEN: Rob.
MARCIANO: Soledad, it's time now for a weather check.
(WEATHER REPORT)
O'BRIEN: Well, one of the biggest media companies in the country could be headed for a big breakup. Andy is "Minding Your Business" just ahead.
MARCIANO: Also, just a few hours until March Madness hits a fever pitch. A man who knows the game tells us who has got the inside track to the Final Four. We'll be right back. More of AMERICAN MORNING is still to come.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MARCIANO: It's time now to check in with Jack Cafferty for the "Question of the Day." What do you have, Jack?
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Thank you, Rob. It was probably a matter of time until Congress got around to this, but with crude oil prices at record highs, the Senate did vote yesterday to open Alaska's 19-million acre National Wildlife Refuge to energy exploration. Supporters think that drilling in ANWR (ph) is a matter of national security, critical in reducing U.S. dependence on foreign oil. Opponents argue that drilling will damage the ecologically-fragile coastal plain, which is America's largest wildlife sanctuary.
So the question is: Do you think Congress ought to allow oil drilling in Alaska's National Wildlife Refuge?
Doug in New Jersey writes: "Alaska's ANWR is a piece of America the beautiful that should not be sacrificed to the energy industry for a paltry one-year supply of oil. To do so in the name of national security is absurd."
Meg in Virginia writes: "Ninety-nine percent of us will never set foot in Alaska's National Wildlife Reserve, 99 percent of us have to buy gas. Drill now."
Jacqueline in Ohio writes: "No, oil is a quantifiable resource. America will eventually need to find alternative sources of energy anyway. It would be almost criminal to destroy the homes of many innocent animals, not to mention upsetting the local eco-system there for the sake of money."
James in Illinois: "We have a president whose family has gotten rich from oil, a vice president who is also a rich man, thanks to oil. Is it any wonder why oil is at an all-time high? The Republicans would drill for oil on the White House lawn."
And Wistar...
ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: If there was oil there, why not? Maybe they should.
CAFFERTY: My people have come back. My folks are home.
And Wistar in Georgia writes: "Sure. With all of the oil we get here, we can delay looking for alternative fuel solutions for another week or two."
MARCIANO: There are so many sides to this issue. I mean, you can argue that, you know, we're knocking down trees all over the place just to build houses and roads.
CAFFERTY: Yes.
MARCIANO: And, you know, you're going to argue that we need the oil as well.
CAFFERTY: I'm not going to argue. I'm tired.
MARCIANO: Oh, Cafferty...
O'BRIEN: You're going just to throw it out there today.
CAFFERTY: Yes, yes.
MARCIANO: Cafferty is an Irish name, isn't it? How come he's not wearing green?
CAFFERTY: Of course it's an Irish name.
O'BRIEN: Well, then let me be the first to wish you a happy St. Patrick's Day.
MARCIANO: Happy St. Patrick's Day.
CAFFERTY: I was wondering how long it would be before we got around to this. And then the next thing is, how come you're not wearing any green? Are you wearing any green? And everybody is Irish today, and the whole thing is tedious, don't you think?
O'BRIEN: OK, Jack, I didn't ask any of that. And I don't care why you're not wearing green. I am just saying, happy St. Patrick's Day, Jack. I hope you have a great day.
Moving on to business, shall we? The bidding war over a popular toy store is over. So who is the next Toys R Us kid? Andy Serwer is "Minding Your Business."
Happy St. Patrick's Day.
SERWER: Thank you very much, Soledad. And likewise to you.
O'BRIEN: Thank you.
SERWER: Let's...
CAFFERTY: Oh, please!
SERWER: That was very civilized, wasn't it? It's not a big deal one way or the other.
OK, let's talk about the stock market yesterday. Not a good one for investors. You can see here, all over the place, red, red, red. Record price of oil, of course. The trade deficit hitting a record. General Motors down 14 percent after talking about a loss for the quarter. Futures are down again this morning.
You know, five years ago, Viacom bought CBS for $40 billion, promising synergies out the wazoo. We're going to put all of these businesses together.
CAFFERTY: Promising what?
SERWER: Yes, a lot of synergies.
CAFFERTY: Where?
SERWER: A lot of synergies. CAFFERTY: But where?
SERWER: I'm not going to...
MARCIANO: Toobin used that term as well.
SERWER: Yes, exactly.
MARCIANO: It's popular today.
SERWER: Really, that's the word of the day.
CAFFERTY: Synergies, out the wazoo (ph).
SERWER: Yes, all kinds of synergies.
CAFFERTY: Yes.
SERWER: Can I get to this, Jack, OK?
CAFFERTY: Happy St. Patrick's Day.
SERWER: Thank you.
MARCIANO: Finally.
SERWER: Civilized.
OK. Anyway, the stock has not fulfilled any of the promises that Sumner Redstone, the 81-year-old billionaire, thought that would happen after this deal. And so, yesterday he suggested they're going to break the company up. Les Moonves, who runs CBS, would be controlling that part of the company, along with Infinity. Tom Freston, the MTV chief, would be running MTV and Nickelodeon, VH-1 and those businesses. And the stock responded. It went up a lot.
Of course, Time Warner tried to do a deal to put together all sorts of properties as well, our parent company. And that hasn't gone as well either. So we'll be watching that stock today.
O'BRIEN: All right.
CAFFERTY: It didn't go well? Our stock used to be $95. What is it now, 17?
SERWER: I think that's a fair assessment.
CAFFERTY: I think that's an indication that it didn't go well, right?
SERWER: Yes, right through the wazoo (ph) situation here.
CAFFERTY: Yes, we had losses out the wazoo (ph), yes.
SERWER: Yes. What does that word actually mean?
CAFFERTY: Huh?
SERWER: Never mind.
CAFFERTY: You know what it means. That's why you used it.
SERWER: Yes indeed.
O'BRIEN: Let's not, shall we?
SERWER: Let's not.
O'BRIEN: All right, moving ahead. March Madness in the road to the Final Four. Jack this morning talks to a basketball insider, up next on AMERICAN MORNING. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CAFFERTY: March Madness has arrived. The NCAA basketball tournament kicks off today.
John Feinstein is a sports columnist, commentator and best- selling author. His latest book is his first for kids. It's titled "Last Shot: A Final Four Mystery." John Feinstein joins us now to talk about a number of things. Let's start with the basketball tournament. It's bigger this year, but is bigger always better?
JOHN FEINSTEIN, AUTHOR, "LAST SHOT": I don't think it is, Jack. I mean, they've gone to 65 teams, which makes no sense, because they didn't want to give up one of the power teams at-large bids a few years ago, when a 31st conference came into existence. And the games take forever now with all of the TV timeouts.
But having said all of that, it's still a wonderful event. We're going to have upsets, little guys beating big guys this week. I think that's the best part of the tournament. And then eventually, the big guys will end up at the Final Four in St. Louis.
CAFFERTY: Who is the biggest of the big guys? Who is going to win it?
FEINSTEIN: Well, Illinois is the favorite.
CAFFERTY: You went to Duke. How can you say Illinois?
FEINSTEIN: Because Duke is not that good this year.
CAFFERTY: Oh, OK.
FEINSTEIN: I mean, it's amazing that they're 25-5. And Mike Krzyzewski (ph) has done an unbelievable job.
CAFFERTY: I was going to say, that's not bad.
FEINSTEIN: No, he's done a remarkable job. But this is not one of his best teams. They're still a No. 1 seed, but I think they'll lose to Syracuse in the round of 16. I think Illinois, because they get to play in Indianapolis, Chicago and St. Louis. It's practically a home tournament for them.
CAFFERTY: Well, that makes sense.
FEINSTEIN: Yes. It has a lot going for it. North Carolina is extremely talented. Louisville is a great, dark horse to watch as a No. 4 seed. They were under-seeded by the committee.
CAFFERTY: Who do you like in the Final Four? You say Illinois will win it all. But who are the others?
FEINSTEIN: I think Illinois is the favorite, Louisville, Syracuse and UConn. Connecticut is the defending champion, remember. They're the second seed in North Carolina's region.
CAFFERTY: Let's talk for a minute about your book, "Last Shot." It's the first fiction that you've written. Why now, why fiction?
FEINSTEIN: Well, because I have an 11-year-old son who is a big basketball fan.
CAFFERTY: There you go.
FEINSTEIN: And he wanted to read something that I had written. And I came up with an idea to have two 13-year-old kids win a writing contest, one that actually exists. And they get to go to the Final Four with press credentials, and they stumble into this plot to blackmail the star player from Minnesota State to throw the national championship game. And then they have to work with him to unravel the plot.
I've been to 25 Final Fours, so I figured that was a good setting to make it sound real.
CAFFERTY: Sure. Very timely.
FEINSTEIN: Yes, I hope it's timely.
CAFFERTY: You said you've got an 11-year-old boy. What do you make of the steroids, the violence, all of the stuff that's not good about the pro game?
FEINSTEIN: You know, it's not just pro game. I mean, we're talking steroids in high school kids. I wish it was just the pro game. I think that what's scary, as the father of an 11-year-old boy, is that the role models out there today, you know, who are your role models? Who do you look to? Who is real? We don't know who is real anymore.
One of the things I tried to do in the book was bring down some of the myths that exist around big-time college basketball, like the fact that they're student athletes, as the NCAA says, when 42 percent of them graduate.
CAFFERTY: Sure. John Feinstein. The book called "Last Shot." Nice to have you with us. Thanks.
FEINSTEIN: Thanks, Jack. Thanks for having me.
CAFFERTY: Soledad.
O'BRIEN: Jack, thanks.
Ahead, Congress takes on Major League Baseball's steroid problem. When the big leaguers talk, no doubt parents and coaches will listen. A look at the growing problem with steroids and teens ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
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Aired March 17, 2005 - 07:29 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back, everybody. It's just about half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING. Bill Hemmer has got the day off, but Rob Marciano has been kind enough to fill in.
Nice to see you. Thanks for joining us.
ROB MARCIANO, CNN ANCHOR: Happy to be here.
O'BRIEN: Thank you very much.
Let's show some you pictures we're just getting into CNN. This is obviously Scott Peterson being led away in handcuffs. He's being transferred to San Quentin prison. This is where he will now be on death row. Obviously, appeals will be filed. It should take a while before he is finally executed, if that does, indeed, happen. But those are the latest pictures of Scott Peterson out in California this morning.
Ahead on AMERICAN MORNING, congressional hearings on steroids in baseball. That's coming up in just a few hours. We're going to talk this morning, though, with one member of the committee about just what he wants to hear today.
MARCIANO: Also, Jeff Toobin, just a few minutes ago, saying he's stunned by the verdict in the Robert Blake trial. Next, four members of the jury join us live to explain why it was their only choice.
O'BRIEN: First, though, let's get right to the steroids showdown on Capitol Hill. Members of a House committee will grill baseball executives, past and present players and health professionals today over the use of steroids in the sport. The committee will also look at some of baseball steroid policies that they say contain disturbing loopholes.
Connecticut Republican Chris Shays, he is the committee's vice chairman, joins us from the Capitol this morning.
Nice to see you, Congressman. Thank you very much for being with us.
REP. CHRIS SHAYS, VICE CHAIRMAN (R), GOVT. REFORM COMMITTEE: It's nice to be with you. Thank you.
O'BRIEN: Some new information has come out about these loopholes. And I guess it's because politicians have kind of gotten around to reading the fine print in what Major League Baseball has been negotiating with the players. Here is what they've said. There are now fines can be replaced for actual suspensions. Strictly confidential will be the results of the testing. The policy can be suspended, in fact, if the government starts doing any kind of investigation. And four steroids were actually left off the list.
When this was discovered in the reading of the fine print, how did you feel? Do you feel like you were duped by Major League Baseball in some way?
SHAYS: Well, it's just a continuation of the arrogance of Major League Baseball. I mean, when we said we were going to have this hearing, I was modestly interested until I started to hear the response of Major League Baseball that said, how dare you.
You know, they're exempt from antitrust laws. They're not exempt from the laws. We're talking about players that are revered, worshipped, adored by our kids, respected by adults. And the bottom line, we're talking about drugs.
These folks said they had a policy to deal with the issue. And I had a problem with 10 days first time, 30 days the second, 60 the third, a year the fourth, and only then, the fifth time, were you out. And then we learn, well, that's just -- you know, it's even worse than that, as you just described.
O'BRIEN: So what's the conclusion, then? They're not serious at all about cleaning up steroids in baseball, and now Congress has to go to get involved?
SHAYS: Well, I mean, the bottom line is, thank goodness we are getting involved. In the end, we may put it back on their shoulders. But you may ultimately see a uniform policy about drugs in major league sports as a result of this. You know this wouldn't be the decision of our committee. We're an investigative committee. But I think you're going to see strong action on the part of Congress.
O'BRIEN: But why are you talking to the players and not the owners? I mean, if you're outraged by all of the loopholes and the inaction, why not haul the owners in front of Congress and not the players?
SHAYS: Well, I think we have the commissioner in. And we'll sure have some interesting questions for him. And so we'll see.
O'BRIEN: At this point, anybody been offered immunity?
SHAYS: I don't think so, and I hope we don't do that.
O'BRIEN: So then...
SHAYS: But let me just say this to you. We also don't want them to exercise their Fifth Amendment rights. In other words, we don't want to put them in a position they feel they have to. So, I'm not interested in knowing if each individual player took steroids. I would like them to voluntarily say what they've done. You know, they perhaps could do that in their opening statement. But I'm not interested in it, and I don't think most of the members are interested in getting somebody.
O'BRIEN: So, if they don't voluntarily mention that they've used steroids, you don't have an interest in knowing the answer to the big question: When you broke all of the records, were you on steroids? That seems like an important question to ask.
SHAYS: No. You know what? No, there are a lot of important questions to ask, and maybe that question will be asked at a later date. If we down go down that route, you know, we're in danger of the players exercising their Fifth Amendment right, which they have a right to do obviously. But then we can't ask them any other questions. You can't selectively use their Fifth Amendment rights.
We'd like to know their attitude. We'd like to know what impact they think drugs have. We'd like to know if other players, not specific names, but if they think this is widely used. A lot of questions.
O'BRIEN: Congressman Chris Shays is joining us this morning. Of course, we're going to be watching this hearing. It begins at 10:00 Eastern Time. And CNN is going to keep you up to date as the testimony progresses throughout the day.
It's time to check in with the other stories that are making headlines this morning with Carol Costello.
Good morning.
MARCIANO: Hi, Carol.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning. Good morning to you both. Good morning, everyone.
"Now in the News."
The first phase of serious withdrawal from Lebanon is apparently over. A senior Lebanese army officer says Syria's army and intelligence officers have redeployed closer to their country's border. Syria's president has promised to bring all of his country's troops home in the second phase. No word on exactly when that will begin, though.
In Miami a grand jury has indicted a caregiver for the murder of a little girl more than four years ago. Geralyn Graham is in prison for an unrelated conviction. That's where she apparently confessed to the killing of Rilya Wilson (ph), according to a state attorney. Authorities suspect she beat and suffocated the little girl in December of 2000, almost two years before the child was officially cited as missing. Graham now denies those claims.
Martha Stewart is fighting to clear her name. The homemaking diva will head back to court today. Lawyers are scheduled to appeal her criminal conviction before a three-judge panel in New York. The court can either uphold her guilty verdict or order a new trial. An opinion is not expected for several months. And March Madness is kicking off today. Sixteen games are scheduled in the NCAA basketball tournament for this afternoon and tonight. Among them, the nation's top-ranked team, Illinois, is taking on Fairleigh Dickinson in Indianapolis. If you still haven't filled out your bracket, time is running out. The first tip-off is at 12:20 Eastern. And by the way, Illinois is favored by, what, 26.5 points?
MARCIANO: Well, they lost a whole one game, so they are a tough team to beat this year.
COSTELLO: To Ohio State, I think.
MARCIANO: Hey, Ohio State.
COSTELLO: Yes. It's good, isn't it?
MARCIANO: Congrats.
O'BRIEN: All right, Carol, thanks.
Well, Robert Blake is a free man this morning. A jury found him not guilty in the 2001 murder of his wife.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We, the jury in the above-entitled action, find the defendant, Robert Blake, not guilty of the crime of first- degree murder of Bonny Lee Bakely.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: The verdict on Wednesday brought Blake to tears. Four members of that jury are with us this morning from Valencia in California. Thomas Nicholson, the jury foreman, along with the jurors Cecilia Moldonado, Lorie Moore and Chuck Safco.
It's nice to see you all. Thank you very much for talking with us.
Let's start with the jury foreman, Mr. Nicholson. You deliberated for quite a long time. Give me a sense of what it was like in the jury room. Was there much argument?
THOMAS NICHOLSON, JURY FOREMAN: Argument isn't the right word. A lot of discussion. As you've got to recall, the jury panel consisted of an age group ranging from mid-20s to late-70s. So, the amount of discussion that was made was very, very full. Each and every person had a full discussion about every issue that was in the testimony, the evidence, everything. Argument? No, I don't think it was really argument.
O'BRIEN: So, Cecilia, when Thomas says there was lots of discussion but not necessarily argument, was it just discussion because of clarification? Everyone was sort of in agreement that you didn't think that he was guilty? CECILIA MOLDONADO, JUROR: Everyone was not in agreement right away. So, what we did was, we had to go through all of the facts. And, yes, we did have our discussions. It was a complete discussion. Everyone put in their opinions. We all answered any questions. We dissected the evidence. We dissected the testimony, went through everything, and came back with the fair decision.
O'BRIEN: Lori, the stuntmen said that Robert Blake hired them to kill his wife. Why did you guys not believe their testimony?
LORIE MOORE, JUROR: Because in the preliminary hearing, he lied and said that he -- oh, I lost my train of thought. He lied and said that he did.
O'BRIEN: That there was a conflict between what he said in the preliminary hearing...
MOORE: Right, right.
O'BRIEN: ... and what he then later said. And so, was it essentially that they just seemed like liars, the stuntmen who claimed that they had been hired by Robert Blake? They just didn't seem like they were honest people to you? Was that the issue?
MOORE: That's the issue. That's what I was trying to say. Sorry.
O'BRIEN: It's early in the morning, I hear you, Lorie. Don't worry about it.
MOORE: Very early. It is.
O'BRIEN: Let's go to Chuck. What did you think was the prosecution's weakest part of the case? I mean, did you think that they just put on a bad case? Or did you think that Robert Blake was an innocent guy?
CHUCK SAFCO, JUROR: I felt Robert Blake was an innocent guy. I think the prosecution did the best job that they could do with what they had. They didn't really have a lot to go on. I mean, that's one reason why we had a circumstantial case.
O'BRIEN: At the same time, Cecilia, you were deadlocked on solicitation of one of the stuntmen. Explain that for me and how it came to be deadlocked and what you discussed about that in the jury room.
MOLDONADO: Well, the juror that was -- the final juror that was deadlocked explained the reasoning. And so we went back and re- reviewed all of the evidence that we needed to regarding Hamilton. And once that -- we did not pressure. Nobody ever pressured anyone. It was a respected opinion. So if that's the decision the juror made, we respected it, and that's how we came back hung. But there were just flaws in the testimony, and the juror had opinions, and we respected them. O'BRIEN: Cecilia, I've got a final question for you, and actually any of you guys can jump in and answer this. Bonny Lee Bakley was the victim, terrible circumstances of her death. But at the end of the day, she had a terrible reputation. Person after person testified about her background, which was unseemly in many, many ways. How much of a role did that play in how you thought about this case?
MOORE: It didn't play much of a role in my opinion.
MOLDONADO: She was a human being.
MOORE: Yes.
NICHOLSON: Yes, the manner in how she died was brutal, regardless of who and what she was previous to her death. It didn't, in my mind, play that big of a role. We were discussing a brutal murder. Irrespective of the fact that it was Robert Blake or Bonny Lee Bakley or whoever, it was a murder and it was brutally done. And she didn't deserve that.
O'BRIEN: The jurors in the Robert Blake murder trial. I thank you all for joining us. We certainly appreciate it. I know you've been busy over many days. You haven't had a chance to spend a lot of time with your families. And we appreciate you getting up very early to talk to us as well. Thank you.
MOLDONADO: You're welcome.
MOORE: Thank you.
NICHOLSON: Thank you.
SAFCO: Thank you.
O'BRIEN: Rob.
MARCIANO: Soledad, it's time now for a weather check.
(WEATHER REPORT)
O'BRIEN: Well, one of the biggest media companies in the country could be headed for a big breakup. Andy is "Minding Your Business" just ahead.
MARCIANO: Also, just a few hours until March Madness hits a fever pitch. A man who knows the game tells us who has got the inside track to the Final Four. We'll be right back. More of AMERICAN MORNING is still to come.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MARCIANO: It's time now to check in with Jack Cafferty for the "Question of the Day." What do you have, Jack?
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Thank you, Rob. It was probably a matter of time until Congress got around to this, but with crude oil prices at record highs, the Senate did vote yesterday to open Alaska's 19-million acre National Wildlife Refuge to energy exploration. Supporters think that drilling in ANWR (ph) is a matter of national security, critical in reducing U.S. dependence on foreign oil. Opponents argue that drilling will damage the ecologically-fragile coastal plain, which is America's largest wildlife sanctuary.
So the question is: Do you think Congress ought to allow oil drilling in Alaska's National Wildlife Refuge?
Doug in New Jersey writes: "Alaska's ANWR is a piece of America the beautiful that should not be sacrificed to the energy industry for a paltry one-year supply of oil. To do so in the name of national security is absurd."
Meg in Virginia writes: "Ninety-nine percent of us will never set foot in Alaska's National Wildlife Reserve, 99 percent of us have to buy gas. Drill now."
Jacqueline in Ohio writes: "No, oil is a quantifiable resource. America will eventually need to find alternative sources of energy anyway. It would be almost criminal to destroy the homes of many innocent animals, not to mention upsetting the local eco-system there for the sake of money."
James in Illinois: "We have a president whose family has gotten rich from oil, a vice president who is also a rich man, thanks to oil. Is it any wonder why oil is at an all-time high? The Republicans would drill for oil on the White House lawn."
And Wistar...
ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: If there was oil there, why not? Maybe they should.
CAFFERTY: My people have come back. My folks are home.
And Wistar in Georgia writes: "Sure. With all of the oil we get here, we can delay looking for alternative fuel solutions for another week or two."
MARCIANO: There are so many sides to this issue. I mean, you can argue that, you know, we're knocking down trees all over the place just to build houses and roads.
CAFFERTY: Yes.
MARCIANO: And, you know, you're going to argue that we need the oil as well.
CAFFERTY: I'm not going to argue. I'm tired.
MARCIANO: Oh, Cafferty...
O'BRIEN: You're going just to throw it out there today.
CAFFERTY: Yes, yes.
MARCIANO: Cafferty is an Irish name, isn't it? How come he's not wearing green?
CAFFERTY: Of course it's an Irish name.
O'BRIEN: Well, then let me be the first to wish you a happy St. Patrick's Day.
MARCIANO: Happy St. Patrick's Day.
CAFFERTY: I was wondering how long it would be before we got around to this. And then the next thing is, how come you're not wearing any green? Are you wearing any green? And everybody is Irish today, and the whole thing is tedious, don't you think?
O'BRIEN: OK, Jack, I didn't ask any of that. And I don't care why you're not wearing green. I am just saying, happy St. Patrick's Day, Jack. I hope you have a great day.
Moving on to business, shall we? The bidding war over a popular toy store is over. So who is the next Toys R Us kid? Andy Serwer is "Minding Your Business."
Happy St. Patrick's Day.
SERWER: Thank you very much, Soledad. And likewise to you.
O'BRIEN: Thank you.
SERWER: Let's...
CAFFERTY: Oh, please!
SERWER: That was very civilized, wasn't it? It's not a big deal one way or the other.
OK, let's talk about the stock market yesterday. Not a good one for investors. You can see here, all over the place, red, red, red. Record price of oil, of course. The trade deficit hitting a record. General Motors down 14 percent after talking about a loss for the quarter. Futures are down again this morning.
You know, five years ago, Viacom bought CBS for $40 billion, promising synergies out the wazoo. We're going to put all of these businesses together.
CAFFERTY: Promising what?
SERWER: Yes, a lot of synergies.
CAFFERTY: Where?
SERWER: A lot of synergies. CAFFERTY: But where?
SERWER: I'm not going to...
MARCIANO: Toobin used that term as well.
SERWER: Yes, exactly.
MARCIANO: It's popular today.
SERWER: Really, that's the word of the day.
CAFFERTY: Synergies, out the wazoo (ph).
SERWER: Yes, all kinds of synergies.
CAFFERTY: Yes.
SERWER: Can I get to this, Jack, OK?
CAFFERTY: Happy St. Patrick's Day.
SERWER: Thank you.
MARCIANO: Finally.
SERWER: Civilized.
OK. Anyway, the stock has not fulfilled any of the promises that Sumner Redstone, the 81-year-old billionaire, thought that would happen after this deal. And so, yesterday he suggested they're going to break the company up. Les Moonves, who runs CBS, would be controlling that part of the company, along with Infinity. Tom Freston, the MTV chief, would be running MTV and Nickelodeon, VH-1 and those businesses. And the stock responded. It went up a lot.
Of course, Time Warner tried to do a deal to put together all sorts of properties as well, our parent company. And that hasn't gone as well either. So we'll be watching that stock today.
O'BRIEN: All right.
CAFFERTY: It didn't go well? Our stock used to be $95. What is it now, 17?
SERWER: I think that's a fair assessment.
CAFFERTY: I think that's an indication that it didn't go well, right?
SERWER: Yes, right through the wazoo (ph) situation here.
CAFFERTY: Yes, we had losses out the wazoo (ph), yes.
SERWER: Yes. What does that word actually mean?
CAFFERTY: Huh?
SERWER: Never mind.
CAFFERTY: You know what it means. That's why you used it.
SERWER: Yes indeed.
O'BRIEN: Let's not, shall we?
SERWER: Let's not.
O'BRIEN: All right, moving ahead. March Madness in the road to the Final Four. Jack this morning talks to a basketball insider, up next on AMERICAN MORNING. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CAFFERTY: March Madness has arrived. The NCAA basketball tournament kicks off today.
John Feinstein is a sports columnist, commentator and best- selling author. His latest book is his first for kids. It's titled "Last Shot: A Final Four Mystery." John Feinstein joins us now to talk about a number of things. Let's start with the basketball tournament. It's bigger this year, but is bigger always better?
JOHN FEINSTEIN, AUTHOR, "LAST SHOT": I don't think it is, Jack. I mean, they've gone to 65 teams, which makes no sense, because they didn't want to give up one of the power teams at-large bids a few years ago, when a 31st conference came into existence. And the games take forever now with all of the TV timeouts.
But having said all of that, it's still a wonderful event. We're going to have upsets, little guys beating big guys this week. I think that's the best part of the tournament. And then eventually, the big guys will end up at the Final Four in St. Louis.
CAFFERTY: Who is the biggest of the big guys? Who is going to win it?
FEINSTEIN: Well, Illinois is the favorite.
CAFFERTY: You went to Duke. How can you say Illinois?
FEINSTEIN: Because Duke is not that good this year.
CAFFERTY: Oh, OK.
FEINSTEIN: I mean, it's amazing that they're 25-5. And Mike Krzyzewski (ph) has done an unbelievable job.
CAFFERTY: I was going to say, that's not bad.
FEINSTEIN: No, he's done a remarkable job. But this is not one of his best teams. They're still a No. 1 seed, but I think they'll lose to Syracuse in the round of 16. I think Illinois, because they get to play in Indianapolis, Chicago and St. Louis. It's practically a home tournament for them.
CAFFERTY: Well, that makes sense.
FEINSTEIN: Yes. It has a lot going for it. North Carolina is extremely talented. Louisville is a great, dark horse to watch as a No. 4 seed. They were under-seeded by the committee.
CAFFERTY: Who do you like in the Final Four? You say Illinois will win it all. But who are the others?
FEINSTEIN: I think Illinois is the favorite, Louisville, Syracuse and UConn. Connecticut is the defending champion, remember. They're the second seed in North Carolina's region.
CAFFERTY: Let's talk for a minute about your book, "Last Shot." It's the first fiction that you've written. Why now, why fiction?
FEINSTEIN: Well, because I have an 11-year-old son who is a big basketball fan.
CAFFERTY: There you go.
FEINSTEIN: And he wanted to read something that I had written. And I came up with an idea to have two 13-year-old kids win a writing contest, one that actually exists. And they get to go to the Final Four with press credentials, and they stumble into this plot to blackmail the star player from Minnesota State to throw the national championship game. And then they have to work with him to unravel the plot.
I've been to 25 Final Fours, so I figured that was a good setting to make it sound real.
CAFFERTY: Sure. Very timely.
FEINSTEIN: Yes, I hope it's timely.
CAFFERTY: You said you've got an 11-year-old boy. What do you make of the steroids, the violence, all of the stuff that's not good about the pro game?
FEINSTEIN: You know, it's not just pro game. I mean, we're talking steroids in high school kids. I wish it was just the pro game. I think that what's scary, as the father of an 11-year-old boy, is that the role models out there today, you know, who are your role models? Who do you look to? Who is real? We don't know who is real anymore.
One of the things I tried to do in the book was bring down some of the myths that exist around big-time college basketball, like the fact that they're student athletes, as the NCAA says, when 42 percent of them graduate.
CAFFERTY: Sure. John Feinstein. The book called "Last Shot." Nice to have you with us. Thanks.
FEINSTEIN: Thanks, Jack. Thanks for having me.
CAFFERTY: Soledad.
O'BRIEN: Jack, thanks.
Ahead, Congress takes on Major League Baseball's steroid problem. When the big leaguers talk, no doubt parents and coaches will listen. A look at the growing problem with steroids and teens ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
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