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Supreme Court Rejects Request to Reinsert Schiavo's Feeding Tube; Kyrgyzstan Protesters Storm Government Compound
Aired March 24, 2005 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DARYN KAGAN, CNN ANCHOR: Let's take a look at what's happening now in the news.
Time and options may be running out for Terri Schiavo. Parents of the brain-damaged are awaiting word from two courts that could decide whether to restore her feeding tube. One seeks the intervention of the U.S. Supreme Court. The other asks a Florida court to allow a state agency to take custody of Terri Schiavo. That Florida ruling is expected within the next two hours.
Legendary chess champ Bobby Fischer is free from a detention center in Japan. He's now heading to a new home in Iceland. Lawmakers there have granted him citizenship. Fischer was detained in Japan on a U.S. warrant. His native U.S. says that he remains wanted for playing a 1992 chess match in the former Yugoslavia. That was apparently in violation of sanctions.
Listen and take a look at these pictures. We have a developing and dramatic story to report this hour. It is from the former Soviet Republic of Kyrgyzstan. The president there has reportedly fled the country, after thousands of protesters stormed and seized the main government building earlier this morning. Those demonstrators had demanded the president's resignation amid on allegations of election fraud.
The State Department has issued a warning for Americans planning to travel to the Philippines. The statement cites terror threats and suspected plans to launch multiple attacks throughout the Philippines. The warning urges Americans to travel there only if those plans are essential.
Good morning to you on this Thursday morning. I'm Daryn Kagan. Rick Sanchez is off today.
The legal options narrow to keep Terri Schiavo alive. Her parents can now look to just two courts in their desperate attempt to have her feeding tube reinserted.
Our correspondents Joe Johns and Ed Henry are following the latest legal developments in Washington and Tallahassee. Our Bob Franken is outside Schiavo's hospice.
Let's start with you, Joe, at the U.S. Supreme Court.
JOE JOHNS, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Daryn, it has been 11 hours now since that appeal was filed here at the Supreme Court. Michael Schiavo, the husband, has filed a response to the parents' appeal. In it, in part, he says Terri Schiavo should be allowed to die in peace and dignity according to her wishes. He also says there'd be no valid justification for reinserting the feeding tube and remanding this case back to the 11-Circuit in Atlanta, which is what the parents want.
He also attacks the legislation that was passed over the weekend by the Congress and signed by the president. In part he says, and we have a graphic. "A statute that imposes burdens on one person that do not apply to anyone else is suspect because such enactments demonstrate that Congress was not seeking to advance any compelling interest. But was instead seeking merely to interfere with the rights of that person because Congress did not agree with the exercise of her rights."
Of course, that filing that occurred around 11:00 Eastern Time last night from the parents once again asked for the feeding tube to be reinserted and for this case to be remanded back to the circuit. Now in that, they say, of course, Terri Schiavo is dying of starvation and dehydration. If the tube is not reinserted by order of the court, Terri will die before this court is able to consider the merits of the petition.
Waiting, of course, now here at the court for some word. We know it went in to Justice Anthony Kennedy. He has the opportunity to enter an injunction on his own or bump it up to the full court. Of course, we would not get word if he asked the full court to consider it. But we also knew that it was likely he might do that. There have been several other times the Schiavo matter has come before the Supreme Court. Each time before, they've refused to hear it -- Daryn.
KAGAN: And any indication from the court on how long it will take to hear anything?
JOHNS: Not at all. We simply don't have any idea. This is something that goes on behind closed doors. You get word of the pleadings, word of the court filing. And you don't get much more than that until some type of a decision is rendered.
KAGAN: All right. Joe Johns at the Supreme Court. Thank you for that.
A family spokesman for the Schindler family -- yes, for the Schindler family speaking right now in Pinellas Park. Let's listen in.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They've had to watch their daughter go through this. I've been in Florida for so long. I've grieved for the children that have been abducted and murdered here. But that family and loved ones did not have to watch that murder taking place.
Mary and Bob Schindler have to stand by and watch the abuser continue to abuse and murder their daughter. This is America. Please someone, help Terri and help this family.
REV. PATRICK MAHONEY, DIR., CHRISTIAN DEFENSE COALITION: Again, my name is Reverend Patrick Mahoney, director of the Christian Defense Coalition. Today is Holy Thursday. And let it be known Terri Schiavo is suffering a barbaric, brutal, suffering horrific death here by dehydration and starvation. If Terri does go home to be with the Lord, this is not a death with dignity. If Terri were an animal, she would not have to endure this.
Now, let's give an update on where we are. As you know, it is now before the United States Supreme Court. We are diligently praying for Justice Kennedy. We hope he considers the extraordinary act of Congress we saw over the weekend and grants review to this case. And our point all along is this. If Terri expires, then there's no opportunity to look at any constitutional violations. Just let a stay be in for this denovo review so we can examine some of these things.
No. 2, the Florida Senate, the Republican-led Florida Senate, has allowed Terri Schiavo to endure this barbaric suffering. They had an opportunity yesterday to intervene to protect her. And they chose not to do that. For President Lee, for the Republican majority in the Florida Senate, the death that Terri is suffering here, the slow agonizing death must be laid at your doorstep.
Now to Governor Bush. We are thankful for the leadership he has shown in the past. But to try to put in context what happened or not, the attorneys say we'll do our best. Governor Bush had a news conference in which he indicated that he could, and DCF could use executive authority to intervene on Terri's behalf. In the interim, Judge Greer issued an order stating that the feeding tube could not be reinserted.
In the midst of that, it appears the governor has backed off and is now struggling with the fact of dealing with a court order. We say to Governor Bush, a citizen of your state is being brutally murdered. You need to intervene on her behalf. You need to intervene on her behalf Governor Bush. Right now, you could have the Florida Department of Law Enforcement come in and take Terri.
We are pleading with you, Governor Bush. We respect you. You know what's happening here. Dr. Martin Luther King many years ago addressed unjust law. Are we -- laws. Are we going to let one judge here...
KAGAN: We've been listening in to both spokespeople and protesters there outside the hospice in Pinellas Park, Florida where Terri Schiavo is right now, expressing some very strong views. Views that are controversial. A lot of people in this country are agreeing with them that this would be a death without dignity. Also allegations that Michael Schiavo has abused his wife.
We need to point out in fairness that those allegations have been presented in court a number of times and not accepted by the courts of Florida. Also there are those who believe that Michael Schiavo is trying to get his wife death with dignity and carrying out her wishes. Strong divided opinions across this country.
Let's bring in our Ed Henry. He's in Tallahassee. That is where a lot -- some people believe could still take place to save Terri Schiavo -- Ed.
ED HENRY, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Daryn. That's right. You just heard the pressure there being put on Governor Jeb Bush to do something, do anything to try to save Terri Schiavo's life. I was just at the governor's office right across the street. I can tell you it's quite a scene there. The phones are ringing off the hook. There are a couple dozen activists outside holding up signs saying, "Do something to save Terri's life."
The problem for the governor right now is that while he wants to do that, time and options are running out very rapidly. Yesterday, the governor filed a motion trying to get, as you heard in that presser, the Department of Children and Families for the state of Florida to come in and take custody of Terri Schiavo. That is going to be reviewed now because the governor is saying that there is new medical evidence suggesting she's not in a permanent vegetative state.
That is being reviewed right now by Judge George Greer, a circuit judge here in Florida. He says he will have a ruling by noon today Eastern Standard Time. But last night in the meantime, he put out an emergency order saying that, in fact, the state could not take custody of Terri Schiavo.
Now, you also have to know that Judge Greer is a person who initially last Friday ordered that the feeding tube to be removed. So the family is not expecting a positive decision from him. Last night, Terri Schiavo's father was on CNN telling Aaron Brown that he believes that Judge Greer is on a, quote, "crusade to kill Terri."
That's why the governor, in addition to pursuing this at the judicial level, also yesterday urged the state Senate to bring up legislation that if it had passed, would have gotten that feeding tube reinserted. There was a three-hour, very emotional debate in the state Senate right behind me. In fact, Terri Schiavo's brother Bobby Schindler was sitting in the Senate gallery watching it. But that legislation failed 21 to 18.
So the bottom line here is that the state Senate leaders are saying they're not going to bring this back again. The legislative avenues have been exhausted. The governor is trying now to exhaust all the judicial avenues here within the state of Florida. And then, of course, the family, the parents have gone to the U.S. Supreme Court as you heard earlier -- Daryn.
KAGAN: Ed, I want to ask you about the plea that we're just hearing from the last protester, Reverend Mahoney, where he was calling on Governor Bush to step in and take custody. Saying he believes that the governor does have that power, but in fact, by state law does he?
HENRY: That's right. And that's why the governor wanted instead to go to Judge Greer and file this motion yesterday. This petition. So that he would not just go in directly and take Terri Schiavo. But in fact, seek the judge's permission to take custody citing this new medical evidence, claiming that she is not in a permanent vegetative state. But also mentioning allegations that perhaps she has been neglected and abused that as you mention are not proven. But those allegations were cited in this order -- in this motion to try to get the state to take custody.
There also is going to be a press conference in about an hour and a half here in Tallahassee, where some conservative activists are going to urge the governor to issue a pardon for Terri Schiavo, believing that that could also save her life. So basically, every measure no matter how desperate it is being considered right now -- Daryn.
KAGAN: Well, when you say a pardon, there's been no crime committed by Terri Schiavo. Is that for people who are trying to compare Terri Schiavo's situation to what a death row inmate would get in terms of process of the law?
KAGAN: This is Alan Keys, the conservative activist, former presidential candidate, also Larry Klayman, a former Republican Senate candidate here in Florida, conservative activist. They want the governor to issue that pardon. You're absolutely right. There's been no crime suggested here. So a lot of people are wondering how in the world could the governor issue a pardon.
I think the point is that a lot of people are urging desperate measures, anything. They want the governor to use every single power he has at his disposal, even if it doesn't necessarily fit this case. You have a lot of activists calling his off, hammering the switchboard, saying do something. Do anything -- Daryn.
KAGAN: Ed Henry live from Tallahassee, Florida. Thank you.
Let's go back to Pinellas Park where Terri Schiavo is right now and to the protest movement. Our Bob Franken has been there covering that part of the story.
Good morning.
BOB FRANKEN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning. And here's the behind the scenes story on why it is that there was no move by Governor Bush to come in yesterday. Send his people in and have Terri Schiavo put under state custody. Governor Bush had received, we're told by a variety of sources, had received legal advice that the law allowed him without authorization from the courts to use this Department of Children and Families, DCF as it's called, to make a decision to in effect, take custody, which would have removed the guardianship -- practically removed the guardianship from Michael Schiavo.
But before he did that, he went to court on motions of Schiavo's lawyer. The judge issued an assertive order. Do not do that. Which left Governor Bush with the choice of doing it in spite of the court order, and leaving himself open to criticisms that he does not live under the rule of law, or waiting.
They're going back into court now to argue the various issues that are involved. They're supposed to be at a hearing before Judge George Greer in about 15 minutes. The judge has promised that he'll have an ultimate decision on whether DCF can, in fact, take custody.
This is the same judge, by the way, that ordered the feeding tube disconnected. The judge has been vilified by representatives of the family who believe that he, in fact, has not been fair to them. The family of the blood relative, he's ruled in favor of the husband, Michael Schiavo who has for years tried to get the tube disconnected.
The agents of DCF, we're told, were nearby; they had been in contact with police. If they received authority, they were going to come in. But there was never a question anybody said that the governor was going to try to defy the court order -- Daryn.
KAGAN: Bob Franken, live from Pinellas Park. Thank you for that.
Other news today, several children are suffering a life threatening kidney infection this morning. And health officials wonder if the problem might be with some petting zoos. It's a story every parent will want to see.
Plus he admitted his problems more than 10 years ago. We have his confessions on tape. Now there's new questions arising why John Couey was allowed out on the streets.
First though, chaos in the capital of Kyrgyzstan. We'll take you there when CNN LIVE TODAY returns.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KAGAN: These quick moving pictures coming to us from a revolt in Kyrgyzstan. Thousands of protesters have stormed and seized the presidential compound in the former Soviet republic. There are unconfirmed reports that the embattled president has fled the country and possibly even resigned.
Demonstrators have demanded the president's resignation amid allegations of elections fraud. That uprising is similar to pro Western opposition that toppled the Moscow-backed government in Ukraine last year.
Kyrgyzstan, to put it in perspective on the map for you, shares its border with three other Soviet republics, as well as China. It is smaller in size than South Dakota. Kyrgyzstan has a population of more than 5 million. The majority are Russian speaking and Muslim. More than 1,100 U.S. soldiers are stationed at an air base in Kyrgyzstan. That is the largest American military presence in central Asia outside of Afghanistan.
Our Ryan Chilcote is following the developments. He filed this report just a short time ago.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RYAN CHILCOTE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (on camera): An OSCE official on the ground in Bishkek is telling CNN that the OSCE would like to see a provisional government of national unity set up in that country, to fill the power vacuum that has clearly been created in Bishkek.
The envoy telling us that officials from the OSCE will be meeting with members of the opposition. That they would like to meet with the president, but that they understand that that will not be possible now. In fact, they even had a meeting set up with him for earlier in the day that the president was unable to attend.
Now, the opposition is saying that they will be making some very important declarations over the next couple of day. The first of which is that they are going to convene the parliament on Friday. Now, they're going to convene the old parliament. Meaning the parliament that was in power before this most recent parliamentary election in Kyrgyzstan, which they contend, or they complain was actually rigged by the government.
They do not recognize the new parliament. So they are calling the old parliament. And they'll meet on Friday in Kyrgyzstan to work some kind of political solution to the crisis in that country.
And lastly, Felix Kulov, a very key opposition leader; a man that many analysts say could actually become a leader who could unite the opposition, was released today from prison by the opposition. He was jailed under President Akayev. He was a staunch critic of President Akayev. Actually was once even the President Akayev's vice president before he left the company.
He actually has appeared on television. He called for national unity. He called for the president to resign. And he also called for order on the streets. He says that Kyrgyzstan has to get beyond this crisis.
Ryan Chilcote, CNN, Moscow.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KAGAN: Parents, the story coming up for you in a little bit that you will want to pay attention to. Children love to visit them. But could some petting zoos be the cause of a serious illness among some Florida children? We're going to have details on that story straight ahead.
Plus, it's a day of honor and reward for the woman credited with helping capture the Atlanta shooting spree suspect.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KAGAN: Buyer beware; it is the ultimate consumer warning. So homebuyers face the purchase of a lifetime. Rely on home inspectors. But that expertise can save any homeowner big bucks regardless of plans.
Our personal finance editor Gerri Willis explains now in our "Top Five Tips."
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GERRI WILLIS, CNN-FN PERSONAL FINANCE EDITOR (on camera): Whether you're buying, selling or staying put, a home inspection can help you identify issues in your home that would have otherwise remained ignored. So when you're ready to give your home a checkup, here is an idea of what to look for.
First, a major defect most likely this will be a structural failure. In older homes, it is often the roof that has irregularities, like ice damming or mold. Also, if the home has an addition built on, sections of the roof may be maintained differently. Which could be problematic. Make sure to check for cracks in the foundation, now that could mean a serious structural problem.
Check for proper insulation and ventilation. Inadequate ventilation in an attic can result in deterioration of the roof. Eventually, you'll have to remove and replace roofing shingles. Also check for foggy windows and doors. If they're not insulated properly you could be letting cold air in and adding to your home heating costs.
One thing every homeowner should be careful of is deferred maintenance. Letting small problems, like a leaky faucet linger could end up costing you big bucks to fix. Make sure the plumbing and electrical works, as well as structural addition and renovations are professionally done. Correcting defects of an inexperienced homeowner can be costly and problematic.
If you're trying to size up a home quickly, there are certain clues you should look for. I caught up with certified home inspector Joe Farcetta to find out some tricks of the trade.
So you say the important thing to look for, as just an average homebuyer walking through a house is inconsistency. What do you mean?
JOE FARCETTA, CERTIFIED HOME INSPECTOR: OK. Every house tells a story. So you are trying to figure that story out in the shortest amount of time. You don't have a lot of time available in the house. So you look for things. For instance, if the stove hasn't been cleaned, or doesn't look like it's been cleaned in 10 years, but the house is...
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KAGAN: We're going to cut out of that Gerri Willis report. We have breaking news out of the Supreme Court. We're getting word from our reporters and producers there. The U.S. Supreme Court has denied a request by the Schindler family, Terri Schiavo's parents, to take that case under review and order the reinsertion of the feeding tube back into Terri Schiavo in Florida.
We have our Joe Johns ready to go at the Supreme Court. All right. We're working on getting Joe Johns up.
But once again, the news of the day, what was considered perhaps the last hope for the Schindler family to have the feeding tube reinserted into Terri Schiavo has been denied. The Supreme Court saying they won't take the case under consideration. This would be the sixth time in this long history of this case that the Schindler family has gone, or somebody else has gone to the Supreme Court, to ask them to take it under consideration.
Five times they've denied the family. And this is the sixth time they're not going to take it. It was Justice Kennedy who had the option of considering to put the order to reinsert the feeding tube or to take it under advisement with the full court.
Our Joe Johns is standing by at the U.S. Supreme Court. Let's get more from you -- Joe.
JOHNS: Daryn this -- excuse me, I'm out of breath. This application has been denied. Just a moment ago, the court issued this one sentence statement. "The application for stay of enforcement of judgment in the filing and disposition of a petition for writ is denied." That's all they say.
So it looks like the appeal here at the Supreme Court now moves away from Washington, D.C., at least for now. There has been some talk that there might be a possibility of going back to the 11-Circuit in Atlanta. But it's been denied by the court. No other comment. And I guess the case moves on from here.
Back to you.
KAGAN: All right. Joe, I'm going to let you take a deep breath there.
JOHNS: Thank you.
KAGAN: But don't go anywhere.
JOHNS: OK.
KAGAN: Just take a deep breath as we do this.
To review: once again, this had been denied by the 11-Circuit Court of Appeals here in Atlanta. The Schindler family had kicked it back up, had appealed and pled to the U.S. Supreme Court with the latest.
We're going to go back to Joe Johns in just a minute. First though, let's go to Pinellas Park to the place where Terri Schiavo is in a hospice. A number of protesters standing by clearly will not be pleased by this news -- Bob.
FRANKEN: No, they will not be. But there is a view here in this part of just about everybody involved including the family, that the prospects at the federal level of the Supreme Court were very, very low. Nobody is going be surprised by this. They, of course, had had their hopes raised to the highest levels in a long time over the weekend, when Congress took the extraordinary action of putting this measure back into the federal court system. But then the judicial reality set in. And now you have three levels of court, the top level included, which have said that as a federal issue is concerned, there is no reason for the courts to get involved. So that takes care of that.
Now there is however, a new visit to the state court. Judge George Greer, who is the judge who ordered the tube disconnected, is holding another hearing to decide on the merits of the claim by Governor Bush that he has the authority to send his Department of Children and Families in and take custody of Terri Schiavo, in effect, wresting guardianship from her husband Michael Schiavo. A judge has promised a ruling on that at noon. But the family has seen just about every last-minute hope that it had dwindling away -- Daryn.
KAGAN: And as you said, we expect that announcement, that decision from that circuit judge in Florida within the next hour and a half. Bob Franken, thank you. We'll get back to you in a moment.
I want to welcome our viewers joining us from around the world on CNN international. Once again, the news breaking right now out of the U.S. Supreme Court, the high court of the land, denying the appeal by Terri Schiavo's parents, the Schindlers, to take that case under advisement and to order the reinsertion of Terri Schiavo's feeding tube.
Our Joe Johns standing by at the Supreme Court -- Joe.
JOE JOHNS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Daryn, yes, that is correct.
And thank you for giving me a chance to get my breath. It's a long run around this building to get to the cameras.
In fact, yes, the application has been denied. It was sent, of course, over to Justice Anthony Kennedy. His name, in fact, is on this single sheet of paper. It says it was presented to him and was referred to the court. So the full court got a chance to take a look at it.
As you know, we had not just the appeal, but also a response from Michael Schiavo. We had both the House of Representatives and the Senate of the United States both weighing in, because, of course, they passed the legislation over the weekend.
Bottom line, though, is that they did didn't bite. This is now the fifth time that they've said no to the Schiavo case. I just finished counting that up. There have been a lot of different numbers about how many times it's come to the supreme court. It looks like five times since around 2001.
And she just has to seek other avenues, the mother and father in this case do. And has been already noted, the avenues are certainly running out.
KAGAN: A question for you, Joe. There was an option for Justice Kennedy in this case to make this decision by himself or to refer it to the full court. Did this come out of his office, and did it only go as far as Justice Kennedy?
JOHNS: No, it seems quite clear from this, it says it was accepted by him and referred to the court. So apparently the entire court had an opportunity to look at these documents that had been filed.
We did know that perhaps most, if not all, of the members of the court had an opportunity today to come to a weekly conference of the justices, and that, we think, should have occurred fairly early, 9:00, 10:00, something like that. That perhaps may have been at one point where minds started coming together.
It was a bit surprising as to how long it took. I mean, this is 11 1/2 hours basically since this thing was filed late last night here at the Supreme Court. And it was clear that somebody took a lot of time in deciding whether to go ahead and accept this case or just to deny it.
KAGAN: When you came out to us for the first time, Joe, you read the statement. It's a very short statement, I think, just maybe two or three lines, basically saying that the high court is not going to look at it. No explanation given this time. But as you said, this is the fifth time the Supreme Court has turned down this case. What has been some of the reasoning earlier of why they decided not to look at it.
JOHNS: Well, that's the trick on these things, you really don't get a full sentence, because a lot of times, this is what you get. You get this one sentence. I'll read it to you again now that I'm not out of breath -- "The application for enforcement of stay of judgment pending the filing and disposition of a petition for writ of sersori (ph) presented to Justice Kennedy, and by him presented to the court is denied." So you know, they don't say a lot about it, quite frankly.
You know, the last time they got a request to look at this was the House Government Reform Committee of the House of Representatives, and they were basically going to them saying, look, we have these subpoenas, we're basically trying to use these subpoenas to get the tube reinserted and prolong her life, and we're using as a justification an inquiry by the Congress, but they didn't buy that either, perhaps. You just don't get a big long written statement about why they decided not to take the case.
KAGAN: All right Joe Johns, live at the supreme court. We will be back to you.
It would seem for those who are trying to fight for the reinsertion of this feeding tube only two potential options left. One this Pinellas circuit judge in the same county where Terri Schiavo is right now. Also a lot of people putting the pressure on Governor Jeb Bush in the state capital of Tallahassee, Florida.
Our Ed Henry standing by there. Let's go to him -- Ed.
ED HENRY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Daryn, that's right, all ice now turning to Governor Jeb Bush. The bottom line is yesterday his brother, President Bush, said the federal government, the executive branch, has done all it can so far in this case. The legislative branch, the U.S. Congress, has done all its can. That emergency legislative passed late Sunday, early Monday morning, now shot down by various courts.
Now all eyes turning on the state level. The state senate yesterday here in Florida deciding not to pass legislation that would have reinserted the feeding tube for Terri Schiavo. That was defeated 21-18 here in the state senate. State senate leaders here say they are not going to bring this legislation up again. That legislative avenue has been closed. That's why the governor yesterday put forth a motion to this circuit court, Judge Greer, trying to seek custody, have the state take custody of Terri Schiavo through this state agency. That is, again, what we're expecting we'll hear a decision from Judge Greer by noon Eastern Time today.
But yes, I was in the governor's office a short while ago. The calls are coming in fast and furious. E-mails are going around through various conservative networks, saying call the governor, put some pressure on him, urge him to help.
The governor is someone on record who says, he wants to help, he wants Terri Schiavo to get this feeding tube back, he wants her to live, but he is finding that time is running out, his options are running out. We are awaiting that decision now from Judge Greer in nearby Pinellas County, but the governor, his options really dwindling at this time. But since the Supreme Court, the U.S. Supreme Court, has now said that they're denying this petition from the parents of Terri Schiavo, all eyes are turning to Governor Bush -- Daryn.
KAGAN: Yes, and is it unclear, or is it clear just exactly what kind of options the governor has at this point? We've heard some pleas from some protesters outside the hospice where Terri Schiavo is right now, calling on the governor really just to take over.
It would appear, though, from hearing from you and others in the state capital that he does not have that power to just act as he wants to.
HENRY: Well, he does have to wait for Judge Greer to issue a ruling here as to whether there is any legal basis for him -- for the state to take custody of Terri Schiavo. But you're right, if Judge Greer shoots that down, then the governor would have to make a decision. That's not just a legal decision, Daryn, but is it a political decision.
Does the governor of Florida really want to go in and seize custody of Terri Schiavo? Does he feel that he wants to save her life to the point that he will go in and have the state of Florida take custody, seize custody from her husband? That is not just a legal decision. It is a political decision. It's one with major ramifications, and it's one that, obviously, the governor is weighing very, very carefully -- Daryn.
KAGAN: The state legislature has also -- before it basically says it couldn't do anything more, looking at other options. Were there concerns in the state capital that any action they might take would have ramifications far past the Terri Schiavo case and affect other people and their wishes and actually make it more complicated than just one woman's tragic story?
HENRY: Absolutely, because we saw what happened in the United States Congress. This became not just about Terri Schiavo. There was a lot of concern expressed at the fact that this emergency legislation passed by the United States Congress would have far-reaching implications beyond this case. That still has not been tested, but it will be tested in the future.
And yesterday, during this state Senate debate, there was a lot of talk about the fact that this was not just about Terri Schiavo, that in fact, it was legislation that would is said that you could not deny food and water to someone who had not put in writing their wishes on whether or not they wanted to die.
For example, in this case with Terri Schiavo, we're judging this based -- and the judges have issued their rulings in the past based on what her husband has said about her wishes. There was nothing, as you know, in writing. So this would have had ramifications far beyond Terri Schiavo's case, because anyone else in the state of Florida who was in this same position in the future would be affected by this if they did not have a living will, if they did not put their wishes in writing.
So you're absolutely right, it would have far-reaching implications beyond the Terri Schiavo case, but the bottom line is, despite the pleas from Governor Bush, the state senate decided not to pass that legislation. It went down 21-18. So that's why the governor is finding that while he wants to do something, and he's getting all this pressure to do something, the list of things he can do, it's dwindling fast -- Daryn.
KAGAN: Ed Henry live in the Florida state capital of Tallahassee. Once again, for our viewers watching across the U.S. and all around the world, the news coming out of the U.S. Supreme Court, the high court has denied the request by the Schindler family, by Terri Schiavo's parents, to take this case.
Therefore, not inserting themselves into the case and not ordering the reinsertion of the feeding tube back into Terri Schiavo.
Our Bob Franken standing by in Pinellas Park, Florida, just outside the hospice where Terri Schiavo is today -- Bob.
BOB FRANKEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, first, what's going on right now is one of the representatives of the family is speaking with the family, trying to gauge reaction, which I'm sure he'll share with us in a few minutes. That's going on right now. There's a court hearing going on at the state court level. Ed has been talking about state action. That hearing is occurring right now. It is the one in which Judge George Greer will rule on the merits of Governor Bush's claim that he has the authority to come in and take custody of Terri Schiavo. Now before anybody says that that will be a last-ditch effort, we have seen several last-ditch efforts that have been replaced by some new strategy. We're not aware that there's any new strategy being developed. In fact, to the contrary, what we're discerning is that there is a resignation that although there is a desperate and angry desire on the part of the blood relatives of Terri Schiavo to reconnect the feeding tube because of the raw emotions involved, that they're running out of options within the law.
Now, to my rear is the group of -- small group of protesters. Their reaction was to immediately be led in prayer. Now what is very interesting about that -- what is very interesting about is that when there is some event like this, the police, who have a very benign presence here, are suddenly sort of fanned out to make sure that nothing really happens. The immediate reaction came from a man who has appeared frequently. He is Reverend Patrick Mahoney. I should point out, by the way, that he's somebody we've seen in various issues around the country. He was very present in the Ten Commandments confrontation in Alabama. He was there when Elian Gonzalez custody battle was going on. He's somebody who frequently appears when there is a cause that the conservative right, the religious right, is interested in. He is here as a spokesman.
And here was his reaction right after the Supreme Court decision.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REV. PATRICK MAHONEY: The reinsertion of Terri's feeding tube. So at this point in time, it appears every legal option has been exhausted. We're just hearing -- God bless you, sister, it's going to be OK. It's going to be OK. Again, the United States Supreme Court has denied the motion by the Schindlers to reinsert the feeding tube. So yesterday the legislation options closed. Just a moment ago the legal options have closed.
We now, once again -- and let us pray hard, brothers and sisters -- Governor Bush is now the only practical hope here for Terri Schiavo. We plead with Governor Bush and DCF to intercede. Let us pray right now for that.
Father, we come to you now in the name of our lord and savior, Jesus Christ...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FRANKEN: Now, this was the reaction, and he went into the prayers with the assembled group there.
Now, we should point out that what they're really asking Governor Bush to do is to say in spite of court orders to the contrary, the governor is going to ignore those court orders and come in and take custody of Terri Schiavo, which would be an extremely significant decision for a person who is, in effect, is in charge of a legal system, to say that he would ignore the orders of a court. There is of course room for a legal appeal. But time is an extremely important factor here.
We can report that last night, the governor had some of his DCF agents -- DCF is the Department of Children and Families -- in this immediate vicinity. He had decided with his legal advisers that there was the possibility that he could make the decision to take custody without a court order, but he decided to check with the court. The court immediately put out an order saying do not do it until the issues can be litigated. That is going on now. Judge George Greer, who was the same judge last Friday ordered that the tube be disconnected, is now ruling on whether the governor has the authority to take custody. That would seem to be, in the minds of many people, the last avenue left, then the governor would have to make a decision about what he wants to do if all the court orders are ruled against him.
KAGAN: All right, Bob Franken in Pinellas Park, we will be back to you shortly. Right now, we want to welcome on the phone David Cardwell, a man, a voice familiar to many of our CNN viewers. We got to know him during the 2000 election aftermath. He is an expert on Florida politics.
David, good morning. Thanks for being here with us.
DAVID CARDWELL, ATTORNEY: Hello, Daryn. Good to talk to you again.
KAGAN: You're just the guy we need to talk to.
With all the focus on Governor Bush at this moment, since the Supreme Court has turned down this request by the family to take the case, what exactly are the options that Governor Bush has at this time?
CARDWELL: Well, the option they're looking at is the statute which allows the Department of Children and Families to step in and actually take custody of an individual for up to 24 hours to determine whether or not they are in jeopardy. That does not require pre- clearance with a court. They did go to Judge Greer to get approval. I think the issue is going to be if Judge Greer comes back and says, no, you cannot do this, whether the governor will buy the court order and go ahead and order DCF to step in.
KAGAN: Were you surprised that the state legislature failed to act on this matter in recent days?
CARDWELL: Somewhat surprising, although I think this has been just a gut-wrenching issue for everyone that's been involved in it. But it does remind me of -- you mentioned the 2000 election. It does remind me of the 36 days, because you've got different branches of government, the state and federal government. It's like a classic collision of the separation of powers and the checks and balances between the different branches. So this is going to be a legal case that's going to be, I think, analyzed for years to come.
KAGAN: And what kind of effect, long term, do you think it will have on Florida politics? CARDWELL: There's already a lot of discussion that this may be an issue in the 2006 election with Senator Nelson up for re-election and with the gubernatorial elections on the ballot, that what was done during this case may indeed be a very strong issue particularly for trying to turn out the base of certain voters.
KAGAN: All right. David Cardwell.
Anything else that you want to make a point on this case, David?
CARDWELL: I just think that it's a case that once the district court ruled as it did, it really, I think pretty much cut off the legal arguments in the courts, and now it's a matter of seeing whether the governor is going to step in.
And I think something that even Jeffrey Toobin has mentioned, it is fascinating to see the difference in opinions, both in terms of legal analysis and medical analysis in this case. There's not much middle ground here. It seems that everyone is just to one extreme or the other.
KAGAN: And as we also heard from our medical correspondent, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, where you have a group of doctors all examining the same patient, the same evidence, the same information and coming away with completely different interpretations.
CARDWELL: That's true.
KAGAN: Very good.
One more question, though -- do you know anything about this circuit court judge, Judge George Greer, who we're still waiting to hear from in the next hour on this decision that would give the governor to go in and take custody of Terri Schiavo?
CARDWELL: Judge Greer has been incredibly consistent in his rulings. He's really not given much support of any motion or argument that Terri's parents have made. He seemed to have concluded that her wish was to have the tubes removed, and he has stuck very much to that. And I hate to predict rulings, but I imagine this ruling we expect around noontime, he'll say the governor cannot step in.
KAGAN: We'll be monitoring that. David Cardwell, thank you, always great to have your expertise, especially on Florida politics.
We want go live now to Pinellas Park, and Reverend Mahoney joining us, somebody who has been watching it.
Reverend, we've actually been listening to you throughout the morning as you've been talking to your fellow protesters there outside the hospice. Your reaction, please, to this latest development that the U.S. Supreme Court has decided not to take Terri Schiavo's case, the Schindlers' case?
PAT MAHONEY, CHRISTIAN DEFENSE COALITION: Well, we're obviously very disturbed. Remember, you have a disabled woman being denied heard constitutional rights. Our position has been all along Congress, ordered a de novo (ph) review. If Terri expires, they cannot be looked into. So issue a stay to keep Terri alive, which was the will of what Congress wanted, so that we can look into these constitutional violation.
We are also challenging Governor Bush -- Governor Bush, intervene to save the life of Terri Schiavo. We believe he has the authority. Think for a moment, if this were an African-American person being denied the right to eat at a lunch counter or vote, would there be any person out there who would say the governor should not act? Judge Greer should not be the final authority here. We are pleading -- we respect Governor Bush, we admire him, but we are pleading, intervene to save the life. This woman is on day seven. She's starving to death. Intervene on her behalf.
KAGAN: Is it possible you're asking the governor to do something that he does not have the power to do, and that there's a reason that he went through the court to get court permission before going in there yesterday and taking custody?
MAHONEY: I believe the governor does have the right. Remember, the courts are not the final say; we are three branches of government -- executive, legislative and judicial. What right do we have to say that Judge Greer is the final authority here? He is not. The governor yesterday in his news conference seemed to indicate that DCF had the authority and he did. I know that Judge Greer has issued this order -- by the way, also asking the sheriffs -- I think, think of the expansive order -- not only the governor, but the sheriffs not to get involved. Governor Bush can act, and if it results in a constitutional conference in this state, then so be it.
KAGAN: You think it is going that far?
MAHONEY: I would hope that the governor would have that kind of courage. We were a little discouraged. The governor was supposed to be in Tampa today. He canceled that appearance. For the viewers out, Tampa is only about 15 miles from Pinellas Park.
We are pleading. We're now discussing our strategy on what to do. And we would ask everyone across America, first, fast tomorrow and pray, stand in solidarity with Terri Schiavo on Good Friday. Second, call Governor Jeb Bush and say, please intervene.
Again, Daryn, put this in another context, if this were a person being denied the right into the University of Florida because they were African-American or a person of color, everyone would be pleading for the governor to intervene. This is a situation perhaps even more tragic, because a woman's life is at stake. Intervene right now. A citizen of your state, Governor, is being brutally starved and dehydrated. Her skin color is fading. Her tongue is swelling. Her lips are cracking. She is fading before our very eyes. I cannot put it any clearer.
Governor Bush, please intervene here, please protect the rights of your citizens. KAGAN: All right, Pat. Pat Mahoney from the Christian Defense Coalition. You have made your point, and very vocal and passionate about your defense of having the feeding tube reinserted. Thank you for your time there.
MAHONEY: Thank you.
KAGAN: Let's go to where the governor has his office, Tallahassee, the state capital. Ed Henry standing by there.
Ed, any word from the governor's office?
HENRY: We are still trying to get comment from the governor's office, trying to get reaction to this U.S. Supreme Court decision. As I mentioned earlier, we were in his office earlier trying to get to his press office. They are obviously very busy right now. Also his receptionist was just getting hammered with call after call.
And what you're hearing from political analysts is that Governor Bush is somebody who wants to help Terri Schiavo here, even though there have been some national polls suggesting that political intervention is something that a vast majority of the public does not want.
Governor bush is not up for re-election in 2006. He is someone who has said on several occasions he has no plans to run for president in 2008. And what you're hearing from various political analysts in the state here is that he wants to try to help Terri Schiavo. He's investigating every possible avenue to help her, even though that is winnowing down very quickly, and he doesn't care about the political consequences, because he is not running for re-election.
And you saw just yesterday, though, that the politics here are very confusing, because fellow Republicans, even hearing pleas from Governor Bush to pass this legislation to reinsert the feeding tube, they ignored those pleas. So it's not just that Republicans are marching in lockstep with the governor. In fact, they went against him yesterday in the state senate. And then when you talked briefly about Senator Bill Nelson, Democrat from Florida, he is up for re- election in 2006, and it's unclear how the politics will play out here. That talking points memo that emerged, it was allegedly written by an anonymous Republican staffer on Capitol Hill back in Washington over the weekend during the congressional debate over that emergency legislation. There was a section in there that mentioned Senator Bill Nelson's race, and how this could really hurt Democrats particularly in that U.S. Senate race in 2006.
But obviously, it's way too early to tell, because as I mentioned, the Republicans in this state are not exactly on the same page here. Just yesteday republicans in the state Senate rejected pleas from the governor to pass this legislation, which the governor very clearly stated, he believed that could have saved Terri Schiavo's life -- Daryn.
KAGAN: And in fact, we have seen some discussion in the media among different conservatives, people who believe in state's right issue, and that this is something that should have stayed with the states, and not even gone to the federal level.
MAHONEY: That's right. Absolutely. That's why this has been a very confusing issue to sort through, in addition to obviously the moral issues that have come up, the legal issues that everyone is trying to sort through, the political ones are far from clear at this point.
Initially, Republicans on Capitol Hill based in part on this memo which, again, has not been verified. It was an anonymous memo that leaked out on Capitol Hill. There are suggestions that Republicans on the Hill thought that this would help whip up the conservative base on the life issue. But you're right, there are other Republicans all across the country in some of these national polls suggesting that they do not necessarily want the federal government or a state government getting involved in a private family decision like this, and that there's also concern about federal rights versus state rights. So the politics are possibly just as scrambled as the legal issues as well -- Daryn.
MAHONEY: Ed Henry, in the state capital of Tallahassee.
So as the story develops, the Supreme Court once again today denying -- refusing the order Terri Schiavo's feeding tube to be reinserted. This story playing out in Tallahassee, the state capital, and Pinellas Park, Florida, where Terri Schiavo lies in a hospice in a bed today.
Our Bob Franken is standing by there. And, Bob, before we go to you I just want to mentioned, after hearing the impassioned plea from Pat Mahoney, talking about and asking for the feeding tube to be reinserted, we have yet to hear from Michael Schiavo, the husband in this case, or his attorney. When we do get those comments, we'll bring those to you live here on CNN.
Meanwhile, Bob Franken in Pinellas Park. Bob, what do you have?
BOB FRANKEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: And of course Michael Schiavo has said repeatedly that his motives are to provide a merciful death to a woman who has suffered, according to his telling, since 1990 when she went into this cognitive state, that he is provided any number of medical advisers to tell the courts -- advise, by the way, that the courts have accepted -- that she is in what is called a persistent vegetative state, which means that she really only has reflex actions and no real cognitive ability. So that the merciful thing to do, according to Michael Schiavo, is to end her life. And of course that has caused a bitter dispute with his in-laws, in effect, the blood relatives of Terri Schiavo who have been successful in creating the atmosphere that we see now.
As for what Reverend Mahoney was saying a while ago, it was interesting, Daryn, and I know you picked up on it, he was crystal clear -- he was acknowledging that if Governor Bush were to do what he wanted, which is to say, to ignore the courts, that there would be a constitutional crisis. Mahoney saying if there's a constitutional crisis, so be it. While there are political considerations, as Ed very, very described extensively just a moment ago, but the other considerations are a legacy, and if the legacy that Governor Bush would leave included a constitutional crisis would not be something to make him happy. Let me look over here for just a second.
Brother O'Donnell, are you in a position that you can talk to us?
KAGAN: Bob, hold that -- go ahead, Bob, sorry.
FRANKEN: We're talking now with Brother Paul O'Donnell. You have spoken to the family, is that correct?
BROTHER PAUL O'DONNELL, SCHINDLER FAMILY SPOKESMAN: Yes, I have.
KAGAN: Can you pass on their reaction?
O'DONNELL: They're very disappointed. They're in shock. They can't believe this is happening. They hope the governor's going to do something, but this is a very significant blow. And Terri's life hangs in the balance.
FRANKEN: Is it fair to say that over the last several days they've almost lost hope?
O'DONNELL: Their hope is dimming. Dimming quickly, yes.
FRANKEN: And you, you are their spiritual adviser. What is it you told them?
O'DONNELL: I told them to trust that God will never forsake them, and that this is happening at a time when the whole world is focusing on Jesus Christ, who is also sentenced to die by the courts and who was -- it was an unjust decision, and God will be with them no matter what.
FRANKEN: Do you have any sympathy at all as a man of the cloth for the other point of view, the husband's point of view that -- and I know this is inconsistent with Catholic theology, that at least he believes that the most merciful thing to do would be to let her die?
O'DONNELL: I can't call this mercy. It's a false sense of compassion. It is a false mercy, and it's morally wrong. And I think it's evil. I pray for him. I pray for his soul.
FRANKEN: Is it fair to say -- and I'm not thinking of this in religious terms, that the family is, in effect, left hoping for a miracle, or that's it?
O'DONNELL: At this point, it is a miracle or that's it. Yes.
FRANKEN: Brother Paul O'Donnell who is one of the Franciscan friars who is here. They are acting as the theological supporters of the family, and have been keeping us in touch with how their feeling when they're not able, the family members, not able, or a place like right now, where they just don't to come out and appear publicly -- Daryn.
KAGAN: It has indeed been an emotional roller coaster for both sides, the Schiavo and Schindler families, over recent weeks.
Bob Franken, thank you for that. We're going to get back to you in just a couple of minutes. We are getting to the top of the hour.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired March 24, 2005 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DARYN KAGAN, CNN ANCHOR: Let's take a look at what's happening now in the news.
Time and options may be running out for Terri Schiavo. Parents of the brain-damaged are awaiting word from two courts that could decide whether to restore her feeding tube. One seeks the intervention of the U.S. Supreme Court. The other asks a Florida court to allow a state agency to take custody of Terri Schiavo. That Florida ruling is expected within the next two hours.
Legendary chess champ Bobby Fischer is free from a detention center in Japan. He's now heading to a new home in Iceland. Lawmakers there have granted him citizenship. Fischer was detained in Japan on a U.S. warrant. His native U.S. says that he remains wanted for playing a 1992 chess match in the former Yugoslavia. That was apparently in violation of sanctions.
Listen and take a look at these pictures. We have a developing and dramatic story to report this hour. It is from the former Soviet Republic of Kyrgyzstan. The president there has reportedly fled the country, after thousands of protesters stormed and seized the main government building earlier this morning. Those demonstrators had demanded the president's resignation amid on allegations of election fraud.
The State Department has issued a warning for Americans planning to travel to the Philippines. The statement cites terror threats and suspected plans to launch multiple attacks throughout the Philippines. The warning urges Americans to travel there only if those plans are essential.
Good morning to you on this Thursday morning. I'm Daryn Kagan. Rick Sanchez is off today.
The legal options narrow to keep Terri Schiavo alive. Her parents can now look to just two courts in their desperate attempt to have her feeding tube reinserted.
Our correspondents Joe Johns and Ed Henry are following the latest legal developments in Washington and Tallahassee. Our Bob Franken is outside Schiavo's hospice.
Let's start with you, Joe, at the U.S. Supreme Court.
JOE JOHNS, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Daryn, it has been 11 hours now since that appeal was filed here at the Supreme Court. Michael Schiavo, the husband, has filed a response to the parents' appeal. In it, in part, he says Terri Schiavo should be allowed to die in peace and dignity according to her wishes. He also says there'd be no valid justification for reinserting the feeding tube and remanding this case back to the 11-Circuit in Atlanta, which is what the parents want.
He also attacks the legislation that was passed over the weekend by the Congress and signed by the president. In part he says, and we have a graphic. "A statute that imposes burdens on one person that do not apply to anyone else is suspect because such enactments demonstrate that Congress was not seeking to advance any compelling interest. But was instead seeking merely to interfere with the rights of that person because Congress did not agree with the exercise of her rights."
Of course, that filing that occurred around 11:00 Eastern Time last night from the parents once again asked for the feeding tube to be reinserted and for this case to be remanded back to the circuit. Now in that, they say, of course, Terri Schiavo is dying of starvation and dehydration. If the tube is not reinserted by order of the court, Terri will die before this court is able to consider the merits of the petition.
Waiting, of course, now here at the court for some word. We know it went in to Justice Anthony Kennedy. He has the opportunity to enter an injunction on his own or bump it up to the full court. Of course, we would not get word if he asked the full court to consider it. But we also knew that it was likely he might do that. There have been several other times the Schiavo matter has come before the Supreme Court. Each time before, they've refused to hear it -- Daryn.
KAGAN: And any indication from the court on how long it will take to hear anything?
JOHNS: Not at all. We simply don't have any idea. This is something that goes on behind closed doors. You get word of the pleadings, word of the court filing. And you don't get much more than that until some type of a decision is rendered.
KAGAN: All right. Joe Johns at the Supreme Court. Thank you for that.
A family spokesman for the Schindler family -- yes, for the Schindler family speaking right now in Pinellas Park. Let's listen in.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They've had to watch their daughter go through this. I've been in Florida for so long. I've grieved for the children that have been abducted and murdered here. But that family and loved ones did not have to watch that murder taking place.
Mary and Bob Schindler have to stand by and watch the abuser continue to abuse and murder their daughter. This is America. Please someone, help Terri and help this family.
REV. PATRICK MAHONEY, DIR., CHRISTIAN DEFENSE COALITION: Again, my name is Reverend Patrick Mahoney, director of the Christian Defense Coalition. Today is Holy Thursday. And let it be known Terri Schiavo is suffering a barbaric, brutal, suffering horrific death here by dehydration and starvation. If Terri does go home to be with the Lord, this is not a death with dignity. If Terri were an animal, she would not have to endure this.
Now, let's give an update on where we are. As you know, it is now before the United States Supreme Court. We are diligently praying for Justice Kennedy. We hope he considers the extraordinary act of Congress we saw over the weekend and grants review to this case. And our point all along is this. If Terri expires, then there's no opportunity to look at any constitutional violations. Just let a stay be in for this denovo review so we can examine some of these things.
No. 2, the Florida Senate, the Republican-led Florida Senate, has allowed Terri Schiavo to endure this barbaric suffering. They had an opportunity yesterday to intervene to protect her. And they chose not to do that. For President Lee, for the Republican majority in the Florida Senate, the death that Terri is suffering here, the slow agonizing death must be laid at your doorstep.
Now to Governor Bush. We are thankful for the leadership he has shown in the past. But to try to put in context what happened or not, the attorneys say we'll do our best. Governor Bush had a news conference in which he indicated that he could, and DCF could use executive authority to intervene on Terri's behalf. In the interim, Judge Greer issued an order stating that the feeding tube could not be reinserted.
In the midst of that, it appears the governor has backed off and is now struggling with the fact of dealing with a court order. We say to Governor Bush, a citizen of your state is being brutally murdered. You need to intervene on her behalf. You need to intervene on her behalf Governor Bush. Right now, you could have the Florida Department of Law Enforcement come in and take Terri.
We are pleading with you, Governor Bush. We respect you. You know what's happening here. Dr. Martin Luther King many years ago addressed unjust law. Are we -- laws. Are we going to let one judge here...
KAGAN: We've been listening in to both spokespeople and protesters there outside the hospice in Pinellas Park, Florida where Terri Schiavo is right now, expressing some very strong views. Views that are controversial. A lot of people in this country are agreeing with them that this would be a death without dignity. Also allegations that Michael Schiavo has abused his wife.
We need to point out in fairness that those allegations have been presented in court a number of times and not accepted by the courts of Florida. Also there are those who believe that Michael Schiavo is trying to get his wife death with dignity and carrying out her wishes. Strong divided opinions across this country.
Let's bring in our Ed Henry. He's in Tallahassee. That is where a lot -- some people believe could still take place to save Terri Schiavo -- Ed.
ED HENRY, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Daryn. That's right. You just heard the pressure there being put on Governor Jeb Bush to do something, do anything to try to save Terri Schiavo's life. I was just at the governor's office right across the street. I can tell you it's quite a scene there. The phones are ringing off the hook. There are a couple dozen activists outside holding up signs saying, "Do something to save Terri's life."
The problem for the governor right now is that while he wants to do that, time and options are running out very rapidly. Yesterday, the governor filed a motion trying to get, as you heard in that presser, the Department of Children and Families for the state of Florida to come in and take custody of Terri Schiavo. That is going to be reviewed now because the governor is saying that there is new medical evidence suggesting she's not in a permanent vegetative state.
That is being reviewed right now by Judge George Greer, a circuit judge here in Florida. He says he will have a ruling by noon today Eastern Standard Time. But last night in the meantime, he put out an emergency order saying that, in fact, the state could not take custody of Terri Schiavo.
Now, you also have to know that Judge Greer is a person who initially last Friday ordered that the feeding tube to be removed. So the family is not expecting a positive decision from him. Last night, Terri Schiavo's father was on CNN telling Aaron Brown that he believes that Judge Greer is on a, quote, "crusade to kill Terri."
That's why the governor, in addition to pursuing this at the judicial level, also yesterday urged the state Senate to bring up legislation that if it had passed, would have gotten that feeding tube reinserted. There was a three-hour, very emotional debate in the state Senate right behind me. In fact, Terri Schiavo's brother Bobby Schindler was sitting in the Senate gallery watching it. But that legislation failed 21 to 18.
So the bottom line here is that the state Senate leaders are saying they're not going to bring this back again. The legislative avenues have been exhausted. The governor is trying now to exhaust all the judicial avenues here within the state of Florida. And then, of course, the family, the parents have gone to the U.S. Supreme Court as you heard earlier -- Daryn.
KAGAN: Ed, I want to ask you about the plea that we're just hearing from the last protester, Reverend Mahoney, where he was calling on Governor Bush to step in and take custody. Saying he believes that the governor does have that power, but in fact, by state law does he?
HENRY: That's right. And that's why the governor wanted instead to go to Judge Greer and file this motion yesterday. This petition. So that he would not just go in directly and take Terri Schiavo. But in fact, seek the judge's permission to take custody citing this new medical evidence, claiming that she is not in a permanent vegetative state. But also mentioning allegations that perhaps she has been neglected and abused that as you mention are not proven. But those allegations were cited in this order -- in this motion to try to get the state to take custody.
There also is going to be a press conference in about an hour and a half here in Tallahassee, where some conservative activists are going to urge the governor to issue a pardon for Terri Schiavo, believing that that could also save her life. So basically, every measure no matter how desperate it is being considered right now -- Daryn.
KAGAN: Well, when you say a pardon, there's been no crime committed by Terri Schiavo. Is that for people who are trying to compare Terri Schiavo's situation to what a death row inmate would get in terms of process of the law?
KAGAN: This is Alan Keys, the conservative activist, former presidential candidate, also Larry Klayman, a former Republican Senate candidate here in Florida, conservative activist. They want the governor to issue that pardon. You're absolutely right. There's been no crime suggested here. So a lot of people are wondering how in the world could the governor issue a pardon.
I think the point is that a lot of people are urging desperate measures, anything. They want the governor to use every single power he has at his disposal, even if it doesn't necessarily fit this case. You have a lot of activists calling his off, hammering the switchboard, saying do something. Do anything -- Daryn.
KAGAN: Ed Henry live from Tallahassee, Florida. Thank you.
Let's go back to Pinellas Park where Terri Schiavo is right now and to the protest movement. Our Bob Franken has been there covering that part of the story.
Good morning.
BOB FRANKEN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning. And here's the behind the scenes story on why it is that there was no move by Governor Bush to come in yesterday. Send his people in and have Terri Schiavo put under state custody. Governor Bush had received, we're told by a variety of sources, had received legal advice that the law allowed him without authorization from the courts to use this Department of Children and Families, DCF as it's called, to make a decision to in effect, take custody, which would have removed the guardianship -- practically removed the guardianship from Michael Schiavo.
But before he did that, he went to court on motions of Schiavo's lawyer. The judge issued an assertive order. Do not do that. Which left Governor Bush with the choice of doing it in spite of the court order, and leaving himself open to criticisms that he does not live under the rule of law, or waiting.
They're going back into court now to argue the various issues that are involved. They're supposed to be at a hearing before Judge George Greer in about 15 minutes. The judge has promised that he'll have an ultimate decision on whether DCF can, in fact, take custody.
This is the same judge, by the way, that ordered the feeding tube disconnected. The judge has been vilified by representatives of the family who believe that he, in fact, has not been fair to them. The family of the blood relative, he's ruled in favor of the husband, Michael Schiavo who has for years tried to get the tube disconnected.
The agents of DCF, we're told, were nearby; they had been in contact with police. If they received authority, they were going to come in. But there was never a question anybody said that the governor was going to try to defy the court order -- Daryn.
KAGAN: Bob Franken, live from Pinellas Park. Thank you for that.
Other news today, several children are suffering a life threatening kidney infection this morning. And health officials wonder if the problem might be with some petting zoos. It's a story every parent will want to see.
Plus he admitted his problems more than 10 years ago. We have his confessions on tape. Now there's new questions arising why John Couey was allowed out on the streets.
First though, chaos in the capital of Kyrgyzstan. We'll take you there when CNN LIVE TODAY returns.
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KAGAN: These quick moving pictures coming to us from a revolt in Kyrgyzstan. Thousands of protesters have stormed and seized the presidential compound in the former Soviet republic. There are unconfirmed reports that the embattled president has fled the country and possibly even resigned.
Demonstrators have demanded the president's resignation amid allegations of elections fraud. That uprising is similar to pro Western opposition that toppled the Moscow-backed government in Ukraine last year.
Kyrgyzstan, to put it in perspective on the map for you, shares its border with three other Soviet republics, as well as China. It is smaller in size than South Dakota. Kyrgyzstan has a population of more than 5 million. The majority are Russian speaking and Muslim. More than 1,100 U.S. soldiers are stationed at an air base in Kyrgyzstan. That is the largest American military presence in central Asia outside of Afghanistan.
Our Ryan Chilcote is following the developments. He filed this report just a short time ago.
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RYAN CHILCOTE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (on camera): An OSCE official on the ground in Bishkek is telling CNN that the OSCE would like to see a provisional government of national unity set up in that country, to fill the power vacuum that has clearly been created in Bishkek.
The envoy telling us that officials from the OSCE will be meeting with members of the opposition. That they would like to meet with the president, but that they understand that that will not be possible now. In fact, they even had a meeting set up with him for earlier in the day that the president was unable to attend.
Now, the opposition is saying that they will be making some very important declarations over the next couple of day. The first of which is that they are going to convene the parliament on Friday. Now, they're going to convene the old parliament. Meaning the parliament that was in power before this most recent parliamentary election in Kyrgyzstan, which they contend, or they complain was actually rigged by the government.
They do not recognize the new parliament. So they are calling the old parliament. And they'll meet on Friday in Kyrgyzstan to work some kind of political solution to the crisis in that country.
And lastly, Felix Kulov, a very key opposition leader; a man that many analysts say could actually become a leader who could unite the opposition, was released today from prison by the opposition. He was jailed under President Akayev. He was a staunch critic of President Akayev. Actually was once even the President Akayev's vice president before he left the company.
He actually has appeared on television. He called for national unity. He called for the president to resign. And he also called for order on the streets. He says that Kyrgyzstan has to get beyond this crisis.
Ryan Chilcote, CNN, Moscow.
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KAGAN: Parents, the story coming up for you in a little bit that you will want to pay attention to. Children love to visit them. But could some petting zoos be the cause of a serious illness among some Florida children? We're going to have details on that story straight ahead.
Plus, it's a day of honor and reward for the woman credited with helping capture the Atlanta shooting spree suspect.
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KAGAN: Buyer beware; it is the ultimate consumer warning. So homebuyers face the purchase of a lifetime. Rely on home inspectors. But that expertise can save any homeowner big bucks regardless of plans.
Our personal finance editor Gerri Willis explains now in our "Top Five Tips."
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GERRI WILLIS, CNN-FN PERSONAL FINANCE EDITOR (on camera): Whether you're buying, selling or staying put, a home inspection can help you identify issues in your home that would have otherwise remained ignored. So when you're ready to give your home a checkup, here is an idea of what to look for.
First, a major defect most likely this will be a structural failure. In older homes, it is often the roof that has irregularities, like ice damming or mold. Also, if the home has an addition built on, sections of the roof may be maintained differently. Which could be problematic. Make sure to check for cracks in the foundation, now that could mean a serious structural problem.
Check for proper insulation and ventilation. Inadequate ventilation in an attic can result in deterioration of the roof. Eventually, you'll have to remove and replace roofing shingles. Also check for foggy windows and doors. If they're not insulated properly you could be letting cold air in and adding to your home heating costs.
One thing every homeowner should be careful of is deferred maintenance. Letting small problems, like a leaky faucet linger could end up costing you big bucks to fix. Make sure the plumbing and electrical works, as well as structural addition and renovations are professionally done. Correcting defects of an inexperienced homeowner can be costly and problematic.
If you're trying to size up a home quickly, there are certain clues you should look for. I caught up with certified home inspector Joe Farcetta to find out some tricks of the trade.
So you say the important thing to look for, as just an average homebuyer walking through a house is inconsistency. What do you mean?
JOE FARCETTA, CERTIFIED HOME INSPECTOR: OK. Every house tells a story. So you are trying to figure that story out in the shortest amount of time. You don't have a lot of time available in the house. So you look for things. For instance, if the stove hasn't been cleaned, or doesn't look like it's been cleaned in 10 years, but the house is...
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KAGAN: We're going to cut out of that Gerri Willis report. We have breaking news out of the Supreme Court. We're getting word from our reporters and producers there. The U.S. Supreme Court has denied a request by the Schindler family, Terri Schiavo's parents, to take that case under review and order the reinsertion of the feeding tube back into Terri Schiavo in Florida.
We have our Joe Johns ready to go at the Supreme Court. All right. We're working on getting Joe Johns up.
But once again, the news of the day, what was considered perhaps the last hope for the Schindler family to have the feeding tube reinserted into Terri Schiavo has been denied. The Supreme Court saying they won't take the case under consideration. This would be the sixth time in this long history of this case that the Schindler family has gone, or somebody else has gone to the Supreme Court, to ask them to take it under consideration.
Five times they've denied the family. And this is the sixth time they're not going to take it. It was Justice Kennedy who had the option of considering to put the order to reinsert the feeding tube or to take it under advisement with the full court.
Our Joe Johns is standing by at the U.S. Supreme Court. Let's get more from you -- Joe.
JOHNS: Daryn this -- excuse me, I'm out of breath. This application has been denied. Just a moment ago, the court issued this one sentence statement. "The application for stay of enforcement of judgment in the filing and disposition of a petition for writ is denied." That's all they say.
So it looks like the appeal here at the Supreme Court now moves away from Washington, D.C., at least for now. There has been some talk that there might be a possibility of going back to the 11-Circuit in Atlanta. But it's been denied by the court. No other comment. And I guess the case moves on from here.
Back to you.
KAGAN: All right. Joe, I'm going to let you take a deep breath there.
JOHNS: Thank you.
KAGAN: But don't go anywhere.
JOHNS: OK.
KAGAN: Just take a deep breath as we do this.
To review: once again, this had been denied by the 11-Circuit Court of Appeals here in Atlanta. The Schindler family had kicked it back up, had appealed and pled to the U.S. Supreme Court with the latest.
We're going to go back to Joe Johns in just a minute. First though, let's go to Pinellas Park to the place where Terri Schiavo is in a hospice. A number of protesters standing by clearly will not be pleased by this news -- Bob.
FRANKEN: No, they will not be. But there is a view here in this part of just about everybody involved including the family, that the prospects at the federal level of the Supreme Court were very, very low. Nobody is going be surprised by this. They, of course, had had their hopes raised to the highest levels in a long time over the weekend, when Congress took the extraordinary action of putting this measure back into the federal court system. But then the judicial reality set in. And now you have three levels of court, the top level included, which have said that as a federal issue is concerned, there is no reason for the courts to get involved. So that takes care of that.
Now there is however, a new visit to the state court. Judge George Greer, who is the judge who ordered the tube disconnected, is holding another hearing to decide on the merits of the claim by Governor Bush that he has the authority to send his Department of Children and Families in and take custody of Terri Schiavo, in effect, wresting guardianship from her husband Michael Schiavo. A judge has promised a ruling on that at noon. But the family has seen just about every last-minute hope that it had dwindling away -- Daryn.
KAGAN: And as you said, we expect that announcement, that decision from that circuit judge in Florida within the next hour and a half. Bob Franken, thank you. We'll get back to you in a moment.
I want to welcome our viewers joining us from around the world on CNN international. Once again, the news breaking right now out of the U.S. Supreme Court, the high court of the land, denying the appeal by Terri Schiavo's parents, the Schindlers, to take that case under advisement and to order the reinsertion of Terri Schiavo's feeding tube.
Our Joe Johns standing by at the Supreme Court -- Joe.
JOE JOHNS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Daryn, yes, that is correct.
And thank you for giving me a chance to get my breath. It's a long run around this building to get to the cameras.
In fact, yes, the application has been denied. It was sent, of course, over to Justice Anthony Kennedy. His name, in fact, is on this single sheet of paper. It says it was presented to him and was referred to the court. So the full court got a chance to take a look at it.
As you know, we had not just the appeal, but also a response from Michael Schiavo. We had both the House of Representatives and the Senate of the United States both weighing in, because, of course, they passed the legislation over the weekend.
Bottom line, though, is that they did didn't bite. This is now the fifth time that they've said no to the Schiavo case. I just finished counting that up. There have been a lot of different numbers about how many times it's come to the supreme court. It looks like five times since around 2001.
And she just has to seek other avenues, the mother and father in this case do. And has been already noted, the avenues are certainly running out.
KAGAN: A question for you, Joe. There was an option for Justice Kennedy in this case to make this decision by himself or to refer it to the full court. Did this come out of his office, and did it only go as far as Justice Kennedy?
JOHNS: No, it seems quite clear from this, it says it was accepted by him and referred to the court. So apparently the entire court had an opportunity to look at these documents that had been filed.
We did know that perhaps most, if not all, of the members of the court had an opportunity today to come to a weekly conference of the justices, and that, we think, should have occurred fairly early, 9:00, 10:00, something like that. That perhaps may have been at one point where minds started coming together.
It was a bit surprising as to how long it took. I mean, this is 11 1/2 hours basically since this thing was filed late last night here at the Supreme Court. And it was clear that somebody took a lot of time in deciding whether to go ahead and accept this case or just to deny it.
KAGAN: When you came out to us for the first time, Joe, you read the statement. It's a very short statement, I think, just maybe two or three lines, basically saying that the high court is not going to look at it. No explanation given this time. But as you said, this is the fifth time the Supreme Court has turned down this case. What has been some of the reasoning earlier of why they decided not to look at it.
JOHNS: Well, that's the trick on these things, you really don't get a full sentence, because a lot of times, this is what you get. You get this one sentence. I'll read it to you again now that I'm not out of breath -- "The application for enforcement of stay of judgment pending the filing and disposition of a petition for writ of sersori (ph) presented to Justice Kennedy, and by him presented to the court is denied." So you know, they don't say a lot about it, quite frankly.
You know, the last time they got a request to look at this was the House Government Reform Committee of the House of Representatives, and they were basically going to them saying, look, we have these subpoenas, we're basically trying to use these subpoenas to get the tube reinserted and prolong her life, and we're using as a justification an inquiry by the Congress, but they didn't buy that either, perhaps. You just don't get a big long written statement about why they decided not to take the case.
KAGAN: All right Joe Johns, live at the supreme court. We will be back to you.
It would seem for those who are trying to fight for the reinsertion of this feeding tube only two potential options left. One this Pinellas circuit judge in the same county where Terri Schiavo is right now. Also a lot of people putting the pressure on Governor Jeb Bush in the state capital of Tallahassee, Florida.
Our Ed Henry standing by there. Let's go to him -- Ed.
ED HENRY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Daryn, that's right, all ice now turning to Governor Jeb Bush. The bottom line is yesterday his brother, President Bush, said the federal government, the executive branch, has done all it can so far in this case. The legislative branch, the U.S. Congress, has done all its can. That emergency legislative passed late Sunday, early Monday morning, now shot down by various courts.
Now all eyes turning on the state level. The state senate yesterday here in Florida deciding not to pass legislation that would have reinserted the feeding tube for Terri Schiavo. That was defeated 21-18 here in the state senate. State senate leaders here say they are not going to bring this legislation up again. That legislative avenue has been closed. That's why the governor yesterday put forth a motion to this circuit court, Judge Greer, trying to seek custody, have the state take custody of Terri Schiavo through this state agency. That is, again, what we're expecting we'll hear a decision from Judge Greer by noon Eastern Time today.
But yes, I was in the governor's office a short while ago. The calls are coming in fast and furious. E-mails are going around through various conservative networks, saying call the governor, put some pressure on him, urge him to help.
The governor is someone on record who says, he wants to help, he wants Terri Schiavo to get this feeding tube back, he wants her to live, but he is finding that time is running out, his options are running out. We are awaiting that decision now from Judge Greer in nearby Pinellas County, but the governor, his options really dwindling at this time. But since the Supreme Court, the U.S. Supreme Court, has now said that they're denying this petition from the parents of Terri Schiavo, all eyes are turning to Governor Bush -- Daryn.
KAGAN: Yes, and is it unclear, or is it clear just exactly what kind of options the governor has at this point? We've heard some pleas from some protesters outside the hospice where Terri Schiavo is right now, calling on the governor really just to take over.
It would appear, though, from hearing from you and others in the state capital that he does not have that power to just act as he wants to.
HENRY: Well, he does have to wait for Judge Greer to issue a ruling here as to whether there is any legal basis for him -- for the state to take custody of Terri Schiavo. But you're right, if Judge Greer shoots that down, then the governor would have to make a decision. That's not just a legal decision, Daryn, but is it a political decision.
Does the governor of Florida really want to go in and seize custody of Terri Schiavo? Does he feel that he wants to save her life to the point that he will go in and have the state of Florida take custody, seize custody from her husband? That is not just a legal decision. It is a political decision. It's one with major ramifications, and it's one that, obviously, the governor is weighing very, very carefully -- Daryn.
KAGAN: The state legislature has also -- before it basically says it couldn't do anything more, looking at other options. Were there concerns in the state capital that any action they might take would have ramifications far past the Terri Schiavo case and affect other people and their wishes and actually make it more complicated than just one woman's tragic story?
HENRY: Absolutely, because we saw what happened in the United States Congress. This became not just about Terri Schiavo. There was a lot of concern expressed at the fact that this emergency legislation passed by the United States Congress would have far-reaching implications beyond this case. That still has not been tested, but it will be tested in the future.
And yesterday, during this state Senate debate, there was a lot of talk about the fact that this was not just about Terri Schiavo, that in fact, it was legislation that would is said that you could not deny food and water to someone who had not put in writing their wishes on whether or not they wanted to die.
For example, in this case with Terri Schiavo, we're judging this based -- and the judges have issued their rulings in the past based on what her husband has said about her wishes. There was nothing, as you know, in writing. So this would have had ramifications far beyond Terri Schiavo's case, because anyone else in the state of Florida who was in this same position in the future would be affected by this if they did not have a living will, if they did not put their wishes in writing.
So you're absolutely right, it would have far-reaching implications beyond the Terri Schiavo case, but the bottom line is, despite the pleas from Governor Bush, the state senate decided not to pass that legislation. It went down 21-18. So that's why the governor is finding that while he wants to do something, and he's getting all this pressure to do something, the list of things he can do, it's dwindling fast -- Daryn.
KAGAN: Ed Henry live in the Florida state capital of Tallahassee. Once again, for our viewers watching across the U.S. and all around the world, the news coming out of the U.S. Supreme Court, the high court has denied the request by the Schindler family, by Terri Schiavo's parents, to take this case.
Therefore, not inserting themselves into the case and not ordering the reinsertion of the feeding tube back into Terri Schiavo.
Our Bob Franken standing by in Pinellas Park, Florida, just outside the hospice where Terri Schiavo is today -- Bob.
BOB FRANKEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, first, what's going on right now is one of the representatives of the family is speaking with the family, trying to gauge reaction, which I'm sure he'll share with us in a few minutes. That's going on right now. There's a court hearing going on at the state court level. Ed has been talking about state action. That hearing is occurring right now. It is the one in which Judge George Greer will rule on the merits of Governor Bush's claim that he has the authority to come in and take custody of Terri Schiavo. Now before anybody says that that will be a last-ditch effort, we have seen several last-ditch efforts that have been replaced by some new strategy. We're not aware that there's any new strategy being developed. In fact, to the contrary, what we're discerning is that there is a resignation that although there is a desperate and angry desire on the part of the blood relatives of Terri Schiavo to reconnect the feeding tube because of the raw emotions involved, that they're running out of options within the law.
Now, to my rear is the group of -- small group of protesters. Their reaction was to immediately be led in prayer. Now what is very interesting about that -- what is very interesting about is that when there is some event like this, the police, who have a very benign presence here, are suddenly sort of fanned out to make sure that nothing really happens. The immediate reaction came from a man who has appeared frequently. He is Reverend Patrick Mahoney. I should point out, by the way, that he's somebody we've seen in various issues around the country. He was very present in the Ten Commandments confrontation in Alabama. He was there when Elian Gonzalez custody battle was going on. He's somebody who frequently appears when there is a cause that the conservative right, the religious right, is interested in. He is here as a spokesman.
And here was his reaction right after the Supreme Court decision.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REV. PATRICK MAHONEY: The reinsertion of Terri's feeding tube. So at this point in time, it appears every legal option has been exhausted. We're just hearing -- God bless you, sister, it's going to be OK. It's going to be OK. Again, the United States Supreme Court has denied the motion by the Schindlers to reinsert the feeding tube. So yesterday the legislation options closed. Just a moment ago the legal options have closed.
We now, once again -- and let us pray hard, brothers and sisters -- Governor Bush is now the only practical hope here for Terri Schiavo. We plead with Governor Bush and DCF to intercede. Let us pray right now for that.
Father, we come to you now in the name of our lord and savior, Jesus Christ...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FRANKEN: Now, this was the reaction, and he went into the prayers with the assembled group there.
Now, we should point out that what they're really asking Governor Bush to do is to say in spite of court orders to the contrary, the governor is going to ignore those court orders and come in and take custody of Terri Schiavo, which would be an extremely significant decision for a person who is, in effect, is in charge of a legal system, to say that he would ignore the orders of a court. There is of course room for a legal appeal. But time is an extremely important factor here.
We can report that last night, the governor had some of his DCF agents -- DCF is the Department of Children and Families -- in this immediate vicinity. He had decided with his legal advisers that there was the possibility that he could make the decision to take custody without a court order, but he decided to check with the court. The court immediately put out an order saying do not do it until the issues can be litigated. That is going on now. Judge George Greer, who was the same judge last Friday ordered that the tube be disconnected, is now ruling on whether the governor has the authority to take custody. That would seem to be, in the minds of many people, the last avenue left, then the governor would have to make a decision about what he wants to do if all the court orders are ruled against him.
KAGAN: All right, Bob Franken in Pinellas Park, we will be back to you shortly. Right now, we want to welcome on the phone David Cardwell, a man, a voice familiar to many of our CNN viewers. We got to know him during the 2000 election aftermath. He is an expert on Florida politics.
David, good morning. Thanks for being here with us.
DAVID CARDWELL, ATTORNEY: Hello, Daryn. Good to talk to you again.
KAGAN: You're just the guy we need to talk to.
With all the focus on Governor Bush at this moment, since the Supreme Court has turned down this request by the family to take the case, what exactly are the options that Governor Bush has at this time?
CARDWELL: Well, the option they're looking at is the statute which allows the Department of Children and Families to step in and actually take custody of an individual for up to 24 hours to determine whether or not they are in jeopardy. That does not require pre- clearance with a court. They did go to Judge Greer to get approval. I think the issue is going to be if Judge Greer comes back and says, no, you cannot do this, whether the governor will buy the court order and go ahead and order DCF to step in.
KAGAN: Were you surprised that the state legislature failed to act on this matter in recent days?
CARDWELL: Somewhat surprising, although I think this has been just a gut-wrenching issue for everyone that's been involved in it. But it does remind me of -- you mentioned the 2000 election. It does remind me of the 36 days, because you've got different branches of government, the state and federal government. It's like a classic collision of the separation of powers and the checks and balances between the different branches. So this is going to be a legal case that's going to be, I think, analyzed for years to come.
KAGAN: And what kind of effect, long term, do you think it will have on Florida politics? CARDWELL: There's already a lot of discussion that this may be an issue in the 2006 election with Senator Nelson up for re-election and with the gubernatorial elections on the ballot, that what was done during this case may indeed be a very strong issue particularly for trying to turn out the base of certain voters.
KAGAN: All right. David Cardwell.
Anything else that you want to make a point on this case, David?
CARDWELL: I just think that it's a case that once the district court ruled as it did, it really, I think pretty much cut off the legal arguments in the courts, and now it's a matter of seeing whether the governor is going to step in.
And I think something that even Jeffrey Toobin has mentioned, it is fascinating to see the difference in opinions, both in terms of legal analysis and medical analysis in this case. There's not much middle ground here. It seems that everyone is just to one extreme or the other.
KAGAN: And as we also heard from our medical correspondent, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, where you have a group of doctors all examining the same patient, the same evidence, the same information and coming away with completely different interpretations.
CARDWELL: That's true.
KAGAN: Very good.
One more question, though -- do you know anything about this circuit court judge, Judge George Greer, who we're still waiting to hear from in the next hour on this decision that would give the governor to go in and take custody of Terri Schiavo?
CARDWELL: Judge Greer has been incredibly consistent in his rulings. He's really not given much support of any motion or argument that Terri's parents have made. He seemed to have concluded that her wish was to have the tubes removed, and he has stuck very much to that. And I hate to predict rulings, but I imagine this ruling we expect around noontime, he'll say the governor cannot step in.
KAGAN: We'll be monitoring that. David Cardwell, thank you, always great to have your expertise, especially on Florida politics.
We want go live now to Pinellas Park, and Reverend Mahoney joining us, somebody who has been watching it.
Reverend, we've actually been listening to you throughout the morning as you've been talking to your fellow protesters there outside the hospice. Your reaction, please, to this latest development that the U.S. Supreme Court has decided not to take Terri Schiavo's case, the Schindlers' case?
PAT MAHONEY, CHRISTIAN DEFENSE COALITION: Well, we're obviously very disturbed. Remember, you have a disabled woman being denied heard constitutional rights. Our position has been all along Congress, ordered a de novo (ph) review. If Terri expires, they cannot be looked into. So issue a stay to keep Terri alive, which was the will of what Congress wanted, so that we can look into these constitutional violation.
We are also challenging Governor Bush -- Governor Bush, intervene to save the life of Terri Schiavo. We believe he has the authority. Think for a moment, if this were an African-American person being denied the right to eat at a lunch counter or vote, would there be any person out there who would say the governor should not act? Judge Greer should not be the final authority here. We are pleading -- we respect Governor Bush, we admire him, but we are pleading, intervene to save the life. This woman is on day seven. She's starving to death. Intervene on her behalf.
KAGAN: Is it possible you're asking the governor to do something that he does not have the power to do, and that there's a reason that he went through the court to get court permission before going in there yesterday and taking custody?
MAHONEY: I believe the governor does have the right. Remember, the courts are not the final say; we are three branches of government -- executive, legislative and judicial. What right do we have to say that Judge Greer is the final authority here? He is not. The governor yesterday in his news conference seemed to indicate that DCF had the authority and he did. I know that Judge Greer has issued this order -- by the way, also asking the sheriffs -- I think, think of the expansive order -- not only the governor, but the sheriffs not to get involved. Governor Bush can act, and if it results in a constitutional conference in this state, then so be it.
KAGAN: You think it is going that far?
MAHONEY: I would hope that the governor would have that kind of courage. We were a little discouraged. The governor was supposed to be in Tampa today. He canceled that appearance. For the viewers out, Tampa is only about 15 miles from Pinellas Park.
We are pleading. We're now discussing our strategy on what to do. And we would ask everyone across America, first, fast tomorrow and pray, stand in solidarity with Terri Schiavo on Good Friday. Second, call Governor Jeb Bush and say, please intervene.
Again, Daryn, put this in another context, if this were a person being denied the right into the University of Florida because they were African-American or a person of color, everyone would be pleading for the governor to intervene. This is a situation perhaps even more tragic, because a woman's life is at stake. Intervene right now. A citizen of your state, Governor, is being brutally starved and dehydrated. Her skin color is fading. Her tongue is swelling. Her lips are cracking. She is fading before our very eyes. I cannot put it any clearer.
Governor Bush, please intervene here, please protect the rights of your citizens. KAGAN: All right, Pat. Pat Mahoney from the Christian Defense Coalition. You have made your point, and very vocal and passionate about your defense of having the feeding tube reinserted. Thank you for your time there.
MAHONEY: Thank you.
KAGAN: Let's go to where the governor has his office, Tallahassee, the state capital. Ed Henry standing by there.
Ed, any word from the governor's office?
HENRY: We are still trying to get comment from the governor's office, trying to get reaction to this U.S. Supreme Court decision. As I mentioned earlier, we were in his office earlier trying to get to his press office. They are obviously very busy right now. Also his receptionist was just getting hammered with call after call.
And what you're hearing from political analysts is that Governor Bush is somebody who wants to help Terri Schiavo here, even though there have been some national polls suggesting that political intervention is something that a vast majority of the public does not want.
Governor bush is not up for re-election in 2006. He is someone who has said on several occasions he has no plans to run for president in 2008. And what you're hearing from various political analysts in the state here is that he wants to try to help Terri Schiavo. He's investigating every possible avenue to help her, even though that is winnowing down very quickly, and he doesn't care about the political consequences, because he is not running for re-election.
And you saw just yesterday, though, that the politics here are very confusing, because fellow Republicans, even hearing pleas from Governor Bush to pass this legislation to reinsert the feeding tube, they ignored those pleas. So it's not just that Republicans are marching in lockstep with the governor. In fact, they went against him yesterday in the state senate. And then when you talked briefly about Senator Bill Nelson, Democrat from Florida, he is up for re- election in 2006, and it's unclear how the politics will play out here. That talking points memo that emerged, it was allegedly written by an anonymous Republican staffer on Capitol Hill back in Washington over the weekend during the congressional debate over that emergency legislation. There was a section in there that mentioned Senator Bill Nelson's race, and how this could really hurt Democrats particularly in that U.S. Senate race in 2006.
But obviously, it's way too early to tell, because as I mentioned, the Republicans in this state are not exactly on the same page here. Just yesteday republicans in the state Senate rejected pleas from the governor to pass this legislation, which the governor very clearly stated, he believed that could have saved Terri Schiavo's life -- Daryn.
KAGAN: And in fact, we have seen some discussion in the media among different conservatives, people who believe in state's right issue, and that this is something that should have stayed with the states, and not even gone to the federal level.
MAHONEY: That's right. Absolutely. That's why this has been a very confusing issue to sort through, in addition to obviously the moral issues that have come up, the legal issues that everyone is trying to sort through, the political ones are far from clear at this point.
Initially, Republicans on Capitol Hill based in part on this memo which, again, has not been verified. It was an anonymous memo that leaked out on Capitol Hill. There are suggestions that Republicans on the Hill thought that this would help whip up the conservative base on the life issue. But you're right, there are other Republicans all across the country in some of these national polls suggesting that they do not necessarily want the federal government or a state government getting involved in a private family decision like this, and that there's also concern about federal rights versus state rights. So the politics are possibly just as scrambled as the legal issues as well -- Daryn.
MAHONEY: Ed Henry, in the state capital of Tallahassee.
So as the story develops, the Supreme Court once again today denying -- refusing the order Terri Schiavo's feeding tube to be reinserted. This story playing out in Tallahassee, the state capital, and Pinellas Park, Florida, where Terri Schiavo lies in a hospice in a bed today.
Our Bob Franken is standing by there. And, Bob, before we go to you I just want to mentioned, after hearing the impassioned plea from Pat Mahoney, talking about and asking for the feeding tube to be reinserted, we have yet to hear from Michael Schiavo, the husband in this case, or his attorney. When we do get those comments, we'll bring those to you live here on CNN.
Meanwhile, Bob Franken in Pinellas Park. Bob, what do you have?
BOB FRANKEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: And of course Michael Schiavo has said repeatedly that his motives are to provide a merciful death to a woman who has suffered, according to his telling, since 1990 when she went into this cognitive state, that he is provided any number of medical advisers to tell the courts -- advise, by the way, that the courts have accepted -- that she is in what is called a persistent vegetative state, which means that she really only has reflex actions and no real cognitive ability. So that the merciful thing to do, according to Michael Schiavo, is to end her life. And of course that has caused a bitter dispute with his in-laws, in effect, the blood relatives of Terri Schiavo who have been successful in creating the atmosphere that we see now.
As for what Reverend Mahoney was saying a while ago, it was interesting, Daryn, and I know you picked up on it, he was crystal clear -- he was acknowledging that if Governor Bush were to do what he wanted, which is to say, to ignore the courts, that there would be a constitutional crisis. Mahoney saying if there's a constitutional crisis, so be it. While there are political considerations, as Ed very, very described extensively just a moment ago, but the other considerations are a legacy, and if the legacy that Governor Bush would leave included a constitutional crisis would not be something to make him happy. Let me look over here for just a second.
Brother O'Donnell, are you in a position that you can talk to us?
KAGAN: Bob, hold that -- go ahead, Bob, sorry.
FRANKEN: We're talking now with Brother Paul O'Donnell. You have spoken to the family, is that correct?
BROTHER PAUL O'DONNELL, SCHINDLER FAMILY SPOKESMAN: Yes, I have.
KAGAN: Can you pass on their reaction?
O'DONNELL: They're very disappointed. They're in shock. They can't believe this is happening. They hope the governor's going to do something, but this is a very significant blow. And Terri's life hangs in the balance.
FRANKEN: Is it fair to say that over the last several days they've almost lost hope?
O'DONNELL: Their hope is dimming. Dimming quickly, yes.
FRANKEN: And you, you are their spiritual adviser. What is it you told them?
O'DONNELL: I told them to trust that God will never forsake them, and that this is happening at a time when the whole world is focusing on Jesus Christ, who is also sentenced to die by the courts and who was -- it was an unjust decision, and God will be with them no matter what.
FRANKEN: Do you have any sympathy at all as a man of the cloth for the other point of view, the husband's point of view that -- and I know this is inconsistent with Catholic theology, that at least he believes that the most merciful thing to do would be to let her die?
O'DONNELL: I can't call this mercy. It's a false sense of compassion. It is a false mercy, and it's morally wrong. And I think it's evil. I pray for him. I pray for his soul.
FRANKEN: Is it fair to say -- and I'm not thinking of this in religious terms, that the family is, in effect, left hoping for a miracle, or that's it?
O'DONNELL: At this point, it is a miracle or that's it. Yes.
FRANKEN: Brother Paul O'Donnell who is one of the Franciscan friars who is here. They are acting as the theological supporters of the family, and have been keeping us in touch with how their feeling when they're not able, the family members, not able, or a place like right now, where they just don't to come out and appear publicly -- Daryn.
KAGAN: It has indeed been an emotional roller coaster for both sides, the Schiavo and Schindler families, over recent weeks.
Bob Franken, thank you for that. We're going to get back to you in just a couple of minutes. We are getting to the top of the hour.
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