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CNN Larry King Live

Prince Charles, Camilla Parker Bowles Tie Knot

Aired April 09, 2005 - 21:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


HEATHER MILLS MCCARTNEY, CNN GUEST HOST: Tonight, the royal wedding in Windsor. Prince Charles and Camilla Parker Bowles say, "I do."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PRINCE CHARLES, PRINCE OF WALES: That is my resolve with the help of God.

CAMILLA PARKER BOWLES, DUCHESS OF CORNWALL: That is my resolve with the help of God.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MCCARTNEY: Some thing it's about time. Others, that it never should have happened. What does this marriage mean for the British monarchy? And will Camilla ever be queen?

It's all next on LARRY KING LIVE.

Thank you so much for joining us tonight. I'm Heather Mills McCartney, sitting in for Larry King.

Well, it's been more than three decades since their first meeting, with two failed marriages, four children and lots and lots of headlines in between. But Britain's Prince Charles and Camilla Parker Bowles are finally husband and wife.

Joining us to talk about the royal wedding, India Hicks, who is with me in New York. India is Prince Charles' goddaughter. She was a bridesmaid when he married Lady Diana Spencer in 1981. She's also a superb designer. Her mother attended today's wedding events.

And joining us from Windsor, England, Dickie Arbiter, a former spokesman for Buckingham Palace. In London, Robert Lacey, best- selling author and veteran royal watcher. And with him, Patrick Jephson, former private secretary to Princess Diana. Patrick is the author of "Portraits of a Princess." In Windsor, best-selling biographer Hugo Vickers. Hugo was a steward -- believe it or not -- for today's prayer service in St. George's Chapel.

Hugo, that was a quite an honor. What did that entail?

HUGO VICKERS, SERVED IN WEDDING: Well, when I was school, I used to show tourists around St. George's Chapel. And when I left school, they made be a lay steward. So I've been there for -- I hate to say -- 35 years. That meant that we were putting people into their seats. And because I've been there for such a long time, I was actually in the choir, which was a central bit, seating members of the royal family and the other guests. So that was rather interesting.

MCCARTNEY: Fantastic.

India, your mom was there. Did you get a call from her? Did you hear anything?

INDIA HICKS, AUTHOR: I did. I spoke to my mother earlier this evening. In fact, she said she'd seen Hugo there tonight, had a little chat at the door.

She just remarked on what a wonderful, wonderful service it was, a very cozy feeling to the whole day.

MCCARTNEY: Robert, what did you think of today's wonderful marriage?

ROBERT LACEY, ROYALS BIOGRAPHER: Well, there was a terrible moment when the Archbishop of Canterbury said, "Charles and Camilla, you have committed...yourselves to each other." And I thought that the dreaded a-word was going to be issued.

There was a sense of apprehension. But in the event, it just went off marvelously. And I think, also, serendipity of the service down in the town in the Guildhall where lots of other people were also getting married that day. It had seemed before the event this was going to be a mistake, a catastrophe. The queen wasn't going to go there.

In the event, it was a masterstroke. And it really gave the whole thing a wonderful, homely and English country town atmosphere.

MCCARTNEY: Dickie, you said last year on LARRY KING that you really didn't think they'd ever get married. What have you got to say about that now?

DICKIE ARBITER, FORMER PRESS OFFICER TO QUEEN: Well, I'm going to eat my words. I suppose deep down inside I felt that the relationship did have to be formalized. And there is no way that the Prince of Wales, when he becomes king, could take a mistress to his coronation.

And there was really probably an ultimatum from the queen, "Either formalize the relationship or, you know, get rid of her as a girlfriend, because you cannot keep going on with this lady in tow as a mistress." So she went into the Guildhall this morning as a mistress, and she came out 20 minutes later as a ma'am.

MCCARTNEY: Patrick, do you feel the queen snubbed the ceremony or do you think there was more to it than that?

PATRICK JEPHSON, PRINCESS DIANA'S FORMER SECRETARY: I don't think the queen snubbed the ceremony. There's been some ill-informed speculation that the queen thought that the Guildhall part of the day was in some way beneath her. I don't think that's true at all. On the other hand, it is a fact that this marriage has produced some very mixed feelings in the country as a whole. The queen has to remember, and in fact, has no difficulty remembering, that she is queen for the country, those who are pro the marriage, those who are against it. And by just keeping one arm's length apart for the first part of the day, I think she very skillfully managed to satisfy both camps.

MCCARTNEY: Robert, who plans this type of event? Does Camilla get much of a say?

ROBERT LACEY, ROYALS BIOGRAPHY: Yes, but it was very interesting. One saw a lot of Sir Malcolm Ross, who is head of the Lord Chamberlain's Office, who did Diana's funeral and was behind the jubilee, planning every detail right down to the buses that were used at quite a lot of stages of the ceremony. It all went off so smoothly. As an old coward once said, "These royal events are the sort of things that the British overdo so well."

And I think symbolically it marked the real embrace of Camilla into the royal family. The whole royal machine went into action to make this woman welcome and to make it clear to the country that, whatever happened in the past, the queen is foursquare behind her and Prince Charles, and that this is a new step forward for the Prince of Wales. And his mistress, as Dickie said, who is now a ma'am, indeed, a royal highness, the Duchess of Cornwall.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, do you think the British public will ever really accept Camilla?

VICKERS: They might. But I think it will take a little while. And I think it will all be played rather quietly and cautiously, as it should be. I think they'll try her out on various different kinds of royal engagements, and if it works, she'll do more and more. And if it doesn't work, I think then she'll spend a little bit more time in the country.

I think it's very much an open book, to be quite honest. I think that there was a change in mood in the course of this week, because as you know, everything's been pretty disastrous and chaotic.

But I think when they actually changed the wedding, I think a lot of people felt a great deal of sympathy for them, obviously, because of the Pope's funeral, because suddenly they were doing something -- you know, responding to some outer thing rather than telling us the whole time what they wanted to do.

Clarence House kept issuing these statements. And then, of course, the legal people and all sorts of other people told them, "Well, I'm sorry, you may think that. But that's not the case. You can't do it." But I think when they went to Westminster Cathedral on Monday to attend a vespa (ph) for the Pope, they looked just sort of so battered and worn down, I think people really felt, "Goodness me, they've gone through so much. Give them a break."

MCCARTNEY: India, this was a much more low-key event than when you bridesmaid at Diana and Charles' wedding. Why'd you think that is?

HICKS: Oh, for a whole host of reasons. But I think most second marriages are very different from their first. I think that when Prince Charles married the first time, he was the most eligible bachelor in the world. And to emerge from that union would be an heir to the throne. This time round, of course, none of those factors mattered.

And obviously, the first time, you know, there were 750 million viewers. This time round, I think there was understandably a lot less interest, not because people don't care but just that it's a different wedding entirely.

MCCARTNEY: How do you think Diana would have felt about this?

HICKS: I have no idea how Diana felt or would think about this. I can only assume that, since her sons have accepted Camilla warmly and graciously into their family, she would be pleased.

MCCARTNEY: And you think they really have?

HICKS: I think they really have.

MCCARTNEY: Wonderful.

OK, we're going to take a break. And then we'll come back and talk more about husband and wife, Charles and Camilla.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Charles, have you resolved to be faithful to your wife, forsaking all others, so long as you both shall live?

PRINCE CHARLES: That is my resolve, with the help of God.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Camilla, have you resolved to be faithful to your husband, forsaking all others, so long as you both shall live?

BOWLES: That is my resolve, with the help of God.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Heavenly father, by thy blessing, let these rings be to Charles and Camilla a symbol of unending love and faithfulness, and of the promises they have made to each other, through Jesus Christ, our Lord.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MCCARTNEY: What an exciting day for all of us, and especially for the royal family.

Patrick, Camilla stumbled a little bit on the "I'll be faithful with the Lord's help -- help." Is there any significance in that?

JEPHSON: Not at all, I suspect, Heather. I don't suppose that many of us who have got married managed to do it word perfect. And I don't suppose the sort of thing that they rehearsed very much.

MCCARTNEY: Dickie, what's the streaker, a royal first?

ARBITER: I think the streaker was just somebody out for a little bit of fun during the course of the day. I mean, on the whole, the crowd were very happy. It was a big crowd, given there wasn't a lot for them to see. All they saw was the car coming from the long walk from Cambridge Gate to the Guildhall, which is about a 500-meter drive and back again.

There was no walkabout, which is a great pity, I think, given the reception they got when they arrived, an even bigger reception when they came out as man and wife. I don't think a walkabout would have gone amiss. And likewise, when they left the castle, there was a very fast drive rather than a slow drive, because, remember, people had been waiting about two, three hours just to catch a glimpse of them. And I think that drive was a little bit too fast.

But on the whole, it was a great day. And the people that came thoroughly enjoyed themselves.

MCCARTNEY: India, do you think there was security reasons behind that, because there were apparently a couple of boos, so it would be a bit risky?

HICKS: No, I think it's simply much more practical than that. I think because of the date change that they had to do it then on the Saturday, and I think because they were in Guildhall, there were a number of other people queuing up to have their wedding vows made in there afterwards. And they simply had to move on, I would say that the other could come in.

I mean, just, again, it shows that the monarchy is moving towards a more informal atmosphere, which is what I think the country's been asking for.

MCCARTNEY: Robert, that really shows with the transport, doesn't it? What did you think of it?

LACEY: Yes, you mean the buses and things, yes? Yes, I agree with India. It does show the monarchy moving in tune with the times. Although, as I said at the beginning, sort of accidentally, because the original plan, of course, was to have the Guildhall service up in the castle.

And I think we can now see what a blessing it was that they discovered that, if they held it in the castle, the castle would then become a venue for all sorts of other people's weddings. Maybe that's not a bad idea. Maybe we'll see that in the age of the democratic monarchy.

But certainly, that atmosphere down in town was a total surprise to me, and I think to everybody. And also the goodwill of people -- I mean, there were a few boos. But the loudest boos, I thought, were when they got straight into the car and didn't do the walkabout. And again, I agree with Dickie. I'm sure they could have found a way to do a walkabout away from the registry office that wouldn't have detracted from the other people who went there. But I think they were scared, frankly.

There's been such an incredible amount of hostile press in this country which has given platforms to people of all sorts of cranky persuasions to sound off about the wedding that the only real walkabout was at the end in the Horseshoe Cloister inside Windsor in sort of safe environments.

But I'm sure, over the months that come, we'll see them getting braver and getting into the crowds. And let's hope they get a warm reception.

MCCARTNEY: Do you think the British media will eventually accept them, and back off, and give them a break?

LACEY: Yes, I think they will. That's the thing I noted today. When Camilla (UNINTELLIGIBLE) in the Horseshoe Cloister, where she was mingling with friends of Prince Charles and charity workers. But there were real smiles and smiles back, and personal contact. I mean, this is no Diana. But she's obviously got a good heart and a good will, and I think people will respond to that.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, do you think it's fair to say that there have been a huge amount of bumbles and fumbles in their lead-up to this wedding?

VICKERS: Well, I certainly do. I mean, every since from the start. And I don't quite know whether that just comes from a certain indecisiveness or whether people of Clarence House, the prince's office, have a habit of saying which then later on prove to be not the case.

I mean, I've found myself saying a little bit -- it's like if I tell you I want to go and drive down the motorway at 100 miles an hour, and you tell me, actually, there's a speed limit at 70 miles an hour, that they were telling us -- which you can understand why -- what they wanted to happen. And then all sorts of people popped up to tell them, "Well, actually, that's not the case."

You know, like the title. I mean, you know, she's going to be called the Duchess of Cornwall. But actually, of course, officially, she is the Princess of Wales. But you can call yourself what you'd like. And I mean, it's obviously a sensible decision that she should take that particular name.

MCCARTNEY: Dickie, is this marriage actually legal?

ARBITER: Yes, it is. There are all sorts of protestations by those in the legal profession. There was even a suggestion from a local vicar that no, they can't get married. It is legal.

The 1846 act was amended in 1949 to allow this. Then there was the 1953 registration act, which sort of put the seal on it. They had to get it right. There was no way they could go ahead with this and suddenly find in years to come that their marriage would have been challenged and to be found illegal. It is very much legal. They are man and wife.

MCCARTNEY: That's wonderful.

We'll be back after the break. Please join us, too.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MCCARTNEY: Welcome back. That is some array of hats.

What did you think of them, India?

HICKS: I thought it was directly out of "Four Weddings and a Funeral," actually, that whole thing with the jazzy music. I thought it was a wonderful turnout, and I thought everybody looked very glamorous, as far as the English do look glamorous. It was very us. It was very garden party. And that's what we do best.

MCCARTNEY: Would you have gone for a big, wide brimmed or one with twigs and fungus hanging off it?

HICKS: Gods, well, twigs and fungus is very "it," aren't they? I actually thought Camilla looked wonderful.

MCCARTNEY: Did you like her hat?

HICKS: I thought it looked wonderful. It's always encouraging to see that a British designer is doing something. And I thought she couldn't have looked, actually -- dare I use the word more regal, and very well-suited and befitting for the occasion.

MCCARTNEY: What about Charles? Do you think he'd be happy that his face was blocked on many angles because the hat was sort of poking out to the side?

HICKS: He's such a good-looking man, I don't think it matters. I think he can take it hat or no hat.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, what did you think of the outfit? How's it gone down in the papers today? Has anything come out?

VICKERS: Well, you know, I don't know about the papers. But I did see the dress in the church, in the chapel, very close to. I mean, I was about three feet away from her. And I mean, I could see the shimmering of the gold thread.

And my first conclusion, as she came around the corner, was that that was as near to a bridal dress that you could get without it actually being a bridal dress, if that makes sense. It was a very sort of pale, blue color, has a kind of very soft brocade.

And it was actually very, very attractive. I agree with India. I think it was a great success. And she also, you know, she looked very touchingly nervous when she was with Prince Charles. And she was also, by the way, very, very, to say, theatrically made-up. I mean, she had very, very heavy make-up on. So she looked pretty good.

MCCARTNEY: It came across very well on TV, but the dress to us looks a little bit of a sort of pale, pale green. So it'd be good to see it in real life. Hopefully, one day, they'll have it up somewhere.

India, your mom went to the wedding. What did she have to say? And little tidbits you can tell us?

HICKS: Well, she was -- you know, I think that the bus idea -- it's not entirely new. That has happened at a number of big European weddings in the past. But I think it is quite a funny idea, all these people on there.

My mother was nervous as to whether she was being terribly off, actually, by wearing her gloves or not. And she said that she got onto her bus, and her bus was full of people wearing gloves. So she felt very at-ease about her glove decision.

I noticed that the queen was also wearing gloves, and I think, (UNINTELLIGIBLE) was, as well. So all generations were wearing their gloves on the buses.

MCCARTNEY: Do you think that's because they were predicting snow, but it didn't actually happen?

HICKS: No, because it's English tradition.

(LAUGHTER)

No, my mother said it was a really wonderful day. She said the smell of the flowers was unbelievable. And I think that would have pleased Charles enormously, because I'm sure he took care about details like that. She said that there were apple blossom trees, actually, in the chapel itself.

And she said the music was sensational. I mean, obviously, the music of the first wedding was world-class, but this time she said was really special, as well, and very interesting to have had a Russian Orthodox woman come in, be flown in from Moscow, to sing.

MCCARTNEY: She sang beautifully, didn't she?

HICKS: Very well.

MCCARTNEY: That was quite amazing.

Patrick, why wasn't there a kiss? Why didn't we get the big smacker?

JEPHSON: Well, I think that second weddings are different. Maybe the enduring image of the first wedding was that kiss. And I think that anything that might have been done in the light of a kiss would have been unfavorably compared with that unforgettable first picture.

I think it's probably representative of the kind of sensitivity that has had to be observed here. I've seen many, many royal occasions, and while I was waiting down by the Guildhall, I certainly sensed a degree of apprehension.

I think one of the reasons there wasn't a walkabout was that nobody was quite sure how the public might react. And certainly, from where I was standing, it was possible to see a couple of banners which were not very pleased about the prince's remarriage.

So no kiss, no walkabout, not very much in the way of contact with the general public yet. I think these are all stages which will follow. But quite sensibly, they're taking it a stage at a time. After all, this marriage does arouse many mixed feelings in the country, and it's only respectful to those whose memories of Diana perhaps make it difficult for them to take much pleasure in today's events, to bear them in mind, too.

MCCARTNEY: Do you think Diana would have put a stamp of approval on this, because she has said in the past, apparently, that Camilla should get some credit?

JEPHSON: Oh, I think India was right. It's always unwise to try and guess what Diana might or might not have thought or said.

But I do know this much: She was a very big-hearted woman. And certainly to me on several occasions towards the end of her life was resigned to the fact that Camilla was a permanent fixture for her husband, and certainly was quite realistic and not particularly hostile to her.

So the crucial element here is that she would have seen that William and Harry appeared quite content with their father's decision, and that would have been enough for her.

MCCARTNEY: And you really think they are content? You don't think that's a front for the public?

JEPHSON: Well, I watched them send Charles and Camilla off from the Guildhall. And of course, we can only guess what might have been in their minds. But certainly, for the cameras, and let's assume that it's genuine, they appear to be quite content.

MCCARTNEY: That's great to hear.

JEPHSON: I wouldn't say that they were beaming from ear-to-ear, but they were -- you know, they did their part. And they did it with obvious sincerity. And I don't think it's possible to ask more of them.

MCCARTNEY: OK, we're going to take a break. And we'll be right back to talk more about the great royal wedding.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MCCARTNEY: Don't you just love the oboe?

Welcome back to our discussion of the royal wedding. I'm Heather Mills McCartney sitting in for Larry King.

After a relationship of more than 30 years, Britain's Prince Charles has made his first love his second wife. Camilla Parker Bowles is now Her Royal Highness, the Duchess of Cornwall.

Still with us, our terrific panel of guests. Here in New York, author and designer, India Hicks. She's Prince Charles' goddaughter and she was a bridesmaid at his first wedding. Joining us from Windsor, Dickie Arbiter, former spokesman for Buckingham Palace. And with him, best-selling biographer, Hugo Vickers, who had a roll in today's post-wedding prayer service. And in London, best-selling author and veteran royal watcher, Robert Lacey. And Patrick Jephson, former private secretary to Princess Diana.

India, why do you think there was so many celebrities at this wedding? The first one, there were so many royals. Why do you think they invited all the celebrities?

HICKS: Well, it's hard to say. I should think at the first one there probably were a number of celebrities, but we are now a celebrity-crazed nation and world. And I'm sure that all the TV channels and presenters were just picking out the celebrities. But it was interesting that there were more celebrities, certainly.

At the first wedding, obviously, it was the biggest gathering of crowned European royals. And this one, there seemed to be many more closer friends than royalty.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, is it because Charles and Camilla have got so many celebrity friends or is because of the supporters of the prince's trust? Why were there so many there today?

VICKERS: Well, a lot of it is certainly supporting the prince's trust. I think that Prince Charles is a great one for entertaining celebrities and also, indeed, very rich people. And I noticed, when looking at the seating plans, that most of the front row in the main were very, very rich people indeed.

I don't think it was any coincidence at all, also, that seated in the choir in his guarded stall was Mrs. HJ Heinz of 57 Varieties and next to her, Lord Rothschild. All these people are great supporters of the prince. So maybe he's saying thank you to them, but he has a habit, also, I have to say, of when he entertains people, he then asks them for a little bit more help in the future.

So I think that there was a very interesting mixture of people today. Of course, the royal family were all there, and one or two members of foreign royal houses, as well. There were certain figures like of the Stephen Fry, indeed, Joan Rivers, who (UNINTELLIGIBLE) and various people like that. And then of course, and then these various rich people. And also, of course, a very strong kind of -- how can I put it -- kind of Gloucester County (UNINTELLIGIBLE) pretty tough, pretty tough.

It was quite difficult. It was quite like a cocktail party in that it was very difficult to get them all into their seats, I have to tell you. They were rushing around. They all knew each other. They all wanted to talk to each other. So it's quite a strong, kind of, county community that Prince Charles has married into, if you like.

MCCARTNEY: Maybe you'll get knighted now, you did such a difficult job.

VICKERS: I think not.

(LAUGHTER)

MCCARTNEY: I thought I'd let you respond to that.

Dickie, could Charles and Camilla have had a religious ceremony if they wanted one?

ARBITER: No, the Church of England is still very much divided on religious remarriage with divorced couples. So, no, they went for the right option.

It's quite interesting that, if you sort of compare today's event, where they had the civil ceremony at the Guildhall and then the religious -- for wont of a better word -- blessing in St. George's Chapel, it's very much how European royals do it. They get married in a civil ceremony first, and then have a church wedding. So they do it twice.

But, no, they went about it the right way here. And you know, as we were saying earlier, that the fact that it happened at the Guildhall brought it out to the great British public rather than having it closeted inside Windsor Castle where people probably wouldn't have seen anything.

MCCARTNEY: Patrick, do you think the TV visuals looked a lot like an actual wedding rather than a blessing?

JEPHSON: Yes, I think they did. That's inevitable. I mean, I think as more and more people are sadly divorced, there is a tendency in second marriages to try and recreate some of the best elements of both the civil and the religious aspects. And that certainly was the case here.

I think anything that underlines the gravity of the commitment that the parties are entering into has got to be encouraged. And in this case, of course, Prince Charles is a great patron of the arts. And it enabled the wedding to become really a bit of a collector's item, in terms of performance as well as religion.

MCCARTNEY: Talking of collector's items, what are they going to do with all those souvenirs with the wrong dates on them, Dickie? JEPHSON: They really now are quite a premium.

MCCARTNEY: What do you think, Dickie?

ARBITER: Oh, I think people will snap them up. They'll want something. And I don't think for a moment that they're going to produce the right date in quantities.

It's quite interesting. There was a shop, almost next door to the Guildhall, selling t-shirts with all sorts of slogans on, some, you know, sort of rather humorous, others in bad taste. And they were also selling souvenirs mugs and plates with the wrong date.

I think the wrong date will be a collector's item, and anybody picking one up with the right date has probably got a valuable item, because I don't think the manufacturers are going to be making many of them.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, are they still letting the royal mail stamps go out with the incorrect date, or did they have a chance to put the proper date on there?

VICKERS: Well, that's a very interesting question. I'm afraid I can't answer, because I don't know whether they actually were going to put the date on. But I imagine that they would change it if they can.

I know that -- you'll be glad to hear that they did change the date on the service sheet, which must be done pretty much at the last minute. So that's correct, at any rate.

MCCARTNEY: OK, well, thanks very much.

We'll be back after the break.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sacrifices of God are a broken spirit, are broken under contract heart, o God, though will not despise. Let us come to the Lord who is full of compassion and acknowledge our transgressions in penitence and faith.

Almighty God, father of our Lord, Jesus Christ, maker of all things, judge of all men, we acknowledge and bewail our manifold sins and wickedness which we, from time to time, most grievously have committed by thought, word and deeds against thy divine majesty.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MCCARTNEY: Two very good-looking chaps there.

Patrick, do you think they seem very relaxed? They did in those pictures.

JEPHSON: Well, I'm sure that they were relaxed, Heather. Don't forget, also, though, that they are now young men rather than boys, and they are also quite seasoned royal performers already.

So this is the way their life is going to be. They're going to spend a great deal of it doing this sort of thing, not obviously at their father's marriage, but they are going to be appearing in public for the rest of their lives. They're going to be having to wearing the right expression for every occasion. And it looks at though they've inherited a lot of their mother's talent of being able to do that.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, did they decorate the honeymoon car?

JEPHSON: I don't think they did. I'm not sure.

(CROSSTALK)

VICKERS: ... think it was decorated.

MCCARTNEY: Sorry?

VICKERS: You wanted me?

MCCARTNEY: Whoever knows the answer.

VICKERS: I think the honeymoon car was certainly decorated with balloons and on the front with "Prince and Duchess," and various hearts and things like that. I wouldn't be at all surprised if some of the youngsters hadn't had a hand in that

MCCARTNEY: India, your mom said that Camilla wasn't actually feeling to good on the day.

HICKS: No, in fact, I think that Camilla was suffering terribly from sinus problems this morning. I mean, extremely understandable, I'm sure, after the enormous pressure she's been put through in the past couple of months, if you think how poisoning the effect of the press must have been on a time like this and how hard they work.

Prince Charles in the past two months, in fact since announcing his engagement, has done 25 public engagements. He's hosted seven dinners for charitable causes. He's video-supported a further seven messages. He's done official tours of four countries, during which he attended more than 30 public events, not to mention his own personal correspondence. And he receives over 33,000 letters a year.

Can you imagine if you and I ever tried to do anything like that in the two months leading up to your wedding?

MCCARTNEY: And on top of that, Camilla's kept a very dignified silence.

HICKS: A very dignified silence. In fact, she remains rather a sort of public enigma, because some -- we really are left to the testimony of others about Camilla, because she has never shared anything, quite rightly so. Unlike Diana, who shared her sorrow with the general public, Camilla has never spoken at all. And I think we will -- as Hugo said -- we will now just begin to get to know this extraordinary woman.

MCCARTNEY: Robert, why do you think the British media wastes so much space on the negative and don't talk about the great work that the prince does to inspire the up-and-coming generation?

LACEY: I couldn't agree with you more. I wish they did more. There was a very candid editor on one of the television programs the other day who said -- this is perhaps more about Camilla than about Charles -- that when you had Diana, put her on a newspaper cover or whatever, the sales leapt up. They've discovered that when they put Camilla on the cover, the sales go down, unless, he said, they make fun of Camilla or criticize her, and then the sales are restored.

Now, these are very hard-headed men and women. And you know, Charles and Camilla have -- let's be honest -- have got a pretty tough challenge on their hands. There's been an enormous momentum of malice, I think, in the last month or so, sort of schaudenfraude, delight in the succession of misfortunes. Let's hope now it changes and that the goodwill engendered by today will let everybody give the couple a fair chance.

MCCARTNEY: Patrick, do you think that Charles seemed a lot jollier today than he did on his recent ski trip?

JEPHSON: Well, it would be hard not to appear jollier than on the ski trip, when certainly, in front of the cameras, he appeared to be rather grumpy. I was struck by his smile when he left St. George's Chapel.

It's one of the most relaxed and genuine smiles I've ever seen on his face. And I think that, if that's the sign of things to come, then the good press will follow. I think that it's worth remembering that the press aren't in the business of supporting or knocking people. They're in the business of selling newspapers and magazines. That generally involves a cycle of building up for a week and knocking down for a week.

The prince and Camilla have endured several weeks of being knocked. There's every chance that they'll enjoy several weeks of being given a very easy and positive ride by the press.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, do you think that this marriage would have happened had Diana been alive?

JEPHSON: You mean, if Diana had been alive, yes...

(CROSSTALK)

JEPHSON: That's a very big question.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo?

VICKERS: I think that's a very, very big -- yes, that's a very big question. I think eventually it will have happened anyway, but I think it would have been a great deal more difficult. And I actually think that it's -- in a way, I'm still a little bit stunned that it happened the way that it did.

Because a few weeks ago, it still seemed to be absolutely impossible. And then suddenly we were told it was going to happen and that it was all all right. And now it's happened. So it's amazing what can be achieved, really.

I think it would been more difficult if she had been alive. But you know, as Patrick has said, you know, she accepted that Camilla was a big part of his life and was always going to be there, and so, you know, who knows what would have happened? But it would have been much more difficult.

MCCARTNEY: Dickie, is it true that Camilla actually helped vet Diana for Prince Charles?

ARBITER: Sorry, I missed that. It didn't come through.

MCCARTNEY: Did Camilla help vet Diana for Prince Charles when he married her?

ARBITER: Well, you know, there is a tendency that myths become fact. And it's one of those things that's grown up. I suppose that, as she's been around for over 30 years now, and it's certainly been around for a number of years, when the Prince of Wales met the Lady Diana Spencer that, yes, she might well have passed some sort of tick in the box, or in several boxes.

I don't think it's a question of vetting. What people don't seem to understand is that, irrespective of what he said on the day of the engagement when asked by an interviewer so much in love, and Diana said, "Yes," very quickly, and he rather hesitatingly said, "Yes, whatever in love means."

They did actually love each other at the beginning. And right at the very beginning, they couldn't keep their hands off each other. But it just didn't work out in these successive years.

So Camilla might well have ticked a few boxes. But they did love each other.

MCCARTNEY: India, do you really think they loved each other? I mean, you were at the wedding.

HICKS: I think love comes in an enormous different variety, like 57 Heinz. I think it must be an enormous relief to Camilla and Charles now to have their 34-year affair on a more conventional footing.

MCCARTNEY: Do you wish them all the best?

HICKS: Of course I do.

MCCARTNEY: We'll talk more. We'll come right back after the break. We're talking royal wedding, Charles and Camilla.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) MCCARTNEY: Welcome back. We're still talking about the fantastically wonderful royal wedding.

India, do you think that the king -- the future king, Prince Charles -- would be a better one if he had a strong woman like Camilla by his side, as he does now? Do you think that will make him a better person?

HICKS: I think that before, if and when he succeeds to be monarch, I think before that, I think there are (UNINTELLIGIBLE) the Prince of Wales was not positioned, it was a predicament. And I think that is very true.

And I think if Charles is able to have the woman who can steer him through that predicament by his side, it is going to help him enormously. She's obviously a woman of humorous warmth, and resilience, and strength, and courage. And I think that that will help Charles to be, if indeed he does become a monarch, a very good monarch.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, do you think he ever will become our monarch? Do you think the queen will step aside or is she going to serve until the day she dies?

VICKERS: Heather, the queen must not step aside, and she won't. She was anointed as queen, and she will serve until the end. Obviously, Prince Charles could take on certain extra duties and make things a little bit easier for her. And taking as he does already a lot of foreign chores and that kind of thing.

But of course, as you know, when the queen dies, he will succeed her automatically. And he will then become king. And instead though, some people talk about whether or not she's going to be queen. She will automatically be queen. And even they pass some civil list act, they're not going to do that on the day he succeeds. So she will automatically be queen, whatever she calls herself. That's going to be the case.

MCCARTNEY: Robert, where are they going on their honeymoon, and how long are they going to get?

LACEY: They're up in Scotland, which is their favorite place, in Birkhall, which is a big house close to Balmoral, where the Queen Mother used to spend her summers with Princess Margaret. I think we're actually going to get a chance to see them tomorrow.

They're going to church tomorrow, so we'll be able to see how they look after their honeymoon night. They certainly left early enough to get started. And then next Wednesday, Thursday, I think, they'll be opening a child's playground in one of the Scottish villages near Balmoral.

Interesting, the photo opportunity for Charles and Diana, they stood in a stream romantically. Sorry, for Diana and Charles. For Camilla, she's getting straight down to work with official duties. And well, that'll be the first time we see the Duchess of Cornwall actually opening something.

MCCARTNEY: Dickie, do you think Camilla has to really worry about security with the Diana fanatics out there?

ARBITER: No, I don't think so. I think certainly this engagement that she's doing next Thursday in Scotland -- the Scots, particularly in that area, around Balmoral and Birkhall, the Ballater area, they're very sympathetic to the royals. And they're very fond of the royals because they spend all summer up there, and certainly the Prince of Wales and his new bride will spend a lot of time up there in the autumn.

So they're sympathetic. So I think people will soften their attitudes. I just hope that there is no element of spin. That is the last thing that is needed. We saw that a few years ago when the press office at Clarence House was sort of outing the then-Camilla Parker Bowles. She doesn't need spin. She's got enough strength and enough wherewithal to be able to do the job herself.

And what she does have, and what India was saying, she has a lot of strength. And the Prince of Wales needs a lot of strength behind him, pretty much like his grandmother was the driving force behind his grandfather, Queen Elizabeth behind George...

(CROSSTALK)

MCCARTNEY: Thank you so much. We've got to go now. I just want to thank all our guests, India Hicks, Dickie Arbiter, Hugo Vickers, Robert Lacey, and Patrick Jephson.

Just a quick note before we go. The reason I was here tonight instead of Larry is that his gorgeous and talented wife, Shawn, is singing in Atlantic City, and he wanted to be there for her. A great husband, what more can we want?

Let's hope Charles and Camilla will be there for each other for many, many years, now that they're finally married. Whatever you think of their relationship, and heaven knows it hasn't been easy one, their love has endured. To the prince and his new royal duchess, best wishes for a long and happy life together.

Up next, a royal wedding special hosted by CNN's Anderson Cooper, Becky Anderson, and Richard Quest.

I'm Heather Mills McCartney. Thanks for watching.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com


Aired April 9, 2005 - 21:00   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
HEATHER MILLS MCCARTNEY, CNN GUEST HOST: Tonight, the royal wedding in Windsor. Prince Charles and Camilla Parker Bowles say, "I do."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PRINCE CHARLES, PRINCE OF WALES: That is my resolve with the help of God.

CAMILLA PARKER BOWLES, DUCHESS OF CORNWALL: That is my resolve with the help of God.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MCCARTNEY: Some thing it's about time. Others, that it never should have happened. What does this marriage mean for the British monarchy? And will Camilla ever be queen?

It's all next on LARRY KING LIVE.

Thank you so much for joining us tonight. I'm Heather Mills McCartney, sitting in for Larry King.

Well, it's been more than three decades since their first meeting, with two failed marriages, four children and lots and lots of headlines in between. But Britain's Prince Charles and Camilla Parker Bowles are finally husband and wife.

Joining us to talk about the royal wedding, India Hicks, who is with me in New York. India is Prince Charles' goddaughter. She was a bridesmaid when he married Lady Diana Spencer in 1981. She's also a superb designer. Her mother attended today's wedding events.

And joining us from Windsor, England, Dickie Arbiter, a former spokesman for Buckingham Palace. In London, Robert Lacey, best- selling author and veteran royal watcher. And with him, Patrick Jephson, former private secretary to Princess Diana. Patrick is the author of "Portraits of a Princess." In Windsor, best-selling biographer Hugo Vickers. Hugo was a steward -- believe it or not -- for today's prayer service in St. George's Chapel.

Hugo, that was a quite an honor. What did that entail?

HUGO VICKERS, SERVED IN WEDDING: Well, when I was school, I used to show tourists around St. George's Chapel. And when I left school, they made be a lay steward. So I've been there for -- I hate to say -- 35 years. That meant that we were putting people into their seats. And because I've been there for such a long time, I was actually in the choir, which was a central bit, seating members of the royal family and the other guests. So that was rather interesting.

MCCARTNEY: Fantastic.

India, your mom was there. Did you get a call from her? Did you hear anything?

INDIA HICKS, AUTHOR: I did. I spoke to my mother earlier this evening. In fact, she said she'd seen Hugo there tonight, had a little chat at the door.

She just remarked on what a wonderful, wonderful service it was, a very cozy feeling to the whole day.

MCCARTNEY: Robert, what did you think of today's wonderful marriage?

ROBERT LACEY, ROYALS BIOGRAPHER: Well, there was a terrible moment when the Archbishop of Canterbury said, "Charles and Camilla, you have committed...yourselves to each other." And I thought that the dreaded a-word was going to be issued.

There was a sense of apprehension. But in the event, it just went off marvelously. And I think, also, serendipity of the service down in the town in the Guildhall where lots of other people were also getting married that day. It had seemed before the event this was going to be a mistake, a catastrophe. The queen wasn't going to go there.

In the event, it was a masterstroke. And it really gave the whole thing a wonderful, homely and English country town atmosphere.

MCCARTNEY: Dickie, you said last year on LARRY KING that you really didn't think they'd ever get married. What have you got to say about that now?

DICKIE ARBITER, FORMER PRESS OFFICER TO QUEEN: Well, I'm going to eat my words. I suppose deep down inside I felt that the relationship did have to be formalized. And there is no way that the Prince of Wales, when he becomes king, could take a mistress to his coronation.

And there was really probably an ultimatum from the queen, "Either formalize the relationship or, you know, get rid of her as a girlfriend, because you cannot keep going on with this lady in tow as a mistress." So she went into the Guildhall this morning as a mistress, and she came out 20 minutes later as a ma'am.

MCCARTNEY: Patrick, do you feel the queen snubbed the ceremony or do you think there was more to it than that?

PATRICK JEPHSON, PRINCESS DIANA'S FORMER SECRETARY: I don't think the queen snubbed the ceremony. There's been some ill-informed speculation that the queen thought that the Guildhall part of the day was in some way beneath her. I don't think that's true at all. On the other hand, it is a fact that this marriage has produced some very mixed feelings in the country as a whole. The queen has to remember, and in fact, has no difficulty remembering, that she is queen for the country, those who are pro the marriage, those who are against it. And by just keeping one arm's length apart for the first part of the day, I think she very skillfully managed to satisfy both camps.

MCCARTNEY: Robert, who plans this type of event? Does Camilla get much of a say?

ROBERT LACEY, ROYALS BIOGRAPHY: Yes, but it was very interesting. One saw a lot of Sir Malcolm Ross, who is head of the Lord Chamberlain's Office, who did Diana's funeral and was behind the jubilee, planning every detail right down to the buses that were used at quite a lot of stages of the ceremony. It all went off so smoothly. As an old coward once said, "These royal events are the sort of things that the British overdo so well."

And I think symbolically it marked the real embrace of Camilla into the royal family. The whole royal machine went into action to make this woman welcome and to make it clear to the country that, whatever happened in the past, the queen is foursquare behind her and Prince Charles, and that this is a new step forward for the Prince of Wales. And his mistress, as Dickie said, who is now a ma'am, indeed, a royal highness, the Duchess of Cornwall.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, do you think the British public will ever really accept Camilla?

VICKERS: They might. But I think it will take a little while. And I think it will all be played rather quietly and cautiously, as it should be. I think they'll try her out on various different kinds of royal engagements, and if it works, she'll do more and more. And if it doesn't work, I think then she'll spend a little bit more time in the country.

I think it's very much an open book, to be quite honest. I think that there was a change in mood in the course of this week, because as you know, everything's been pretty disastrous and chaotic.

But I think when they actually changed the wedding, I think a lot of people felt a great deal of sympathy for them, obviously, because of the Pope's funeral, because suddenly they were doing something -- you know, responding to some outer thing rather than telling us the whole time what they wanted to do.

Clarence House kept issuing these statements. And then, of course, the legal people and all sorts of other people told them, "Well, I'm sorry, you may think that. But that's not the case. You can't do it." But I think when they went to Westminster Cathedral on Monday to attend a vespa (ph) for the Pope, they looked just sort of so battered and worn down, I think people really felt, "Goodness me, they've gone through so much. Give them a break."

MCCARTNEY: India, this was a much more low-key event than when you bridesmaid at Diana and Charles' wedding. Why'd you think that is?

HICKS: Oh, for a whole host of reasons. But I think most second marriages are very different from their first. I think that when Prince Charles married the first time, he was the most eligible bachelor in the world. And to emerge from that union would be an heir to the throne. This time round, of course, none of those factors mattered.

And obviously, the first time, you know, there were 750 million viewers. This time round, I think there was understandably a lot less interest, not because people don't care but just that it's a different wedding entirely.

MCCARTNEY: How do you think Diana would have felt about this?

HICKS: I have no idea how Diana felt or would think about this. I can only assume that, since her sons have accepted Camilla warmly and graciously into their family, she would be pleased.

MCCARTNEY: And you think they really have?

HICKS: I think they really have.

MCCARTNEY: Wonderful.

OK, we're going to take a break. And then we'll come back and talk more about husband and wife, Charles and Camilla.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Charles, have you resolved to be faithful to your wife, forsaking all others, so long as you both shall live?

PRINCE CHARLES: That is my resolve, with the help of God.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Camilla, have you resolved to be faithful to your husband, forsaking all others, so long as you both shall live?

BOWLES: That is my resolve, with the help of God.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Heavenly father, by thy blessing, let these rings be to Charles and Camilla a symbol of unending love and faithfulness, and of the promises they have made to each other, through Jesus Christ, our Lord.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MCCARTNEY: What an exciting day for all of us, and especially for the royal family.

Patrick, Camilla stumbled a little bit on the "I'll be faithful with the Lord's help -- help." Is there any significance in that?

JEPHSON: Not at all, I suspect, Heather. I don't suppose that many of us who have got married managed to do it word perfect. And I don't suppose the sort of thing that they rehearsed very much.

MCCARTNEY: Dickie, what's the streaker, a royal first?

ARBITER: I think the streaker was just somebody out for a little bit of fun during the course of the day. I mean, on the whole, the crowd were very happy. It was a big crowd, given there wasn't a lot for them to see. All they saw was the car coming from the long walk from Cambridge Gate to the Guildhall, which is about a 500-meter drive and back again.

There was no walkabout, which is a great pity, I think, given the reception they got when they arrived, an even bigger reception when they came out as man and wife. I don't think a walkabout would have gone amiss. And likewise, when they left the castle, there was a very fast drive rather than a slow drive, because, remember, people had been waiting about two, three hours just to catch a glimpse of them. And I think that drive was a little bit too fast.

But on the whole, it was a great day. And the people that came thoroughly enjoyed themselves.

MCCARTNEY: India, do you think there was security reasons behind that, because there were apparently a couple of boos, so it would be a bit risky?

HICKS: No, I think it's simply much more practical than that. I think because of the date change that they had to do it then on the Saturday, and I think because they were in Guildhall, there were a number of other people queuing up to have their wedding vows made in there afterwards. And they simply had to move on, I would say that the other could come in.

I mean, just, again, it shows that the monarchy is moving towards a more informal atmosphere, which is what I think the country's been asking for.

MCCARTNEY: Robert, that really shows with the transport, doesn't it? What did you think of it?

LACEY: Yes, you mean the buses and things, yes? Yes, I agree with India. It does show the monarchy moving in tune with the times. Although, as I said at the beginning, sort of accidentally, because the original plan, of course, was to have the Guildhall service up in the castle.

And I think we can now see what a blessing it was that they discovered that, if they held it in the castle, the castle would then become a venue for all sorts of other people's weddings. Maybe that's not a bad idea. Maybe we'll see that in the age of the democratic monarchy.

But certainly, that atmosphere down in town was a total surprise to me, and I think to everybody. And also the goodwill of people -- I mean, there were a few boos. But the loudest boos, I thought, were when they got straight into the car and didn't do the walkabout. And again, I agree with Dickie. I'm sure they could have found a way to do a walkabout away from the registry office that wouldn't have detracted from the other people who went there. But I think they were scared, frankly.

There's been such an incredible amount of hostile press in this country which has given platforms to people of all sorts of cranky persuasions to sound off about the wedding that the only real walkabout was at the end in the Horseshoe Cloister inside Windsor in sort of safe environments.

But I'm sure, over the months that come, we'll see them getting braver and getting into the crowds. And let's hope they get a warm reception.

MCCARTNEY: Do you think the British media will eventually accept them, and back off, and give them a break?

LACEY: Yes, I think they will. That's the thing I noted today. When Camilla (UNINTELLIGIBLE) in the Horseshoe Cloister, where she was mingling with friends of Prince Charles and charity workers. But there were real smiles and smiles back, and personal contact. I mean, this is no Diana. But she's obviously got a good heart and a good will, and I think people will respond to that.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, do you think it's fair to say that there have been a huge amount of bumbles and fumbles in their lead-up to this wedding?

VICKERS: Well, I certainly do. I mean, every since from the start. And I don't quite know whether that just comes from a certain indecisiveness or whether people of Clarence House, the prince's office, have a habit of saying which then later on prove to be not the case.

I mean, I've found myself saying a little bit -- it's like if I tell you I want to go and drive down the motorway at 100 miles an hour, and you tell me, actually, there's a speed limit at 70 miles an hour, that they were telling us -- which you can understand why -- what they wanted to happen. And then all sorts of people popped up to tell them, "Well, actually, that's not the case."

You know, like the title. I mean, you know, she's going to be called the Duchess of Cornwall. But actually, of course, officially, she is the Princess of Wales. But you can call yourself what you'd like. And I mean, it's obviously a sensible decision that she should take that particular name.

MCCARTNEY: Dickie, is this marriage actually legal?

ARBITER: Yes, it is. There are all sorts of protestations by those in the legal profession. There was even a suggestion from a local vicar that no, they can't get married. It is legal.

The 1846 act was amended in 1949 to allow this. Then there was the 1953 registration act, which sort of put the seal on it. They had to get it right. There was no way they could go ahead with this and suddenly find in years to come that their marriage would have been challenged and to be found illegal. It is very much legal. They are man and wife.

MCCARTNEY: That's wonderful.

We'll be back after the break. Please join us, too.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MCCARTNEY: Welcome back. That is some array of hats.

What did you think of them, India?

HICKS: I thought it was directly out of "Four Weddings and a Funeral," actually, that whole thing with the jazzy music. I thought it was a wonderful turnout, and I thought everybody looked very glamorous, as far as the English do look glamorous. It was very us. It was very garden party. And that's what we do best.

MCCARTNEY: Would you have gone for a big, wide brimmed or one with twigs and fungus hanging off it?

HICKS: Gods, well, twigs and fungus is very "it," aren't they? I actually thought Camilla looked wonderful.

MCCARTNEY: Did you like her hat?

HICKS: I thought it looked wonderful. It's always encouraging to see that a British designer is doing something. And I thought she couldn't have looked, actually -- dare I use the word more regal, and very well-suited and befitting for the occasion.

MCCARTNEY: What about Charles? Do you think he'd be happy that his face was blocked on many angles because the hat was sort of poking out to the side?

HICKS: He's such a good-looking man, I don't think it matters. I think he can take it hat or no hat.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, what did you think of the outfit? How's it gone down in the papers today? Has anything come out?

VICKERS: Well, you know, I don't know about the papers. But I did see the dress in the church, in the chapel, very close to. I mean, I was about three feet away from her. And I mean, I could see the shimmering of the gold thread.

And my first conclusion, as she came around the corner, was that that was as near to a bridal dress that you could get without it actually being a bridal dress, if that makes sense. It was a very sort of pale, blue color, has a kind of very soft brocade.

And it was actually very, very attractive. I agree with India. I think it was a great success. And she also, you know, she looked very touchingly nervous when she was with Prince Charles. And she was also, by the way, very, very, to say, theatrically made-up. I mean, she had very, very heavy make-up on. So she looked pretty good.

MCCARTNEY: It came across very well on TV, but the dress to us looks a little bit of a sort of pale, pale green. So it'd be good to see it in real life. Hopefully, one day, they'll have it up somewhere.

India, your mom went to the wedding. What did she have to say? And little tidbits you can tell us?

HICKS: Well, she was -- you know, I think that the bus idea -- it's not entirely new. That has happened at a number of big European weddings in the past. But I think it is quite a funny idea, all these people on there.

My mother was nervous as to whether she was being terribly off, actually, by wearing her gloves or not. And she said that she got onto her bus, and her bus was full of people wearing gloves. So she felt very at-ease about her glove decision.

I noticed that the queen was also wearing gloves, and I think, (UNINTELLIGIBLE) was, as well. So all generations were wearing their gloves on the buses.

MCCARTNEY: Do you think that's because they were predicting snow, but it didn't actually happen?

HICKS: No, because it's English tradition.

(LAUGHTER)

No, my mother said it was a really wonderful day. She said the smell of the flowers was unbelievable. And I think that would have pleased Charles enormously, because I'm sure he took care about details like that. She said that there were apple blossom trees, actually, in the chapel itself.

And she said the music was sensational. I mean, obviously, the music of the first wedding was world-class, but this time she said was really special, as well, and very interesting to have had a Russian Orthodox woman come in, be flown in from Moscow, to sing.

MCCARTNEY: She sang beautifully, didn't she?

HICKS: Very well.

MCCARTNEY: That was quite amazing.

Patrick, why wasn't there a kiss? Why didn't we get the big smacker?

JEPHSON: Well, I think that second weddings are different. Maybe the enduring image of the first wedding was that kiss. And I think that anything that might have been done in the light of a kiss would have been unfavorably compared with that unforgettable first picture.

I think it's probably representative of the kind of sensitivity that has had to be observed here. I've seen many, many royal occasions, and while I was waiting down by the Guildhall, I certainly sensed a degree of apprehension.

I think one of the reasons there wasn't a walkabout was that nobody was quite sure how the public might react. And certainly, from where I was standing, it was possible to see a couple of banners which were not very pleased about the prince's remarriage.

So no kiss, no walkabout, not very much in the way of contact with the general public yet. I think these are all stages which will follow. But quite sensibly, they're taking it a stage at a time. After all, this marriage does arouse many mixed feelings in the country, and it's only respectful to those whose memories of Diana perhaps make it difficult for them to take much pleasure in today's events, to bear them in mind, too.

MCCARTNEY: Do you think Diana would have put a stamp of approval on this, because she has said in the past, apparently, that Camilla should get some credit?

JEPHSON: Oh, I think India was right. It's always unwise to try and guess what Diana might or might not have thought or said.

But I do know this much: She was a very big-hearted woman. And certainly to me on several occasions towards the end of her life was resigned to the fact that Camilla was a permanent fixture for her husband, and certainly was quite realistic and not particularly hostile to her.

So the crucial element here is that she would have seen that William and Harry appeared quite content with their father's decision, and that would have been enough for her.

MCCARTNEY: And you really think they are content? You don't think that's a front for the public?

JEPHSON: Well, I watched them send Charles and Camilla off from the Guildhall. And of course, we can only guess what might have been in their minds. But certainly, for the cameras, and let's assume that it's genuine, they appear to be quite content.

MCCARTNEY: That's great to hear.

JEPHSON: I wouldn't say that they were beaming from ear-to-ear, but they were -- you know, they did their part. And they did it with obvious sincerity. And I don't think it's possible to ask more of them.

MCCARTNEY: OK, we're going to take a break. And we'll be right back to talk more about the great royal wedding.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MCCARTNEY: Don't you just love the oboe?

Welcome back to our discussion of the royal wedding. I'm Heather Mills McCartney sitting in for Larry King.

After a relationship of more than 30 years, Britain's Prince Charles has made his first love his second wife. Camilla Parker Bowles is now Her Royal Highness, the Duchess of Cornwall.

Still with us, our terrific panel of guests. Here in New York, author and designer, India Hicks. She's Prince Charles' goddaughter and she was a bridesmaid at his first wedding. Joining us from Windsor, Dickie Arbiter, former spokesman for Buckingham Palace. And with him, best-selling biographer, Hugo Vickers, who had a roll in today's post-wedding prayer service. And in London, best-selling author and veteran royal watcher, Robert Lacey. And Patrick Jephson, former private secretary to Princess Diana.

India, why do you think there was so many celebrities at this wedding? The first one, there were so many royals. Why do you think they invited all the celebrities?

HICKS: Well, it's hard to say. I should think at the first one there probably were a number of celebrities, but we are now a celebrity-crazed nation and world. And I'm sure that all the TV channels and presenters were just picking out the celebrities. But it was interesting that there were more celebrities, certainly.

At the first wedding, obviously, it was the biggest gathering of crowned European royals. And this one, there seemed to be many more closer friends than royalty.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, is it because Charles and Camilla have got so many celebrity friends or is because of the supporters of the prince's trust? Why were there so many there today?

VICKERS: Well, a lot of it is certainly supporting the prince's trust. I think that Prince Charles is a great one for entertaining celebrities and also, indeed, very rich people. And I noticed, when looking at the seating plans, that most of the front row in the main were very, very rich people indeed.

I don't think it was any coincidence at all, also, that seated in the choir in his guarded stall was Mrs. HJ Heinz of 57 Varieties and next to her, Lord Rothschild. All these people are great supporters of the prince. So maybe he's saying thank you to them, but he has a habit, also, I have to say, of when he entertains people, he then asks them for a little bit more help in the future.

So I think that there was a very interesting mixture of people today. Of course, the royal family were all there, and one or two members of foreign royal houses, as well. There were certain figures like of the Stephen Fry, indeed, Joan Rivers, who (UNINTELLIGIBLE) and various people like that. And then of course, and then these various rich people. And also, of course, a very strong kind of -- how can I put it -- kind of Gloucester County (UNINTELLIGIBLE) pretty tough, pretty tough.

It was quite difficult. It was quite like a cocktail party in that it was very difficult to get them all into their seats, I have to tell you. They were rushing around. They all knew each other. They all wanted to talk to each other. So it's quite a strong, kind of, county community that Prince Charles has married into, if you like.

MCCARTNEY: Maybe you'll get knighted now, you did such a difficult job.

VICKERS: I think not.

(LAUGHTER)

MCCARTNEY: I thought I'd let you respond to that.

Dickie, could Charles and Camilla have had a religious ceremony if they wanted one?

ARBITER: No, the Church of England is still very much divided on religious remarriage with divorced couples. So, no, they went for the right option.

It's quite interesting that, if you sort of compare today's event, where they had the civil ceremony at the Guildhall and then the religious -- for wont of a better word -- blessing in St. George's Chapel, it's very much how European royals do it. They get married in a civil ceremony first, and then have a church wedding. So they do it twice.

But, no, they went about it the right way here. And you know, as we were saying earlier, that the fact that it happened at the Guildhall brought it out to the great British public rather than having it closeted inside Windsor Castle where people probably wouldn't have seen anything.

MCCARTNEY: Patrick, do you think the TV visuals looked a lot like an actual wedding rather than a blessing?

JEPHSON: Yes, I think they did. That's inevitable. I mean, I think as more and more people are sadly divorced, there is a tendency in second marriages to try and recreate some of the best elements of both the civil and the religious aspects. And that certainly was the case here.

I think anything that underlines the gravity of the commitment that the parties are entering into has got to be encouraged. And in this case, of course, Prince Charles is a great patron of the arts. And it enabled the wedding to become really a bit of a collector's item, in terms of performance as well as religion.

MCCARTNEY: Talking of collector's items, what are they going to do with all those souvenirs with the wrong dates on them, Dickie? JEPHSON: They really now are quite a premium.

MCCARTNEY: What do you think, Dickie?

ARBITER: Oh, I think people will snap them up. They'll want something. And I don't think for a moment that they're going to produce the right date in quantities.

It's quite interesting. There was a shop, almost next door to the Guildhall, selling t-shirts with all sorts of slogans on, some, you know, sort of rather humorous, others in bad taste. And they were also selling souvenirs mugs and plates with the wrong date.

I think the wrong date will be a collector's item, and anybody picking one up with the right date has probably got a valuable item, because I don't think the manufacturers are going to be making many of them.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, are they still letting the royal mail stamps go out with the incorrect date, or did they have a chance to put the proper date on there?

VICKERS: Well, that's a very interesting question. I'm afraid I can't answer, because I don't know whether they actually were going to put the date on. But I imagine that they would change it if they can.

I know that -- you'll be glad to hear that they did change the date on the service sheet, which must be done pretty much at the last minute. So that's correct, at any rate.

MCCARTNEY: OK, well, thanks very much.

We'll be back after the break.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sacrifices of God are a broken spirit, are broken under contract heart, o God, though will not despise. Let us come to the Lord who is full of compassion and acknowledge our transgressions in penitence and faith.

Almighty God, father of our Lord, Jesus Christ, maker of all things, judge of all men, we acknowledge and bewail our manifold sins and wickedness which we, from time to time, most grievously have committed by thought, word and deeds against thy divine majesty.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MCCARTNEY: Two very good-looking chaps there.

Patrick, do you think they seem very relaxed? They did in those pictures.

JEPHSON: Well, I'm sure that they were relaxed, Heather. Don't forget, also, though, that they are now young men rather than boys, and they are also quite seasoned royal performers already.

So this is the way their life is going to be. They're going to spend a great deal of it doing this sort of thing, not obviously at their father's marriage, but they are going to be appearing in public for the rest of their lives. They're going to be having to wearing the right expression for every occasion. And it looks at though they've inherited a lot of their mother's talent of being able to do that.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, did they decorate the honeymoon car?

JEPHSON: I don't think they did. I'm not sure.

(CROSSTALK)

VICKERS: ... think it was decorated.

MCCARTNEY: Sorry?

VICKERS: You wanted me?

MCCARTNEY: Whoever knows the answer.

VICKERS: I think the honeymoon car was certainly decorated with balloons and on the front with "Prince and Duchess," and various hearts and things like that. I wouldn't be at all surprised if some of the youngsters hadn't had a hand in that

MCCARTNEY: India, your mom said that Camilla wasn't actually feeling to good on the day.

HICKS: No, in fact, I think that Camilla was suffering terribly from sinus problems this morning. I mean, extremely understandable, I'm sure, after the enormous pressure she's been put through in the past couple of months, if you think how poisoning the effect of the press must have been on a time like this and how hard they work.

Prince Charles in the past two months, in fact since announcing his engagement, has done 25 public engagements. He's hosted seven dinners for charitable causes. He's video-supported a further seven messages. He's done official tours of four countries, during which he attended more than 30 public events, not to mention his own personal correspondence. And he receives over 33,000 letters a year.

Can you imagine if you and I ever tried to do anything like that in the two months leading up to your wedding?

MCCARTNEY: And on top of that, Camilla's kept a very dignified silence.

HICKS: A very dignified silence. In fact, she remains rather a sort of public enigma, because some -- we really are left to the testimony of others about Camilla, because she has never shared anything, quite rightly so. Unlike Diana, who shared her sorrow with the general public, Camilla has never spoken at all. And I think we will -- as Hugo said -- we will now just begin to get to know this extraordinary woman.

MCCARTNEY: Robert, why do you think the British media wastes so much space on the negative and don't talk about the great work that the prince does to inspire the up-and-coming generation?

LACEY: I couldn't agree with you more. I wish they did more. There was a very candid editor on one of the television programs the other day who said -- this is perhaps more about Camilla than about Charles -- that when you had Diana, put her on a newspaper cover or whatever, the sales leapt up. They've discovered that when they put Camilla on the cover, the sales go down, unless, he said, they make fun of Camilla or criticize her, and then the sales are restored.

Now, these are very hard-headed men and women. And you know, Charles and Camilla have -- let's be honest -- have got a pretty tough challenge on their hands. There's been an enormous momentum of malice, I think, in the last month or so, sort of schaudenfraude, delight in the succession of misfortunes. Let's hope now it changes and that the goodwill engendered by today will let everybody give the couple a fair chance.

MCCARTNEY: Patrick, do you think that Charles seemed a lot jollier today than he did on his recent ski trip?

JEPHSON: Well, it would be hard not to appear jollier than on the ski trip, when certainly, in front of the cameras, he appeared to be rather grumpy. I was struck by his smile when he left St. George's Chapel.

It's one of the most relaxed and genuine smiles I've ever seen on his face. And I think that, if that's the sign of things to come, then the good press will follow. I think that it's worth remembering that the press aren't in the business of supporting or knocking people. They're in the business of selling newspapers and magazines. That generally involves a cycle of building up for a week and knocking down for a week.

The prince and Camilla have endured several weeks of being knocked. There's every chance that they'll enjoy several weeks of being given a very easy and positive ride by the press.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, do you think that this marriage would have happened had Diana been alive?

JEPHSON: You mean, if Diana had been alive, yes...

(CROSSTALK)

JEPHSON: That's a very big question.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo?

VICKERS: I think that's a very, very big -- yes, that's a very big question. I think eventually it will have happened anyway, but I think it would have been a great deal more difficult. And I actually think that it's -- in a way, I'm still a little bit stunned that it happened the way that it did.

Because a few weeks ago, it still seemed to be absolutely impossible. And then suddenly we were told it was going to happen and that it was all all right. And now it's happened. So it's amazing what can be achieved, really.

I think it would been more difficult if she had been alive. But you know, as Patrick has said, you know, she accepted that Camilla was a big part of his life and was always going to be there, and so, you know, who knows what would have happened? But it would have been much more difficult.

MCCARTNEY: Dickie, is it true that Camilla actually helped vet Diana for Prince Charles?

ARBITER: Sorry, I missed that. It didn't come through.

MCCARTNEY: Did Camilla help vet Diana for Prince Charles when he married her?

ARBITER: Well, you know, there is a tendency that myths become fact. And it's one of those things that's grown up. I suppose that, as she's been around for over 30 years now, and it's certainly been around for a number of years, when the Prince of Wales met the Lady Diana Spencer that, yes, she might well have passed some sort of tick in the box, or in several boxes.

I don't think it's a question of vetting. What people don't seem to understand is that, irrespective of what he said on the day of the engagement when asked by an interviewer so much in love, and Diana said, "Yes," very quickly, and he rather hesitatingly said, "Yes, whatever in love means."

They did actually love each other at the beginning. And right at the very beginning, they couldn't keep their hands off each other. But it just didn't work out in these successive years.

So Camilla might well have ticked a few boxes. But they did love each other.

MCCARTNEY: India, do you really think they loved each other? I mean, you were at the wedding.

HICKS: I think love comes in an enormous different variety, like 57 Heinz. I think it must be an enormous relief to Camilla and Charles now to have their 34-year affair on a more conventional footing.

MCCARTNEY: Do you wish them all the best?

HICKS: Of course I do.

MCCARTNEY: We'll talk more. We'll come right back after the break. We're talking royal wedding, Charles and Camilla.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) MCCARTNEY: Welcome back. We're still talking about the fantastically wonderful royal wedding.

India, do you think that the king -- the future king, Prince Charles -- would be a better one if he had a strong woman like Camilla by his side, as he does now? Do you think that will make him a better person?

HICKS: I think that before, if and when he succeeds to be monarch, I think before that, I think there are (UNINTELLIGIBLE) the Prince of Wales was not positioned, it was a predicament. And I think that is very true.

And I think if Charles is able to have the woman who can steer him through that predicament by his side, it is going to help him enormously. She's obviously a woman of humorous warmth, and resilience, and strength, and courage. And I think that that will help Charles to be, if indeed he does become a monarch, a very good monarch.

MCCARTNEY: Hugo, do you think he ever will become our monarch? Do you think the queen will step aside or is she going to serve until the day she dies?

VICKERS: Heather, the queen must not step aside, and she won't. She was anointed as queen, and she will serve until the end. Obviously, Prince Charles could take on certain extra duties and make things a little bit easier for her. And taking as he does already a lot of foreign chores and that kind of thing.

But of course, as you know, when the queen dies, he will succeed her automatically. And he will then become king. And instead though, some people talk about whether or not she's going to be queen. She will automatically be queen. And even they pass some civil list act, they're not going to do that on the day he succeeds. So she will automatically be queen, whatever she calls herself. That's going to be the case.

MCCARTNEY: Robert, where are they going on their honeymoon, and how long are they going to get?

LACEY: They're up in Scotland, which is their favorite place, in Birkhall, which is a big house close to Balmoral, where the Queen Mother used to spend her summers with Princess Margaret. I think we're actually going to get a chance to see them tomorrow.

They're going to church tomorrow, so we'll be able to see how they look after their honeymoon night. They certainly left early enough to get started. And then next Wednesday, Thursday, I think, they'll be opening a child's playground in one of the Scottish villages near Balmoral.

Interesting, the photo opportunity for Charles and Diana, they stood in a stream romantically. Sorry, for Diana and Charles. For Camilla, she's getting straight down to work with official duties. And well, that'll be the first time we see the Duchess of Cornwall actually opening something.

MCCARTNEY: Dickie, do you think Camilla has to really worry about security with the Diana fanatics out there?

ARBITER: No, I don't think so. I think certainly this engagement that she's doing next Thursday in Scotland -- the Scots, particularly in that area, around Balmoral and Birkhall, the Ballater area, they're very sympathetic to the royals. And they're very fond of the royals because they spend all summer up there, and certainly the Prince of Wales and his new bride will spend a lot of time up there in the autumn.

So they're sympathetic. So I think people will soften their attitudes. I just hope that there is no element of spin. That is the last thing that is needed. We saw that a few years ago when the press office at Clarence House was sort of outing the then-Camilla Parker Bowles. She doesn't need spin. She's got enough strength and enough wherewithal to be able to do the job herself.

And what she does have, and what India was saying, she has a lot of strength. And the Prince of Wales needs a lot of strength behind him, pretty much like his grandmother was the driving force behind his grandfather, Queen Elizabeth behind George...

(CROSSTALK)

MCCARTNEY: Thank you so much. We've got to go now. I just want to thank all our guests, India Hicks, Dickie Arbiter, Hugo Vickers, Robert Lacey, and Patrick Jephson.

Just a quick note before we go. The reason I was here tonight instead of Larry is that his gorgeous and talented wife, Shawn, is singing in Atlantic City, and he wanted to be there for her. A great husband, what more can we want?

Let's hope Charles and Camilla will be there for each other for many, many years, now that they're finally married. Whatever you think of their relationship, and heaven knows it hasn't been easy one, their love has endured. To the prince and his new royal duchess, best wishes for a long and happy life together.

Up next, a royal wedding special hosted by CNN's Anderson Cooper, Becky Anderson, and Richard Quest.

I'm Heather Mills McCartney. Thanks for watching.

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