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Michael Jackson Trial; Should He Stay or Go?

Aired April 21, 2005 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


DARYN KAGAN, CNN ANCHOR: The FBI has joined the search for a 16- year-old girl who disappeared yesterday while waiting for a school bus in Tompkinsville, Kentucky. An Amber Alert is in effect for Janet Quijano. The sheriff's department says looking for five Hispanic men in a red minivan or SUV that they believe abducted Quijano.
And the Sistine Chapel, with its framed frescoes by Michelangelo, reopens to the public on Monday. It'll be the first time the chapel will be on view since the new pope was chosen.

Keeping you informed, CNN is the most trusted name in news.

To California now, there's only a half day of testimony today in the Michael Jackson trial. The judge will send the jury home while he hears motions this afternoon. The jury arrived just a few moments ago at the courthouse in Santa Maria, in California. A former Neverland security guard is expected back on the stand today in the child- molestation trial. This morning's big headline, though, is centered on an unexpected celebrity witness for the defense.

And with more on that, here is our Ted Rowlands.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TED ROWLANDS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): CNN has learned from a source close to the case that actor Macaulay Culkin is planning to testify on Michael Jackson's behalf. Culkin, who as a boy spent considerable time with Jackson, is expected to refute the testimony of two former Jackson employees, who say they saw Michael Jackson grope Macaulay Culkin at Neverland Ranch.

JIM MORET, POOL REPORTER: It's very powerful when somebody says you're saying I'm the victim, I'm telling you nothing happened. Who are you going to believe, me, the person that it supposedly happened to or somebody who says something happened to me?

ROWLANDS: In court yesterday, a former Jackson guard testified that he and other Neverland security employees were instructed not to allow the accuser in the current case to leave Neverland. The former guard, Brian Barron (ph), said those instructions were posted on a security office message board for a week in early 2003.

ANNE BREMNER, LEGAL ANALYST: I think that's very key because we haven't had anything definitive about directives to security, very organized and well-run security, mind you, to keep these children, especially the accuser, on that property. ROWLANDS: On the way out of court yesterday, Jackson did not comment about the case, but told reporters his back is still bothering him.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: On a scale of one to ten, how are you feeling?

MICHAEL JACKSON, ENTERTAINER: Pretty bad, sorry.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Eight or nine?

JACKSON: Seven.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Seven.

ROWLANDS: Ted Rowlands, CNN, Santa Maria, California.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAGAN: Barring a successful court challenge, gay couples in Connecticut will be permitted to form civil unions beginning on October 1st. The governor signed the bill yesterday after it easily passed the state senate. The legislation did stipulate that marriage was a term reserved for heterosexual unions.

Texas, however, is moving in the opposite direction. The statehouse overwhelmingly approved a bill to prevent gays from becoming foster parents. If enacted it would be the only such law in the country. A similar measure in Arkansas was struck down last year as unconstitutional.

California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger is apologizing for his tough talk on border control. At a speech on Tuesday, he said the border with Mexico should be closed. But Schwarzenegger says that's not really what he meant to say. The governor called it a screw-up, and blamed it on his trouble with the English language.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. ARNOLD SCHWARZENEGGER (R), CALIFORNIA: The bottom line is I misspoke, and I'm sorry if that, you know, offended anyone. But it was a language problem, because I meant securing our borders, rather than closing our borders.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KAGAN: Schwarzenegger adds that he filmed four movies in Mexico and he loves to go there on vacation.

Sanctuary laws, you might not be familiar with them, but an unlucky delivery man is shining a spotlight on these rules.

Our Carol Costello tells us more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) CAROL COSTELLO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A week and a half ago, Ming Kung Chen was where he wanted to be, in America and safely under the radar. But now his secret is out, and he's landed in the middle of a battle that's much bigger than just him.

JOHN C. LIU, NEW YORK CITY COUNCILMAN: People now know his status and his picture is plastered everywhere.

COSTELLO: His status: he's illegal. His bubble burst in the unluckiest of ways; he got stuck in an elevator for three-and-a-half days. Too afraid, some say, to push the emergency button, fearing it would bring police. Finally, he did hit the button and help came.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He wants to thank everyone spend time look for him in the past four days.

COSTELLO (on camera): Everyone agrees Chen's ordeal was horrible, but it also calls into question the country's confusing immigration laws. There are those who believe Chen should be kicked out of the country, especially now since immigration officials know he's illegal.

HEATHER MACDONALD, MANHATTAN INSTITUTE: I think he should be deported. He's here illegally. He took his chances.

COSTELLO (voice-over): Heather MacDonald, who studies immigration issues with the Manhattan Institute, just testified before Congress on what's keeping Chen here, so-called sanctuary laws.

New York has one. It's called Executive Order 41. It forbids New York City agencies, including the police, from asking people their immigration status and sharing that information with federal agencies, including Homeland Security.

The order, signed by Mayor Michael Bloomberg, took effect nearly two years after 9/11, an attack carried out by terrorists, some of whom were in this country illegally.

New York City Councilman John Liu says the order is designed to make undocumented immigrants feel comfortable approaching police. He says it's unfair to compare Chen to the 9/11 hijackers.

(on camera): What makes them different from Ming? We don't know what his background is.

LIU: What makes them similar to Ming?

MACDONALD: You have to start enforcing the immigration laws and send the message that once you're inside the country you can't expect to be home free.

COSTELLO (voice-over): For now, Chen remains in hiding. He lost his delivery job. And as for whether he'll be deported, Homeland Security is undecided. In its words, he doesn't seem to be a threat.

(END VIDEOTAPE) KAGAN: That was our Carol Costello.

President Bush once called Iran part of the axis of evil, but what does the leader of Iran think of the U.S., of nuclear weapons and some of the other world issues. We'll talk to reporter who got a rare interview, an American journalist who gets to talk with Iran's president. We'll get some rare insight about the Iranian leader.

And Passover just around the corner, join in, even if you live in a zoo.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAGAN: Mohammad Khatami leads the regime branded by President Bush as part of the axis of evil. His election as Iran's president in 1997 stirred hopes for reforms and a thaw with the U.S. Well, that has pretty much faded by now. President Bush is warning Iran to give up its nuclear ambitions, and the country is now sandwiched by democracies allied with the U.S.

Iran's president rarely sits for interviews with Western journalists, but he has sat down with Hooman Majd, a writer from "G.Q." magazine. And he joins me from Time Warner Center in New York this morning. Human, good morning. Good to have you here with us.

HOOMAN MAJD, "G.Q." MAGAZINE: Thank you, good morning.

KAGAN: OK, I have to ask you, journalist to journalist. The president hasn't given an interview to an American journalist in eight years. How'd you get it?

MAJD: Well, it wasn't that easy, but I contacted someone that I went to school with in Washington. It was actually his chief of staff. And initially, his reaction was that he doesn't really sit with American journalists, but they decided that it was OK. And, obviously, my own Iranian heritage is...

KAGAN: Didn't hurt.

MAJD: No, it didn't hurt.

KAGAN: Well, anyway how you slice it, good get. Let's talk about some of the things you were able to ask President Khatami. him. You asked him about democracy and how parts of it might be working in his country and how it's emerging in the Middle East?

MAJD: Right. He's very much -- you know, he holds a belief that Islam and democracy are completely compatible. As far as he's concerned, the Islam that we know in the West is not the Islam that is the real Islam. There are people in Iran who obviously disagree with him, but he is very much a reform-minded Muslim theologian. He's not an ayatollah, he's a hujasda Islam (ph), which is a mid-level cleric.

But he is an intellectual, and he believes that Islam is going to reform and democracy is compatible with Islam. And he believes that what's going on in the Islamic Republic right now is, in fact, a real democracy that is compatible with the religion that he thinks is quite a liberal religion.

KAGAN: Let's get to back to this idea of the great hope, when he came into office eight years ago, that this was going to be a big opportunity for better relations between the Iran and the U.S., that it wasn't going to be as anti-American. When you read your interview with him, there are not a lot of warm feelings for this country.

MAJD: Well, he does say -- he does call America the great American nation, which I think is warmer than calling it Great Satan.

KAGAN: Yes. All things being relative, yes.

MAJD: All things being relative, yes. He believes, and I think the administration -- his administration -- believe that there are hard-liners in America and there are hard-liners in Iran who oppose him, who work in concert with each other, knowingly or unknowingly, in terms of keeping the status quo of the bad relations between the United States and America and Iran.

KAGAN: But he pretty much puts the blame, the responsibility, on America to make things better?

MAJD: Well, he does. I mean, that's the standard line in Iran, that America has harmed Iran and what they're referring to is obviously the 1953 coup, which, you know, America's essentially apologized for, if you consider Madeleine Albright's apology an apology. But Iran wants more than that, they want America to really say that Iran is an equal. They view the sole superpower, being America, as being a country that will dominate the world unless they're independent nations.

Iran, Mr. Khatami believes, is an independent nation and is not going to ally itself to either the United States, Europe, former Soviet Union countries, Russia, China, anywhere else. So his feelings about America are actually -- in person, are actually quite warm. He says America is great. But he did say to me, outside of the interview in our initial conversation, that he felt that there was a lot of things about America that Iran didn't understand and vice versa, which is why he promotes this dialogue amongst civilizations.

KAGAN: What was your general impression of the man?

MAJD: He's a very charming man. He's obviously been in politics now for a number of years. Before he was president, he was culture minister. He's somewhat of a reluctant president. He didn't really want to run the first time. He was asked to, and certainly didn't expect to win. He told me that he had no idea he was going to win and win so easily. I think his personal feelings, if he were allowed to say so, would be that he would like Iran to have relations with the United States.

Under his watch, Iran has opened up quite a bit to the West, certainly to Europe. He was the first president who was able to change the foreign minister, who had been in power for 16 years and reported directly to the supreme leader. And you know, it was his foreign minister who opened up relations between Great Britain, Germany, France. And all of those countries enjoy actually very cordial relations with Iran. Khatami visits those countries all time. He was in Paris two weeks ago, met with the president there. They embraced each other. I mean, he's very, very warm with the West.

KAGAN: It is an interesting read, because, he might be warm, but his views of the West are very different than what a lot of people think, looking from this direction towards Iran. The article, the interview, appears in the May issue of American "G.Q." Hooman Majd, thank you.

MAJD: Thank you.

KAGAN: Next time we have you on, I'm going to want to know how a former music executive turns into an international journalist, but that's a topic for another day.

MAJD: That's a different topic, yes.

KAGAN: Absolutely. A fascinating story.

MAJD: Thank you.

KAGAN: Thank you. That's Hooman Majd. His piece with President Khatami appearing in American "G.Q." Of course, also, our own chief international correspondent Christiane Amanpour recently talking to the Iranian president as well.

In this morning's "World Wrap," the ousted president of Ecuador has been granted asylum at Brazil. He was removed from power yesterday by the national Congress following weeks of escalating unrest. Brazil's ambassador says the two countries are now negotiating for the former president's safe passage out of Ecuador.

In Western India, several people were killed and dozens more were hurt when a passenger train slammed into a freight train. Local villagers had to use blow torches to free those traps inside the up- ended train cars. About 300 accidents occur each year on India's railways, which carry more than 13 million people every day.

And near Tel Aviv, even the primates are honoring Passover, which begins this weekend, by the way. It's doubtful the apes understand at the zoo about the diet and the Passover seder. But you know what? It's the time of year the zoo keepers are not allowed to handle wheat products or risen bread, so that is what the gorillas get, they get the matzoh. Good for them.

The government recently gave us some new advice about how to properly eat. It is a good attempt at eating better, if you can figure it out. A How-to-Eat explainer, pyramid style, gets to the point coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAGAN: Let's find out what's coming up at the top of the hour. "NEWS FROM CNN," with my friend Wolf Blitzer. Hi, Wolf. WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Hi, Daryn. Thanks very much. Another busy hour ahead on NEWS FROM CNN. We're continuing to watch those fast-moving developments from Iraq. A civilian helicopter crashed, killing all nine people onboard, including six Americans. We'll get the late-breaking details. We'll go live to Baghdad.

Also, President Bush comes out swinging today in defense of John Bolton, his controversial choice to become the next ambassador to the U.N. Coming up during the next hour, I'll speak live with two key members of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee on why Bolton's nomination has run into deep trouble.

Watch out for those stories, much more, all on "NEWS FROM CNN" -- Daryn, in the meantime, back to you.

KAGAN: All right, Wolf, thank you.

If you're a little bit round in the middle, don't be square about it. Get hip to the new shape in town. It's the triangle reinvented.

CNN's Jeanne Moos takes a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEANNE MOOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): You can visit the pyramids, you can form a pyramid, but can you remember this pyramid?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Vaguely.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sort of.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No. No thank you.

MOOS (on camera): What is funny about the food pyramid?

(voice-over): The old food pyramid got no respect.

(on camera): Did you ever use the food pyramid for anything?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jeanne, do I look like I ever used a food pyramid?

MOOS: (voice-over): If your belly shakes like a bowl full of jelly, maybe you should check out the new improved food pyramid. The old one went horizontal. The new one goes vertical. They considered other shapes, like a plate, but opted to stick with a pyramid. The guy running up the steps symbolizes exercise, which was emphasized at the press conference where the new food pyramid was unveiled.

DENISE AUSTIN, FITNESS EXPERT: Now come on, stretch that spine! Your spine is your lifeline. Keep it healthy. Keep it strong.

MOOS: The old pyramid was good for kiddie games. There were versions ranging from vegetarian to low carb, but the new pyramid is interactive.

MIKE JOHANNS, AGRICULTURE SECRETARY: Every single American can find a My Pyramid that is right for them at mypyramid.gov.

MOOS: Want to bet? Dietitian Lisa Drayer typed in her age and sex and amount she exercises. You're suppose to get one of 12 food pyramids personalized for your type. But we, and thousands of others, waited and waited for a pyramid that never appeared.

(on camera): The agency that created the pyramid, the spokesperson can't get on.

LISA DRAYER, DIETICIAN: Really?

MOOS: Because they're getting 48 million hits in a day.

DRAYER: The concept is good. The science is good. The recommendations are good.

MOOS: (INAUDIBLE) make it worst.

(voice-over): Cartoonists are already taking aim at the food pyramid's makeover. What's wrong with the one we have now?

Food consultant Clark Wolf noted the rainbow colors and spandex- clad figure and told "The San Francisco Chronicle" the pyramid looks as though all you need to do to be healthy in America is be gay and exercise.

Some folks never figured out that the bottom of the old pyramid was supposed to be good.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And I don't eat that stuff.

MOOS (on camera): No, this is the good stuff down here. That's not the crap. That's the crap.

(voice-over): As for the guy going up the steps on the new pyramid.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There should be an escalator.

MOOS: Jeanne Moos, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAGAN: Makes me hungry for lunch.

Are you ready for some football? The season has not officially begun, but it's still going to be a football weekend for some fans. A little sports talk, coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(STOCK MARKET REPORT)

KAGAN: It is the weekend that football star fans have been waiting for since the Super Bowl. It's the 2005 NFL draft. All the off-season dreams and disappointments that take root in all that selection.

For a closer look, if you want to feel like an insider, listen in to the dot-com desk and CNN's Christina Park.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHRISTINA PARK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Fire up the grill and go long. SI.com is the place to get you ready for the NFL draft this weekend. And to help you get to know who will be playing with big boys, our expert Peter King gives you the lowdown on his top 12 picks for the draft. At the top of his dirty dozen, San Francisco probably picking Utah quarterback Alex Smith. King says he seems destined to be the heir the 49ers QB thrown. The last of his top 12 picks, San Diego to tap USA wide receiver Mike Williams.

Don't like sure things? SI.com/NFL also takes a look at some diamonds in the rough. Toni Pauline (ph) ranks 10 draft longshots who could pay off in a big way, like Roydell Williams (ph), Tulane's wide receiver, a dominant forcer on the offense who likes to throw the ball. His reliable hands catch many a touchdown pass. SI.com has profiles and grades for all the players, and you can search by school or position. We also tell you when to fire up that gill for your tailgate party with a complete 2005 NFL schedule. And if drama's more your thing, check out SI's ranking of top 10 games to watch this year.

So kick back at si.com/NFL and let the games begin. I'm Christina Park for the dot-com desk.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAGAN: Thank you, Christina. But see, here's the thing, it's going to be so nice outside this thing, most people are not going to want to sit indoors and watch the draft on television.

(WEATHER REPORT)

And that's going to do it for me. I'm Daryn Kagan. I'm taking a day off tomorrow, but I'll see you right here on Monday morning.

Wolf, you take over from Washington D.C.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com


Aired April 21, 2005 - 11:30   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DARYN KAGAN, CNN ANCHOR: The FBI has joined the search for a 16- year-old girl who disappeared yesterday while waiting for a school bus in Tompkinsville, Kentucky. An Amber Alert is in effect for Janet Quijano. The sheriff's department says looking for five Hispanic men in a red minivan or SUV that they believe abducted Quijano.
And the Sistine Chapel, with its framed frescoes by Michelangelo, reopens to the public on Monday. It'll be the first time the chapel will be on view since the new pope was chosen.

Keeping you informed, CNN is the most trusted name in news.

To California now, there's only a half day of testimony today in the Michael Jackson trial. The judge will send the jury home while he hears motions this afternoon. The jury arrived just a few moments ago at the courthouse in Santa Maria, in California. A former Neverland security guard is expected back on the stand today in the child- molestation trial. This morning's big headline, though, is centered on an unexpected celebrity witness for the defense.

And with more on that, here is our Ted Rowlands.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TED ROWLANDS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): CNN has learned from a source close to the case that actor Macaulay Culkin is planning to testify on Michael Jackson's behalf. Culkin, who as a boy spent considerable time with Jackson, is expected to refute the testimony of two former Jackson employees, who say they saw Michael Jackson grope Macaulay Culkin at Neverland Ranch.

JIM MORET, POOL REPORTER: It's very powerful when somebody says you're saying I'm the victim, I'm telling you nothing happened. Who are you going to believe, me, the person that it supposedly happened to or somebody who says something happened to me?

ROWLANDS: In court yesterday, a former Jackson guard testified that he and other Neverland security employees were instructed not to allow the accuser in the current case to leave Neverland. The former guard, Brian Barron (ph), said those instructions were posted on a security office message board for a week in early 2003.

ANNE BREMNER, LEGAL ANALYST: I think that's very key because we haven't had anything definitive about directives to security, very organized and well-run security, mind you, to keep these children, especially the accuser, on that property. ROWLANDS: On the way out of court yesterday, Jackson did not comment about the case, but told reporters his back is still bothering him.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: On a scale of one to ten, how are you feeling?

MICHAEL JACKSON, ENTERTAINER: Pretty bad, sorry.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Eight or nine?

JACKSON: Seven.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Seven.

ROWLANDS: Ted Rowlands, CNN, Santa Maria, California.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAGAN: Barring a successful court challenge, gay couples in Connecticut will be permitted to form civil unions beginning on October 1st. The governor signed the bill yesterday after it easily passed the state senate. The legislation did stipulate that marriage was a term reserved for heterosexual unions.

Texas, however, is moving in the opposite direction. The statehouse overwhelmingly approved a bill to prevent gays from becoming foster parents. If enacted it would be the only such law in the country. A similar measure in Arkansas was struck down last year as unconstitutional.

California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger is apologizing for his tough talk on border control. At a speech on Tuesday, he said the border with Mexico should be closed. But Schwarzenegger says that's not really what he meant to say. The governor called it a screw-up, and blamed it on his trouble with the English language.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. ARNOLD SCHWARZENEGGER (R), CALIFORNIA: The bottom line is I misspoke, and I'm sorry if that, you know, offended anyone. But it was a language problem, because I meant securing our borders, rather than closing our borders.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KAGAN: Schwarzenegger adds that he filmed four movies in Mexico and he loves to go there on vacation.

Sanctuary laws, you might not be familiar with them, but an unlucky delivery man is shining a spotlight on these rules.

Our Carol Costello tells us more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) CAROL COSTELLO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A week and a half ago, Ming Kung Chen was where he wanted to be, in America and safely under the radar. But now his secret is out, and he's landed in the middle of a battle that's much bigger than just him.

JOHN C. LIU, NEW YORK CITY COUNCILMAN: People now know his status and his picture is plastered everywhere.

COSTELLO: His status: he's illegal. His bubble burst in the unluckiest of ways; he got stuck in an elevator for three-and-a-half days. Too afraid, some say, to push the emergency button, fearing it would bring police. Finally, he did hit the button and help came.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He wants to thank everyone spend time look for him in the past four days.

COSTELLO (on camera): Everyone agrees Chen's ordeal was horrible, but it also calls into question the country's confusing immigration laws. There are those who believe Chen should be kicked out of the country, especially now since immigration officials know he's illegal.

HEATHER MACDONALD, MANHATTAN INSTITUTE: I think he should be deported. He's here illegally. He took his chances.

COSTELLO (voice-over): Heather MacDonald, who studies immigration issues with the Manhattan Institute, just testified before Congress on what's keeping Chen here, so-called sanctuary laws.

New York has one. It's called Executive Order 41. It forbids New York City agencies, including the police, from asking people their immigration status and sharing that information with federal agencies, including Homeland Security.

The order, signed by Mayor Michael Bloomberg, took effect nearly two years after 9/11, an attack carried out by terrorists, some of whom were in this country illegally.

New York City Councilman John Liu says the order is designed to make undocumented immigrants feel comfortable approaching police. He says it's unfair to compare Chen to the 9/11 hijackers.

(on camera): What makes them different from Ming? We don't know what his background is.

LIU: What makes them similar to Ming?

MACDONALD: You have to start enforcing the immigration laws and send the message that once you're inside the country you can't expect to be home free.

COSTELLO (voice-over): For now, Chen remains in hiding. He lost his delivery job. And as for whether he'll be deported, Homeland Security is undecided. In its words, he doesn't seem to be a threat.

(END VIDEOTAPE) KAGAN: That was our Carol Costello.

President Bush once called Iran part of the axis of evil, but what does the leader of Iran think of the U.S., of nuclear weapons and some of the other world issues. We'll talk to reporter who got a rare interview, an American journalist who gets to talk with Iran's president. We'll get some rare insight about the Iranian leader.

And Passover just around the corner, join in, even if you live in a zoo.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAGAN: Mohammad Khatami leads the regime branded by President Bush as part of the axis of evil. His election as Iran's president in 1997 stirred hopes for reforms and a thaw with the U.S. Well, that has pretty much faded by now. President Bush is warning Iran to give up its nuclear ambitions, and the country is now sandwiched by democracies allied with the U.S.

Iran's president rarely sits for interviews with Western journalists, but he has sat down with Hooman Majd, a writer from "G.Q." magazine. And he joins me from Time Warner Center in New York this morning. Human, good morning. Good to have you here with us.

HOOMAN MAJD, "G.Q." MAGAZINE: Thank you, good morning.

KAGAN: OK, I have to ask you, journalist to journalist. The president hasn't given an interview to an American journalist in eight years. How'd you get it?

MAJD: Well, it wasn't that easy, but I contacted someone that I went to school with in Washington. It was actually his chief of staff. And initially, his reaction was that he doesn't really sit with American journalists, but they decided that it was OK. And, obviously, my own Iranian heritage is...

KAGAN: Didn't hurt.

MAJD: No, it didn't hurt.

KAGAN: Well, anyway how you slice it, good get. Let's talk about some of the things you were able to ask President Khatami. him. You asked him about democracy and how parts of it might be working in his country and how it's emerging in the Middle East?

MAJD: Right. He's very much -- you know, he holds a belief that Islam and democracy are completely compatible. As far as he's concerned, the Islam that we know in the West is not the Islam that is the real Islam. There are people in Iran who obviously disagree with him, but he is very much a reform-minded Muslim theologian. He's not an ayatollah, he's a hujasda Islam (ph), which is a mid-level cleric.

But he is an intellectual, and he believes that Islam is going to reform and democracy is compatible with Islam. And he believes that what's going on in the Islamic Republic right now is, in fact, a real democracy that is compatible with the religion that he thinks is quite a liberal religion.

KAGAN: Let's get to back to this idea of the great hope, when he came into office eight years ago, that this was going to be a big opportunity for better relations between the Iran and the U.S., that it wasn't going to be as anti-American. When you read your interview with him, there are not a lot of warm feelings for this country.

MAJD: Well, he does say -- he does call America the great American nation, which I think is warmer than calling it Great Satan.

KAGAN: Yes. All things being relative, yes.

MAJD: All things being relative, yes. He believes, and I think the administration -- his administration -- believe that there are hard-liners in America and there are hard-liners in Iran who oppose him, who work in concert with each other, knowingly or unknowingly, in terms of keeping the status quo of the bad relations between the United States and America and Iran.

KAGAN: But he pretty much puts the blame, the responsibility, on America to make things better?

MAJD: Well, he does. I mean, that's the standard line in Iran, that America has harmed Iran and what they're referring to is obviously the 1953 coup, which, you know, America's essentially apologized for, if you consider Madeleine Albright's apology an apology. But Iran wants more than that, they want America to really say that Iran is an equal. They view the sole superpower, being America, as being a country that will dominate the world unless they're independent nations.

Iran, Mr. Khatami believes, is an independent nation and is not going to ally itself to either the United States, Europe, former Soviet Union countries, Russia, China, anywhere else. So his feelings about America are actually -- in person, are actually quite warm. He says America is great. But he did say to me, outside of the interview in our initial conversation, that he felt that there was a lot of things about America that Iran didn't understand and vice versa, which is why he promotes this dialogue amongst civilizations.

KAGAN: What was your general impression of the man?

MAJD: He's a very charming man. He's obviously been in politics now for a number of years. Before he was president, he was culture minister. He's somewhat of a reluctant president. He didn't really want to run the first time. He was asked to, and certainly didn't expect to win. He told me that he had no idea he was going to win and win so easily. I think his personal feelings, if he were allowed to say so, would be that he would like Iran to have relations with the United States.

Under his watch, Iran has opened up quite a bit to the West, certainly to Europe. He was the first president who was able to change the foreign minister, who had been in power for 16 years and reported directly to the supreme leader. And you know, it was his foreign minister who opened up relations between Great Britain, Germany, France. And all of those countries enjoy actually very cordial relations with Iran. Khatami visits those countries all time. He was in Paris two weeks ago, met with the president there. They embraced each other. I mean, he's very, very warm with the West.

KAGAN: It is an interesting read, because, he might be warm, but his views of the West are very different than what a lot of people think, looking from this direction towards Iran. The article, the interview, appears in the May issue of American "G.Q." Hooman Majd, thank you.

MAJD: Thank you.

KAGAN: Next time we have you on, I'm going to want to know how a former music executive turns into an international journalist, but that's a topic for another day.

MAJD: That's a different topic, yes.

KAGAN: Absolutely. A fascinating story.

MAJD: Thank you.

KAGAN: Thank you. That's Hooman Majd. His piece with President Khatami appearing in American "G.Q." Of course, also, our own chief international correspondent Christiane Amanpour recently talking to the Iranian president as well.

In this morning's "World Wrap," the ousted president of Ecuador has been granted asylum at Brazil. He was removed from power yesterday by the national Congress following weeks of escalating unrest. Brazil's ambassador says the two countries are now negotiating for the former president's safe passage out of Ecuador.

In Western India, several people were killed and dozens more were hurt when a passenger train slammed into a freight train. Local villagers had to use blow torches to free those traps inside the up- ended train cars. About 300 accidents occur each year on India's railways, which carry more than 13 million people every day.

And near Tel Aviv, even the primates are honoring Passover, which begins this weekend, by the way. It's doubtful the apes understand at the zoo about the diet and the Passover seder. But you know what? It's the time of year the zoo keepers are not allowed to handle wheat products or risen bread, so that is what the gorillas get, they get the matzoh. Good for them.

The government recently gave us some new advice about how to properly eat. It is a good attempt at eating better, if you can figure it out. A How-to-Eat explainer, pyramid style, gets to the point coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAGAN: Let's find out what's coming up at the top of the hour. "NEWS FROM CNN," with my friend Wolf Blitzer. Hi, Wolf. WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Hi, Daryn. Thanks very much. Another busy hour ahead on NEWS FROM CNN. We're continuing to watch those fast-moving developments from Iraq. A civilian helicopter crashed, killing all nine people onboard, including six Americans. We'll get the late-breaking details. We'll go live to Baghdad.

Also, President Bush comes out swinging today in defense of John Bolton, his controversial choice to become the next ambassador to the U.N. Coming up during the next hour, I'll speak live with two key members of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee on why Bolton's nomination has run into deep trouble.

Watch out for those stories, much more, all on "NEWS FROM CNN" -- Daryn, in the meantime, back to you.

KAGAN: All right, Wolf, thank you.

If you're a little bit round in the middle, don't be square about it. Get hip to the new shape in town. It's the triangle reinvented.

CNN's Jeanne Moos takes a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEANNE MOOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): You can visit the pyramids, you can form a pyramid, but can you remember this pyramid?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Vaguely.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sort of.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No. No thank you.

MOOS (on camera): What is funny about the food pyramid?

(voice-over): The old food pyramid got no respect.

(on camera): Did you ever use the food pyramid for anything?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jeanne, do I look like I ever used a food pyramid?

MOOS: (voice-over): If your belly shakes like a bowl full of jelly, maybe you should check out the new improved food pyramid. The old one went horizontal. The new one goes vertical. They considered other shapes, like a plate, but opted to stick with a pyramid. The guy running up the steps symbolizes exercise, which was emphasized at the press conference where the new food pyramid was unveiled.

DENISE AUSTIN, FITNESS EXPERT: Now come on, stretch that spine! Your spine is your lifeline. Keep it healthy. Keep it strong.

MOOS: The old pyramid was good for kiddie games. There were versions ranging from vegetarian to low carb, but the new pyramid is interactive.

MIKE JOHANNS, AGRICULTURE SECRETARY: Every single American can find a My Pyramid that is right for them at mypyramid.gov.

MOOS: Want to bet? Dietitian Lisa Drayer typed in her age and sex and amount she exercises. You're suppose to get one of 12 food pyramids personalized for your type. But we, and thousands of others, waited and waited for a pyramid that never appeared.

(on camera): The agency that created the pyramid, the spokesperson can't get on.

LISA DRAYER, DIETICIAN: Really?

MOOS: Because they're getting 48 million hits in a day.

DRAYER: The concept is good. The science is good. The recommendations are good.

MOOS: (INAUDIBLE) make it worst.

(voice-over): Cartoonists are already taking aim at the food pyramid's makeover. What's wrong with the one we have now?

Food consultant Clark Wolf noted the rainbow colors and spandex- clad figure and told "The San Francisco Chronicle" the pyramid looks as though all you need to do to be healthy in America is be gay and exercise.

Some folks never figured out that the bottom of the old pyramid was supposed to be good.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And I don't eat that stuff.

MOOS (on camera): No, this is the good stuff down here. That's not the crap. That's the crap.

(voice-over): As for the guy going up the steps on the new pyramid.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There should be an escalator.

MOOS: Jeanne Moos, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAGAN: Makes me hungry for lunch.

Are you ready for some football? The season has not officially begun, but it's still going to be a football weekend for some fans. A little sports talk, coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(STOCK MARKET REPORT)

KAGAN: It is the weekend that football star fans have been waiting for since the Super Bowl. It's the 2005 NFL draft. All the off-season dreams and disappointments that take root in all that selection.

For a closer look, if you want to feel like an insider, listen in to the dot-com desk and CNN's Christina Park.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHRISTINA PARK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Fire up the grill and go long. SI.com is the place to get you ready for the NFL draft this weekend. And to help you get to know who will be playing with big boys, our expert Peter King gives you the lowdown on his top 12 picks for the draft. At the top of his dirty dozen, San Francisco probably picking Utah quarterback Alex Smith. King says he seems destined to be the heir the 49ers QB thrown. The last of his top 12 picks, San Diego to tap USA wide receiver Mike Williams.

Don't like sure things? SI.com/NFL also takes a look at some diamonds in the rough. Toni Pauline (ph) ranks 10 draft longshots who could pay off in a big way, like Roydell Williams (ph), Tulane's wide receiver, a dominant forcer on the offense who likes to throw the ball. His reliable hands catch many a touchdown pass. SI.com has profiles and grades for all the players, and you can search by school or position. We also tell you when to fire up that gill for your tailgate party with a complete 2005 NFL schedule. And if drama's more your thing, check out SI's ranking of top 10 games to watch this year.

So kick back at si.com/NFL and let the games begin. I'm Christina Park for the dot-com desk.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAGAN: Thank you, Christina. But see, here's the thing, it's going to be so nice outside this thing, most people are not going to want to sit indoors and watch the draft on television.

(WEATHER REPORT)

And that's going to do it for me. I'm Daryn Kagan. I'm taking a day off tomorrow, but I'll see you right here on Monday morning.

Wolf, you take over from Washington D.C.

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