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American Morning
Minuteman Project; Bridge to Nowhere; Where's Eloise?
Aired April 26, 2005 - 07:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning. Welcome back everybody. It's just exactly half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING.
The push is on in Washington, D.C., to make the controversial Minuteman Project a permanent part of U.S. border security. One of the co-founders of that group is going to join us in just a few moments. We're going to talk about the reception that he's getting today from members of Congress.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: They're getting a lot of attention, too, aren't they? Just started?
Also this half-hour, a massive project in California to build a new Oakland Bay bridge. It started off with a hefty price tag, 2.5 billion. Well, now that's tripled, and nobody is working. We'll find out what's happening out there in the bay in California.
O'BRIEN: Yes, I like that shot, because it's like it's not really going anywhere, that big bridge.
HEMMER: Good work if you can get it.
O'BRIEN: Yes. Let's get right to the headlines with Carol.
Hey, good morning.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning to you.
HEMMER: Good morning.
COSTELLO: Good morning to all of you.
"Now in the News."
Thousands are celebrating in Lebanon this morning. Lots of flag- waving, singing and dancing this hour. The country is without Syrian military presence for the first time in three decades. An historic farewell ceremony wrapped up in the Bekaa Valley just about two hours ago. Top Syrian and Lebanon military officials exchanged medals and referred to each other as brothers in arms.
The search for weapons of mass destruction in Iraq has gone as far as possible, and it has come up empty. Investigators say they have found no evidence the weapons were moved to Syria for safekeeping. Its' in a 92-page report released last night. The group released its main findings last October, claiming Saddam Hussein did not possess chemical or biological weapons.
In Washington, a Senate committee is set to debate President Bush's Social Security reforms. The Senate Finance Committee will get under way in less than three hours. In the meantime, President Bush is on the road, trying to drum up support for his proposals. The president will take part in a roundtable in Galveston, Texas, a little later today.
The judge in the Michael Jackson sex trial has ruled he will allow Debbie Rowe to testify for the prosecution. Rowe, as you know, is Jackson's ex-wife and the mother of two of his children.
Here is Jackson's spokeswoman on the judge's decision.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RAYMONE BAIN, MICHAEL JACKSON'S SPOKESWOMAN: Michael and Debbie Rowe had a good relationship. He cares about his kids. He is a wonderful father. And it's nothing Debbie Rowe could say, Larry, other than the fact that Michael Jackson is a loving and caring father. And Michael Jackson was very, very, very kind and very good to Debbie Rowe.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COSTELLO: But she's testifying for the prosecution. She'll take the stand in the case by week's end.
Actor/comedian George Lopez is recovering from a kidney transplant, donated by his wife. Lopez underwent surgery on Monday. A genetic condition apparently caused the kidney deterioration. Lopez and his wife are said to be resting comfortably, and both are expected to make a full recovery. How nice that his wife was able to do that for him.
O'BRIEN: Incredible, isn't it?
COSTELLO: Yes.
O'BRIEN: I mean, that's amazing. I really hadn't heard much about it before they did the surgery.
COSTELLO: Yes, I didn't even know he was sick.
O'BRIEN: Well, we hope that he has a nice, fast and easy recovery and he's right back on TV. Thanks, Carol.
Well, today in Washington, we're going to hear what a volunteer border patrol called the Minutemen claims to have accomplished along the Arizona/Mexico border, also about some plans to expand their effort as well.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
O'BRIEN (voice over): Nearly 900 volunteers have helped capture 315 illegal immigrants along the Mexico/Arizona border. That's what the all-volunteer Minuteman Project says it's accomplished since early April when the group began patrolling a 23-mile stretch of desert between Naco and Douglas.
U.S. border officials have doubts about the group's claims.
MICHAEL NICELY, TUCSON BORDER PATROL CHIEF: As far as them having an affect on stopping illegal immigration, it's been negligible. Any kind of an official government presence on the south is a deterrent.
O'BRIEN: Still, the project's organizers insist they've been successful. And they say they're extend the program, which was supposed to end this week, until Congress improves border security.
CHRIS SIMCOX, CO-FOUNDER, MINUTEMAN PROJECT: We will not discontinue patrolling the border until the Congress funds and clear the way for the National Guard and/or specially-trained military troops to follow our model.
O'BRIEN: Minuteman patrols are now being planned for Texas, New Mexico and California. And discussions are under way to spread the program to northern border states like Michigan and Vermont.
One of the group's founders, Jim Gilchrist, says he'll lead an entirely new phase of the project, which will include protests against employers who use illegal immigrants.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
Chris Simcox is the co-founder of the Minuteman Project. He joins us from Washington this morning.
Hey, Chris, good morning. Nice to see you.
SIMCOX: Good morning. Thanks for having me.
O'BRIEN: My pleasure. You have given a number of 315 illegal immigrants that you have essentially headed off across the border. You've said before that something like 3,000 a day try to cross, and that you've cut way back then on these numbers. Where are you getting these figures from?
SIMCOX: Well, that's Border Patrol numbers. And, again, our goal is not to catch anyone. Our goal is to show that if you have a presence on the border, people don't cross in the first place. We shouldn't be catching people coming across our border. They should be coming through an authorized port of entry.
O'BRIEN: But I guess I'm trying to get back to how successful you've been in just the few weeks you've been doing the project. The Border Patrol actually says they have no idea where you're getting these numbers from, neither the 315 that you claim to have already caught, would be the word I use, and also the 3,000, the estimate of the daily numbers of immigrants who try to cross across the board.
SIMCOX: Yes. In the Naco/Tucson sector from the New Mexico border to around Naco in the Huachuca Mountains they average sometimes 2,000 to 3,000 a day. Border Patrol admits in that sector that their apprehensions are down about 60 percent. And that was our goal was to show that if we fund more Border Patrol agents and we set up static observation posts in those areas that people will not cross. And that's the problem. We don't have enough Border Patrol agents on the line.
O'BRIEN: Explain to me exactly how it works. I've seen pictures and videotape where you sit out on lawn chairs and sort of just, as you say, static border patrol, kind of sit there, wait for someone to cross. When you see someone trying to cross the border, what do you do?
SIMCOX: Then we call Border Patrol agents on cell phones, and we tell them, you know, where we've identified people illegally crossing the border. And then we let Border Patrol do the job. We're hoping that we can get National Guard troops or military troops to train on the border, which would be -- you know, solve two problems. Number one, it would help create more of a presence on the border. And then, of course, our soldiers have training with the civilian population as they go into the Middle East.
O'BRIEN: So, what's the strategy with the Congress people you're meeting with today? What are you asking for? What do you want?
SIMCOX: Well, we want military augmentation of Border Patrol until Border Patrol can hire enough agents to effectively secure the borders. You had a poll earlier, citizens in the country are very concerned about the criminal element that comes across their border, the drugs. Most of that comes across our southern border. Child molesters, you know, murderers. We have over 300 families in the Los Angeles area alone who have fallen victim to criminal alien crimes, and who then they run back across the border, and we have no extradition rights with Mexico.
O'BRIEN: You've talked about expanding the project to the northern borders. Same exact scenario? Where exactly?
SIMCOX: Yes. This is in the model of the World War II-era Civil Defense Corps, where when our troops are fighting wars on foreign soil, we, the citizens, pick up the slack and help with homeland security in this instance. So, we're taking this to Vermont, Michigan, North Dakota and Idaho at this point have shown serious interest in bringing this model to their borders and to help with homeland security until our government can fix the problem.
O'BRIEN: We will see what the government can do about it, because, of course, as you know, Congress may not spend the money for this. Chris Simcox, the co-founder of the Minuteman Project, joining us this morning. Thanks for talking with us.
SIMCOX: Sure. My pleasure.
O'BRIEN: One more example of stricter border control, federal agents recently seizing more than 800 pounds of bologna, 100 pounds of cheese smuggled into the U.S. from Mexico. The cheese sandwich fixings, rather, were hidden under clothes and in suitcases. The man entered the country legally. He is not being charged in the case -- Bill.
HEMMER: It's about 22 minutes before the hour now.
Last week, we told about -- talked about, rather, the financial and the safety problems of the so-called Big Dig project in Boston. On the West Coast, there are similar problems. The Bay Bridge that connects San Francisco with Oakland is at issue. And there is a list of problems, too, to talk about and the huge price tag. And now there's a plan for drivers to pay for all of it.
Here's Rusty Dornin this morning.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RUSTY DORNIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): The Oakland Bay Bridge, there is not a day when Anna Sylvester drives it that she doesn't remember the moment she was crossing the span in 1989 when the Loma Prieta earthquake shook the bay area so hard a portion of the bridge in front of her collapsed. It was repaired in a month.
But 16 years later, amid charges of mismanagement, faulty welding and billions in cost overruns, a new quake-safe bridge to replace the existing span is far from finished.
ANNA SYLVESTER, BAY BRIDGE COMMUTER: I do care that from the earthquake perspective that it's taken so long.
DORNIN: Now it's a bridge going nowhere. All work stopped on a section to connect Yerba Buena Island with Oakland, because no one can agree on what it will look like: a suspension tower or a skyway. Tower supporters say it's cheaper to stick with the original design. Caltrans, the state agency charged with building the bridge, claims the suspension design is too complex.
WILL KEMPTON, DIRECTOR, CALTRANS: Complexity breeds uncertainty. And with uncertainty comes the risk of schedule delays and cost increases.
DORNIN (on camera): Speaking of cost increases, in 2001 it was estimated to cost $2.6 billion. Four years later, it's more than tripled, and possibly still rising.
(voice over): How did that happen? Both sides claim skyrocketing steel and concrete prices, and problems with insurance after 9/11. But...
TOM TORLAKSON (D), CALIFORNIA STATE SENATE: On top of that, some mismanagement of the project, which has cost, I think, a couple of hundred million dollars more on top of these inevitable rises in steel and concrete costs.
DORNIN: Caltrans denies the mismanagement charges. Regardless, someone has to pay for it. Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger wants bay area drivers to ante up by increasing the toll from $3 to $5. Work has also stopped on another section due to charges of faulty welding. It won't start up again until the FBI and state inspectors investigate. Caltrans insists the welds are safe.
And for a survivor of the last collapse, safety is paramount.
SYLVESTER: And you hope that the 5 or 10 minutes that you're crossing it that nothing will ever happen to you.
DORNIN: Even if a design is picked tomorrow, the span won't be finished until 2012 at the earliest. And for many, that's a bridge too far from completion.
Rusty Dornin, CNN, San Francisco.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HEMMER: They have issues and need a lot of luck, too, out there in the bay area.
A check of the weather now.
(WEATHER REPORT)
O'BRIEN: Well, everybody thought they were breaking up, right? But Disney might actually get back together with the studio that's behind its biggest hits. Andy is "Minding Your Business" just ahead this morning.
HEMMER: Also today, a follow-up on the transformation of the Plaza Hotel here in New York. We found out what will happen to its most famous guest, and we'll tell you after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: We're going to follow up now on a story we told you about a month ago, the controversy over the closing of the legendary Plaza Hotel in New York City. Two weeks ago, the new owners and the union representing hotel workers struck a deal that will preserve hundreds of rooms and jobs when the renovated hotel opens in late 2006 or 2007. But what about Eloise, the little girl who is perhaps more famous than the hotel itself?
Kelly Wallace back here this morning with an update.
Good morning.
KELLY WALLACE, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Bill.
It seems we still don't know what's going to happen to little Eloise. The cover of "The Wall Street Journal" today, what will become of poor, little Eloise? It seems there's a little bit of a squabble going on. And we've confirmed this as well.
The new owners of the Plaza want Eloise to have a permanent place there when the hotel reopens, but there's a catch. The owner of the TV and merchandising rights wants the Plaza to pay for this privilege, something it has never done before.
Add to this mix the publisher of the Eloise books are angry it's not been part of the negotiations, and threatening to make a deal with another hotel.
Well, all of this means little Eloise could be homeless when the Plaza closes its doors on Saturday.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Good morning, Eloise.
WALLACE (voice over): She is the little girl that every little girl wanted to be, Eloise, footloose and fancy free, the fictional character with a whole lot of room to run around, because, of course, she lives in the Plaza.
(on camera): So, could she be running around the hall right now?
HILARY KNIGHT, ILLUSTRATOR OF "ELOISE" BOOKS: Absolutely, sure. Probably is.
WALLACE: What time is it? It's 12:15. Could she be ordering lunch?
KNIGHT: Yes, sure.
WALLACE (voice over): Meet the man who knows Eloise better than anyone else still living, the illustrator of "Eloise" books, Hilary Knight.
(on camera): What is that amazing connection between Eloise and the Plaza?
KNIGHT: She is established now as this symbol of something that is extraordinary and forceful and imaginative and lots of things that this hotel represents.
WALLACE (voice over): Since she first arrived in 1955, she's been attracting moms and daughters to the hotel, hoping for a glimpse of her shoes.
(on camera): How often do people ask to see Eloise's shoes?
FERNANDO LUNA, PLAZA DOORMAN FOR 24 YEARS: At least 20 times a day.
WALLACE (voice over): And hoping to get a glimpse of their idol. Fernando Luna, who has worked as a doorman for 22 years, gets the question "where's Eloise" more than most.
LUNA: Oh, just left yesterday. But next time when you come over here, I'm going to let Eloise know you're here.
WALLACE: But what will happen once the Plaza closes its doors and the precocious Eloise will no longer be able to order room service, dash through the halls and keep those doormen on their toes? Four-year-old Morgan Killam, who was visiting the Plaza, thinks she knows.
MORGAN KILLAM, 4-YEAR-OLD "ELOISE" FAN: She's going to live in Paris.
WALLACE: Maybe for a while, but then she'll be back when the new Plaza opens its doors, because there couldn't be a Plaza without her.
KNIGHT: She's legendary. She's part of it. She is a legend now. There aren't too many people that can make that claim.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WALLACE: But, again, exactly what place she will have at the new Plaza uncertain. A spokesman for the new owners, who I spoke with this morning, Bill, says everyone is confident there will be a happy solution. But, again, we don't know.
HEMMER: I think they can find some room. I mean, it's good PR, for crying out loud.
WALLACE: It sure is.
HEMMER: Name a movie filmed at the Plaza Hotel.
WALLACE: Oh, good thing we had a test here before. "Crocodile Dundee."
HEMMER: All right.
WALLACE: "Arthur."
HEMMER: All right.
WALLACE: "Home Alone 2."
HEMMER: Correct.
WALLACE: "Scent of a Woman." Right, Al Pacino?
HEMMER: Can you confirm that?
WALLACE: I need to get back to you.
HEMMER: Ted is telling me "Cotton Club 2" in my ear here.
WALLACE: OK, good.
HEMMER: How about "North by Northwest," Alfred Hitchcock in the Oak Bar?
WALLACE: There you go.
HEMMER: I love that. See you, Kelly.
WALLACE: This was a group effort here.
HEMMER: Good stuff. Talk to you later.
WALLACE: OK, thanks.
HEMMER: In a moment here, they were one of Hollywood's most successful duos. Now it looks like Disney is trying to woo back its old partner. Andy has that next "Minding Your Business" right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O'BRIEN: Welcome back, everybody.
There are reports that Disney is trying to get back with one of its exes. Here with details on that, plus a preview of the market this morning, Andy Serwer, he's "Minding Your Business."
Good morning.
ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: Good morning, Soledad.
In Hollywood, business is very, very personal. And a case in point is the situation with Michael Eisner at Disney and Pixar, which is run by Steve Jobs. He also runs Apple Computer.
Eisner has been unable to renew a deal with Pixar, which is one of the most successful movie studios in the history of Hollywood. And that is not an overstatement. They have made six movies, and all of them have been blockbusters -- "Toy Story," "Nemo," "The Incredibles," "Monsters."
This is a very important deal for Disney. And yesterday in a newspaper in Britain, a senior Disney executive now says that they definitely, definitely want to do a deal with Pixar, which is a different tone from what we have been hearing previously.
Michael Eisner hands the reins over to Bob Iger on September 30. So, I would not be surprised to see a deal happen sometime around that time.
O'BRIEN: So, maybe they don't like Michael, but they like Bob?
SERWER: I think that's probably it. Bob is a consensus-builder, as we say in the business world.
Let's talk about the markets a little bit. A good day for investors yesterday. The upward trend continues. You can see here green ink across the board. Lower oil prices and higher housing starts were helping the market move up yesterday. The Dow is still down 5 percent for the year, though. So, don't count your chickens quite yet. And futures are down this morning.
Just crossing the tape, very quickly, Martha Stewart reporting a bigger loss. This company is -- you know, it's a small company, $38 million in sales. It lost $19 million. For all of the hullabaloo about this company, it's a small money-losing business right now. They might get some more money with TV later. But it's just amazing the stuff we talk about.
O'BRIEN: And they're kind of in transition.
SERWER: Right.
O'BRIEN: I mean, she just got out of prison, for god's sake, right?
SERWER: Yes, OK.
O'BRIEN: We've got to give her a little time.
SERWER: Cut her a little slack, yes.
O'BRIEN: All right, thanks, Andy.
SERWER: You're welcome.
HEMMER: I love this "Question of the Day."
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: You do, huh?
HEMMER: Yes.
CAFFERTY: Well, good.
The saying is, "Nice guys finish last." And there may be something to it, at least when it comes to the workplace. A new study in the "Journal of Economic Psychology" claims that how much you are paid is influenced by your personality. The more disagreeable and devious you are at work, the more money you are likely to take home.
The study found of 3,000 people that being agreeable is a negative. The nicer you are, the less money you earn.
The question is this: Which pays better at work, being nice or being a jerk?
D.W. in California: "Definitely being a jerk. Upper management thinks of us as dogs, and they prefer pit bulls over poodles."
Teresa in Michigan: "The chemical plant here in Michigan rewards both the nice and the jerks. The only qualification is that you have no common sense whatsoever."
Chris in Ottawa writes: "Dear Jack, your question today sucks."
HEMMER: Oh, come on, Chris.
CAFFERTY: Steve in Staten Island writes: "Anyone who thinks they can just quietly show up for work each day and they'll be rewarded is a jerk. Make some noise. Positively shake things up. Get noticed. That's the best way to get paid."
And Frank in Pennsylvania: "You tell me. Who makes more, Soledad or Jack?
SERWER: Ooh!
O'BRIEN: Well, here's my question for you.
SERWER: Wow!
O'BRIEN: Here's the question. It's all about a definition. Like, so what's a jerk? I think a lot of times women are painted as obnoxious or a jerk because they stand up for themselves.
SERWER: Yes, there's that point.
O'BRIEN: And the woman who stands up for herself -- a woman who doesn't sort of takes it -- oh, stop rolling your eyes when I go off on my woman thing, Jack. Come on.
CAFFERTY: I didn't say a word.
O'BRIEN: Yes, I know, you're rolling your eyes. But I think if you stand up for yourself...
CAFFERTY: It's a wide shot. They can't see it.
HEMMER: Not from this angle. Turn this way.
CAFFERTY: Only you can see it.
SERWER: Yes.
O'BRIEN: If you stand up for yourself, then you're, you know...
SERWER: A jerk?
O'BRIEN: A jerk.
SERWER: A jerk?
O'BRIEN: And I think that's just people trying to stand up for themselves.
SERWER: I'm getting jerkier all the time.
O'BRIEN: Are you?
SERWER: I think that's the DTs. HEMMER: Yes, that's -- you know, that's...
SERWER: Sorry. That's terrible.
HEMMER: We won't go there.
O'BRIEN: That was a really dumb joke.
CAFFERTY: That was the worst joke you've ever done.
SERWER: This is Vaudeville.
O'BRIEN: Yes, it was, and not very good.
CAFFERTY: That's why it's dead.
SERWER: Exactly. All right. I tried, OK?
O'BRIEN: We've got a lot more time to talk about this. Coming up in just a moment, our special series on retirement, "Never Too Late." Today, why more Americans are still working after 65, and some of them are actually loving it. That's ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
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Aired April 26, 2005 - 07:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning. Welcome back everybody. It's just exactly half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING.
The push is on in Washington, D.C., to make the controversial Minuteman Project a permanent part of U.S. border security. One of the co-founders of that group is going to join us in just a few moments. We're going to talk about the reception that he's getting today from members of Congress.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: They're getting a lot of attention, too, aren't they? Just started?
Also this half-hour, a massive project in California to build a new Oakland Bay bridge. It started off with a hefty price tag, 2.5 billion. Well, now that's tripled, and nobody is working. We'll find out what's happening out there in the bay in California.
O'BRIEN: Yes, I like that shot, because it's like it's not really going anywhere, that big bridge.
HEMMER: Good work if you can get it.
O'BRIEN: Yes. Let's get right to the headlines with Carol.
Hey, good morning.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning to you.
HEMMER: Good morning.
COSTELLO: Good morning to all of you.
"Now in the News."
Thousands are celebrating in Lebanon this morning. Lots of flag- waving, singing and dancing this hour. The country is without Syrian military presence for the first time in three decades. An historic farewell ceremony wrapped up in the Bekaa Valley just about two hours ago. Top Syrian and Lebanon military officials exchanged medals and referred to each other as brothers in arms.
The search for weapons of mass destruction in Iraq has gone as far as possible, and it has come up empty. Investigators say they have found no evidence the weapons were moved to Syria for safekeeping. Its' in a 92-page report released last night. The group released its main findings last October, claiming Saddam Hussein did not possess chemical or biological weapons.
In Washington, a Senate committee is set to debate President Bush's Social Security reforms. The Senate Finance Committee will get under way in less than three hours. In the meantime, President Bush is on the road, trying to drum up support for his proposals. The president will take part in a roundtable in Galveston, Texas, a little later today.
The judge in the Michael Jackson sex trial has ruled he will allow Debbie Rowe to testify for the prosecution. Rowe, as you know, is Jackson's ex-wife and the mother of two of his children.
Here is Jackson's spokeswoman on the judge's decision.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RAYMONE BAIN, MICHAEL JACKSON'S SPOKESWOMAN: Michael and Debbie Rowe had a good relationship. He cares about his kids. He is a wonderful father. And it's nothing Debbie Rowe could say, Larry, other than the fact that Michael Jackson is a loving and caring father. And Michael Jackson was very, very, very kind and very good to Debbie Rowe.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COSTELLO: But she's testifying for the prosecution. She'll take the stand in the case by week's end.
Actor/comedian George Lopez is recovering from a kidney transplant, donated by his wife. Lopez underwent surgery on Monday. A genetic condition apparently caused the kidney deterioration. Lopez and his wife are said to be resting comfortably, and both are expected to make a full recovery. How nice that his wife was able to do that for him.
O'BRIEN: Incredible, isn't it?
COSTELLO: Yes.
O'BRIEN: I mean, that's amazing. I really hadn't heard much about it before they did the surgery.
COSTELLO: Yes, I didn't even know he was sick.
O'BRIEN: Well, we hope that he has a nice, fast and easy recovery and he's right back on TV. Thanks, Carol.
Well, today in Washington, we're going to hear what a volunteer border patrol called the Minutemen claims to have accomplished along the Arizona/Mexico border, also about some plans to expand their effort as well.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
O'BRIEN (voice over): Nearly 900 volunteers have helped capture 315 illegal immigrants along the Mexico/Arizona border. That's what the all-volunteer Minuteman Project says it's accomplished since early April when the group began patrolling a 23-mile stretch of desert between Naco and Douglas.
U.S. border officials have doubts about the group's claims.
MICHAEL NICELY, TUCSON BORDER PATROL CHIEF: As far as them having an affect on stopping illegal immigration, it's been negligible. Any kind of an official government presence on the south is a deterrent.
O'BRIEN: Still, the project's organizers insist they've been successful. And they say they're extend the program, which was supposed to end this week, until Congress improves border security.
CHRIS SIMCOX, CO-FOUNDER, MINUTEMAN PROJECT: We will not discontinue patrolling the border until the Congress funds and clear the way for the National Guard and/or specially-trained military troops to follow our model.
O'BRIEN: Minuteman patrols are now being planned for Texas, New Mexico and California. And discussions are under way to spread the program to northern border states like Michigan and Vermont.
One of the group's founders, Jim Gilchrist, says he'll lead an entirely new phase of the project, which will include protests against employers who use illegal immigrants.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
Chris Simcox is the co-founder of the Minuteman Project. He joins us from Washington this morning.
Hey, Chris, good morning. Nice to see you.
SIMCOX: Good morning. Thanks for having me.
O'BRIEN: My pleasure. You have given a number of 315 illegal immigrants that you have essentially headed off across the border. You've said before that something like 3,000 a day try to cross, and that you've cut way back then on these numbers. Where are you getting these figures from?
SIMCOX: Well, that's Border Patrol numbers. And, again, our goal is not to catch anyone. Our goal is to show that if you have a presence on the border, people don't cross in the first place. We shouldn't be catching people coming across our border. They should be coming through an authorized port of entry.
O'BRIEN: But I guess I'm trying to get back to how successful you've been in just the few weeks you've been doing the project. The Border Patrol actually says they have no idea where you're getting these numbers from, neither the 315 that you claim to have already caught, would be the word I use, and also the 3,000, the estimate of the daily numbers of immigrants who try to cross across the board.
SIMCOX: Yes. In the Naco/Tucson sector from the New Mexico border to around Naco in the Huachuca Mountains they average sometimes 2,000 to 3,000 a day. Border Patrol admits in that sector that their apprehensions are down about 60 percent. And that was our goal was to show that if we fund more Border Patrol agents and we set up static observation posts in those areas that people will not cross. And that's the problem. We don't have enough Border Patrol agents on the line.
O'BRIEN: Explain to me exactly how it works. I've seen pictures and videotape where you sit out on lawn chairs and sort of just, as you say, static border patrol, kind of sit there, wait for someone to cross. When you see someone trying to cross the border, what do you do?
SIMCOX: Then we call Border Patrol agents on cell phones, and we tell them, you know, where we've identified people illegally crossing the border. And then we let Border Patrol do the job. We're hoping that we can get National Guard troops or military troops to train on the border, which would be -- you know, solve two problems. Number one, it would help create more of a presence on the border. And then, of course, our soldiers have training with the civilian population as they go into the Middle East.
O'BRIEN: So, what's the strategy with the Congress people you're meeting with today? What are you asking for? What do you want?
SIMCOX: Well, we want military augmentation of Border Patrol until Border Patrol can hire enough agents to effectively secure the borders. You had a poll earlier, citizens in the country are very concerned about the criminal element that comes across their border, the drugs. Most of that comes across our southern border. Child molesters, you know, murderers. We have over 300 families in the Los Angeles area alone who have fallen victim to criminal alien crimes, and who then they run back across the border, and we have no extradition rights with Mexico.
O'BRIEN: You've talked about expanding the project to the northern borders. Same exact scenario? Where exactly?
SIMCOX: Yes. This is in the model of the World War II-era Civil Defense Corps, where when our troops are fighting wars on foreign soil, we, the citizens, pick up the slack and help with homeland security in this instance. So, we're taking this to Vermont, Michigan, North Dakota and Idaho at this point have shown serious interest in bringing this model to their borders and to help with homeland security until our government can fix the problem.
O'BRIEN: We will see what the government can do about it, because, of course, as you know, Congress may not spend the money for this. Chris Simcox, the co-founder of the Minuteman Project, joining us this morning. Thanks for talking with us.
SIMCOX: Sure. My pleasure.
O'BRIEN: One more example of stricter border control, federal agents recently seizing more than 800 pounds of bologna, 100 pounds of cheese smuggled into the U.S. from Mexico. The cheese sandwich fixings, rather, were hidden under clothes and in suitcases. The man entered the country legally. He is not being charged in the case -- Bill.
HEMMER: It's about 22 minutes before the hour now.
Last week, we told about -- talked about, rather, the financial and the safety problems of the so-called Big Dig project in Boston. On the West Coast, there are similar problems. The Bay Bridge that connects San Francisco with Oakland is at issue. And there is a list of problems, too, to talk about and the huge price tag. And now there's a plan for drivers to pay for all of it.
Here's Rusty Dornin this morning.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RUSTY DORNIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): The Oakland Bay Bridge, there is not a day when Anna Sylvester drives it that she doesn't remember the moment she was crossing the span in 1989 when the Loma Prieta earthquake shook the bay area so hard a portion of the bridge in front of her collapsed. It was repaired in a month.
But 16 years later, amid charges of mismanagement, faulty welding and billions in cost overruns, a new quake-safe bridge to replace the existing span is far from finished.
ANNA SYLVESTER, BAY BRIDGE COMMUTER: I do care that from the earthquake perspective that it's taken so long.
DORNIN: Now it's a bridge going nowhere. All work stopped on a section to connect Yerba Buena Island with Oakland, because no one can agree on what it will look like: a suspension tower or a skyway. Tower supporters say it's cheaper to stick with the original design. Caltrans, the state agency charged with building the bridge, claims the suspension design is too complex.
WILL KEMPTON, DIRECTOR, CALTRANS: Complexity breeds uncertainty. And with uncertainty comes the risk of schedule delays and cost increases.
DORNIN (on camera): Speaking of cost increases, in 2001 it was estimated to cost $2.6 billion. Four years later, it's more than tripled, and possibly still rising.
(voice over): How did that happen? Both sides claim skyrocketing steel and concrete prices, and problems with insurance after 9/11. But...
TOM TORLAKSON (D), CALIFORNIA STATE SENATE: On top of that, some mismanagement of the project, which has cost, I think, a couple of hundred million dollars more on top of these inevitable rises in steel and concrete costs.
DORNIN: Caltrans denies the mismanagement charges. Regardless, someone has to pay for it. Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger wants bay area drivers to ante up by increasing the toll from $3 to $5. Work has also stopped on another section due to charges of faulty welding. It won't start up again until the FBI and state inspectors investigate. Caltrans insists the welds are safe.
And for a survivor of the last collapse, safety is paramount.
SYLVESTER: And you hope that the 5 or 10 minutes that you're crossing it that nothing will ever happen to you.
DORNIN: Even if a design is picked tomorrow, the span won't be finished until 2012 at the earliest. And for many, that's a bridge too far from completion.
Rusty Dornin, CNN, San Francisco.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HEMMER: They have issues and need a lot of luck, too, out there in the bay area.
A check of the weather now.
(WEATHER REPORT)
O'BRIEN: Well, everybody thought they were breaking up, right? But Disney might actually get back together with the studio that's behind its biggest hits. Andy is "Minding Your Business" just ahead this morning.
HEMMER: Also today, a follow-up on the transformation of the Plaza Hotel here in New York. We found out what will happen to its most famous guest, and we'll tell you after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: We're going to follow up now on a story we told you about a month ago, the controversy over the closing of the legendary Plaza Hotel in New York City. Two weeks ago, the new owners and the union representing hotel workers struck a deal that will preserve hundreds of rooms and jobs when the renovated hotel opens in late 2006 or 2007. But what about Eloise, the little girl who is perhaps more famous than the hotel itself?
Kelly Wallace back here this morning with an update.
Good morning.
KELLY WALLACE, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Bill.
It seems we still don't know what's going to happen to little Eloise. The cover of "The Wall Street Journal" today, what will become of poor, little Eloise? It seems there's a little bit of a squabble going on. And we've confirmed this as well.
The new owners of the Plaza want Eloise to have a permanent place there when the hotel reopens, but there's a catch. The owner of the TV and merchandising rights wants the Plaza to pay for this privilege, something it has never done before.
Add to this mix the publisher of the Eloise books are angry it's not been part of the negotiations, and threatening to make a deal with another hotel.
Well, all of this means little Eloise could be homeless when the Plaza closes its doors on Saturday.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Good morning, Eloise.
WALLACE (voice over): She is the little girl that every little girl wanted to be, Eloise, footloose and fancy free, the fictional character with a whole lot of room to run around, because, of course, she lives in the Plaza.
(on camera): So, could she be running around the hall right now?
HILARY KNIGHT, ILLUSTRATOR OF "ELOISE" BOOKS: Absolutely, sure. Probably is.
WALLACE: What time is it? It's 12:15. Could she be ordering lunch?
KNIGHT: Yes, sure.
WALLACE (voice over): Meet the man who knows Eloise better than anyone else still living, the illustrator of "Eloise" books, Hilary Knight.
(on camera): What is that amazing connection between Eloise and the Plaza?
KNIGHT: She is established now as this symbol of something that is extraordinary and forceful and imaginative and lots of things that this hotel represents.
WALLACE (voice over): Since she first arrived in 1955, she's been attracting moms and daughters to the hotel, hoping for a glimpse of her shoes.
(on camera): How often do people ask to see Eloise's shoes?
FERNANDO LUNA, PLAZA DOORMAN FOR 24 YEARS: At least 20 times a day.
WALLACE (voice over): And hoping to get a glimpse of their idol. Fernando Luna, who has worked as a doorman for 22 years, gets the question "where's Eloise" more than most.
LUNA: Oh, just left yesterday. But next time when you come over here, I'm going to let Eloise know you're here.
WALLACE: But what will happen once the Plaza closes its doors and the precocious Eloise will no longer be able to order room service, dash through the halls and keep those doormen on their toes? Four-year-old Morgan Killam, who was visiting the Plaza, thinks she knows.
MORGAN KILLAM, 4-YEAR-OLD "ELOISE" FAN: She's going to live in Paris.
WALLACE: Maybe for a while, but then she'll be back when the new Plaza opens its doors, because there couldn't be a Plaza without her.
KNIGHT: She's legendary. She's part of it. She is a legend now. There aren't too many people that can make that claim.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WALLACE: But, again, exactly what place she will have at the new Plaza uncertain. A spokesman for the new owners, who I spoke with this morning, Bill, says everyone is confident there will be a happy solution. But, again, we don't know.
HEMMER: I think they can find some room. I mean, it's good PR, for crying out loud.
WALLACE: It sure is.
HEMMER: Name a movie filmed at the Plaza Hotel.
WALLACE: Oh, good thing we had a test here before. "Crocodile Dundee."
HEMMER: All right.
WALLACE: "Arthur."
HEMMER: All right.
WALLACE: "Home Alone 2."
HEMMER: Correct.
WALLACE: "Scent of a Woman." Right, Al Pacino?
HEMMER: Can you confirm that?
WALLACE: I need to get back to you.
HEMMER: Ted is telling me "Cotton Club 2" in my ear here.
WALLACE: OK, good.
HEMMER: How about "North by Northwest," Alfred Hitchcock in the Oak Bar?
WALLACE: There you go.
HEMMER: I love that. See you, Kelly.
WALLACE: This was a group effort here.
HEMMER: Good stuff. Talk to you later.
WALLACE: OK, thanks.
HEMMER: In a moment here, they were one of Hollywood's most successful duos. Now it looks like Disney is trying to woo back its old partner. Andy has that next "Minding Your Business" right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O'BRIEN: Welcome back, everybody.
There are reports that Disney is trying to get back with one of its exes. Here with details on that, plus a preview of the market this morning, Andy Serwer, he's "Minding Your Business."
Good morning.
ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: Good morning, Soledad.
In Hollywood, business is very, very personal. And a case in point is the situation with Michael Eisner at Disney and Pixar, which is run by Steve Jobs. He also runs Apple Computer.
Eisner has been unable to renew a deal with Pixar, which is one of the most successful movie studios in the history of Hollywood. And that is not an overstatement. They have made six movies, and all of them have been blockbusters -- "Toy Story," "Nemo," "The Incredibles," "Monsters."
This is a very important deal for Disney. And yesterday in a newspaper in Britain, a senior Disney executive now says that they definitely, definitely want to do a deal with Pixar, which is a different tone from what we have been hearing previously.
Michael Eisner hands the reins over to Bob Iger on September 30. So, I would not be surprised to see a deal happen sometime around that time.
O'BRIEN: So, maybe they don't like Michael, but they like Bob?
SERWER: I think that's probably it. Bob is a consensus-builder, as we say in the business world.
Let's talk about the markets a little bit. A good day for investors yesterday. The upward trend continues. You can see here green ink across the board. Lower oil prices and higher housing starts were helping the market move up yesterday. The Dow is still down 5 percent for the year, though. So, don't count your chickens quite yet. And futures are down this morning.
Just crossing the tape, very quickly, Martha Stewart reporting a bigger loss. This company is -- you know, it's a small company, $38 million in sales. It lost $19 million. For all of the hullabaloo about this company, it's a small money-losing business right now. They might get some more money with TV later. But it's just amazing the stuff we talk about.
O'BRIEN: And they're kind of in transition.
SERWER: Right.
O'BRIEN: I mean, she just got out of prison, for god's sake, right?
SERWER: Yes, OK.
O'BRIEN: We've got to give her a little time.
SERWER: Cut her a little slack, yes.
O'BRIEN: All right, thanks, Andy.
SERWER: You're welcome.
HEMMER: I love this "Question of the Day."
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: You do, huh?
HEMMER: Yes.
CAFFERTY: Well, good.
The saying is, "Nice guys finish last." And there may be something to it, at least when it comes to the workplace. A new study in the "Journal of Economic Psychology" claims that how much you are paid is influenced by your personality. The more disagreeable and devious you are at work, the more money you are likely to take home.
The study found of 3,000 people that being agreeable is a negative. The nicer you are, the less money you earn.
The question is this: Which pays better at work, being nice or being a jerk?
D.W. in California: "Definitely being a jerk. Upper management thinks of us as dogs, and they prefer pit bulls over poodles."
Teresa in Michigan: "The chemical plant here in Michigan rewards both the nice and the jerks. The only qualification is that you have no common sense whatsoever."
Chris in Ottawa writes: "Dear Jack, your question today sucks."
HEMMER: Oh, come on, Chris.
CAFFERTY: Steve in Staten Island writes: "Anyone who thinks they can just quietly show up for work each day and they'll be rewarded is a jerk. Make some noise. Positively shake things up. Get noticed. That's the best way to get paid."
And Frank in Pennsylvania: "You tell me. Who makes more, Soledad or Jack?
SERWER: Ooh!
O'BRIEN: Well, here's my question for you.
SERWER: Wow!
O'BRIEN: Here's the question. It's all about a definition. Like, so what's a jerk? I think a lot of times women are painted as obnoxious or a jerk because they stand up for themselves.
SERWER: Yes, there's that point.
O'BRIEN: And the woman who stands up for herself -- a woman who doesn't sort of takes it -- oh, stop rolling your eyes when I go off on my woman thing, Jack. Come on.
CAFFERTY: I didn't say a word.
O'BRIEN: Yes, I know, you're rolling your eyes. But I think if you stand up for yourself...
CAFFERTY: It's a wide shot. They can't see it.
HEMMER: Not from this angle. Turn this way.
CAFFERTY: Only you can see it.
SERWER: Yes.
O'BRIEN: If you stand up for yourself, then you're, you know...
SERWER: A jerk?
O'BRIEN: A jerk.
SERWER: A jerk?
O'BRIEN: And I think that's just people trying to stand up for themselves.
SERWER: I'm getting jerkier all the time.
O'BRIEN: Are you?
SERWER: I think that's the DTs. HEMMER: Yes, that's -- you know, that's...
SERWER: Sorry. That's terrible.
HEMMER: We won't go there.
O'BRIEN: That was a really dumb joke.
CAFFERTY: That was the worst joke you've ever done.
SERWER: This is Vaudeville.
O'BRIEN: Yes, it was, and not very good.
CAFFERTY: That's why it's dead.
SERWER: Exactly. All right. I tried, OK?
O'BRIEN: We've got a lot more time to talk about this. Coming up in just a moment, our special series on retirement, "Never Too Late." Today, why more Americans are still working after 65, and some of them are actually loving it. That's ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
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