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American Morning
Tabloid Photos of Hussein Create Controversy
Aired May 23, 2005 - 08:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning.
Welcome, everybody.
Talk this morning that Saddam Hussein might be suing over the pictures that were published of him in his underwear.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: We're going to talk to one of Saddam's lawyers in a moment here.
We'll get to that story in a moment.
First, Jack Cafferty also with us here.
What's coming up in "The File?" -- good morning.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Coming up in "The Cafferty File," Bill, we'll introduce you to the entire class, graduating class, of 2005 in Outlook, Montana. It won't take long.
Sex in the city for old people.
And the top frog in Calaveras County poses for pictures.
HEMMER: All right, you're cooking on a Monday, aren't you?
CAFFERTY: Yes.
HEMMER: Nice.
Thanks, Jack.
To the headlines.
Here's Carol Costello again -- good morning, Carol.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning.
Good morning to all of you.
Now in the news, Afghan President Hamid Karzai wants more say over U.S.-led military operations in Afghanistan. Karzai is expected to push the issue when he meets with President Bush at the White House just about two hours from now. Both leaders are expected to speak later this morning.
CNN will have live coverage of the event in the Rose Garden beginning at 11:00 a.m. Eastern.
In Florida, a court appearance today for the man accused of sexually assaulting an 8-year-old girl and then leaving her for dead in a landfill. The suspect is being held on charges of attempted murder, sexual battery and false imprisonment. The girl is recovering in good condition this morning. Police call finding her alive a miracle. She was in a landfill in a dumpster, covered up with rocks.
The family of former NFL player Pat Tillman is criticizing the Army for the way it handled the investigation of their son's death. More than a year after he was killed by friendly fire in Afghanistan, Tillman's family tells the "Washington Post" military investigators tried to cover up the truth and create a heroic tale about how their son died. Army officials say everything was done to keep the family informed.
A school bus crash in Miami, Florida this morning. These pictures just in to CNN. Some cars and two homes damaged. Look at that. The school bus ran right into a home. No word of injuries. Emergency crews, as you can see, are on the scene. Of course, we'll keep you posted as we get more information on this.
What a weird picture that is.
HEMMER: Not the kind of wake up call you want, you're right, Carol.
Thanks.
A number of developments already today in a violent day in Iraq. An adviser to the prime minister was assassinated in a drive-by shooting and a major explosion killed at least three people, injured more than 50, at a popular restaurant in northern Baghdad.
Also, five members of a Kurdish official's security team dead after a car bomb went off in northern Iraq.
Three suicide bombers went after U.S. troops in Samara. That's also north of Baghdad. There were three Americans wounded in that incident.
Also in northern Iraq, in Mosul, three American soldiers killed today, or, rather, on Sunday, in insurgent attacks there. Four civilians died in a car bombing.
Another U.S. soldier died in a car bomb explosion north of Tikrit on Sunday.
And in western Baghdad, a combined U.S.-Iraqi force has rounded up "a substantial number of suspected terrorists" in an operation called Squeeze Play.
Also throughout Iraq today, there is strong reaction to those published pictures of Saddam Hussein in his underwear.
Ryan Chilcote is live in Baghdad -- Ryan, what are you hearing on this?
RYAN CHILCOTE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Bill, as you know, those photos came out stateside late last week. But they only made their way into the Iraqi papers over the weekend, creating quite the impression here on Iraqis.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
CHILCOTE (voice-over): On the newsstands of Baghdad, beneath the glamour shots of Arab and Western models, front page photos of a half- naked Saddam Hussein. Iraqis snapped them up, but draw different views.
Dr. Amar Sabr (ph) found them distasteful and had no doubt about why they'd appeared in the newspapers.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think to humiliate Iraqi people.
CHILCOTE: In a country where proper opinion polls are impossible, our unscientific survey came up with one universal conclusion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): These photos are unacceptable, immoral and hurt all Iraqis, regardless whether we like or dislike the previous regime. At the end of the day, Saddam was the president of Iraq. It is unacceptable for the American administration.
CHILCOTE: One man did get a kick out of them
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): He's sitting in the cell he deserves. With no A/C in there, maybe he got hot and decided to take off some clothes. Besides, he'd already humiliated himself and his country with what he did to it.
CHILCOTE: At an Internet cafe, we found two women who looked, but refused to talk. Kamal Hassan (ph) had just finished a Google search for Saddam and sex when we walked up. He, like everyone we spoke with, blamed the U.S. government for the photo's release.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): I am sure the new photos were published on purpose. It's a clear message to all the Arab leaders who oppose America: they will end up in a small jail facing humiliation.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
CHILCOTE: Bill, you know, after those photos came out from Abu Ghraib, one thing that is clear is that while Iraqis have differing views of Saddam Hussein, and some probably found the pictures to be funny, most didn't. And there seems to be a pretty widespread suspicion of the U.S. military's intentions. Almost everybody here believes that the U.S. military leaked those pictures on purpose to both embarrass, as you heard, Saddam, and the Iraqi people -- Bill.
HEMMER: Ryan Chilcote live in Baghdad -- Soledad. O'BRIEN: Well, Giovanni Di Stefano is one of Saddam Hussein's attorneys.
He joins us from London this morning.
Nice to see you, Dr. Di Stefano.
Thank you for talking with us.
GIOVANNI DI STEFANO, ATTORNEY FOR SADDAM HUSSEIN: Good morning.
O'BRIEN: What was your reaction when you first saw those pictures?
DI STEFANO: Well, as we have said, it is regrettable and unfortunate that this should have happened. It doesn't, however, distract from the situation, that here we have a man that has not been charged with any crime whatsoever and has been 19 months in custody. And that is something that needs to be addressed far more than the question of any man in his underpants or whatever.
O'BRIEN: OK, so then on both fronts, both the photos and also the 19 months without any charges, as you say, what do you plan to do?
DI STEFANO: Well, what I've done today, of course, if any offense has occurred, and we have to give the benefit of the doubt in the same way that Saddam Hussein is currently today innocent of anything, so are the tabloid newspapers who have published these photographs.
There is a law that applies for all.
We have today written, and I have here, a letter to the attorney general in the United Kingdom, because if any offense under the Geneva Convention has occurred, it has occurred in the United Kingdom. And what is surprising to all of us is the silence from the British government, from the ministry of the defense and from the attorney general. Everyone, every jurist that has seen these pictures believes that there an offense is being committed. And it's been committed on more than one occasion now. And the attorney general has done nothing. And that's something that, in our letter, we have asked him to explain why he has taken no action on something that is so, so clear, a potential breach of the Geneva Convention's Section 13.
O'BRIEN: Here's what the Pentagon had to say about the photographs: "They were taken in clear violation of DOD" -- Department of Defense -- "directives and possibly Geneva Convention guidelines for the humane treatment of detained individuals."
What do you think Britain, then, needs to do its own investigation?
DI STEFANO: Well, the offense occurred, if anything, they were published in a British newspaper. You would think that common sense would prevail and that the British government would make some statement or would say something. We have to give credit to President Bush and to Donald Rumsfeld, who at least have called for an aggressive investigation. It may very well be a whitewash, but he's called for one.
But Britain has called for nothing and that is something that has to be addressed. This is a criminal offense. The Geneva Convention is in the statute books in the United Kingdom, and it has to be addressed, like any other crime, like burglary, murder, rape, house breaking, anything else. And they've done nothing. And that leak gives me cause for concern as to the involvement of perhaps not the American military, but perhaps the British military.
O'BRIEN: As you well know, Saddam Hussein has many, many lawyers. Many of them have been quoted in various press.
Have any of you spoken to him since these pictures have been released and do you know what his reaction has been? Is he aware of them?
DI STEFANO: Well, I mean without a doubt he would be aware of those by now. But I understand that my colleague Carlie (ph) will be attending him this week or next week to find out what action, if anything, the president wants to take.
For our part, we want, in England, an inquiry, and we want the attorney general to explain why, when a potential crime has been committed, he has taken no action, made no statement, has not sent the police, has not secured the scene of the crime, has asked for no witness statements from anybody. It is very, very unusual. And this is something, again, unlike the Americans, this is something that has to be addressed here in the U.K., not so much in America.
O'BRIEN: Giovanni Di Stefano is one of Saddam Hussein's attorneys.
Thanks for joining us this morning.
Appreciate your time.
DI STEFANO: Thank you.
Thank you.
HEMMER: About eight minutes past the hour now, Soledad.
Afghan President Hamid Karzai is in Washington today meeting with the president at the White House. In fact, that meeting will take place in a few hours from now.
Among the topics likely to be discussed there, allegations of the abuse and reported death of two Afghan detainees back in 2002.
President Karzai talked about that issue with CNN, and about his reaction to that report.
Listen here.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRES. HAMID KARZAI, AFGHANISTAN: This is simply, simply not acceptable. We are angry about this. We want justice. We want the people responsible for this sort of a brutal behavior punished and tried and made public.
At the same time, I must say that while we condemn this, we tell Afghans, we tell the rest of the world that the behavior of one or two soldiers or interrogators must not reflect on the United States or on the U.S. people. There are bad people everywhere.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HEMMER: President Karzai is also expected to defend his government's efforts to eradicate the heroin trade. And we will have live coverage later today when the presidents speak at the White House, both of them, in the Rose Garden, starting at 11:00 a.m. Eastern time, 8:00 out on the West Coast. We'll have it for you then.
In the meantime, a check on the weather.
He's Chad Myers again on a Monday -- how goes it?
The Northeast looks how, my friend?
(WEATHER REPORT)
O'BRIEN: Coming up in just a moment, was it discrimination? It's being alleged of a department store hair salon. One woman tells us why she is suing over the salon's prices.
HEMMER: Also, back to the shocking fight caught on videotape between the school bus driver and students on board. Now there's a question today, and a bit of a controversy over the charges in that case. We'll get back to it in a moment.
O'BRIEN: And does your boyfriend or your husband or your co- anchor refuse to ask for directions?
HEMMER: No.
O'BRIEN: Could be a man thing. It could be because of how his brain is wired. We are "Paging Dr. Gupta" ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O'BRIEN: A lawsuit filed in Alabama federal court accuses a Dillard's Department Store of charging black women more for salon services than white women. Vaughan Thomas is one of the plaintiffs in the suit. She recorded a conversation that she says proves that the store deliberately set higher prices for shampoo and styling for black customers.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRISH: OK shampoo and style, $30. Shampoo and style, $30. VAUGHAN THOMAS: But for who?
TRISH: They always told me now, since I've worked at Dillard's, black hair was $30. Now, that's what I was told.
THOMAS: That's what I'm saying. That's what they told u.
TRISH: Honestly, that's what I was told. That's what I was told. It's not my rules, now, that's what I was told. See what I'm saying? That's what I was told.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: Vaughan Thomas and her attorney, Patrick Cooper, join us this morning from Birmingham, Alabama.
Nice to see you both.
Thanks for talking with us.
Vaughan, the person at the center of all this really is your mother-in-law. She's 67 years old and you took her in for a wash and set.
What were you told at the time?
VAUGHAN THOMAS: I was told that it would cost $30 for a wash and a set.
O'BRIEN: OK. And that bothered you? Or what your reaction?
THOMAS: Well, it bothered me because I thought it was rather high and when I came back to pick her up, I started talking to the hair stylist. And I asked her well why was it so expensive to get a wash and a roller set? And she said it's really not that much money. I says you don't think $30 is a lot of money for a wash and a roller set. She said, no, ma'am, it's not that. It's that management tells us -- meaning the stylists -- to charge ethnics $30 and to charge Caucasians $20. I really didn't believe her, but she said it's really so, that management tells them to do that.
O'BRIEN: So what was your reaction to that?
THOMAS: I didn't believe her at first. I thought she was just joking. So I told her I wanted to ask management, and I did.
O'BRIEN: And what did they say?
THOMAS: They said -- I asked her, "How much is it for a wash and a roller set?"
And she said to me, "Well, for what kind of hair?"
I says, "What difference does it make?"
She says, "Well, ethnic hair is $30, Caucasian is $20." O'BRIEN: Here's what Dillard's has to say, Vaughn.
Let me read it to you: "Dillard's does not charge different prices based on the race of the customer. This is a matter which has been distorted by the apparent simplicity of the plaintiff's claim. Prices for salon services are based on the level of experience of the hair stylist, degree of the service, amount of the time required and the cost of materials provided to the customer."
That's what Dillard's had to say when they responded.
Do they have a point there? Did your mother-in-law take a little more time, require more conditioner and more blow drying services?
PATRICK COOPER, THOMAS' ATTORNEY: You know, Soledad, this is Patrick Cooper.
And let me respond to that.
That is a -- like since this issue has hit the national media, that's been a complete about-face by Dillard's. Prior to you guys contacting them, their position had always been that there is a policy for Caucasian hair and for ethnic hair and that it's justified. And not only was it justified, they intended proving in court, with expert witnesses, that this is a policy that's going to stay in place.
So now that you've had some national sunshine, sort of, hit this issue, they've done a complete about-face. And it's completely, also, contrary to what they have told the judge.
O'BRIEN: But is there...
COOPER: And...
O'BRIEN: Isn't there a point that if -- that they are trying to make that maybe ethnic hair, or whatever they're figuring is ethnic hair, it might require more time and more stuff, and that would translate into more money?
COOPER: Well, now, let me tell you what this issue is.
Our lawsuit focuses on just the most basic, common, elemental starting point when you go to a hair salon, which is basically having your hair shampooed and put in rollers and then hair dried. We're not talking about tinting. We're not talking about a hairdo. We're talking about the most basic thing that you can talk about, which is shampooing and putting in curlers and hair drying. And there, what they're doing is they have decided that they will look at someone and figure out whether they are Caucasian or whether they are "ethnic," which is basically black. And based on that, not looking at, for example, the length of their hair or looking at the texture of their hair, they will make a decision based purely on race. And you can't do that.
O'BRIEN: This is not a class action...
COOPER: Uh.
O'BRIEN: Let me just interrupt you there for a second.
It's not a class action lawsuit. At the end of the day we're talking about a $30 wash and set.
How much money are you seeking in damages from Dillard's?
COOPER: No, no, no. It is a class action.
O'BRIEN: Oh, it is?
COOPER: We've filed the lawsuit. It's a -- we've asked the judge to certify a class for all African-American women who over the, you know, the past couple of decades have been discriminated by this policy, who, quite, I also point out, had no...
O'BRIEN: How much money are you looking for?
COOPER: Well, you know what, we can't figure out -- we figure it's going to be millions upon millions. But we can't have an accurate determination until we get their documents and we look and see what their financials have been over the past years with their 300 and some odd stores around the U.S.
O'BRIEN: Vaughn...
COOPER: But this is a...
O'BRIEN: Let me just ask Vaughn the last question before we run out of time.
COOPER: Sure.
O'BRIEN: Vaughn, what would you like to see at the end of the day? Do you want financial compensation from Dillard's? Do you want an apology? What do you want?
THOMAS: I'd like to see the procedures stopped. It's not fair. We're in the 21st century. No one should have to go through that. So Dillard's really needs to stop.
O'BRIEN: Vaughn Thomas and Patrick Cooper joining us this morning.
Thanks for sharing your story.
Appreciate your time.
THOMAS: Great.
Thank you.
COOPER: Thank you.
HEMMER: Just about 20 minutes past the hour now. In a moment here, the first lady running into a bit of a protest over the weekend, from both sides, over the weekend, in fact. Did the White House misjudge her tour or is this simply a reflection of the times? We'll debate that with Kamber and May this hour on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: The Question of the Day -- back to Jack for that.
CAFFERTY: Nearly 200 level three sex offenders getting free Viagra courtesy of the New York taxpayers. An audit by the state comptroller's office found that Medicaid was reimbursing Viagra and giving the money to people convicted of assaulting kids as young as two and raping women as old as 90.
Courts have determined that level three sex offenders represent a high risk to public safety. A 1998 federal mandate requires state Medicaid programs to pay for Viagra. It's a problem.
The question is this, should Medicaid coverage include sexual potency pills such as Viagra?
Nobody thinks this is a great idea.
Jeffrey in Maryland writes: "Sure, Jack. And we ought to supply bullets for violent felons, alcohol for alcoholics and heroin and meth for drug addicts."
Jody in Michigan writes: "Medicaid won't pay me for half my asthma or allergy medications. I don't think it's fair that Medicaid will pay for people to have sex when they won't help me breathe."
Cherie in Maine writes: "Medicaid should only pay for prescriptions that are necessary, such as heart medication, blood pressure, diabetes, etc."
And Theresa in New York writes: "Jack, again, you leave me scratching my head with these issues. Sex pills for pervs is as irresponsible as giving guns to gang members or, worse, power to warmongers. Oh, wait, we did that already. Never mind."
O'BRIEN: Theresa has started e-mailing you all the time.
CAFFERTY: Has she?
O'BRIEN: Yes. Yes, I follow her.
CAFFERTY: Yes?
O'BRIEN: She's pretty well read in.
Has anybody established any kind of medical necessity for Viagra that you know of? I mean that's the only way that that would make sense in any way, shape or form. CAFFERTY: Oh, I don't know if there's a medical necessity, but the federal government mandated that Medicaid pay for it. There was a question in 1998 and they said no, you must pay for this. So if a doctor prescribes it, Medicaid has to pay for it.
HEMMER: And the senators from New York are taking it up now.
CAFFERTY: And I guess it's up to a doctor to decide if it's necessary. I mean that's -- it's a prescription drug.
O'BRIEN: And this is the -- Medicaid won't pay for birth control pills, right?
CAFFERTY: That I don't know. I've never tried to get a prescription for the pills.
HEMMER: Charles Schumer is coming up in about an hour, too, so we can put some of these questions to him then, too.
O'BRIEN: Oh, good.
All right, Jack, thanks.
HEMMER: It was so hot in L.A. on Sunday. How hot was it?
O'BRIEN: That was my line.
HEMMER: Thank you.
O'BRIEN: How hot was it, Bill?
HEMMER: Come on.
This 200 pound black bear went for a swim. A dip in the backyard pool, the L.A. suburb of Puerto Ranch. Police and eyewitnesses say the bear seemed a bit lost -- true -- and very thirsty.
Listen here.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CAPT. JOHN MITCHELL, LOS ANGELES FIRE DEPARTMENT: Well, when we got here, he seemed very hot and very tired. He was panting heavily. I really think he was looking for water, and he found it.
KATHERINE HAKOOPIAN, RESIDENT: He was basically running up to doors. He was banging on windows. He was trying to find his way out of here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HEMMER: Wildlife experts later moved in. They tranquilized the bear and told him to wait until the adults swim. Actually, they took him back to the woods and let him run his own way.
O'BRIEN: He actually looks pretty comfortable. HEMMER: He got his dip. He's in the deep end there, too, Soledad. You see that?
O'BRIEN: He's a good swimmer, apparently.
Well, if your boyfriend or your husband refuses to ask for directions when driving, it may not be his fault after all. Coming up, some surprising new research on the differences between men's and women's brains. We're "Paging Dr. Gupta" on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: You can get the latest news every morning in your e- mail. Sign up for AMERICAN MORNING "Quick News" at cnn.com/am. There for you right now, in fact.
In a moment here, the shocking school bus fight between a driver and the students caught on videotape. Now there's a controversy today over whether or not who should face the most serious charges. We will revisit this story in a moment here on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: Almost 8:30 here in New York on a Monday morning.
Good to have you along with us today.
Good morning.
O'BRIEN: Going back at you.
HEMMER: How about this videotape?
O'BRIEN: Oh.
HEMMER: I mean this will get your attention. Look at this. Hit happened on a school bus.
O'BRIEN: That's the driver.
HEMMER: It involved the driver, right, going back with some students in the back seat there, caught on videotape fighting with the students.
O'BRIEN: It's pretty amazing when you see his hands are around the neck of these students. He's now charged with a misdemeanor. The students, though, charged with felonies. Well, now that school officials have seen the tape, could those charges change? That's ahead this morning.
Headlines first, though.
Here's Carol Costello -- good morning.
COSTELLO: Good morning.
Good morning to all of you.
Now in the news, U.S. and Iraqi forces rounding up a substantial number of suspected terrorists. The new mission being called Operation Squeeze Play. It was launched in western Baghdad. In the meantime, these are new pictures just in to CNN of that explosion we told you about earlier. A car bomb went off at a restaurant in the Iraqi capital just two hours ago. An Iraqi official says at least four people are dead, more than 100 others wounded.
Investigators collecting the last remnants of evidence from an Idaho home where three people were found dead, two small children still missing. They are 8-year-old Shasta Groene and her 9-year-old brother, Dylan. CNN has obtained home video of the girl taken earlier this month. Police say they've received more than 800 tips in the search, but no solid leads.
Their father, Steve Groene, says an FBI agent told him he failed parts of a polygraph test. But Groene insists he does not know where his children are.
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Aired May 23, 2005 - 08:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning.
Welcome, everybody.
Talk this morning that Saddam Hussein might be suing over the pictures that were published of him in his underwear.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: We're going to talk to one of Saddam's lawyers in a moment here.
We'll get to that story in a moment.
First, Jack Cafferty also with us here.
What's coming up in "The File?" -- good morning.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Coming up in "The Cafferty File," Bill, we'll introduce you to the entire class, graduating class, of 2005 in Outlook, Montana. It won't take long.
Sex in the city for old people.
And the top frog in Calaveras County poses for pictures.
HEMMER: All right, you're cooking on a Monday, aren't you?
CAFFERTY: Yes.
HEMMER: Nice.
Thanks, Jack.
To the headlines.
Here's Carol Costello again -- good morning, Carol.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning.
Good morning to all of you.
Now in the news, Afghan President Hamid Karzai wants more say over U.S.-led military operations in Afghanistan. Karzai is expected to push the issue when he meets with President Bush at the White House just about two hours from now. Both leaders are expected to speak later this morning.
CNN will have live coverage of the event in the Rose Garden beginning at 11:00 a.m. Eastern.
In Florida, a court appearance today for the man accused of sexually assaulting an 8-year-old girl and then leaving her for dead in a landfill. The suspect is being held on charges of attempted murder, sexual battery and false imprisonment. The girl is recovering in good condition this morning. Police call finding her alive a miracle. She was in a landfill in a dumpster, covered up with rocks.
The family of former NFL player Pat Tillman is criticizing the Army for the way it handled the investigation of their son's death. More than a year after he was killed by friendly fire in Afghanistan, Tillman's family tells the "Washington Post" military investigators tried to cover up the truth and create a heroic tale about how their son died. Army officials say everything was done to keep the family informed.
A school bus crash in Miami, Florida this morning. These pictures just in to CNN. Some cars and two homes damaged. Look at that. The school bus ran right into a home. No word of injuries. Emergency crews, as you can see, are on the scene. Of course, we'll keep you posted as we get more information on this.
What a weird picture that is.
HEMMER: Not the kind of wake up call you want, you're right, Carol.
Thanks.
A number of developments already today in a violent day in Iraq. An adviser to the prime minister was assassinated in a drive-by shooting and a major explosion killed at least three people, injured more than 50, at a popular restaurant in northern Baghdad.
Also, five members of a Kurdish official's security team dead after a car bomb went off in northern Iraq.
Three suicide bombers went after U.S. troops in Samara. That's also north of Baghdad. There were three Americans wounded in that incident.
Also in northern Iraq, in Mosul, three American soldiers killed today, or, rather, on Sunday, in insurgent attacks there. Four civilians died in a car bombing.
Another U.S. soldier died in a car bomb explosion north of Tikrit on Sunday.
And in western Baghdad, a combined U.S.-Iraqi force has rounded up "a substantial number of suspected terrorists" in an operation called Squeeze Play.
Also throughout Iraq today, there is strong reaction to those published pictures of Saddam Hussein in his underwear.
Ryan Chilcote is live in Baghdad -- Ryan, what are you hearing on this?
RYAN CHILCOTE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Bill, as you know, those photos came out stateside late last week. But they only made their way into the Iraqi papers over the weekend, creating quite the impression here on Iraqis.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
CHILCOTE (voice-over): On the newsstands of Baghdad, beneath the glamour shots of Arab and Western models, front page photos of a half- naked Saddam Hussein. Iraqis snapped them up, but draw different views.
Dr. Amar Sabr (ph) found them distasteful and had no doubt about why they'd appeared in the newspapers.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think to humiliate Iraqi people.
CHILCOTE: In a country where proper opinion polls are impossible, our unscientific survey came up with one universal conclusion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): These photos are unacceptable, immoral and hurt all Iraqis, regardless whether we like or dislike the previous regime. At the end of the day, Saddam was the president of Iraq. It is unacceptable for the American administration.
CHILCOTE: One man did get a kick out of them
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): He's sitting in the cell he deserves. With no A/C in there, maybe he got hot and decided to take off some clothes. Besides, he'd already humiliated himself and his country with what he did to it.
CHILCOTE: At an Internet cafe, we found two women who looked, but refused to talk. Kamal Hassan (ph) had just finished a Google search for Saddam and sex when we walked up. He, like everyone we spoke with, blamed the U.S. government for the photo's release.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): I am sure the new photos were published on purpose. It's a clear message to all the Arab leaders who oppose America: they will end up in a small jail facing humiliation.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
CHILCOTE: Bill, you know, after those photos came out from Abu Ghraib, one thing that is clear is that while Iraqis have differing views of Saddam Hussein, and some probably found the pictures to be funny, most didn't. And there seems to be a pretty widespread suspicion of the U.S. military's intentions. Almost everybody here believes that the U.S. military leaked those pictures on purpose to both embarrass, as you heard, Saddam, and the Iraqi people -- Bill.
HEMMER: Ryan Chilcote live in Baghdad -- Soledad. O'BRIEN: Well, Giovanni Di Stefano is one of Saddam Hussein's attorneys.
He joins us from London this morning.
Nice to see you, Dr. Di Stefano.
Thank you for talking with us.
GIOVANNI DI STEFANO, ATTORNEY FOR SADDAM HUSSEIN: Good morning.
O'BRIEN: What was your reaction when you first saw those pictures?
DI STEFANO: Well, as we have said, it is regrettable and unfortunate that this should have happened. It doesn't, however, distract from the situation, that here we have a man that has not been charged with any crime whatsoever and has been 19 months in custody. And that is something that needs to be addressed far more than the question of any man in his underpants or whatever.
O'BRIEN: OK, so then on both fronts, both the photos and also the 19 months without any charges, as you say, what do you plan to do?
DI STEFANO: Well, what I've done today, of course, if any offense has occurred, and we have to give the benefit of the doubt in the same way that Saddam Hussein is currently today innocent of anything, so are the tabloid newspapers who have published these photographs.
There is a law that applies for all.
We have today written, and I have here, a letter to the attorney general in the United Kingdom, because if any offense under the Geneva Convention has occurred, it has occurred in the United Kingdom. And what is surprising to all of us is the silence from the British government, from the ministry of the defense and from the attorney general. Everyone, every jurist that has seen these pictures believes that there an offense is being committed. And it's been committed on more than one occasion now. And the attorney general has done nothing. And that's something that, in our letter, we have asked him to explain why he has taken no action on something that is so, so clear, a potential breach of the Geneva Convention's Section 13.
O'BRIEN: Here's what the Pentagon had to say about the photographs: "They were taken in clear violation of DOD" -- Department of Defense -- "directives and possibly Geneva Convention guidelines for the humane treatment of detained individuals."
What do you think Britain, then, needs to do its own investigation?
DI STEFANO: Well, the offense occurred, if anything, they were published in a British newspaper. You would think that common sense would prevail and that the British government would make some statement or would say something. We have to give credit to President Bush and to Donald Rumsfeld, who at least have called for an aggressive investigation. It may very well be a whitewash, but he's called for one.
But Britain has called for nothing and that is something that has to be addressed. This is a criminal offense. The Geneva Convention is in the statute books in the United Kingdom, and it has to be addressed, like any other crime, like burglary, murder, rape, house breaking, anything else. And they've done nothing. And that leak gives me cause for concern as to the involvement of perhaps not the American military, but perhaps the British military.
O'BRIEN: As you well know, Saddam Hussein has many, many lawyers. Many of them have been quoted in various press.
Have any of you spoken to him since these pictures have been released and do you know what his reaction has been? Is he aware of them?
DI STEFANO: Well, I mean without a doubt he would be aware of those by now. But I understand that my colleague Carlie (ph) will be attending him this week or next week to find out what action, if anything, the president wants to take.
For our part, we want, in England, an inquiry, and we want the attorney general to explain why, when a potential crime has been committed, he has taken no action, made no statement, has not sent the police, has not secured the scene of the crime, has asked for no witness statements from anybody. It is very, very unusual. And this is something, again, unlike the Americans, this is something that has to be addressed here in the U.K., not so much in America.
O'BRIEN: Giovanni Di Stefano is one of Saddam Hussein's attorneys.
Thanks for joining us this morning.
Appreciate your time.
DI STEFANO: Thank you.
Thank you.
HEMMER: About eight minutes past the hour now, Soledad.
Afghan President Hamid Karzai is in Washington today meeting with the president at the White House. In fact, that meeting will take place in a few hours from now.
Among the topics likely to be discussed there, allegations of the abuse and reported death of two Afghan detainees back in 2002.
President Karzai talked about that issue with CNN, and about his reaction to that report.
Listen here.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRES. HAMID KARZAI, AFGHANISTAN: This is simply, simply not acceptable. We are angry about this. We want justice. We want the people responsible for this sort of a brutal behavior punished and tried and made public.
At the same time, I must say that while we condemn this, we tell Afghans, we tell the rest of the world that the behavior of one or two soldiers or interrogators must not reflect on the United States or on the U.S. people. There are bad people everywhere.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HEMMER: President Karzai is also expected to defend his government's efforts to eradicate the heroin trade. And we will have live coverage later today when the presidents speak at the White House, both of them, in the Rose Garden, starting at 11:00 a.m. Eastern time, 8:00 out on the West Coast. We'll have it for you then.
In the meantime, a check on the weather.
He's Chad Myers again on a Monday -- how goes it?
The Northeast looks how, my friend?
(WEATHER REPORT)
O'BRIEN: Coming up in just a moment, was it discrimination? It's being alleged of a department store hair salon. One woman tells us why she is suing over the salon's prices.
HEMMER: Also, back to the shocking fight caught on videotape between the school bus driver and students on board. Now there's a question today, and a bit of a controversy over the charges in that case. We'll get back to it in a moment.
O'BRIEN: And does your boyfriend or your husband or your co- anchor refuse to ask for directions?
HEMMER: No.
O'BRIEN: Could be a man thing. It could be because of how his brain is wired. We are "Paging Dr. Gupta" ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O'BRIEN: A lawsuit filed in Alabama federal court accuses a Dillard's Department Store of charging black women more for salon services than white women. Vaughan Thomas is one of the plaintiffs in the suit. She recorded a conversation that she says proves that the store deliberately set higher prices for shampoo and styling for black customers.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRISH: OK shampoo and style, $30. Shampoo and style, $30. VAUGHAN THOMAS: But for who?
TRISH: They always told me now, since I've worked at Dillard's, black hair was $30. Now, that's what I was told.
THOMAS: That's what I'm saying. That's what they told u.
TRISH: Honestly, that's what I was told. That's what I was told. It's not my rules, now, that's what I was told. See what I'm saying? That's what I was told.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: Vaughan Thomas and her attorney, Patrick Cooper, join us this morning from Birmingham, Alabama.
Nice to see you both.
Thanks for talking with us.
Vaughan, the person at the center of all this really is your mother-in-law. She's 67 years old and you took her in for a wash and set.
What were you told at the time?
VAUGHAN THOMAS: I was told that it would cost $30 for a wash and a set.
O'BRIEN: OK. And that bothered you? Or what your reaction?
THOMAS: Well, it bothered me because I thought it was rather high and when I came back to pick her up, I started talking to the hair stylist. And I asked her well why was it so expensive to get a wash and a roller set? And she said it's really not that much money. I says you don't think $30 is a lot of money for a wash and a roller set. She said, no, ma'am, it's not that. It's that management tells us -- meaning the stylists -- to charge ethnics $30 and to charge Caucasians $20. I really didn't believe her, but she said it's really so, that management tells them to do that.
O'BRIEN: So what was your reaction to that?
THOMAS: I didn't believe her at first. I thought she was just joking. So I told her I wanted to ask management, and I did.
O'BRIEN: And what did they say?
THOMAS: They said -- I asked her, "How much is it for a wash and a roller set?"
And she said to me, "Well, for what kind of hair?"
I says, "What difference does it make?"
She says, "Well, ethnic hair is $30, Caucasian is $20." O'BRIEN: Here's what Dillard's has to say, Vaughn.
Let me read it to you: "Dillard's does not charge different prices based on the race of the customer. This is a matter which has been distorted by the apparent simplicity of the plaintiff's claim. Prices for salon services are based on the level of experience of the hair stylist, degree of the service, amount of the time required and the cost of materials provided to the customer."
That's what Dillard's had to say when they responded.
Do they have a point there? Did your mother-in-law take a little more time, require more conditioner and more blow drying services?
PATRICK COOPER, THOMAS' ATTORNEY: You know, Soledad, this is Patrick Cooper.
And let me respond to that.
That is a -- like since this issue has hit the national media, that's been a complete about-face by Dillard's. Prior to you guys contacting them, their position had always been that there is a policy for Caucasian hair and for ethnic hair and that it's justified. And not only was it justified, they intended proving in court, with expert witnesses, that this is a policy that's going to stay in place.
So now that you've had some national sunshine, sort of, hit this issue, they've done a complete about-face. And it's completely, also, contrary to what they have told the judge.
O'BRIEN: But is there...
COOPER: And...
O'BRIEN: Isn't there a point that if -- that they are trying to make that maybe ethnic hair, or whatever they're figuring is ethnic hair, it might require more time and more stuff, and that would translate into more money?
COOPER: Well, now, let me tell you what this issue is.
Our lawsuit focuses on just the most basic, common, elemental starting point when you go to a hair salon, which is basically having your hair shampooed and put in rollers and then hair dried. We're not talking about tinting. We're not talking about a hairdo. We're talking about the most basic thing that you can talk about, which is shampooing and putting in curlers and hair drying. And there, what they're doing is they have decided that they will look at someone and figure out whether they are Caucasian or whether they are "ethnic," which is basically black. And based on that, not looking at, for example, the length of their hair or looking at the texture of their hair, they will make a decision based purely on race. And you can't do that.
O'BRIEN: This is not a class action...
COOPER: Uh.
O'BRIEN: Let me just interrupt you there for a second.
It's not a class action lawsuit. At the end of the day we're talking about a $30 wash and set.
How much money are you seeking in damages from Dillard's?
COOPER: No, no, no. It is a class action.
O'BRIEN: Oh, it is?
COOPER: We've filed the lawsuit. It's a -- we've asked the judge to certify a class for all African-American women who over the, you know, the past couple of decades have been discriminated by this policy, who, quite, I also point out, had no...
O'BRIEN: How much money are you looking for?
COOPER: Well, you know what, we can't figure out -- we figure it's going to be millions upon millions. But we can't have an accurate determination until we get their documents and we look and see what their financials have been over the past years with their 300 and some odd stores around the U.S.
O'BRIEN: Vaughn...
COOPER: But this is a...
O'BRIEN: Let me just ask Vaughn the last question before we run out of time.
COOPER: Sure.
O'BRIEN: Vaughn, what would you like to see at the end of the day? Do you want financial compensation from Dillard's? Do you want an apology? What do you want?
THOMAS: I'd like to see the procedures stopped. It's not fair. We're in the 21st century. No one should have to go through that. So Dillard's really needs to stop.
O'BRIEN: Vaughn Thomas and Patrick Cooper joining us this morning.
Thanks for sharing your story.
Appreciate your time.
THOMAS: Great.
Thank you.
COOPER: Thank you.
HEMMER: Just about 20 minutes past the hour now. In a moment here, the first lady running into a bit of a protest over the weekend, from both sides, over the weekend, in fact. Did the White House misjudge her tour or is this simply a reflection of the times? We'll debate that with Kamber and May this hour on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: The Question of the Day -- back to Jack for that.
CAFFERTY: Nearly 200 level three sex offenders getting free Viagra courtesy of the New York taxpayers. An audit by the state comptroller's office found that Medicaid was reimbursing Viagra and giving the money to people convicted of assaulting kids as young as two and raping women as old as 90.
Courts have determined that level three sex offenders represent a high risk to public safety. A 1998 federal mandate requires state Medicaid programs to pay for Viagra. It's a problem.
The question is this, should Medicaid coverage include sexual potency pills such as Viagra?
Nobody thinks this is a great idea.
Jeffrey in Maryland writes: "Sure, Jack. And we ought to supply bullets for violent felons, alcohol for alcoholics and heroin and meth for drug addicts."
Jody in Michigan writes: "Medicaid won't pay me for half my asthma or allergy medications. I don't think it's fair that Medicaid will pay for people to have sex when they won't help me breathe."
Cherie in Maine writes: "Medicaid should only pay for prescriptions that are necessary, such as heart medication, blood pressure, diabetes, etc."
And Theresa in New York writes: "Jack, again, you leave me scratching my head with these issues. Sex pills for pervs is as irresponsible as giving guns to gang members or, worse, power to warmongers. Oh, wait, we did that already. Never mind."
O'BRIEN: Theresa has started e-mailing you all the time.
CAFFERTY: Has she?
O'BRIEN: Yes. Yes, I follow her.
CAFFERTY: Yes?
O'BRIEN: She's pretty well read in.
Has anybody established any kind of medical necessity for Viagra that you know of? I mean that's the only way that that would make sense in any way, shape or form. CAFFERTY: Oh, I don't know if there's a medical necessity, but the federal government mandated that Medicaid pay for it. There was a question in 1998 and they said no, you must pay for this. So if a doctor prescribes it, Medicaid has to pay for it.
HEMMER: And the senators from New York are taking it up now.
CAFFERTY: And I guess it's up to a doctor to decide if it's necessary. I mean that's -- it's a prescription drug.
O'BRIEN: And this is the -- Medicaid won't pay for birth control pills, right?
CAFFERTY: That I don't know. I've never tried to get a prescription for the pills.
HEMMER: Charles Schumer is coming up in about an hour, too, so we can put some of these questions to him then, too.
O'BRIEN: Oh, good.
All right, Jack, thanks.
HEMMER: It was so hot in L.A. on Sunday. How hot was it?
O'BRIEN: That was my line.
HEMMER: Thank you.
O'BRIEN: How hot was it, Bill?
HEMMER: Come on.
This 200 pound black bear went for a swim. A dip in the backyard pool, the L.A. suburb of Puerto Ranch. Police and eyewitnesses say the bear seemed a bit lost -- true -- and very thirsty.
Listen here.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CAPT. JOHN MITCHELL, LOS ANGELES FIRE DEPARTMENT: Well, when we got here, he seemed very hot and very tired. He was panting heavily. I really think he was looking for water, and he found it.
KATHERINE HAKOOPIAN, RESIDENT: He was basically running up to doors. He was banging on windows. He was trying to find his way out of here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HEMMER: Wildlife experts later moved in. They tranquilized the bear and told him to wait until the adults swim. Actually, they took him back to the woods and let him run his own way.
O'BRIEN: He actually looks pretty comfortable. HEMMER: He got his dip. He's in the deep end there, too, Soledad. You see that?
O'BRIEN: He's a good swimmer, apparently.
Well, if your boyfriend or your husband refuses to ask for directions when driving, it may not be his fault after all. Coming up, some surprising new research on the differences between men's and women's brains. We're "Paging Dr. Gupta" on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: You can get the latest news every morning in your e- mail. Sign up for AMERICAN MORNING "Quick News" at cnn.com/am. There for you right now, in fact.
In a moment here, the shocking school bus fight between a driver and the students caught on videotape. Now there's a controversy today over whether or not who should face the most serious charges. We will revisit this story in a moment here on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: Almost 8:30 here in New York on a Monday morning.
Good to have you along with us today.
Good morning.
O'BRIEN: Going back at you.
HEMMER: How about this videotape?
O'BRIEN: Oh.
HEMMER: I mean this will get your attention. Look at this. Hit happened on a school bus.
O'BRIEN: That's the driver.
HEMMER: It involved the driver, right, going back with some students in the back seat there, caught on videotape fighting with the students.
O'BRIEN: It's pretty amazing when you see his hands are around the neck of these students. He's now charged with a misdemeanor. The students, though, charged with felonies. Well, now that school officials have seen the tape, could those charges change? That's ahead this morning.
Headlines first, though.
Here's Carol Costello -- good morning.
COSTELLO: Good morning.
Good morning to all of you.
Now in the news, U.S. and Iraqi forces rounding up a substantial number of suspected terrorists. The new mission being called Operation Squeeze Play. It was launched in western Baghdad. In the meantime, these are new pictures just in to CNN of that explosion we told you about earlier. A car bomb went off at a restaurant in the Iraqi capital just two hours ago. An Iraqi official says at least four people are dead, more than 100 others wounded.
Investigators collecting the last remnants of evidence from an Idaho home where three people were found dead, two small children still missing. They are 8-year-old Shasta Groene and her 9-year-old brother, Dylan. CNN has obtained home video of the girl taken earlier this month. Police say they've received more than 800 tips in the search, but no solid leads.
Their father, Steve Groene, says an FBI agent told him he failed parts of a polygraph test. But Groene insists he does not know where his children are.
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