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CNN LARRY KING LIVE
Latest in Natalee Holloway Investigation
Aired July 29, 2005 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
TED ROWLANDS, GUEST HOST: Tonight, the search for Natalee Holloway hits the two-month mark. Investigators continue draining a pond. A search team from Texas is also checking out a landfill, and a judge rules on taking DNA from the prime suspects.
We've got the latest with Natalee's uncle, Paul Reynolds, in Aruba. Tim Miller, head of that Texas search team. T.J. Ward, the private eye hired by Natalee's family. And CNN's Susan Candiotti, on top of all the latest developments in Aruba. They are all next on LARRY KING LIVE.
Hello and welcome, everyone. I'm Ted Rowlands in for Larry King. A somber milestone in the case of missing Alabama teenager, Natalee Holloway. This weekend marks exactly two months since Natalee went missing from the tropical island paradise of Aruba.
Tonight, there is a new sense of urgency in the search of an Aruban landfill. We get details from Susan Candiotti, who is in Aruba tonight. I guess, Susan, there is another witness now coming forward with more potential details. What is the latest?
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: There is. Well, sources familiar with the investigation tell us that there is at least one witness who is claiming that he saw, at the landfill, sometime after Natalee's disappearance, we don't know exactly when, that this person saw a car, a vehicle, I should say, drive up to the landfill just before closing time, and describes what the witness thinks could have been a body being disposed of.
Now, this same witness was able to give authorities a tag number on this vehicle, and I'm told that it is a registered tag number, but the sources would not reveal to whom it was registered.
Naturally, this raises a lot of questions as to did this person really see what they saw? Is it possible? And why and when at this time are they coming forward? We don't know exactly when they came forward to authorities.
This is a public landfill, where people can drive up and drive in and dump off garbage. There are also dumpsters outside of it.
So now, what the authorities have done, again, trying to cover all leads, they brought in their own team of people, as well as a company out of Texas, to bring in heavy equipment to start going through this landfill. My sources, familiar with the investigation, say that they are looking in a particular area of that landfill. And Ted, authorities have looked at this area before. The FBI was in way at the beginning of the investigation, and had dogs that went through there for a few days. However, they didn't find anything at the time, and now, authorities are back again.
ROWLANDS: Now, meanwhile, there is also a continuing search, I guess tonight, they are searching overnight at this pond or lake, however you want to describe it, and they continue to try to drain it. What is the status on that?
CANDIOTTI: Well, they have working around the clock, ever since they started draining this pond, which is just over my shoulder, but of course, it's very dark and very difficult to make out.
However, there are at least two pumps working at that site at this time.
They thought they'd have the area drained by now. There's a very low level of water in it. And they plan on continuing to work until they get it low enough or completely dry.
I think part of the problem, as it's described to me, is that there's a lot of ground water underneath there. So it seems the more they drain, sometimes it's hard to get rid of all the water.
Nevertheless, earlier this day, they did have some -- bring in a bulldozer. They did bring in a bulldozer, and they did bring in some equipment that is able to detect the presence of methane gas, which could indicate that a human body was present. But it didn't turn up anything. But it would only work for a brief period of time.
Again, they don't know if they're going to find anything at this pond. They want to wait until they get more water out, but the plan is this -- once they get it down to a level that they feel is workable, the plan is to bring in people, personnel, who are going to walk through that muck, and decide whether they want to concentrate on any specific areas. If they do, they'll bring in that piece of heavy equipment to start digging, and they could, theoretically, bring back that methane detecting equipment again.
And this night, Ted, I can tell you, that we, just a little while ago, saw a helicopter that was hovering over that area with a search light that was pointing down at it. It was taking off and landing where that command post is set up. Beyond that, we can't tell you any more.
ROWLANDS: Tim Miller is the director of Equusearch, that search company out of Texas that Susan was talking about, that is now involved in the landfill search. Tim, what can you tell us about the job ahead for you? How big is this landfill, and have you already looked there? I guess the FBI had looked at one point.
TIM MILLER, DIRECTOR, TEXAS EQUUSEARCH: Well, you know, unfortunately a lot of the information has leaked out about the suspect, that's one thing, you know, we didn't want to happen, but we know there's no secrets on this story. That suspect actually said that on Wednesday after Natalee disappeared, 4:30 in the afternoon, he saw the vehicle go up, two guys in the vehicle -- three guys in the vehicle, I'm sorry, a jeep that was parked to the side of a backhoe actually came in, and he really thought that he had seen hair and breast and a top of a girl's body. He's been scared for his life during that period of time, and he's actually been out there with us every day, showing us the spot. But that spot is hard to determine where it was exactly at, because we went out there yesterday and we went back today, you know, that landfill grew another 20, 30 yards, because they keep moving debris in.
We know that that there's probably six feet of debris that's been put over that area since that period of time. So you know, it's going to be a long, tedious process and dirty process. I mean, nobody likes to be going through everybody's garbage, but you know, unfortunately, we got a big task ahead of us.
ROWLANDS: You said suspect. I'm sure you meant to say witness.
MILLER: I mean the witness, I'm sorry.
ROWLANDS: What is -- you've obviously talked to this young man. Is he credible?
MILLER: I -- I don't think he has anything to gain, for number one. I think he truly does fear. I think, you know, he's stuck to a story that he -- you know, I talked to the police commissioner this morning. The police commissioner says, you know, he's not one of the guys you'd probably want to hire to go to work for you or something like that, but he's sticking to that story. And we've interviewed him. We sent the FBI out there, you know, and no matter what his mental condition is or his IQ is, a lot of times, it's these type of people that see something that help solve cases.
So anyhow, again, we've got a big task ahead of us. I think tomorrow also, we're going to be bringing in that gas detection device that we've got, to go back into the pond, and then we're using the ground penetration radar systems to be in another area. So we're going to be spread real thin tomorrow, but I think the area that we're focused on the very most, where we're going to have most of our people is at the dump.
ROWLANDS: Paul Reynolds is Natalee Holloway's uncle. It has been or will be this weekend two months. Are you surprised that it's taken this long to figure out what has happened to Natalee?
PAUL REYNOLDS, NATALEE'S UNCLE: We certainly never expected it to take this long, especially after my sister and her husband arrived on the island the day that she was missing, and you know, confronted the Van Der Sloot family, but you know, we're -- even though it's been eight weeks, you know, we're still determined to get some answers. We're very pleased to have Texas Equusearch here, and the search has gone beyond all of our expectations. And we feel the investigation is intensifying. We feel that has given...
ROWLANDS: Go ahead.
REYNOLDS: I was going to say, we feel that has given witnesses the confidence to come forward and help us in an investigation and give us new leads.
ROWLANDS: There's also a reward out, $100,000 for any information leading to Natalee's whereabouts, and $1 million leading to her safe return. We'll talk about that and a judge's ruling when we come back. You're watching LARRY KING LIVE. Stay with us.
ROWLANDS: Welcome back to LARRY KING LIVE. I'm Ted Rowlands, sitting in for Larry tonight.
Dr. Henry Lee, they're talking about methane gas detectors at the dump and possibly at this pond. It's been two months. How long does a body emit methane gas?
DR. HENRY LEE, FORENSIC SCIENTIST: Once the body starts to decompose, the methane gas starts -- it released, and however, not only the body give methane gas. Like sewers, like a lot of any organic material will release methane gas. Methane gas, we commonly use the methane gas detector to look for any decomposed organic material, not necessarily it happened to be a human body.
ROWLANDS: So is this a useful tool? Would you recommend using this in trying to detect that, or are they going to make things even more complicated?
LEE: Well, it's the stage -- at this stage of the, you know, now, this stage of the game, any scientific tool we should try to use it, and try to look at any suspicious sign. If there is a large amount of methane gas, they should evaluate the area, because this is a pond which stays ordinarily not much enough water there, so the marine life must be less. So methane gas may be not that much abundant, so the detection of any large amount of methane gas, that area should be further investigated.
ROWLANDS: Arlene Ellis-Schipper is an Aruban attorney. She is in Aruba tonight. Joran Van Der Sloot remains in custody. What is the next step for prosecutors? At what point are they going to have to file charges against this young man, or let him go?
ARLENE ELLIS-SCHIPPER, ARUBAN ATTORNEY: Well, first of all, the next court hearing will be planned next week. As you maybe recall, there is a summary case that they have started for FBI involvement, or against FBI involvement. And the next hearing for his pretrial detention will be in September. And then of course, the judge of instruction has to assess whether there still is enough reason to hold him.
ROWLANDS: So the defense say, they don't want the FBI to be involved in this, and this is separate to whether or not he'll be detained following this September court date. What about these, the Kalpoe brothers? They were released. There's a witness that says that they may have seen them in certain spots. Are they still under a cloud of suspicion, and what would prosecutors need at this point to bring them back into custody and continue to ask them questions, interrogate them?
ELLIS-SCHIPPER: Well, first of all, they have remained suspects. So in that respect, they can be called in at any point for further interrogation. But to re-arrest them, they would need some sufficient grounds, as the same assessment is for Joran Van Der Sloot, that means strong suspicion of guilt, probable cause.
ROWLANDS: Paul Reynolds, is the family convinced that the Kalpoe brothers do have knowledge as to what exactly happened to Natalee?
REYNOLDS: Absolutely. You know, they were lying in the beginning. It's a well-known fact. They were obviously covering up a crime. You don't lie if you're innocent. We just need for them to tell us what -- why they were covering up the incident and what the crime was.
ROWLANDS: What do you think, knowing what you know? You've been there. You know all of the details from the investigation. What do you think happened to Natalee?
REYNOLDS: You know, I really can't say exactly what happened. We do know that the suspects were with her. We know that she was in their car. The last report we had was that -- admitted by the three of them -- was that Joran was left on the beach with her alone.
We know from that that when my sister arrived on the island, that she went to the Van Der Sloot home, confronted the father. He seemed very suspicious. He was lying about where his son was. And you know, when they went off to find him in one location at the casino, he wasn't there. Then he showed up back at the house, and he was there with one of the Kalpoe brothers, leaning against the car. It was very suspicious. You know, I wish that the Van Der Sloot family would have allowed them to go in the house. I wish I knew what was in the house at that time. There's just so many questions that we need answers to.
ROWLANDS: T.J. Ward, do you think that there will be a resolution here, in terms of what happened to Natalee? Are you optimistic, knowing what you know about the investigation at this point?
T.J. WARD, PRIVATE INVESTIGATOR: Well, I would hope so. I mean, we know about a letter now that was brought out that Joran Van Der Sloot made claims that Deepak killed her and raped her and then took her from the beach. And so, if that's the case, and we know at 2:00 that all three of the boys, if the -- the accountable story, that the racquetball -- the racquet club, that all three of the boys were seen there by a gardener and a witness, that they were in the car, they were in the car together, they were positively identified around 2:00 a.m., that it's going to put all three of them together, with Natalee, if this happened, the accountability on the beach.
I have to say that one of the reasons the pond is an issue here, that the law enforcement has brought Van Der Sloot three times to the beach right next to the Marriott, and the pond is directly across the street, and the racquet club is right behind it. I found another accountable witness, who I understand has now changed her story to law enforcement, which I'm not surprised, but in fact she claims that she saw the vehicle a week after that and ID'd it at 100 percent.
ROWLANDS: Susan Candiotti, do you know anything about this letter?
CANDIOTTI: No, there's no letter. We're talking about a statement that, during the interrogations of Joran Van Der Sloot, and this became available evidently to someone on the island who happens to be the editor of a newspaper.
Now, we do know for a fact that the suspects early on were pointing fingers at each other. That's according to law enforcement sources. Now, according to the attorney representing Van Der Sloot, he claims that his client was not saying that Deepak, you know, take it for what it's worth, but he said that his attorney -- his client was not pointing a finger at Deepak, but instead said, well, maybe he's the one that did it, and put it off offhandedly like that.
Now, in terms of the woman that T.J. Ward, the private investigator, just referred to, who he said changed her story -- well, I went and spoke with her today, and she told me that -- and I also talked with the interpreter, who was with Mr. Ward while he interviewed this woman, who speaks Spanish, and she told me that she did not change her story, and the interpreter showed me his notes. And she, at least what she said that she saw that night to me was that a car that she couldn't really describe as being what particular one color or the other -- she thought it was either blue or silver gray, she wasn't sure. Couldn't see who was inside, except for the fact that it was two men, and that it was about two weeks after Natalee was missing.
She also told me that about -- she was not sure of what kind of a car it was, and that when, after the investigator left, that police came about a half hour later, and she said that she told the police the very same thing that she had told Mr. Ward, and that the police -- excuse me, I should say law enforcement sources told us this day that, after hearing from this woman, quote, "it was not what we were looking for. It was not the Kalpoe brothers' car."
So again, this woman says that she didn't change her story, and you can interpret it as it may, but apparently the police don't put much credence into what she's saying.
ROWLANDS: All right. It has been 61 days since Natalee Holloway disappeared, and there are still many more questions than answers. We'll have more coming up. You're watching LARRY KING LIVE. Stay with us.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANTONIO CARLO, ATTORNEY FOR JORAN VAN DER SLOOT: My client finds that there is no -- it has no use to bring him to a place of interrogation, because he has nothing to add to the declaration he has already given.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ROWLANDS: It's been two months since Natalee Holloway disappeared. And the investigation continues on the island of Aruba. They are searching overnight, working around the clock, trying to drain a pond near where Natalee Holloway was last seen there, trying to get all of the water out of this pond, and then search the contents of what is below.
They have a search helicopter lighting the area. Clearly they have not given up on looking for answers for Natalee Holloway.
Dr. Henry Lee, why is it important to drain this pond instead of just dredging?
LEE: Well, in this case, as you know, this case become a cold case now. You really don't have any more leads. When you investigate a cold case, you need four most important elements. You need information. Second, you have to have a crime scene. Third, you want to find some physical evidence. And the fourth one, a little bit of luck. Just like building a four-legged table. You need the four most important elements.
Here, we don't have a crime scene yet. The only piece of physical evidence did not pay off, some duct tape with blonde hair. Now, if they just dredge the pond, it can create a lot of problems and miss a lot of evidence. So they drained the pond, so everything will remain in the regional location.
Let's say they're looking for clothing, shoes, (INAUDIBLE) sometime the tire track, maybe it still remains there. If you drain the pond slowly and everything will remain in the original position. That original location and position can give experience to the crime scene investigator, forensic scientist tremendous clues.
Let's say you're looking for the shoes. That show you far from the edge of the pond. And let's say you're looking for a buried body. Everything. And that's why we have to drain the pond, get all the water out, study that area, grid it out, and carefully and meticulously looking for each piece of clue. That's the only way you can solve this case now.
ROWLANDS: Paul Reynolds, there has been some criticism about the investigation from the family's standpoint, seeing them searching overnight and working around the clock, trying to drain this pond, does it give you confidence that they are doing everything that they can to find out what happened to Natalee?
REYNOLDS: We are more confident that the investigation is proceeding. You know, we did have some earlier concerns about some of the things that happened. But we've seen a change in the intensity of the investigation, the responsiveness of the investigators. And you know, we feel like it's making a difference. It's giving the witnesses confidence to come forward. It's giving us new leads. You know, we want every lead to be investigated.
We don't know where the individual leads will take us, but we want to follow up on each and every one with all the intensity that we can, and just keep going.
ROWLANDS: Tim Miller with Equusearch, you've been on the island searching yourself. You see that they are looking at this pond. Are you confident that you're going to find answers eventually or -- I know we talked earlier, and you were a bit pessimistic about really finding the exact details of what happened to Natalee. What's your stance now? And what's been your relationship with the Aruban officials?
MILLER: Well, you know, I think we've got a wonderful working relationship now. And I think, you know, in the very beginning things weren't bad by any means. Things were just different.
But we did share information. The police commissioner back then shared a lot of stuff. We shared stuff. The new police commissioner now, I think we've got a wonderful working relationship. And I think he's really focused on this case. We're focused on it. And I think everybody's doing everything they can possibly do right now, to locate Natalee and bring this to an end.
And you know, I'm not real optimistic that Natalee will ever be found, but I know this, if she's not, it's not for lack of everybody's efforts. I mean, I don't know how anything could have been put together any better than this was, with all of the cooperation from everybody, and the resources brought in. And you know, I just hope that we can end this pretty quick and everybody go home and -- I mean I got fires at home to put out in my own self.
So -- and we made a commitment to stay here. And we'll stay here until there's nothing left to do, or unless we just run out of resources to do it with.
But you know, we made that commitment. And we got to live by that right now. And you know, we're working every day, as long and hard as we can. And we'll continue that until there just isn't that spot to look anymore. So we're here.
ROWLANDS: The search continues for Natalee Holloway. And they are searching overnight, around the clock, trying to drain this pond looking for clues in this case, which has baffled prosecutors and investigators for now two months. You're watching LARRY KING LIVE. We'll have more right after a break.
ROWLANDS: Two months since Natalee Holloway disappeared in Aruba. The investigation continues. You're looking at a live picture of investigators draining a pond near where Natalee Holloway was last seen. They're working around the clock. Susan Candiotti, is this odd that they are working overnight? Is there something specific that they are on to, do you think, or -- why search overnight, and why continue to work 24 hours a day here, two months after she disappeared?
CANDIOTTI: Well, we know, Ted, that they have being doing work around the clock here at this particular site. It's taken them several days now since, what, Tuesday or Wednesday, I believe, when they fully got the drain going, and so the operation -- it takes a lot of work. We're talking about thousands and thousands and thousands of gallons of water.
Now, as I said, it's not uncommon to have the work going on, but usually, to the best of my knowledge, it's been pumps. I have not seen in the past few days a helicopter up at night.
What precisely it could be looking for, I don't know, but we saw it go up and down about 10 times. It appears as though they are taking some photographs now. I can see a camera, that they're taking some snapshots of some area of interest. Naturally, we don't know what that is, but the helicopter had been shining its light on different parts of that drainage area.
Are they looking for something specific? I don't know. Are they trying to get a better look at what it looks like from a nighttime perspective? Possibly. But they're certainly being meticulous about it this particular night. If something specific happened to lead to it, we don't know, but we're certainly making phone calls to try to find out.
So whether they're going to be doing this all night or for the next couple of hours, we don't know, but they've been going up and down.
We do know that the intent is to build some small dams to try to shore up this area, because there's a degree of ground water here, and it's been difficult for them to get all of the water out.
We also know that the plan, according to police this morning, and firefighters who are doing this work, is to bring in some Dutch Marines to walk through this particular pond area, once they get most, if not all, of the water out, and do kind of a grid search, standing side by side, walking through the muck, to see whether they want to concentrate on any particular areas. They may. They may not.
Again, do they have any specific leads? Not that we have heard until now. So we don't know if they've spotted something or not, or whether they just want to take some snapshots at night -- Ted.
ROWLANDS: Have you seen this level of activity, though, in, say, last night or the night before? I mean, it clearly seems that they have a lot of people out there and they're working well into the night.
CANDIOTTI: No, this is the first time we have seen this many people out there at night. Normally, it's just been the pumps going and the personnel it takes to work the pumps. So this is, to the best of my knowledge, unusual. I have not seen this in the past few nights. But they certainly do have the lights up there, and they have that helicopter that's brought in, so it's been interesting to watch, certainly, as they've been circling, I would say for at least an hour to an hour-and-a-half now.
ROWLANDS: Tim Miller with Equusearch, you have been involved in this search in Aruba, working with Aruban authorities. What do you make of this, what's going on now? Is there a sense of urgency here? What's your take on that, what we're looking at?
MILLER: I don't know if there's a sense of urgency. I think some, you know, some things have developed, and I know that once they get that pond pumped out, they've got to work real fast in that, because there is ground water that's seeping back into it, and to keep it, you know, keep it to a point where they can go search it. And it's going to be a difficult task. Last thing in the world we need right now is any rain.
So I think that sense of urgency is, let's get this thing pumped. Let's search it before another tropical storm comes in or rain comes in, and you know, all of the efforts are in vain. So I think it's an evidence search over there, but who knows what's going to show up? But, you know, all of the efforts being made right now need to be applauded. You know, I can say that for all the authorities here, you know, they certainly need -- they certainly need to be applauded.
ROWLANDS: Dr. Lee, what can be found -- let's say something is found, not necessarily a body, but a piece of evidence. It's been 60 days. And if something is under water in mud, can you learn a lot from that, or has it been just too long to really get at any real evidence at this point?
LEE: Well, yes, we can always learn quite a bit. And Ted, to just answer your question, the helicopter looked at the night, they'll probably look at -- try to use infrared camera, infrared scope, and heat sensor, all those more advanced equipment. Hopefully can see some differences between the (INAUDIBLE) different level.
As far as the marine (ph) and other police officers, they're probably ready to do a line search to walk through. If you do a two- line search, one goes forward and one goes sideways, that becomes a grid search. Basically, they'll look at every piece of single evidence.
The evidence, you have a body under the ground, may be actually protected, because the water prevent decomposition a little bit, and can delay the decomposition.
As far as shoes or clothing, it will not go to deteriorate that fast. It all depends on the pond, how much marine life there, any bacteria or material which will decompose the biological samples. As far as the rest of the evidence, if it's a weapon or clothing or anything that belongs to Natalee, that's going to be important.
CANDIOTTI: And Ted, Ted... ROWLANDS: Go ahead.
CANDIOTTI: I just wanted to say, Ted, remember, at the time of Natalee's disappearance, there wasn't much water in this particular drainage area. Very, very little water. And it's only been within the last couple of weeks, when we had the hurricane, the two storms that came through, that it filled up to about two feet. So that's, you know, a point of interest here.
So whether there's anything there, we don't know, and that's why they're there, to try to figure this out.
LEE: Another very important factor here, you have very little water before. More likely you bury the body, and the water subsequently covers, so it actually protected, delayed the decomposition.
CANDIOTTI: Yes, Dr. Lee.
ROWLANDS: Which would potentially lead to more evidence if indeed they do find something.
The search continues for any clues in the Natalee Holloway case. It has been two months, but as you can see from that live picture, they continue to look for anything as to what happened to this Alabama teenager in Aruba.
You're watching LARRY KING LIVE. Stay with us.
ROWLANDS: Arlene Ellis-Schipper is an Aruban attorney. Today a judge in Aruba declared that the DNA samples from Satish Kalpoe and Joran Van Der Sloot cannot be used against them. Why not?
ELLIS-SCHIPPER: Well, it was don't a decision that it cannot be used. This -- the order to take the sample has been declared null and void. First of all, in the Deepak -- in the case of the Kalpoe brother that appealed this case, it was declared that there was not enough grounds to take this DNA sample.
So on that basis, it was thrown out. In the case of Joran Van Der Sloot, however, there was a procedural mistake that the judge's instructions made and on that basis, it was declared null and void.
ROWLANDS: So, they could go back and fix the mistakes and then that sample could indeed be used in the future.
ELLIS-SCHIPPER: Well, that is -- no, no. That's only for the case of Joran Van Der Sloot.
ELLIS-SCHIPPER: In that case, there was apparently enough grounds, but not in the Deepak brother case. ROWLANDS: I've got you. In your opinion, do they have to find more evidence, a body or at least physical evidence in order to continue to hold Joran Van Der Sloot or bring charges here or could they go forward with a no-body prosecution if they have a partial confession or other circumstantial evidence?
ELLIS-SCHIPPER: Well, it is possible to convict someone or prosecute someone when a body hasn't been found. That has been done before in the Netherlands and -- but you have to have strong evidence and of course I'm only a bystander. I don't know what they have in file, but they would have to have some forensic evidence and some strong declarations against the suspect.
ROWLANDS: In order to -- how about to hold them to this point, to have Joran Van Der Sloot still in custody, do they have to have some pretty solid evidence here or is it sort of middle of the road?
ELLIS-SCHIPPER: Well, the next time the assessment is made by the judge of instructions, the judge of instructions will surely look at the fact whether a summation of court -- whether they're working towards a summation of court.
So, I would guess that -- I would say that they would have to have stronger evidence. Every time -- we're talking about pretrial detention. Every time that an assessment has been made, the judge looks at probable cause, strong objections against a release and those grounds for detention.
ROWLANDS: Let's take a couple calls.
Long Beach, California. Hello.
CALLER: Hello. This is Penny. My question is this: Can't the boys be hypnotized or use truth serum or a psychic? Can't they do that, too?
ROWLANDS: Arlene, can that be used?
ELLIS-SCHIPPER: Psychics? No. That is not a...
ROWLANDS: Can they hypnotize a witness or a potential suspect?
ELLIS-SCHIPPER: I'm sorry. I didn't hear you.
ROWLANDS: How about hypnotizing a potential witness or a suspect in a case?
ELLIS-SCHIPPER: No, according to our law a suspect is not an object of investigation. It is seen as a person that you can talk to. That's why, for instance, polygraph tests and other objective testing of a person are not allowed in our system.
ROWLANDS: Dr. Lee, what kind of evidence could be found besides a body that could be -- that could lead to a conviction?
LEE: Yes, if you found victim's clothing and of course the clothing or suspect's clothing or a weapon, that can also help out. Use the statement and other circumstantial evidence.
Of course, just now a caller called in saying a truth serum. This is not even in the United States, you cannot use it. You have to have the cooperation of the subject itself, he himself or herself willing to do that, also have a legal requirement.
As far as the psychic, that's the last straw, really not a piece of scientific evidence. Of course, geographic scene analysis and right now, you have a lot of volunteers, excellent experienced people helping out. So, you do need some scientific evidence and -- or forensic evidence, besides some witnesses saying it.
ROWLANDS: OK. Dr. Henry lee and Arlene Ellis-Schipper both have to leave us. Thank you both for joining us. The search continues in Aruba. They're searching overnight for clues as to what happened to Natalee Holloway.
We'll have much more coming up. You're watching LARRY KING LIVE. Stay with us.
ROWLANDS: This weekend will mark two months since Natalee Holloway disappeared in Aruba. Paul Reynolds is her uncle. There seems to be no slowdown in the investigation. More witnesses are coming forward. Do you attribute that to the reward, now up to $1 million and $100,000 or what do you attribute the continued investigation to?
REYNOLDS: Well, I think the reward might have an effect, but certainly, I think the intensity of the investigation is giving people confidence. They're finally willing to come forward. They feel safe enough to bring that information out and give us new leads that we can use and follow up and make some progress.
ROWLANDS: How important is it for the family to find out exactly what happened to Natalee?
REYNOLDS: Well, we have to know. Not knowing is the worst of all possible situations. You know, we don't know where the truth will take us. We don't know where the leads will take us. We want to follow up on everyone and find out everything that we can and you know, just find out what happened and we want to bring Natalee home.
ROWLANDS: Tim Miller with Equusearch, what will you be doing in the next few days and how many people do you have physically on the ground helping out?
MILLER: I think right now the count is 19 people that we've gotten over here. We're probably going to be doing some things at that pond again in the morning, but I think, again, we're going to be concentrating on that dump site. I mean, if a new lead comes in or there's some new information comes in and they want us to go somewhere else, we're certainly willing to do that.
So you know, things can change daily, as they have, in this case. so You know, we just got to kind of be prepared and try not to set ourselves up for disappointments. I mean, that's happened a lot of times.
And so, you know, we're just learning to go with the flow of things, and hope for the best, but expect the worst. And you know, just stay focused. I mean, that's kind of hard to do when you're being shifted all over the island at times.
But you know, that break that we took for a short period of time, I've gone back to the states, regrouped and coming back. That was certainly good for us. I know we couldn't just have stayed here that entire time without total burnout.
So you know, maybe the timing is right again. Maybe information is coming in that is going to lead us somewhere, and you know, again, we're just going to do the very best that we can possibly do. And I think we've done that. And we'll certainly continue until we can't do it anymore.
ROWLANDS: Let's take more calls. Dorchester, Ontario, hello.
CALLER: Hello, Ted. Our prayers continue, of course, for Natalee and her family. Just one question, have the Aruban authorities ordered no more garbage to be dumped until that area is completely searched? And if not, does anyone know why not?
ROWLANDS: Tim, do you know that or Susan?
MILLER: Yes. You know, one of the things, they can't close off that whole dump. They've got trash that's coming in there. But the area that we're searching is being protected right now. Nobody's going to be dumping there. And nobody's even going to be there right now. That's kind of a protected area. We'll get back on it again in the morning.
And I mean, it's an inconvenience for the people working at the dump. But right now, you know, everybody's you know, thinking about one thing and that's Natalee. And they can deal with a little bit of inconvenience. So, no, the dump is, you know, safe where we're digging at.
ROWLANDS: T.J. Ward, after talking to people in Aruba, what is your take? What do you think happened to Natalee?
WARD: Well, I think after they left the bar at 1:30 on the 29th into the 30th, that they obviously went somewhere. And of course the beach, I believe, is probably one of the targets in the area, which is why I believe the pond is a big issue.
After they got out there, something happened. Either something happened to Natalee and they panicked. Everybody's forgetting about Paul Van Der Sloot. Paul Van Der Sloot is still a suspect in this case. And I believe a very much suspect. I think he had some kind of direct or indirect responsibility for the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.
And after that, I think that they were instructed to do something with the body. And learned to keep quiet.
The mere fact that they were seen in the racquet club leaves me to believe there's something that's going to come up or show up around that pond area. With that being under construction, there were shovels and everything else right there in that construction area of that racquet club. And I believe something is going to appear in that area.
One of the things we don't know is that, what's so hard in this investigation, is that the Aruban police have not exposing any of their evidence or giving any information out.
But we do know that all the information, and audio tapes that were taken in statements and declarations are all now in Quantico with 11 Aruban police officers who are being assisted on the FBI on how to go forth with this case.
ROWLANDS: Paul Van Der Sloot, the father of Joran Van Der Sloot, the only suspect still in custody. Paul Van Der Sloot was brought in for a period of time, but let go because of insufficient evidence. The search continues. They're searching overnight in Aruba. It has now been two months since Natalee Holloway disappeared. We'll have much more. You're watching LARRY KING LIVE. Stay with us.
ROWLANDS: Susan Candiotti, Joran Van Der Sloot has been questioned numerous times. He is going to be questioned again by a special investigator, a Dutch investigator? What's the latest on that?
CANDIOTTI: These are behavioral specialists, Ted. And there is a plan by them to interview Joran Van Der Sloot again.
Remember, as you said, they have talked to him a number of times. But there was a court ruling that opened the door for the interrogation, the questioning to continue. Today, a judge ruled at the request of prosecutors that they be permitted to move Joran Van Der Sloot from the current location, the current jail where he is -- a prison to another jail where presumably they would be able to observe him, as they have doing, and allow these Dutch specialists to talk to him.
These are people who are used to dealing with young people, and behavioral specialists, as I said. And that could happen, we understand, as early as Sunday.
ROWLANDS: Does he have the right, Van Der Sloot, to say, I'm not talking anymore? I am done? I've already been interviewed?
CANDIOTTI: Absolutely. As a matter of fact, his lawyer said when they arguing this motion, my client, your honor, has said as much as he's going to say. He's told investigators all he knows. He doesn't have anything else to say.
Nevertheless, investigators do want to continue their discussions with him. And so the court has so ruled.
Now, he is allowed to have a lawyer present with him, just as you would be in the United States. And that lawyer will be there with him.
ROWLANDS: T.J. Ward, quickly, we're running out of time, who would you like to talk to of anybody down in Aruba if you were given the chance?
WARD: As far as the suspects who I'd want to talk to?
WARD: I'd probably want to talk to the Kalpoe brothers.
ROWLANDS: You think that they know more than they've led on? And do you think that they'll be back in custody eventually here? Is that your sense?
WARD: I think they will be in custody. And I also think at some point in time that there will be a target of Paul Van Der Sloot will be a target for the law enforcement.
ROWLANDS: But at this point, only Joran Van Der Sloot is in custody. Susan Candiotti, what happens tomorrow?
CANDIOTTI: Well, tomorrow you are going to see more work going on at the drainage pond over my shoulder. They're going to continue to try to get the water out, bring in some bulldozers, if they find some areas of interest.
Again, men are going to walk across, Dutch marines in kind of a grid pattern, walk across there through the muck. That's if they get enough water out to do that. And they're also -- the work is going to continue out at the landfill in a particular area of interest to see whether there is any evidence at that spot, because of what a witness said, that he thinks he might have seen what could have been a body being dumped there.
ROWLANDS: OK. The search continues for Natalee Holloway. It has been two months and there is still very little in terms of real details of what happened. But as you saw, the search continues.
That is it for Larry King tonight. Thanks again to all of our guests. And thanks, as always, to Larry for allowing me to fill his shoes for the hour.
Tomorrow night an encore airing of Larry's interview with Kurt Bloodsworth. He is the first innocent death row inmate ever to be cleared by DNA evidence.
On Sunday Tammy Faye Messner talks about her return -- about her life and the return of her inoperable cancer. And her fight to stay alive.
Stay tuned, "NEWSNIGHT" is next. Good night. TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com