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Nancy Grace

Search for Natalee Holloway

Aired July 29, 2005 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

NANCY GRACE, HOST: Tonight, breaking news. We go live to Aruba and the search for 18-year-old Alabama beauty Natalee Holloway. The Aruban government strikes a mortal blow to the search for Natalee on DNA taken from the three chief suspects.
And tonight, investigators formally launch a search of a massive landfill on the southern tip of the tiny island. Firefighters still working tonight to drain a pond that could reveal answers to Natalee`s disappearance. But tonight, sea water keeps rushing back into the pond as quickly as they can pump. Three suspects now spotted at that pond the night Natalee disappeared not by one, but two witness who have just come forward.

Good evening, everybody. I`m Nancy Grace, and I want to thank you for being with us tonight.

A 26-year-old newlywed and his brand-new bride, seen here in these photos from "A Current Affair," set out on a European dream cruise to honeymoon. But the dream turned into a nightmare. The groom vanishes into thin air, the only trace, blood, blood on the ship`s side and in the groom`s cabin.

And breaking news. Live to Aruba and the search for 18-year-old Natalee Holloway. Firefighters working around the clock, still fighting the forces of nature that are keeping a local pond from being drained.

And tonight, tractor, bulldozer, high-tech detection equipment at work even into the dark at that landfill in Aruba. Two suspects free, while a judge`s son, Joran Van Der Sloot, still behind bars.

And tonight, an Aruban judge deals a death blow to the search for Natalee, throwing out DNA evidence on the three suspects. Tonight, in Aruba, Jossy Mansur. He is the managing director and editor of "Diario" newspaper. Natalee`s uncle, Paul Reynolds is with us. In Atlanta, T.J. Ward, private investigator on the case, hired by the family. In Salt Lake City, Captain Roger Winkler, Utah division commander of investigations unit there at the Salt Lake police department. In Denver, defense attorney Lisa Wayne. In New York, defense attorney Debra Opri. And with us in New York, psychoanalyst Bethany Marshall.

But first let`s go to Aruba and CNN correspondent Susan Candiotti. Susan, bring me up to date, friend.

SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Nancy, let`s see. Where do we begin? First of all, let`s talk a little bit about this important DNA ruling from the judge today, a judge throwing out DNA evidence that had been collected from two of the three named suspects in the case. In the case of, first of all, Satish Kalpoe, who has been released from jail, the judge ruled that there were not sufficient grounds to collect that DNA evidence in the first place, the saliva sample. Now, the judge said that if prosecutors come up with sufficient grounds, they are permitted to refile.

In the case of Joran Van Der Sloot, who remains in jail behind bars, the judge ruled that there are sufficient grounds to collect a DNA sample from him. However, there are some of what the judge described as missing documents, but not specifying what kind of documents, and that prosecutors need to get those documents into the file and then they can refile their motion. But in the meantime, Nancy, the current DNA samples that were collected must be destroyed.

GRACE: Now, that goes to Satish Kalpoe and Joran Van Der Sloot. It`s my understanding we likely would have gotten the same ruling with Deepak, the other Deepak -- Deepak Kalpoe, but his lawyer didn`t find the motion, right?

CANDIOTTI: Apparently not.

GRACE: Well, I`m stunned. I`m stunned that the judge has thrown out this DNA evidence. Susan Candiotti, what about the landfill? What can you tell me?

CANDIOTTI: Well, according to sources familiar with the investigation, at least one witness has come forward who claims to have seen more than one person dumping what the witness says could have been a body. The body was, I am told, covered in some fashion, and that this happened at a public landfill not long before closing time.

Now, when this happened, sources close to the investigation would not tell me exactly when this happened. But again, it was close to closing time. And this is a landfill where the public can go and dispose of waste. Now, this same witness claims to have told police that he saw a vehicle and was able to provide a tag number to police. I am told that this is a registered car in Aruba, but I can`t tell you more than that.

GRACE: So is this witness the tin man?

CANDIOTTI: You know...

GRACE: The man who collects metal, iron, copper, whatever, at the landfill?

CANDIOTTI: I don`t know that. The person`s occupation has been described to me as a handyman.

GRACE: I want to go to Jossy Mansur with "Diario." Jossy, do we know if this witness, who is now giving a car tag number and a very detailed statement about seeing people putting what may have been a body into the landfill -- is it the same guy you told us about last night?

You`re taking a look, everybody -- this is video of the landfill, where a witness has stepped forward as of tonight, stating he observed people, several of them, throwing what could have been a body into the landfill around the time of Natalee`s disappearance.

Jossy, is it the same guy who collects metal?

JOSSY MANSUR, MANAGING EDITOR, "DIARIO": Yes, ma`am, it is exactly the same person. He did give the description that he saw a car there, a white pick-up, with three male occupants throwing something that looked like a body, carried by two of them into that rubble that you see over there, that big bunch of thrown-away bags of garbage.

GRACE: OK. Jossy, is there any way to tie in a white pick-up to this scenario?

MANSUR: Yes, ma`am, because there`s another witness that, before that, told someone that works at the hotels that he saw a white pick-up over there by the Holiday Inn, in which three persons were also in, all of them male, carrying what looked like the body of a girl, putting it in the back of the white pick-up and driving away with it.

GRACE: OK. So you`ve got a white pick-up at the Holiday Inn, where Natalee was staying. You`ve got a white pick-up at the landfill. Both eyewitnesses state that there were three individuals, I`m assuming male. But can they give an identification of Joran Van Der Sloot or the Kalpoe brothers?

MANSUR: None of them have given that kind of a description. They haven`t identified the three males. But it`s very important to note that the witness on the beach by the Holiday Inn has absolutely no knowledge of the witness over there to the east side of the island by the landfill or dump. They don`t know each other, but still they give the same description of the same white pick-up.

GRACE: OK, wait a minute. Wait a minute. Jossy Mansur, remember the fishermen that were out in the water? Didn`t they state they saw a pick-up along the beach that night?

MANSUR: Probably. I don`t know. I haven`t made any statements to that effect, ma`am.

GRACE: Take a listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY, NATALEE`S MOTHER: We`ve been going through this since June 10. What have I not been exposed to? What have I not been put through? Where has she not been? It just -- it`s been endless. You know, until I am shown definitively, of course, I`m going to have hope that she`s alive.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: I want to go to Captain Roger Winkler with Salt Lake City Police Department. Sir, you were part of the search for Lori Hacking. Everyone, you will recall Lori Hacking was murdered by her husband, Mark Hacking, and finally, after weeks of searching, this American beauty`s remains were found in a dump, a landfill. Tell us about that search and how difficult it is, Captain.

CAPT. ROGER WINKLER, SALT LAKE CITY POLICE: Well, it`s extremely physical -- physically demanding. It takes just a lot of hard work to get through this debris. Our primary search was to do a visual search of all debris, looking for any evidence that we could find on this case. Involved the use of large pieces of heavy equipment. We initially were looking at moving approximately 4,500 tons of debris. It wound up being closer to approximately 10,000 tons of debris, going through this by hand with rakes under difficult conditions. We had weather. We had insects. We had the physically demanding conditions, as well as the smell associated with the landfill.

And going through that debris, doing a physical and visual search of all debris to identify evidence and then preserve that for court, is very demanding.

GRACE: Captain, remember when it became so hot that the dogs had to be taken in, the cadaver dogs, because they couldn`t keep working in the heat?

WINKLER: Yes, ma`am. We actually had to change our whole operation to a -- basically, a graveyard operation, where we were working a late- night shift. So we would start at dark and finish up before daylight just because the dogs were overheating so badly.

GRACE: Back to Jossy Mansur. Who is searching the landfill? Are any FBI there, or is it just the Aruban authorities?

MANSUR: I believe it`s the Equusearch team from Texas and also accompanied by a few individuals, private, our reporters, and the search- and-rescue party from Aruba. There`s a whole bunch of people that have been searching all day long.

GRACE: Are there any dogs involved?

MANSUR: Well, I see stray dogs walking all over the place, but I don`t think I have...

GRACE: That`s not what I had in mind! That`s not exactly what I had in mind. I meant bloodhounds, scent dogs or cadaver dogs.

I want to go very quickly to Paul Reynolds, Natalee`s uncle. Sir, thank you for being with us. Do you think you`re seeing a light at the end of the tunnel?

PAUL REYNOLDS, NATALEE`S UNCLE: We`ve seen a significant change in the investigation. We feel it is becoming much more aggressive, much more responsive. We feel like that is a significant factor in allowing these witnesses to come forward and bring information. I think they feel more confident in their ability to do that. And we`re very appreciative of that, and we feel that`s going to help us resolve this case.

GRACE: To Debra Opri, veteran defense attorney. Debra, you know from practicing here in the States that a murder case can be proven without a body. We saw that in the Scott Peterson case. But here, we don`t have a confession. We don`t have DNA. We don`t have any forensic evidence. But Debra, just how valuable is it that Joran Van Der Sloot has changed his story up to 22 times now, including, according to Jossy Mansur, stating that a Kalpoe brother raped and murdered Natalee?

DEBRA OPRI, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, here in the states, they don`t put much credence on behavioral evidence. Look what happened with Scott Peterson. In Aruba, it may be different...

GRACE: Well, he got convicted.

OPRI: Well, we were lucky, but...

GRACE: He got the death penalty!

OPRI: No, we were lucky that it got to the media and Amber came out.

But let me tell you something. I`ll tell you what I`m troubled about in this investigation. I`m starting to develop an opinion that we have a severely bungled investigation because 61 days later, if they find that body now, what is she, a skeleton? What kind of evidence are we going to be left with, other than somebody saying, I can positively identify that truck?

Look to why that landfill was not looked at in the early days of the investigation. If somebody`s going to dump a body, why didn`t these investigators say, number one, take all the cadaver dogs immediately, go to all the landfills? How many landfills are on the island of Aruba? Were any of the landfills traced? Why is it, after they only get a million dollars together, the parents of Natalee, that somebody suddenly decides, Hey, gee...

GRACE: Oh, here she goes!

OPRI: No, I`m telling you, that should have...

GRACE: Second verse same as the first!

OPRI: Nancy! Nancy, the landfill should have been looked at early on, not 61 days later.

GRACE: You`re preaching to the choir.

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: We`ve been screaming about the landfill from the get-go. But one thing they had in the Scott Peterson case that they don`t have in the Joran Van Der Sloot case is the remains. They had Laci Peterson.

OPRI: They may have remains, but we`re not going to have much after 61 days.

GRACE: We`ll see. We`ll see. I think you`re likely right.

To Lisa Wayne, she`s right about this. The case was bungled from the get-go. I know the Aruban government hates it when we say that, but that is the reality.

Elizabeth (ph), do we have that list so far? Oh, OK. Take a look at this, Lisa Wayne. Let`s go. Number one, blood found in the car was reported on national TV. Not! Blood found on a mattress. It was a dog`s blood. Bones were found. That made the headlines. They were donkey bones. Confession. That was widely reported, then retracted. Ten-day delay in searching the getaway car belonging to Joran Van Der Sloot. They gave the suspects alone time in a car together to cook up their story, handcuffed together.

Round one, catch and release. The two security guards wrongfully arrested. They stay behind bars for weeks. Catch and release two. Judge Paul Van Der Sloot. We`ve gotten familiar with his backside as he runs from questions. Round three, catch and release. Remember the party boat deejay, Steve Croes? That`s not all. Catch and release round four, Deepak and Satish Kalpoe.

Very quickly to Bethany Marshall. Now the FBI is being allowed to take part in the case. That should give us some encouragement.

BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST: I hope so. I mean, when you really look at this crime, it was planned, purposeful and predatory. Joran Van Der Sloot told a lie to Natalee when he first met her at the nightclub. He told her he was a foreign exchange student in order to gain her trust. This is a part of a crime that was planned. And here this kid -- if the allegations are true, the kid has the whole thing planned out, although he does get sloppy at the end. He has to tell the 22 lies to cover his tracks. But the people investigating the case can`t carry out a thorough and thoughtful plan of their own.

GRACE: We`ll all be right back. We are live in Aruba and the search for Natalee Holloway. Breaking news not only in the search of the landfill, the draining of a pond, but a mortal blow to the search for Natalee dealt by none other than a set of Aruban judges. Stay with us.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TWITTY: (INAUDIBLE) coming forward. I`m really encouraged, Nancy. I mean, I think that`s a huge step forward for us. And you know, maybe it`s taken him a little while to have some assurance and trust in order to come forward and make sure there are no repercussions for him coming forth with this information.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: A $1 million reward offered for Natalee Holloway`s safe return, $100,000 reward for information on her whereabouts. Tip line, 877- 628-2533. Call toll-free.

Welcome back, everybody. Very quickly, to Jossy Mansur with "Diario." Jossy, what can you tell us about the investigation?

MANSUR: The investigation itself is going ahead full-time, full speed. The interrogations of the person still in custody is going on every day. And the police is exercising, as well as the whole community, whatever activity is necessary to try to find this girl, alive, if possible, if she still is. If not, in whatever shape she is in now.

GRACE: All right, Jossy, can you tell me about the equipment now being used? I understand bulldozers and very high-tech -- I call it a dust-buster, but it searches down into the dirt to look.

MANSUR: It searches into the dirt to look. It also separates all these bags of garbage that you see lying around in heaps with some care. And then you have all these people poking with sticks and everything else into all of this garbage that they have to look through. It`s a physical, time-consuming job.

GRACE: To Paul Reynolds. All the equipment that is being brought in for Natalee`s search -- does that hearten the family at all?

REYNOLDS: All of the assistance that we have received, the equipment that`s coming in, the assistance from Equusearch has been a tremendous support for us. You know, we`re struggling to understand some of the things that were done in the investigation, you know, why the Kalpoe brothers were released. They were covering up a crime. It tells us they have knowledge of a crime. And you know, we`re hoping with the witnesses that are coming forward now, we can find more reasons to bring them into custody and continue questioning them.

GRACE: To Jossy Mansur. What is it exactly, Jossy, they`re looking for in the pond? We know this pond had very little water in it at the time Natalee went missing, so it`s not a body.

MANSUR: I don`t know what they`re looking for. Some say a shoe. I don`t know what kind of a shoe. But from the information that we have from the police, they are looking for a body somewhere near there.

GRACE: OK. Very quickly, Susan Candiotti, please explain to us what is taking so long to drain the pond.

CANDIOTTI: Well, part of the problem, as I understand it, is that there`s ground water. I mean, we`re very close -- that pond is very close to the ocean here, I mean, a few hundred yards, let`s say. And so even though they`re draining, draining, draining, draining, I think that is part of the problem. That`s how Equusearch is explaining it. And so those pumps are going around the clock even as we speak, over my shoulder, but it`s too dark to tell. They`ve got some lights going on. So they`re trying the best they can to get it out.

Now, earlier today, they did bring in some equipment, including equipment that can determine methane gas, the presence of methane gas, which might indicate a body being present. But it turned up nothing. They`re going to try again tomorrow.

GRACE: Yes, when a body decomposes, it releases methane gas.

We`ll all be right back. We are live in Aruba.

But quickly, to "Trial Tracking." Tonight, the search goes on for 24- year-old LaToyia Figueroa, 5 months pregnant, the mother of a 7-year-old little girl. LaToyia disappeared in Philadelphia 11 long days ago after a doctor`s appointment. No activity on her cell phone or bank card.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LT. FRANK VANORE, PHILADELPHIA POLICE DEPARTMENT: She was last seen on Monday, we know -- that`s 7/18, Monday, around 3:00 PM in the area of 59 (ph) and Walton (ph). Since then, we`ve done numerous surveys of that area. We`ve gone door to door. The family has surveyed the area and surrounding areas along with us. So what we`re looking for is anyone who thinks they may have seen her not only that Monday, but any time after that. We`d like to talk to them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Take a look. If you have any information on LaToyia Figueroa, please call the Philadelphia police, 215-686-3183. There is a $10,000 reward.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: You are seeing a live shot from Aruba. As we speak, a pond very near the Holiday Inn where Natalee Holloway was staying on her high school senior trip -- this pond is being drained. As you can see, bright searchlights light up the pond for firefighters to continue draining that pond. What are authorities looking for? We don`t know. But we do know they believe that pond will yield some answers. And in case you need it, guys, my producer, Elizabeth, brought this along to try to help, since things are going so slowly, a little dip (ph) action.

You know what, Susan Candiotti? They promised us last week it was going to take two days to drain this pond. What happened?

CANDIOTTI: Well, that was actually earlier this week, actually.

GRACE: I`m going to Fedex this to you, Susan. I`m Fedexing this, and I want you to hand it over to the Aruban authorities!

CANDIOTTI: Nancy?

GRACE: Yes?

CANDIOTTI: I`ll let you do that.

GRACE: OK.

(LAUGHTER)

CANDIOTTI: Anyway, no, they`re -- what`s taking them long is because of this groundwater that`s apparently -- that`s what the authorities seem to think is part of the problem. But they`re pumping all night long, all day, all night and they hope to be able to get in there tomorrow. The plan is to get some bulldozers in there, if they want to use it, to get people to walk through the pond area, once they get the water level down, and see whether they find any areas that they want to concentrate on.

GRACE: And I`ve only got a couple of seconds left, Susan. But Susan`s not going away. She`s staying with us. What are they planning to do when they get the majority of the water out?

CANDIOTTI: They`re planning on doing a walk through that muck and see whether they want to pinpoint certain areas.

GRACE: OK.

CANDIOTTI: Then bring the bulldozer in.

GRACE: We`ll be right back with Susan Candiotti and Jossy Mansur. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: Again, this is a live shot, straight from Aruba, firefighters working around the clock, draining a pond, a fairly large pond, searching for clues in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. Those bright lights have been set up to allow them to work through the night. Now, this pond is not too, far away from the Holiday Inn where Natalee was staying. Here`s a shot, a map to help us understand. You see the Holiday Inn far left, the Marriott in the middle and the pond across the tracks.

Welcome back, everybody. I`m Nancy Grace. Thank you for being with us. Very quickly, to Natalee`s uncle. Joining us is Paul Reynolds. Paul, I understand that you took it upon yourself to go search the area of the of the Holiday Inn.

REYNOLDS: Actually, I was following the Equusearch people that were doing the ground-penetrating sonar over on the beach just north of the Marriott. And one of the Equusearch personnel that I was speaking to had found something suspicious over -- under some trees adjacent to the north side of the Marriott.

GRACE: Hold on. Hold on, Paul. This is a live shot of what he`s talking about, near the hotels. Go ahead, Paul.

REYNOLDS: We went over there and found a suspicious-looking bag, a small bag, but, you know, had a strong odor about it. We weren`t sure what it was. We were looking around the area. We detected some strange-looking mounds close to that and some strange odors coming in that area.

We contacted the police. They sent some detectives over there, and you know, brought a dog over there to check it out. You know, I`m not sure that we found anything, but you know, it gives us confidence in the responsiveness of the investigation, the intensity. You know, while Dave and Equusearch and all them are over at the landfill, you know, we`re still looking in other places. It`s -- you know, we`re -- it`s a multi-faceted investigation. And it`s this much awareness and intensity that gives us hope.

GRACE: To T.J. Ward. He is the private investigator hired by Natalee`s family. T.J., you told us the other night that a woman who lived -- who was staying in a home near that racquet club, where the Van Der Sloots are members, had seen Joran Van Der Sloot`s car driving around, I believe we said, three times. Very unusual. And we launched into a discussion about how criminals often go back to the scene of the crime almost instinctively. Now an interpretation what was she`s saying is different. Response?

T.J. WARD, INVESTIGATOR HIRED BY NATALEE`S FAMILY: Well, I don`t know how she could change her story because when I took her statement from her, she described a car to a T. And then about 30 minutes later, I came back with a picture from law enforcement that was used when they took the -- Deepak`s car into custody and took pictures of it. And she specifically said, That`s the car. That`s the car that I saw a week after the 28th -- I mean, the 29th and 30th of May, that was seen three times in the subdivision of the racquet club, where she lives, and was around the subdivision, and so on and so forth.

The funny thing about this is if the gardener`s story is correct and the center of attraction for the past six weeks now, the bringing the -- bringing Joran out to the -- Joran Van Der Sloot out to the beach by the Marriott, then this, in fact, would put this in the vicinity where it`s happened.

I heard about the landfill yesterday. I`m in Atlanta, and I`ll be returning to Aruba on Sunday. But I heard about the landfill yesterday, and it`s extremely a long way away from the timeline. If this gardener had seen, at around 2:00 AM on the 29th into the 30th -- saw Joran Van Der Sloot in the front seat of the car, covering his face and Deepak and his brother in the back seat, bending down so the gardener couldn`t see him, then the area in which we should be searching -- of course, that`s why we`re draining the lake.

Now, we have to take into consideration that the construction that`s going on in this subdivision and all the tools that are out around the new homes and all, it would make sense. The water in the area around the 28th -- I mean, the 29th and 30th of May was only about inch or two deep, according to the witness that I interviewed...

GRACE: Right.

WARD: ... who`s now changed her story. Now, just taking into consideration the gardener (INAUDIBLE) They could have -- they just would not have enough time to go to the landfill, if the timeline in which it`s been -- has been considered all along, were taking Joran Van Der Sloot out to the beach.

GRACE: OK. Well, T.J. Ward, you`ve been under cross-exam many times in court in Atlanta, so this is a tiny taste of what you`re looking at if you ever become a state`s witness in this case. Of course, everyone is going to try to discredit what you or your witness said.

Here, I`m just wondering why, Bethany Marshall, a witness may back away from a statement. Very quickly.

MARSHALL: Well, I think that in third-world countries, witnesses are often very afraid to come forward, especially once a case like this gets publicized. They`re afraid of being caught in the crossfire.

GRACE: You know, Lisa Wayne, I once had a judge I tried a lot of cases in front of. He was 84 years old, and he would tell the jury every trial, Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, it`s your duty to try to make all witnesses speak the truth, impugning perjury on no one. Now, when I consider timelines, and you`ve got various people throwing in their two cents about what they saw at a certain time, it is very easy to make a mistake about what time you saw what, Lisa.

LISA WAYNE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, I agree with you, Nancy. And making a mistake, though, when you`re talking about making an accusation is a big deal. And what we have here is a classic situation of witnesses coming forward when there`s been a time delay and media saturation as to this case. And you have no idea what the reliability might be of these witnesses at 61 days. It`s very, very difficult. So you have to scrutinize that.

And I have to tell you, I`m a little defensive of the law enforcement down in Aruba and the Aruban people because you know what? It seems to me they`re trying very hard to make sure...

GRACE: Oh!

WAYNE: ... if they find -- if there is a suspect, it looks likes like one who has stayed in jail, which would have never happened in this country. They let innocent people go, and they`re scrutinizing. So...

GRACE: Well, I`m glad you`ve decided everybody`s innocent before trial because...

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: If I could finish! If I could finish! Jossy Mansur described a police report in which Joran Van Der Sloot said a Kalpoe brother raped and murdered Holloway. Now, to me, that is very, very incriminating!

To Debra Opri, response?

OPRI: Well, Lisa, I`m going to say, for Lisa`s point of view, I think you`re putting it too far out there. What we need to see here is -- and Nancy, I think you`ve opened yet another door in this investigation tonight. We may have witness-tampering. We may have these people giving honest-to-God statements and then somebody getting to them afterwards, basically telling them to change their stories. If that`s the case, we have a high-level problem.

The other thing I need to mention, and you need to let your audience know this, until we have a crime scene, until we find a body, until we have a confession, we still have a missing girl, and we should be exploring searching other islands.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hey, Nancy...

GRACE: You are seeing a live shot, everyone, of a chopper flying around the pond, even as we speak. Apparently, all methods possible are being used to find Natalee at this juncture. Maybe it`s late. We`re into day 61, but it seems to me that we can learn a lot -- we can determine a lot by the seriousness in which they are pursuing, Susan Candiotti, this pond.

CANDIOTTI: Well, Nancy, of course, it`s important to note here, we don`t know what this helicopter is. I can`t tell, because it`s too dark, whether it`s a police helicopter. It could be a tourist helicopter. It could be a media-hired helicopter. We really do not know, and it`s really important to point that out. But it certainly is circling the pond with a searchlight.

GRACE: OK, let me -- Elizabeth, did you not just tell me that this is a police chopper? Right. Susan, we`re hearing on the ground in Aruba that this is a police chopper. But you are right. We can`t see it, but we`re being told that it is a police chopper.

Jossy Mansur, a lot of energy, a lot of resources and manpower are on this pond.

MANSUR: Yes, ma`am. And it must be for a specific reason. It must be because the authorities have leads that they are very reluctant to release as to what has happened and what they`re looking for at this point. I don`t think they`re going to do all this investigation, all this digging, all this pumping for nothing. They must have some strong leads on which they are basing all this effort.

GRACE: So tonight, a dual attack in the search for Natalee Holloway. As you can see, pumping going on through the night there at the pond. Also, a landfill is being searched as we speak. We are live in Aruba and the search for Natalee Holloway.

As we go to break, I wand to remind you, we at NANCY GRACE want very much to help in our way solve unsolved homicides, find missing people. Tonight, take a look at Brenda Middlekauff, 40 years old. She disappeared July 19, 2002, from LePine, Oregon. Investigators found her body July, 2005, three years later. Police say her husband, who has a criminal history, is a person of interest. If you have any information on Brenda Middlekauff, call the Deschutes County sheriff, 541-383-4396. Please help us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: Welcome back, everybody. Million-dollar reward still up for Natalee`s safe return, $100,000 for information on her.

Very quickly, before we go to the missing groom story, Susan Candiotti, about this witness, thoughts?

CANDIOTTI: Yes. This is the woman who spoke with T.J. Ward, the private investigator. Nancy, I went over and spoke with her this day, and I also spoke with the interpreter who was with T.J. Ward when he talked with her. I saw the notes that the interpreter made after talking with this woman, who speaks only Spanish. I speak some Spanish.

This woman said that she did not change her story, that this is what she told to the private investigator, and this matches up with what the interpreter`s notes also read. She said she wasn`t ever sure of the color. She said it was blue or gray. She said that she saw it at least a couple of weeks afterwards. And she said that about 30 minutes after she met with the private eye, that two police officers came over and talked with her, and she told them the same thing, and that the police are now -- or rather, law enforcement sources, I should say, are telling us, quote, "It was not what we were looking for." Quote, "It was not the Kalpoe brothers` car." That`s from law enforcement.

GRACE: Susan Candiotti there in Aruba, thank you, friend.

We are quickly switching gears to the story of a newlywed couple on their honeymoon on a dream cruise through the Mediterranean. He goes missing, nothing left about but a trace of his blood. This is a photo from "A Current Affair." It is of George Smith and his bride, Jennifer.

Tonight, in New York, Adriana Gardella. She is the associate editor of "Justice" magazine. Adriana, welcome. Bring us up to date. What`s happening?

ADRIANA GARDELLA, ASSOC. EDITOR, "JUSTICE" MAGAZINE: Well, the most recent development, Nancy, has been that for the first time, U.S. law enforcement official -- it`s Kevin O`Connor, the U.S. attorney for Connecticut -- has come forward and said two things. One, that we`re now operating under an assumption that a crime has been committed. And two, that it`s something that his office and the FBI is going to be aggressively pursuing.

GRACE: Adriana, do we know for sure it`s his blood?

GARDELLA: We don`t know that for sure, no.

GRACE: Well, Adriana, isn`t the story that they go out partying on the boat, they both drink a lot the night before, she says -- the bride can`t remember coming back to the room. She wakes up. The husband is gone. This is the honeymoon. This is time for love and togetherness. She wakes up. He`s not there, so she goes to work out.

GARDELLA: That is the story, yes.

GRACE: OK. Now, another question, Adriana. Is it correct that now a witness has come forward from the next-door cabin, stating that the night he goes missing, the witness, the ear witness, hears furniture moving, a loud ruckus, voices, male voices arguing and, he said, a horrific thud?

GARDELLA: That is exactly what he said. And this is coming from the passenger who was, again, in the cabin right next door.

GRACE: What else can you tell us, Adriana? What measures are being taken to find the missing groom?

GARDELLA: Well, what has been -- the search has been suspended, but the Turkish officials have requested a blood sample from George Smith`s family in order to try to match with the blood on the boat.

GRACE: And what is the bride doing to help find her groom?

GARDELLA: Well, that we don`t know. We do know she`s back in Connecticut, and according to the U.S. attorney, both George Smith`s family and the bride, Jennifer Hagel`s (ph) family, they`re both cooperating with the investigation.

GRACE: Adriana, is it correct that she came back to the States the very next morning?

GARDELLA: That is my understanding, that she got off the ship in Turkey and then flew home after being questioned by authorities there.

GRACE: Bethany Marshall, response?

MARSHALL: I think in the absence of forensic data being released, we have to look to what we know about these types of crimes to form a hypothesis. And 20 percent of crimes involve multiple perpetrators, meaning more than one person is involved in the commission of the crime. And also, 15 percent of all victims are killed by a spouse. So you have to take these stats, put them together, and take a really good look at the wife. You have to take a look at the people who were on the boat and the people that they were partying with that night.

GRACE: Adriana, where was the bride, Mrs. Smith, when all of the arguing and the horrific thud and the furniture being moved around in her cabin was going on? Where was she?

GARDELLA: That`s a very good question, and it`s one that we do not have an answer to yet.

GRACE: You know, Adriana, this brings up to mind not only this particular instance in which you`re telling me now the search is off -- why is the search off -- but it`s making me wonder what else is going down on these cruise lines. They`re in international waters. This is between Greece and where?

GARDELLA: Turkey.

GRACE: And it`s on a cruise ship that is -- the company is based in Florida, and is the -- the boat is registered in the Bahamas. Now, when you don`t know where the territory lies, the jurisdiction lies, with the registration of the boat, which would be Bahaman law. So my question is, what are all the authorities doing to find the missing groom? Anything?

GARDELLA: Well, the FBI and Turkish officials are now working cooperatively together, so those are the two countries that are now involved.

GRACE: And very quickly, to Debra Opri. Right now, no one has been named as a suspect. But you know, behavioral evidence usually comes into trial following a disappearance.

OPRI: Exactly. And this is going to be a good case of behavioral evidence. What the investigators are going to have to do -- and I understand the FBI has or will be getting involved. They`re going to have to have a reenactment, a timeline of what happened that night, in terms, You went to dinner, how much did you drink? When you went with your husband to the casino, who did you meet? How much did you win or lose? Where did you go from there?

And you know what? It`s a crime scene. There`s blood. There`s a thud. There`s a witness from next door who said, This is what I heard, this is what I saw. With all the papers and articles coming out, we understand that these individuals that this husband met with may have been of Russian descent. So it`s the beginning of an investigation of a crime scene.

GRACE: The beginning? Whoa! They`re a little late!

Lisa Wayne, all I want to know is if she doesn`t remember getting back to her cabin, she doesn`t remember this big argument that the neighbor overhears, and she doesn`t remember where her husband was, I want to know, what was she drinking?

WAYNE: Well, you know, there might be a very innocent explanation, Nancy. And that is they partied hard, she came back, she did pass out. And I have no idea what their habit and routine is. He may get up early in the mornings and go for a jog, she goes to the gym, and she didn`t suspect anything had happened. So you just don`t know. I mean, she clearly could have a very innocent explanation.

GRACE: Lisa, Lisa, you mean you`re not suspicious of those health nuts that wake up at 5:00 o`clock in the morning and go running?

(LAUGHTER)

WAYNE: Well, you know, the other thing is, you know, what happened to him? Did he hit his head? Did someone else hear it? I mean, there is a lot of other explanation.

GRACE: Hey, you know, reality check. We don`t even know if it`s his blood.

WAYNE: We don`t.

GRACE: But that would be a good place to start. PS -- Hey, Turkey, takes three days to get DNA results!

Quick break, everybody. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: What a week in America`s courtrooms. Take a look at the stories, and more important, the people who touched all of our lives.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

Guilty! The Florida jury hands down a verdict in the murder trial of multi-millionaire Donald Moringiello. The well-known engineer shot his wife, Hattie, in the chest four times and dumped his wife in the choppy waters of the bay behind their luxury home.

Possibly the most prolific child molester and predator ever in U.S. history has a date with Lady Justice. That`s right. Dean Schwartzmiller kept detailed notebooks of over 30,00 incidents of child molestation.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDY KAHAN, VICTIMS` CRIME OFFICE FOR HOUSTON MAYOR: The slimeball that he is deserves his fair share of blame. Yet at the same time, the criminal justice system, our system, continued to spit him out, time and time again.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Philadelphia police search desperately for 20-year-old LaToyia Figueroa, the Pennsylvania beauty, five months pregnant and missing. She vanished 10 days ago. LaToyia also has a little girl who wants her mother back. She apparently went to a doctor`s appointment that afternoon with the father of the baby that she is carrying. She was last seen in his West Philadelphia neighborhood, just a short distance from a park that they have now been searching aggressively for any sign of LaToyia.

Does a remote pond in Aruba hold answers to 18-year-old Natalee Holloway`s disappearance?

Man, oh Manischewitz. There was a 10-day delay in searching the getaway car. There was round one of catch and release, the innocent security guards. Then there was round two, Judge Paul Van Der Sloot. Catch and release. Round three, Steve Croes, the deejay on the party boat. Remember him? But the topper is this. Catch and release round four, Deepak and Satish Kalpoe.

First of all, we heard that blood had been found in the car. Not. Then we found blood on a mattress. It was dog`s blood. Then there were rumors of a confession. Then that was retracted.

In Aruba, everything is bass-akwards.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

And the beat goes on. I want to thank all of my guests tonight. My biggest thank you to you for being with us, inviting us into your homes. A special good-bye tonight from a friend of my family. Eleven-year-old David says good night to his family. And from the control room, good night, everybody!

Coming up, headlines from around the world, Larry on CNN. I`m Nancy Grace, signing of for tonight. See you here Monday. Good-bye, friend.

END