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Niger Famine; The Funeral of King Fahd; Garang Death

Aired August 02, 2005 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ANNOUNCER: Live from CNN Center, this is YOUR WORLD TODAY.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If it rains a lot, it will be difficult to get to the site.

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JIM CLANCY, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: International aid workers struggling to help victims of the famine that has already killed thousands in Niger and threatens millions more.

ZAIN VERJEE, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: A royal in life, but buried among commoners. Saudi Arabia's King Fahd is laid to rest in a simple, unmarked grave.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nobody wants to die. If you go and bomb yourself, there's a reason. There's a very good reason why you do so. It's either you're hopeless or devastated, or sick and tired of life. That's how people are.

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CLANCY: Trying to understand the roots of terrorism. We talk with four young Arabs to hear their perspective.

It is 5:00 p.m. in Maradi, Niger, 7:00 p.m. in Riyadh.

I'm Jim Clancy.

VERJEE: And I'm Zain Verjee.

Welcome to our viewers throughout the world. This is YOUR WORLD TODAY.

CLANCY: The United Nations Food and Agriculture Organization is renewing its appeal for emergency aid for Niger. It is hoping for at least $4 million to help ease a worsening famine there.

VERJEE: The agency says its first plea for help back in May just yielded $650,000, all of it from Sweden.

CLANCY: All right. Now, with their matchstick legs and their swollen bellies, the sight of young children wasting away is heartbreaking for many, including the doctors that are there trying to help.

Anderson Cooper is alongside them.

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ANDERSON COOPER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): On a plastic- covered mattress in a makeshift hospital ward, a 10-month-old child fights to stay alive. His name is Habu Rebu (ph). His tiny body riddled with infections from months of severe malnutrition.

(on camera): So he came in on the 19th of July?

DR. MILTON TEKTONIDIS, DOCTORS WITHOUT BORDERS: Yes.

COOPER: And by the 30th?

TEKTONIDIS: He did well until about the 23rd, and then he crashed.

COOPER: So he's -- he's actually worse?

TEKTONIDIS: And now he came up a bit, and, yes, he's worse than when he came in.

COOPER: Worse than when he came in.

(voice-over): Dr. Milton Tektonidis works for the relief group Doctors Without Borders. Since January, in Niger, they've treated more than 14,000 children at risk of starvation. They know there are many more too sick to make it to the hospital.

(on camera): The mothers bring their children here from out of the bush. And there's one child here who is probably going to be admitted to the hospital.

(on camera): What do you look for?

TEKTONIDIS: Well, usually in a kid, you look for sunken eyes and skin that -- skin that doesn't come back, decreased skin terger (ph). Skin that -- see like that? It doesn't go right back. It stays folded.

COOPER (voice-over): This child's name is Rashidu Mamou (ph). He's two years old, and his pain is beyond tears.

TEKTONIDIS: This is a marasnekwa (ph), actually the worst case possible.

COOPER (on camera): So there's fluid?

TEKTONIDIS: There's fluid. You can feel it. If you feel it, you can feel he's got water in his tissues.

I think we'll get him. They will give him fluid, they will give him sugar right away to make sure that he's not hypoglycemic, and then antibiotics and milk. And if he makes it through the first day or two, you'll see him running around in another week.

COOPER: Really?

TEKTONIDIS: Yes. Yes. Yes. It's miraculous.

COOPER (voice-over): A few beds away, covered with a blanket, we find Aminu Yahehu (ph), watched over by his mom.

TEKTONIDIS: How are you? How are you doing, huh? How are you doing?

Move your hand a bit. OK. OK. Shh.

So he came in with edema everywhere.

COOPER (on camera): Edema, that's water.

TEKTONIDIS: Water in the tissues. So water everywhere. Water in the tissues, water around his eyes. And their skin discomates (ph).

COOPER: Discomates (ph) means?

TEKTONIDIS: Comes off. It comes off because of a zinc deficiency.

COOPER: So his skin is literally just peeling off?

TEKTONIDIS: Here it's gotten back down to normal again. It's gotten better. But there are some places it hasn't completely finished.

And he's unfortunately developed some lesions of pressure sores from being sick so long, but he's getting better fast. I'm sure we're going to save him. If he makes it through another day or two...

COOPER: That's a question, whether he would make it through a day or two?

TEKTONIDIS: Well, yes, for sure. He can get -- in an hour, he can die if he gets too much bacteria in his blood. What a life, eh? What a life.

COOPER (voice-over): If a child in this intensive care unit is able to drink milk formula, there's a good chance they'll live.

(on camera): Now he's drinking.

TEKTONIDIS: He's going to drink the whole thing. Bravo, bambino. Bravo. Bravo.

Bambini, bravo. Bravo. Bravo. All finished. Bravo. Bravo.

COOPER (voice-over): Rashido (ph) is trying to drink milk as well, but he can't take as much.

TEKTONIDIS: Almost gone. Slowly. Slowly. He's hungry. You have to go slowly, slowly, but he wants it, which is a very good sign.

COOPER: Habu (ph), however, can't drink at all. Doctors don't think he'll live through the night.

The next morning when we return, the arrivals' tent is once again filled, children getting weighed and measured. Some immediately receive milk.

Inside intensive care, Aminu (ph) is still asleep. Rashidu (ph) is awake, and Habu (ph) is alive. His breathing shallow and quick, but the nurses say he's stable.

This is the last time we'll see him. When we return later in the day, Habu's (ph) bed is empty.

(on camera): It's shocking how quickly things can change here, how in the blink of an eye a child can simply vanish. And when we came in this morning, the three kids we met yesterday were doing OK. At least they made it through the night, they were still alive.

Well, now it's the evening, several hours later, and things have changed. Aminu (ph) is OK, and his mom is pretty confident. But Rashidu (ph) is in septic shock. And Habu (ph) -- well, Habu (ph) died several hours ago. He was just 10 months old.

(voice-over): On the bed, Habu's (ph) cup and bowl are all that remain. His mother lives more than 100 miles away and is already returning home. She left Habu (ph) behind, buried in an unmarked grave somewhere on the outskirts of town.

(on camera): Do you get used to seeing this?

TEKTONIDIS: Yes, there's two or three a day. So we know which ones are going to go. There are some surprises. Those are a bit harder.

You have to keep on going. You can't -- you can't stop for -- for one death.

The mothers understand. They don't expect you to show sympathy. They expect you to try your best.

If you cry in front of the mothers, what good is that? They just start worrying about their own kids. So if you start doing that in front of the mothers, they start, "What's going to happen to my kid?"

COOPER (voice-over): Tomorrow, it's likely Habu's (ph) bed will get filled. In Niger, in this terrible time, there's always another child fighting to stay alive.

Anderson Cooper, CNN, Maradi, Niger.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CLANCY: Well, as Anderson Cooper said there, things change quickly inside those emergency tents. Aminu (ph), the little boy you saw profiled, shown here, whose skin was peeling off, died just hours after he was last filmed.

VERJEE: CNN is planning a special report on the Niger famine. Our Anderson Cooper and Jeff Koinange will be reporting from Niger, and you can watch the special edition of "ANDERSON COOPER 360" at 23:00 GMT on Tuesday, and again at 03:00 GMT on Wednesday.

CLANCY: All right. Turning to other news of the day, this time in the Middle East, a simple but emotional farewell to the man who ruled Saudi Arabia as its king for almost a quarter of a century. Muslim leaders from around the world gathered in Riyadh to pay their respects as King Fahd was laid in a desert grave.

Nic Robertson joins us now from Riyadh with details.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Jim, what was striking about the funeral service was the calm and dignity with which it took place. King Fahd was laid to rest in a graveyard that was perhaps the size of 20 football fields. It was filled with other graves that were marked just with a headstone and a footstone at the end of the grave.

There was no -- no names on any of the graves, and that was the same with King Fahd. He was buried alongside all those other anonymous graves, thousands upon thousands in that graveyard.

Senior dignitaries, senior members of the royal family came to the gravesite in the scorching heat to witness and partake in his burial. After he was buried, it was quite striking.

A lot of people, a lot of Saudis who had been held back -- normal people had been held back by the security forces from entering the gravesite, the graveyard, were able then once the dignitaries left to come in. And I stopped -- I stopped some of them and talked to them.

I said, "Why are you coming?" They said, "We want to pay our respects to him. He was the father of our nation. We liked him. We like what he did for us, and we've come to pay our respects, come to respect him in the way that he respected us," one man put it.

Many people coming just to stand for a few moments at his gravesite, perhaps throw another handful of soil on the grave. Of course, before the short ceremony at the gravesite, there had been prayers at the main mosque in the center of Riyadh. Those prayers attended by dignitaries from all over the world: Hamid Karzai, the president of Afghanistan; President Musharraf, Pervez Musharraf, from Pakistan; Bashar al-Asaad, the president of Syria.

Prince Charles from Britain was in attendance. Indeed, Dick Cheney, we understand, led the delegation for the United States.

Senior members, senior figures from countries all over the world. Indeed, world leaders came here today to pay their respects, and after the ceremonies went to meet with the new king, King Abdullah, in his residence, to pay him respects and tributes for his -- for his dead brother -- Jim. CLANCY: Beyond the scenes of the funeral, you have a royal family with some 22,000 princes or princesses. You have dividing lines within that family, the ultra conservatives, as well as those who would reform Saudi Arabia.

What is the future course of the country after King Fahd? What is the best estimation that you're hearing there?

ROBERTSON: I think the best estimation is that the course that it is on now is the course that it will continue to take, Jim. As we have seen over the last 10 years, King Fahd's health failed. Crown Prince, as he is now, King Abdullah, was essentially steering the country, ruling the country.

Those forces that you talk about, about the sort of extremes towards a certain view within Islam, and the extremes towards wanting to modernize the country quickly, are the same forces that King Abdullah has been balancing for some time. And they will continue to exist in the background.

One doesn't see them play out publicly. They are forces that privately, some Saudis close to royal circles will talk about and will explain -- will explain to us. But perhaps the biggest challenges that face the whole of the royal family at this time, including King Abdullah, are the need to reform the economy and provide a huge employment base that's needed for the rapidly growing young population here in Saudi Arabia.

So while there are those tensions behind the scenes within the royal family, I don't think one can expect to see them to spill over. They've been managed and contained within -- within the royal family for many, many decades now -- Jim.

CLANCY: Senior International Correspondent Nic Robertson reporting to us there live from Riyadh.

Nic, thank you.

VERJEE: The U.S. military says seven Marines have been killed in action in Iraq. Six died in fighting near Haditha. That's northwest of Baghdad. Another was killed in a suicide car bombing near -- or hit also northwest of the capital.

It begins -- excuse me. It brings the death toll among U.S. forces in Iraq to 1,800 since the war began in March of 2004.

CLANCY: We're going to take a short break. But still ahead, right here on YOUR WORLD TODAY...

VERJEE: A second day of unrest sweeps Africa's largest country.

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(END VIDEO CLIP) CLANCY: Supporters mourning the former rebel leader who helped end two decades of bloody warfare in Sudan. Stay with us for details.

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VERJEE: Welcome back. You're watching an hour of world news on CNN International.

We want to take you back to one of our top stories, the humanitarian crisis in Niger, where mothers are bringing their starving children to feeding centers in a desperate attempt to save their lives.

CNN's Jeff Koinange joins us now. He's gotten a firsthand look at the crisis there -- Jeff.

JEFF KOINANGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Zain. And the pictures that you were seeing in Anderson Cooper's piece of those little children being brought was right here, Zain, at this center won by the aid agency Medecins Sans Frontieres, or Doctors Without Borders.

Looking around me, I can see every day, and even now, hundreds of starving mothers bringing their equally starving and malnourished children here to the center, seeking any kind of nourishment, any kind of nutrition just to keep them going an extra day.

Now, even the World Food Program admits they may have to feed a lot more people than they expected, up from 1.6 to 2.5 million. Zain, that simply means that this famine is not going away anytime soon.

The worst part about all this is it could have been avoided. It shouldn't have happened, and we shouldn't have had to be seeing all these terrible and heartbreaking pictures -- Zain.

VERJEE: Why did it get this bad, Jeff?

KOINANGE: It got this bad because of several reasons. One, there was a recurring drought in this country over the last two years, two successive droughts. And then about this time last year, a terrible locust invasion, not just in Niger, but across the entire region.

This is when aid agencies started raising that red flag, telling the world there was a problem, there was a looming catastrophe in Niger. This was about November of last year. The world seemed to have -- seemed to have turned its back on Niger.

And then in December, the world's attention was directed towards the tsunami and southeast Asia. Then, Niger and possibly most of Africa was off the radar. And this problem continued up until a few weeks ago, Zain, when those pictures of starving children started streaming in television screens across the world.

This is how bad it's gotten. And Zain, guess what? These are the lucky ones who make it this far. Out in the countryside and villages, it's even worse the situation, where people cannot get access to food, to nutrition, to any kind of supplements. It's even worse out there. And aid workers are having a tough time getting to those difficult-to-reach places -- Zain.

VERJEE: Jeff, while people searching for food, needing food, the market stores themselves have food, don't they? It's just that people can't afford to buy it.

KOINANGE: And that's the irony of it all, Zain, is that, yes, there's plenty of food in the marketplaces. And merchants tell us they can't bring the prices down because that's going to affect their bottom line.

So we asked them, "So what? Will people starve?" They said, well, if they get some kind of compensation from the government, they're willing to lower the prices.

But then again, that has not happened. So you find people -- here's one classic example.

We were sitting in a sidewalk cafe having a meal. One of -- and the meal was brought to us, we started eating it. One of our crew members got up to go and wash his hands. Before you knew it -- and his plate wasn't empty yet. You saw a bunch of people just scrambling into that restaurant, grabbing food from his plate and rushing out.

They call them scavengers. This is how hungry and desperate people are.

They are waiting, literally, as people eat in restaurants. Whatever you don't finish, they grab it and they just take off. This is how terrible it's gotten, Zain. And it's not getting any better anytime soon.

VERJEE: CNN's Jeff Koinange reporting.

Thanks, Jeff.

In Sudan, supporters and family members of John Garang are paying their last respects. The Sudanese vice president and former rebel leader was killed on the weekend in a helicopter crash. He'll be buried on Saturday in Juba (ph), and that's the seat of the southern regional government.

Mr. Garang's party moved quickly to name a successor. His top deputy, Salva Kiir, has stepped in to lead the Sudan people's liberation movement. Kiir and the rest of the Sudanese government face the immediate challenge of calming rioting in Khartoum. Violence broke out in the capital soon after Mr. Garang's death was announced. More clashes have been reported on Tuesday.

For some perspective now on Garang's death and its effect on Sudan's peace process, we're joined now by Ambassador Michael Ranneberger. He's the principal deputy assistant secretary at the U.S. State Department's Bureau of African Affairs.

Thanks so much for joining us.

Are you worried that Mr. Garang's death will tear apart the peace deal -- peace deal that the U.S. was so instrumental in getting?

MICHAEL RANNEBERGER, U.S. STATE DEPARTMENT: Well, as you said, the United States has been the lead country working for peace in Sudan, and we did help to achieve this peace settlement that was signed in January. And we are confident actually that this accord will continue to be implemented.

Both sides, both the northern leadership in Khartoum, and the SPLM leadership, has signaled its total commitment to implementing the accords. And we fully expect that to continue with our strong support.

VERJEE: There's been a somewhat hurried departure by two U.S. envoys to the region, to Sudan, presumably to shore up the implementation of the peace deal. What will they be doing?

RANNEBERGER: The two enjoys, Assistant Secretary for African Affairs Connie Newman, and the Deputy Secretary Special Representative on Sudan Roger Winter, have gone out there to consult with the parties, to touch base with the SPLM leadership, and they will be talking to officials in Khartoum as well. And the purpose of that is to encourage the two sides to move quickly, to continue implementation, essentially to maintain the momentum, both with respect to the comprehensive peace agreement, but also with respect to the humanitarian crisis in Darfur.

VERJEE: You say that you are confident that all sides will adhere to the agreement to implement the peace deal. How can you be so sure?

RANNEBERGER: Well, we've been working this obviously for quite some time. We know the leadership quite well on both sides. And it's clear to us that the leadership on both sides had collectively made a commitment to this peace accord when it was signed.

This has never been about one man on either side. And it's clear from the statements that have come out and the conversations that we've had directly with the leadership of both sides since Dr. Garang's tragic death that they are absolutely committed to pushing ahead with the peace accord.

I think it's a very positive sign that the SPLM moved so quickly to designate the replacement for Dr. John. The government has responded positively to that. So all the signs are that the two sides will move ahead quickly to, as you said, shore up the implementation process.

VERJEE: Salva Kiir, Mr. Garang's deputy, is the successor, and he's been very open about his desire for two Sudanese, a north and a south. Does that worry you? RANNEBERGER: Well, of course the possibility of secession is built into the peace accords. There is a provision for a referendum at the end of the six-year interim period which began in July.

Now, that said, I think it's very significant that Salva Kiir and the other members of the senior leadership of the SPLM since Dr. John's death have been clear in saying we want to fulfill Dr. Garang's vision and his objectives for peace in Sudan. And Garang, as we know, had been one of the leaders calling for a unified, democratic country.

The fact that the SPLM leadership has come forward and said they support that vision, I think makes it clear that they are committed to that. And that is -- that is our assumption at this point.

VERJEE: Ambassador Michael Ranneberger, the principal deputy assistant secretary of state at the U.S. State Department's Bureau of African Affairs.

Thank you very much.

RANNEBERGER: Thank you.

CLANCY: All right. We're going to take a short break here, but coming up on YOUR WORLD TODAY, stories making news in the U.S. and, well, a little bit further away.

VERJEE: The space shuttle astronauts prepare for a big day in orbit. Details on what they plan to repair on the shuttle when we come back.

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CLANCY: Welcome back to YOUR WORLD TODAY. Let's check some of the other stories that are making news right now.

Just before heading to his Texas ranch for a vacation, U.S. President Bush signing the Central American Free Trade Agreement, CAFTA. It removes trade barriers between the U.S. and six other countries.

In pushing for CAFTA's approval, Mr. Bush stressed the deal helps national security. He said it will reinforce democratic governments in an area that until recently was torn by civil war and political turmoil.

Astronauts aboard the Space Shuttle Discovery gearing up right now to make repairs during a spacewalk. They want to remove filler material that is dangling from between heat-resistant tiles on the shuttle's underbelly. The seven-hour spacewalk, the third on this current mission, is scheduled now for Wednesday.

Baltimore Orioles baseball star Rafael Palmeiro has been suspended for 10 days for violating doping policy. Palmeiro says he has never intentionally used steroids and doesn't know how they may have gotten into his body. Palmeiro is the highest-profile player to test positive since a new major league testing policy was adopted this year.

VERJEE: A major business story to tell you about now. Chinese oil and natural gas giant CNOOC has withdrawn its bid for Unocal. CNOOC had offered $18.5 billion for the ninth largest U.S. oil producer, but the company says it was forced to back off because of what it calls unprecedented political opposition in the United States Congress. The move now clears the way for Chevron to finalize its $17.5 billion deal for Unocal.

CLANCY: All right. We're going to have a roundup of the main stories coming up in just a moment.

VERJEE: And what drove the London bombers to become involved in terrorism?

CLANCY: We posed that question to young Arabs and Muslims in a roundtable discussion. Join us for that shortly.

This is CNN.

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CLANCY: Welcome back to your world today here on CNN International. I'm Jim Clancy.

VERJEE: And I'm Zain Verjee.

Here are the top stories we're following. The U.N. is pleading for $4 million in emergency aid for Niger. A worsening famine there has 2.5 million people at risk for starvation. The World Food Program recently announced recently it's going to double the number of people getting urgent rations. Officials say that's necessary as the health of more and more people deteriorate.

In Sudan, relatives and supporters of John Garang have gathered, bidding farewell to their leader. The Sudanese vice president died in a helicopter crash on Monday. A formal rebel leader, he spent two decades fighting in the Bush fighting for independence for southern Sudan. He was sworn into a power-sharing government just last month.

VERJEE: Muslims from around the world gathering in Riyadh to pay their last respects to King Fahd. The Saudi ruler was laid to rest on Tuesday, after a simple funeral ceremony. In keeping with the kingdom's Islamic tradition, he was buried in an unmarked grave in a cemetery shared with common Saudis. King Fahd's half-brother Abdullah has assumed the thrown.

Italian authorities have charged London bombing suspect Hamdi Adus Issac with terrorism. Issac was arrested in Rome last week. He and three men arrested in Britain are accused of participating in the failed July 21st London attacks. Britain is seeking Isaac's extradition to London. His lawyer, though, has repeatedly suggested Isaac will resist extradition, and has told British television his client did not intend to kill anyone.

CLANCY: Part of Central London was briefly evacuated on Tuesday after a fire broke out aboard a double-decker bus. Please sealed off a large area around King's Cross station, but reopened roads within about an hour, saying there was nothing to worry about.

London, of course, is on high alert, and there have been scores of false alarms since last month's attacks. Thus far in the probe into the attempted bombings of July 21st, British police have 17 people in custody, including the four bombing suspects. They have detained and released some 30 people, including two men and a woman that they arrested in Brighton on Sunday. The four suicide bombings on the 7th of July killed 52 commuters and wounded more than 700. A previously unknown group calling itself Al Qaeda in Europe claimed responsibility for that. CNN, of course, has been unable to verify the authenticity of that claim.

Well, it isn't only the police and the press in Britain that are posing questions about what drove the London bombers to become involved in terrorism. Around the world, it's troubling young Arabs and young Muslims as well.

We had a chance to sit down and talk with four young people, all Arabs, visiting the United States for the first time. Here's how it went.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CLANCY: We want to begin with a question that's really on the minds of a lot of people, not only in the United States, but around the world, and having four young people here from the Arab world to discuss this is going to help.

Falastin, from the West Bank, I want to begin with you, and ask you the question, why do young people, why do young Muslims give up their lives to go out and kill others, and especially innocent civilians? What do your friends say about it? What do you think?

FALASTIN DWIKAT, FROM NABLUS, WEST BANK: Well, it's not only a matter of Palestinian, or Muslims or this stuff; it's a matter of nationality, of identity. I think the Palestinian people, they just give their lives as a gift for their home, for their freedom. Like in many countries of the world, when they were captured by other forces or other military, of course they will fight for that, to have their freedom. So I say see that thing as really normal.

CLANCY: So are Palestinians proud of it then? They see it as a sacrifice for their country?

DWIKAT: Yes, it is. It is sacrificing for their country.

CLANCY: And if it kills innocent civilians?

DWIKAT: No, it's not (INAUDIBLE). For me, I'm not really actually with the bombs that happen, people, where civilians live, but we can't also say they're suicide bombs, because also fighting for their nationality, fighting for their home, fighting for their freedom.

CLANCY: Sherine, you're from Egypt, and we just a bombing there that killed more than...

(CROSSTALK)

CLANCY: Yes, Sharm El-Sheikh, more than 80 people dead. Most of them were tourism workers, and they were Egyptians.

SHERINE EL-TARABOULISI, FROM ALEXANDRIA, EGYPT: And Egyptians, of course. I don't agree with the fact that you know, you just go and bomb yourself and kill innocent people. I don't agree with killing innocent people. I think that even in Islam, the concept of jihad is based on fighting for your own rights against people who are assaulting you or trying to take away your rights. That's basically what jihad is all about. But I think that...

CLANCY: Is it justified?

EL-TARABOULISI: What?

CLANCY: Is it justified?

EL-TARABOULISI: Is it justified, killing innocent people?

CLANCY: Yes.

EL-TARABOULISI: No, it's not justified. I don't agree with it at all. I don't think that even Muslims, or even Egyptians or any Arab -- or the Arab people in general, I don't think that they agree with killing innocent people. I don't think they agree with that.

But you have to understand that people are really suffering in the Middle East. Many people are suffering economically. There are some political problems, like the occupation in Palestine and so on, and really pressed down by all of that. And so, like, this affects the coming generations. It has been for, like, years and years and years before, and so I think they're really frustrated and devastated, and that's why they commit those suicide bombings and so on.

CLANCY: Is Osama bin Laden a hero?

DWIKAT: No, I don't think so. He's not.

CLANCY: But I think some people think he is.

DWIKAT: Some people they do, but they are also extreme, and they are also frustrated, and they just want a hero for them that can get some of their lost rights.

But for me as Muslim and as Palestinian, too, I don't think that he's a hero. What he actually did, he put Muslims and Arabs in a very bad place, that all the world looks at them like they are the terrorists. So I don't think that what he did was the right thing. It was really frustrating and more depression for all Arabs and Muslims.

HAJER ELLOUMI, FROM SFAX, TUNISIA: Those who believe that he's a hero have weak personalities and they are just being brainwashed. (CROSSTALK)

EL-TARABOULISI: I want you to understand that most of the youth, I mean, people our age in my country and the Middle East, I mean, they're really extremely vulnerable and impressionable as well. I mean, we suffer from different problems, so when somebody...

CLANCY: What are you talking about, they're vulnerable? They don't have jobs? They don't have hope?

EL-TARABOULISI: They're vulnerable. No, they don't have jobs. They don't have hope. It's hopeless. That, I think, is what Americans do not really understand. I mean, nobody wants to die. Nobody wants to die. We're always talking about immortality and all that. Nobody wants to die. If you go and bomb yourself, there's a reason, there's a very good reason why you do so. It's you're either hopeless or devastated, or you're sick and tired of life. That's how people are.

And I don't think like the Americans and the Europeans, they're always talking about the problems in the Middle East, but there's not no action.

CLANCY: No action. Do you think if they really wanted to solve it, they could? And what would it mean?

MAJID YAGOUT, FROM SANAA, YEMEN: Yes, it's easy for them. I mean, if they just think seriously about this problem, it can be solved, like Palestinian and Israeli problem. I mean, this issue can be solved easily if they just all later sit together.

CLANCY: What you're really saying here, and correct me if I'm wrong, what you're really saying is, if the U.S. really did force Israel to give back the occupied territories up to the green line, this wouldn't be a problem? Or would it. Come on, let's be real. I mean, do you think that terrorism would go away if you did that?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No.

(CROSSTALK)

DWIKIT: No, it will be more even.

CLANCY: Why?

ELLOUMI: An American intervention would worsen the state, I think.

CLANCY: No, but what I mean is, if the U.S. said to Israel, you have to go back to the line.

DWIKAT: Well, if they did, that would be good, but even the... CLANCY: But would it really end terrorism? That's the question. Would Israel be allowed to live in peace? That's the question.

ELLOUMI: No, but terrorism is not only a question of the Palestinian conflict. It's a question -- but what is terrorism? It's not only related to Islam. Terrorism is all over the world. I mean, during the First World War, the Second World War, there was terrorism, but it's only now...

CLANCY: But I don't expect you to know anything about that. You know, I mean, you know it exists.

ELLOUMI: But this word terrorism is a new word. It was just invented.

CLANCY: And it hasn't been yet defined.

ELLOUMI: No, it hasn't been.

DWIKAT: Yes, what is terrorism?

EL-TARABOULISI: But I think the problem with people is that, when a Muslim, like, bombs himself -- Islam is a religion of terrorism. And yesterday I was reading this article in "The New York Times," and it was all about Islamic terrorism, Islamic dominion. I mean, those words do not really exist. Why don't you look into Islam and understand what Islam is all about before coining such new phrases? You know, it forms a whole discourse (INAUDIBLE). It forms a whole big discourse. And it's very difficult to tune it out. People start thinking.

CLANCY: But to root it -- let me ask you something. To root it out, you as young people, you don't want your religion blamed for these horrendous killings.

EL-TARABOULISI: No, we don't.

CLANCY: But are you willing to stand up and say, look it, you know, you -- you can't do it -- if you think you're going to go off and do this, I'm going to have to turn you into the police to stop this. Do you have the courage to do that?

EL-TARABOULISI: Yes, we do.

CLANCY: But you said that a lot of people look up to these people?

EL-TARABOULISI: No, not a lot of people. Very few.

DWIKAT: Very few people.

EL-TARABOULISI: They're a minority. Very few look up to those people. I don't think that anybody I know in Egypt looks up to those people. And, in fact, we think they're the enemies of God. We don't agree with what happened in London, what happened in Egypt. I mean, Egyptians -- look at what happened in Sharm el-Sheikh. Hundreds of people died. And then you have the more Egyptian. I mean, my grandfather was in the same hotel, the compound. He checked out, like half past nine, and then at half past ten, it got bombed. I mean, what would have happened? How would I feel had he been there and killed? I mean, no, we don't agree with that at all.

CLANCY: Before we have to go, let me ask you. This is the first trip to the United States for all of you. And, you know, times have changed, Arabs -- like it or not, Muslims are being blamed for a lot of terrorism. How have you been treated?

EL-TARABOULISI: Nicely. I've been treated unexpectedly nicely. I expected that something would happen because I'm veiled and I look Muslim, and so on. But they were really nice to me. And I mean, all Americans were really quite nice.

CLANCY: Majid, your experience, what do you hope to get out of your trip, to learn?

YAGOUT: Well, for me, I got like, a huge experience here. The first time I came here, they told me, when you go to New York, you will find like a lot of problems, especially in Manhattan. But we stayed up until morning and there wasn't any problem. They were really friendly.

DWIKAT: But that was because we're a group.

YAGOUT: (INAUDIBLE) all people were really friendly with us. We were like speaking in Arabic, and they noticed that were Arabs, they tried to practice some few words in Arabic that they have with us. So it was quite nice.

CLANCY: Hajer?

ELLOUMI: I didn't find any difficulty. In the airport, they thought I was Italian or Spanish, they didn't believe I was Arabic. But I really -- I was impressed by New York. Almost everybody was speaking either Spanish or Italian or Arabic. It didn't look weird that we were speaking Arabic. We were treated very nicely.

CLANCY: That's called the melting pot. Welcome to all of you, and thank you so much for sharing what's on your minds today.

ELLOUMI: Thank you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CLANCY: That was our discussion. We've got a lot more coming up on YOUR WORLD TODAY.

VERJEE: We're going to go live to Israel, where soldiers are deflecting protests over the government of Gaza's disengagement plan.

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VERJEE: Welcome back. You're watching YOUR WORLD TODAY, an hour of world news here on CNN International. Israeli police and troops are deployed across Southern Israel, determined to block protesters from entering Gaza. Settlers and their supporters are gathering in the town of Sderot for another march against the upcoming Gaza withdrawal.

Paula Hancocks is there. She joins us now with an update. How many people have gathered, Paula?

PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Zain, at the moment, I'd say there's probably about 4,000 protesters here, many of them thinking there were 15 days to go before that withdrawal takes place. This is probably the last chance they're going to have to show their objections to the Israeli pullout of their settlement, from Gaza and parts of the West Bank.

Now, the police have said that they're only go to allow up to 5,000 protesters in the town itself for security reasons. We're only about a mile away from Gaza here, and this town in the past has been the target of many (INAUDIBLE). They're launching (INAUDIBLE) rockets here, which have killed and injured a handful of people. So the people here, in about an hour or so, an hour and a half's time, are then going to go to another town about 20 kilometers away from Gaza.

And now Wednesday morning is when the police say that they do have worries that could be some -- we will try to make that march to the Kushakativ (ph), the main block within Gaza. Now, this happened two weeks ago. They tried to make a march on Gaza. But there were thousands of people -- security forces, stopping them and surrounding them in (INAUDIBLE), where they were actually demonstrating. This time around, they picked a town which is very difficult to surround, and so it would be very difficult for police.

We expect 20,000 to 25,000, I'm being told, police and military forces trying to stop them getting into Gaza itself. It's been a military zone for about two weeks now. It's not open to non- residents, as the security forces do not want more people in Gaza than the actual settlers themselves. But they're worried that on August 15th, when it becomes illegal for settlers to be in Gaza, that there could be a lot of non-residents there as well. Another 48-hour grace period, and we'll have to leave Gaza, and then that's when the people go in. And at that point, the rest of the settlers -- Zain.

VERJEE: Competing with some of the loud speakers there. Thank you very much. Paula Hancocks, reporting.

CLANCY: And let's take a look at some of the other stories that are making news.

The newly-installed U.S. ambassador to the United Nations presenting his credentials this day to Secretary-General Kofi Annan. Bolton was in place -- put in place by President Bush in what is called a recess appointment. That happened Monday. It bypasses Senate confirmation, which Bolton wasn't getting. But several diplomats have said that they judge Bolton on his actions, not on all the past statements and the political rhetoric, that some of it has been critical of the United Nations. Well, nearly 20 years after he was convicted of rape, a Pennsylvania man is now free, thanks to DNA testing. Thomas Doswell, now 46 years of age, was denied parole four times because he refused to admit to the crime. Speaking at his mother's house on Monday, Doswell said he's thankful to be home.

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VERJEE: Former U.S. Vice President Al Gore's cable TV channel is up and running, and it's distributed to about 20 million homes.

CLANCY: A lot of people interested in this one, but as Brian Todd tells us, it is not developing into a bully pulpit just yet, and you probably won't even see Gore on the air if you don't get Current TV.

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BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Gone are the earth tone suits and ties, post-election facial growth and firebrand speeches. For now, Al Gore is darkly attired, open-collared, appealing to a new constituency.

AL GORE, FORMER VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I'm making a long-term commitment to the future of this network, and I don't expect to ever be a candidate for office again.

TODD: The former vice president and Democratic standard bearer no doubt hopes this venture might work a little better than his endorsement of Howard Dean.

Current TV, which just launched, features Al Gore as chairman, and touts itself as America's first network created for, by and with an 18- to 34-year-old audience.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Go everywhere, meet everyone, do everything, try it all once.

TODD: Current seeks to grab those young viewers with stylized news and social features, introed by MTV-ish hosts, some with journalistic backgrounds, others like Johnny Bell, whose previous experience, according to the network, consists of surfing and working on a banana farm.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You ever feel like hanging your boss over a tall building by his toenails, see how well they're attached to his feet? Well, if you have, you should probably chill out.

TODD: Bell and his cohorts aren't wrapping around traditional programs, but so-called pods, short-versed stories lasting anywhere 15 seconds to 15 minutes. They are all over the scheduling map: A mixed blessing, according to TV writers.

PAUL FARHI, WASHINGTON POST: Television viewing is very habitual. People like to sit down at a certain hour, flip around and see something that's familiar to them. This thing is going to shake up the whole model altogether.

TODD: About a quarter of the content is produced by amateurs with their own cameras. While some programming is political, Gore promise it won't be partisan, and network officials say there are generally no plans for the former vice president to appear on air.

Still, could it be a platform for future ambitions?

BILL SCHNEIDER, CNN SR. POLITICAL ANALYST: Even if he's not on air, people will be talking about Al Gore's television network, Al Gore's station. What's going on. The point is he has got to keep part of the debate, keep himself part of the debate. This could be one way of doing that.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CLANCY: All right, a look at a new TV channel in the U.S., CNN's Brian Todd introducing us there from Washington.

VERJEE: This has been YOUR WORLD TODAY on CNN International. I'm Zain Verjee.

CLANCY: I'm Jim Clancy. And this is CNN.

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