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Iraqi Negotiators Have Less Than Eight Hours to Reach Agreement on New Constitution; Exclusive Look at Some of Private Conversations Between Eric Robert Rudolph and His Mother

Aired August 22, 2005 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Developing story in Iraq. Government negotiators, with just eight hours to work out a constitution, working on a compromise to figure out the role of Islamic law. How much power will they give to hard-line clerics? We are live in Baghdad.
The historic Israeli evacuation of Gaza coming to an emotional end this morning. Residents leaving the final Jewish settlement there. We're live in Gaza.

And as protests and counter-protests spring up around the president's ranch in Crawford, Texas, Mr. Bush leaving town, trying to rally support for the war in Iraq on this AMERICAN MORNING.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning. Welcome, everybody.

M. O'BRIEN: Good morning. A bit of a new look here. We've moved to the Time Warner Building. It's spiffy, it's new, no window.

S. O'BRIEN: Ten blocks away from the old one.

M. O'BRIEN: Yes, we were 3/4 of a mile away from our control room. It's nice to be near everybody. I don't know if they're happy we're here, but that's another story.

S. O'BRIEN: Maybe it'll take more than just a couple days before they can answer that.

M. O'BRIEN: They'll get used to us.

S. O'BRIEN: Let's get to our top story this morning. Iraqi negotiators now have less than eight hours to reach agreement on Iraq's new constitution. If a deal cannot be reached by 4:00 p.m. Eastern time, another extension would be required. Otherwise, the legislature will be dissolved. Aneesh Raman, live for us at the convention center in Baghdad this morning.

Aneesh, once again, the negotiators cutting it very close?

ANEESH RAMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Soledad, good morning. Exactly. Hours to go and the National Assembly has not even set yet a time to convene. Last week, of course, there were two main issues; the role of religion and the notion of federalism. The latter, federalism, remains an emerging impasse, something they are struggling to find compromise on. We do understand though, in terms of the role of religion, an agreement has been reached. I spoke earlier with the president of Iraq's National Assembly about what the wording might be.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HACHIM AL-HASSANI, SPEAKER, IRAQI NATIONAL ASSEMBLY: What we agreed upon is that Islam would be a main source of legislation. And, also, anything that contradicts the principle and provisions of Islam would not be accepted.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAMAN: Now, this is a concession, Soledad, to more conservative politicians. Women's groups specifically had long been vocal that Islam should simply be a source, one of many, to ensure that their rights are kept intact.

The U.S. had also been pushing for that. They softened that stance in recent days, hoping instead that compromise on that point could push this process along. But it does raise questions about how prominent a role religious clerics will play in the new Iraq.

S. O'BRIEN: Give me a sense, then, Aneesh. Before they came to this potential agreement, people were saying they're 97, 98 percent of the way there. Does this agreement then solve all the problems and actually they're going to make this deadline? Or do you think that that's not enough of an agreement at this point?

RAMAN: Well, it's always been a matter of wording. They said, "Essentially we've agreed on everything except a few minor points." Those minor points are everything in the dialogue. Federalism encompasses oil revenue, how powerful these regional governments will be.

And laced in all of this is making sure that all the parties feel that this is a constitution that they are a part of, specifically, of course, the Sunnis who have voiced to me frustration that in the past week, they have been left out of the dialogue. And they have the power, Soledad, later by mid-October to reject this constitution if they choose.

Also, getting Sunnis involved in this process is essential to curbing the insurgency which is predominantly made of Sunnis. So they've said they're close to getting there, but the final step is everything, Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: It sure is. And the deadline looms, as we've said before. Aneesh, thanks -- Miles?

M. O'BRIEN: Evacuations are underway right now in the final Jewish settlement of Netzarim in Gaza. The process of relocating more than 8,000 settlers expected to be completed today. Ben Wedeman is outside the settlement.

And Ben, people in Netzarim said they would not offer up a struggle. Has that been the case so far?

BEN WEDEMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: By and large, that has been the case, Miles. No dramatic scenes really from inside the city of Netzarim. We know that they've spent quite a while praying in the settlement synagogue. But by and large, the process has gone fairly smoothly here, largely because of the prior experience the Israeli police and army got in the other settlements.

And also Israeli security, the army, has really reinforced itself around the settlement. For instance, in the bluff right behind me, there is now one tank and two armored vehicles very close to this building we're in, which is a Palestinian apartment building. So they've really reinforced the defenses around this settlement.

And also, the Palestinian security forces, which are apparently coordinating very closely with the Israelis, have also been deployed around Netzarim to prevent any sort of problem. Now, we have been seeing -- for instance, what you hear below me is a sound truck playing Palestinian national sort of patriotic music.

But the Palestinian security forces are trying to make sure that no militants and really no civilians go anywhere near the settlements to avoid any sort of problems, because the Palestinians do want this evacuation to be completed as soon as possible.

Now, just to give you a little background on Netzarim. It was founded in 1973. At the beginning of the Palestinian uprising in September, 2000, it was the scene -- or right near here was the scene of intense clashes between Israeli forces and Palestinians. I was there for a good deal of it, and it was some of the most intense fighting. But people hope that that's going to be a thing of the past now that this settlement has been evacuated -- Miles?

M. O'BRIEN: Ben Wedeman in Gaza, thank you very much.

Let's check some other headlines. Carol Costello joining us with that.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, good morning to all of you.

Now in the news, the U.S. military says American and Afghan forces have killed at least 40 militants in the eastern part of the country in recent weeks. The operation said to be aimed at securing the region ahead of elections next month. At least 14 U.S. soldiers have died in Afghanistan this month, 11 of them in hostile situations.

A possible breakthrough in stem-cell research. Some Harvard scientists say they have fused an adult skin cell with an embryonic stem cell. The development could lead to the creation of stem-cells without destroying human embryos. More details on the finding are set to be released today. Some of the information can be found on the Web site of "Science" magazine. So if you're interested, go to that Web site.

Pope Benedict XVI is back at the Vatican following his international debut. Hundreds of thousands turned out Sunday to hear the pope speak in his homeland of Germany. The mass capped off a week of World Youth Day events there. Pope Benedict urged young people to help others discover Christianity, and announced the next World Youth Day would be held in Sydney, Australia in 2008.

And Northwest Airlines resumes a weekday schedule today with more than 4,000 of its employees on strike. The airline's mechanics and cleaners walked out on Saturday morning after refusing to approve major pay cuts and layoffs. Northwest says there have been some cancellations, but most of its flights are on time.

But the mechanics are predicting it will become more difficult for the number four airline to maintain a normal schedule with replacement workers. So it might get worse, Soledad, at the week progresses.

S. O'BRIEN: One would imagine. All right, Carol. Thanks.

Eric Robert Rudolph will be sentenced to life in prison today for three Atlanta bombings, including the deadly 1996 attack in Centennial Olympic Park. About a dozen victims and family members will speak and Rudolph may as well. But his mother says she's not going to be in court today. Here's CNN's Rick Sanchez with an exclusive look at some of the private conversations between Rudolph and his mother.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

RICK SANCHEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's in these North Carolina mountains where Eric Rudolph eluded authorities for more than five years. Now, through letters and conversations shared with his mother and revealed to CNN, we are able to retrace his steps.

(on-camera): Were you as fascinated as the rest of us to hear how Eric was able to survive in the mountains for such a long period of time?

PAT RUDOLPH, ERIC RUDOLPH'S MOTHER: Yes, it's very interesting, you know, that he knew how to do all this. And I'm sure a lot of it, he didn't know. He just improvised as he went along.

SANCHEZ (voice-over): Rudolph survived, in large measure, from skills he learned in the military, his firsthand knowledge of the area where he had grown up, and in several cases, just dumb luck. In one letter, he describes to his mother how he stole a car, then ran out of gas in the middle of the road and, suddenly, was face-to-face with what he feared the most: the law.

RUDOLPH: It was in the middle of the night and a police officer came by and asked him what was wrong. He told him. And he said, "Oh, don't worry about it. I have gas in my car for when I run out and you can have that." So he gave it to him.

SANCHEZ: The police officer didn't know that he was helping a fugitive who was on the lamb?

RUDOLPH: Right. SANCHEZ (voice-over): Finally, in 2003, a rookie cop in Murphy, North Carolina, apprehended Rudolph. At the time, Pat Rudolph did not believe her son was guilty or even capable of such horrible crimes. Now, after hearing it from his own lips, she does.

RUDOLPH: It was quite a shock.

SANCHEZ: Eric Rudolph has admitted to, but not apologized, for two murders from four bombings that also injured more than a hundred people. Pat Rudolph says she doesn't agree or condone with what her son did, but had this to say to those who call him a monster.

RUDOLPH: I don't see him as a monster. I don't think I could.

SANCHEZ: Pat Rudolph says she will not attend her son's sentencing.

(on-camera): You're not going to go to the sentencing?

RUDOLPH: No.

SANCHEZ (voice-over): Rick Sanchez, CNN, Murphy, North Carolina.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

S. O'BRIEN: You can hear more of CNN's interview with Eric Rudolph's mother tonight at 7:00 Eastern on "ANDERSON COOPER 360" -- Miles?

M. O'BRIEN: Let's check back in on the weather. Chad Myers at the weather center, good morning, Chad.

(WEATHER UPDATE)

M. O'BRIEN: Still to come on the program, part one of our special back-to-school series, and get this title. We're calling it "School Days." That's good. That's good.

S. O'BRIEN: It took me days to come up with that, Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: It gets to the point. Today, some tips on helping your kids make smart food choices. Is there any smart food in the cafeteria? We'll find out.

S. O'BRIEN: We're going to tell you about that ahead.

Also, Judge Joseph Crater. He was once called the missingest person in America. But recently, a letter that was found might hold the key to the 75-year-old's cold case. We'll take a look back just ahead.

M. O'BRIEN: And next, will Cindy Sheehan's protest spark a serious anti-war movement? We'll ask that question next on AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) M. O'BRIEN: President Bush is scheduled to speak to veterans today in Salt Lake City. Part of a White House effort to bolster support for the Iraq war. The push comes as recent polls show support for the war slipping.

Just last night, Joan Baez, leading figure in the anti-Vietnam War movement, gave a free concert in Crawford, Texas, to protest the war. Joining us now from Washington, David Gergen, editor-at-large for "U.S. News and World Report." He has advised presidents Nixon, Ford, Reagan, and Clinton.

David, good to see you. When you see Joan Baez you know you've got a full-fledged anti-war movement underway here. What advice would you give the president right now, and perhaps, what advice would you have given him when Cindy Sheehan said, "I'd like to come visit"?

DAVID GERGEN, EDITOR-AT-LARGE, "U.S. NEWS AND WORLD REPORT": I think he might well have listened to some of the senior members of his own party. Senator Hagel, Senator George Allen both have said yes, he would have been far better off to see her.

If he gets a constitution in the next eight hours in Iraq, if that were to come off so you've got this huge story -- you know, he might have her come in just for a half an hour today and say hello to her, listen to her, do it in a dignified way. Well, I guess she's not there today, but in the next few days, find a way to do that.

And I think that would take some of the heat out. It would at least -- the anti-war protest would continue but there would be a sense in the country that he was listening, that he was not impervious, that he was not erecting a shell, and he was not in his own world, which is some of the argument.

M. O'BRIEN: But David, isn't the damage done somewhat? Can that be undone at this point?

GERGEN: I think the damage has largely been done. But Cindy Sheehan has become such a vehicle for the protest. She's become such a symbol and given voice to the protesters. I think to allow that symbol to embrace that, or to, in effect, listen to her, I think would serve the president well.

But I have to tell you, Miles, the anti-war movement is going to take shape now, it's going to take hold. We've had over a thousand demonstrations around the country in the last week or so. And you're going to see it grow over the next few weeks.

But this is not Vietnam. It's very different from -- there are a lot of serious parallels, but there is no draft here. We don't have thousands of young men being pressed into service around the country. So that when young people come back to colleges and universities in the next few weeks, I doubt that you're going to see major marches on campuses, because they don't face the fear of the draft as they did in Vietnam.

M. O'BRIEN: As the president goes out and tries to sell the war, if you can use that term in this case, what does he need to say? Who does he need to speak to? Who does he need to get through to? Today he's going to go to Salt Lake City to speak to a very friendly audience, Veterans of Foreign Wars. Is that the kind of setting you would recommend he'd speak to?

GERGEN: Well, traditionally, presidents have spoken to the veteran's groups at the end of the summer. That's when the VFW, the American Legion, have their big conventions. And they are good platforms for presidents, and he's wise to speak there.

But -- all of these things in Iraq are now hazed with "buts," aren't they? I think he's unlikely to be very much heard beyond his own base for a while. It's like the way he went on the campaign for Social Security reforms. The longer he talked, the more people seemed to drift away. And support never built for him.

In this situation, I think words alone are not enough. It's the facts on the ground that are going to determine how Americans respond to the war. Does he get a constitution today? Does he have to extend the deadline again? Very important. If they get a constitution, will the Sunnis support it in mid-October during the elections? If they veto it, we're back to square one.

Can this insurgency be reduced? Can the Iraqi troops be increased and strengthened in capacity. All those are big, big questions on the ground in Iraq. That's where he has to solve the problem.

What he needs here at home is a holding action. Keep the support of the war sufficiently strong that he's not forced to withdrawal until he has time to change the facts on the ground. If he can't change the facts on the ground he's in real trouble. He's in trouble now. But he'd be in real trouble then.

M. O'BRIEN: He's got some trouble in his own party. And this is unusual the GOP is a pretty disciplined group, generally. Let's listen to Senator Chuck Hagel real quickly.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. CHUCK HAGEL (R), NEBRASKA: Well, there's no question there's a parallel emerging here between Iraq and Vietnam. I've said from the beginning, and still say, there are a lot of, mostly dissimilarities. But there are some similarities. And the longer we stay in Iraq, the more similarities will start to develop.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

M. O'BRIEN: They don't like to hear that at the White House, right?

GERGEN: No, they sure don't. And as you well know, Chuck Hagel is very closely allied politically with John McCain. John McCain is one of the most popular figures in the country, not among conservatives in his own party, which is one of the -- you know, there are splits in the Democratic Party and there are splits in the Republican Party over this war.

But Chuck Hagel is giving voice to what a growing number of Republicans believe. I thought the bigger surprise in Chuck Hagel speaking as forceful as he did, and he is always forceful and independent minded, was the fact that George Allen, the new darling of the conservatives, the senator that many conservatives are looking to as their possible standard bearer for the presidential election of 2008, has broken with the president some.

He used to be in lock-step with him on so many issues. But now, George Allen is saying he should of met with Cindy Sheehan. He would have done it differently. That suggests the president -- his own base, his core base of conservatives is getting restless.

M. O'BRIEN: David Gergen, thank you very much.

GERGEN: Thank you.

M. O'BRIEN: David Gergen's the editor-at-large at -- I'm sorry, go ahead.

GERGEN: Breakfast with the O'Brien's, right?

M. O'BRIEN: Yes, absolutely. Enjoy the bacon. All right, thanks for joining us. He is you with "U.S. News & World Report." We appreciate it -- Soledad?

S. O'BRIEN: How did he know we wanted to change the name of the show to that. We'll talk more about that later?

And speaking of breakfast, still to come this morning, breakfast and lunch and after-school snacks. We've got tips on helping your kid make healthy choices. Stay with us. You're watching AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

S. O'BRIEN: Guess what? Summer vacation is rapidly coming to a close for many kids across the country. And their parents, too. And a lot of schools, in fact, are already back in session. So today, we begin our five-part series, it's called "School Days," on how the parents to make the transition.

We begin with kids and nutrition. Nutritionist and health columnist Heidi Skolnik joins us with a little bit of advice. We're talking about what to eat. And we're talking about, really, all age ranges. My kids who are little bit -- you know, the ones who are in preschool, three, four. And even up to high schoolers. Here's the problem. The bad stuff tastes good. The bad stuff tastes great. The bad stuff generally tastes better than the good stuff.

HEIDI SKOLNIK, NUTRITIONIST: It is a challenge. And we know that there are nine million -- 16 percent of American children are overweight or obese. That is huge. So this is an issue. Part of it though, is our taste buds are developed from when we're children onward, so what we get used to the flavor of, what we think tastes better, has partly to do with what you're educated about.

S. O'BRIEN: That's actually one of your tips. So let's run through some of them. You say the first thing you can do is teach kids when they're young about what's healthy and what's not healthy? I mean, can a 3 or 4-year-old understand that?

SKOLNIK: Absolutely. You can begin when your child is young. It's like you teach them many things from routines of the day...

(CROSSTALK)

S. O'BRIEN: Don't hit your sister.

SKOLNIK: Exactly. Don't hit your sister and drink your milk. It's that kind of thing. It really is where you are helping to establish for them what healthy means, what good eating means. That's a challenge because some adults don't know that. But we also know that parents influence is still the greatest influence. Your modeling of your behavior is the greatest influencer on your child's food selection.

S. O'BRIEN: So I can't say, "Don't eat Oreos," and then sit down and eat a box of Oreos...

SKOLNIK: Right. But you can teach them that you can have two Oreos and that's a boundary.

S. O'BRIEN: I know you say also control what you can. I guess when they're out in school and not home you shouldn't just give up, though?

SKOLNIK: No, we're not talking about giving up. We are talking about trying to understand that -- because you don't know what they're going to eat when're out. Use what you can do. Control what you can. So start with breakfast.

Again, we know with children that eating breakfast impacts their problem solving skills, their mood, and weight control. And actually, the whole cognitive function. So start with breakfast, you know, whether you're serving up oatmeal, Tropicana orange juice, or you're giving them a whole-grain waffle or yogurt. You need to be sure to both make the selections at home healthy and have the emphasis that eating is important, that patterning is important.

S. O'BRIEN: You also say send them in with snacks. And I think this is good for kids and also grown-ups. When you don't have the snacks is when you run to the machine to get the candy.

SKOLNIK: When you're hungry, it doesn't matter your selection. You just want to feed yourself. So if you have better foods available and you're prepared, you're going to eat better.

S. O'BRIEN: Do you think parents should ban or limit fast food? Which one?

SKOLNIK: I'm only to limiting, because I don't think -- you can't be the food police. You need to help educate your children, even at a young age, about how to be an educated consumer, and that all foods fit, but there's a difference between how much and when you're going to have it.

S. O'BRIEN: What do you mean by educated consumer?

SKOLNIK: Well, you know, even talking to a five-year-old, you can begin to say, you know -- my child would say, "I want that product," because it's their favorite character. And you can begin to say, "Do you think because the character is on the outside it affects what's on the inside?"

So begin to help them understand the marketing strategies that are employed. And that's going to again fare them well in all different sorts of things in life.

S. O'BRIEN: Do you think vending machines, which often support the marching band and any arts program in the school nowadays -- should parents be working to get those removed? Because a vending machine full of apples is not going to get as much money, and not generate as much income for school as a vending machine full of Coca Cola.

SKOLNIK: Well, there are 17 different states now -- 17 or 18 different states are actually making efforts in this way. And there are a lot more things that you can put in a vending machine. There are healthier choices and go well beyond just an apple.

So I think it's been shown that revenue does not necessarily drop by adding healthier choices or limiting choices, because you're just actually providing more choices.

S. O'BRIEN: Heidi Skolnik, thanks. Good advice. Thank you very much, we appreciate it.

SKOLNIK: Thank you.

S. O'BRIEN: Tomorrow, in the second part of our series, "School Days," how to keep kids from being stretched too thin with their school work and other activities. That's coming up tomorrow -- Miles?

M. O'BRIEN: Alright, thank you, Soledad. Still to come, a possible break in a bizarre and legendary missing person case. We'll look at the letter that could shed new light in the 1930 disappearance of a New York judge. That's ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.

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