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Nancy Grace
Louisiana Governor Declares Martial Law; Will Joran Van Der Sloot Walk Free in September?
Aired August 30, 2005 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Tonight, with the death toll rising as each hour passes, Louisiana in a state of martial law, martial law declared just hours ago in the face of rampant looting on top of the suffering across the South, from New Orleans to Mississippi, Alabama to Florida. The law is struggling tonight to cope.
Good evening, everybody. I`m Nancy Grace, and I want to thank you for being with us tonight. Tonight, to Aruba: Rape and murder suspects Satish and Deepak Kalpoe behind bars, after days of questioning by Aruban authorities and counting down four days before prime suspect judge`s son suspect Joran Van Der Sloot could walk free.
And tonight, a 12-year-old little girl missing from her own home in North Carolina, her bed discovered empty. Police say the child is on the move with a convicted sex offender, Philip Daniel Denkler.
But first, the Louisiana governor declares all of New Orleans must be evacuated. And tonight, in a rare move practically unheard of in the United States, martial law declared.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. HALEY BARBOUR (R), MISSISSIPPI: Let me just make a very flat statement here. I have instructed the Highway Patrol and the National Guard to treat looters ruthlessly. Looting will not be tolerated, period. And the rules of engagement will be as aggressive as the law allows.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: With us tonight in Montgomery Alabama, Lieutenant Colonel Robert Horton of the Alabama National Guard. In New York, defense attorney Alan Ripka, defense attorney Barry Sorrels, psychiatrist Dr. Joseph Deltito. In Biloxi, CNN meteorologist Rob Marciano, and in Gulfport, Mississippi, CNN`s Anderson Cooper.
Anderson, what do you see?
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Nancy, it`s almost impossible to describe what we have seen in Gulfport. I`m in the downtown part of Gulfport. I want to show you is behind me, a casino, which is a casino barge because, you know, by state law, all the casinos here have to be on barges. Well, it is now on land. That casino, that entire building was picked up by Katrina and deposited about half a mile or -- say -- yes, maybe about half a mile or so, right into the downtown of Gulfport, Mississippi.
And if the camera pans to the right, there are dozens of tractor- trailer trucks which have been picked up from the port area, carried by the water. It`s like a child`s playground of Tonka toy trucks just deposited right in the downtown. They are literally on top of each other. I`ve never seen anything like it, Nancy.
GRACE: Anderson, it`s my understanding that there has been rampant looting. In fact, martial law declared in other areas. Have you seen looting?
COOPER: I wouldn`t call it looting. What I have seen is desperate people kind of wandering around here in downtown Gulfport. There are a lot of police here in Gulfport, so you can`t get away with looting. But I have seen people picking stuff up from the wreckage. I saw a man with two bottles of olive oil. He was hoping to try to cook something up. He says he has no water. He doesn`t really have much of a place to go. So there are a lot of people just desperately in need.
But CNN`s Adaora Udoji just reported moments ago she is getting information about looting in New Orleans. Shots have been fired. A number of arrests have been made. We`re trying to get a sense of how wide-scale it is, but may be getting serious in the city of New Orleans right now, Nancy.
GRACE: Well, Anderson, recently enacted, just August 11, which is uncanny, Anderson, looting laws going into effect in Louisiana, up to three years behind bars for looting, six months for price-gouging. And Anderson, CNN has so much of this on video! The hurricane strikes, and suddenly, that`s your free ticket to a microwave!
The problem with looting, Anderson, not just that people may steal a microwave, many people are refusing to evacuate, Anderson, because they fear looting!
COOPER: Yes, absolutely. And it`s a concern. I mean, it`s a scary situation. You know, when darkness falls, I mean, you`re stuck in your home all alone, and there are people wandering around in your neighborhood. And you know, the phones don`t work. You can`t call the police. The land lines don`t work. The cell phones don`t work. It is very scary. And looting, you know, it`s a breakdown in civil society, and that is something that authorities simply cannot tolerate or will not tolerate because it just spreads and it feeds on itself, as you know, Nancy.
GRACE: Anderson Cooper is with us. Everyone, take a listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEN. HAROLD CROSS, MISSISSIPPI NATIONAL GUARD: If you`re in the business of theft, this may not be the best time to apply your trade. I would advise that you pick another time because we are going to be very, very aggressive with those that try to exploit this disaster against people`s property.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Let me go out to Lieutenant Colonel Robert Horton. He is with the Alabama National Guard. Thank you for being with us, sir. Is Alabama deploying National Guardsmen?
LT. COL. ROBERT HORTON, ALABAMA NATIONAL GUARD: Well, so far, Alabama has deployed 1,600...
GRACE: Whew!
HORTON: ... Guard members here in the state of Alabama. Out of the 1,600, we`re sending 300 military police to the state of Mississippi to help law enforcement officials maintain law and order there. And we`re also deploying engineers to the state of Mississippi. At the same time, we`re sending an entire infantry battalion to Mobile, Alabama, to support local law enforcement officials in that area.
GRACE: Lieutenant, take a listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARBOUR: Let me just make a very flat statement here. I have instructed the Highway Patrol and the National Guard to treat looters ruthlessly. Looting will not be tolerated, period. And the rules of engagement will be as aggressive as the law allows.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Back to Lieutenant Colonel -- excuse me for calling you Lieutenant, sir -- Lieutenant Colonel Robert Horton with the Alabama National Guard. Your people were probably thinking that they were going to help clean up, hand out aid, blankets water, ice. Instead, they may be faced with looting.
HORTON: Well, one of our state missions in the event of a natural disaster is to support local law enforcement agencies, and we`re prepared to do that. But at the same time, we have to follow the military rules of the use of force. We`re not a lead law enforcement agency when it comes to supporting natural disasters here in Alabama. We support civil law enforcement agencies and we take guidance from them, and our intent is not to use deadly force. We have, again, rules and regulations that we have to abide by, but the lead law enforcement agencies are the civilian law enforcement agencies and not the National Guard.
GRACE: To Anderson Cooper. What is the food and water situation there? We`ve lost Anderson Cooper at this moment. We`ll have him right back. I want to go back to Lieutenant Colonel Robert Horton. Sir, what advice do you give these guys that are heading out into a very volatile situation?
HORTON: Well, one thing I would like to say is that our National Guard here in Alabama are well led, they`re well trained and well equipped. They understand the rules of use of force. I would say that over 90 percent of our Alabama Guardsmen who are supporting disaster relief efforts in Alabama and also in Mississippi are combat veterans. We`ve deployed over 10,000 Alabama Air and Navy National Guardsmen to Afghanistan and Iraq. So these are seasoned veterans, and they`re going to perform their mission in a professional manner.
GRACE: Let me go to Professor Harry Scheiber out of Berkeley University. He is a specialist in martial law. Professor, welcome. What do you make of the situation of martial law being declared?
HARRY SCHEIBER, MARTIAL LAW EXPERT, U.C. BERKELEY: Well, right now, you have the -- the local authorities have declared emergencies. So you have these local emergency declarations. And the National Guard is moving in to support them under the civilian rules. In these extreme emergency situations, the courts really do tolerate the suspension normal property rights and normal civil liberties. The Guard and -- (INAUDIBLE) Guard and your local authorities can just go in and aggressively enforce by deadly force because they`d be answerable to it later. And they have their own rules, as was just said.
But if they have to take your house or commandeer your car or your truck, that can be done because it`s an emergency situation that has -- that I`m sure any court in that area, if it`s challenged later, will say was necessary under emergency powers. And then the legislatures can sort out compensation and all that later.
GRACE: Right. I`ve just been handed a wire. Policemen warn of an arrest at the Louisiana Superdome. Policemen tell CNN unrest rising in that area near the Superdome in downtown New Orleans, three shootings, looting, attempted car jackings taking place in broad daylight, concerned the situation is deteriorating and will do more so overnight outside the stadium. At least 20,000 people holed up there since Katrina roared ashore. We have pulled CNN reporter John Zarrella because of the unrest.
I want to go back to Professor Harry Scheiber, who is an expert in martial law. Professor, when has martial law been declared in the U.S.?
SCHEIBER: It`s been declared hundreds of times, in cases of violent labor disputes, times of emergency like this, with floods or fires, and in wartime. Hawaii, for example, which was then a territory, the entire islands of Hawaii were under martial law for several years and in complete Army control.
GRACE: Professor, hold on just one moment. I`ve got my connection back to CNN`s Anderson Cooper. Anderson, what`s the water and food situation there?
COOPER: It is very bad. I mean, they`re basically -- as far as we know, there`s no potable water, there`s no electricity for pumps. And there -- a lot of the people have been evacuated. We found a couple of people just kind of stumbling around in Gulfport, just kind of looking for something. They don`t have electricity. They can`t cook up their food. It`s rotting.
Some people have been encouraged to try to barbecue whatever food they have in their refrigerator. But you know, there`s no ice. It is really miserable for people here right. We`ve seen a bunch of people are lined up for some ice just to get a cool drink. But you know, darkness is falling, and there are a lot of people in need right now in Gulfport, Mississippi.
GRACE: Anderson, barbecue how? Rub two sticks together?
COOPER: I`m sorry?
GRACE: How do you barbecue? How do you tell the people to barbecue food? They have no electricity. They have no water. They have no home to go to. Barbecue how? What do they mean?
COOPER: Well, you know, that`s the thing. All you can do is build a fire and try to cook up what you have. I mean, it`s a survival technique. You know, I mean, it`s really gotten down to that. And it`s hard to sort of -- you know, we`re all comfortable in our regular lives, and it`s hard to imagine how quickly you can be just taken out of your life. You`re living your normal life, and you know, being brought into survival conditions. And that`s what people are in right now, Nancy.
You know, darkness is falling. People got nowhere to go. It is really -- it`s miserable, and it`s just going to get worse. There`s no end in sight, really, for these people because right now, you know, search and rescue operations are going on. There`s not a lot of operations going on of trying to, you know, feed people, bring water to people because it`s just -- you know, it`s just too early for that and the police have too much on their hands.
GRACE: Anderson, where are you going to go?
COOPER: That`s a good question. I don`t know. I mean, I was in -- we found a hotel in Philadelphia, Mississippi, about four hours north of here last night. We ran out of gas. We found some gas at a Wal-Mart. We got a little bit of food at that Wal-Mart, some, like, potato chips. We drove down here. I don`t know where we`re going to go tonight. We`ll find something. Maybe we`ll sleep in the truck and wake up and, you know, start working again tomorrow.
There`s so many communities here, and people are so desperate for information. You know, the last thing we`re thinking about is, like, where we`re going to sleep or how we`re feeling. That doesn`t matter. There`s so many people in need right now, and information is so important.
GRACE: Anderson, you were just showing us a shot of casinos. Could we pan back to that?
COOPER: Yes.
GRACE: How the heck are they going to protect...
COOPER: Yes, could we show that shot of the casino?
GRACE: How are they going to protect casinos?
COOPER: Yes, go ahead, Nancy.
GRACE: How can they be protected?
COOPER: Well, they can. I mean, there are police officers around here, but you know -- and this whole area is cordoned off. I mean, citizens cannot come back to Gulfport, Mississippi, right now. We were able to get down by showing press passes, but the highway is shut down to anyone. It`s only people who decided to stay here during the storm who are actually here, and police are keeping a very close eye in downtown of anyone who`s kind of roaming around. We`ve seen a couple of people roaming around, and police are kind of, you know, moving them along as politely as they can.
But that casino, which is -- I mean, that`s a barge that was just picked up and deposited on the ground. I`ve never seen anything like that, Nancy. To be honest, when I first came here -- I haven`t been to the Gulfport before -- I saw that casino, I thought, You know what? It`s got a little bit of damage on the ground floor, not too bad. I didn`t realize the whole building had been picked up and just pushed there. It`s just extraordinary. You can actually see the slot machines. The owner, apparently, is somewhere around there, and there are police. But you know, there`s -- it just -- it`s -- I can`t even describe it, Nancy. It`s just - - it is so surreal, it`s like...
GRACE: Anderson...
(CROSSTALK)
COOPER: ... this is real life and people are in need. Go ahead.
GRACE: Anderson, get out of there. I don`t like you right there with all those slot machines. Police -- everything is in disarray. You might not be worried about you, Anderson Cooper, but we`re worried about you. Friend, thank you.
COOPER: Well, thank you, Nancy.
GRACE: We`ll all be right back. And in a very unusual twist, martial law has been declared in the state of Louisiana. Stay with us.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARBOUR: I`m concerned about looting. I`m going to tell you what. Now, we`re just going to be ruthless about it. There was some looting during the night before -- you know, we don`t -- we didn`t have that many soldiers on the coast. We`ve got a lot of soldiers on the coast now. And we`re going to be aggressive about it. I mean, to me, looting is about like grave robbing. I have no -- I want to be merciless in dealing with them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: A state of martial law, very unusual move, declared in Louisiana. All across the South, suffering. And on top of it, martial law.
Very quickly, I want to go to a new guest joining us, Major General Herald Cross, commander general of the Mississippi National Guard. Major, thank you for being with us. Describe the scene there.
CROSS: Yes, I can just barely hear. I think we got a bad connection. But I am on line. I can barely hear you. Can you speak up, please?
GRACE: Yes, sir. Could you describe the scene there?
CROSS: All across the coast of Mississippi, there`s just a very destructive devastation that reaches from the shoreline, up about a mile from the shoreline, where almost every building is either fully destroyed or the structural integrity is compromised. Beyond that, there`s a tremendous amount of debris, and people -- some of the people that are trapped in falling buildings.
And so it looks like closest thing I can describe it, Nancy, is a nuclear weapon having gone off two miles from shore and just a blast wave hitting the entire Gulf Coast. This was storm surge with tremendous energy, far beyond what we saw in Hurricane Camille.
GRACE: Major General Herald Cross with us, commander general with the Mississippi National Guard. What are your people, the National Guard, prepared to do?
CROSS: Actually, we rolled in just after the winds died down with military police and search and rescue people. And we`ve augmented that with several hundred more this morning, and we`ve got a couple of thousand more rolling toward the Gulfport, Biloxi, Pass Christian, Pascagoula and Bay St. Louis area to try to prevent looting and to rescue people who were stranded.
And then we`ve got to really get into the business of distribution of supplies, water and food and those necessities. We don`t have any running water throughout most of the Gulf Coast, and very little electricity. And as you know, it`s 95 degree-plus temperature in a post-hurricane environment. So we have a lot of people that have a potential of getting into trouble very rapidly if we don`t get the distribution system up. We`ve got it well under way, and we`ve got a lot of help from the Federal Emergency Management Agency, along with our local emergency management staff and augmented by National Guard agreements from adjacent states. And we`re getting a lot of help, but we need it fast.
And we`re responding as well as we can to immediately trying to save lives, and then, of course, reaching out for distribution, to keep people going until we can clear...
GRACE: Major...
CROSS: ... everybody out and get...
GRACE: Major, as night begins to fall, what dangers are your people facing?
CROSS: Well, of course, we have people spread out as far as possible, still trying to rescue those that are stranded. We face dangers, of course -- downed power lines -- that are not as apparent at night as they would be in daytime, some of which may still be charged.
We also have the normal dangers of trying to sift through debris of apartments and dwellings where you have structural integrity compromised and you have roofs still collapsing. So we have very tenuous work to do there. But also, we`re very concerned about looting at the same time. There`s a tremendous amount of that starting up, and we`re trying to control that and will control it very aggressively.
GRACE: Well, it`s interesting that you would say that. With us, Major General Harold Cross. He`s the commander general of the Mississippi National Guard.
We have just been handed wires, Major General Cross. New Orleans police have told us there is widespread, and they quote, massive looting in the downtown area, three different shootings around the Superdome, two of them near apartment buildings where people are, multiple car-jackings, attempts by refugees, as they say, on downtown highways trying to get control of passing cars leaving the city.
Very quickly, to professor Harry Scheiber. What is martial law?
SCHEIBER: Well, martial law involves the suspension of normal legal processes regarding property and civil liberties in a time of extreme emergency. And when General Clark (SIC) says that they`re going to give all support that they can within the law and when Governor Barbour says that he`s going to be as aggressive as the law permits, it means that any action that`s reasonable in the face of this kind of devastation and this kind of dangerous behavior...
GRACE: With us is Professor Harry Scheiber from Berkeley University. The last federally declared martial law appears to be in Hawaii during World War II, declared by the state.
Elizabeth, could you help us out with those full screens? Everyone, here are the numbers you need to know as we go to break. If you want to help, call the Red Cross toll-free, 800-HELP-NOW. The conditions, devastating. FEMA, 800-621-FEMA. Price gouging, 800-488-2770. Open your hearts and your wallets.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: A state of martial law declared in Louisiana due to looting. Now three reported shootings, multiple car-jacks. As people are trying to leave the city, they are attacked for their car.
Welcome back, everybody. Very quickly to Major General Herald Cross. He is the commander general of the Mississippi National Guard. Major General, how do you take bankers, accountants, secretaries and prepare them to enforce martial law?
CROSS: Well, let me first say that we`re nowhere near martial law being declared in Mississippi.
GRACE: True.
CROSS: I talked briefly with Governor Barbour this afternoon, and what we have here in Mississippi, we don`t have car-jackings going on right now...
GRACE: But how do you prepare everyday laypeople for situations unheard of?
CROSS: Well, you prepare soldiers to do their job wherever called on, on their federal mission, as well as their state mission. But what we`re doing now is preventing looting of the shops and stores, that people see an opportunity to get a free television or something like that, and they steal other people`s property.
We can control that. It`s going to take a little while to get a full grip on it, but we treat it very aggressively. But that`s far from being martial law. We`re just assisting local law enforcement agencies by providing military police and other...
GRACE: Well, you know what, Major? You are the lucky ones. The National Guard deployed to Louisiana not so lucky. Everyone, martial law declared in the state of Louisiana. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SOPHIA CHOI, CNN HEADLINE NEWS ANCHOR: Hi there. I`m Sophia Choi with your "Headline Prime Newsbreak."
Millions are without electricity or drinking water in the tragic wake of Hurricane Katrina, which has killed at least 115 people. Aid agencies say things might not improve for months.
In New Orleans, things are getting worse, as water levels continues to rise. There are reports of looting and gunshots near the Superdome. In some areas, water is 20 feet deep. And the mayor says 80 percent of the city is now under water.
Mississippi officials now say at least 100 people are dead in a coastal area alone. A 25-foot wall of water smashed into Biloxi, where a coastal casino was torn from its moorings and split right in two. Businesses there also reporting widespread looting.
And Homeland Secretary Michael Chertoff is calling for the involuntary recall of 555 U.S. Coast Guard reservists to assist in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina. The Coast Guard has about 8,000 reservists in all.
That`s the news for now. I`m Sophia Choi. Now back to NANCY GRACE.
GRACE: That`s right. They`re all back together again behind bars. Digs, not so nice, but it`s time to be reunited. Right now, Satish, Deepak Kalpoe behind bars, questioning going on for days.
We`re talking about the Natalee Holloway disappearance. Big day tomorrow. Joran Van Der Sloot, the state`s chief suspect, the judge`s son, is to appear back in court.
With me tonight from "A Current Affair," correspondent Harris Faulkner. Also with us, Giovani Lane, a reporter for "Diario." Paul Reynolds is with us, Natalee`s uncle. Of course, Alan Ripka, Barry Sorrels, and Dr. Joseph Deltito.
To Harris Faulkner, bring us up-to-date.
HARRIS FAULKNER, "A CURRENT AFFAIR" CORRESPONDENT: Well, Nancy, first of all, you brought up Joran Van Der Sloot. Let`s get started with what could possibly happen tomorrow.
And that`s that court appearance, where there`s a possibility this week, at least, if not tomorrow, he could be charged. Let me tell you what prosecutors did today. They filed their motion to try to get his detention detained for 30 more days.
The burden of proof at this point is higher. So what they`re going to try to do is charge him -- and our sources on the island are telling "A Current Affair" -- that the charges will have something to do with sexual assault or violation of Natalee Holloway.
Coming and going with Joran Van Der Sloot today, you know, he was not questioned. We were told by his attorney that interrogation set to begin again today. He wasn`t questioned yesterday. He got a break.
His attorney, though, is saying don`t expect Joran to say very much during that interrogation. Why? But he`s, quote, "going to exercise his right to remain silent."
Well, you know, I don`t know if that`s such a bad thing, because he`s had so many stories up until now, that maybe if he exercises his right to remain silent, they can stick to one story, Nancy, and we can see prosecutors go forward based on that.
Also, a note on the Kalpoe brothers. Satish and Deepak Kalpoe going inside one of the jails today. They were spotted. And we had heard reports yesterday that their interrogation was supposed to begin in earnest again today. We can only assume that that was happening.
Also, Steve Croes, the party boat deejay -- I`m kind of giving you the jail coming and goings, because that`s really where a lot of the action has been this week -- the party boat deejay, aboard Tattoo. Remember, he was arrested early on.
We told you last night that it looked like he had been arrested again, because he was spotted at jail. Although when he ran into a camera crew, Steve Croes said, "No, I`m just here to pick up a few things."
Well, we confirmed today he was, in fact, being interrogated again, questioned again by police, but not officially arrested -- Nancy?
GRACE: To Giovani Lake -- she is a reporter with -- he is a reporter with "Diario" newspaper -- first of all, how`s the health of our friend, Jossy Mansur?
I think I`ve got Giovani.
GIOVANI LANE, REPORTER, "DIARIO": Yes, hi, Nancy. Jossy came in today. He was looking OK. I asked him how he`s doing. He said he`s OK, and he`s ready to keep on working.
GRACE: Well, please give him our best. Jossy Mansur in the hospital and at the same time dealing with the fact that the Aruban prime minister has filed a defamation lawsuit against him.
Giovani Lane, is it just coincidental that it`s time for reelection for the Aruban prime minister, and Jossy Mansur has been reporting on this missing person`s case that happened under his watch?
LANE: Well, it seems every time an election is near, there are certain things going on, people are criticizing the government or criticizing other parties. And Jossy has seen that the government hasn`t done the job that they said they were going to do.
And he`s accusing the prime minister of certain things that he had proof of long time ago and certain proof of now. And the prime minister, seeing his election, and "Diario" is the biggest newspaper on the island. Everybody reads "Diario."
So if something bad is said about the prime minister, a lot of people are going to read it. And he`s afraid that a lot of people might believe it and don`t vote for him.
GRACE: News tonight. The arm that washed ashore a Venezuelan coast line does not belong to Natalee Holloway. As a matter of fact, this arm is not a human bone. So, this is yet another wild goose chase that we have been led upon by authorities.
Very quickly, to Paul Reynolds. Paul, Joran Van Der Sloot back in court tomorrow. What is the response of the family? And what do you expect, realistically expect to happen?
PAUL REYNOLDS, NATALEE HOLLOWAY`S UNCLE: Well, first of all, we`re very pleased that the Kalpoe brothers were re-arrested. You know, we think that they, along with Joran Van Der Sloot, certainly know what happened and are the key to the answers that we need.
We, you know -- we expect him to stay in custody. We certainly think the evidence is there. You know, we`re hopeful that that will come forward very soon. And, you know, we`re very happy with the process right now. The authorities are moving diligently towards this end.
You know, we did have some problems in the beginning. There were some problems with the investigation. And, you know, we harped on the chief investigator a great deal. But, you know, I know you mentioned the prime minister. You know, he`s always been a strong supporter. And Jossy Mansur, both of those men have been strong supporters of this investigation.
GRACE: Right.
Very quickly to Alan Ripka, defense attorney. We know that the Kalpoe brothers are behind bars on suspicion of rape and premeditated murder.
Alan, the significance, to me, of those suspicions are, one, felony murder. If a death occurs, even by accident, during the commission of a felony, rape, that is a murder, such as when a shooting occurs during a bank robbery. That is the same penalty as premeditated murder.
Also, Alan, the suspicions are premeditated murder. And you know what that does, Alan? That completely shoots out of the water this theory that has been flourishing that, "Oh, maybe she had an accident. Maybe she fell and hit her head. Maybe they gave her drugs like ecstasy and she choked and died."
These charges do away with any theory of accident, Alan.
RIPKA: That`s right, Nancy. But I`ll tell you this: First of all, your felony murder rule is correct. And that goes for all three of these suspects, which makes it dangerous for all three of them.
But as well, Nancy, that`s a big leap to say that this is premeditated murder when at this time there`s absolutely no evidence on anything.
GRACE: Well, I`m just telling you what they were booked on suspicion of, and I`m quoting, "premeditated murder." I didn`t just make that up on the way to the studio. This is what they are booked on, suspicion of, quote, "premeditated murder."
Barry Sorrels, response?
BARRY SORRELS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, suspicion is the key word. They`ve arrested these guys before on suspicion and said they had the evidence when they didn`t. So I don`t know why we should give these arrests any more credibility.
I mean, Nancy, Aruba has due process of law. You can`t lock somebody up and throw away the key that you suspect of having committed a crime.
GRACE: Well, I`m not worried about that in Aruba, all right?
SORRELS: The government has to -- they`re going to have to put some evidence up.
GRACE: They definitely did not throw away the key. The Kalpoe brother were over at the Internet cafe just one week ago, OK?
SORRELS: Well, if they have the evidence, let`s bring it and follow the law. The law says, if you have it, that he can be held, they can be charged, and the court can be prosecuted...
GRACE: Well, my whole point is that...
SORRELS: But if you don`t have it, let them go.
GRACE: ... you are dancing around is, they are booked on suspicion of rape and premeditated murder. Now, listen, these Aruban prosecutors are not exactly daredevils, OK? They`re not going out on a limb. But these are the formal booking suspicions, premeditated murder.
SORRELS: All I`m saying is, instead of suspicions, let`s put forth some hard evidence that connects these kids to the crime. And if they`ve got it, that`s great. Let`s prosecute them.
GRACE: I don`t know why you keep saying "kids." They`re 18 to 21. At 18 years old, my father was on a battleship, all right? I don`t know what you mean by kid.
SORRELS: I take my kid back. These young men.
GRACE: To Dr. Joseph Deltito, professor of psychiatry, Doctor, once again, we hear they`re stone-walling, exercising their right to remain silent. Doctor, do you have any glimmer of hope that this team of so- called expert, Dutch experts, are going to crack these three?
JOSEPH DELTITO, PROFESSOR OF PSYCHIATRY: Well, I think they`ll probably crack by the usual means. And that is, when they`re actually charged of a specific crime, and a prosecution has begun, I believe that, at that point, the wall of silence will probably break and they`ll point fingers at who actually did what when.
I think they`re sort of stone-walling now, but I would be very suspicious that once there actually (INAUDIBLE) charges, a prosecution going on, lawyers preparing to defend them. At that point, I think people who might not have been as culpable as others will point the finger at who did most mayhem in this case.
GRACE: As we continue to track Hurricane Katrina, the destruction she left in her wake continues to mount. One hundred and counting killed by the hurricane. Their bodies are floating in the flood waters. Coast Guard rescued 1,200 other people stranded in the floods in the New Orleans area alone.
Oil rigs also lost in the storm. The federal government may release crude from the petroleum reserve, called a national security asset if oil production is disrupted. Martial law declared tonight in some parishes of Louisiana, not the entire state. No martial law in Mississippi, but in Louisiana.
There is help. If you need disaster relief, please call FEMA, 1-800- 621-FEMA. If you have been the victim of price gouging, 1-800-488-2770.
Open your hearts and your wallet. If you would like to help with relief, call the Red Cross, 1-800-HELP-NOW.
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GRACE: CNN now reporting, just in, the crime situation becoming extremely dangerous in New Orleans. The National Guard is set to take over Canal Street, New Orleans, in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina. Martial law in effect in multiple parishes across Louisiana.
Welcome back, everybody. We`re also live tonight in Aruba. Let me quickly show you some video of Joran Van Der Sloot`s parents this morning on CBS "Early Show."
Do we have that, Elizabeth?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PAULUS VAN DER SLOOT, FATHER OF JORAN VAN DER SLOOT: I`m not hiding anything. We`re telling the whole truth, nothing but the truth. And I spoke always to Joran to tell the truth.
ANITA VAN DER SLOOT, MOTHER OF JORAN VAN DER SLOOT: I think what the family is doing is terrible. I don`t think it`s their right to do things like this. But I know so there must be so upset.
Our prior goal is to get Joran back. I just want my kid back. It has been enough. It really has been enough.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Again, that`s from the CBS "Early Show."
Back to Harris Faulkner with "A Current Affair," who, p.s., on "Current Affair" tonight, exclusive interview in the missing groom case with the Royal Caribbean. Now, that`s a tough nut to crack. Congratulations on that one, Harris.
FAULKNER: Well, thank you very much.
GRACE: So, Harris, again, for those of viewers just joining us, tomorrow Joran Van Der Sloot in court. And what do we expect to happen?
FAULKNER: Well, we could possibly see his detention carried on for another 30 days. That`s what the motion that was filed by the prosecutors today is really pushing for.
But, you know, I think the thing to look for this week is possibly a sexual assault or some sort of violation charge against Joran.
Dr. Deltito was talking about the...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, violation charge? You mean something short of rape?
FAULKNER: Yes, you know, I mean, some of the details that have come out -- and I don`t know that we want to get quite that explicit -- but some of the detail that have come out about what might have happened between Joran Van Der Sloot and Natalee in the backseat of the car that were testified -- I shouldn`t say testified -- but that were talked about in interrogations by both the Kalpoe brothers and Joran very early on in this case.
You may remember Beth Twitty talking and saying, "Well, we knew things had happened."
GRACE: So you`re saying some type of a sex charge against Joran Van Der Sloot. What about murder?
FAULKNER: Well, you know, we could see that, although sources on the island have told "A Current Affair" that what they might push for first, because they think they can get it best with the evidence that they have, is a sexual assault or some sort of sexual violation charge.
I do want to say this. You saw the parents talking, Nancy. June 9th was when they arrested their son. I bet they`re getting frustrated.
GRACE: Well, yes. But, you know what? They get to visit their son.
FAULKNER: Exactly.
GRACE: Can you tell me the same thing about Beth Twitty? No.
Harris Faulkner, everybody, reporting on Aruba. But remember tonight -- Harris, I`m going to be watching -- exclusive report with Royal Caribbean on the missing groom case. Hope you ask them the tough questions, Harris. Thank you, friend.
FAULKNER: You bet I did.
GRACE: Everybody, I want to quickly shift gears. We need your help. A 12-year-old missing girl out of North Carolina taken from her bedroom.
Tonight, with us, Rocky Mount Police Chief John Manley; in Raleigh, North Carolina, 12-year-old Jodie Collie`s grandmother, Dorothy Collie is with us; in Atlanta, "Gwinnett Daily Post" reporter Andria Simmons.
Very quickly, Officer, what do you know about this guy we believe she`s with? Is he a sex offender?
I think I have the officer with me, Chief John Manley. Chief, are you with me?
OK, not hearing the chief, I`m going to quickly go to Andria Simmons with the "Gwinnett Daily Post." Andria, what can you tell me about this guy we believe she`s with?
ANDRIA SIMMONS, "GWINNETT DAILY POST" REPORTER: He is a registered sex offender. He had gotten out of prison about a week prior to this disappearance. And he had served some time on equivalent of a child molestation charge. I think they call it taking liberties with a minor.
And that was in his past. He had had a probation violation and had just gotten out when this happened.
GRACE: Everybody, Jodie Collie`s grandmother is with us in Rocky Mount, but just hearing the facts of the case has made her breakdown. We`ll be with her in just one quick moment.
Back to Andria Simmons with the "Gwinnett Daily Post." Andria, how do we think this 12-year-old girl came in contact with a sex offender?
SIMMONS: He worked at a store in that area of Rocky Mount, North Carolina. And they believe that they met at some point, maybe as long as a year ago, and had perhaps kept in contact by phone. And I don`t think that her grandmother was even aware of it, but somehow he kept calling her and built a friendship with her, is what police believe, anyway.
GRACE: I am getting a report -- an unconfirmed report -- right now, Andria, that the girl has been found. Jodie Collie has been found, this 12-year-old girl.
Do we have the chief, Elizabeth?
I want to go to Chief John Manley with the Rocky Mount Police Department. Chief, is there good news?
CHIEF JOHN MANLEY, ROCKY MOUNT POLICE DEPARTMENT: Yes, that`s what I`m hearing at this time, that there is good news. I don`t know exactly know what all of that pertains to at this particular point.
GRACE: So, Chief, have you or have you not found the girl?
MANLEY: Just hold on one second. I got detectives here talking with me now at the same time you were calling me. Hold on one second.
GRACE: We may have good news about Jodie Collie, breaking news. The 12-year-old girl who we believe was taken by a convicted sex offender, I`m hearing in my ear, we may have found the girl. And the grandmother has just been apprised of this.
Alan Ripka, very rare that we get this good news.
RIPKA: Yes, this is incredible, Nancy. Thank God this guy was not a killer.
GRACE: Very quickly. We`re going to be right back with the officer and with the grandmother.
As we go to break, to tonight`s "All-Points Bulletin."
FBI and law enforcement across this country on the lookout for Lawrence Seth Wayne, wanted in connection with the manslaughter and 1998 death of 44-year-old Donald Alan Cantwell (ph), Palm Beach County, Florida.
Wayne, 31, 5`7", 170 pounds, brown hair, brown eyes. If you have information on Lawrence Seth Wayne, call the FBI, 305-944-9101.
Local news next for some of you. But we`ll all be right back. And remember, verdict watch in the daycare homicide trial, 3:00 to 5:00 Eastern, Court TV`s "Closing Arguments."
Please stay with us as we remember Marine Second Lieutenant James J. Cathey, just 24, an American hero.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: We at NANCY GRACE want very much in our own way to help solve unsolved homicides, find missing people.
Take a look at Nita Mayo, 64 years old. Nita Mayo disappeared this month, her car abandoned on the highway east of Pinecrest, California. There`s a $10,000 reward for information leading to Nita`s safe return.
If you information on this beautiful senior, Nita Mayo, please call the Carole Sund Carrington Foundation toll-free, 888-813-8389.
Everybody, a miraculous piece of breaking news. Twelve-year-old girl Jodie Renee Collie, taken out of her own bedroom in North Carolina, has been found, while we are here on air talking about her.
With us, Chief John Manley with the Rocky Mount Police Department. Sir, what can you tell me?
MANLEY: OK. The information I have at this time is that she has been located out in Des Moines, Iowa. And I`m at the present time trying to get more additional information, but she has been located and she`s...
GRACE: Alive?
MANLEY: That`s what I have. And as I get more information...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Do you have the man, Phillip Denkler, 27 years old?
MANLEY: No, we do not.
GRACE: So, bottom line, Barry Sorrels, he made it from North Carolina to Des Moines, Iowa, and he left her alone where she was discovered. Now, there`s a piece of work, Barry.
SORRELS: Yes, this guy, he`s very impressive, isn`t he? I`m hoping that the innovations that`s been in place with respect to abducted children worked in this case and this guy let her go unharmed. And he`s probably heading for the hills. And now the best thing we can do is catch him.
GRACE: Well, you know, he has been let out early on another sex offense, but this girl on her way home.
Chief John Manley, congratulations, sir.
MANLEY: Yes. And as I stated earlier, this is the information that we have at this time, but I understand that a lot of this came directly from the family at this particular point in time. So I know that the federal authorities are still doing everything they can to directly put our hands on her, but they do know where she is at this particular point.
That`s the information I have and it`s as accurate as I can give it.
GRACE: Thank you, Chief John Manley with the Rocky Mount Police Department.
Tonight, Jodie Renee Collie, 12 years old, is headed home.
I want to thank all of my guests tonight, especially a special guest joining me from the control room, David Broza (ph). Our staff person, Ramon`s (ph) dad is with us.
Thanks for being with us.
Good night, everybody. See you tomorrow.
END
