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CNN LARRY KING LIVE

Hurricane Katrina

Aired September 6, 2005 - 21:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LARRY KING, CNN HOST (voice-over): Tonight deadly E Coli bacteria has been found in the floodwaters off New Orleans. Five die in the hurricane zone of a cholera-related infection. Is a disease disaster brewing? We'll ask the Surgeon General of the United States Vice Admiral Richard Carmona.

Plus, "Purpose-Driven Life" author Pastor Rick Warren, who is in Baton Rouge, after touring the disaster area; our man Dr. Phil McGraw who spent Sunday with evacuees in the Astrodome, and more of those evacuees and their stories of lost loved ones next on LARRY KING LIVE.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KING: Good evening. Our regular panel throughout this first hour will be in Washington, Vice Admiral Richard Carmona; here in Los Angeles, Dr. Phil McGraw and Pastor Rick Warren in Baton Rouge. He's author of the "Purpose-Driven Life."

Dr. McGraw's book "Family First" and "The Family First Workbook" are now out in paperback. He has visited the evacuees, was with us the other night as well and he will host this program next Monday night. He's the host of "Dr. Phil" the fourth season starts September 12th. We're going to talk about a special program he's got coming up in that series on Thursday.

But first, Admiral Carmona, the Center for Disease Control is urging all people who have been exposed to the floodwater to get a shot for Hepatitis A. Is the government prepared to administer this type of medical aid to this many people and where do they go to get the shots?

VICE ADM. RICHARD H. CARMONA, U.S. SURGEON GENERAL: Larry, in fact, what's going on right now my colleague Julie Gerberding at CDC, which is part of Health and Human Services, has dispatched 24 teams, many with U.S. Public Health Service officers to do an assessment in the area, find out just what's going on environmentally as well as to do an individual assessment of any patients that remain in the area.

That's why it's really critical that we get patients moved out of that area to evacuee centers where it's safer for them while that assessment is being done. The centers themselves have provisions for vaccinations when they're needed and that's all people have to do is check in and get assessed and their medical provider will guide them as to what is needed. KING: Is this a killer E Coli?

CARMONA: Well, certainly E Coli can. It's not unusual to find E Coli when you have disasters, when you have large amounts of people congregating in one place where sanitation is not the best.

But the public health authorities within New Orleans, Dr. Kevin Stephens, we were in contact with him numerous times throughout the day working with leadership there and all of the federal partners trying to get a handle on that. And, in all of the centers that we visited the last couple of days they have very good public health input there to make sure that infection does not spread.

KING: Dr. Phil, you've been there. You've been to the Astrodome. You've been in Dallas. I'm going to show a clip in a minute. What do you make of all this from a human standpoint?

DR. PHIL MCGRAW: HOST, "DR. PHIL": Well, Larry, the truth is that we've never seen anything like this I think in our lifetime. I think the loss of life here is going to very likely number greater than 9/11, which certainly was not a natural disaster but something that Americans had to deal with. This is different in that from other hurricanes and other storms that we've seen in that these people are not going to be able to go home a lot of them.

KING: Ever maybe.

MCGRAW: Ever because home is not there. Saturday and Sunday I was in Dallas. We have evacuees at the Reunion Arena there and at the Civic Center, at the Astrodome in Reliant Park down there, thousands and thousands of these evacuees and in talking with them they're saying they don't want to go home. They can't go home. They're going to have to start an entire new life.

And, think about this. They got out with the clothes on their back, which they probably don't even have anymore, so they have no mementos. Their banks are gone. Their records are gone. Everything is gone. They're just like standing there having to start completely over and the short term response and care in these shelters has been absolutely inspirational.

You have no idea the passion of those volunteers that are working with these people and how much it's appreciated but this is a long term problem and now we add the disease.

And I'm curious about asking the surgeon general he's saying about the patients being assessed what are the symptoms? I think the viewers want to know what are the symptoms, Mr. Surgeon General, that we should be looking for if the exposure -- how can you be exposed and what are the symptoms? I think that's what America wants to know.

KING: Good question.

CARMONA: Happy to answer, Phil, and thank you for the question. E Coli is a germ. It's a bacteria that normally inhabits your intestinal tract but at times when there's close crowding, at times when there's not the best of sanitary conditions it can cause problems, like diarrhea. It can cause gastrointestinal problems.

The problem with that in a crowded environment like the evacuees are experiencing there are a lot of germs, both viruses and bacteria that can cause that problem, so it's of utmost importance that the health professionals are screening to ensure that the right diagnosis is made and the right treatment afforded.

And as you said, Phil, I just came back with Secretary Leavitt yesterday from visiting the New Orleans site, Baton Rouge, as well as the evacuee sites. What they have put together where there was nothing four or five days ago, what these communities have done to come together with a great passion to serve mankind is absolutely extraordinary and unprecedented in the history of this country.

KING: I'm going to have Phil follow up. I want to ask Rick Warren one thing in here because I want to get a clip in from Phil's show. Rick, you've talked about three phases of disaster, rescue phase, resuming phase, rebuilding phase, what do you mean?

PASTOR RICK WARREN, "PURPOSE-DRIVEN LIFE" AUTHOR: Well, Larry, the rescuing phase is a phase that usually lasts several days. FEMA comes in and they find the survivors and they take them out. They find them. They rescue them and they take them out and it does take several days.

Then comes the resuming phase which is usually the responsibility of the local governments and that's the resumption of water, of power, of electricity, communications. Of course, here in Louisiana still there's a lot of communications that is still out and those resources have to be resumed and that often takes weeks.

The rebuilding phase takes years and I think it's very interesting that you've invited Admiral Carmona, who is about physical and Dr. Phil about emotional and myself about spiritual because, as human beings when we go through a crisis it affects all three parts. We're spirit, we're soul and we're body and that rebuilding has to take place on all three levels.

KING: Dr. Phil, on this Thursday you weren't scheduled to resume Thursday, were you?

MCGRAW: No, we had finished season three but we have gone back early into that and are taping shows because, as Pastor Warren says, this is a multi-part thing and, Pastor, I can tell you that the faith among these evacuees that we've been around in Dallas and Houston is what's sustaining them right now.

KING: How do you explain that?

MCGRAW: Well, it's just that, it's just faith. I mean they truly believe God has a plan and that they're not going to be forgotten and abandoned.

KING: I want to show a clip from Phil's show which will air Thursday. Watch and we'll ask him about it. Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MCGRAW: We've been gathering information and we have a really good lead on your husband and children. We may be able to locate them just right now. I feel good enough about it to tell you that I'm leaving here right now and going to Dallas and if you want to do that, I'm happy to take you and your three children and you can go with me to Dallas and we'll see if we can connect you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: What happened?

MCGRAW: Well you have to tune in Thursday to see.

KING: It's optimistic though.

MCGRAW: But, let me tell you what we've been working to do and hopefully to create hope and optimism for these people is to do as many reunions as we possibly can to fine these people because, Larry, the system hasn't caught up with him yet.

They're in the shelters. They're registering but it's difficult to get their names, get everything on a database that's consolidated with all of the shelters so people can see whether or not their husbands, their wives, their loved ones are alive.

Many of these people saw their loved ones last on a rooftop and what happened is they took the women and children out first. Everybody thought they would come back for the husbands take them to the same place. Houston filled up so fast they had to start diverting family members to other places.

Some truly have been lost in the flood. Some are in shelters and they're just kind of nameless and faceless right now database wise but they're safe and we want people to not -- to absolutely not give up hope.

KING: We'll take a break and be back with more. Don't go away.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BREAKING NEWS)

KING: This just in and we'll get a comment from Anderson Cooper. Mayor Ray Nagin has ordered police and other law enforcement agencies to remove everyone from New Orleans who is not involved in recovery efforts following the hurricane.

The order authorizes state and local police, firefighters, National Guard and other military forces to compel the evacuation of all persons from the city of New Orleans regardless of whether such persons are on private property or don't desire to leave unless such persons are determined by such public safety officers to be specifically engaged by the city, the state or the U.S. government in providing assistance.

The only exemption is for the residents of the Algiers District across the Mississippi River from downtown which suffered only limited flooding. They have ordered everyone evacuated.

Anderson Cooper what do you make of that on the scene in New Orleans?

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: We've been hearing that for some 24 hours now that that was likely to happen, so it doesn't come as a great surprise. It's absolutely necessary. I mean, Larry, you still have people living in their homes or in homes that they have commandeered in the midst of floodwaters and what is in this water I can tell you have I have had it in my mouth, I have had it all over me yesterday, is, you know, as you know E Coli.

There are all sorts of bacteria. There are corpses floating. I saw a man on top of a car who has been out there for more than a week. No one is even picking up these bodies at this point. I mean occasionally they do if they're getting in the way.

But, the National Guard in some places from reports I've heard are tying ropes around some of these bodies and just tying them to stop signs to keep them from floating away and then they just move on.

When this water starts to drain and we find out how many bodies are inside these houses it is just going to be a very dark and very dirty few days. It is a huge health problem. All the doctors here we're talking to are talking about it and the concern also is for these first responders. It's not just media who are out in these boats. They're not wearing face masks. They're not wearing gloves, Larry.

These are guys and women who are just volunteering who come from around from various states risking their lives probably more than anyone even realizes because they're in this water and they are breathing it and they are getting it in their eyes and getting it in their mouths -- Larry.

KING: I want to get the comments of our panel. Admiral Carmona what do you make of that? Is that the right move to take everybody out whether they want to or not?

CARMONA: It's absolutely important that people evacuate. We would hope that they would do it of their own volition when appraised of the risks but because this is a public health emergency it's absolutely vital that people leave the area.

Our first responders they're trained to deal with this. If their skin is intact, they take precautions, what we call universal precautions. It minimizes the risk of infection from any of the contaminated water that they come in contact with but they still are placing themselves at risk. These are heroes. Let's face it. They're out there jeopardizing, accepting the risk to their own lives to go and save others, which is what they do every day.

KING: Dr. Phil, what's the emotional aspect of being told to leave?

MCGRAW: Well, I think it's -- you've got a real tension right now and I think the admiral is describing it well. A lot of people don't understand an invisible threat like this. I mean they know that the waters are there but some of these people are truly believing that if they leave their home that they'll never come back that something will happen that it will be bulldozed down or it will go away and it's the only place they know.

And, to take them away from that it's like they're giving up. It's like they're saying "I'm just, I'm giving up. I'm throwing my life away. When I get in that boat my life as I know it is over" and so they're hanging on to that.

And, while that's understandable, the truth is that as the Admiral knows and as Anderson is reporting, if they stay there their likelihood of death or serious injury is exponentially greater and then that taxes the system and the situation even more.

KING: So, they got to do this.

MCGRAW: They absolutely have to do it and there's an emotional price that you pay for that but they have to do it. And the question I have for the admiral is, again, I think people want to know how can you get infected?

We have 239,000 evacuees in Texas right now most of whom have been in contact with the floodwaters, most of whom have gotten it in contact with their mucous membranes, either in the eye or in their mouth.

We have so many of them that now are going to have some of the symptoms of diarrhea and gastrointestinal distress because of the stress, the change of diet, the lack of sleep, the stress. How do you do a differential diagnosis for these folks?

KING: Admiral, I'm going to have you answer in a minute but I want to get in one word here from Dr. Gregory Henderson. He moved to New Orleans three weeks ago to take a job with Oxner (ph) Hospital. He sent his wife and two young children out of the city ahead of the storm, felt he had to remain.

As a pathologist he got a crash course. He compares the worst of this to health crisis in the Darfur, Sudan and he said it is criminal. What do you mean by criminal, Dr. Henderson?

DR. GREGORY HENDERSON: I think it's criminal that the degree of, lack of medical support that was here early on after the storm and for the several days after so so many people were allowed to basically receive not only no water, very little food but certainly no medications, not even their basic medications, whether it be their insulin, whether it be any other, their high blood pressure medication, any of those medications.

But, beyond that, these people needed acute medical care and by virtue of the fact that there were floodwaters -- whatever prevented it, I don't know what prevented it because I was here in the middle of it praying for it, wishing it would arrive just like everybody else. But it got here. It's finally here but it was way too late and a lot of people died and a lot of people suffered needlessly.

KING: Thank you, doctor.

I want to ask when we come back I'll ask the admiral to respond to Dr. Phil's question and get Rick Warren's thought on anger and what you do with that. What do people of faith do with their logical anger?

Don't go away.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KING: We're back.

And, before we get back to the key questions that Dr. Phil had for Vice Admiral Richard Carmona, the Surgeon General, Pastor Rick Warren's thoughts on the evacuation, and other reporters we'll get in touch with, Senator Barack Obama is joining us from Washington, Democrat of Illinois.

He has been at the Astrodome with Oprah Winfrey, as well as with Bill and Hillary Clinton and he just attended a hearing with the heads of national security, with Secretary Rumsfeld and we understand, Senator Obama it got a little testy, true?

SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D), ILLINOIS: Well, I think there are a lot of us that are still unsatisfied with the answers that have been provided. I think all of us, Republican and Democrat, share the view that we have to focus on making sure that people are safe, secure that they've got housing, that they've got basic sanitation conditions.

But, ultimately we're also going to have to go back and ask some tough questions and this wasn't the forum I guess that various cabinet members thought we needed to ask those questions but there's going to be time over the next month as we stabilize the situation to really figure out what happened last week.

KING: Did they get angry these officials?

OBAMA: Well, no, you know, I think that their attitude is, is that everything went as well as it could have gone under the circumstances and we're moving forward. And, you know, I recognize the interest at this point in making sure that we don't start doing the Monday morning quarterbacking before the job is done.

On the other hand, the breakdowns were so severe last week and I think that the emotions that the entire country felt were so profound and acute that it's going to be very important for us as a country to process what happened and to make sure that it never happens again.

KING: Senator Obama, Dr. Phil wants to ask you something.

BARACK: Go ahead. MCGRAW: Senator, certainly we're going to have to deconstruct all of this and figure out how to do a better job the next time this happens. How do you -- and we'll learn from that I'm sure.

How do you feel about the plan from this day going forward? I mean clearly we're going to have to break it down, figure out where things went wrong but we are where we are now. How does it look in terms of the readiness, preparedness and responsivity over the next 30, 60, 90 days?

OBAMA: Well, you know, I visited Houston as you did and I think all of us were impressed. We've got to I think give great credit to the city of Houston and that entire region for the outstanding work that they've done creating a clean, safe environment for all these displaced populations.

But, I think moving forward we've still got tiny towns in Mississippi, in Louisiana, all across the gulf that are still struggling and we've got to stabilize the situation for them, people who weren't evacuated out of New Orleans.

And then we've got the medium term of finding housing, making sure that people have employment opportunities or at least some income, that children are in school and that as I'm sure you're aware the enormous shock that people are going through is somehow processed and they've got an opportunity to deal with that with professionals.

MCGRAW: Well, that's true and I know I spent today earlier, Senator and Larry, on the phone with Dr. Russ Newman (ph) and Dr. Judy Andrews, who are with the American Psychological Association and the Texas Psychological Association talking about the disaster response network that has been created in the psychological community here to give these people the short term support, I mean support in the immediate term because you can't get in and do psychotherapy at this point.

What you've got to do is support them, answer their questions, let them know that somebody is listening and try to normalize the feeling so they kind of get down off the wall and realize, OK, we've got to live in the moment and put one foot in front of the other.

But then the question becomes in the long term when the referrals start going to their community mental health centers and people that are dealing with post traumatic stress disorder, they're dealing with anxiety, they're going through the grief process are we going to overwhelm that system?

Just as with 239 evacuees in Texas many of these are children in already overpopulated schools fighting budget problems. Where do we put the children? I mean as the Senator is saying it's so difficult to think about how many fingers this has into American society.

KING: I want to bring Rick Warren back in. Senator, do you want to comment on what Dr. Phil just said?

OBAMA: You know, I do think Dr. Phil made an important point. We already had tremendous strains on our school systems, on our health systems before the hurricane. You know one of the most profound things that was said to me while I was visiting the Astrodome, one of the women who were there said "You know, I had nothing before the hurricane. Now I have even less."

And I think that describes the state of a lot of folks that were displaced and one of the questions that we're going to have to ask ourselves as a country is how do we address the sense of abandonment that many of these communities felt even before this crisis and how are we going to start getting serious about making sure that children have opportunity?

How are we going to make sure that we're serious about a health care system that can accommodate all people? This compounds those problems and they're going to be born not just in Louisiana and Mississippi but surrounding states like Arkansas and Texas who are going to be tested to the breaking point.

KING: Pastor Warren, I haven't forgotten you. How do you people keep their faith during this?

WARREN: Well you know, Larry, I've been amaze at the resilience the people have been showing. I've been in four states and probably nearly a dozen different relief things in the last 24 hours and I actually was at that Astrodome myself. I spoke there on Monday and then walked the floor and most of those people they're not having a problem with keeping their faith. In fact, it's their faith that's holding them up.

And really the real story is not the Astrodome and it's not these other domes. While there were 18,000 to 20,000 in the Astrodome, there are 150,000 out in the community in Houston and the untold story is there are thousands of local churches of all stripes and denominations that are taking these people in and they are the only possible distribution system for problems of this size.

The government doesn't have enough distribution systems. Red Cross and all the NGOs, as great as they are, do not have the system that's already in place. And, I have been visiting church after church after church that are taking 800, 1,000, 300, 500 and moving them actually into homes of members.

I was in a church just this morning where they bring each person in. They take their picture. They get information on them. They give them a shower. They take them to the next room where they choose all the free clothes that they want. They give them a suitcase and then they put them in their gymnasium where they've got a cordoned off area to take care of their families there until they can place them in homes.

And, I've actually been meeting, I talked to Governor Barbour today on the phone when I was in Mississippi earlier today and I've been meeting with different government and religious leaders and relief leaders and together there's going to have to be a triage.

KING: Yes. WARREN: You see between government and business and the faith community, between private sector, public sector and faith.

KING: Senator Obama thanks for joining us. We'll be calling on your again, always good seeing you.

OBAMA: Wonderful to talk to you, Larry. Thank you.

KING: Senator Barack Obama.

We'll be right back with more. Don't go away.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KING: We're back. Because I moved to other things, I want Dr. Phil to rephrase the question succinctly for Vice Admiral Richard Carmona, the Surgeon General of the United States.

MCGRAW: Admiral, what I'm asking is, I think so many people, when they hear E. coli, when they hear bacteria, I don't want there to be, emotionally, a panic among people. And a lot of the symptoms that come with this kind of infection are also associated with stress, change of diet, loss of sleep, and other less potentially fatal type diseases.

So I think the question is, how do people make a differential diagnosis to know when they know they need to go get assessed? And no. 2, how can they get infected? If an evacuee came from the flood waters, goes to someone's home in Houston or Dallas, for example, and interacts with them and they are infected, can they pass that on, and if so, how, and what precautions do those people need to take?

CARMONA: That's a book worth, so thanks for the question, Phil, but it's really important to increase the health literacy of the American public as it relates to this. We have bacteria that we live with every day, some of them are very helpful to us. They live in our intestinal system. They help us digest food and absorb nutrients.

The fact is, there are some bacteria, there are some viruses that can become pathogenic or they can cause infection under certain circumstances. How people get those, especially in crowded areas, is fairly well known. Not washing your hands, drinking water that's contaminated, preparing food that may have been spoiled in a refrigerator too long. There are a number of breaks in the sequence of hygiene that occur during a disaster such as we are experiencing. So, generally, basic public health measures will extinguish those type of problems. Not eating the contaminated food. If water has to be used, making sure that it is boiled first, preferentially, drinking bottled water, washing hands.

Most of the sites that I visited in the effected area, as well as the evacuee centers, had protocols in place already, where they were handing out disinfectants, so people would wash their hands. All of the food handlers had gloves on, and also washed their hands frequently. Simple steps like that stop the spread of infection. As far as the diagnosis, you're absolutely right, stress can sometimes cause the same symptoms. So as the providers, they have to be aware of that. And what we do is, if somebody has a diarrheal disease, basically, we isolate them, we make sure that they can't spread that to anybody else. And that's being done in the centers. In fact, in many of the centers we visited they have a very robust public health system and infectious disease group that are working with our CDC to make sure the infections aren't spread.

But making the distinction sometimes takes a little while and involves cultures. You take a sample. You send it to a lab. You look to see if there are bacteria or viruses growing, and if it does, then you can make the diagnosis. The other forms, generally, are self-limiting, don't have a fever, present slightly differently with the pain distribution. So there are small keys to help you make that diagnosis.

But your question was right on point in dealing with a large amount of people who all may be suffering the stress that comes with this, and you can't make that differentiation so easily.

KING: I have got to check in at the Astrodome with Johnny Rankins. Johnny is trying to find his 24-year-old daughter, Keyshawn Collins (ph). He last spoke to his daughter, when, before the hurricane hit, Johnny?

JOHNNY RANKINS, EVACUEE: Yes, just before the hurricane. Yes.

KING: Where was she?

RANKINS: At that time she was in New Orleans East. That was the last place that she would have been there, yes, in New Orleans East.

KING: How did you get out of your house?

RANKINS: Well, what I did, I had to actually swim. The water was pretty deep. Once I got to Canal Street it was up to my chest and I walked toward Canal and Claiborne, and it was down to my knee, and I got to the Superdome.

KING: And then evacuated from there out to Houston?

RANKINS: Yes, sir. There was several people along the way that was going to the Superdome that I ran into and got to be real close friends to them.

KING: Your daughter's name is Keyshawn Collins, right.

RANKINS: Her name is Keyshawn Collins (ph). That's right.

KING: And the phone number to reach you is 713-797-2652.

RANKINS: Yes. The phone number to reach me is area code 713, the number is 797-2652.

KING: All right. If anybody, please, anybody has any information on Keyshawn Collins (ph), Johnny's daughter --

RANKINS: Anybody has any information to call me, call 731-797- 2652

KING: No, 713. Thanks, Johnny. 713. I know you've been dealing with a lot of these folks. This has got to be the hardest thing in the world.

MCGRAW: It is hard. They need information. And there are so many family members that are in affected areas that are still in their homes, but their phones are down. There are whole area codes in Louisiana that are out of service, so they can't call and check. Which makes it really, really tough.

KING: Get a break, and then more from our panel. We'll check in with John Cannigi (ph) in New Orleans as well, and then more from Admiral Carmona and Dr. Phil McGraw and Pastor Rick Warren. Don't go away.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KING: One more contact at the Astrodome, Pauline Johnson, is trying to find her missing brother Ivory and her Alvin. When did you last see them, Pauline?

PAULINE JOHNSON, EVACUEE: The last time I've heard of them, they were still in New Orleans.

KING: And they didn't get out of the city?

JOHNSON: I have no idea. Someone told me when I was at the Superdome that they were still in New Orleans.

KING: And their names are Ivory Johnson and Alvin Keeler (ph), right?

JOHNSON: Ivory Johnson, Jr. And Alvin Keeler (ph).

KING: And your number is 713-797-2653.

JOHNSON: Yes, that's it. 7-1-3...

KING: Thank you, the best of luck. We've got the number. I'll repeat it again.

JOHNSON: OK. Thank you.

KING: You're welcome. 7-1-3-7-9-7-2-6-5-3. I want to get around on this to both Phil and Rick Warren. What do you say to your children?

MCGRAW: Well, I think --

KING: How do you explain this to a 5-year-old?

MCGRAW: I think one of the things you have to be careful about is allowing them to watch this coverage too much. And your explanations, of course, need to be age-appropriate, but I think you and I talked about before, First Lady Bush and I were working with some children on the Oprah show after 9/11 and one of the most shocking things I heard from those kids is, every time they saw this on television, they thought it was happening again.

So, they would see a building get knocked down and then they would see it from another angle and they thought every building in the country was being knocked down and they were horrified and nobody knew that until we talked to them.

So, if your children are going to watch this, I think you need sit with them, you need to watch it with them, you need to answer their questions. And if they don't have any, you need to answer the questions they should be asking, which has to do with, 'is this going to happen to us?' And, 'what's happen?' 'Did those people do something wrong?'

You need to answer all of the kinds of questions because children then to fill things in to their detriment. And the best thing that people can do to overcome their own concern and depression, their children's negative reactions to this, is do something.

They've got to -- if the children can collect some of their toys that they can give to the children, if they can raise some money by anything from a lemonade stand to their piggy banks or whatever and take it to the church and give it.

It's when people feel helpless to impact a situation that they experience the most stress. And that's true all of us adults, but certainly get your children involved in volunteerism so they don't feel helpless.

KING: Rick Warren, what would you add?

WARREN: Well, you know, I would agree with what Phil have said. The people that have bothered me the most -- I've been most worried about were the children because they're certainly going to be traumatized much easier. The adults are going to get through this and as a parent, I would tell the parents in this area, where I am now and the other areas of the Gulf states, you must reassure your children. We're here. God's here. You're here. And we're going to make it together.

I would not focus on what's lost, but focus on what's left. Not what's lost, but what's left. And if you're going to help people get over their insecurity, then you must teach them, whether children or adults, that they have to put their confidence, their trust into something that can never be taken from them.

Now, if you put your trust in your career, it can be taken from you. If you put your trust in material possessions, they can be taken from you. If you put your trust in your husband or your wife or even your children, they can be taken from you as we have seen this week.

The only thing that cannot be taken from you is a personal relationship with God and Jesus Christ, as I know him. He gives me strength and you know, America could be taken over by a foreign country, we could be put in concentration camps and they could strip us naked and take away everything, including my wedding ring, but they cannot rob me of my personal faith in God.

And so, I would teach my children that ultimately they have to put their trust in something that cannot be taken away from them.

KING: Kisha Key is in Atlanta, Georgia. She's looking for her mother, Sylvia Hall. The last time they spoke was about a week ago. Where did Sylvia -- she live in New Orleans?

KISHA KEY, LOOKING FOR MOTHER: She does lives in New Orleans. She lives in the mid-city area around Carrolton and -- she lives in between Carrolton and Banks on Palmara (ph). I last heard from my mom, Monday.

She followed me to New Orleans. I was a student at Xavier university and when I last spoke with her, she said that she couldn't escape because the water was like over her head. She's about 5'3. So, I'm hoping that in her area the water has subsided to where she could have escaped.

KING: Kisha, you're not going to believe this, but I met your mother. I was -- I was the king of the Bacchus Mardi Gras four years ago, and she was a seamstress.

KEY: Yes, she was. I was going to mention that.

KING: Yes. I remember. I saw that face, I remember it well.

KEY: That's my mom. Yes.

KING: Kisha -- if any of you know Kisha Key or are near by Kisha Key or if you're with Bacchus or any of the wonderful people in New Orleans who aware of the festivals, the number to reach your -- Sylvia Hall. The number to reach Kisha -- Sylvia Hall is the one missing, 7- 7-0-8-4-5-11-0-1.

KEY: Yes.

KING: 770-845-1101. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KING: Before LeAnn Rimes winds things up for us and we get a final word from our guest, we want to check in with my man T. Boone Pickens in Dallas, Texas, the founder of B.P. Capital, the founder of Mesa Petroleum. He and B.P. have donated $5 million to the Red Cross.

Are you challenging other corporations to follow the same T-bone -- T. Boone?

T. BOONE PICKENS, MESA PETROLEUM: Sure. I am. You know, it's -- this is -- this is the worst disaster, you know, that we've ever had and you know, when I look at how can I help and you know, I feel there's not anything I can do but give money, and I'm glad to do that. And I challenge people, yes, make them think, you know, but I talked to Bonnie McElveen-Hunter this afternoon, the chairperson of the American Red Cross. She said they had raised over $400 million, but it's going to take over $1 billion to take care of these people. And I think -- you know, I think we ought to look again in our wallets, to see if we can come up with a little more money.

And you know, I did not think about this until I've been sitting here watching the show tonight. And, you know, I'd like to challenge again. I'll give another $1 million to this effort.

KING: So you're giving -- you're going to top -- make it $5 million -- will be $6 million?

PICKENS: That's right, I'll give another million on the five.

KING: T. Boone, you're amazing. I want to check back with you later in the week, because I want to talk about the implications for oil and gas. I'm running close on time. T. Boone Pickens tonight ups the ante, goes from 5 to 6.

Admiral Carmona, I want to thank you for joining us. I hope you'll come back too, and I hope we can get a handle on this.

CARMONA: Larry, thanks very much for doing this. And we are getting a handle on it. We have got a great plan at HHS and our federal partners, and especially dealing with the faith and the mental health aspects of this, which is going to go on for a long time, as are the public health challenges. But we have got a plan in place with great partners, and we're supporting those people who need us most.

KING: And Rick Warren, we'll be calling on you again. Thanks so much for all you do.

WARREN: Thank you, Larry. And you know, I would just commend all of Americans who are outpouring in their generosity, this is such a wonderful thing, and it's good for the heart. Every time you give, it breaks the grip of materialism in your life, and I would encourage everybody to just support this, support it through your local area, your church, to make a difference.

KING: Thank you. And finally, Dr. Phil, we have about 30 seconds. Dr. Phil will host this program on Monday night. Bob Costas on Tuesday night. I'll get a couple of nights away.

The doctor has his own program Thursday, right? That will be the return of "The Phil McGraw Show."

MCGRAW: Yes, Thursday we're doing some very important programming on this. I hope everybody will watch. And I want to say to everyone in America, this is getting better hour by hour and day by day. The system is catching up. And the spirits are strong, the volunteers are strong, and we are going to get through this.

KING: An amazing man. MCGRAW: Thank you, Larry.

KING: Dr. Phil.

A special close, don't go away. LeAnn Rimes is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KING: We're back, and we're going to close things out tonight with LeAnn Rimes. She joined us on Saturday night, when we did our three-hour special, the mega-selling, Grammy-winning singer. LeAnn was born in Jackson, Mississippi. One of the last entertainers to play the Beau Rivage in Biloxi before it hit. Do you have any relatives there now?

LEANN RIMES, SINGER: I have relatives still in Jackson and around that area, and they got hit very hard, still without electricity, and a lot -- all of the siding on their house is blown off, the shingles. It's pretty bare. So they're living with lanterns, and cold water at the moment, which is so minor compared to what the other conditions people are living under.

KING: When are you going back?

RIMES: As soon as I can. We've been -- it's so hard to say right now exactly what we'll be doing, but I've been trying to round up other fellow artists from Mississippi, and writers -- writer friends of mine, and we're going to try to get down there as soon as possible, and do a concert to raise money, and also to just do a concert to raise spirits.

KING: LeAnn Rimes will sing a cappella tonight, to close things out on this edition of "LARRY KING LIVE." The song is very appropriate, "Amazing Grace." LeAnn.

RIMES: Thank you.

(SINGS "AMAZING GRACE")

KING: Wow.

LeAnn Rimes in Nashville, Tennessee.

Tomorrow night, a lot of guests, including Sean Penn, who just finished filming a movie in New Orleans. And he will be one of our special guests tomorrow evening. Sean Penn will join us, after visiting the area, by the way.

Joining us now to host "NEWSNIGHT" from New York, another two- hour edition of "NEWSNIGHT," as CNN stays atop this story is our dear friend Aaron Brown. Mr. Brown, the things may be turning the tide? No pun intended.

AARON BROWN, HOST, NEWSNIGHT: Yeah, I think that you have actually what I -- what I think you have is you clearly have improvement over where we were a week ago, but we're settling into what will be such a long, difficult and terribly expensive recovery that we'll be talking about this in one way, shape or form a year from now, literally, and probably beyond.

KING: Go get'em, Aaron.

BROWN: Thank you, sir. I will. Thank you, Larry.

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