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The Situation Room
Bird Flu Discovered in Greece; Saddam Hussein Likely Plotting Own Defense; Forecasters Track Tropical Storm Wilma
Aired October 17, 2005 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Wolf Blitzer. And you're in THE SITUATION ROOM, where new pictures and information are arriving all the time.
Happening now, it's 10:00 p.m. in Iraq, where former Iraqi President Saddam Hussein is likely plotting his own defense. The first trial against him starts Wednesday for alleged crimes against humanity. One woman, whose family is believed to have been murdered, says she wants Saddam Hussein executed seven times over.
It's 10:00 p.m. in Athens, Greece, where there are new fears of a worldwide bird flu pandemic -- Greek officials now saying they have identified the country's first case of bird flu and are running tests to see if it's the same deadly strain that has ravaged parts of Asia.
And it's 3:00 p.m. in Miami, where forecasters are nervously trying to track Tropical Storm Wilma. The wayward weather pattern is churning in the Caribbean, but where it goes, at this point, no one really knows.
I'm Wolf Blitzer. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
In Iraq, two unprecedented events, one to set the country's path toward a stable democracy, the other set to put Iraq on a path towards psychological healing.
The vote-counting for Saturday's constitutional referendum is under way. Although final results will not be known for at least a few days, partial results suggest the charter will pass. But the results could be delayed. Iraq's Electoral Commission says it will audit the count.
Meanwhile, the country's also sorting out its legal strategy against the former leader, Saddam Hussein -- his trial set to begin Wednesday. He a -- he is accused of crimes against humanity for allegedly torturing and killing scores of Iraqis in a small town, just north of Baghdad, after an unsuccessful attempt on his life back in 1982.
Let's bring in our chief international correspondent, Christiane Amanpour. She's on the scene for us in Baghdad. Christiane, what's going on?
CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, in terms of the election, that's correct. We do not have the full and final results yet, although all manner of officials, from U.S. to Iraqi, have said they believe the constitutional referendum has passed.
Well -- there was a problem earlier today, with people here saying that they couldn't get some of the ballots back from some of the outlying provinces because of a sandstorm that had enveloped Baghdad.
And take, as you mentioned, you have heard a report about a possible audit by the local election committee. We haven't any official word on that. But we have talked to some officials in the government, who suggest that the Mosul vote may be disputed because of a higher turnout than number of people who were registered. Again, this is what we have just heard from one official. And we're waiting to see whether, in fact, that plays out.
Wolf.
BLITZER: Christiane, it looks very dark, once again, behind you. Is there another power outage, at least in parts of Baghdad?
AMANPOUR: Well, I can't really tell. You're right. It's dark. The mosque, which is usually behind us, lit up, is not lit up. We don't have any announcement or word of a power outage.
And as you can imagine, we live in -- in a fairly electrified world, because all the houses around us have generators and are powered by themselves. So, we have no official indication that anything untoward has happened.
BLITZER: Now, the Saddam Hussein trial starts on Wednesday. You will be there for the opening rounds of this trial. Set the scene for us, the stakes involved, in the beginning of this trial against Saddam Hussein and -- what? -- seven of his associates?
AMANPOUR: Yes, Saddam Hussein and seven others, who are charged with crimes against humanity in relation to a massacre in Dujail, a village somewhat -- about 60 kilometers away from Baghdad.
In -- in 1982, Saddam was visiting there. And we want to show you now pictures that have almost never been broadcast before. They were first broadcast on Channel Four network. And they are pictures taken by Saddam's own cameraman when he visited that little village in 1982.
And you can see his motorcade going through, and Saddam basically going through that town and addressing the people. What happened there was, it's a mostly Shiite town. He went for a visit there. The Shiites there were known not really to support Saddam Hussein, because it was in the middle of the war that Saddam launched against Shiite Iran. And many of the Shiites did not agree with that war.
In any event, after he had talked to the villages, after they had come out in a ritual show of loyalty, in case they get reprimanded afterwards, they -- even though they may not have supported him, they came out in a ritual show of loyalty -- afterwards -- and you don't see this on camera -- as he was passing a certain intersection, shots were fired at his motorcade. And it's in connection with these shots, this attempt on his life, that he's being tried first in the court in Baghdad, because, in revenge killings, several hundred were killed there, 140 of which are the bulk of the case against him.
You will see, in a second video, that even after the shots fired at his motorcade, he looked a little shaken, but he continued with the visit. And he returned to the place where the shots had come from. And he started to basically question some of the men who he saw there and interrogate them on his own in sort of a preliminary fashion. But it seems, according to, you know, people who have gone back there, that they feared the worst, and they knew that they were going to get retribution.
But it was an incredibly harsh retribution -- as I say, several hundred men killed, many women and children rounded up -- all their date palms and economy destroyed by Saddam's regime, and many residents simply removed from that town and moved into internment camps very far away, some for about four years or so.
Wolf.
BLITZER: He's -- he was 45 years old at the time.
Christiane, thank you very much. Christiane Amanpour will be reporting on the Saddam Hussein trial this week. Stay with CNN for complete coverage.
The Pentagon, meanwhile, says U.S. troop levels in Iraq will drop in the coming weeks, but as a result of what it calls normal rotation, not because of the vote on the weekend's constitutional referendum and the failure of insurgents to disrupt the voting process.
Meanwhile, with the insurgency far from defeated, the U.S. military is reviving an old tactic to try to keep up the pressure on the terrorists -- namely, air strikes.
More from our -- our senior Pentagon correspondent, Jamie McIntyre. Jamie?
JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SR. MILITARY AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Wolf. You will see U.S. troop levels in Iraq drop in the coming weeks. But as you said, the big cut probably won't come until next year. Meanwhile the U.S. is reviving an old tactic to keep insurgents on the run.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MCINTYRE (voice-over): The U.S. military is increasingly employing airpower to target suspected insurgents in western Iraq. This strike, by an F-16 a month ago, on an alleged terrorist safe house was said to have killed 20 foreign fighters. Over the weekend, the U.S. claimed 70 terrorists were killed in three separate air strikes in and around the insurgent hotbed of Ramadi.
But the precision air strikes bring a predictable result, the claim that innocent civilians -- including, in one case, a half-dozen children -- were among the victims. A U.S. military release says, in one of the weekend strikes, an F-15 pilot observed a group of 20 men planting another roadside bomb at the site of a previous attack. The U.S. military says the strike was called in after insurgents were seen placing a large cylinder back in a crater.
The attacks underscore the continued need for U.S. troops to back up Iraqi security forces. Currently, there are some 157,000 U.S. troops in Iraq, mostly because of a planned overlap of forces rotating in and out, timed to coincide with the referendum. Pentagon officials say the numbers will drop back into the 140,000 range in the coming weeks, and stay there through the end of the year.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MCINTYRE: Pentagon officials say no decision will be made on making deep cuts to the U.S. force in Iraq until after the December elections. And there's still a hope that, next year, they may be able to make cuts in the range of 30,000 to 40,000 troops. But again, they say it will depend on what's happening on the ground.
Wolf.
BLITZER: All right, Jamie McIntyre, at the Pentagon. Thank you very much.
Time now for the "Cafferty File." Jack Cafferty standing is by live in New York with his question this hour. Hi, Jack.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Wolf, how are you doing?
Karl Rove, the deputy White House chief of staff, may have a plan B. According to our colleagues over there at "TIME" magazine, if Rove is indicted in the CIA leak case, he would immediately resign or possibly go on unpaid leave. They don't know -- they don't say in the story whether or not he could stay on as a consultant, like that guy Brown over there at FEMA.
"TIME" sources say that the resignation is the most likely outcome. By breaking his ties with the White House, one source says that Rove would then have more time to fight whatever charges could come out of this thing. Rove's lawyer, Robert Luskin, says there is -- quote -- "absolutely no truth whatever" -- unquote -- to the "TIME" magazine report.
Here's the question: What should Karl Rove do if he is indicted? You can e-mail us your thoughts at CaffertyFile@CNN.com. Or you can go to CNN.com/CaffertyFile. Both those addresses will get you to the same place.
We will read some of your -- he might want to -- he might want to get measured for one of those extra large orange jumpsuits, Wolf, because, looking at old Karl, I'm not sure that he would -- they would be able to zip him into the regular-size one.
BLITZER: Well, he's actually lost some weight. I think he's in pretty good shape.
CAFFERTY: Oh, well, then maybe just the regular, off-the-shelf large would handle it for him.
BLITZER: Yes.
CAFFERTY: Yes.
BLITZER: But, you know, it's still a big if. It's still a big if.
CAFFERTY: Oh, I understand. I'm -- I'm just hoping, you know? I love -- I love to see those kind of things happen. It -- it does wonders for me.
(LAUGHTER)
BLITZER: All right, Jack.
CAFFERTY: Yes.
BLITZER: We will get back to you. Thank you very much.
Coming up, will it be the next hurricane? We will get the forecast for Wilma, the record-tying 21st named storm of the Atlantic season.
Also, more on the trial of Saddam Hussein. It's poised to begin. We will have a preview.
Plus, a senator to the rescue. We will show you who he helped save. There he is.
Stay with us.
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BLITZER: We're watching Tropical Storm Wilma. It's the 24th -- excuse me -- the 21st named storm of the Atlantic hurricane season, now the most active in some 72 years.
Our meteorologist Jacqui Jeras is tracking Wilma. She's joining us from the CNN Hurricane Center with more. What's the latest, Jacqui?
JACQUI JERAS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Well, it's been gaining some strength today, Wolf. And the maximum winds are now up to 50 miles per hour. It's also been moving extremely slowly. And it's been drifting down towards the south. And that's been bringing it closer in to Honduras and Nicaragua. It's about halfway in between that border and the Grand Cayman Islands, roughly 200 miles away from either location.
We are expecting it to start to turn a little bit off more off to the west and continue to gain strength. Tropical storm warnings and hurricane watches have been issued for all of the Cayman Islands. And we also have tropical storm warnings now, which have been issued from the Nicaragua-Honduras border, extending over to Cabo Cameron (ph). So, that means that tropical-storm conditions expected in 24 hours or less.
And those tropical-storm force winds extend out about 70 miles from the center of the storm on either side. It's also been getting a little bit larger throughout the day today. We're expecting it to strengthen to hurricane status and move on up towards the Yucatan Peninsula, possibly making landfall here.
But, take note how wide the margin of error is. It looks like it's going into the Gulf of Mexico, but still anyone's guess as to exactly where.
Wolf.
BLITZER: All right. We will be tracking it very closely, Jacqui. Thank you very much.
And, if it seemed warmer than normal to you last month, it's not your imagination. Government experts now say this was the fourth warmest September on record, with the average U.S. temperature a full 2.5 degrees higher than the mean over the last century.
Our Internet reporter Jacki Schechner is monitoring the situation online. She's joining us now live. Jacki?
JACKI SCHECHNER, CNN INTERNET CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, NOAA coming out with the graphics to prove just what you were talking about.
Take a look at what is available online. This is for September 2005. And you can see here, this is much above normal. That's everything that is in that dark orange cover. And, here in Louisiana, you have got the record warmest temperatures on date. Let's see if we can bring those back up again.
Here, you can take a look at just how incredible the departure from normal is. You can see eight degrees Fahrenheit are those dark, dark red areas. Just below that would be six degrees Fahrenheit.
And I just wanted to show you this, also. This is global significant events for the month of September. You can see things like the hurricanes, Ophelia and Rita, the flooding in South Asia, the Western Pacific typhoons. It was an incredible year -- or incredible month, rather -- in September of this year.
Wolf.
BLITZER: All right, Jacki, thank you very much.
Still to come, as Iraqis await the outcome of their constitutional referendum, their ousted leader, Saddam Hussein, is preparing to go on trial.
And President Bush's approval ratings have been steadily sinking. But is that changing in the wake of this weekend's Iraq vote? We have brand new poll numbers here at CNN. And we will bring them to you here in THE SITUATION ROOM.
Stay with us.
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BLITZER: The wife of a high-profile criminal defense attorney was found dead, apparently murdered in their home near San Francisco. And only hours later, there's a mistrial in one of her husband's most prominent case.
CNN's Ted Rowlands is joining us now live from Lafayette, California, with details. Ted?
TED ROWLANDS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, reports that there has been an arrest in the slaying of Daniel Horowitz's wife are erroneous, according to Contra Costa Sheriff's Department, the people handling this investigation. They say, at this point, there has been no arrest made. There were some reports that a caretaker had been arrested. There is no caretaker on the property. So clearly, those reports are wrong.
That said, we're outside the property. And there is activity, increased activity, of detectives and sheriff deputies coming to the home. So, an arrest may be imminent.
Daniel Horowitz lost his wife over the weekend. Saturday night, he called 911 to report that he had found her dead. Today, a mistrial in an ongoing high-profile case here in the San Francisco Bay area was declared by a judge. Horowitz, according to his co-counsel, will still be active in that trial. They're going to restart that in early December.
So at this point, at hand now, who killed Daniel Horowitz's wife? No clear answers right now. There's one individual in the neighborhood that there was a restraining order out against, not only for Horowitz, but his wife. He was ordered to stay 100 yards away from the couple. I talked to that individual within the last hour. He said the allegation that he may be responsible was -- quote -- "ridiculous." But there is increased activity at the property where this individual lives and where this woman was killed over the weekend.
Wolf.
BLITZER: All right, Ted. We will keep an eye on the story. Thanks very much -- Ted Rowlands reporting from Lafayette, California.
Our Zain Verjee is joining us now from the CNN Center in Atlanta with a closer look at some other stories making news. Hi, Zain.
ZAIN VERJEE, CNNI ANCHOR: Hi, Wolf. Good to see you.
It appears that bird flu is moving westward. Greek officials have confirmed the first case of the virus in Greece. It was found in a turkey at a poultry farm on the island -- on an island in the Aegean Sea. Tests are being done to determine if the strain is the deadly H5N1 virus. One turkey was positively determined with the H5-type virus. The H5N1 is the lethal strain that has killed at least 60 people in Asia. The White House is refocusing its efforts to rally lagging support among conservatives for Supreme Court nominee Harriet Miers. Meeting with current and former justices of the Texas Supreme Court today, President Bush called Miers uniquely qualified for the bench. Miers herself, is meeting with Senate Democrats on Capitol Hill today. Meantime, Senate Republicans are pushing to begin confirmation hearings early next month.
The driver of that bus that caught fire and exploded on a Texas freeway last month faces charges of criminally negligent homicide. Twenty-three nursing home patients who were fleeing Hurricane Rita were killed in the explosion. The driver is in federal custody on immigration charges. The bus caught fire outside Dallas, as thousands of people were evacuating before the hurricane.
Senator Edward Kennedy attempted a daring rescue. The Massachusetts Democrat was walking his dogs along Hyannis Beach yesterday, when he saw six fishermen trapped on a jetty by high tide. Kennedy and a friend tried to rescue the men by boat, but rough waters forced them back. Firefighters were called in and they got the men to safety. All six were treated for mild hypothermia.
Wolf.
BLITZER: All right, Zain, We will have more on that story, coming up in the next hour. Zain Verjee reporting for us. We will get back to you.
There's word of a deal between General Motors and the auto workers union on health care costs. This is very, very significant.
CNN's Ali Velshi is joining us with the "Bottom Line" from New York. Hi, Ali.
ALI VELSHI, CNN ANCHOR: Hey, Wolf. Have you bought a car recently?
BLITZER: Not recently.
VELSHI: All right. If you haven't, don't, because the deals are getting better.
GM, as part of this big announcement that I'm going to tell you about, is now offering a $500 gas card if you buy a GM 2005 or 2006 SUV. I think, pretty soon, they'll just leave the key in the car on the lot, and you can just go and get it without paying anything.
It's not a good day to be GM right now, not a -- particularly not a good day to be a GM union worker. I'll tell you why. The world's biggest automaker has now announced its fourth straight quarterly loss. If you do all the math on this, it comes to about $1.1 billion that the company lost in the third quarter, bringing its total for the year to $4.5 billion that the world's biggest automaker has lost.
It sounds like there's a problem in doing business at that company. Part of what they have done today, what they have announced, is a tentative deal that they have cut with the United Auto Workers . It's going to cut their health care costs for existing workers by about $3 billion a year. And, it's going to cost -- cut their liability to retired workers by about $15 billion.
Now, you wonder why unions in this country agree to this sort of thing. And that answer is, because they have to. If you look at Northwest, if you look at all the -- all the industries that have large unionized work forces, what tends to happen now is, if the companies can't get a deal with the union, to save money, they tend to push themselves into bankruptcy or find themselves in bankruptcy. And -- and then they are allowed to abrogate some of those contracts and then just go ahead and save that money anyway. So this is what GM is talking about doing.
Now, a -- a couple other problems GM has -- we talked last week, its biggest auto parts manufacturer, Delphi, has declared bankruptcy. And that could land GM with a bill for $12 billion in those health care liabilities, almost erasing all the benefit they have got today.
So, GM has got some problems. And part of the new deal is, if you buy a new SUV, apparently, you can negotiate with your dealer to get a $500 gas voucher, like a debit card from them.
That's what it is in the auto world.
Wolf.
BLITZER: But -- but, Ali, I just was checking GM's stock earlier, and it was going up as a result of this deal.
VELSHI: Yes. You know, at this point, it's -- it's a -- it's a game of seeing whether they're going to do better. The -- the -- the -- the ratings agencies have already said that GM is in a great deal of trouble. Their bonds now are rated at junk status. So, at this point, they're saying, ah, you know what? Fifteen billion dollars, $18 billion could actually be a good thing for them. Maybe this helps them get out of the problems that they're in. Still, not a -- not a fun place to be today.
BLITZER: All right. We will check back with you later, Ali. Thanks very much.
Just ahead, from dictator to defendant -- Saddam Hussein about to go on trial. We will show you what to expect.
Plus, bird flu spreading, unfortunately -- it's now confirmed in another European country. And health officials across the continent are bracing.
You're in THE SITUATION ROOM
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BLITZER: The story is as dramatic as the allegations are awful. A new president survives an assassination attempt, then, allegedly, exacts revenge by having his henchmen torture and murder his attackers and their families -- those charges against the former Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein, who will now stand on trial for the alleged atrocities.
Let's get the full picture.
CNN's Brian Todd standing by with a preview. Brian?
BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, this is the first of many trials Saddam Hussein is expected to face. And the charges in this case are actually considered minor compared to other allegations against him. But the images and symbolism are, nonetheless, very powerful.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TODD (voice-over): Western leaders have called it the beginning of Iraq's healing process, the graying former tyrant answering charges of crimes against humanity. The Iraqi special tribunal has chosen one case to prosecute first against Saddam Hussein, some believe, because it is not as complex as other charges he may face.
RAHUL MANCHANDA, INTERNATIONAL LAW EXPERT: I think the facts of -- of this particular issue, the '82 Dujail massacre, are pretty straightforward.
TODD: Dujail, a Shiite dominated town in the middle of the Sunni Triangle. When Saddam visited there in July of 1982, some historians believe, it was the closest he came to assassination. Gunmen, thought to be from a Shiite political group, opened fire on his motorcade. Soon after his narrow escape, according to the U.S. State Department, hundreds of men, women and children were arrested, jailed, tortured, many later executed, huge swathes of farmland destroyed.
On Wednesday, Saddam and seven former officials will hear the charges against them related to the incident. If convicted they could be executed.
The former president's attorneys say his actions were not a crime at that time and one of them says the State Department is -- quote -- "conducting the whole show."
ABDUL HAQ AL-ANI, ADVISER TO SADDAM'S LEGAL TEAM: He asked questions (INAUDIBLE) from day one. He came before a magistrate. But I don't think his appearance has anything to do with him. He'll be brought there by force, when he likes it or not.
TODD: Iraqi officials say the panel of five Iraqi judges made up of Shiites and Kurds will decide the outcome. And they have confidence in the prosecution's case.
HOSHYAR ZEBARI, IRAQI FOREIGN MINISTER: There is no lack of evidence to persecute Saddam. I mean, the water, the mountains, the people, you see can testify against him in the court.
TODD: Some of those witnesses may be disguised if the trial is put on television. According to a source close to the tribunal, the proceedings will be open to the public and to cameras, but it's not been decided if the trial will be televised live.
And don't expect this to be a dramatic battle of high-profile lawyers. Experts say, with this tribunal, the presiding judge will take considerably more control over the proceedings than Western court observers are accustomed to.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
TODD: Still, look for early maneuvering by Saddam Hussein's attorneys. They've long complained about not getting enough time or documents to prepare for their case and they may petition for a delay.
Wolf.
BLITZER: Brian Todd reporting. Thank you very much, Brian
Let's talk a little bit more about the upcoming trial of Saddam Hussein. Joining us is Patrick Cockburn. He's the author of "Out of the Ashes," He's a journalist with the British newspaper "The Independent." He's joining us on the phone live now from Baghdad.
Patrick, thanks very much for joining us. Give us your sense of how significant the start of this trial on Wednesday will be.
PATRICK COCKBURN, THE INDEPENDENT: Well, it's of enormous significance in Iraq when you think of the extent to which Saddam Hussein has dominated the life of every single Iraqi over the last 30 or more years. He was the most powerful man in the country from 1968 to 2000. But this is an epic event in Iraq. And it's seen as such by Iraqis.
BLITZER: What is the mood among the rank and file, people on the streets of Baghdad? What are they saying about this trial?
COCKBURN: Well, unfortunately, there's a straight sectarian division between Sunni on the one hand, and Shia and Kurd on the other about the trial. I was asking people outside Baghdad University today, mostly students about what they thought about it. And the Shia students were all in favor of the trial and were all in favor of Saddam being executed at the end of it.
When I asked Sunni students the same question, they said it's a affect, it's a put-up job. It's orchestrated by the U.S. We don't believe a lot of the allegations against Saddam Hussein. We think the mass graves contained Iranian soldiers killed in the war.
So unfortunately there's a straight sectarian divide in how people regard this.
BLITZER: Which doesn't necessarily speak well for the territorial integrity of Iraq, but that's another story. There are some experts who have suggested that perhaps this trial will further inflame the passions and strengthen, if you will, the insurgency. Is that your sense?
COCKBURN: Well, I don't think one can assert that, if only because passions are so inflamed already. I guess one could say that this will be one more additional factor that's going to divide the Sunni from the Shia and the Kurds within the country. But there are so many things dividing them already it may not weigh that much.
BLITZER: And do you fully expect that, at the end of this trial, which could probably last a few weeks, he will be executed?
COCKBURN: There will be enormous pressure from people here to execute him. I mean, from the Kurds in particular, many of the Shia, many of the people who have come to the leadership positions and lost members of their family...
BLITZER: Looks like we've lost that connect with Patrick Cockburn author of "Out of the Ashes." We'll check back with him.
The trial of Saddam Hussein begins this Wednesday. Once again, stay with CNN for extensive coverage of that.
Up next, first it was Turkey then it was Romania. Now bird flu showing up in yet another European country. Why health officials fear we might be getting closer to a possible pandemic.
Plus, just released new poll numbers on President Bush. Our senior political analyst Bill Schneider is standing by to show us what these numbers mean.
Stay with us.
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BLITZER: Here's a look at some of the "Hot Shots" coming over from our friends over at the Associated Press, pictures likely to be in your hometown newspapers tomorrow.
In Wisconsin, high school students holding a candlelight vigil in memory of four students and their band director killed in a bus crash.
In Northern Pakistan, villagers gathering around a Red Cross helicopter delivering supplies, tents and a medical team in the aftermath of last week's devastating earthquake.
A researcher in Italy analyzes the carcass of a dead duck. Restrictions on dead birds have intensified after recent cases of bird flu in Turkey and Romania.
In Pyongyang, North Korea, a massive propaganda spectacle known as a mass game (ph). This year's show is the largest yet, drawing tourists around the world into the reclusive country.
That's some of the "Hot Shots" coming in, pictures worth a thousand words, thanks to our friends over at the A.P.
Now to fears over the spreading bird flu. In addition to parts of Asia, cases of the virus have been confirmed in Romania and Turkey. And now Greece is trying to determine whether the dread deadly strain has turned up in that country. Here to help sort out what this means for a potential crisis here in the United States is Dr. Daniel Paris. He's a flu expert over at the University of Maryland. He's joining us on the phone.
If it shows up, first in Turkey, then in Romania, now in Greece, after already showing up in several Asian countries, Dr. Perez, what does that mean to you?
DR. DANIEL PEREZ, INFLUENZA EXPERT, UNIV. OF MARYLAND: Well, it brings up the reality of the previous concerns which is the virus to extend its host range. And a few months ago we knew it went into migratory birds. And the fear was that this virus could extend even more.
Like I said, these fears have become a reality. Now the virus is showing up in other parts of the world. And I think the worrisome feature of this virus is reaching Europe.
BLITZER: It's still so far only transmitted to humans from birds. It's not transmitted from human to human. But there's fear if the virus mutates, that could happen. How concerned are you that could happen? In other words, that humans could spread this disease?
PEREZ: Well, this virus has seen several locations being able to do the jump from avian to humans. And it's probably a matter of time for this virus to learn one more step, which is a transmission among humans.
Now, we have to be also careful with what it means, the virus showing up in Europe. Because until we do a full characterization of these viruses in animal models -- and that means mammalian models -- we will not know until then what is the potential of these viruses in going into humans -- those that have showed up in Romania and Turkey. But given the history of these viruses, we have to be very cautious. And the possibility exists that the virus can actually jump to humans.
BLITZER: Well, when you say it's a matter of time for that deadly transfer to occur, what does that mean, a matter of time? Are we talking weeks, months, years, decades?
PEREZ: Unfortunately, we don't know enough about these viruses. And they are unpredictable in the way that they can mutate that this could be days or it could never happen. We just cannot put a timeframe to this.
BLITZER: One final question. Condoleezza Rice, the secretary of State, said this over the weekend. She said we firmly -- we believe firmly that there has to be complete transparency about what is going on with avian flu. The world should not be caught unawares by a very dangerous pandemic because countries refuse to share information. Is it your fear that some countries are hiding information for fear it could cause them economic dislocation?
PEREZ: Unfortunately, this is a very political issue. And, yes, I believe that there could be countries that at the beginning do not like to share this information as openly they should. And the problem with this decision is that it ends up backfiring on the country and contributing to the spread of the disease to other countries.
BLITZER: Dr. Daniel Perez is with the University of Maryland. Dr. Perez, thanks very much for joining us.
For more now on the bird flu, our Internet reporter Jacki Schechner is checking the situation online. What are you picking up, Jacki?
SCHECHNER: Well, Wolf, on the heels of a Greek poultry farmer finding out that one of his turkeys had bird flu, we wanted to show you what the USDA is doing online. It's a campaign called biosecurity. Essentially, there was an outbreak about three years ago of something called Exotic New Castle Disease. And they call it the largest animal disease outbreak in the United States in 30 years.
So they set up this campaign for prevention called biosecurity. The idea -- protect your birds from disease. And it's actually much simpler than you might expect. Things like a gallon of bleach or disinfectant in a bucket will keep your poultry clean. The idea behind it is to keep out germs at the source, keep your poultry separated. It seems so silly because how many people actually own poultry? But the idea is get to the root of it.
If you're interested in more information, we found something also called thepoultrysite.com. This is aggregating news sources. It's a free information resource online about bird flu stories, and the number one right now is from Reuter's and that's tackling bird flu at its source.
Wolf.
BLITZER: All right, Jacki, thank you very much.
Up next, racially-charged violence in Ohio. We'll tell you where things stand right now in Toledo after this weekend's clash between police and protesters of a neo-Nazi march.
And Supreme Court nominee Harriet Miers trying to win over Senate skeptics as the White House revamps its strategy to get her confirmed.
You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
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BLITZER: Let's bring in our Zain Verjee, once again from the CNN Center in Atlanta, with a closer look at other stories making news. What do you got, Zain?
VERJEE: Hi, Wolf.
Violent crime is down in the United States. New FBI figures out today show that violent crime dropped 2.2 percent last year. The number of murders, rapes, robberies and assaults were 32 percent lower than in 1995. Despite the decline, more than a million violent crimes were reported last year, and a murder in the United States occurred every 32.5 minutes. Court arraignments today for some of the more than 100 people arrested during looting and violence in Toledo, Ohio, over the weekend. The suspects are charged with aggravated riot and violence. The unrest erupted on Saturday over a planned neo-Nazi march in a racially mixed neighborhood. Toledo's mayor says that there was nothing he could do to stop the march and blames the violence on gang members.
The Supreme Court today refused to step in to block a Missouri prison inmate from getting an abortion. In a unanimous decision without comment, the court let stand a lower court's ruling that Missouri's Department of Correction has to provide transportation for the woman to have the procedure done. Missouri law prohibits the use of state funds to facilitate abortion, but a federal judge ruled that the state was barring the woman from her right to the procedure.
And after 100 days of waiting, Wolf, a giant panda cub at Washington's National Zoo finally has a name. It's called Tai Shan, which means "Peaceful Mountain." That name received 44 percent of 200,000 votes that were cast on the zoo's Web site. The 100-day wait is a Chinese custom. Zoo officials say that Tai Shan will make his debut in public in December.
Wolf, back to you, and I'm wondering if Jack approves of the name.
BLITZER: It is Tai Shan or Tai Shan? See, if I've heard it pronounced various ways, Zain.
VERJEE: Tai Shan.
BLITZER: Tai Shan. Jack, you like that name?
CAFFERTY: I'm going to request a transfer, because I don't want to be a part of any TV news program where they spend time discussing the fact that 100,000 people took time out of their lives to suggest a name for a baby bear. This is not a good sign. The thing's going to make it debuts in December, and then what will happen to it after that? They send it back to China?
BLITZER: No, no, no, it stays in Washington.
VERJEE: No, and you know, it's good news for the zoo, as well, because, I think since...
CAFFERTY: It is?
VERJEE: Yes, it is, because since I think it's 1998, two of their red pandas died, a zebra died, a lion died. You know, they have a panda. It's a good moral boost.
BLITZER: And a giraffe died today, Jafari.
CAFFERTY: Well, but you know what? I mean, animals in zoos die. They get old and they die and that's what happens, just like animals outside zoos and just like people. You know, it's part of the natural cycle of life.
Speaking of which, you're coming to New York next week to work on AMERICAN MORNING here at the Time Warner Center, Miss Verjee, is that is true?
VERJEE: It's true Mr. Cafferty, and I'm expecting a red carpet, a hot cup of tea every morning at 7:00 a.m. and some scones.
CAFFERTY: I hope you get one.
VERJEE: You're in charge of the welcoming committee.
CAFFERTY: I'm on vacation next week.
VERJEE: What?
CAFFERTY: Yes, no, I'm not here next weekend. I'm on vacation.
VERJEE: Jack! You know, Wolf, I've never met Jack. I was kind of looking forward to that.
BLITZER: He'll be there. He'll be there. He'll be there.
VERJEE: The whole thing.
CAFFERTY: I will not be there. I'm on vacation next week. And it may come as news to the viewing audience, none of the three of us has ever met each other. I guess, Wolf and Zain have met. But, Wolf and I have never met. And Zain and I have never met.
VERJEE: We need to meet in THE SITUATION ROOM.
BLITZER: All right, all right guys, we're going to continue this conversation off-line. Jack, what do you got this hour on your questions?
CAFFERTY: I think we should keep it that way. "TIME" magazine reports if Karl Rove's indicted in the CIA leak case, he would immediately resign or possibly go on unpaid leave.
Rove's lawyer, Robert Luskin, says there's no truth, whatsoever, to the "TIME" magazine report. Not surprising that Mr. Rove's lawyer would respond that way.
The question is, what should Karl Rove do if he's indicted? We got a lot of letters I can't read to you because it's a family show.
Robert in Bellevue, Washington: "Rove should resign , whether or not he's indicted. He is obviously not helping the president at this time, and President Bush could use the "points" PR-wise".
Bill in Quarryville, Pennsylvania: "Keep his big mouth shut and get a good lawyer. Buy a dog if he doesn't already own one because that will be the only friend he will have left in Washington".
Ronald in Las Vegas: "Turn state's evidence and testify against his boss. Tell us everything, about everything. It might be bad for the Bush administration, but it would be good for the democracy".
Chuck in Chicago writes: "I love your objectivity. You should be "Exhibit A" in the case for liberal bias in the media".
Terry writes: "He should replace Harriet Miers as the president's next choice for the Supreme Court, after she withdraws".
BLITZER: Terry's got a sense of humor.
CAFFERTY: I like Terry's idea though, might work.
BLITZER: Thanks, Jack. We'll get back to you soon.
Still ahead, one political headache after another for President Bush. Can he find any relief in our new poll numbers? The numbers are about to be revealed. That's coming up.
And has "New York Times" Reporter Judith Miller told all in the CIA leak investigation? We'll examine the backlash against her, the anger over at the "Times" and whether this is another black eye for the news media.
You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
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BLITZER: Welcome back to THE SITUATION ROOM. It's almost time for the markets to close and the closing bell.
Let's check in with our Ali Velshi, he's in New York, he's got details. Ali?
VELSHI: Well, last time I talked to you I asked you if you owned a GM because I was talking about GM. I bet you the answer to this one is no, too. Do you own any Barbie dolls?
BLITZER: My daughter used to have a lot of them.
VELSHI: All right, that's good, well at least we have a connection to it. Barbie, here's my little resident Barbie doll, this is Working Mom Barbie.
You know, over time designers have designed outfits for Barbie. This one was never for sale, by the way. I don't know what the story is behind Working Mom Barbie. But, a lot of well-known designers designed clothes for Barbie over the last several years.
Well, now Barbie's changing course and they are introducing Barbie Luxe, which is a clothing line for regular people, for women. They are aiming for women 20 to 40 years old, using some of the designers who might have designed for Barbie, but just generally speaking influenced by Barbie and made for adults.
I don't know if you know these names, but Giorgio Armani is one of them, Christian Dior, they've all made stuff for Barbie. Now, we're looking at Anna Sui, Tarina Tarantino, these are going to be launched at Fred Siegel in Beverly Hills. People can buy clothes based on Barbie.
Now, this had better work because Barbie is made by Mattel. Mattel shares are off about 30 percent in the last quarter. It's having a rough time. Barbie's not selling the way that she used to. In fact, Mattel is sort of losing a bit of market share on this.
The other thing that's interesting about Barbie is this company was affected and it was written about some time ago, because it takes petroleum products to make these plastics that make Barbie. So, they were getting hit on the manufacturing end, on the fact that it costs more money to transport these things on ships and to the stores.
And now they're not selling as well. So one hopes, Wolf, that at some point we'll be seeing people around us wearing Barbie clothing.
BLITZER: All right, quick follow up. What about Ken? You know Barbie's boyfriend, Ken. Are there going to be Ken clothes for real men as well?
VELSHI: That's funny actually. I was planning on bringing Ken into this discussion on another topic because we've been talking about Karl Rove and Scooter Libby and Judith Miller, and why Judith Miller sat in prison when she was allegedly allowed to be released.
So, I was going have Ken and Barbie being Scooter Libby and Judith Miller. And Barbie would be in a cup and Ken would be saying, come on, you can come out, come out. And she is saying, are you sure I can come out? Like, could you just make it really clear that I can come out?
So, I was going to use Barbie and Ken anyway. But, no, I don't know if Ken's coming out with clothes and frankly I don't think they'd be made for me.
BLITZER: Let me guess, let me guess, if the Barbie clothes work for women, the Ken clothes will soon come out for men?
VELSHI: Yes. But I don't know that I'm the model for that. So, I'm not sure I'd be suitable for Ken clothes. But that strikes me as a discussion for another time, I'm sure.
BLITZER: All right, let's go from Barbie to the price of oil. What's the latest?
VELSHI: Yes, right. We were talking about how Barbie gets affected by the price of oil. Price of oil is up again because of Wilma. We don't know where this thing is going but it might be heading toward the Gulf.
Price of oil up $1.73 a barrel to $64.36. Not having a massive effect on markets, though. But we are looking, there's the storm. You know, it's precariously close to the Gulf of Mexico. And as you know we are still back up and we are some months away from being back up to full oil production.
And right now, you know, there's a little chill in the air, Wolf, and that's starting to make people think about their heating oil prices. Heating oil, natural gas, electricity, all of those things are going to cost people a lot more. And frankly that is translated into inflation worries, Wolf.
On Friday, we had the highest inflation number, that's the fastest inflation growth in 25 years. And as I was saying earlier in the day, even though when you take out the food and energy components from inflation, because they like to measure the core, the fact of the matter is, we all consume food and energy, energy being the biggest part of inflation right now.
So, for anybody investing or buying things right now, it's not an ideal situation that there's another storm headed toward the Gulf of Mexico that could become a hurricane. It is affecting the price of energy.
BLITZER: Even the very thought of that has an impact on those refineries in the Gulf of Mexico. Because if it gets through there and goes into the Gulf, the warm waters presumably will increase the...
VELSHI: Mix it up a little bit more. That's exactly right. And so right now, people are a little worried about this. But, as I say, other things are having an influence on the market today.
So, we're looking at a Dow and NASDAQ ready to close at higher points. They are not higher -- the market is not higher year-to-date, keep that in mind. It's higher today.
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BLITZER: All right, Ali, thank you very much. It's 4:00 p.m. in Washington. And you're in THE SITUATION ROOM where new pictures and information from around the world are arriving all the time.
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