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CNN Live At Daybreak

Hotel Attacks; Political Scandal; Need For Sleep

Aired November 11, 2005 - 06:29   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: A manhunt is still under way right now in Jordan for those behind Wednesday's suicide bomb attacks on western hotels. The Associated Press is reporting a number of arrests have been made.
This comes as another person dies, bringing the death toll to at least 57. Authorities say 95 people are wounded, and they remain in the hospital this morning.

In the meantime, thousands of Jordanians rallied last night in Amman, calling for the death of Iraq's al Qaeda leader, Abu Musab al- Zarqawi. His terror group has claimed responsibility for those three hotel bombings.

Well, right now, we want to talk more about this with Loretta Napoleoni. She is the author of a book about al-Zarqawi. It's called "Insurgent Iraq: al-Zarqawi and the New Generation." And she joins us live in the studio now.

Welcome.

LORETTA NAPOLEONI, AUTHOR, "INSURGENT IRAQ": Good morning.

COSTELLO: You know, if al-Zarqawi is supposedly behind these bombings -- I mean, if he had meant to kill Americans, what a colossal miscalculation. I mean, what was his intent here?

NAPOLEONI: Well, we have to look at the symbolism. It's actually he has attacked three hotels, which are American hotels, are also hotels very popular among Americans and Israelis in Jordan.

So, the symbolism is very important. It was also the 9/11 for the Middle East, because it was the ninth day...

(CROSSTALK)

COSTELLO: Well, I guess I understand the symbolism. But there were a lot of Muslims inside those hotels. I mean, does that not matter at all to him at this point?

NAPOLEONI: No. Actually, to be honest, from his point of view, those people, those innocent Muslims who have been killed, are actually martyrs. This is the way they see it. People that die in a suicide bombing operation who are innocent Muslims immediately they are considered martyrs, and (INAUDIBLE) the life of the martyrs.

COSTELLO: OK. So, thousands and thousands of people have taken to the streets in Jordan. And they're saying, burn in hell, al- Zarqawi. They want him hunted down. I mean, do you think that this kind of thing surprises him if he has that stuff in mind?

NAPOLEONI: No, I don't think so. I think, you know, you consider the people that are in the streets now demonstrating (INAUDIBLE). I mean, he's not interested in being popular among the people. He's actually completely focused on his fight. And he thinks, you know, he will succeed. This is a guy that is a fanatic.

COSTELLO: This is really, though, the first time that we've seen these mass demonstrations against al Qaeda, because other terrorist attacks have gone down in other countries -- Saudi Arabia, for example. But we haven't seen this backlash, so to speak. So, will that have an affect on the hunt for him?

NAPOLEONI: Well, I hope so. I hope the information now will start (INAUDIBLE), because, you know, there are people who are still connected to him, especially in Zaica (ph), where probably, you know, are in touch with him. Until now, we have not had any information from these people. So, maybe this is a major change. But we have to wait.

COSTELLO: He's from Jordan, and there is support for him within that country. How much support is there?

NAPOLEONI: Well, he had a lot of support before this attack, because he was fighting the coalition forces in Iraq. Now, more than 75 percent of the Jordanian population, they actually support the insurgency in Iraq. Now, perhaps now this situation will change. But, you know, again, we have to wait for another...

(CROSSTALK)

COSTELLO: You know, though, Jordan kind of says mixed -- sends mixed messages. Jordan is a great ally of the United States. Yet, many Iraqi refugees have come to Jordan, including Saddam Hussein's daughters. So, if -- I don't know. To me, that just sends a mixed message as to where Jordan really stands.

NAPOLEONI: Yes, Jordan is a country that is in between. It's in between the modernized western world and the Muslim world. They are the Muslim world, the Islamic Muslim world. And this is why we have these people that come.

I mean, we also have people that support the jihadists. We will have to wait and see if the suicide bombers were really from Iraq, because I doubt -- I think there are probably people, you know, linked to other al-Zarqawi from Jordan.

COSTELLO: Oh, you think so? Because, you know, people have said that one of the suicide bombers had an Iraqi accent. Some reports say at least two of the suicide bombers were actually from Iraq.

NAPOLEONI: I doubt it. I doubt it. I mean, al-Zarqawi in Iraq is a foreigner. He actually is leading a group of foreigners. The majority of these people are coming from Jordan. They're coming from Palestinian. They're coming from Syria, and some also from the Gulf.

So, why would Iraqis be using (INAUDIBLE) be used in Iraq? It doesn't make sense.

COSTELLO: Well, we'll see how the investigation falls out. Loretta Napoleoni, thank you very much. The book again, "Insurgent Iraq: al-Zarqawi and the New Generation." Thank you for helping us understand this morning. We appreciate it.

NAPOLEONI: Thank you.

COSTELLO: In news across America now.

Listen to this exchange:

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hey, hey, hey! The man was 69, he wasn't going to live forever.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Well, if you didn't hear that, she said, "The man was 69, he wasn't going to live forever." She was referring to 69-year- old Darrell Johnson, who was beaten to death last January by a 19- year-old. The teenager's family is upset with the 30-year sentence handed down by the court. Police in Pierce County, Washington, are considering charges in this brawl.

A movie theater in Homestead, Pennsylvania, pulled 50 Cents' new film following a fatal shooting in the theater lobby. Theater management says they don't know if the movie played a part in the death, but the victim had just come from seeing the film when he got into a fight. No arrests have been made.

Six fishermen are safe this morning after their boat took on water and flipped over. The Coast Guard came to their aid off the coast of Oregon to try and help pump the water out of the sinking ship. When that failed, the men jumped overboard and were picked up by a Coast Guard rescue boat.

Sex and politics. Do you think people would learn by now? We'll tell you about the latest sex scandal generating buzz; this time in Michigan.

Also consider this: A giraffe only needs to sleep for two hours a day. That's right. A giraffe -- although we're showing a bear. But a giraffe only sleeps two hours a day. We need to sleep about seven hours a day. Why? We'll talk to a researcher next on DAYBREAK.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: A federal investigation into corruption before, during and after the construction of those failed levees in New Orleans. That's a story that's coming up on "AMERICAN MORNING."

Miles O'Brien joins us now to tell us a little more.

Good morning.

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, Carol.

The question is: Why did those levees fail? Was it an act of God? Was it human error? Was it possibly criminal?

And that's what brings us to our guest this morning. We're going to check in with the attorney general of the Louisiana. An active investigation is going on that front as well as the Federal Bureau of Investigation.

And at the bottom of this, Carol, is compensation for people who were flooded out because of those levees. As you know, in many ways these people who are -- well, high and dry would not be the term. Not so high and dry. And if, in fact, there was some sort of criminal wrongdoing discovered, they might get some compensation that they would otherwise not be entitled to there in New Orleans.

So, we'll talk to him about that.

Also, airfares. Are you going anywhere for Thanksgiving, Carol?

COSTELLO: No, I'm working.

M. O'BRIEN: Oh, you're working. Oh. That's right. I'm going somewhere. But I'm flying on my own little plane. And so, I'm not going to charge myself any more. But if, in fact, I was getting on a major carrier, I'd be paying more, through the nose you might say, helping these airlines that are on the ropes.

(CROSSTALK)

COSTELLO: OK. You get off Thanksgiving, and you have your own plane to fly you to wherever you -- I just don't want to talk about to you anymore.

M. O'BRIEN: I'm a lucky guy. I'm not complaining. I'll just fly down to the Bahamas. That would be fun.

COSTELLO: Get off the air right now, Miles!

M. O'BRIEN: I'll phone you. I'll phone you on Thanksgiving. I promise.

COSTELLO: OK. We'll see you in a bit.

Let's talk about sex. Politics and sex just don't mix. We've learned that so many times. But Michigan's attorney general is just getting the message. He admits to having an extramarital affair.

Michael Cox says he was forced to go public, though, by a political opponent. Listen:

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) MIKE COX, MICHIGAN ATTORNEY GENERAL: I'm ashamed of what I did. Any embarrassment I suffer is deserved. I'm really sorry that my behavior has caused embarrassment for my wife.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: And then he and his wife proceeded to sob during this news conference.

Joining us live to help us sort out this sordid tale is Chris Christoff, veteran political reporter for the "Detroit Free Press."

Good morning, Chris.

CHRIS CHRISTOFF, "DETROIT FREE PRESS": Good morning.

COSTELLO: So, tell us about Mr. Cox, because this affair that he had happened a couple of years ago. So, why is he coming out now with it?

CHRISTOFF: Well, this really does take some sorting out. It happened, he said, a number of years ago. And he just told his wife in 2003.

What's behind this all is an investigation into attorney Geoffrey Fieger, which the world knows mostly as Jack Kevorkian's ex-attorney. And this involved some very complicated alleged violations of Michigan's campaign finance laws. Jeff Fieger funded a TV campaign to try to unseat a Supreme Court justice, Stephen Markman, and he donated some $450,000.

Now, how that money was donated or whether it was covered up and not disclosed is what's at the center of this. And Cox is alleging that Jeff Fieger tried to blackmail him with this affair several years ago in return for dropping Cox's investigation into this campaign finance case.

COSTELLO: And then a little twist here. Mr. Fieger was apparently going to run for the attorney general's office?

CHRISTOFF: He has said that he's interested in running for attorney general. Fieger ran for governor in 1998.

COSTELLO: So...

CHRISTOFF: And whenever Jeff Fieger gets involved in politics, it's like a tornado entering the room. So, at the very least...

COSTELLO: Well, we can see that.

CHRISTOFF: ... it becomes very interesting.

COSTELLO: So, I still don't get why Mr. Cox felt he had to come out in publicly admit to this affair alongside his weeping wife. I mean, why didn't he just go to authorities? CHRISTOFF: It is bizarre. It was a bombshell. It's left everybody trying to second-guess and figure out why, in fact, he did this, why he went public with this several years later. You know, how is this going to affect his career? He's up for re-election next year.

We're all puzzled by it. We really are. I mean, I can't -- we were all trying to remember the last time we had this kind of a sex scandal. Certainly nothing under these circumstances.

But this just came out of the blue and just stunned everybody.

COSTELLO: Well, is he a popular attorney general? I mean...

CHRISTOFF: Well, he's popular among Republicans. One thing about Mike Cox is when he took office -- he was elected in 2002 -- I mean, he replaced Jennifer Granholm, who was elected governor that year. He's been a very partisan attorney general. He's been a big fund-raiser for the Republican Party. He's been somewhat controversial at times. He's popular certainly more so among Republicans than among Democrats.

COSTELLO: Well, maybe he's just -- I don't know. Maybe he has just learned a lesson that it's better to say I'm sorry and admit to your mistakes.

CHRISTOFF: Well, I don't know. The conventional political wisdom is he's trying to inoculate himself for re-election next year. In other words, if you get this dirty laundry aired this far out before the election a year from now, things will settle down, all will be forgiven and, you know, he'll have an easier time of it.

So, what everybody sort of whispers, is this the only case? You know, that's what happens in these kinds of sex scandal cases.

COSTELLO: Yes.

CHRISTOFF: Is there something -- another shoe to drop? And, I mean, if this is the only -- you know, the only instance of this kind of thing, then he probably will be OK...

COSTELLO: We'll see.

CHRISTOFF: ... in the re-election next year.

COSTELLO: I'm sure you'll continue to follow it.

CHRISTOFF: We're all holding our breath for more to come.

COSTELLO: Chris Christoff, political reporter for the "Detroit Free Press" joining us live this morning. Thank you, Chris.

Your news, money, weather and sports. It's 6:44 Eastern. Here's what's all new this morning.

Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice is again vowing to help rebuild Iraq, saying the fate and future of Americans are directly linked to those of the Iraqis. Rice made the comments today in Baghdad. She is there on a surprise visit.

In money news, blame it on Wilma. There were about 15,000 new jobless claims for unemployment benefits last week. A Labor Department official says many of those claims are related to Wilma.

In pop culture, Angelina Jolie and Brad Pitt are the top contenders in the People's Choice Awards. They got three nominations each, including favorite on-screen match-up. The pair co-starred in the box office hit "Mr. and Mrs. Smith." And if you didn't know that, you've been living under a rock.

In sports, Chris Carpenter of the Saint Louis Cardinals is the National League's Cy Young award winner. Carpenter led the Cards with 21 wins. He had only five losses. Amazingly, it was just two years ago that he was on the verge of retiring with a shoulder injury. Hey, never give up, Bonnie.

BONNIE SCHNEIDER, CNN METEOROLOGIST: For sure.

Let's take a look at the cold and flu report for today as we look across the country for flu season. No activity reported in many states, especially in the Midwest. That's good news.

Sporadic activity elsewhere on the West Coast, in California, left to Hawaii and also through states like Wyoming and Utah. We'll be watching for that.

Regional activity has been reported for flu season from areas in Texas and also sporadic areas into Florida and Pennsylvania and New York as well.

So, let's hope everybody stays healthy this season. And this source comes from the CDC is where we get our information from -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Thank you, Bonnie.

We know you're just waking up. But do you feel really refreshed? Or could you use a cat nap? How about 20 z's with the d's? Researchers are studying how animals sleep and insects, too, and how that all relates to you and me.

But first, it's time to say happy birthday.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: And welcome back. It's 6:50 Eastern. Here is what will be making news today.

In honor of Veterans Day, Vice President Cheney will lay a wreath at the Tomb of the Unknowns. He'll also speak at a remembrance ceremony at Arlington National Cemetery.

And major health news for women who used the birth control patch. The maker of the Ortho Ever patch says it exposes users to higher doses of hormones and may put them at greater risk for blood clots than previously disclosed.

Sorry, I just had to take a drink of water there.

I think all of us that are awake this early can agree on one thing: We like sleep, and we don't get enough of it. But how much sleep do we really need?

A recent study showed how some other species sleep. Bats -- brown bats have to get 20 hours of sleep per night. Lucky bats. Fruit flies get 10 hours while giraffes get less than two. Giraffes only need two hours of sleep.

So, which are you closer to? Me, the giraffe.

Joining me, ironically, from Los Angeles to talk about our sleep habits is Dr. Jerry Siegel. And we say 'ironically' because it's really, really early in California.

Good morning.

DR. JERRY SIEGEL, UCLA, CENTER FOR SLEEP RESEARCH: Good morning.

COSTELLO: Why are scientists so interested in studying the way animals sleep? And how does that relate to us?

SIEGEL: Well, because we don't really understand the function of sleep. And as you just mentioned, there are tremendous variations in the amount of sleep across animals. And using that difference, we can draw some conclusions about what sleep is for; that some animals sleep as much as 20 hours a day, some as little as two. The ones that sleep very little don't seem to sleep any deeper than the ones that sleep a lot. In fact, just the opposite. The ones that sleep a lot also sleep more deeply.

So, by examining these differences, we hope to get some clues to what the function of sleep is.

COSTELLO: Well, OK. So, do you have any clues? I mean, why do human beings need to sleep at all?

SEIGEL: Well, when you look across species, one surprising finding is that sleep doesn't seem to be related to brain size. It doesn't seem to be related to longevity.

What seems to determine the amount of sleep across species is issues of energy conservation. That is, animals that are able to get their energy requirements in a short period of time, such as meat- eating animals will sleep a lot. Because when they're not engaged in that behavior, it's most adaptive for them to stay out of trouble basically, whereas grazing animals, animals that eat plants, have to spend a lot of time eating.

So, one determinant of sleep time is just...

COSTELLO: Interesting.

SEIGEL: ... how much time you need to spend eating.

COSTELLO: OK. So, we are meat-eaters, obviously. So, through evolution, is that why we need more sleep than, let's say, giraffes do?

SEIGEL: Well, humans are actually right in the middle. There is nothing very unique about the amount of sleep humans have. In fact, compared to animals with an equivalent diet, we tend to sleep a little less.

So, yes, we fit into this overall pattern that we can conserve energy. And certainly human babies sleep a lot, because it's in their interests to also be quiet and save energy until they get old enough to experience the world. And then it becomes advantageous for them to be awake and to be interacting.

(CROSSTALK)

COSTELLO: Fascinating. I wish we could talk on and on about this. But unfortunately we cannot. Dr. Siegel, thank you for joining us so early in the morning. We appreciate it.

SEIGEL: Thank you.

COSTELLO: And we hope you get a nap later today.

SEIGEL: I'll try.

COSTELLO: We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Oh, you know, this actually happened a short time ago. But we put it on tape, because it was just so darned beautiful. The sun coming up over New York City this morning. So, good morning to all of you.

If you're traveling, though, Bonnie has some news.

(WEATHER REPORT)

SCHNEIDER: Well, it's time now to give away a DAYBREAK coffee mug. We have a look now at our questions and answers.

Which actress has written a song to benefit Hurricane Katrina victims? And the second question is, who was voted the National and American League managers of the year?

The answer to the first question, Sharon Stone, of course. And the answer to the second question is Bobby Cox and Ozzie Guillen.

COSTELLO: Guillen.

SCHNEIDER: I'm sorry. All right, let's see our winner. Thursday's winner is Judy Varner from Dunlap, Tennessee. Congratulations, Judy.

All right. Let's take a look at the questions for today. What anniversary does the United Kingdom's Remembrance Day mark? And how many hours do giraffes sleep per day?

Submit your answers to CNN.com/daybreak.

How many hours do giraffes sleep? That's a good question.

COSTELLO: Oh, I was just going to say...

SCHNEIDER: How many hours do we sleep?

COSTELLO: That's just like (INAUDIBLE). But I didn't say it.

I know. But I wish I only needed that much sleep per night.

SCHNEIDER: Me too.

COSTELLO: That would be a lot...

SCHNEIDER: That would make things easier.

COSTELLO: I know. You'd get a lot more done.

SCHNEIDER: Definitely.

COSTELLO: Thank you, Bonnie.

SCHNEIDER: Sure.

COSTELLO: "Now in the News."

Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice is again vowing to help rebuild Iraq, saying the fate and future of Americans are directly linked to those of Iraqis. Rice made those comments in Baghdad today. She's there on a surprise visit.

President Bush will use a Veterans Day speech to battle allegations the White House misused intelligence to go to war in Iraq. The White House has been accused of manipulating intelligence on Iraq and leaking classified information to discredit critics of the war.

Chanting burn in hell Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, hundreds of Jordanians demonstrated against the leader of al Qaeda in Iraq. Al- Zarqawi is a Jordanian-born terrorist. His group says it was behind the hotel bombings in Amman that killed 57 people.

From the Time Warner center in New York, I'm Carol Costello. "AMERICAN MORNING" starts right now.

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