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CNN Live Today

Iraq Vets Speak Out; Potholes and Pitfalls of GM; Fraud After Hurricane Katrina

Aired November 22, 2005 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DARYN KAGAN, CNN ANCHOR: And let you know what happened.
Also, out of Washington, D.C., a story involving Jose Padilla. This is a man the government has referred to as an enemy combatant. Well, we're getting word now, CNN learning that government officials intend to announce a criminal indictment against him today. That is key because he's been in military custody for two years. He has been held in a brig in Charleston, South Carolina.

He will be charged in Miami, Florida. The exact charge is not clear at this point but it's a big story because it concerns what happens with enemy combatants and what happens with this particular man and the war on terror. So we're going to have more on that story just ahead.

Right now, let's take a look at what else is happening "Now in the News."

And for that we go first to Lititz, Pennsylvania, where police there say a 14-year-old girl willingly fled with her 18-year-old boyfriend after he reportedly shot and killed her parents. Authorities say that both David Ludwig and Kara Borden say that she went with him willingly. He is charged with murder, but the kidnaping charges will be dropped.

This hour in Austin, Texas, Congressman Tom DeLay appears in court. His lawyers will ask the judge to toss out charges of conspiracy and money laundering. If they succeed, the Republican could reclaim his position as house majority leader.

In that highlighted area you're looking at right there, a hockey player who was about to flirt with death, Jiri Fisher of the Detroit Red Wings, suffered a seizure and collapsed on the bench during last night's game. Medical personnel discovered his heart had stopped. They were able to revive him with a defibrillator. The 25-year-old seems fine today. He is undergoing tests to figure out what happened in the first place.

We're going to begin the hour, though, with more debate over the war in Iraq and calls to bring U.S. forces home. Today we hear from the troops themselves, many of them young men and women, who have left an arm or a leg on the battlefield. CNN's Tom Foreman reports now what they think of the war and the debate over it.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT, (voice over): In wheelchairs, on crutches, anywhere they could, casualties of Iraq came to the Potomac River. The Disabled American Veterans arranged this holiday cruise to help these troops move beyond the war that won't go away.

AIRMAN MICHAEL FLETCHER, U.S. AIR FORCE: It's bigger than us. It's bigger than me.

FOREMAN: Airman Michael Fletcher lost an arm, an eye and his nose when his vehicle rolled during a high-speed maneuver in the midst of the battle zone.

Has this experience changed your opinion of the war?

FLETCHER: In a way I want us to get out of that country. You know, I'm tired to seeing airmen, soldiers, Marines, you know, getting killed every day, senseless killing. But I don't think it's time to leave, you know? I don't think that . . .

FOREMAN: Why not?

FLETCHER: I don't think they're stable enough.

Many of these troops were in Iraq only weeks ago waging the daily battle with insurgents. Now in rehabilitation at stateside military hospitals, they're watching the political battle over when and how the war might end.

CPL. MATTHEW ZEBACK, U.S. MARINE CORPS: It was about a three foot concrete block, it had wires coming out of the front of it.

FOREMAN: Like many, Marine Corporal Matthew Zeback, who lost two fingers to a makeshift bomb, will talk of duty but not the debate.

Should the war be over? Should we be out of there?

ZEBACK: That's not my call, sir. I'm an infantrymen. And that's decided by people much higher than me, sir.

FOREMAN: But you would go back?

ZEBACK: Yes, sir. Today.

FOREMAN: Certainly in protests across the land, some veterans are speaking out against the war.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It makes me sick to think that we're doing this in America's name. We need to bring the troops home.

FOREMAN: But Army Sargent Nick Zwicker, injured when his team stopped an insurgent attack, is not ready to give up the fight.

SGT. NIC ZWICKER, U.S. ARMY: Personal view, if we pulled out right now, everything we've gone after and everything we've started to do over there would pretty much be shot down. FLETCHER: That means me losing an arm, me losing an eye or whatever, so be it. So be it.

FOREMAN: And you feel like for all you've been through that it still needs to be finished?

FLETCHER: It needs to be finished.

FOREMAN: This was just one group of wounded troops on one rainy day, but seemingly a group that is not willing to give up on this war. At least not yet.

Tom Foreman, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAGAN: Here now, though, one sign of stability in Iraq. It came today during a handover ceremony in the city of Tikrit. Take a look at this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: North central Iraq.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Cover!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KAGAN: That was a mortar exploding near a group of U.S. and Iraqi officials. A military spokesman says no one was hurt. The blast came as the U.S. was formally handing over a forward operating base to the Iraqi government. A senior U.S. official described the incident as a futile attempt to thwart progress that is being made in Iraq.

The Bush administration and a congressional war critic have stepped back from personal attacks. Each side, though, remains resolved. Appearing on CNN's "The Situation Room" with Wolf Blitzer, Congressman John Murtha says there will be less terrorism when U.S. force leave Iraq.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. DICK MURTHA, (D) PENNSYLVANIA: Just because the president, just because the White House says there's going to be more terrorism if we withdraw, doesn't make it so. He said there's going to be weapons of mass destruction. They said oil was going to pay for it. They said it was an al Qaeda connection. That's not necessarily true.

I predict the opposite. I think there will be less terrorism. We've become the target. We're the ones that have become the enemy. Eighty percent of the people there believe that we shouldn't be there. We shouldn't be occupiers. And 45 percent think it's justified to attack Americans.

Now let me tell you something. In 1963, Secretary McNamara (ph) predicted that we'd be out of there in two years. We had 220 casualties in 1965. Two years later, after he made that prediction, from that time on . . .

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: You're talking about Vietnam.

MURTHA: I'm talking about Vietnam. From that time on we had 53,000 casualties. I'm trying to prevent another Vietnam.

BLITZER: Listen to what the vice president, your old friend Dick Cheney, said today.

DICK CHENEY, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Recently my friend and former colleague, Jack Murtha, asked for a complete withdrawal of American forces now serving in Iraq with the draw down to begin at once. I disagree with Jack and believe his proposal would not serve the best interest of this nation. But he's a good man, a Marine, a patriot and he's taking a clear stand in an entirely legitimate discussion.

BLITZER: Has he called you, the vice president, to discuss this issue?

MURTHA: Well, Dick Cheney and I we are old friends. I used to talk to him every day when I was chairman of the committee and when we were in the '91 war. As a matter of fact, I would say, let's get this thing moving and he would say, not until Schwarzkopf's ready.

So we are old friends but he hasn't called me yet, but I'm sure he will. I'm convinced that he will come around to my position. This war cannot be won militarily. We have to turn it over to the Iraqis. The Iraqis will let us fight this war forever. I'm convinced the only way it's going to be won is politically. I said 18 months ago, either mobilize totally or get out. A year ago I said, you can't win it militarily. I'm saying the same thing now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KAGAN: A wide range of Iraqi political leaders is now calling for a timetable for the withdrawal of U.S. force. The statement coming at the end of a conference held in Egypt with three leading Iraqi factions.

A reminder, you can watch "The Situation Room" with Wolf Blitzer. You get it twice on weekdays on CNN, 4:00 p.m. Eastern and again at 7:00 p.m. Eastern.

Well, in business news now, today America's big three automarks are on a road filled with potholes and pitfalls and leading toward more uncertainty. At the bottom of the hour, we expect to hear from another troubled automaker. We've already heard from General Motors and its plans to layoff 30,000 of its workers over the next few years. The world's largest car maker blames declining sales, rising health care costs and foreign competition. But the impact is felt across North America. There are plant closings from Georgia to Oregon to Southern Canada. CNN's Ali Velshi takes a closer look at the industry and the company that has led it in good times and now bad. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ALI VELSHI, CNN CORRESPONDENT, (voice over): General Motors has been the world's biggest car maker since 1931. In 1955, it became the first American company to make over a billion dollars a year and it was all built on relentless demand for cars.

Cars for the masses were first built in America about 100 years ago and Americans haven't stopped buying them since. The thing is, they just don't buy as many from GM anymore, or from Ford. And GM and Ford's losses seem to be Toyota's gain. In fact, once the restructuring is done, GM will build a million fewer cars a year, allowing Toyota to take the lead and become the world's biggest car maker.

MICHAEL QUINCY, CONSUMER REPORTS: There's less of that stigma about, I don't want to buy foreign, I only want to buy American. I think Toyota had the right cars at the right time since even the 1970s when fuel prices were high and the oil embargo, they built small, fuel-efficient cars that people flocked to buy.

VELSHI: U.S. car makers got into a price war five years ago to overcome the sagging sales, then they introduced lower than bank interest financing, then zero interest financing. Now they tell you they'll sell you a car for the same price that employees pay. None of it worked.

GM and Ford now have the smallest share of the U.S. car market ever. Meanwhile, Toyota, Honda and others swooped in and won American drivers over with their quality, value and their styling. For GM, it's more than just sales, it's costs.

GM's biggest parts supplier, Delphi, recently filed for bankruptcy. GM used to own Delphi and may have to cover some of Delphi's healthcare expenses. That could cost GM billions. GM's own healthcare costs will amount to $5.8 billion this year. GM has already lost $4 billion this year. Some people on Wall Street think the car maker itself could go bankrupt.

Now it's not all bad. American pickup truck sales have been solid. You might say, like a rock. GM's Chevy Silverado is the second best-selling vehicle in the United States. The best selling vehicle is Ford's F-sears pickup. But the best selling car in the United States, the Toyota Camry.

Toyota knows that as early as next year it could earn the title of world's biggest car maker and they're worried that in the world's biggest car market, that may trigger a backlash, especially given how many American auto workers have been laid off. So Toyota's embarked on an ad campaign touting the 190,000 U.S. auto jobs that it's created.

Ali Velshi, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAGAN: At the bottom of the hour, we're going to hear more from Ali. He will check the pulse of the U.S. auto making industry.

Right now let's update you on a breaking story, a developing story here in Atlanta, Georgia. Atlanta fire crews on the scene trying to rescue a man who has fallen into a drainage pipe. We're getting word that apparently he was a hopeless man who somehow fell down into that pipe. First thing they're doing is putting pipes down there and breathing tubes so that the man can breathe while they try to carry out that rescue.

Also ahead, the trip to see family this Thanksgiving not going that easy for many. We're going to take a look at the weather. It's kind of hazy there in Washington, D.C. and Albany, New York, as well. Meteorologist Jacqui Jeras will be along to give you a look at what you face today. I hear it's actually the busiest travel day, even more than tomorrow. We'll get to that in just a second.

Also, fraud and lots of it. Investigations underway into millions of federal dollars paid to supposed victims of Hurricane Katrina. Some of the more far-fetched claims coming up.

And twin sisters whose lives took opposite roads. One is a successful psychiatrist, the other, a lifelong victim of schizophrenia. The struggle both have endured to cope with the illness against all odds.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAGAN: I want to go back to these live pictures here in Atlanta, Georgia. Atlanta fire rescuers on the scene right now. They're trying to get a man who has fallen into a storm drain. Now we did get word earlier that apparently it's a homeless man who somehow had fallen into that storm drain. They first put a ventilation pipe, lowered it into the hole to help the man breathe and apparently that's helped because now we're getting word that apparently they're very close to pulling the man out of the hole.

Yep. OK. We're getting the pull up. One firefighter saying lift him up. And again, we're using our affiliate WAGA here in Atlanta. So we're at the mercy of their pictures there. But it does look like they're pulling on the ropes and trying to pull this man up.

Not exactly sure how long he's been down there. I can tell you, the weather's been pretty severe here in the Atlanta area over the last 24 hours. A lot of rain yesterday and then intense winds overnight and really cold temperatures, at least for Atlanta. Other parts of the country might not consider it cold, but definitely around the 30s and 40s.

And it looks like they're getting close. They're putting a tarp up and looks like they have him. Can't see that well because they're keeping the tarp up, but it looks like indeed they've been able to get the man out of the storm drain. This, once again, has been unfolding here in Atlanta, Georgia. Some time either early today or last night the man fell into the storm drain. They put a ventilation pipe down first to help him breathe while they conducted that rescue.

Well, good to have that ending to that story. Let's go ahead and talk about weather. Jacqui Jeras here.

Jacqui, how did I do on my weather reporting for the Atlanta area?

(WEATHER REPORT)

KAGAN: And while we are keeping the pictures up live here in Atlanta while we were listening to Jacqui's weather, it looks like they did get the man out of storm drain and . . .

JERAS: Yes, if you guys can help it at all in . . .

KAGAN: No. Actually, not sure exactly on the condition of the man as they brought him out of the storm drain. But once again, they were able to get him out, putting a ventilation pipe down there first to help him breathe, and then they raised him up and now they're taking him for medical help. Not sure of his condition right now, but they did get the man out and congratulations to the city of Atlanta fire department for a successful rescue there.

Hurricane Katrina, we have heard so many stories of people who need help, perhaps some got it and some didn't. But what about the stories of people who have taken advantage of the systems, putting their hand out for help when they really didn't deserve it? That story's just ahead here on CNN. Right now, a quick break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAGAN: And it looks like they're giving treatment to a man here in Atlanta. We've been following this developing story. A man who fell into a storm drainpipe earlier and they had gone ahead and lowered a ventilation pipe down there to make it easier for him to breathe while they were trying to get him out. And they did. Credit to Atlanta fire department in this case.

Not really sure on the condition of the man. As I mentioned and Jacqui Jeras was saying, the weather has been a little bit severe here in Atlanta. Cold, windy temperatures. A lot of rain over the last 24 hours. So I'm sure on his condition. I'm sure they'll get him the medical help that he might need. But they did get him out of the storm drainpipe and we continue to follow the story.

Also as we look at the calendar, it is nearly three months since Hurricane Katrina. Thousands of people are still unaccounted for. "USA Today" reporting the government still has not caught up with 6,644 people, including almost 1,000 children. Of particular concern, about 1,300 people, some of them disabled are just living in the areas slammed by Katrina. Several of the missing may number a Louisiana morgue where 301 bodes have not been identified. Officials say many, if not most of the missing, are probably alive and living somewhere else. The official death toll in Louisiana and Mississippi from Katrina now stands at 1,306.

So, an estimated 53,000 Hurricane Katrina evacuees are getting a reprieve. FEMA and listen to this story carefully because it's very specific. FEMA is extending its temporary housing program by two weeks but only for certain people. The agency will pick up hotel tabs through December 15th, but this only applies to evacuees in Louisiana and Mississippi. They now have until January 7th to find a permanent place to live. This is not a nationwide reprieve. FEMA came under heavy criticism last week when the agency announced that funding would end on December 1st.

So where there's millions to be spent, you can often find people trying to make a quick buck, even out of a tragedy like Katrina. CNN's Joe Johns tells us about one huge fraud investigation.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOE JOHNS, CNN CORRESPONDENT, (voice over): Jackson, Mississippi, isn't exactly shoreline, it's a three-hour drive to New Orleans, for example. So alarm bells started going off after Hurricane Katrina when a slew of people in Jackson put in for and got millions in relief money from FEMA and the Red Cross. If you look around, it just didn't seem like there was enough hurricane damage in Jackson to justify the payout. By one estimate, more than $60 million. Now the federal prosecutor for these parts is sifting through about 1,000 complaints of alleged fraud from those who said people were scamming the system to get money they were not entitled to. The director of the county emergency department claims there's a huge discrepancy between the number of people claiming they're displaced and the number of destroyed homes.

LARRY FISHER, HINDS CO. EMERGENCY DIR.: The figure now is closer to 6,100 or 6,200 people who claim that they have been displaced, needed immediate food and shelter during the storm. I still can't go that high. Twenty-five to 30, I will take into consideration as a possibility that I did not see every home in the city of Jackson, but I still would not go for 45 or 50 homes that were considered unlivable.

JOHNS: Make no mistake, there were some Katrina-related problems here, but the storm damage that occurred was much less extensive than on the coast. Most of it the result of power blackouts. The Red Cross isn't so sure there was as much fraud as some suspect.

LAURA HOWE, AMERICAN RED CROSS: We know that Jackson was a hub for evacuees. So we know that we had a lot of evacuees that came in from South Mississippi. We know we had evacuees who relocated there from Louisiana. So it's very possible that a lot of the assistance we gave out in the Jackson area was to people who relocated there from other parts of the country because of the hurricane.

JOHNS: There hasn't been a firm accounting yet, but there are a lot of anecdotes, including nagging reports that some people here got relief checks and went on spending sprees, not for the necessities of life, but for things like electronics and jewelry as first reported by "The New York Times." The U.S. attorney's office, which has been monitored a 1-800-Fraud complaint hotline says, there could be an announcement of some indictments as early as Tuesday. They hope vigorous investigation will serve as a deterrent. The officials we talked to said there was no mechanism in place to monitor an emergency assistance program of this magnitude. (END VIDEOTAPE)

KAGAN: And that was CNN's Joe Johns reporting.

The House of Representatives, by the way, has also ordered an oversight investigation into spending of relief money. A team of former law enforcement officers is expected to get on the ground soon in that investigation.

It's 28 minutes past the hour. More bad news for the ailing U.S. auto industry. You already know about General Motors and the cuts announced yesterday. Now another U.S. automaker facing a bleak future. We will tell you who actually might benefit from that news.

A violent police chase is caught on tape. We'll tell you what happened to the suspect.

And twin sisters with a very special relationship. How love is helping them get through the struggles of a painful illness.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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