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American Morning

U.S. Torture Policy; Jackpot Jinx?; Hussein Trial Adjourned Until Late December

Aired December 07, 2005 - 09:35   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Let's turn now and talk about Condoleezza Rice. As you well know, she's been going through Europe this week, and she's really been followed, dogged you might say, by questions rather about U.S. torture policy. This morning, she tried to clarify the matter a little bit. Barbara Starr's following the story live from the Pentagon.
Hey, Barbara, good morning to you.

When you listen to what the secretary of state had to say, it wasn't particularly clear, it wasn't particularly clear, and it wasn't particularly, I guess, concise and to the point.

What did you read in to that?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, Soledad, good morning to you.

A lot of attention now already being paid to that statement that Condoleezza Rice made while traveling through Ukraine earlier today, when she spoke and said, at least it appeared to be somewhat definitive, that U.S. personnel would not engage in torture of detainees, whether they are held inside the United States or held abroad. Now, let's start by listening to what the secretary had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CONDOLEEZZA RICE, SECY. OF STATE: As a matter of U.S. policy, the United States's obligations under the CAT, which prohibits, of course, cruel, and inhumane and degrading treatment, those obligations extend to U.S. personnel wherever they are, whether they are in the United States or outside of the United States.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STARR: Saying that the U.S. is agreeing to abide by this Convention Against Torture, is that a shift in Bush administration policy or not? Now, listen very carefully, because what she did not say, is anything about the so-called rendition, the transfer of detainees to third countries where they're interrogated and the U.S. does not control that interrogation, somewhat deliberately it does not control that interrogation. No telling if torture occurs in those countries.

What analysts who have looked at this are saying is this statement may be more politically motivated. Senator John McCain, a Vietnam POW himself, tortured by the North Vietnamese during the time he was held, has been very active in trying to get a legislative ban on torture. It has passed the Senate. There are growing indications that the McCain ban will pass the House. And that is something the Bush administration does not want to see.

So many people feel that Condoleezza Rice's statement this morning was an attempt to fend off that notion of a legislative ban. Negotiations going on behind the scenes with Senator McCain and others on the Hill, all of this really expected to be sorted out this week -- Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: Yes, it's not exactly clear. All right, Barbara Starr at the Pentagon for us this morning. Barbara, thank you -- Miles.

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Here are the words you'd love to hear, right? You just won the lottery. And so you would think the rest of your life will be easy living, high living, no problems at all. Well, the truth of the matter is just the opposite.

Joining us now to talk a little bit about this, perhaps it may sound like sour grapes a little bit, but we'll explain, is the author of "Sudden Money," the subtitle, "Managing a Financial Windfall."

Susan Bradley joins us. She's with the Sudden Money Institute. She's a certified financial planner, and she helps people who realize their dream, and in many cases it turns out to be a nightmare.

Is it sour grapes, Susan, or is it reality?

SUSAN BRADLEY, "SUDDEN MONEY": Well, winning the Lottery, like any other sudden-money event, could be good. But there's a simplistic view that we have about it, that essentially money is good and more is better. If you win the lottery or get a big inheritance, you think that life's supposed to be good all of a sudden. And it might be. But it also might be just the opposite, and whether it goes one direction or the other is really up to you.

M. O'BRIEN: You know if you really do the research on this, there are so many cases, it's almost the exception to find a lottery winner who's done really well. I think the ones that do well you don't read so much about, of course, so maybe it's not a very good study.

But the person who comes to mind of course, kind of the poster child, if you will, for this is Jack Whittaker, who won Christmas Day 2002, West Virginia, won $112 million bucks after taxes, big lotto pot, and has seemingly was well-equipped to handle it all, was a man of means, had a business, employed 100 and some odd people, but it's been really, as you've see pictures of him shortly after he won -- there you see December 27th on this program -- one problem after another. He's been robbed, and ultimately, his granddaughter died, 17-year-old granddaughter, very sad story. What happened to Jack Whittaker? BRADLEY: Well, you know, when people win the Lottery, they don't expect it to be -- they think it's just about the money, and it's not just about the money. All of a sudden everything in your life gets magnified, all your family relationships, all your personal beliefs and value systems, and hopes and dreams, and relationship between you and your spouse.

Everything kind of goes up in the air and moves around for awhile, and unless you have a process to figure that out, in the context of this new experience, then make some financial decisions, it's likely that you're going to run in to some pretty tough water.

The Whittakers went very public with their win and that's one of the more difficult things. Most lottery winners choose not to identify themselves, try not to be in the public eye. If you talk to a lottery winner a couple years after they win, they'll tell you that they -- if you even know that they're a lottery winner -- I would -- but they'll say that they never identify themselves as a lottery winner.

M. O'BRIEN: Hey, would you advise...

BRADLEY: The Whittakers were very public.

M. O'BRIEN: ... people to do that? Stay anonymous? Is that a good idea?

BRADLEY: Absolutely.

M. O'BRIEN: Now Jack Whittaker...

BRADLEY: Absolutely, keep a low profile.

M. O'BRIEN: He's been quoted as saying if he had to do it over, he'd rip that ticket up. That's an amazing statement. Is that what you hear from a lot of lottery winners?

BRADLEY: I hear it from some, certainly not a lot. And what you said earlier is true. The ones that have the difficulties really hit the papers.

You know, a lot of the things that happened to the Whittakers before the death of their granddaughter were kind of things that happen to people. You know, they get drunk in a bar, they do this or they get speeding tickets. But because they're a big lottery winner, now it's big news and it's in the headlines, that some lottery winner, you know, got ten speeding tickets.

So you become sort of the focus of the public. Most people think that winning the lottery would be easy for them. They laugh at the kind of work that I do and they all say things like, you know, that's a problem I'd like to have.

M. O'BRIEN: Sure, wouldn't we all?

BRADLEY: We don't know how we're going to be around it. Yes, everybody thinks that.

M. O'BRIEN: Are lotteries, then -- would you go as far to say as lotteries are inherently bad?

BRADLEY: Absolutely not. I wouldn't say that -- money is not good or bad. Lotteries are not good or bad. It's what you bring to it. It's the unexpected complexity that's really the problem. Most people think that they want a permanent vacation when they win the lottery. What they really want is a new job, which is wealth management.

Could be a great thing. But it takes them time and it's a different intention. You don't just go to a stockbroker and say here, I have all this money, please invest it for me. You really need a special form of financial planning. You need an attorney that really understands the personal dynamics, the human dynamics, of lotteries. Same with the accountant. And maybe a family therapist.

So you need a whole new team in your life. And most people don't get that for several years. During that time, some pretty unfortunate things can happen.

M. O'BRIEN: Final thought, Susan. Do you play the lottery?

BRADLEY: Once in awhile for my dad. He's got special numbers and he's when out of state I play them for him.

M. O'BRIEN: All right. And if he wins, you'll take care of him, I'm sure. Susan Bradley, who is author of "Sudden Money," joining us from Palm Beach. Thanks for your time.

Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: More developments now in the Saddam Hussein trial. The trial has now been adjourned till the 21st of December.

Let's get right to Aneesh Raman. He's covering this trial for us this morning. Aneesh, what happened?

ANEESH RAMAN, CNN BAGHDAD CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Soledad, court adjourning just moments ago. The judge saying that the session has been postponed until December 21st. It came at the end of two witness testimonies. Again, as we saw throughout the week, the witnesses were anonymous behind a blue curtain, their voices disguised.

Today starting off with a huge delay, because of procedural matter, a big one: Saddam Hussein did not want to show up to court. And, in fact, he did not show up. An empty chair in the docks where he usually sits. All morning, negotiations were taking place between the judges, the defense lawyers and Saddam, trying to see if they could find out any sort of way to make him come back to court or figure out how they would deal with his refusal to show up.

He had said at the end of yesterday's session that because he had been in the same clothes for the past three days and the same underwear, he didn't want to show up in court anymore. They didn't put any closed circuit television, as some were suspecting this morning, in order for him to see the proceedings. He'll simply be made aware of what took place by the judge after it is done.

But again, just a few moments ago, the third day this week of the trial against Saddam Hussein and seven other co-defendants adjourning until December 21st. We had assumed it would adjourn until some date after December 15th. That's when Iraq has its general elections.

The security situation around this trial is so impossibly difficult, if it were to take place alongside the elections. So we knew they'd postpone it 'til after the 15th, Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: Aneesh Raman with an update of what's happening at the Saddam Hussein trial. Aneesh, thanks.

"CNN LIVE TODAY" is coming up next. Let's get right to Daryn Kagan. What you working on? Good morning.

DARYN KAGAN, CNN ANCHOR: Soledad, it is a busy morning ahead. President Bush pushes his plan for victory in Iraq. He'll speak just about an hour from now. Of course, we'll carry that speech live.

And we want to know how you would define victory in Iraq. Log on to our Web site and e-mail us. The address, livetoday@CNN.com. We'll read some of your responses on the air. For now, back to you in New York City.

S. O'BRIEN: All right, Daryn, thanks.

Ahead this morning, new numbers on just how high the heating bill is going to climb this winter. Andy's "Minding Your Business."

M. O'BRIEN: And those sky high bills could put a big dent in your holiday shopping budget. But can you still get great gifts without spending beyond your budget? The cheapest guy I know, Clark Howard, is in the House today. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

M. O'BRIEN: All right, it's a tough time of year if you're trying to meet a budget. Matter of fact, most people don't even have a budget. They just go out and start spending willy-nilly. Frequently when they see something they like for themselves, buying that. That's even worse. It just starts snowballing and pretty soon, come January, you get some bills you really don't want to see. So how can we avoid this?

We know just the guy to help us out. Consumer advocate and famous cheapskate and he takes that, actually, as a compliment -- Clark Howard. Real quick, Clark, how much...

CLARK HOWARD, CONSUMER ADVOCATE: There's nothing wrong with being cheap.

M. O'BRIEN: Good to see you. How much did you spend for this outfit? About five bucks total? HOWARD: No, this was expensive. This shirt was $16.

M. O'BRIEN: Ooh, $16! Unbelievable!

HOWARD: A hundred percent cotton, doesn't wrinkle.

M. O'BRIEN: Very nice.

HOWARD: Yes. So big bucks.

M. O'BRIEN: Usually, it's something like five bucks for a pair of pants, right?

HOWARD: Well, usually, I buy them used. But these were new. These were ten bucks.

M. O'BRIEN: Oh, man. Getting high off the hog here. Ten bucks. All right, let's talk about how we can rein our spending in.

HOWARD: Oh, boy this year you've got to. Because when those home heating oil bills and natural gas bills come in in January, it's going to be an ugly hangover. And then all the Christmas bills, if you charged up like a fool, are going to eat you up.

So you have to come up with a total budget. How much overall can you really afford to spend? And always put yourself on that list. Because when you're out shopping for others, you're buying stuff for yourself, too.

M. O'BRIEN: Yes.

HOWARD: So you have to...

M. O'BRIEN: So you include yourself in your budget? So when you see that cool doo-dad that you get in the midst of shopping, instead of feeling guilty about it, say, look, I budgeted a few bucks for myself. I can give myself a gift.

HOWARD: Oh, but it's more specific than that. You have a total amount of money you're going to spend, put everybody on the list, how much money you want to spend for them, add it up. If it adds up to more than the total you had, you got to start cutting people off your list or reduce what you're spending on them.

And then you carry the list with you. So when you're in a store, if you say, that would be perfect for so and so, but it's more money than you had for them, you got to pull money away from somebody else.

M. O'BRIEN: And so you've got to do it there in realtime.

HOWARD: Yes, because if you don't, you're going to have the best of intentions, January comes around, you're dead meat.

M. O'BRIEN: All right, let's look at some other tips. All right, you sort of addressed the making-a-budget issue here and the list. One of the things you recommend is never use a shopping cart. What's that all about.

HOWARD: Right, well;, you only shop in stores with concrete floors to start with. So those stores...

M. O'BRIEN: Used clothing store, no shopping cart, right?

HOWARD: Yes, so when you don't have the cart, because the cart is your impulse enemy, because you put things in there, you carry things around in your arms. What happens is you look down, you think, do I really need that? Do I really need that? And you get a free exercise program while you're doing it.

M. O'BRIEN: You can call it a Sherpa budget, I guess. Avoid the mall. What about the mall? Bad place, right?

HOWARD: Yes, the only time to go to malls is after, after, after Christmas. Because the malls, you're paying for all that fancy doodad stuff -- the fancy floors, the fancy fixtures. You go to the strip malls, where the real deals are. And you know, Black Friday showed the consumer knows that, because people overwhelmingly shopped right after Thanksgiving at the discount stores.

M. O'BRIEN: Interesting. That's where the action is, isn't it?

HOWARD: Right.

M. O'BRIEN: And shop ahead for the next year. So with you I suspect you do, it's like the day after Christmas sort of, that week, all the sales come, you do your list.

HOWARD: Not anymore. Can't do that anymore.

M. O'BRIEN: Why not?

HOWARD: Gift cards. Gift cards have blown apart the calendar for buying bargains. You buy your bargains after January 9th. On this year's calendar, January 9th forward is when you're going to find incredible deals.

M. O'BRIEN: That's when the gift cards expire?

HOWARD: No, that's when people have exhausted themselves shopping. Whatever's left in the stores is marked down so dirt cheap that if you do shopping for next Christmas starting the week of January 9th, you're going to do your Christmas shopping at 75 percent off.

M. O'BRIEN: All right, finally, I want to give -- you had a couple of Web sites that people should go for gifts online. I just want to share. There's one that we kind of like, boredmom.com. I don't know of any bored moms. I know of exhausted moms. I know moms that are frazzled. I don't know too many bored one. Tell me about that.

HOWARD: There are some great Web sites, and there's so many of them, where you can get secret codes for free shipping, discounts online. I just got an e-mail while I was waiting for you that had a 15-percent discount on all cellular accessories. So whatever area you're interested in, these great sites will help you get the secret codes that unlock extra bargains.

M. O'BRIEN: Clark Howard is a bored mom.

And final thought here, I want you to get this, because I know you like to proselytize this. Use a credit card, you say. Why? Real quick.

HOWARD: Well, you use a credit card when you're buying electronics or appliances, because if you use the right one, you get a doubling of the manufacturer's warranty for free.

M. O'BRIEN: Not debit cards, credit cards.

HOWARD: Credit cards.

M. O'BRIEN: Clark Howard, cheapest guy I know. He's got a $20 outfit; he looks like a million bucks. Always a pleasure to have you drop by.

We're back with more in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

S. O'BRIEN: What's it going to cost to heat your home this winter? Andy's got that.

Good morning.

ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: Good morning, Soledad.

A lot of money. That's the answer to that question. Let's go to the Big Board, though, first of all, to see how stocks are trading at this hour to start off the day. Down 25 points in the Dow Jones Industrials. Big news coming out of Detroit this morning. "The Detroit News" reporting that Ford will be laying off 25,000 to 30,000 employees over the next five years, and shuttering at least 10 plants. This is a lot more than previously thought. We thought it was going to are more like 7,000 people. So not some very good news there, and this matches GM's cuts.

As far as heating oil goes and heating prices to heat your home this winter -- gas, electric -- it doesn't matter, it's going to cost about $200 more on average. That's up 25 percent from last year. You can see $998 -- $999 -- $989 that is.

S. O'BRIEN: You need glasses.

SERWER: I do. But I just couldn't say it. I don't want to say it, it's so much money that it's hard to say. It's almost $1,000 to heat your home this winter.

S. O'BRIEN: That's going to be steep.

SERWER: Brutal.

S. O'BRIEN: It's going to be brutal.

SERWER: Yes.

S. O'BRIEN: Andy, thank you very much.

SERWER: You're welcome.

S. O'BRIEN: Coming up tomorrow on AMERICAN MORNING, we're going to take a look at John Lennon's legacy, 25 years. Can you believe it's been 25 years since he was murdered? We also have some pretty rare footage of the legendary singer/songwriter where he reflects on his life. We'll show you some of that, as well.

A reminder, AMERICAN MORNING starts at 6:00 a.m. Eastern. We'll see you then. And we're back in just a moment.

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