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American Morning

Bush Visits NSA Headquarters to Defend Wiretapping; Looking at Palestinian Elections

Aired January 25, 2006 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning.
I'm Miles O'Brien.

The U.S. keeping an eye on an important vote by Palestinians this morning. Will a group linked to terror grab a large share of the power there? We'll take you live to the scene.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Soledad O'Brien.

Can American troops succeed in Iraq? A new Pentagon report says they might be stretched too thin. We've got that story this morning.

M. O'BRIEN: And should the government have been better prepared for hurricane Katrina? That seems like a cheap shot, doesn't it? Accusations of warnings ignored, though, ahead on this AMERICAN MORNING.

A special guest coming up today.

S. O'BRIEN: Who are you talking to?

M. O'BRIEN: Paul Begala, James Carville...

S. O'BRIEN: A new book, I can see.

M. O'BRIEN: A new book. It's called "Take It Back." I love the back side, is the best part.

Can you get a close-up there? OK. We'll let you identify who is whom in that threesome there. Depending on where you come from, you might say -- anyway. In the middle is the jackass, folks. In any case, we will talk to them about how they, they would like to get the White House back for the Democrats. That's coming up.

But first, President Bush preaching to the converted today. He will head to Fort Meade, Maryland, home of the domestic spying program. He is speaking to some of the spies at the super secret National Security Agency. And we get to listen without a warrant.

Suzanne Malveaux live at the White House with more on that -- good morning, Suzanne.

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Hey, good morning, Miles. This really is an extraordinary development when you think about it, the fact that the National Security Agency was a place in the governor, it was so secret they didn't even acknowledge its existence. Well, today President Bush is going to be going to the NSA. He is actually going to be visiting, shaking hands with employees, taking a tour, also talking to the traveling press.

All of this, Miles, of course, part of an extraordinary effort by this administration to defend its domestic spy program, a program that the government, the administration insists is either calls coming in or going out of the United States, with the terrorists, at least, on the line -- Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: Suzanne, let's talk about the broader political strategy here. I mean the polling numbers would indicate most people are in favor of what the president and the NSA are doing here. And clearly they're trying to go on the offensive. That's what we've seen over the past couple of days.

MALVEAUX: Well, certainly. And there three things that they're trying to accomplish. First, they are trying to minimize any kind of political damage that these congressional hearings that are going to happen next month actually caused because of this program.

Secondly, they are trying to frame the debate here, that is one of national security instead of legality, although they say that the president is acting within legal means.

And finally, of course, they're trying to exploit the perception or misperception of Democrats as being weak on security. That, of course, playing into those congressional midterm elections -- Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: Suzanne Malveaux at the White House.

Thank you very much.

Meanwhile, is the U.S. Army stretched to thin to win in Iraq? A new report commissioned by the Pentagon says the Army cannot keep rotating troops into Iraq long enough to defeat the insurgency there. The report's author says the Army is, and we quote now: "in a race against time to adjust to the demands of war or risk breaking the force in the form of a catastrophic decline." That's a quote from the report.

The report does say the Army is still a highly effective fighting force right now -- Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: To the Middle East now. Lots at stake for Palestinians, who are lining up to vote today, as well as their -- as well as, really for their Israeli neighbors. The elections are pitting the ruling Fatah Party against Hamas, a group that says it is committed to Israel's destruction.

John Vause is in downtown Ramallah for us this morning on the West Bank -- hey, John, good morning.

How is the turnout so far? Can you tell?

JOHN VAUSE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Soledad, very, very strong voter turnout. In fact, many Palestinians were lining up at the polling stations before they even officially opened.

The last word we had, a 50 percent turnout so far in Gaza, 40 percent here in the West Bank.

It's been a long three week campaign, a bitter campaign at times. But they're calling it a festival of democracy. And, in fact, in Palestinian cities and towns, it's difficult to find a wall which hasn't been plastered with these kind of election campaigns. This one is for Fatah. That's the ruing party. It's the party founded by the late Yasser Arafat.

Now, they're campaigning on his legacy, a legacy which is mixed, at best. Now, Fatah is facing that challenge from Hamas, the militant Islamic group. Now, Hamas has been campaigning on this platform of change and reform. That's their campaign banner over there on the lighthouse tower. The Arabic reads: "change and reform for an open and honest, accountable g."

But Hamas, of course, is best known for that wave of suicide bombings and other attacks against Israelis over the last five years.

And even in the course of this campaign, while it's toned down the rhetoric, dropped the outright call for Israel's destruction, saying that it will be left for future generations, it's still refusing to recognize Israel's right to exist and still recognizing or refusing to disarm, still refusing to lay down their weapons.

So a lot of nervous Israelis watching the outcome of these elections -- Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: Yes, one would imagine.

What happens, John, if there's no clear winner?

VAUSE: Well, then the coalition building begins. If it's deadlocked between Fatah and Hamas, then the independents come in. So most likely the independents will go with Fatah and then, in many ways, it'll be business as usual. But the emphasis will be on cleaning house, ending the corruption, ending the blatant nepotism, which has been rife within the Palestinian Authority for 10 years -- Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: John Vause for us this morning.

John, thank you.

Another salvo in the war of words between the United States and Cuba. Hundreds of thousands of people packed the streets of Havana for Tuesday's organized anti-American protest. But as Fidel Castro and the crowd near the U.S. diplomatic mission, a new message board was sort of flicked on. It was turned on by the Americans inside the mission. The ticker shows news and messages, including quotes from Martin Luther King and also Abraham Lincoln.

Needless to say, the Cuban leader not a huge fan of the ticker.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PRES. FIDEL CASTRO, CUBA (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): They have turned on that little sign. Cockroaches are so valued. It seems that little Bush gave the order.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

S. O'BRIEN: Castro called for the march to protest an immigration case in the United States involving a former CIA operative who Castro claims tried to assassinate him.

Other stories making news this morning, six minutes past the hour.

Let's get right to Carol for a look at those -- good morning.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning.

Good morning to all of you.

Samuel Alito takes another step to becoming a Supreme Court justice today. The full Senate getting ready to start debating his nomination. The Republican majority's Senate Judiciary Committee voted along party lines Tuesday, giving Alito an up v. His confirmation if pretty much a sure thing.

And Iraqi official says five Iraq female prisoners could be freed tomorrow as the fate of American journalist Jill Carroll remains unclear. Her abductors have demanded the U.S. release all Iraqi women in custody. Carroll was abducted on January 7th in Baghdad. Her Iraqi translator was killed during that abduction.

Senators looking into the government's response to hurricane Katrina are crying foul. Both Republican and Democratic members of the Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee says the White House is not answering its questions or handing over documents. Republican Senator Susan Collins also accuses the White House of barring agency officials from talking with the panel.

The White House says it's merely protecting the conviviality of presidential advisers.

And those omega-3 fatty acids in fish may be good for your heart, but not so much when it comes to fighting cancer. According to some new findings, fish is probably no help in the fight against cancer. The American Cancer Society recommends fish partly because it doesn't include high amounts of saturated fats, like those in red meat.

Medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen joins us in the next hour to talk more about this, because, man, it gets confusing, doesn't it -- Chad.

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: It is. Just keep drinking that green tea, Carol.

COSTELLO: Yes, or white tea now. That's the new thing.

MYERS: Oh, is that it? I'm not -- that'll take me a year to catch up to that one.

(WEATHER REPORT)

S. O'BRIEN: Ahead this morning, the White House wiretapping -- officials say they're only spying on people linked to al Qaeda. How do they know that in the first place? We're going to do an explainer ahead.

M. O'BRIEN: Also, thousands of Ford workers will soon be looking for new jobs.

But where should they look first? How do they begin? We've got tips on getting back into the job hunt.

S. O'BRIEN: And then later, James Carville and Paul Begala join us. We're going to ask those feisty Democrats about their new book. It's called "Take It Back." We'll also talk about the presidency in 2008.

That's ahead.

We're back in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

S. O'BRIEN: We've been talking about domestic spying without a warrant. Today, President Bush is going to visit the place where it's all done, the National Security Agency, so secret that for years the government actually didn't even acknowledge its existence.

Patrick Radden Keefe is the author of a book called "Chatter," and he can tell us just who gets spied on and how it's done.

Good morning, Patrick.

Nice to see you.

Thanks for talking with us.

PATRICK RADDEN KEEFE, AUTHOR, "CHATTER": Thanks for having me.

S. O'BRIEN: Let's start with those very questions.

Exactly how is it decided who is going to be spied upon?

KEEFE: Well, if you think about it, it's a little bit like sort of a six degrees of separation type way of looking at things. I mean what you have is there are particular people who get calls inside the United States from countries we're interested in -- Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, places where you might have terrorists. And then what you want to do is look at those people, look at all the people they're calling, look at all the people they're calling and it sort of radiates out in that manner.

S. O'BRIEN: Here's what the attorney general said to me in my interview with him yesterday about exactly who's being targeted.

Let's listen for a sec.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ALBERTO GONZALES, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: We're talking about communications where one end of the call is outside the United States and where there is a reasonable basis to believe, based upon the experience of a qualified foreign intelligence expert, that a person on the call is either a member of Al Qaeda or a member of an organization that is affiliated with al Qaeda.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

S. O'BRIEN: So then people who we sort of consider to be, you know, innocent civilians who are on the personal phone call, they're not being spied upon?

KEEFE: Well, you've got to think about it. There's two different things going on here. One of them is when you actually listen in on a phone call and the other is when you see who those people call. Again, it's this idea that you're trying to see who are these networks, these terror cells? How do we know where they are?

And so one of the stories that came out last week, actually, was that the NSA was feeding tips, thousands of tips, to the FBI and that the people at the FBI would get these tips and a lot of the time they said it was like, you know, oh boy, we've got to go to Pizza Hut again and check out, you know, the people there.

So that in that case, I think it really was innocent civilians who just happened to be in the wrong person's speed dial.

S. O'BRIEN: Are they listening to code words, you know, where they could say ooh, that code word means bombing or that code word means dirty bomb? Or are they listening to sort of -- or looking for connections to people who they know are terrorists?

KEEFE: It's both. I think it's much more of the connections. There's a misconception which is that if you say bomb or jihad on the phone, the computers at the NASA are going to pick it up right away.

But if you think about it, first of all, the NASA is much more sophisticated than that in terms of the way they're going about this. And, second, the terrorists are more sophisticated, too. I mean they know very well that people are listening and they know better than to use those words on the phone.

S. O'BRIEN: And I would imagine they know better than to use those words in e-mails.

So how are the terrorists getting around that? Because I assume we're talking about e-mail, too, not just phone communication?

KEEFE: Yes, very much. I mean, and they've come up with many, many incredibly sophisticated ways of getting around this. It's funny, you know, it's easy to think of them, because we know about the caves in Afghanistan and, you know, what some might argue is the kind of backwards philosophy of the terrorists, as not especially sophisticated.

But, in fact, they have really embraced cutting edge technology. So they do all kinds of things. I mean they use disposable cell phones in order to throw off -- throw American authorities off the scent. They use a technology called steganography, where you basically hide a text message inside an image on a Web site. And if somebody else knows which Web site it is, they can extract that text. And it looks, you know, to you or me, it would just look like an image.

S. O'BRIEN: And I guess you could send e-mails without really sending them, I mean just have access -- if everybody has access to the same login, you could share an e-mail...

KEEFE: That's another...

S. O'BRIEN: ... without ever really mailing it to somebody.

KEEFE: Exactly. And if you think about it, that way the e-mail is not actually in transit. And if you have somebody, you know, in New York and somebody in Afghanistan and they have the same e-mail address, all you have to do is write out the emotional and save it in the drafts folder and the other person can just log on and check it out.

S. O'BRIEN: Do they have technology to be able to reveal who's in a suspected terrorist, you know, speed dial? Because I would imagine there's, you know, to be able to determine that would make a big difference, you know, in sort of proving a relationship, who's in your speed dial versus who you might just call?

KEEFE: They absolutely do have the technology. But you have to think about it, this is actually an area where, you know, that's both an advantage and a disadvantage. Because, on the one hand it means you can see who people are calling. On the other hand, in our day to day lives, whether you're a soccer mom or a terrorist, you make a lot of phone calls. And if all you're doing is seeing well, who do all of these people call and then who do all of they -- those people call, you're going to end up with a very, very long list, which I think is why you had the FBI sort of pushing back a little bit and saying look, we're trying to chase down too many of these leads and most of them are going nowhere.

S. O'BRIEN: So, is the NSA essentially being overwhelmed because they're casting this net so wide and trying to sort of get everybody and then having to sort through those messages? Or do you think, you know, I guess is the NSA winning or are the terrorists sort of winning on the technology front?

KEEFE: Oh, I think it's a cat and mouse game. I mean I think it's very difficult to say on any given day. We certainly have heard that this particular program has, in some cases, provided information that has averted disaster. So, for instance, there was the operation on the Brooklyn Bridge, which was supposedly averted because of information gained from this particular wiretapping program.

But having said that, there's all of those false leads the FBI is chasing down. So it's difficult to say on any given day.

S. O'BRIEN: Patrick Radden Keefe in a snowy Boston today.

He's the author of "Chatter."

Nice to see you.

Thanks for talking with us.

KEEFE: Thanks for having me.

S. O'BRIEN: Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: It looks positively Rockwellian there.

S. O'BRIEN: Doesn't it?

M. O'BRIEN: It's beautiful.

S. O'BRIEN: It's beautiful.

M. O'BRIEN: Yes, behind him.

Coming up, thousands of -- there you are over there. Thousands of Ford employees are about to be out of work, joining millions of other Americans in the unemployment lines already. We have some tips on how to rebound from the layoffs.

Stay with us for more AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

M. O'BRIEN: About 30,000 Ford families this morning still trying to come to terms with the bad news. Their good jobs going the way of the Model T. And finding anything with the same pay and benefits will not be easy.

So, where to begin for them and, for that matter, for anyone looking for a job right now?

Richard Bayer is a career counselor. He has some tips for us. He's with the Five O'Clock Club. And we'll tell you about the book they have in just a little bit.

Richard, good to have you with us.

RICHARD BAYER, THE FIVE O'CLOCK CLUB: My pleasure.

M. O'BRIEN: This is a particularly difficult layoff, because what we're talking about at the root here is, you know, a tectonic shift in U.S. economics.

BAYER: Yes.

M. O'BRIEN: These factory jobs which they've relied on are like hen's teeth these days.

So what's a Ford worker to do?

BAYER: Well, the economy is changing more toward service industries. And I think the first thing that someone would do would be to negotiate in an exit interview. You should negotiate the benefits. You know, will they carry your health care or contribute to your...

M. O'BRIEN: Well, the union does that in this case, right?

BAYER: In this case.

M. O'BRIEN: Right, yes.

BAYER: In Ford, but more generally...

M. O'BRIEN: Right.

BAYER: ... you've got to worry about the cash settlement that you receive. It is six months? Is it a year? And then, finally, career counseling. If you want to move forward, move into that next job, you've got to have career counseling.

M. O'BRIEN: So hopefully that will be part of the package which Ford says it wants to offer employees.

BAYER: Part of the package.

M. O'BRIEN: You know, one of the things, I think, in this case, is more than career counseling, you have many of these factory workers who probably need to go back to school.

BAYER: They may need to do that. They can have skill obsolescence, which is one of the things you really don't want to have. And so you join association meetings. You read the literature. You go back to school. You get your skills up to where they need to be.

M. O'BRIEN: Let's talk about just keeping yourself focused in the right direction and the right attitude.

BAYER: Right.

M. O'BRIEN: One thing you say is keep self-esteem high.

BAYER: Right. M. O'BRIEN: Much easier said than done.

BAYER: It is, because you've just been laid off or fired. But you need to keep your self-esteem going. See a career coach. A career coach will tell you what you've done or help you figure out what you enjoy doing and what you've also done well. It presumes you've done something well.

M. O'BRIEN: You know, it's interesting, we talked yesterday to a couple of Ford workers and one of them -- father and son. The son says he does very well in bass tournaments. He wants to pursue that, as a professional bass fisherman. A tough job, but he said he's also going to go to school, as well.

I think that's probably a good way to play both sides.

BAYER: Right. Right.

M. O'BRIEN: Targeting your search. If you know you like bass fishing, you do it, right?

BAYER: Right.

M. O'BRIEN: I mean is that it? You focus on what you're good at, what you have a passion for?

BAYER: Right. I mean if you're into something that you don't enjoy, it's going to grind you down to a pulp. So you need to do something that you do enjoy and do well. And, of course, you have got to compete in the marketplace. And, you know, that's what you need to be doing.

M. O'BRIEN: You need to be computer savvy, Internet savvy these days. Absolutely mandatory, isn't it?

BAYER: Absolutely mandatory. Now, the Internet is good for some things and not good for others. Very few people find a job off the Internet. I mean if you think...

M. O'BRIEN: So those monster.com things, forget about that?

BAYER: Well, I mean it doesn't hurt.

M. O'BRIEN: Yes.

BAYER: You can do it.

M. O'BRIEN: But it's not going to get you a job necessarily?

BAYER: No. Don't mistake that for a real job search.

What you do use the Internet for is research so you can research about a company before an interview, before a meeting. You can research about the industry. And so you should be very knowledgeable when you go into an interview.

M. O'BRIEN: And there's so much information out there that would be helpful for people.

BAYER: Yes.

M. O'BRIEN: It's amazing how much you can be armed with what would take several trips to the library just a few years ago.

BAYER: Download their annual report, for example.

M. O'BRIEN: Right.

Yes.

Finally, you say this -- get out of the house.

BAYER: Yes.

M. O'BRIEN: And that's, you know, you sort of have to force yourself, because you've lost the reason to get in the car in the morning, right?

BAYER: Right. Your world can get smaller and smaller. And that's bad. But what you really need to be doing is going to association meetings. What you really need to be doing is talking with positive people, other people in job search. Get out of that house because it's toxic just to stay there. Have interviews. Even if they're just informational interviews, do that.

M. O'BRIEN: So getting out of the house and going to the corner saloon is not what you're thinking about. Getting out and doing something productive.

BAYER: Right. You should be working at least 40 hours a week on your job search. And so get out and do those informational interviews. Have meetings. Associate with positive people and do those sorts of things.

M. O'BRIEN: All right, one final thought here, because in thinking about the Ford workers, $30 an hour wages, good benefits.

BAYER: Right.

M. O'BRIEN: Difficult to replace that. A lot of this has to do with expectations. So a lot of these -- I think a lot of these workers are going to face some -- face the prospect of making much less. They need to have their expectations tuned to reality, don't they?

BAYER: I think so. The key is the market. What will the market bear? And it's not going to bear, for many of them, the same salaries that they've been earning.

M. O'BRIEN: Richard Bayer, thanks for being with us.

He's with a group called the Five O'Clock Club. That sounds like a drinking club to me, but it's not.

BAYER: It's not. It's a job search group.

M. O'BRIEN: It's a job search group. And they have a book which you can check out, a couple of them, actually. "Shortcut Your Job Search" and "Targeting A Great Career." Both are aimed at helping folks network, get back into the workforce. Just some of those tips we just discussed are in that book plus more.

Thanks for being with us, Richard.

BAYER: Absolutely.

M. O'BRIEN: All right.

BAYER: Glad to be here.

M. O'BRIEN: All right -- Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: Ahead this morning, the Sundance Film Festival is underway this week.

How did this quaint little film festival in Utah become a make or break event for the leading power brokers in Hollywood?

A look at that is ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.

We're back in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

M. O'BRIEN: Get the latest news every morning in your e-mail. Sign up for AMERICAN MORNING Quick News at cnn.com/am.

Still to come on the program, these two characters, Begala and Carville. They've got a book. You know it's going to be entertaining.

S. O'BRIEN: I'm going to guess, it's about politics.

M. O'BRIEN: Politics! How did you do that?

They say, it's called "Take It Back," and I think you can get what that title is all about. They want to figure out how to repair the Democratic Party. We'll ask them if it's reparable in just a little bit.

S. O'BRIEN: That's ahead.

We're back in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: You're watching AMERICAN MORNING with Soledad O'Brien and Miles O'Brien.

S. O'BRIEN: Good morning.

Welcome back, everybody.

Ahead this morning, we're talking about the Sundance Film Festival. The big question is how did a little teeny film festival started by Robert Redford become...

M. O'BRIEN: Ah, that might have had something to do with it, that Robert Redford did it.

S. O'BRIEN: ... that is one of the hints this morning -- become a place where the power brokers and all the celebrities must go every winter? We're going to take a closer look at that this morning.

M. O'BRIEN: And we'll also get some headlines in.

And why don't we do that with Carol Costello -- hello, Carol.

COSTELLO: I've got them right here.

Thank you, Miles.

And good morning to you.

M. O'BRIEN: Uh-oh.

I think you need to turn your mike on.

COSTELLO: (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

M. O'BRIEN: Yes.

She's going to talk about Palestinians voting for a 132-member legislative council today. And the polls close there in about three- and-a-half hours -- take it away, Carol.

COSTELLO: Thank you, Miles.

I appreciate that.

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