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American Morning

Dane Reeve Dies of Lung Cancer; Enron Trial; New Shows Explores Race Relations

Aired March 07, 2006 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back, everybody. We're following some breaking news this morning, the death of Dana Reeve. She died of lung cancer at the age of 44. She was working in the foundation that was made for her husband, working for possible cures for paralysis. The foundation, as we mentioned, was named for her late husband. And it was just last August that she announced she was diagnosed with lung cancer. She died on Monday at Memorial Sloan- Kettering Cancer Center right here in New York City.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Dana Reeve one of a growing number of women who never smoked and yet still gets lung cancer. Sanjay Gupta has been with us this morning talking about this. Relatively rare, and yet a problem to reckon with situation. Lung cancer and even though you're not smoking. we always associate lung cancer with smoking. I think maybe that's a lot of our perception of the disease is associated with that.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN SR. MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: And I think it's not an inaccurate perception, by any means. I think the vast majority of people who are victims of lung cancer are still smokers. But obviously in the case of Dana Reeve never smoked, and it seems a couple of things interesting here, women seem to have a higher chance of getting lung cancer than men do. About 20 percent of lung cancer women are nonsmokers as compared to 10 percent of men. We don't really know why that is.

I found a couple of things interesting. Obviously, smoking, again, the biggest risk factor, far and away. And I don't want to undermine that at all. But radon is an interesting gas that sometimes actually comes up from the soil. The American Cancer Society actually lists that as the second-leading risk factor for lung cancer, radon. There could also be secondhand smoke. It could be genetics as well.

In the case of Dana Reeve, she was diagnosed very young. Most people are actually diagnosed in later life. She was, I think, 44 when she was diagnosed. Only about three percent of people are diagnosed that young. And that usually, interestingly, is a poorer prognosis. It usually may mean that there's a genetic factor of some sort that stimulated this cancer.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: It seems just really aggressive in her case, because she said the tumor was shrinking. Kate Michelman, who we talked to not long also said that there was such great hope among all her friends, because the news was great. The tumor was shrinking. She was feeling great. And then this news is really baffling. GUPTA: Yes, you know, we just aren't very good at taking care of this cancer, Soledad. Sixty percent of people who have lung cancer die within the first year still, 85 percent within five years.

When it comes to good, you know, some things working better than other treatments, what we're still talking about here in terms of success is just a couple of months maybe of added survival. A couple of months can be a lot for somebody who is only given a few months to live. But still, it's just not very good at all when someone is diagnosed. It could be that we're diagnosing these lung cancers too late. We don't screen very well for lung cancer at all in this country. It could be...

O'BRIEN: Are they working on, like, a blood test? Because you know, you talked about a CAT scan, which is incredibly expensive. And the truth is your average American is not going to go out and consistently get a CAT scan. But what about a blood tests? I mean, or is that just sort of way in the future?

GUPTA: Maybe at some point there will be a marker. You know, you find out that lung cancer actually puts something in the blood that you can measure.

I don't know that we're there yet in actually in terms of coming up with a blood test. But there has to be a better screening for this. We're good at mammograms for breast cancer, colonoscopies for colon cancers, PSAs for prostate. We just have not been able to do that with lung cancer. And that might be the biggest problem of all.

S. O'BRIEN: They have a 13-year-old son, Will, and I know if there's any good news in this, he has a stepbrother and a stepsister. Apparently they're all very close. They're a little bit older. Their in their 20s, so that's some good news. I mean, he's got close family to sort of take care of him now that he is an orphan.

GUPTA: Sure.

S. O'BRIEN: Does that mean he has a greater risk because his mother had lung cancer and was not a smoker? Does that put him at greater risk for having the same kind of cancer?

GUPTA: It's a great question, and there might be a genetic component to Dana Reeve's lung cancer. There might be. We don't know if this was a result of genetics, if this was a result of secondhand smoke or radon. But if she had a genetic risk factor for the lung cancer, he might be at greater risk. And you know, it's a good question, because maybe he's someone that would get screenings. Maybe we need to identify a population of people who would benefit from screenings, and maybe Will Reeve would be one of those people.

O'BRIEN: Oh, god, what a brutal story, just a terrible story. Everybody was just so shocked when she said that she had -- now she had cancer, and just really pulling for her and the family after all they have been through. It is just terrible, terrible news. Sanjay, thank you for helping us out understanding it a little bit better. Appreciate it. (NEWSBREAK)

(WEATHER REPORT)

S. O'BRIEN: We've been telling you all morning about Dana Reeve, who died at the age of 44 at lung cancer. Back in May, seven months after her husband Christopher Reeve died and three months before she announced to the world that in fact she had been diagnosed with lung cancer, we had a chance to sit down and talk, and we covered a lot of ground. But primarily we talked about stem cell research. Her husband's foundation focusing on that as a potential cure for paralysis, and a new book she had out in order to raise some awareness. Here's a little bit of that interview.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

S. O'BRIEN: It's been seven months since Christopher Reeve passed away. And his widow, Dana, is now fighting for stem cell research as a potential cure for paralysis. Her new project, though, was inspired by her husband's life, and it's a book called "Dewey Do- It Helps Owlie Fly Again."

Dana Reeve joins us this morning. Nice to see you. It's a book for children really.

DANA REEVE, CHRISTOPHER REEVE'S WIDOW: It is a children's book.

S. O'BRIEN: And it's a story of an injured little owl who gets a little help from his friends.

REEVE: Yes, gets help from his friends, and he's able to fly again. It's not the same as before, but he's able to fly again, and I really think that's really a symbol of what Chris stood for as well.

S. O'BRIEN: Truly a metaphor. He was involved with the project, because of course it takes a long time.

REEVE: Yes, he was. He was. The writers came to him first, and said we have this thing, and we want to raise money for your foundation, and he said, let's go. And then when we started looking at the book more closely, I worked with the writers after Chris died, to change the ending a little bit. So that instead -- originally, Owlie got completely cured and flew off into the jungle.

S. O'BRIEN: Good, but unrealistic.

REEVE: Well, and also just that really what Chris stood for was the fact that he could fly with help, and support and community, and he really could fly. It just wasn't the normal definition of flying.

S. O'BRIEN: All about changing your definitions.

REEVE: Absolutely.

S. O'BRIEN: How have the last seven months been? I mean, you have a child who is at that tricky 12-year-old age. REEVE: Yes, it's been tumultuous. It's been pretty busy. I've been doing a lot of work for the foundation. We have a lot of new fund-raising initiatives, and you know, I have moments of, you know, that it's hard.

S. O'BRIEN: Craziness and dizziness.

REEVE: Yes.

S. O'BRIEN: You've taken up your singing career again...

REEVE: Yes.

S. O'BRIEN: ... after a long time.

(CROSSTALK)

S. O'BRIEN: And you're also dealing with the stem cell research issue...

REEVE: Yes.

S. O'BRIEN: ... which is before Congress, which voted affirmatively. It looks like President Bush, though, would veto it if it goes through. What's the message you'd like to send to him, the president that is?

REEVE: Well, we're pretty confident it will go through the Senate. And I think that really, that he needs to listen to what the people are saying and what Congress is saying, that this should go through.

S. O'BRIEN: What's the message you hope this book sends? I mean, obviously the book is for kids, but it's the parents that read the book to the kids.

REEVE: It is. I mean, the message is really about getting to children while they're young, to say, you know, we're all part of a community. We need to help one another. You can be a part of helping. You can be part of a cure, and really it's very uplifting, and it's funny and it's a great book.

S. O'BRIEN: It's very, very cute. I read it to my kids last night. It's nice.

I noticed the dog tag, and it's -- for people who can't really see it, it's a Superman symbol.

REEVE: Superman symbol, and these are -- it says, "go forward," which is sort of our new rallying cry, and it's really sort of Chris's message, go forward. He worked so hard, and his work was so important that we really need to go forward.

S. O'BRIEN: You know that now that people have seen it on TV and that very tight shot of your neck, everyone's going to want one. Are you selling them? REEVE: Yes, they are absolutely on our Web site, christopherreeve.org, and you can order them, and the proceeds go to the foundation, and Warner Brothers has been so nice to give us this logo for a year.

S. O'BRIEN: Fantastic.

Congratulations on all of the things that you're working on and accomplishing.

REEVE: Thank you very much.

S. O'BRIEN: We'll come back for the next in the series, because I know it's a continuing series.

REEVE: Yes, we do it as a series.

S. O'BRIEN: Terrific. Thanks, Dana

(END VIDEOTAPE)

S. O'BRIEN: Dana Reeve dead at the age of 44. But as you heard in that interview, that was done three months before she announced to the world that she had been diagnosed with lung cancer, and seven months after the death of her husband Christopher Reeve. Go forward. Move on. And as she talked about in the interview surrounded by help and support, and one can only hope that's what's going to carry the couple's 13-year-old son, Will, through the next months and difficult years that certainly lie ahead.

We've got a short break. We're going to be back in just a moment. Stay with us. You're watching AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

S. O'BRIEN: Welcome back, everybody. We've been reporting some sad news this morning. Dana Reeve, who you see here in a picture with her 13-year-old son, Will, a woman who was a singer and an actress, and who married Christopher Reeve, and who then later became in the wake of his accident a real champion for fund-raising in medical research, is dead. She died of lung cancer even just months after saying that the tumor was shrinking and she was feeling much better to survive. She died late Monday at Memorial Sloan-Kettering Medical Center right here in New York City.

We're going to continue to update this story for you, and this very sad news. Dana Reeve was just 44 years old -- Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: Big day in Houston at a very big trial. We're talking, of course, about the Enron trial. The former Enron numbers man, Andy Fastow, the man who was kind of the architect of all of those off-the-book partnerships, which ultimately led to the house of card that was Enron crumbling in what was at the time the largest bankruptcy in U.S. history.

Well, he's cut a deal with prosecutors, and he is testifying at the trial of his former bosses, ex-CEO Jeff Skilling, and of course the company founder, Ken Lay.

Mimi Swartz of the "Texas Monthly Magazine" wrote "Power failure: The Inside the story Of the Collapse of Enron," with the company's now-famous whistle-blower Sherron Watkins. She joins us now from the courthouse in Houston.

Mimi, I imagine most everybody in Houston will be paying attention today to this. Will it live up to its advanced billing?

MIMI SWARTZ, "TEXAS MONTHLY": I think it has to live up to its advanced billing just because I think Fastow has been perfectly managed, unlike Lay, unlike Skilling. No one has heard from him since basically one brief meeting with some reporters many years ago. So I think everybody is waiting to her what he'll say.

M. O'BRIEN: In advance, we reported Fastow as being sort of the cornerstone of the prosecution case. Is that overstating it?

SWARTZ: I think that's overstating it. I don't think he's the cornerstone of the prosecution's case. I think the prosecution has done pretty well in showing a pattern of fraud throughout the company. I think the defense would love for Fastow to be the cornerstone of the case. But I just don't think that's true.

M. O'BRIEN: It's bigger than Andy Fastow then?

SWARTZ: It's bigger than Andy Fastow. I think the last few witnesses, particularly Dave Delaney and Paula Reichert (ph) have shown that, that there were problems in many divisions of the company that Fastow was not directly involved.

M. O'BRIEN: Andy Fastow, 28 years old, whiz kid, financial genius, but one little detail, a crook, right?

SWARTZ: Well, you could certainly make the case that he was a crook. I think his case is much more straightforward than Skilling or Lay's.

What I think is interesting about Fastow is that when he came to the company, he was such a whiz kid, and a lot of the evidence -- a lot of his personality was obvious even then.

One of my favorite stories is that at one point when he joined the company, they had these cubicles, and they were freshly painted. Everything was newly minted, and it was Andy who had a toy called slime that he used to throw against the wall. And every mother knows you don't want your kid to have slime because it stains the walls. And I always thought it was indicative of Andy that he went ahead and slimed everything early on.

M. O'BRIEN: Symbolic in every way, I guess.

SWARTZ: Symbolic in every way.

M. O'BRIEN: Let's talk -- he and his wife walked away with a lot of money through this whole deal, personally, through these shadow corporations, these partnerships that were set up, and that is going to be what the defense will be latching on to here, that they made a lot of money, and that they -- there's not a lot of credibility there. What do you think? Will that stick? Will they be able to slime Andy Fastow?

M. O'BRIEN: Well, the defense be able to?

SWARTZ: Yes.

M. O'BRIEN: I think so. I mean he -- you know, what he did was nothing more glamorous than stealing from the company.

Again, I think what Skilling did is -- what Skilling is accused of and what Lay is accused of, there's a lot more room for argument. With Fastow, I think you have proof time and again that what he did was against the law.

And what was interesting to me was when Fastow first joined the company, you didn't see any evidence of wrongdoing. And suddenly, his antics start in about '97. And '97 is when Rich Kinder left the company. And Kinder was really the break on all of the bad behavior. Once he was gone, I think that was when the company started its slide. So since 1997 -- uh huh?

M. O'BRIEN: I assume you secured yourself a good seat, right?

SWARTZ Excuse me?

M. O'BRIEN: Do you have a good seat?

SWARTZ: Do I have what?

M. O'BRIEN: Do you have a good seat to view things?

SWARTZ: Do I have a good seat? Yes, I do.

M. O'BRIEN: OK, just wanted to make sure. Mimi Swartz...

SWARTZ: Sorry.

M. O'BRIEN: ... with "Texas Monthly."

SWARTZ: Thank you.

M. O'BRIEN: It's kind of a noisy street corner there in Houston. Thank you very much for being with us.

S. O'BRIEN: Just had a good (INAUDIBLE) bad audio this morning.

M. O'BRIEN: Bad audio, good seat. She'll have good audio during the proceedings today.

S. O'BRIEN: She'll be right in the front row, which is where you want to be.

Ahead on AMERICAN MORNING, a pretty daring premise for a reality show. Two families, one black, one white. They under go makeovers. I mean, we're talking dramatic makeovers. The black ones become white, the white ones become black. Actor and rapper Ice Cube is one of the executive producers of the show. He's going to join us live in studio to talk about why they did it and how it went.

We're back in a moment'

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

S. O'BRIEN: In "A.M. Pop" this morning, a new documentary series explores some unchartered territory. Two families, through the magic of makeup, literally change the color of their skin to experience how the other race lives. It's called "Black, White."

And joining us this morning to talk about, executive producers R.J. Cutler and Ice Cube.

Nice to see you guys. Thanks for talking about it. Why did you want to do this?

R.J. CUTLER, EXEC. PRODUCER, "BLACK, WHITE": Well, we had the opportunity to do it. FX, actually, the network where we're premiering tomorrow night, approached me with the idea over two years ago, asking the question if I was interested in exploring race as a subject and also if I thought it could be done, a show that had transformations...

S. O'BRIEN: Nobody does it well. Honestly...

CUTLER: We've never seen anything like this.

S. O'BRIEN: ... a biracial woman in this world, no -- I don't think anybody writes about it well, does it well, talks about it well, has a frank discussion. This is probably the closest thing you get.

You have the black family, the Sparks family; Brian, Renee and Nick. And you got the white family, Wurgels...

CUTLER: Wurgels.

S. O'BRIEN: Wurgels. I keep mangling their name. Bruno and Carmen and Rose. And at one point, we see that Mr. Sparks, the black guy playing the white guy, learns sort of in a harsh way that the neighborhood comes down when black people move in. I mean, one of the guys basically says it to his face. What do you think the black family got out of all this?

ICE CUBE, EXEC. PRODUCER, "BLACK, WHITE": You know, just a little bit of -- I wouldn't say vindication is the word. But just a little bit of, you know, finally somebody gets to see the world how we see it just for a second, for a split second. You know, make-up can't make you black, of course, but you do get a chance to get a taste. And I think that's kind of really what the Sparks really got out of it, the fact that America would get a taste of what it's like.

S. O'BRIEN: And the Wurgel family -- Carmen, I think in particular was a little bit out of it, in the sense that she really had no clue kind of how the other half lives.

CUTLER: You know, it's interesting, because for all the family members, this is a really intense, stressful experience.

S. O'BRIEN: Oh, I bet.

CUTLER: And you know, and putting on these other identities and then going out in the world and then dealing with the other family -- family of another race at the end of the day outside of your makeup.

S. O'BRIEN: But there's a point like...

CUTLER: All sorts of stuff comes up.

S. O'BRIEN: Carmen says -- and beautiful poetry reading. It's going great, it's really a nice experience. The white girl as a black girl has all these friends. And at the end Carmen, the mom, the white mom, says -- calls her a beautiful black creature. Says the word beautiful black creature.

And all -- I mean, you literally see the thing dissolve. Everybody is pissed off and they walk off. And I thought, you know what, if my mother, who's black, had said beautiful black creature, no one would have cared. I mean, I don't think you'd have the same reaction. So isn't that kind of unfair to Carmen, who sort of steps in a lot, I think, during the show? But, I mean...

CUTLER: Yes, it may be -- you know, it's interesting. That's right. There are two standards. And language is something that people don't really understand. And you know, there's a lot of defensiveness, so intent sometimes get less -- all of these things add up and you start to see in the show how much that they're -- all the layers of complications. So how are we going to get through that? Well, we have to talk more to each other. We have to understand more about language, about intent, where we're coming from.

S. O'BRIEN: Rose is my favorite person in the world. Rose is the symbol of -- I think she's a symbol of the future, I hope. She is the white daughter who plays a black girl and, I mean, becomes a black girl through makeup. And she just -- you know, you see someone who really tries to understand every side.

CUBE: Yes, she jumps in with both feet. She definitely jumps in with both feet, trying to understand and, you know, trying to go with the project and not really, you know, holding herself back by her own limitations of her own walls in her mind, but just kind of going with it. And, you know, we was lucky to have someone like that.

S. O'BRIEN: Oh, yes, she was terrific. Well, as you said, premieres tomorrow.

CUTLER: It does, on FX, tomorrow night.

S. O'BRIEN: It is excellent. I tell you, Miles and I have been talking about it. He was saying that it sparks sort of debates about race in his family. In my family, too. So I hope that that happens across the nation. Premiering Wednesday 10:00 p.m. on FX.

R.J. Cutler, Ice Cube, thanks for talking with us. We certainly appreciate it.

CUTLER: Thank you.

S. O'BRIEN: Short break. We're back in just a moment.

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