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Ports Deal Dead; Rumsfeld Doubts Civil War Will Happen in Iraq; Men's Rights And Child Support; Life With Dementia

Aired March 10, 2006 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: We begin with a CNN "Security Watch" and a political lifeline thrown to President Bush. Dubai Ports World steps out of that deal to manage six key U.S. ports, but there may be no escape from the Republican infighting that it kicked up.
AMERICAN MORNING'S Bob Franken live in Washington this morning.

Bob, the deal has got the president into a sticky situation. Is he out of it?

BOB FRANKEN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, we'll see. The Dubai Ports World at least is trying to look like it is stepping out of the situation, but talk about careful wording, Miles, they are talking about transferring to a U.S. entity. Those are precise quotes from Dubai Ports World.

What does that mean? It doesn't necessarily mean a sale. What is a U.S. entity? Could it be one that continues to have some connection to Dubai Ports World? That's not clear.

What about a United States company? Would one be willing to buy the operations that would control U.S. ports? Six of them, anyway. There's an awful lot of hassle involved with that. We've already found that out.

And would they be willing to pay a price that would be acceptable to Dubai Ports World?

In other words this, is a long way from being consummated; however, it did, for the immediate moment, anyway, get the White House out of a big, big jam because the president was looking to have his first veto battle with Congress, a battle that it looked like he was going to lose -- Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: Bob, so now you've got the Republicans fighting on a bread and butter issue, which is war on terror, security. Does that continue?

FRANKEN: Well, the Republicans who are running for Congress this year put quite a bit of distance between themselves and the Republican president. What is really interesting here is that every poll that comes out -- and there's a new one today from The Associated Press -- show -- all the poll shows that the president is losing ground on his issue, his conduct on the war on terror.

So, this is one that has had a real debilitating effect on this president. The Democrats are very aware of it, so they are not going to let this be forgotten.

M. O'BRIEN: Bob Franken at our bureau in Washington.

Thank you very much.

Follow me on this one. "TIME" magazine reporting that one of the company's under consideration as a U.S. partner for Dubai Ports World is Kellogg, Brown and Root. Now, KBR is a subsidiary of Halliburton, which, of course, is the company formerly headed by the vice president, Dick Cheney.

KBR is already partnered with a company called ISS. And it provides security to U.S. Navy ships at ports in the Middle East.

Now, here's the kicker. ISS is a company that is owned by the government of the United Arab Emirates. It all comes right back to UAE.

Stay with CNN day and night for the most reliable news about your security -- Soledad.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: To Iraq now.

The last 24 hours have been deadly in Iraq. Nine people killed in several attacks, and police have found the bodies of nine more people. Eight of them killed when a suicide truck bomber hit an Iraqi police and military checkpoint in Falluja. And the other death came on the outskirts of Baghdad. All the bodies that were found by police had been shot.

Much of the violence, in fact, in the last two weeks was sparked by the bombing of a Shiite shrine in Samarra, bringing the country really to the brink of a civil war. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld was asked about the possibility of civil war in an appearance before Congress on Thursday.

What did he respond? Well, let's get right to CNN Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr.

Hey, Barbara. Good morning.

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you, Soledad.

Well, that hearing might have been a bit of a turning point. Top commanders making it publicly clear for the first time they now consider sectarian violence part of the permanent landscape in Iraq, at least for now, along with the insurgency.

So how to deal with all of that? Secretary Rumsfeld asked what would happen if civil war broke out, who would deal with it? He said it would not be U.S. troops.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD RUMSFELD, SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: The plan is to prevent a civil war, and to the extent one were to occur, to have the -- from a security standpoint, have the Iraqi security forces deal with it to the extent they are able to.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STARR: Soledad, Rumsfeld making it clear that the 132,000 U.S. troops in Iraq right now, though he wasn't specific, he's making it pretty clear by his statements he does not expect them to get involved if a civil war were to break out. The U.S. strategy, however, remains the same: get those Iraqi forces trained up, get a security structure in place, and hope that a civil war does not break out -- Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: OK. So, realistically, then, are those Iraqi troops that they are trying to bring up to speed prepared and able to deal with a civil war should one break out?

STARR: If there was civil war -- and that, of course, means basically a break down of society, a breakdown of security structures, who would be available to deal with it? Consider this, Iraq is a country of, you know, many, many millions of people, but the security force looks like this: about 227,000 overall Iraqi security forces raided, trained and equipped, about 106,000 army, about 83,000 or so police forces.

It is those police forces, the 83,000, that remain the greatest concern. There is ongoing controversy right now about the extent to which they are more loyal to the Shia militia groups, to those who are involved in some of the sectarian violence, rather than to any central government in Iraq. So, the loyalty, the capability of these forces remains a question down the road -- Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: Barbara Starr at the Pentagon for us this morning.

Barbara, thanks.

Other stories making news this morning we want to get to. Carol has got those in the newsroom.

Hey, Carol.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning.

Good morning to all of you.

Remembering the victims of the Atlanta courthouse shooting. A memorial service now beginning at the Fulton County Courthouse. One year ago tomorrow, Brian Nichols was accused of overpowering a deputy and starting a shooting rampage. The portraits of the three victims will be unveiled.

Nichols is behind bars today. He'll be tried for murder in October in the same courthouse. He faces the death penalty.

President Bush going into a shark tank. Well, not really. He's just facing a room full of reporters. The president set to address a newspaper conference in Washington later this hour. And then he'll open himself up to Q&A. It could be interesting. CNN will update you as it happens.

The judge in that al Qaeda trial is warning prosecutors they are on shaky legal ground. The issue with Zacarias Moussaoui, legally obligated to tell investigators what he knew about 9/11 when he was arrested the month before the attack.

Is Neverland nevermore? The state of California ordering employees not to show up for work at the ranch. It seems Michael Jackson hasn't been paying his bills. He faces fines of nearly $170,000 for not paying employees and for not renewing their insurance.

And they are hypnotic. They're hypnotic. They're like a narcotic. You just can't get enough of them.

That's why we're showing you these pictures, because they are so darn nauseatingly cute. This fuzzy group of fur balls live in a sort of panda kindergarten in China where they learn to play and play and play some more.

OK, say it with me, ah. Ah. Look at the little panda bear.

M. O'BRIEN: You are just panda nutty.

S. O'BRIEN: She's a panda freak.

COSTELLO: No, I'm really not. But there are certain people here who are.

M. O'BRIEN: We want to take care -- oh, come on, that is cute. That will turn you over to the pro-panda camp, won't it?

COSTELLO: You know, when you go see them in the zoo, though, they don't do that. They just sleep and eat. That's it.

M. O'BRIEN: Well, just watch CNN. You'll see all the highlights.

COSTELLO: Cool idea.

M. O'BRIEN: All right.

Lots of storm damage. At least two dead in the South today. Arkansas got the worst of it. A tornado ripping through Morton. Damage and power out in Missouri, Mississippi and Tennessee, too.

One man died in Arkansas. Lightning struck his house, set it on fire.

A UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE dead in Tennessee. A car wreck in heavy rain.

And check out this camera phone video from Sacramento. That is a funnel cloud amid some bad weather there. And of course we all know the difference -- faithful viewers of AMERICAN MORNING know the difference between a funnel cloud and a tornado, don't we?

S. O'BRIEN: That's right. Why, a funnel cloud becomes a tornado when it hits the ground, Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: There you go. Soledad, once again, 100 percent correct.

Chad Myers is beaming now because he knows we've been listening to him all this time.

S. O'BRIEN: Exactly. I've been listening. We learn from you, Chad.

M. O'BRIEN: We learn from you. You are our hero.

(WEATHER REPORT)

S. O'BRIEN: Thank you, Chad.

MYERS: You bet.

S. O'BRIEN: Did you hear about the story near Detroit? A really bizarre incident involving two pregnant women. The women were in their SUV when suddenly a guy in another SUV behind them started to ram their vehicle.

This is a police dash cam video of the man's SUV. See how the wheels are smoking? That's because of the force of the car trying to hit the women's car.

Anyway, the police were able to prevent him from actually pushing the women into oncoming traffic, which apparently is what he was trying to do. Listen to the 911 call. It's utterly frightening.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OPERATOR: What is going on?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He's moving our car. Now he's blowing kisses at us.

OPERATOR: Now he's what?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He's blowing kisses at us.

OPERATOR: Yes, he's pushing their car.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, my God! Oh, my God!

OPERATOR: Ma'am, what's going on?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He's pushing our car!

OPERATOR: OK, I understand. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're both pregnant!

OPERATOR: Oh, my God.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What do we do? What do we do?

OPERATOR: Stay in the car. How hard is he pushing you? Is he moving you?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Very hard.

OPERATOR: OK. He's moving you?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

OPERATOR: OK. You guys can't drive away from him?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Stop!

OPERATOR: OK, I'm getting help as fast as I can, ma'am.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, my God.

OPERATOR: OK, I understand. He's still pushing you?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nicole, I can't hear.

OPERATOR: Tell Nicole the police are there.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The police are here. The police are here. They're here! They're here!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

S. O'BRIEN: Oh, my god. How brutal. Well, police were there, and they arrested 50-year-old Earl Boyd.

There's his mug shot. They charged him with two counts of assault with a motor vehicle. The women had been on their way to a baby fair when that horrifying incident occurred. Oh.

M. O'BRIEN: Horrifying, indeed.

As we speak, a NASA spacecraft is homing in on Mars. Will it live to tell a story to eager scientists? The odds are actually against it. We'll explain.

S. O'BRIEN: Also this morning, we're talking about dealing with dementia. We'll show you a program that helps caregivers experience what dementia patients are going through.

M. O'BRIEN: And Roe versus Wade for men? It's the tale of a guy who is fighting to get out of paying for a child he didn't want. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) S. O'BRIEN: We first told you about this story on Thursday. It's a lawsuit filed for men's rights, a so called Roe v. Wade for men, if you will. At issue is a Michigan man who has been paying child support for his former girlfriend's daughter. He thinks he shouldn't have to.

More on this, this morning -- Kathy Rodgers, the president of a women's rights advocacy group, Legal Momentum, and Mel Feit, whose National Center for Men is behind the lawsuit.

Thanks to both of you for joining us. We certainly appreciate it.

MEL FEIT, NATIONAL CENTER FOR MEN: Thank you.

KATHY RODGERS, PRESIDENT, LEGAL MOMENTUM: Good to be here.

S. O'BRIEN: Mel, I'm going to have you start. Give me the nuts and bolts background on this case.

FEIT: We call it Roe versus Wade for men because what we want for Matt Dubay (ph) and for all men is what women have had since Roe versus Wade, and that is the right to have intimacy in your life without giving up reproductive choice.

S. O'BRIEN: Well, before we get into the debate over it, I want to talk about -- let's talk about your client.

FEIT: Matt Dubay ...

S. O'BRIEN: Twenty-five years old.

FEIT: ... had a relationship with a young woman.

S. O'BRIEN: Had sex with her and had a baby.

FEIT: Yes. And he's told her before and he says that he did not want to be a father. She knew he did not want to be a father. And she represented to him that she had a disease and could therefore not get pregnant. But there is a pregnancy.

And Matt said, "She knew before I had sex that I did not want to be a dad. It's not now fair to force me to be a father."

S. O'BRIEN: So he doesn't want to pay the $500 a month child support.

FEIT: Well, he doesn't want to be a father. But the issue for us is that as - he should have had what I think women have, is the right to have intimacy without being forced to parent. And I think it must be nice to be a woman and to know that if there's a failure of contraception, no one will be able to take control of the most important decisions in your life. You will have your reproductive rights no matter what, as a man I would like to have the same right.

S. O'BRIEN: So it's not about the money, you're saying. It's about...

FEIT: Well, the money -- the money is part of it because for the next 25 years, presumably, Matt will be reminded with every paycheck that he had no right to control the most fundamental decisions which affect any person.

S. O'BRIEN: Overstating it to call it Roe v. Wade for men, do you think, Kathy?

RODGERS: Oh, I do completely, because the difference here is that, you know, a woman makes these decisions and they impact her for the rest of her life. Whatever decision she makes. And she's going to have responsibility for that child.

It's entirely different when you have the government saying to you, I'm not allowed to have an abortion, I'm not allowed to make my own choices. Here we have two people who are having consensual sex, and there's no perfect solution to this.

And I think part of the issue is timing, because a man, if he really doesn't want to have a child with that woman, well, maybe he doesn't need to have sex with her, or he can use a condom. Or he can have a vasectomy.

FEIT: Well, let's be clear about this. The government is forcing Matt Dubay to be a father. And I don't agree it was consensual sex. Now, that's an important point.

I don't think there was consensual sex, because Matt had sex with this woman under the terms that he would not be forced to be a father. He consented to that. He did not consent to this. He did not consent to this.

S. O'BRIEN: And with all due respect, I'll tell you, this has a lot of the ring of the, "Don't worry, baby, you can't get pregnant," men have said to women for time in memoriam.

FEIT: And you know what? That's wrong. I don't want to defend any man who would lie to a man. Do you want to defend a woman who would like to a man and say, "Don't worry, honey..."

S. O'BRIEN: Oh gosh. I'm not a lawyer. I'm not in the business of defending anybody.

FEIT: Well, I don't think it's right.

S. O'BRIEN: But I'll say this to you -- but I'll say this to you, there are so many people out there who would say, 25 years old, you don't want to have a baby, don't have sex. That's kind of the best way to protect yourself.

FEIT: And you know what? And here's the point, a generation ago, when lawyers argued against Roe versus Wade and they argued against reproductive choice for women, you know what they said? They said women have the right not to have a baby by not having sex. And feminists fought against that argument and they discredited that argument.

Why do they now turn around and use it against men when we want exactly the same rights that women have?

S. O'BRIEN: Is there a point, though, that Matt here, really has no voice in what happens to this baby? He said he wants to put the baby up for adoption. Well, you know, he doesn't have a say. She gets to decide.

He could have said, gee, I prefer not to be a father, why don't you have an abortion? You know what? He didn't have a say. This child is his child, and yet he really lacks a voice in what is going to happen to the baby.

RODGERS: There isn't a solution here that allows Matt and the girlfriend to have everything that they want. There is no perfect solution.

Once the baby is born, there's a new element, which is the welfare of the child. And that's really how the government looks at it, which is that the father has to pay something to the support of the mother.

She will be doing much more. She will be paying much more. She will be taking care of that child 24/7. He's not being asked to change his life.

FEIT: That's her choice. That's her choice.

RODGERS: He's not even being asked to change a diaper.

FEIT: That's her -- no, no, he's being -- well, you pay the child support for him and see what...

RODGERS: Don't interrupt. He made a choice when he had sex with that woman. And he's got the timing wrong. He could have made his decisions then. He had total control, and to rely on somebody else, if that was that important to him, that was his mistake.

S. O'BRIEN: Do you think...

FEIT: Can I suggest a solution here? Because Kathy said there's no perfect solution. I think there's a solution that's in the best interest of the child and that will give men and women equal choice. And that is adoption. I think if a woman...

S. O'BRIEN: So you think adopting this baby, taking her from her natural mother is the best -- is the best choice for the child?

FEIT: Well, you know what? Do you think it's a good choice to force a person to be responsible as a parent if he chooses not to be? I don't think that's a good thing either.

S. O'BRIEN: That's -- so sending the baby off to adoptive parents...

FEIT: Well, that's what's in the best interest of the child.

S. O'BRIEN: ... when the mother would like to keep the baby is a better choice than having...

FEIT: Yes.

S. O'BRIEN: ... the natural father paying $500 a month?

FEIT: Forcing someone to be a father, a parent, against his will, is not a good answer. Is not a good answer.

S. O'BRIEN: Well, a parent, versus someone who is financially paying, right? I mean, he's not parenting, he's paying.

FEIT: He's paying a lot of money, and he will be reminded for every week for the next 25 years that he had no say and no voice and no choice. His choice was to not be a parent.

S. O'BRIEN: I think that this -- this very case is really -- I mean, you can tell by this debate it's opening the door of really an issue about, you know, rights, parental rights on both sides.

I thank you both for coming in, because clearly we could continue this discussion for a long time.

Thank you very much.

FEIT: Thank you.

S. O'BRIEN: Mel Feit, the executive director of the National Center for Men, Kathy Rodgers, the president of the women's rights advocacy group Legal Momentum -- Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: Coming up in the program, your morning "House Call." Life with dementia, what's it like for people who suffer from this disease? Carol Lin will show us a program that allows others to see the world through their eyes.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

M. O'BRIEN: In this morning's "House Call," dealing with dementia. It is a disease which might be hardest on the caregivers. And in many cases, it sadly leads to elder abuse. Now there is a way, a novel one, to understand what it is like to suffer from the disease and get a little more empathy.

CNN's Carol Lin with that.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CAROL LIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): The police would come day and night responding to calls about attackers armed with knives or guns. But there were no attackers at Lois Ruhnke house, only those who existed in her elderly mother's deluded mind. LOIS RUHNKE, DAUGHTER OF DEMENTIA PATIENT: She would hear somebody in the house and she would imagine them doing terrible things. Or at one point -- I think this broke my heart -- she felt that there was a cage I was building to put her in.

LIN: The delusions tormenting Lois' 78-year-old mother were symptoms of dementia. Her brain is dying, leaving her in a sometimes violent or blank child-like state. It's more than most families can deal with, much less understand.

P.K. BEVILLE, SECOND WIND DREAMS: When we know that for our elders who have this terrible disease, 24/7, even we now know in their dreams.

LIN: P.K. Beville is a psychologist and a founder of a senior citizen advocate group, Second Wind Dreams. She tells nursing homes and families around the country that to understand the dementia patient, you have to experience what they see, feel and hear.

She invited me to take what she calls her virtual dementia tour, something she developed after working with dementia and Alzheimer's patients for 20 years.

BEVILLE: I need to put a few of these in each one of your shoes.

LIN: The dried corn poured in my shoes and the gloves with fingers taped together are supposed to mimic the physical pains of arthritis and the limits of age. The goggles, a senior's declining vision. The headphones, a cacophony that often fills a demented person's mind.

With all this, I am given a few simple tasks to accomplish.

(on camera): All right. Am I supposed to (INAUDIBLE)? It's hard to see. That one?

(voice over): I was so distracted by the noise in my head I started to feel anxious.

(on camera): I have a hard time picking things up. Oops. Oh.

BEVILLE: Well, can you imagine what it's like for a family member to have a mama or a daddy that has been so active and so vital in this kind of state and just getting so frustrated that they can't get their mom or dad back?

LIN (voice over): Beville has taken 7,000 caregivers through this exercise, which is now being used in many nursing homes, hospitals and medical schools.

Lois Ruhnke also took the tour. She ended up having to put her mother in a home for dementia patients. But now she understand how to coax and encourage her mother through tasks.

RUHNKE: It makes me realize what a fighter my mom is, because she always struggled to maintain her independence. And when you go through the dementia tour, you come to realize how difficult that really is.

LIN: For those who care for the elderly, this virtual tour gives them greater understanding. For the dementia patient, the prospect of better and more sympathetic care.

Carol Lin, CNN, Atlanta.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

M. O'BRIEN: And for a more comprehensive look at dementia, join Carol for the entire virtual tour and what that was like through the eyes of someone with dementia. To do that, go to Pipeline -- CNN.com/pipeline.

Coming up on our program, some kids try to play an online prank and they end up nabbing a suspected sex offender instead.

Plus, a NASA spacecraft homing in on the Red Planet today, hoping to find more evidence of water. But first it's got some big hurdles to clear.

We'll explain ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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