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Nancy Grace
Darryl Littlejohn Arraigned for Murder of Imette St. Guillen; Florida Police Investigate Claims on Serial Killer; Missing Pennsylvania Woman Reunited with Family; Wife and Daughters of Tennessee Minister Found
Aired March 23, 2006 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Tonight, breaking news out of a New York courtroom. The prime suspect in the brutal assault and murder of 24-year- old New York grad student Imette St. Guillen arraigned in open court today after a grand jury indicts the local bar bouncer on charges of murder one. Tonight, we have that indictment here in the studio. Let`s take a look. What clues do the indictment reveal?
And tonight, breaking news out of Tennessee. A highly-respected church pastor is found dead in his bedroom, his wife, three little girls missing. We may have the correct car make and model. Could that be a lead in the case?
Good evening, everybody. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us tonight. Tonight, breaking news out of Tennessee, a church pastor, of all people, found dead, his wife and daughters missing. We go live to Tennessee for the latest.
But first tonight, suspect one in the assault and murder of 24-year- old New York grad student Imette St. Guillen has a date with Lady Justice in open court, Darryl Littlejohn slapped with an indictment on murder one.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RAY KELLY, NEW YORK CITY POLICE COMMISSIONER: Imette was last seen leaving The Falls bar with Darryl Littlejohn, according to witnesses interviewed by our detectives.
KEVIN O`DONNELL, LITTLEJOHN`S ATTORNEY: He walked her out of the bar at the end of the night. He`s not hiding from that.
KELLY: The cell phone used exclusively by Littlejohn had been in close proximity to where her body was found.
O`DONNELL: That`s not evidence. It`s information. It`s not evidence until a judge says it`s evidence.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Red polyester rug fibers, along with brown mink hair from a jacket in his residence, were consistent with rug fibers that were found on the tapes used on Imette`s head.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: After the grand jury heard all of the evidence in this case, they returned a three-count indictment charging Darryl Littlejohn with two counts of murder in the second degree and one count of murder in the first degree.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Finally, Lady Justice, through a secret grand jury, has spoken, Darryl Littlejohn now facing trial on murder charges, murder one and murder two, murder one carrying a possible life without parole in the state of New York. A 24-year-old grad student goes missing, her body found thrown to the side of a desolate highway, tortured, raped, murdered, and partially bound in masking tape like a mummy.
Let`s go to Nancie Katz, courts reporter "New York Daily News." Nancie, welcome back. You were in court today for that open court arraignment. What happened?
NANCIE KATZ, "NEW YORK DAILY NEWS": Well, it was a packed -- (INAUDIBLE) call a full-court press. The courtroom was packed. The -- everyone was waiting for the family to file in. Imette`s mother and her sister were there with other family and friends. And Mr. Littlejohn walked in, shackled behind -- his ankles and his wrists shackled behind in a gray sweatshirt. He didn`t look at them. He sat down and stared straight ahead. The family -- Alejandra, the sister, when she saw him, put her hand to her head and seemed to wipe tears. And the family seemed to be riveted on him for a minute, until the proceedings began -- even as they began, actually.
And the prosecutor then announced the indictment, and Mr. Littlejohn was asked whether he was going to -- was he pleading -- how does he plead? And his lawyer, Mr. O`Donnell, said, Not guilty. And from there, it was more sort of perfunctory questions about what Mr. Taub was going to hand over to Mr. O`Donnell. And it came out that Mr. O`Donnell...
GRACE: Right.
KATZ: ... had sent a letter to the 75th precinct saying he was representing other witnesses. But basically, it was very quick. It was 15 minutes. And it was packed with police. It was packed with -- you know, a full court, full media...
GRACE: Right. You know...
KATZ: ... with court officers...
GRACE: ... it`s interesting to me that Darryl Littlejohn couldn`t even stand up and give an answer in court. He didn`t even have the backbone to stand up and say, Not guilty. He never met the eyes of Imette St. Guillen`s family, who had flown into New York for this very moment. Our sources tell us the family was in tears throughout the entire proceeding, especially when Darryl Littlejohn walked into that courtroom.
If you take a look at Imette St. Guillen`s sister, she is the spitting image of the dead girl. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALEJANDRA ST. GUILLEN, IMETTE`S SISTER: Imette was a good person, a kind person. Her heart was full of love, a love she willingly shared with her friends and family. She had a passion for life and her search (ph) for seeing the world and learning new things. With Imette`s death, the world lost something very special far too soon.
New York was Imette`s home. She loved the city and its people, and you have honored her memory with your outpourings of love and support for her and for our family. Our friends and neighbors in Boston have been extraordinary. You`ve sat by our side, cried with us, cooked for us, and offered us your unending support. We will continue to need you in the weeks and months and years ahead, and we know that you will be there for us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: There you see the sister of Imette St. Guillen. She and the family drove all the way from Boston today to be here at the arraignment. A formal arraignment is simply when charges are read in open court so the defendant knows exactly what they are being charged with. Trial 101, the indictment, formal charges, the arraignment, the reading of those formal charges.
You know, it`s interesting -- to Stacy Schneider, defense attorney. He couldn`t even stand up and say, Not guilty. He couldn`t even look the victim`s family in the face?
STACY SCHNEIDER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, sometimes a defendant is so shackled, hands and legs, that they aren`t really able to stand up. And fortunately, the courtroom does not realize that that is happening, so there may be a reason behind it. You know, also, him not looking at the family -- he`s already given his television interview to local TV in New York. He did express sympathy to the family for what happened, but he adamantly denied that he was responsible for doing it.
GRACE: At this juncture, Nicole Deborde, also a defense attorney, a veteran trial lawyer, the defense lawyer has said all along he can`t get a fair trial in New York, but now he says he`s not changing venue. Explain.
NICOLE DEBORDE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, it`s hard to guess or second- guess why the attorney says what he`s saying. I mean, there is so much coverage and so much of an outpouring, as the sister to this victim mentioned, that what we need is to make sure that whoever ultimately hears this case, whoever the jurors are, can actually look at the evidence and hear the evidence from a scientific perspective, from an evidentiary perspective, and make sure that the emotions don`t rule the day and that we get to the truth of the matter by really hearing the facts in this case. And that`s really going to be important.
So I don`t know what he did to analyze this circumstance that made him feel more comfortable with the court system, with this particular venue. But he has probably taken all of these factors into consideration, and these are certainly factors that are important.
GRACE: Of course, the defense attorney probably spinning like a top because his client giving statements from behind bars, Mr. Littlejohn speaking out. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SCOTT WEINBERGER, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER, WCBS-TV: Did you cooperate with the police investigation?
DARRYL LITTLEJOHN, CHARGED IN MURDER OF IMETTE ST. GUILLEN: I cooperated fully, even before I was placed under arrest. I went to the 75th precinct voluntarily. I was not handcuffed. I was -- not any of that. I went there voluntarily. I spoke to them. I told them what I know. And then once it became the finger pointing at me, this is when I decided to seek the advice of counsel.
WEINBERGER: Did you kill Imette St. Guillen?
LITTLEJOHN: No, I did not.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Now, that is exclusive footage from WCBS. They spoke to Littlejohn behind bars. As you can see, Littlejohn showing very little emotion.
Here in the studio with me, a very special guest, you know him well, Dr. Lawrence Kobilinsky, Dr. Kobilinsky a forensic scientist, and he also teaches at John Jay College, where Imette St. Guillen was a student.
What can you tell us, after you have read this indictment, Dr. Kobilinsky? What do we know now? What do we learn from this indictment?
LARRY KOBILINSKY, FORENSIC SCIENTIST: Well, Nancy, first of all, there`s an awful lot of evidence here. We have a murder one charge, which means that he`s charged with killing somebody, and of course, that has to be in the act of a felony, either a kidnap or torture or rape.
And there is an awful lot of evidence here. We`re talking about the sock that was forced into her throat. We`re talking about the tape that was put over her face, her nose and mouth, which just happens to have a number of fibers. There are fibers from a mink, fibers from rabbit, and there are carpet fibers. Interestingly enough, all of these fibers match the evidence taken from the basement of the home where Mr. Littlejohn lives.
GRACE: Dr. Kobilinsky, you said mink and rabbit. How does that come from the home?
KOBILINSKY: Well, clothing will have collars that have animal hair. And let me tell you, the analyst that did this work is top-notch. I happen to know him. And if he says it matches, it matches. And it`s very important.
But there`s a lot of other evidence. The plastic ties, of course, we all know now has DNA that matches Mr. Littlejohn. But there`s other evidence we haven`t even heard about yet. We certainly know that they collected Mr. Littlejohn`s clothing from his home, and that is yet to be analyzed. And we heard today that about 80 percent of the evidence has not been completed.
We have the 911 phone call. I`m sure that audio evidence has to be sent to the FBI lab. And we don`t know if that is completed yet. There`s cat hair that was found on the comforter. That cannot be analyzed in New York City. Probably, it`ll go to Maryland, to a lab there, or to California. And there`s an awful lot of information here, the cell phone records. Put it all together, all the pieces of the puzzle fit and point in one direction.
GRACE: Here is what the local district attorney had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: After the grand jury heard all of the evidence in this case, they returned a three-count indictment charging Darryl Littlejohn with two counts of murder in the second degree and one count of murder in the first degree. The charge of murder in the first degree, which carries a sentence upon conviction of life without any possibility of parole, alleges that the defendant intentionally caused the death of Ms. St. Guillen during the course of committing or attempting to commit one of four enumerated felony sex crimes.
The evidence before the grand jury included a timeline which began at approximately 4:00 o`clock in the morning of Saturday, February 25, of this year, the last contact Ms. Guillen had with The Falls bar on Lafayette Street in Manhattan. That timeline ended 17 hours later, when her body was found dumped on the side of a deserted stretch of Fountain Avenue just north of the Belt (ph) Parkway in the east New York section of Brooklyn at approximately 8:30 Saturday evening.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Breaking news out of a New York courtroom today, the prime suspect in the murder of a 24-year-old grad student in open court today, a packed courtroom full of the girl`s family, as well as press.
To Leslie Snadowsky, investigative reporter. I wonder why Littlejohn couldn`t bring himself to speak in court today. And come on, Leslie, let`s just get real. How likely is it you`re going to find mink and rabbit in some other guy`s apartment, which was found on the tape binding this girl.
LESLIE SNADOWSKY, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER: And it was blue rabbit hair.
GRACE: Oh, good Lord! Kobilinsky, how could you leave that fact out?
(LAUGHTER)
GRACE: Blue rabbit! The last time I saw blue rabbit I think Puff Daddy -- oh, excuse me -- P. Diddy was wearing it.
SNADOWSKY: Well, Littlejohn is actually no angel. I mean, he has an extensive rap sheet. There are seven prior convictions. No prior sexual offenses, though. But he was in -- served time in jail for armed robbery and drugs. And he`s also a person of interest in some other rapes that occurred in Queens and Nassau County.
GRACE: Now, Leslie, Why do you say no prior sex offenses, if police at this moment are trying to link him to three other rapes?
SNADOWSKY: Well, he hasn`t been charged because two of the victims had him in a line-up, and neither of them pointed him out. So he`s not been charged with anything. But the victims say the man who did this to them kind of fits Littlejohn`s description. He also said that he was a law enforcement officer, which is something he did at The Falls bar. I believe he told the owner of the bar was a federal marshal. So -- and also, he dragged them, snatched them, dragged them to a blue van, which I know police are considering. That`s, you know, his car...
GRACE: Leslie, we`re showing the viewers right now the location of those other three rapes. With us, investigative reporter, Leslie Snadowsky. Leslie, I notice you stated that in two of those, the victims could not make an identification. But what about the third one?
SNADOWSKY: Actually, you know, authorities have been very tight- lipped about all this. In fact, it`s been very tough to get answers. I think they`re really concentrating on the present indictments and trying to get Littlejohn, you know, convicted on some of these charges.
GRACE: To Dr. Joseph Deltito, professor of psychiatry. You know, remember when Simpson, O.J. Simpson, made the big production of pleading not guilty? You know, you often see that in high-profile cases. Littlejohn couldn`t stand up and say, Not guilty? He had to have his lawyer speak for him?
JOSEPH DELTITO, PROFESSOR OF PSYCHIATRY: Well, maybe his lawyer jumped the gun and said it before he had a chance or didn`t...
GRACE: Oh, please! It was orchestrated!
DELTITO: ... understand exactly what the procedure was.
GRACE: It was orchestrated.
DELTITO: I`m sure it was orchestrated, but I`m not sure I would read too much into it, in terms of guilt or non-guilt. I mean...
GRACE: I`m not -- I`m...
DELTITO: ... there are a lot of other factors to suggest that he`s guilty, not -- you don`t have to rely on...
GRACE: Deltito, I`m not suggesting...
DELTITO: ... not speaking up in court.
GRACE: I`m not asking you about guilt. You`re the professor of psychiatry. I`m just a trial lawyer. I`m asking you why this guy couldn`t speak in court.
DELTITO: I don`t know why he couldn`t speak in court, but I imagine that he was -- most people are reticent to speak in court anyway, and if his lawyer suggested that he shouldn`t or the lawyer jumped the gun and said, Not guilty before he could -- I don`t think he was itching to say, Not guilty, necessarily.
GRACE: Maybe he couldn`t bring himself to say it, although I`m not so sure...
DELTITO: Well, he said it on...
GRACE: ... he`s having pangs of conscience.
DELTITO: He said it on the air. He said it on the air in the famous interview.
GRACE: He did say it in the interview. And speaking of the interview, when we come back, Scott Weinberger is joining us. He took that interview from Darryl Littlejohn. We`ll find out more about that.
But to tonight`s "Case Alert." First, the parents of an Orlando missing girl, Jennifer Kesse, have been standing at an intersection during rush hour day and night, holding signs with photos of their girl, Jennifer. Anyone with information concerning Jennifer Kesse, please call 1-800-423- TIPS.
Also tonight, on the docket, police now expand their search for two missing Milwaukee boys. They`ve expanded to a 100-square-block area. Tonight, the reward grows for information on the whereabouts of 11-year-old Purvis Parker and 12-year-old Dre Henning. It is now up to $23,000. If you have information, call Milwaukee police, 414-935-7401.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: This man, prime suspect in the torture, rape and murder of a beautiful grad opportunity in court today with a date with Lady Justice, formal arraignment after a grand jury hands down charges of murder one and murder two.
Straight out to the man that interviewed Littlejohn behind bars, Scott Weinberger. He got an exclusive interview with Littlejohn for WCBS-TV. Scott, take a listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WEINBERGER: Were you working that night?
LITTLEJOHN: Yes, I was.
WEINBERGER: Did you see Imette St. Guillen at the bar?
LITTLEJOHN: At the end of the night, yes.
WEINBERGER: OK.
LITTLEJOHN: Just before closing.
WEINBERGER: Did somebody ask you to escort her out?
LITTLEJOHN: Yes. It was close to closing time. Every -- all the other patrons had left the bar, and I was asked to escort her out.
WEINBERGER: Did you do that?
WEINBERGER: Yes. That`s normal. Upon closing time, the stragglers or whoever`s remain in the bar, they have to be out of the -- off the premises by 4:00 AM, or the bar gets fined.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: To Scott Weinberger, WCBS reporter. Scott, thank you for being with us.
WEINBERGER: Sure.
GRACE: I`m very interested in Darryl Littlejohn. What was his demeanor behind bars?
WEINBERGER: Well, I found it not to change throughout the entire interview. Nancy, we did a lot of research and a lot of work prior to doing the interview. We went out to his neighborhood within hours when he was named a person of interest. We talked to neighbors. They described him as soft-spoken and articulate. And we got an indication from them that he was someone who, even though he had sort of this rough and tough presence to him, that he was sort of a well-spoken man.
So when we approached the attorney to talk to about the possibility of getting an interview, we felt -- we told him we felt it was important that if that was the case and he was so well spoken, there were millions of people that really needed to have several questions answered. You heard a few there. A lot of people wanted to know what happened that night.
GRACE: Well, I want to get to what he told you. What does he say happened at The Falls bar that night? And did he ever wear glasses throughout this interview, or is that just the look?
WEINBERGER: He didn`t wear glasses during at the interview at all. And of course, we did not touch upon any of the forensic evidence or anything that the witnesses may have told police. Basically, what we talked about is a few questions relative to his involvement within the bar and escorting her out.
GRACE: Did he talk about the victim?
WEINBERGER: He did. He talked about the fact that what he was told is that she was a woman who had a bright future, and he was very, very sorry for what happened, but he wanted to make it clear, he says, police have the wrong guy.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALEJANDRA ST. GUILLEN: Going forward, we will strive to honor Imette by focusing our energies on helping others through the establishment of charities and scholarships in Imette`s name. It is our hope that the lives we touch in this positive way will forever be Imette`s living legacy.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That girl will never be the same, her sister, Imette, raped, tortured, murdered and thrown to the side of the road like trash, wrapped like a mummy in masking tape.
I want to go back to WCBS reporter Scott Weinberger. He is the only person so far that has managed to interview Darryl Littlejohn, did so behind bars. And Scott Weinberger, everybody, not just another pretty face. This is a guy who was a detective in south Florida for some time before he became a reporter, which I find incredibly interesting. Scott, from your other life as a detective, what did you pick up about Littlejohn?
WEINBERGER: Well, the purpose of this interview with Littlejohn was obviously as a journalist. Nancy, I am not familiar -- I have not identified and seen all the evidence in the case. And my perspective, clearly, was just as a journalist. When I interviewed him, the most important stuff was to get the important questions...
GRACE: Right. I`m trying to find out...
WEINBERGER: ... in so the viewers...
GRACE: ... what he said. I mean, was he -- is he convinced he`s a scapegoat?
WEINBERGER: Well, he said to us that, you know, he could obviously play the race card, but he felt like, in this situation, he`s an ex-con who was working at a nightclub illegally...
GRACE: He said he could play the race card? He said that?
WEINBERGER: He said he could play the race card, but he mentioned that he was working at a bar...
GRACE: OK, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa...
WEINBERGER: ... violating his probation...
GRACE: ... whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa! Hold on just a moment. You`re telling me that here is a guy behind bars, you`ve got a dead girl wrapped in masking tape, he`s like, Hah, yes, I could play the race card. You`re kidding me!
WEINBERGER: I`m just telling you what he told me.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: When Imette St. Guillen left the Falls Bar in Lower Manhattan at 4:00 a.m. on Saturday, February 25th, she had every expectation, like so many other young people in this city, of arriving home safely.
Instead, her body was discovered by police officers from the 75th Precinct at 8:43 p.m. at Fountain and Seaview Avenues in East New York, Brooklyn. The officers were responding to a 911 call made 20 minutes earlier, at 8:23 p.m., by an anonymous caller who reported a body there. That caller has yet to be identified.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: The formal charges against Darryl Littlejohn handed down by a grand jury, announced in formal court today at arraignment: first-degree murder, one count; second-degree murder, two counts. Facing life behind bars without the possibility of parole.
I`ve got in my hands right here the indictment, a formal indictment that lists -- if you take a look at it -- the manner of death, asphyxiation. Don`t know if it`s strangulation or smothering. If it is strangulation, don`t know if it is manual, by hand, or by ligature.
Second count, we also learn in count one that there is a sex assault. There are several choices to this jury. There is a rape allegation. There is a criminal sex act allegation. There is aggravated sex abuse and sex abuse in the first degree, all these having their own individual legal meaning.
In the third count, which is also second-degree murder, it talks about various wounds, injuries, asphyxiation on this girl, a girl minding her own business, leaving a bar on her own, here in New York City, a graduate student studying criminal justice.
Tonight, we are taking your calls. A panel of experts to answer your questions.
First of all, let`s go out to Wisconsin. Calling in is Cammy. Hi, Cammy.
CALLER: Hi, Nancy.
GRACE: What`s your question, friend?
CALLER: I just have a question. Do the police believe that this Littlejohn is the only one responsible for Imette`s murder?
GRACE: Excellent, excellent question. There`s actually been a lot of speculation about that.
What about it, Scott Weinberger?
WEINBERGER: They haven`t said anything to us, and I don`t have a theory on that.
GRACE: Leslie Snadowsky, there`s been a lot of speculation that someone was with him. Is it idle speculation?
SNADOWSKY: Actually on the blanket that Imette was found in, there was actually semen, but it did not match the DNA to Littlejohn. So whose was it? Maybe there was someone else involved.
GRACE: Oh, oh, oh, oh, Leslie, that hurt me. You stabbed me in the chest. You could go to any motel or hotel, hey, check out the Four Seasons. I don`t care what they charge. Get one of those infrared lights and check out the bedspread. You`ll be disgusted and repelled at what you find. Now, where was this blanket -- where had the blanket been, Leslie?
SNADOWSKY: Well, it supposedly was linked to his place, but, you know, she was found wrapped in it. And you`re 100 percent right; it could come from anywhere. But, I mean, I think that was one of the reasons why they couldn`t really link the rape to Littlejohn, because they didn`t find any evidence of the sexual nature.
GRACE: Nancie Katz, any suggestion he did not act alone, to your knowledge?
NANCIE KATZ, REPORTER, "NEW YORK DAILY NEWS": Actually, both the commissioner and Mr. Hynes were questioned today about whether there were any other accomplices they were looking into. People did ask questions about the bartender manager who was there.
GRACE: Did they answer? Do we have any evidence?
KATZ: The answer was that the investigation remains open and that the inference was that they have not ruled out accomplices.
GRACE: Interesting. So Cammy in Wisconsin, you may be on to something.
Let`s go to Florida. Calling in, Cathy. Hi, Cathy.
CALLER: Hi, Nancy.
GRACE: Hi, dear.
CALLER: Good evening, my friend. Now, listen, on those three other cases that they suspect Littlejohn in, do you know if there`s any DNA in those cases?
GRACE: Oh, that`s a good question. We`ve been talking about that.
Dr. Kobilinsky, what can you tell us?
KOBILINSKY: The answer is that they do not have any DNA. Had they had DNA, they would have been able to check the state or national database, and they would have pulled up a suspect.
GRACE: Well, the other thing is this, though. Let`s don`t let Cathy`s question go so quickly, Doctor. What about the theory that the victims were wiped clean, for instance, with baby wipes?
KOBILINSKY: Nancy, you`re absolutely right. In one case, the victim was forced to wash herself in a shower. And in the other case, there were baby wipes that were used to wipe the victim clean.
GRACE: But, listen, washing yourself in a shower doesn`t get rid of sperm after a rape, OK?
KOBILINSKY: Well, I tell you, criminals are learning from television, from "CSI," from movies, from books. They are learning that, if they leave semen, evidence, or any other kind of physical evidence behind, they are going to get in trouble, so they know better...
GRACE: They`d rather wear the condom.
KOBILINSKY: ... to clean the victim, wear a condom. We can actually check if that happened by looking at the lubricant, but nevertheless, no semen.
GRACE: But also, these live victims can say whether their attacker wore a condom.
KOBILINSKY: Well, that`s true, but, you know, sometimes you can`t take that on face value. Physical evidence is what`s key here.
GRACE: Right, right, right.
Let`s go out to Edward in New York. Everyone, we are taking your calls with this panel of experts. Hi, Edward.
CALLER: Hi, Nancy. We love you and your show. We want to ask you if, since they made it public that his friend, Kwan, is a good friend of his, can they check to see if that`s his DNA on the blanket?
GRACE: Hmm. Ellie, what do you know about the friend?
ELIZABETH YUSKAITIS, PRODUCER: Well, Kwan is in -- the "New York" magazine mentioned him.
GRACE: Right.
YUSKAITIS: He was a guy who was another bouncer there at the Falls, hung out with Darryl Littlejohn. We don`t know if police are looking for him at this point.
GRACE: Well, you know what though? To Nicole Deborde, as Ellie is pointing out, he is simply a friend, but Edward has a point: They could ask for him legally to voluntarily give his DNA.
DEBORDE: They sure could, and I really think that they should in this. This is obviously a very serious case with horrendous facts. And the consequences for Mr. Littlejohn right now are extremely severe, and they need to be looking at all of the possible suspects in this case. And obviously, if you have DNA to a different person on this scene somewhere, they really need to find out who that is.
GRACE: Whoa, whoa, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. First of all, let`s just be clear. Our sources state that Littlejohn`s DNA -- I believe it was blood -- was found on the plastic handcuffs, the ties holding this girl. She was bound and tortured, murdered, and wrapped in duct tape like a mummy.
So we`ve already got his DNA, but the blanket with the other DNA -- you`re right about that, Nicole Deborde -- let`s go out to Kathy in Massachusetts.
Hi, Kathy.
CALLER: Hi, Nancy.
GRACE: What`s your question?
CALLER: My question is -- you might have already answered this -- but will something happen to the owner of the Falls Bar?
GRACE: Oh, excellent, excellent question. Stacy Schneider, we all know that, when it comes to alcohol, tobacco and firearms, there are very strict regulations. What about this bouncer with the record as long as my arm?
SCHNEIDER: Well, this bar had an obligation to check out who they were hiring, to protect the bar patrons. And, clearly, they didn`t do that.
There`s also speculation that another bouncer from the Falls Bar also had a criminal record. And the most interesting thing about this, being a native New Yorker, is the family who owns this particular bar, the Dorrian family, is the same family that owned Dorrian`s Red Hand Bar, which is the scene where Jennifer Levin, who was the victim of the preppy murderer back in the `80s, she was an underage drinker and left that bar and ended up being murdered in Central Park by Robert Chambers.
What are the odds in New York, where we have hundreds and hundreds of bars...
GRACE: Exactly.
SCHNEIDER: ... of having another problem with a Dorian family-owned bar?
GRACE: And, of course, Stacy, the moment Robert Chambers gets out, whoops, he captured another cocaine charge. You know how that happens.
SCHNEIDER: Robert Chambers did as much time as he could possibly do.
GRACE: Yes.
SCHNEIDER: He went all the way, without getting released early.
GRACE: Then, the moment he got out, he got busted on cocaine.
SCHNEIDER: Yes, he did. He`s back in.
GRACE: He`s already been back in, dear. It`s like a revolving door for him.
SCHNEIDER: That is true.
GRACE: To Dr. Joseph Deltito, professor of psychiatry, Doctor, it`s already started. I`ve already had to get in a fistfight today hearing someone say Imette St. Guillen shouldn`t have been at the bar that late. She was clearly there because she had a crush on the bouncer or somebody in the bar that she was waiting, like she`s the stalker.
It`s already started, the blame-the-victim defense. And I finally said to the person, who was a woman, why are you saying this? You have no evidence to say this whatsoever. And she said: Because I don`t want it to be random, because that means it could happen to me.
DELTITO: Well, it could happen to almost anyone, and I think that there is a public health message here and a public safety message here. And the public safety message is: Beware, if you`re drinking alone, particularly as a female in certain parts of New York at 4:00 in the morning.
That doesn`t mean that someone wants to be raped or they`re up to no good, but it`s dangerous. There are predators. There are ways to protect yourself. There are places and neighborhoods not to be in at certain times.
So I`m not blaming the victim, but there is a public health message that I think we should give, being the father of a teenage daughter, we should give to all our daughters, and sisters, and whatever, is beware of the predator. They`re there, and they tend to concentrate in certain places and at certain times.
GRACE: You know what, Dr. Deltito? My message is, as much as we want to separate ourselves from what happened to Imette St. Guillen, violent crime is random. It can happen to anyone, just like Imette, truly in the wrong place at the wrong time.
To tonight`s "Trial Tracking," Daytona Beach police investigate claims a serial killer in the murders of three Florida women could be one of their own: a cop. If you have information, please call 1-800-423-TIPS.
And tonight, some good news in the world of crime and justice. A 24- year-old Pennsylvania woman who went missing 10 years ago, alive and well. Tanya Kach of McKeesport, Pennsylvania, found in the same city after a tip from a convenience store owner.
Tonight, we learn Kach was held at the home of Thomas Hose, just two miles from her own home, not allowed out of the house for years. Tonight, Hose is behind bars on sex assault charges. Kach reunited with her parents.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We received a call last night, approximately 9:20 p.m., in regards to a deceased person.
QUESTION: And he was shot to death?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was shot in the back.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They`re trying to find the wife and children. We have ruled this a homicide, so, therefore, we would feel that they are in danger.
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GRACE: Tonight, we have breaking news out of Tennessee. As you all know by now, a minister found shot dead in his home, a well-respected minister in that town. His wife and three little girls missing. We have just heard the girls and the mom have been found.
Let`s go straight out to Jennifer Johnson with the Tennessee Bureau of Investigations.
Jennifer, bring us up to date.
JENNIFER JOHNSON, TBI SPOKESPERSON: Well, Nancy, literally, as I was sitting here waiting to go on the show, we just got the phone call that they have been found. They were in a van in Orange Beach, Alabama.
We have been working on this, really, over the last couple of hours. We thought that we had tracked them to that area. We were in contact with authorities down there, the Orange Beach police. And through the course of their patrols and through our investigative work, we were able to find that van on the side of the road.
It was parked on Perdido Beach Road. The officers made what we call a welfare stop. The mother was inside the van, along with the children, and from what we can make out right now, all are in safe condition and healthy.
GRACE: Well, hold on, hold on, Jennifer -- Jennifer Johnson with us from Tennessee Bureau of Investigation -- was the mother alone with the children? There was no one that forced her out of the home?
JOHNSON: There is no one else in the van. I was very specific to ask that. That`s been a question that`s come up all day long, who may have been with her, exactly what`s been going on? And so that`s what we have to find out now.
It`s 10 minutes old. So our job now is to figure out what happened, where she had been with these kids, and what happens next.
GRACE: Were the police that looked at the van aware of the Amber Alert?
JOHNSON: They were. Actually, we were in the process of asking Alabama and Florida to activate an Amber Alert, because we had information that they were in that area. They were going to do that within the next 30 minutes when this happened.
GRACE: Let`s go out to Liz Daulton with WREC Radio, a reporter there, Liz, what can you tell us about the nature of this murder?
LIZ DAULTON, REPORTER, WREC: The nature of the murder is that, during a service last night Wednesday night at 7:00, Matthew failed to show up to preach for the service. And so several members of the congregation, after the service was over, went there to his house, managed to get a key, entered the home, and found him deceased.
GRACE: And the mother and the three girls?
DAULTON: The mother and the three girls were not in the house. There was no sign of forced entry, were the initial reports. The police did not comment on the crime scene at all today, but they said that the van and the girls and the mother had been gone.
GRACE: What can you tell us about the family itself?
DAULTON: What we can tell you of the family itself, from members of the church, and one of the church elders who we spoke with earlier, they said that they were active members of the church. No previous history of family violence or anything of that sort, and it just was total shock to everyone that something like this could happen in their community.
GRACE: What room was he found in?
DAULTON: I`m not sure; there was no speculations on the crime scene.
GRACE: And do we know how many times he was shot?
DAULTON: The police did not say that it was a gunshot. They did want to comment that it was ruled it a homicide and it was death by unnatural causes, but they did not say whether it was a gunshot or not.
GRACE: OK, yes, I know police didn`t give a statement. Our sources tell us it was, in fact, a gunshot wound. Question: Was there any struggle in the home?
DAULTON: They said there were no signs of struggle, but, again, when we asked, they said that they would prefer not to comment on the crime scene until things were processed further.
GRACE: OK.
Straight to Leslie Snadowsky, investigative reporter who has also been working this case, Leslie, everyone assumed -- well, many people assumed at the beginning that the mom had been forced out of the home, but a mom and three kids forced out of the home? It seemed as if this was not random. This is a small town. How long had this minister been at this church in this community?
SNADOWSKY: For about a year. And, in some of the reports that I read, you know, the family got glowing reviews. In fact, one of the members of the church said he was the best minister they ever had, and they described the wife, Mary, as being precious and the kids as precious. She was a substitute elementary school teacher. I mean, they were pretty well- revered.
The one thing interesting thing is, is that there actually was a gun in the home. I read a report today that Pastor Winkler said that, actually, he had a gun in his home that he used to turkey hunt. So maybe that will turn out to be the weapon, because there was in the home. But it does look...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Good lord, what do you hunt a turkey with? I can get one in the grocery store.
(LAUGHTER)
What would that be, a shotgun?
SNADOWSKY: Unfortunately, I didn`t...
GRACE: I only can assume. Let`s just all agree that it`s a long gun of some sort.
Very quickly, back to Jennifer Johnson with TBI, Tennessee Bureau of Investigation. So now my question is: Did the wife give any statements that we know of, Ms. Johnson?
JOHNSON: Not at this point. I mean, literally, this has happened within the last 10 minutes. So those are the kind of things that we want to get to the bottom of. I think, all day long, we`ve had a lot of people questioning: Is she a suspect or is she a victim?
GRACE: Victim.
JOHNSON: We`ve wanted to know that ourselves, and that`s what we have to get to the bottom of.
GRACE: You`re absolutely right. With us, Jennifer Johnson, PIO with Tennessee Bureau of Investigation, and Liz Daulton with WREC Radio.
Very quickly, to tonight`s "All-Points Bulletin." Law enforcement across the country on the lookout for Jamie Lee Coker, in connection with the 2005 Texas DUI manslaughter of his wife, 43-year-old Sonya, and 74- year-old Martha Wallace. If you have information, go to Crime Stoppers at 903-236-7867.
Local news next for some of you; we`ll all be right back. And remember, verdict watch in the case of a 73-year-old woman charged with the murder of her husband, Court TV.
Please stay with us, everyone, as we stop to remember Marine Lance Corporal Ryan McCurdy, 20, of Baton Rouge, Louisiana. He died in a small- arms combat, Fallujah. A star baseball player, the team catcher, happy-go- lucky. Ryan S. McCurdy, an American hero.
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GRACE: This wife and three little girls went missing. The minister in the Church of Christ church in Tennessee found dead in his home. We are taking your calls.
Let`s go straight out to Michigan and Carla. Hi, Carla.
CALLER: Hi, Nancy. Are there any persons of interest?
GRACE: You know what? I don`t believe so. But let`s ask Jennifer Johnson with Tennessee Bureau of Investigation -- Jennifer?
JOHNSON: Well, Nancy, I think we`re going to have a lot more information after we`re able to talk to her. I mean, we`ve just found her with the van and the children. Thank God they were safe. And that`s really where we`re going to start and find out.
GRACE: And, of course, Jennifer, you`re dead-on. All day long, I`ve been thinking about these three little girls. And, of course, you`ve got clarification. You do shoot a turkey with a shotgun.
And, yes, to the viewers that are arriving in, Jennifer, wasn`t this the family van?
JOHNSON: It is the family van. And I know we said this earlier in the show, but just to reiterate: There was no one else with them. It was just the mother and the three girls. So we really need to talk to her and find out what she knows about this.
GRACE: And what condition were they in, Jennifer?
JOHNSON: You know, I mean, it`ll take some time and questioning to find out exactly, you know, what kind of psychological things may be going on, but I can tell you that physically...
GRACE: How far away had they gotten? How far had they gotten, Jennifer?
JOHNSON: A long way. They were in Florida. Well, actually, they`re in Alabama, but it`s right there on the panhandle. It`s called Perdido Beach Road, Orange Beach, Alabama. A lot of people may vacation down there.
GRACE: Was her family from down there?
JOHNSON: Not to my knowledge. I think she might have had family in some southeastern states other than Alabama, but not there.
GRACE: OK. And, Jennifer Johnson, sorry for the rapid fire questions. We`ve just got so many questions. We`re just trying to wring every ounce of info from you and Liz Daulton with WREC Radio.
Thank you to Jennifer, Liz, and Leslie. But you know what? Thank you to all of our guests tonight. Our biggest thank you is to you for being with us and inviting us and our legal stories your homes.
Before I say good night, our hearts and prayers to the family of Joseph Whitehead, a 36-year-old Bibb County, Georgia, sheriff`s deputy, shot to death, 1:30 a.m. today, in the line of duty. Whitehead, an 11-year sheriff`s veteran, a member of the drug squad and SWAT team, leaving behind a wife and three children.
Sheriff, good night.
Nancy Grace signing off for tonight. See you here tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.
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