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American Morning

Immigration Battle; Iraqi Army Recruits Attacked; Preacher's Wife to be Arraigned on First-Degree Murder Charges

Aired March 27, 2006 - 08:59   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning. I'm Miles O'Brien.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Soledad O'Brien.

A wife accused of killing her preacher husband heads to court for the first time today. She's confessed, she's even apologized. But why did she do it? It's till a big question.

We've got a live report straight ahead.

M. O'BRIEN: New developments in the case of those two missing boys. It's now a criminal case.

We'll have the latest for you.

Plus, we have seen those huge protests. Now the real fight in Washington begins over a proposed crackdown on millions of undocumented immigrants in America.

S. O'BRIEN: Then this morning, this: he's Hasidic, he's into hip-hop, and he's popular on the reggae charts. He's Matisyahu. He is all the rage.

We've got his story just ahead.

Also, how much would you pay for a little bling-bling for your baby? We're going to take a look on this AMERICAN MORNING.

M. O'BRIEN: Well, it is borderline political civil war in Washington as Republicans debate immigration reform in that city today. We saw protests and demonstrations last week. Now it all moves to D.C. The Senate today taking up some controversial proposals for the government's new immigration policy.

CNN Congressional Correspondent Dana Bash joining us now.

Dana, what are we going to see on the Hill today?

DANA BASH, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Miles, today we are going to see how all of that emotion that you just talked about actually translates into any particular legislation. That is going to start in the Senate today.

The focus of the drama will be in the Senate Judiciary Committee. And staffers worked all weekend trying to find some middle ground on the issue that rips Republicans apart. That is, whether or not illegal workers should be able to stay in the United States and on what terms.

Now, the Senate Judiciary chairman, Arlen Specter, over the weekend seemed to indicate that he supports some kind of temporary worker program that would lead to a path to citizenship.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. ARLEN SPECTER (R-PA), CHAIRMAN, JUDICIARY COMMITTEE: They are going to be checked out very, very carefully. They are not going to go ahead of people who have been waiting in line for citizenship. They are going to go to the end of the line for people who have stayed at home and have gone through the normal channels.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: Now, there is yet another Republican proposal that would allow illegal workers to stay and work legally in the United States for five years, but then would have to leave the country and apply to reenter. But some other Republicans, some more conservative, I would say, Republicans, like Tom Tancredo of Colorado, say, Miles, all of this is akin to amnesty.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. TOM TANCREDO (R), COLORADO: When you reward millions and millions of people, which Senator Specter's bill does do, for coming across the border the wrong way, doing it illegally, then you -- it's a slap in the face to every single person who has done it the right way and to everybody who is waiting out there to do it the right way. It's bad policy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: There you hear one Republican saying it's bad policy. The Judiciary Committee in about an hour is going to start to debate this, and they could work well into the night trying to find the compromise, at least something to bring this particular bill to the Senate floor. But, Miles, they might not have to worry about that, because the Senate majority leader, Bill Frist, says he has a measure that he's going to bring to the Senate floor for the full Senate to debate no matter what happens in the Judiciary Committee, and that could happen as soon as tomorrow -- Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: All right. We'll be watching that.

Meanwhile, one of the proposals out there, Dana, is a 700-mile fence or wall along the border there. Does that idea really have much traction?

BASH: Well, that actually passed the House of Representatives, over $2 billion to build that wall. That is just one of the issues that maybe illustrates how difficult this is going to be to actually go to the president's desk, because it passed the House of Representatives, in the Senate there are lots of different proposals. At this point there doesn't seem to be a lot of support for that kind of broad (INAUDIBLE) like that, but this, again, is -- shows one of the major differences between Republicans that will make it very hard for them to come together and get something to the president's desk in this time, especially since, as we know, this is an election year.

M. O'BRIEN: Dana Bash on the Hill.

Thank you.

The president's remarks on immigration reform scheduled for 10:00 Eastern this morning, right after our program, a little less than an hour from now. We'll bring it to you live, of course -- Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: There has been a deadly suicide attack on a group of men lined up in an Iraqi army recruiting center. This videotape just into CNN. Take a look. At least 30 people are dead. At least another 30 injured. It happened in northern Iraq near Tal Afar.

CNN Senior International Correspondent Nic Robertson is live for us in Baghdad this morning.

Nic, good morning.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Soledad.

The details of this attack have become clearer through the day. And we can see clearly now from these pictures that this was, as it was described to us, a mobile base with very little security around it. A mobile recruiting center for the Iraqi army that the insurgents have chosen to target.

Thirty Iraqi army and civilians lined up waiting to sign up for the Iraqi army killed when a suicide bomber wearing an explosive vest walked up to the line of would-be recruits, detonated his explosives. We're told 30 other people also wounded in the attack.

We understand that no U.S. personnel were involved, were caught up in the casualty list there. But we do understand that a U.S. medical team came in very quickly to provide medical support for the -- for the Iraqis caught in the blast. But this appears to be an indication of the insurgents seeing what appears to be a relatively soft target and targeting these would-be army soldiers as they lined up to join the new Iraqi army -- Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: Nic Robertson reporting from Baghdad for us this morning.

Nic, thanks for the update -- Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: The preacher's wife who is accused of murdering her husband in court this afternoon. Mary Winkler to be arraigned on first-degree murder charges in Selmer, Tennessee. She is accused of shooting her husband, Matthew Winkler, last week.

Live now to Selmer. Rusty Dornin is following it for us.

Good morning, Rusty. RUSTY DORNIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Miles, the big question on everyone's mind is, why on earth would Mary Winkler, who was supposedly in a very happy marriage and a very loving couple, shoot her husband in the back, as she confessed to police over the weekend? Police are keeping it very close to the vest. They say they know what the motive was.

Meantime, her colleague, Pam Killingsworth, visited Mary Winkler in jail over the weekend, said she seemed to be in pretty good spirits but seemed very upset about how what she had done might have an impact on others.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PAM KILLINGSWORTH, FRIEND OF MARY WINKLER: Just repeatedly through our conversation she was asking me to apologize to this one or that one for all the problems that she'd caused them, that she was so sorry that she had caused the church all the problems that we're going through right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DORNIN: Killingsworth said she never actually admitted to shooting her husband, and her attorney is now saying she will plead not guilty in her arraignment later this afternoon. He's saying he hasn't even seen the confession and won't see it until he sees the discovery.

Meantime, funeral arrangements for Mathew Winkler will be taking place tomorrow -- Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: Rusty, tell us about members of his congregation. How are they doing? Did they have services yesterday, for example?

DORNIN: It's been very difficult for the congregation because apparently -- Pam Killingsworth just told me also -- they lost two other members of their congregation to natural causes, apparently, in addition to this. They had services yesterday. The deacon there saying please don't talk to anyone, don't speculate on the motive for what happened. And please have forgiveness, please forgive Mary Winkler for what she has done.

So they are trying to stick together and trying not to apparently speculate on the motive in this case.

M. O'BRIEN: Very difficult time, to say the least.

Rusty Dornin in Selmer, Tennessee.

Thank you very much.

Once again, that arraignment this afternoon. We'll keep you posted on that.

Let's get to Carol Costello in the newsroom with some other stories we're looking at. Good morning, Carol.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, Miles.

Good morning to all of you.

Two Americans and a British man held hostage for the past month in Nigeria will soon head home. Militants released the men earlier today. They're now with Nigerian officials. The men were abducted five weeks ago as part of a protest against oil companies in the region.

Police have a name but no motive in a mass shooting in Seattle. Six people killed, two injured Saturday after a rave party. The suspect, Aaron Kyle Huff, apparently left the party but came back armed and opened fire on a house full of people. He then shot himself.

Medical marijuana and the right to fight for life, that's the issue facing the federal appeals court in San Francisco. It's hearing arguments about whether marijuana should be legalized in very special, very serious cases. The Bush administration says the case is without merit.

An Afghan man who faced the death penalty for converting to Christianity could be released today. The Afghan court dropped the case, saying there wasn't enough evidence.

In the meantime, some 1,000 people in Afghanistan are protesting the court's dismissal. They say the Afghan courts caved in to Western pressure.

Pretty incredible pictures from Brooklyn New York, to show you. Check out that -- that's an SUV in that hole. It's teetering on the edge of a manhole.

There was a water main break underneath the street and that caused the street to literally cave in. A good old-fashioned sinkhole for you.

The driver is fine. She was able to get out safely. The street, though, has been shut down. Subway service for that line that runs underneath the street now on hold.

And Tillie is getting another chance at a crime-free life. Tillie is the mannequin a Colorado driver used to get into the HOV lane. He was caught.

The mannequin was sold on eBay for $15,000. Proceeds benefit the teen safe driving group Alive at 25. That makes it a little better, doesn't it?

S. O'BRIEN: Fifteen thousand? Is that what you said? Fifteen thousand dollars?

COSTELLO: Fifteen thousand dollars. But it goes for a good cause, so maybe...

S. O'BRIEN: Oh, no, that's a great cause. I mean...

COSTELLO: ... that's why they spent that much money.

S. O'BRIEN: Wow. Just $15,000 for Tillie?

COSTELLO: Otherwise -- I know. Otherwise...

S. O'BRIEN: That he kind of put together with, like, spit and glue, pretty much? OK.

COSTELLO: Pretty much.

M. O'BRIEN: Maybe she looked like the Virgin Mary.

S. O'BRIEN: What?

M. O'BRIEN: Well, you know, remember that grilled cheese sandwich that...

S. O'BRIEN: Oh, I see. No, Tillie, nothing.

M. O'BRIEN: Nothing.

S. O'BRIEN: Looking nothing like the Virgin Mary.

Carol, thank you.

Let's get to the forecast. Chad has that.

Tillie, $15,000 -- would you pay $15,000 for Tillie, Chad?

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: You know, somebody wanted that Breckenridge hat. That's all I can think. It was a very valuable hat, because the body was Styrofoam, wasn't it?

S. O'BRIEN: Yes. Yes, pretty much.

MYERS: OK. Whatever. I'm sure somebody will tattoo something...

M. O'BRIEN: What are we going to auction off here?

MYERS: Something -- someone will...

(CROSSTALK)

S. O'BRIEN: How much for my laptop?

MYERS: Exactly.

Good morning, everybody.

(WEATHER REPORT)

MYERS: Back to you guys.

M. O'BRIEN: Chad, stay with us for a moment. We have a picture. We want to introduce you to a friend of ours.

S. O'BRIEN: A friend of Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: Hopefully -- check this out. This is a guy, he's got some kind of Pier One offering (ph) there, enjoying the sun, he's got a little drink.

It looks like he's waiving at us. Does he have CNN out there or something? Now, pull back. Where are we, folks? Right in the middle of Columbus Circle.

S. O'BRIEN: Which for people who don't know, it's right in the middle of Manhattan. I mean, he's basically surrounded by a roadway, and Central Park, of course, right next to him. But it's kind of a strange place to sit, even on a beautiful day, Chad.

MYERS: I hope he has his sunscreen on.

M. O'BRIEN: Yes. Yes. And we were thinking about auctioning off that little Pier One cushy deal.

S. O'BRIEN: Yes, the lounger.

MYERS: The papa san?

M. O'BRIEN: The papa san. It's a papa san.

MYERS: That's right, supposedly.

S. O'BRIEN: What do you offer for that, Chad? We'll start at $100. We'll let our friend know that we're selling the chairs.

M. O'BRIEN: We'll give him a cut.

S. O'BRIEN: It's all fair.

MYERS: Ten bucks.

M. O'BRIEN: All right. Thank you, Chad.

MYERS: All right.

M. O'BRIEN: Coming up, a much more serious story for you: 911 from 9/11. New York City repairs to release emergency tapes from that fateful date, and many victims' families are angry about that. We'll tell you why.

S. O'BRIEN: I can imagine.

Also this morning, we're going to find out today if Zacarias Moussaoui will testify in his sentencing trial. At least one legal expert says that would be a nightmare scenario. We'll ask him why. M. O'BRIEN: And a Red Cross rip-off. The charity has fired three, but is the problem bigger than that? We'll ask the man at the top.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

S. O'BRIEN: Welcome back, everybody. A CNN "Security Watch" now.

The defense taking its turn today in the sentencing trial of Zacarias Moussaoui. The confessed al Qaeda conspirator insists that he's going to testify against his attorney's wishes.

Jonathan Turley is a professor at George Washington University Law School. He's in Washington, D.C., this morning.

Nice to see you, Jonathan. Thanks for being with us.

JONATHAN TURLEY, PROFESSOR, GWU LAW SCHOOL: Good morning, Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: So you have called this a nightmare scenario. What do you mean?

TURLEY: Well, you know, once again, Moussaoui seems to be riding down from the hills to save the government. You know, originally in the trial, most of us saw the government's case falling apart on simply proving all of these counts against Moussaoui. Then he suddenly came into court and pled guilty to everything, every count, including counts where there didn't seem a lot of evidence.

Now, once again, the government's on the ropes, and the defense very well could win this difficult part of the case, and Moussaoui is saying, I'm going to testify. If he gets on that stand, I think he's going to put a noose around his neck.

He -- the jury is not going to like him. He's a perfect lunatic. And I think that he will just basically eradicate all of the progress the defense team has made.

S. O'BRIEN: His lawyers have made it very clear they do not want him to testify. Explain for me, legally speaking, how it works. I mean, how -- would he just make his wishes known to the judge? Does he just stand up and start saying, "I want to testify?" I mean, how does it work?

TURLEY: Well, Soledad, this is part of the sort of odd aspect of this case. The court decided that Zacarias Moussaoui was competent even though many people who observed the trial believe that he is truly unhinged and that he is not competent. And then, however, she would not let him represent himself.

Now, usually you have a constitutional right not only to represent yourself, but certainly to take the stand. So she will once again have to deal with this weird trial where she found the man competent but she's denied him aspect of self-representation. It's going to be hard for her to deny his request to take the stand on his behalf.

But, you know, the defense here really sort of pulled this case out of the fire. And they have done an extraordinary job in really pressing the government that's now their game to lose. And Moussaoui, I think, is going to lose it for them if he takes the stand.

S. O'BRIEN: He's been found competent. Is there a potential that he could take the stand and everybody would see that he is, as you've described, unhinged, that he's -- that he's insane, that he is not competent, and then that could backfire, frankly, for the prosecution because it would become clear that he's not mentally capable to be on the stand or really be tried?

TURLEY: Yes. You know, frankly, Moussaoui has been one of those things that everyone has sort of been averting their eyes, that there's a barking lunatic in the room. I mean, he has done everything short of chewing the carpet in the courtroom. And if you read his letters, he really comes across as a hateful but also demented man.

I don't think the court is going to change her decision. One of the reasons is that the federal standard for sanity is set so low, that you really do have to be chewing the carpet to qualify.

So I don't think that he's going to be able to show his incompetence. He has done that over and over again, in my view. But what he will do is he's likely to go off on one of his tirades.

You know, he keeps on going into court and saying he wants to kill everyone, including people of the jury. You know, that's not a good jury case when you want to say, I want to hang you on meat hooks.

S. O'BRIEN: Yes -- no.

TURLEY: Yes.

S. O'BRIEN: That will pretty much probably get you the death penalty right there in and of itself.

TURLEY: Yes.

S. O'BRIEN: Let me ask you one quick question about Carla Martin. What happens to her? She's of course the lawyer who kind of set the prosecution up to ruin their case, to some degree. Could she be disbarred for what she did?

TURLEY: Well, I think that there is a chance for disbarment. I think there's also a chance for a suspension or a reprimand. I think it's very likely she will be referred to the bar.

What's the biggest concern is whether she will be charged with civil or criminal contempt. As you know, Soledad, we expected her to testify today, but her attorney met with the judge, and the speculation is that the attorney said, look, if my client gets on that stand, she is going to take the fifth, she's going to refuse to testify. And frankly, I think that's a wise move, because I can't imagine anything that she could say that would not be self- incriminating.

S. O'BRIEN: Professor Jonathan Turley joining us this morning from George Washington University Law School.

Nice to see you, as always. Thank you very much.

TURLEY: Thanks, Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: And, of course, you'll want to stay with CNN day and night for the most reliable news about your security -- Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: The Red Cross sends three volunteers packing amid accusations of fraud in the wake of Katrina. And we're looking, we think, at just a few bad apples. Or is it a much bigger problem?

We'll ask the president of the Red Cross about that.

S. O'BRIEN: And later this morning, a look at this guy, who is arguably -- arguably the world's first Hasidic Jewish reggae...

M. O'BRIEN: Oh, he's definitely.

S. O'BRIEN: No, you're right. Let's go out on a limb and say he's definitely the world's first Hasidic Jewish reggae artist...

M. O'BRIEN: I think that's safe to say.

S. O'BRIEN: ... making hit songs while he stays true to his faith. A profile of Matisyahu is just ahead.

Stay with us.

M. O'BRIEN: Oy vey.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

M. O'BRIEN: Another scandal at the Red Cross to tell you about. The Red Cross has dismissed three volunteers in New Orleans. They were in charge of very crucial kitchens and shelters in the wake of Hurricane Katrina. Might have been involved in criminal activity, perhaps diverting hard-earned and donations from well-intentioned Americans. Instead of going to people who needed them, lining some people's pockets.

Joining us from Austin, Texas, Jack McGuire, who is the interim president of the American Red Cross.

Mr. McGuire, good to have you back on the program.

Another black eye for the Red Cross. How big a deal is this, do you think?

JACK MCGUIRE, INTERIM PRESIDENT, AMERICAN RED CROSS: Well, Miles, any situation like this is a big deal. And it's critical that we -- we look at these rigorously, we -- we investigate them rigorously and we take the proper action.

M. O'BRIEN: All right. Well, let's talk about what is proper here. There are three volunteers that have been singled out so far. In broad brushes, what is alleged that they have done?

MCGUIRE: Well, we currently are investigating. That's still an active investigation. So I can't really talk about specifics. But any time we're concerned that either we have activities that are improper in terms of procedure or judgment, or certainly in terms of any fraudulent activity, we need to take action to remove those people, and if necessary get information to the authorities.

M. O'BRIEN: All right. But how much money, donations that people were hoping would help out Katrina victims ended up being diverted?

MCGUIRE: I do not have an actual amount of money on this.

M. O'BRIEN: Well, give us a ballpark. Do you have a ballpark figure? Do you have a sense of it?

MCGUIRE: No, I do not, Miles. You know, we had 225,000 to 230,000 different people, different volunteers helping during Katrina. We operated about 1,200 shelters and operating centers all over the country.

We're talking about one of those at this point. So it is not an enormous amount of money compared to the money that actually went to victims. But nonetheless, we will follow this and we will follow any other accusation to be able to get the right action done.

M. O'BRIEN: OK. So just to be clear, do you not have a handle then -- I have a sense you don't even have a handle on the problem, or you just don't want to share with us? Or a little bit of both?

MCGUIRE: No. No, we have a handle on the problem. But since it's actively being investigated at this point, we're not in a position to share that type of information.

M. O'BRIEN: All right. Well, here's the thing, watching this, I'd be rather concerned if I was thinking about writing a check to the Red Cross if the president of the Red Cross is saying, you know, I don't really know yet, we're working on this. What can you tell people to give them some assurance that the money they donate to the Red Cross doesn't get diverted in this way?

MCGUIRE: Miles, the information for the people in the Red Cross who have helped -- and we need their help for every event like this -- is that we will -- will strongly investigate, and we will prosecute where needed any of these. We currently this year have gotten over $2 million back from situations where people took money wrongly from the Red Cross, from donations we've received, and we'll continue to go after more money if it is out there that people should not have gotten. M. O'BRIEN: Last time we spoke we were talking about a situation in Bakersfield, California, a call center there, kind of a subcontracted operation where there was allegations of fraud, actual fraud. In this case this continues.

I realize you're talking about in the grand scheme of things $2 billion that came into the Red Cross. So as you say, it's a small number. But you've got to wonder about the screening process. True, it's an overwhelming event, but what can you do to try to separate out these sorts of people?

MCGUIRE: We have gone through all of our procedures in the wake of Katrina. We've looked at everything from logistic to training to screening to the way that we partner with both commercial firms, as well as with other charities. And we are in the process of actually upgrading about 45 different projects to be able to tighten up those procedures.

Now, if you look at the situation in Bakersfield, that was in a program that we had literally put into place after Katrina hit. And we found that fraud, and we have now turned over to the authorities that information, and there are more than 60 people being prosecuted for that.

M. O'BRIEN: I guess the sad fact is, in a situation like this, some of this is inevitable, unfortunately.

MCGUIRE: Well, it's always a said situation. You know, disaster bring out the very best in people, but in some it brings out the very worst in people. And we can't tolerate that.

We need to do the right job for the people who are affected and we need to do the right job for the donors who have given us their time or their money. And we will rigorously pursue any of these situations that we find.

M. O'BRIEN: Jack McGuire is the acting president and CEO of the Red Cross.

Thanks for being with us.

Let's again mention the Red Cross Concern Connection. That number is 888-309-9679 -- 888-309-9679. That's if you have a concern about Red Cross, Red Cross volunteers, that sort of thing.

We're back with more in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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