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Senate Gears Up for Immigration Debate; At Least 30 Iraqi Army Recruits Killed by Insurgents

Aired March 27, 2006 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm Miles O'Brien.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Soledad O'Brien.

The border battle heats up and heads to Washington today, as lawmakers begin debate on the future of immigration in America.

M. O'BRIEN: A story breaking while you were sleeping. In Iraq, Iraqi army recruits targeted by insurgents. At least 30 are dead, several others injured. We're live with the latest from Baghdad.

S. O'BRIEN: The defense makes its case this week in the death penalty trial of Zacarias Moussaoui. The al Qaeda conspirator threatens to take the stand. We've got a live report just ahead.

M. O'BRIEN: New developments in that desperate search for two missing Milwaukee boys. We'll have more on what is now a criminal investigation.

S. O'BRIEN: And the preacher's wife accused of killing her husband -- she'll be in court today and the message she sends to members of her church. We'll take a look at that ahead on this AMERICAN MORNING.

Let's begin with the president. President Bush going to make his case for a new immigration law today. Huge crowds are making huge headlines for protesters. A crowd over the weekend estimated at half a million people protested a House bill that would make it a felony to be in the United States illegally. The Senate goes to work on its version today.

Ed Henry is live for us at the White House this morning -- Ed, good morning to you.

ED HENRY, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning.

S. O'BRIEN: What's the president's message?

HENRY: Well, with the immigration debate really splitting the Republican Party, we're seeing the president trying to get his fellow Republicans in the Senate to moderate that House bill that you mentioned that has grown so controversial. He kicks off that lobbying effort about two hours from now right here in Washington at a naturalization ceremony welcoming in new citizens to the United States. And the message from the president to his fellow Republicans is clear -- while the government should be celebrating those who play by the rules, he also wants the government to find a humane way to deal with the nearly 12 million illegal immigrants already here in the United States.

Many conservatives disagree. They only want to focus the Senate legislation on tightening U.S. borders.

Part of the problem for the president is that he's getting more support from Democrats like Ted Kennedy than fellow Republicans on the Hill.

Take a listen to Senator Kennedy yesterday on one of the Sunday shows.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. TED KENNEDY (D), MASSACHUSETTS: We cannot solve the problem of illegal immigration just by law enforcement alone. We have spent $20 billion on chains and fences and border guards and dogs in the southern border over the last 10 years and it doesn't work.

What we need is a comprehensive approach. I think President Bush understands it. I think John McCain understands it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HENRY: It will be very difficult for the president to bridge this divide. It's very possible that a final bill never makes it to his desk. That would be another defeat at a time when he desperately needs some victories -- Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: Yes, what exactly is at stake for the president in this fight?

HENRY: Well, look, this is coming so quick after that Dubai Ports controversy that also split the Republican Party. The president came out on the short end. If he loses this one, as well, we're going to hear a lot more talk about his diminishing political capital. I think the president, though, is trying to look beyond the short-term political situation, look at the long-term.

Number one, he thinks this is the right term -- the right thing to do in terms of his legacy. And, secondly, he may be looking at those nearly 12 million illegal immigrants. Some of those may wind up being Republican voters if he's seen as the person who brings them in a fair way to citizenship -- Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: Ed Henry for us at the White House this morning.

Ed, thank you.

HENRY: Thank you.

S. O'BRIEN: President Bush's remarks on immigration reform are scheduled for 10:00 a.m. Eastern, this morning.

CNN, of course, is going to bring you live coverage of that -- Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: Iraqi Army recruits targeted in northern Iraq by a person wearing a suicide vest. It happened a little less than five hours ago. At least 30 are dead. That's not all the violence we have to tell you about.

Senior international correspondent Nic Robertson live for us from Baghdad -- Nic, tell us what we know.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Miles, over those last five hours, we've been getting an increasingly clear picture of what happened to this small mobile recruiting base we have learned was the target for this particular attack. Would-be Iraqi Army soldiers, civilians lined up outside. A suicide bomber with a suicide vest on approached the line of people, detonated his explosives about 11:15 in the morning.

Thirty people, at least, killed, we're told, so far. About 30 others wounded in that attack. We do know that this was an Iraqi base. There were some U.S. personnel present and U.S. personnel did come in to provide medical support. But there were no U.S. casualties in this attack.

What it appears to be is another insurgent attack targeting the efforts to build up the Iraqi security forces here and taking advantage of a line of people who were standing there without really any proper protection -- Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: Nic, let's shift gears here and talk about a story which caught our attention here. Baghdad's provincial governor saying he would like to cut off cooperation with U.S. forces.

Tell us about that.

ROBERTSON: Not only the governor, the city council in Baghdad. They -- there was an incident in Baghdad last night. Iraqi police have said that U.S. troops were in a gun battle at a mosque with the Mahdi Militia. That's the militia of a firebrand cleric here.

Now, the U.S. military says this was Iraqi special operations forces backed up by U.S. special operations forces advisers. They were on a specific mission to target a kidnapping and execution squad. They say that they killed -- they got into a gun battle with this group, killed 16, detained 18, freed one Iraqi hostage being held there.

But it is proving to be, because of the pictures on Iraqi television of dead bodies, dead bodies that appear to be very close to a mosque, it is proving to be a very incendiary issue. That appears to be why the governor of Baghdad and the city council have now withdrawn cooperation, until there is an investigation -- Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: Nic Robertson in Baghdad. Thank you -- Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: Will Zacarias Moussaoui take the stand in his own defense?

Today, the defense is presenting its case in the sentencing trial.

CNN's Kelli Arena is live for us in Alexandria, Virginia with this CNN Security Watch -- hey, Kelli, good morning.

KELLI ARENA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Soledad.

Well, the defense case resumes this morning with their first witness, former FBI agent turned private investigator, Eric Rigler.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

ARENA (voice-over): Defense lawyers are trying to show that even if Zacarias Moussaoui had not lied to investigators about who he was and what he was doing in the United States, they would not have been able to prevent the September 11 attacks.

The defense began its case with a former FBI agent who told jurors how the government missed at least five opportunities to track down two Al Qaeda operatives in the United States.

Those men, Khalid al-Mihdar and Nawaf al-Hazmi, were among the hijackers who flew a plane into the Pentagon.

ANDREW MCBRIDE, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: The defense theory is a powerful one. The defense theory is, look, Moussaoui knew a general outline of a plan to take planes, use them as missiles, drive them into buildings.

Guess what? The FBI knew that for years.

ARENA: While they won't be in court, jurors also are expected to hear from Al Qaeda operatives being held in U.S. custody overseas, including 9/11 planners Ramzi Bin al-Shibh and Khalid Shaikh Mohammed. For the first time, notes from their interrogations will be read out loud. Intelligence officials say both have said Moussaoui was not part of the September 11 plot.

If the jury finds Moussaoui's lies caused people to die and that he's eligible for the death penalty, the trial would move into the next phase, to determine whether he should be executed.

Many legal experts believe that is unlikely.

MCBRIDE: There have been 150 federal death penalty prosecutions. There's only one I know of where someone who didn't actually do the killing and who wasn't actually present at the scene of the murder got the death penalty. And that was a drug kingpin who was accused of having directed the murder. ARENA: There is one wildcard -- Moussaoui himself is expected to take the stand, against the advice of his lawyers, whom he refuses to talk to.

(END VIDEO TAPE)

ARENA: Now, if Moussaoui were to testify, that could happen as early as today, Soledad. But we're not exactly sure how long cross- examination and the interrogation notes will take by the end -- and if that happens by the end of the day. And that will be very interesting if it does happen -- Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: Oh, it certainly will.

Kelli Arena for us this morning.

Kelli, thanks.

ARENA: You're welcome.

S. O'BRIEN: You want to stay with CNN day and night for the most reliable news about your security.

Seven minutes past the hour.

Time to check the headlines with Carol Costello in our newsroom -- hey, Carol.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, Soledad.

Good morning to all of you.

Final respects for a Tennessee preacher apparently shot to death by his wife. A wake is being held today for Matthew Winkler. His funeral is scheduled for tomorrow. Mary Winkler now being charged with first degree murder. Police say she confessed to the shooting. She's expected to plead not guilty at today's arraignment, though. Still no word on a motive. The couple's three children are staying with their paternal grandparents.

The search for those two missing boys in Milwaukee, Wisconsin now a criminal case. Twelve-year-old Quadrevion Henning and 11-year-old Purvis Parker have not been seen in more than a week. Henning's grandfather spoke with us just a short time ago. He says the families will keep on searching until the boys are found.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GARRY HENNING: Don't forget. Don't forget these boys. Don't forget the other missing children. Just burn -- burn it in their minds and in their hearts, where they will not be forgotten, because we're not going to let Purvis and Dre, we're not going to let them be forgotten.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Anyone with information about Quadrevion Henning or Purvis Parker please call the Milwaukee police.

The final moments of the World Trade Center in New York -- the city is releasing tapes and transcripts of the 911 calls made on September 11. The release is being made under a court order after a four year legal battle. The victims' half of the conversations will not be made public unless their families agree.

No death penalty for the Afghan man who converted to Christianity from Islam. We're hearing the man could be released today. After weeks of growing international pressure, the court has decided to dismiss the case. A judge said the prosecution didn't have enough evidence. In the meantime, some 1,000 people in northern Afghanistan are protesting. They say the court buckled to Western pressure.

For music fans, Graceland has always been a landmark. But now the federal government thinks so, too. Later this morning, Elvis' home will join George Washington's house and the Brooklyn Bridge as national historic landmarks. Elvis Presley bought the house back in 1957 from earnings from his first hit, "Heartbreak Hotel."

And, you know, the only question I have is why did it take so long?

S. O'BRIEN: Yes. I would have thought that was done already.

M. O'BRIEN: You would think.

Let's check the weather.

Chad Myers looking at that for us -- Chad, good morning.

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: You think there'll be somebody on the street corner saying hey, buddy, want to buy Graceland?

M. O'BRIEN: We can hook you up if you want to get it, Chad.

MYERS: That's the same guy who tried to sell the Brooklyn Bridge.

(WEATHER REPORT)

M. O'BRIEN: Coming up, a horrible crime in Seattle -- seven dead at an all night party, a murder/suicide, and police there are searching for some answers.

S. O'BRIEN: Also this morning, more on Mary Winkler, the woman accused of killing her preacher husband. One of her friends visited her in jail. We're going to talk about the visit and a special note that Winkler gave her.

M. O'BRIEN: Plus, the battle over immigration reform -- another debate that pits Republicans against Republicans.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) M. O'BRIEN: What in the world was Aaron Kyle Huff thinking on Saturday night when police say he went to an all night party he had been attending, went back in with weapons, shot six people and then shot himself fatally?

A murder-suicide with very little clues left behind. Perhaps the only one that we have right now is that spray-painted on the sidewalk leading up to the party was the word, ominously now, it was "now." There you see it.

Joining me now is Deputy Chief Clark Kimerer of the Seattle Police Department.

Chief, good to have you with us.

First of all, Huff was invited to this party, correct?

He had been at this party and I assume you've had a chance to talk to some witnesses who were there.

Was there anything odd or unusual about him at that party?

DEP. CHIEF CLARK KIMERER, SEATTLE POLICE: That was certainly part of the mystery because according to the survivors of his murderous assault, he was fairly quiet. He didn't distinguish himself in any way, certainly not as a person that was capable of this kind of homicidal violence.

The victims who survived described him as quiet, kind of self- effacing, maybe a little bit moody, but, again, certainly nothing that would give a sign or a signal of the kind of violence he was ultimately capable of.

M. O'BRIEN: And was he well known to most people at that party?

KIMERER: No, he was a relative stranger, at least according to the witnesses that we debriefed. We, of course, had a number of people to talk to at the conclusion of this tragedy. About 25 partygoers survived and we interviewed each and every one of them extensively. And none of them said that prior to encountering him at the rave and then ultimately inviting him back to this party that they'd ever seen him before in their lives.

M. O'BRIEN: Let's talk about these raves. Raves are associated with the drug Ecstasy, in many cases. Other drugs often present.

Do we know if drugs were in his system based on autopsy findings?

KIMERER: We do not. And the autopsy and the toxicology reports are not going to be available to us for some time.

But I guess I'd like to say that while police officers -- and as a parent, I have concern about raves, I don't find that the context of what these young people were doing and where they were in any way illuminates why this person did what he did. There may have been a whole other set of other circumstances, other, you know, another type of party, that sort of thing and would have had no anticipation or expectation that somebody would be so merciless in their design to take innocent life.

M. O'BRIEN: Oh, understand. I'm not blaming raves in a broad stroke. But the fact is it would lead one to at least ask the question about whether there was some sort of drug, not motivation but that somewhere exacerbated things for him.

KIMERER: That will certainly be a part of our investigation. And in our search of the murder scene, while there was alcohol present, there was not indications of significant drugs, at least during the initial investigation. Obviously, some of the partygoers were intoxicated. But I cannot, at this point, say that we have evidence that there was significant drug use as part of the overall scene.

M. O'BRIEN: Now, evidence -- we talked briefly about the spray- painted word "now" a couple of times on the path between his vehicle and the party -- ominous but not in, really, not that telling, except that, of course, he was thinking about doing it. Of course, he had gone back to his car to get the weapon.

What other sorts of evidence are you going to be able to glean? Are you going to his apartment, that kind of thing?

KIMERER: Yes. We've conducted a search. We executed a search warrant on his residence, on his apartment, found additional weapons there. But not evidence that would have indicated to us a reason for his assault. No notes, no kind of material literature that were particularly illuminating.

It is very clear that he had thought out a murderous spree, a campaign. He had hundreds of rounds of weapons. An assault weapon was found in his vehicle in addition to the shotgun and the handgun and numerous rounds that he took with him into the house. A machete was found. Flex cuffs were found in the vehicle. This was a clearly premeditated and well planned assault on innocent people.

M. O'BRIEN: Deputy chief of the Seattle Police Department, Clark Kimerer, thank you for your time this morning.

KIMERER: Thank you, Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: Well, Republicans have made a lot of gains lately in attracting Latino voters. But the battle brewing over immigration could end up costing the GOP come November. Ahead, immigration reform's political impact.

Then later, we're going to talk to retired Colonel Janis Karpinski. She, of course, was in charge of Abu Ghraib Prison when the abuse took place. She says she's a scapegoat.

We'll talk about that ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.

We're back in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

S. O'BRIEN: Lawmakers will take up the battle over immigration today.

In Los Angeles this weekend -- take a look at these pictures -- half a million people demonstrating against a proposed new law that they say would treat all illegal immigrants as criminals.

Joining us from Washington, D.C. to talk about this, CNN political analyst and "L.A. Times" columnist Ron Brownstein.

Nice to see you, Ron, as always.

RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST, "LOS ANGELES TIMES": Good morning, Soledad.

S. O'BRIEN: Good morning to you.

First of all, the pictures you see from this protest, I think, a clear indication of just what a hot potato this issue is and is going to be, right?

BROWNSTEIN: Absolutely. You know, immigration is one of these issues that isn't really kind of the symbolic debate that we have in Washington. There is a reality on the ground, as you see in these demonstrations not only in Los Angeles, which you might expect, but around the country, in places like Chicago and Denver and Phoenix, as well.

There are nearly 12 -- roughly 11 to 12 million people who are here illegally. Many more come across the border. Many businesses rely on this labor. Many other Americans are unnerved by this -- by this trend. And so there is an underlying reality here that Congress has to deal with.

Whether they will this year, as Ed Henry said before, is another question.

S. O'BRIEN: Well, let's talk a little bit about some of the proposals that are on the table right now.

First, you have the House legislation. And it says this. It says illegal immigration is a felony. It requires employers to verify workers' status. There are fines for hiring, fences called for along parts of the U.S.-Mexico border and there's no guest worker program.

Then you have the program -- the proposals in the Senate. Senator Specter, for example, requires employers to verify worker status, prison for employers who hire more than 10 illegal immigrants a year and a three year guest worker program.

Senator Frist wants this one -- would add Border Patrol agents and have fines for illegal immigrants. Senator Kennedy and Senator McCain are working jointly on this one: that would allow temporary work visas for six years and illegals could apply for residency and citizenship.

BROWNSTEIN: Yes.

S. O'BRIEN: The president himself says the six year guest worker program increases, as we now know, the number of green cards and opposes amnesty.

And just for everybody who's now thoroughly confused at these various proposals, the current law right now, as it stands, employers can only hire citizens, nationals or authorized immigrants. Employers have to verify identity and it's a felony, of course, to come into the U.S. without authorization after you are deported.

So now we're all sort of at the same...

BROWNSTEIN: Yes, well...

S. O'BRIEN: Yes?

Go ahead.

BROWNSTEIN: I was going to say, I mean that was a very impressive tour of the horizon.

But to sort of cut through...

S. O'BRIEN: Yes, it's a confusing horizon is the problem.

BROWNSTEIN: It is.

But there is a way -- there is sort of a conceptual framework to sort of understand what the debate is really in Washington. I really think there are two kind of forks in the road here. The first question is do you believe you can get a handle on the problem solely by tougher enforcement of the existing law, which is, by and large, the House approach? Or do you think you also have to change the law to create a guest worker program?

And people who believe that argue that the only way to get control of the border is to move most of the people who come across into a legal program that would allow them to come here to work temporarily, and that would allow you to focus your enforcement attention on the last remaining folks who are coming across who are presumably doing so for less admirable reasons.

The second debate is if you -- once you cross that first threshold, if you do believe there should be a guest worker program, what kind of guest worker program should there be? And, in particular, should it allow people who were here illegally a path to citizenship? That's what the advocates call it. The critics call that amnesty.

So those are really the two debates -- enforcement only or comprehensive. And then if there is a comprehensive plan, what kind of guest worker program should there be?

That's the division in the Republican Party, in particular. And that's what we're going to see play out in the Senate over the next couple of weeks.

S. O'BRIEN: But an interesting question to add to those two points, as you say, sort of your forks in the road there, is what's the political impact?

The Hispanics are a big voter bloc. They have historically supported, to some degree, recently, the Republicans. But you also have people who go to the polls and any sort of big issue, like a half a million people marching in L.A. could sway opinion.

BROWNSTEIN: Well, you know, on many issues, the president has governed over these last five plus years in a way to solidify and consolidate his base. This is not one of them. This is one where he is challenging his base in order to appeal to the constituency that has trended away from Republicans in the past.

Hispanics are a very important and growing voter bloc in a lot of important places -- Arizona, Colorado, Florida, Texas, California. The president has improved his performance with those voters from 2000 to 2004, and he has seen immigration reform as, I think, the capstone of that effort.

Now, it's important -- the shadow in all of this, Soledad, the historical precedent that looms over many Republicans is 1994 in California, when Governor Pete Wilson won reelection, in part, by promoting a ballot initiative, Prop 187, to deny public services to illegal immigrants. It led to a sharp backlash, a reduction in the Republican vote among Hispanics there, and really has tilted the state solidly toward the Democrats.

The president, as governor of Texas, when he ran, opposed that kind of idea. He sees this as a way to reach out and what many Republicans fear is if the party consolidates around an enforcement only approach that is seen as harsh, it will undo the gains that he has made in the last few years and send them in the wrong direction among a growing voter bloc.

S. O'BRIEN: We will see, as we say a lot.

Ron Brownstein, CNN political analyst, "L.A. Times" columnist.

Thanks a lot, Ron.

BROWNSTEIN: Thank you.

S. O'BRIEN: Miles.

M. O'BRIEN: Coming up on the program, we'll talk to a friend of that woman accused of killing her preacher husband. She visited Mary Winkler in jail. We'll ask her about that and the note that Winkler asked her to pass along. Plus, it's been about seven months since Katrina hit now. So why are search teams still finding bodies in homes that were already searched, supposedly? We'll take a look, ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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