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American Morning
Tough Questioning; Rumsfeld Effective?; NRA Fired Up; 'Will & Grace' Finale
Aired May 18, 2006 - 07:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: If you like a little pampering when you're away from home listen up. Here is Business 2.0. writer Suzanna Hamner with today's edition of "Road Warriors: Biz on the Go."
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SUSANNA HAMNER, WRITER, BUSINESS 2.0: Looking to make business travel more comfortable? Here's a tip. If you visit the same city often, find a hotel that you like and then schmooze the staff and you're more likely to next time that you come back to get an upgrade on your hotel room or some kind of celebrity-like perks.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back, everybody.
Happening this morning.
Forget what the scientists are saying about the Indonesian volcano near Mount Merapi. Thousands of residents who evacuated because of fears the volcano could erupt, they're returning. CNN's Dan Grant (ph) tells us a mystic is telling the villagers it's OK to return to their homes and they're listening to him.
On Capitol Hill, the U.S. House approves a $2.8 billion budget. Last night's vote fell almost entirely along party lines.
And Southwest Airlines is considering changing its first come first serve seating policy. The airline is changing its computer reservation system so it can go to assigned seating. If Southwest officials say they want to go that way.
Good morning. Welcome, everybody. I'm Soledad O'Brien.
MILES O'BRIEN: And I'm Miles O'Brien. Glad to have you with us this morning.
General Michael Hayden, the man the president would like to run the CIA, heads into a congressional buzz saw today. A bit of a grilling expected. About two hours from now he goes before the Senate panel which will decide whether he is confirmed in that job. Tough questioning expected, as we say. White House Correspondent Ed Henry joining us live now from the White House with more on that.
Hello, Ed.
ED HENRY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Miles.
You're right, there will be tough questions about whether General Hayden has crossed any lines in his fight against terrorism, such as his potential role in this alleged effort by the Bush administration to collect the phone records of millions of Americans, as well as the fact that General Hayden was really the chief architect of that domestic surveillance program, controversial warrantless wiretaps. The White House yesterday clearly trying to take some of the sting out of these sharp questions that he's likely to face today by yesterday going to Capitol Hill and finally briefing the full House and Senate intelligence committees about this domestic surveillance program. Senior Republicans suggest this last minute move will help seal General Hayden's confirmation, but top Democrats are not so sure.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. PAT ROBERTS, (R) INTELLIGENCE CHAIRMAN: The more people that know about the details of this program and the more people that know that a lot of what has been, with all due respect in the media, has been misinformation, I think why the more helpful that will be in defense of the program.
SEN. HARRY REID, (D) MINORITY LEADER: I hope this action has more to do with the new found interest to keep Congress fully informed than about its concerns regarding their nomination of General Hayden.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HENRY: The White House know there will be plenty of fireworks at this hearing, but they're still confident that at the end of the day General Hayden will be confirmed.
Miles.
MILES O'BRIEN: Ed, tell us a little bit about what the president is doing today. He's focused once again on issues along the border, headed to the border. What's he going to be doing?
HENRY: That's right. He's going to Umah (ph), Arizona. He'll be meeting with border patrol agents. Another chance to pitch this immigration reform plan he laid out in that prime time address on Monday night. Having a hard time selling it, though, to fellow conservatives on Capitol Hill. The president's top gun, Karl Rove, yesterday went for a closed door meeting, came out feeling optimistic that they could have some sort of a deal. But a lot of conservative lawmakers left that closed door meeting saying they're really digging in. The conservatives on The Hill still just want border security. They do not want the president's guest worker plan.
Miles.
MILES O'BRIEN: Ed Henry at the White House, thank you. Our coverage of the hearing begins in a special edition of "The Situation Room" beginning at 9:25 Eastern Time. Wolf Blitzer will preside over that. If you're away from your television, you can still stay with that hearing by checking in with our Pipeline service. CNN.com/pipeline is the place for that.
Soledad.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Anti-war activist Cindy Sheehan is in Washington today. She's planning on marching up Connecticut Avenue to Donald Rumsfeld's home. The secretary of defense is under increasingly heavy criticism and some are asking, is it making him less effective? Let's put that question to Pentagon Correspondent Barbara Starr.
Hey, Barbara. Good morning.
BARBARA STARR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you, Soledad.
Well, it is a debate, it is a question that never seems to go away.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
STARR, (voice over): These days protests seem to follow Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld wherever he goes.
DONALD RUMSFELD, DEFENSE SECRETARY: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Liar!
STARR: Yesterday a woman disrupted Rumsfeld's testimony on Capitol Hill.
SEN. TED STEVENS, (R) ALASKA: Security, please remove them.
STARR: Earlier this month at a speech in Atlanta, a silent protester turned his back on Rumsfeld and then this.
RAY MCGOVERN, PROTESTER: I'm Ray McGovern, a 27-year veteran of the Central Intelligence Agency. Why did you lie to get us into a war that was not necessary and that has caused these kinds of casualties? Why?
RUMSFELD: Well, first of all, I haven't lied. I did not lie then.
STARR: But does this public dissent make Rumsfeld any less effective?
BUSH: I decide what is best. And what's best is for Don Rumsfeld to remain as the secretary of defense.
STARR: Rumsfeld watchers say that endorsement makes the secretary a powerhouse.
MICHAEL O'HANLON, SENIOR FELLOW, BROOKINGS INSTITUTION: That doesn't mean you have to like him and it doesn't mean you have to think the policy in Iraq is headed in a good direction. In fact, I think it will go down as a very mixed legacy for him and perhaps even more negative than positive. STARR: Even so, the debate has not ended.
SEN. BYRON DORGAN, (D) NORTH DAKOTA: Are these criticisms by retired generals, are they raising legitimate issues? Are they issues that resonate with you?
RUMSFELD: Well, sure, I take things seriously. And I've wanted to reflect on it. I read a lot of history and I guess I don't think there's ever been a war where there haven't been disputes.
STARR: Two years ago, at the height of the Abu Ghraib scandal, Rumsfeld made it clear that he himself would know when it was time to go.
RUMSFELD: Needless to say, if I felt I could not be effective, I'd resign in a minute. I would not resign simply because people try to make a political issue out of it.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
STARR: Soledad, those days of Abu Ghraib, of course, have passed. But nonetheless, the secretary's closest aides say he was very shaken by all of this recent criticism from retired generals. But the protesters and the critics now these days have only stiffened his resolve to stay on the job.
Soledad.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Interesting. All right, Barbara Starr for us at the Pentagon. Barbara, thanks.
Miles.
MILES O'BRIEN: A controversial grab for guns in the wake of Katrina has the National Rifle Association up in arms. The NRA is out with a full-page ad in papers all across the country. This is from "USA Today." It is asking police chiefs to take a pledge never to disarm law-abiding citizens, especially in times of crisis. Wayne LaPierre is the executive VP and CEO of the NRA. He joins us now from Milwaukee where the NRA is meeting.
Mr. LaPierre, good to have you with us this morning.
WAYNE LAPIERRE, EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT, NRA: Good to be with you, Miles.
MILES O'BRIEN: You know we've anecdotally we've seen pictures of guns being confiscated, but have you really been able to, in all the confusion post-Katrina, to document how many guns were taken away that were owned by law abiding citizens and properly registered?
LAPIERRE: I have. It's definitely hundreds, it may be thousands. I've been down there talking to people and there's just tremendous outrage. The lesson in New Orleans is that when one of these disasters hits, citizens have to be able to rely on their own ability to survive. And the underpinning of that effort to stay alive is the second amendment. At a time when people were completely on their own, there was no 911 at all, people were trying to make it through a long, dark night with looters and robbers out on the streets and breaking into homes, the police chief issued an unjust order to go barging into peoples homes, often at gun point, confiscate their firearms, not give them any receipts or paperwork at all and leave them totally defenseless. And that's wrong.
MILES O'BRIEN: Now Warren Riley is the current police chief. At the time his predecessor, Eddie Compass, was the one who actually issued the order. Warren Riley supported it. I want to tell you what Warren Riley recently said about this as this whole thing was brought to court.
He said we took guns that were stolen that were stashed in alleyways. If we went into an abandon house and a gun was there, absolutely we took that weapon. Obviously there were looters out there. We didn't want some burglar or looter to have an opportunity to arm themselves. That seems like a reasonable statement.
LAPIERRE: The people of New Orleans know that that's not an accurate statement and they need to tell the truth. They're not. We've got documented hundreds of cases where people will tell you what really happened when they were completely alone, that police chief, based on his opinion alone, that doesn't trump the Constitution. That doesn't cancel individual rights. And yet on his opinion alone he said break into houses, take their firearms, and leave them defenseless. And that's what happened. And we're going to make sure it doesn't happen again.
MILES O'BRIEN: Well, let's talk about this though because the governor had issued a state of emergency. And I just want to read a brief passage to you from the Louisiana state statutes as it relates to this. And it says this. "The chief law enforcement officer of the political subdivision effected by the proclamation," declaration of emergency, "may promulgate orders regulating and controlling the possession, storage, display, sale, transport and use of firearms, other dangerous weapons and ammunition." Is that, if you will, enough ammunition for them to do what they did?
LAPIERRE: Well it wasn't according to federal courts in the United States. The NRA immediately brought a federal court case in the eastern district court of Louisiana. We showed plaintiffs where we could prove that they were going into houses, confiscating firearms. We showed that the order was carried out. And the federal court order said that what New Orleans did, the police chief's order, was against the Constitution of the United States. It ordered them to cease and desist from confiscating firearms.
The problem is, the guns were already gone. The people were left defenseless. They have no paperwork to prove that those are their firearms. They still haven't gotten them back. And that's what the NRA wants to prevent from ever happening again. The courts are too late to fix the problem. And these pledges ought to be . . .
MILES O'BRIEN: But let me ask you about this. You've got the second amendment, you've got all kinds of laws supporting the second amendment, including a court rolling recently here. The city of New Orleans didn't even try to defend itself when you took this thing to court. So why is it you need above and beyond all of that, above and beyond a constitutional amendment that guarantees it, a pledge, a written pledge from police chiefs? What good would that do?
LAPIERRE: Because what happened in New Orleans is the courts were after the fact. We need to make sure there's something in real time when a disaster's going on to make sure that this is stopped and doesn't go on. This ought to be an easy pledge for police chiefs and mayors to take. They swore an oath to uphold the Constitution.
Yet if they won't take the pledge, they ought to describe the scenario under which I can get ready for them to come into my home and take my guns. Because as a law-abiding gun owner, I can't think of a scenario where it would be OK for the government so come barging into my house and disarm me and leave me totally defenseless. And that's the way Americans feel all over this country.
It could be a dirty nuke attack, a terrorist attack, another natural disaster. But if that happens, you can't always count on the government to protect you. That's what New Orleans proved. You can count on the robbers, the looters and the bad guys. And people want to be safe.
MILES O'BRIEN: Wayne LaPierre, who is with the National Rifle Association there in Milwaukee for their convention, thank you for your time.
LAPIERRE: Thanks, Miles.
MILES O'BRIEN: Soledad.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: It's 43 minutes past the hour. That means another check of the weather with Rob Marciano who's in for Chad today.
Hey, Rob.
(WEATHER REPORT)
MILES O'BRIEN: Another "American Idol" . . .
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Bites the dust.
MILES O'BRIEN: That would one -- poor guys. Geez, you know.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Sorry. Moves on to something else in his career. Is that better?
MILES O'BRIEN: There were tears everywhere. Even Paula Abdul was crying. I know you're shocked to hear that.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Oh, she cries over everybody.
MILES O'BRIEN: We'll tell you who got the boot coming up. SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: And "Will and Grace" ends its eight season run with tonight's series finale. We're going to show you how the groundbreaking sitcom mixed in a message with its laughs.
MILES O'BRIEN: And later, do you remember this young lady, Erin Peterson? She volunteered to lie around in a bed for three months straight for the greater good of searching and exploring the high frontier. She did it for NASA, believe it or not. Well she's finally out of bed. She took her first steps this week. We're going to check in with her and see show she did. A little lightheaded? You bet. Stay with us for more AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MILES O'BRIEN: Now you've got to wonder if there's any justice. Even Simon, the miserable Simon, said he is the best vocalist they have ever seen in the "American Idol" competition and yet he was out by fractions of a percentage point. Each of them had 33 percent. It was all within the hundredths of a point, believe it or not. Between the three of them, Elliott Yamin out on the "American Idol" program. That leaves Katharine McPhee and Taylor Hicks. Taylor's the gray- haired guy. And they will face off on Tuesday. The big sing-off. Who are you voting for? You don't know. You don't know.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: I don't know. I don't know.
MILES O'BRIEN: Yes, all right, meanwhile, Snoop Dogg, you know, he's not going to be doing much in the United Kingdom we hear. Word is today he has been banned in Britain because of that fight he and his entourage had at duty-free (ph) shop there at Heathrow Airport. Now the question is, will Snoop care?
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Might. Might.
MILES O'BRIEN: It could cost him a lot of benjamins, as he would say, because he won't be able to perform there. But, you know, for Snoop . . .
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Being banned might . . .
MILES O'BRIEN: Grounding your chump change, whatever you want to say . . .
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: It gives him a little more street cred, I think, if he's banned in . . .
MILES O'BRIEN: It is more cred. More jasizzle (ph) or whatever it is. Yes, all right..
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: The sitcom "Will & Grace," which many, of course, credit for bringing TV comedy out of the closet, so to speak. Well today, after eight years, it's time for the final curtain call. Sibila Vargas has our report this morning.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DEBRA MESSING, ACTRESS, "WILL & GRACE": Is you're sexy. You turn me on. That one look at you proves I'm a queer.
SIBILA VARGAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT, (voice over): Clever writing and lovable characters made "Will & Grace" a hit with million.
MEGAN MULLALLY, ACTRESS, "WILL & GRACE": Me say (ph) cheeses (ph), you are rocking my clock, Mary.
VARGAS: But for many, "Will & Grace's" greatest achievement wasn't its comic timing but its message.
ERIC MCCORMACK, ACTOR, "WILL & GRACE": I'm gay.
NEIL GUILIANO, GLAAD PRESIDENT: We know that television has an tremendous impact and influence on peoples beliefs and peoples opinions of other people. So in that sense, "Will & Grace" has done a tremendous service for the gay and lesbian community of America.
VARGAS: (INAUDIBLE) spoke the "l" word, "Queer Eye for the Straight Guy" and "Boy Meets Boy" are just a few of the shows developed in the wake of "Will & Grace's" success, but many of them are now off the air.
GUILIANO: Two percent of the main characters on American television right now are lesbian or gay characters. That has to improve. And we would really hope that the networks will see that from the success of "Will & Grace" they can take that step.
MCCORMACK: Just as black and Latinos have fought to have equal representation on television, you know, so does the gay community need gay characters.
SEAN HAYES, ACTOR, "WILL & GRACE": Are you ready for this Mr. Right. Well, Mr. Right now anyway. But (INAUDIBLE) here all be Jack 2000.
VARGAS: For others, the end of "Will & Grace" is part of an enviable cycle that all TV shows, even ones with strong cultural messages, eventually run their course.
CHRIS LISOTTA, TV WEEK MAGAZINE: If you think of all the great shows in television, from "Mary Tyler Moore," to "M.A.S.H.," to "The Cosby Show," nothing quote unquote replaced them.
MESSING: I think that we're blessed because we're doing exactly what we had always hoped, which would be to go out with people still enjoying us.
VARGAS: While many will lament the loss of this historic sitcom . . .
MULLALLY: I don't think I can go on.
VARGAS: "Will & Grace's" quest for laughter was a mission accomplished.
MULLALLY: There we go, nice and cold. VARGAS: Sibila Vargas, CNN, Hollywood.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: "Will & Grace" won 14 Emmy's during its eight- year stint, including statues for each of the four stars. The series finale airs tonight. AMERICAN MORNING's back in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MILES O'BRIEN: oh, you like that, huh?
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: That's such a cheesy picture.
ANDY SERWER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. What's with the checkerboard.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Hi, I'm Miles O'Brien and I'll be doing Pipeline today at 10:30 a.m. Eastern Time.
SERWER: That a boy.
MILES O'BRIEN: OK. There's the Pipeline -- OK.
SERWER: That is the pipe. Look at the pipe.
MILES O'BRIEN: There's the pipe and there's a line and there's Miles and there's the MilesCam.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: You need a jacket over your shoulder.
MILES O'BRIEN: And if you're really nice, I'll let you do the Soledad-cam today, which is actually part of the plan because I've got some things to do. Not more important than this, but Soledad's going to join in the latter half of this so we have Miles and Soledad-cam.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: I'm sitting in. Sitting in.
MILES O'BRIEN: Here's the drill, though. I forgot to tell you the drill. Am@cnn.com is the place to send the questions. Cnn.com/pipeline, 10:30 a.m. Eastern, the place to see the answers from me and the lovely Soledad O'Brien.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Perfect. Just briefly I'm helping out today.
SERWER: That works. I guess so.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: You know, some places are getting hit harder than others by the housing bubble that appears to be bursting.
SERWER: Yes, well, it's . . .
MILES O'BRIEN: No, it's not. It's not bursting. Would you just stop that?
SERWER: It's sort of . . .
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Lots of hands (ph), yes?
SERWER: Waning, cresting, not doing as well as it used to.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Going downwards.
SERWER: Yes, that's it.
Are we becoming a nation of delinquents? Mortgage delinquents that is. Apparently this is the case. A story in "The Wall Street Journal" this morning talking about delinquencies, mortgage delinquencies on the rise. Still low historically, but definitely climbing. And the interesting part here is, they were starting to see delinquencies from mortgages that originated last year in 2005. Usually it takes three years for delinquencies to start to crop up. So that is not a good sign. You can see here up to 4.7 percent, up from 4.38 in 2004.
Here's an interesting stat though. Twenty-nine percent of those who took out mortgages last year have no equity in their homes or owe more than their home is worth. That is a bad sign.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Wow.
SERWER: Yes.
MILES O'BRIEN: That is upside down, as they say.
SERWER: That is bad.
MILES O'BRIEN: Yes.
SERWER: And here's an interesting one also in the housing business. Well, which state leads the nation in foreclosures? Nevada? California? No. Colorado. Get this. As of last month, 3,706 homes in Colorado were foreclosed. That's one out of 494 homes. As opposed to the overall national average, one out of 1,268. So you wouldn't really suspect Colorado.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: I know. I wouldn't have picked that.
MILES O'BRIEN: No.
SERWER: There's a lot of building there and that may account for it.
MILES O'BRIEN: Kind of rocky there, so to speak.
SERWER: Yes, indeed.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: All right, Andy, thank you very much.
SERWER: You're welcome.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: A short break. A look at our top stories when we come back starting the next hour. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
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