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Nancy Grace
CSI of the Animal World
Aired May 29, 2006 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Tonight, incredible stories of animals to the rescue, real-life pet detectives, true cases of dogs, cats, even pigs -- not kidding -- using their skills to fight crime, crack cold cases and even save lives. Tonight, the "CSI" of the animal world, a lab that uses animal DNA to solve crime.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Use your nose. Use your nose. One (ph)! One! Where is he? Get him! Drop the weapon! Drop the weapon!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening, everybody. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us tonight. Tonight, a very special show. Animals take a bite out of crime. Tonight, we meet a highly decorated police dog that tracks down the bad guys, a cat who calls 911, and we go inside a California lab, the "CSI" of the animal kingdom.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In a human lab, all they have to worry about is humans. With us, we`re doing dogs, cats, horse, llamas, alpacas, elk, white-tailed deer. I mean, the list goes on. There`s definitely an increase in the number of cases that we`re seeing, and part of that, I think, is just more and more people are becoming aware that animal DNA evidence is another tool to use.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Tonight, in addition to some real pet detectives, a face you know well, a special guest for us here on the NANCY GRACE show, Jack Hanna with the Columbus Zoo, his show, "Jack Hanna Into the Wild."
Our first guest tonight is Robert Kornfeld. He is out of the East Hartford Police K-9 unit. And with him, his special guest, Sergeant Joe Friday. Tell me all about Sergeant Friday, please.
ROBERT KORNFELD AND "FRIDAY," RET. EAST HARTFORD POLICE K-9 UNIT: Well, Friday`s a 9-and-a-half-year-old German shepherd, and both us just retired recently. I`ve been retired for about a month, him about the same. And we`re both enjoying retirement. He still has a work ethic, and he really wants to go and work when it`s really not the correct time for him. But he had a great career.
GRACE: Like when you`re having your morning coffee?
(LAUGHTER)
KORNFELD: When I`m having my morning coffee. Right now, we have a nice life. We`re living on a boat, and so we`re patrolling the marina, and he really enjoys that.
GRACE: Now, tell me, how did you get involved with police dogs?
KORNFELD: Well, I`ve been an officer now about 20 years.
GRACE: Yes.
KORNFELD: And I started doing patrol work, and I realized I needed something else to do besides just doing patrol work, so I started the K-9 unit. And right now, it`s grown to -- we`re up to five dogs, and I can`t believe where it`s gotten to so far. We`ve done a lot of competition and found lost children and catching the bad guys.
GRACE: What are Sergeant Friday`s specialities?
KORNFELD: Specialities are, is his nose, and he can track for scents that have been long gone. We`ve tracked a missing child, went away in a big-wheel and just forgot to tell Mom where he was going. So for that 20 to 30 minutes, the parents were just in absolute terror, didn`t know where their child was. So we just started tracking. I didn`t think he could do it. I wasn`t sure. But I got nothing to lose but try. And he was able to track a big-wheel.
JACK HANNA, DIR. EMERITUS, COLUMBUS ZOO: You know, Nancy, can I interject something?
GRACE: Yes.
HANNA: Is that these dogs are amazing. I`ve worked with them over the last 10 years on two separate shows. They actually -- when they had the earthquake in California, these dogs found me in rubble. I went to a fake place, a fake earthquake thing, and they found me in rubble that it was impossible to see where I was. You know, you see this on TV, but until it happens to you -- then I went in the woods up in LA -- up in the mountains up there, and went out there for half an hour, hiding, and they actually, at that point, found me then. And the stories go on and on, what these dogs can do.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Watch him. Show me your hands! Police with a K- 9! Stop or I`ll send the dog! Get him! Get him!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bad guy, stop moving or I`ll release the dog.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Good dog! What a good boy!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Good dog, buddy!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Good boy!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Some of the dog behavior he`s doing now is he`s thrashing it. It goes back to his primal instincts.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Use your nose. Use your nose. Where is he? Use your nose. That`s a boy. Use your nose. Use your nose. One! One! Where is he? Get him! Drop the weapon! Drop the weapon!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That`s it. Slip the sleeve. Stand still! Break!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And to take a deeper look at the animal kingdom, there`s no greater expert than Jack Hanna. He is with the Columbus Zoo, and he also has his own show, "Jack Hanna Into the Wild." Here on the set, an agouti and a sloth. I`ve always wanted to meet a sloth.
HANNA: Yes, a lot of people don`t know that much about sloths, even though they`re not -- they`re threatened in some areas, not really endangered. This is a two-toed sloth. Or a three -- there`s a two-toed, right? And the three-toed. Now, the sloth, as you see -- feel that fur?
GRACE: It`s so soft.
HANNA: Very, very soft. Remember something. The sloth can spend his entire life in two or three trees, number one. Number two, they go so slow that algae grows on their backs. So when we film them in the wild, it`s very, very difficult to even tell that they`re a sloth. They hang upside down. They eat upside down. They breed upside down. They have their babies upside down. And they come down on the ground once a week to go to the bathroom because if they went in the trees, the jaguars, the harpy eagles would hear that and they would attack them. So this is from the Niabi Zoo, as well, as from -- Tom (ph) brought it down here because I`m so fascinated by this animal every time I see it.
GRACE: Well, he`s trying to go up!
HANNA: You see how slow he went?
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Yes, but where is he trying to go?
HANNA: He saw a light up there he wanted to go to.
GRACE: You know, that is amazing. Instinctively, they know not to urinate or defecate right below their tree, or predators would find them.
HANNA: Exactly. Exactly.
GRACE: And what about the agouti?
HANNA: The agouti is from central South America, as well. It`s in the rodent family. And this animal hunted a great deal for food, the little agouti here. And they also -- an animal that is a -- I`ll use the word pollinator. That`s not exactly correct. This animal goes around and eats a lot of the Brazil -- a lot of nuts, for example. And they`ll take the nuts and hide them, and then they`ll come back and maybe not -- forget where they are. So what this animal is doing is actually taking tree seeds and planting them all over the rain forest. So this is a very important animal to the rain forest, as well as a source of food for many people who live there -- called the agouti. You would think it`s a big rat, and some people say that. The largest over there is the capybara.
GRACE: Where is your next trip? You just got back from Kenya.
HANNA: Yes. We`re looking at going maybe into the -- the -- over into Borneo and Sumatra with orangutans or going into Australia -- we just got back two years ago from Australia -- and go back in the outback again.
GRACE: jack, what do you think when you hear these stories, like from Elizabeth Wicktom (ph), from Jane Velez-Mitchell, like the cat that dialed 911? When you see animals in the wild, how do those stories strike you?
HANNA: Well, I often say it, you know, people sometimes refer to people and say, That guy`s acting like a -- let`s say a murderer, That guy`s an animal. I don`t like it when they say that because animals wouldn`t usually do that. And so when I`m in the wild and I see animals in their native -- where they live, whatever continent it is, you must remember that these animals wouldn`t -- most animals wouldn`t abuse their young. Most animals wouldn`t kill each other. Most animals do kill because they have to...
GRACE: Speaking of child abuse, remember what you told me? Would you tell the viewers?
HANNA: Right. In Columbus and other cities, when you find animal abuse in a home, bad animal abuse, a lot of the times, a great percentage of time, you find child abuse or spousal abuse. So it just shows you people have to learn -- and I`m a very big proponent of young people having pets when they`re young because it really helps. It really does.
GRACE: You`re now about to meet two very special guests joining us. Oh, gosh!
HANNA: Isn`t this beautiful? These are beautiful...
GRACE: Oh!
HANNA: ... white lion cubs. Isn`t this something, this one here? I`ll let you take the bottle. Aren`t they beautiful? These are one of the few in the world. And the white lion cub...
GRACE: Oh!
HANNA: ... is not an albino. They carry a recessive gene. The first ones I ever saw, Nancy, were about in the early `80s, in the Pretoria zoo in South Africa. They`re the ones that had the first ones.
GRACE: Oh, my gosh! Isn`t this beautiful?
HANNA: Isn`t that something? Now, you know, we talk about how do we tie this into what were you just talking about. A lot of people think that the lion...
GRACE: Quick, more formula!
(LAUGHTER)
HANNA: The lion being the king of beasts -- what people don`t know is...
GRACE: You are the king of beasts!
HANNA: Well, they refer to it as the king of beasts, but...
GRACE: Please do not eat my finger. I need that.
HANNA: But -- but really, the lions -- you know, they will -- elephants, they don`t particularly run and attack elephants or rhinos or that type of thing...
GRACE: Will he bite me if I hold him?
HANNA: I don`t know. Are you allergic to cats?
GRACE: No, not this one.
(LAUGHTER)
HANNA: But they get to be about 400 or 500 pounds. They rely on their numbers when they hunt. They rely on the numbers of cats. They each have a certain job to do in a hunt like that. So the lion is the animal that is very powerful, but they`re also a very social cat. A lot of cats are not that social.
GRACE: What is this one named?
HANNA: This is -- which one is this one?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That`s Atlas.
HANNA: Atlas. This is Atlas.
GRACE: I think he likes me.
HANNA: By the way, one of the other few breeders are, is also Siegfried and Roy, who did a beautiful job breeding the white lions as well.
GRACE: Now, where do you -- this is a very rare animal.
HANNA: Right.
GRACE: How many are there of these in the world?
HANNA: Well, it`s hard to say anymore. You know, back in the `80s, there were very, very few, like, you know, maybe 30 or 40. But today, they say there are upwards of maybe, you know, a 100 or 150 of them throughout the world.
GRACE: Now, what were you saying about them having individual jobs when they hunt?
HANNA: Well, yes, they have individual jobs when they hunt, you know, the lions do, as far as...
GRACE: The bottom of his paws feels like fingers and flesh. They really do.
HANNA: The one lion, for example, would go out, and let`s say a herd of zebra would see one lion. And they would see -- and they`d pay attention to that, while the others go way, way around, who knows, maybe a mile away on the back side. And so then they start chasing them towards the one that`s in the bushes. And the zebra obviously don`t know that. And then another could be the left flank. So to watch an lion kill is an incredible thing. It takes us about three or four cameras to really get the entire process. It`s a...
GRACE: So the instinct -- they actually have a division of labor.
HANNA: A division of labor. Exactly. Right. And they even keep -- the one female -- they`ll choose which female stays back and stays with the cubs while the others go out and hunt, unlike a tiger, which is solitary, unlike a jaguar, solitary. These animals are social. That`s how they live as...
GRACE: Is it true that you met your wife through a donkey?
HANNA: Yes~!
(LAUGHTER)
HANNA: Well, yes, I did. At college...
GRACE: So animals are not just pet detectives, they`re match-makers.
(LAUGHTER)
HANNA: I never thought of it that way.
GRACE: You know!
HANNA: You`re right.
GRACE: You know!
HANNA: I tried to get her to breast-feed a chimpanzee once, when my daughter was born.
GRACE: Wait. Wait. OK, we can edit that out. I want to hear about...
HANNA: There`s nothing wrong with that.
GRACE: ... meeting your wife through a donkey.
HANNA: She said no, anyway. What?
GRACE: OK, good. I want to hear about you meeting your wife through a donkey.
HANNA: Well, I played football in college, and I raised donkeys in Tennessee on our farm, and I told the guy at the school I wasn`t going to come there unless I could bring my donkey. So he let me bring the donkey.
(LAUGHTER)
HANNA: And I put him behind the place I lived, the dormitory. And I had a little barn built for him. And she was a cheerleader, so he became our mascot at Muskegon (ph) College. Had -- put a little "M" blanket on it, you know? We`d take him out (INAUDIBLE) on the football field. His name was Doc. I had donkeys -- I had, like, 12 of them.
GRACE: Now, when you hear these stories of pet detectives, how does that strike you?
HANNA: Well, you know, it used to strike me as something -- I just -- Is this a hoax? Or I didn`t believe it. But I want to tell you something. It`s amazing what these animals can do as far as detectives. The dog is a -- I can tell you story after story about German shepherds and what they have done to help detectives.
But animals -- animals have DNA. Animals have -- you know, there was even a story where -- I think you had it here, where a person had murdered somebody and the dog urinated on a truck, and then they found out -- the robber because of the dog`s urine, the DNA.
GRACE: That`s right.
HANNA: Bugs, insects, for example, incredible animals as far as DNA. If you kill a person that`s out here in Central Park and then you move the body, some of the bugs would be water bugs that`d be on the body.
GRACE: Wait! Discovery. I think that he`s ticklish. He keeps trying to move his foot away.
HANNA: Oh, I thought you were (INAUDIBLE) tickling...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Rosie, do we have Jane Velez with us, Jane Velez-Mitchell? Jane, can you -- hi, friend. Can you tell us...
JANE-VELEZ-MITCHELL, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER, ANIMAL ACTIVIST: How`re you doing?
GRACE: I`m good. Oh, you know, I know you`re an animal lover. I wish you were here. Jane, tell us the story about the dog that urinated on the tire and a murderer was caught.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: This is an absolutely amazing story. To show you how animal fibers and animal hairs and animal urine can be instrumental, Nancy, in solving crime, a woman in Iowa was attacked by a man who showed up in a truck. It was an extremely traumatic experience for her. She couldn`t pick him out of a line-up. She just had fragmented recollections. And one of her recollections was looking over and seeing her dog peeing on the tire of this man`s truck.
GRACE: Jane, we don`t say "pee" on this show, OK?
(LAUGHTER)
GRACE: So look what I`ve got. OK, go ahead. And please, no, no "P" word.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. So in any case, they decide they`re going to test the tire. They`re also going to take a DNA swab from the dog. Guess what? It was a match, and the guy ended up pleading guilty.
And I want to say very briefly, while animals are doing so much to save human lives, humans can save animal lives. This is a little guy who was just rescued from the LA dog shelter, dumped there when he was just a couple of days old. And he now has a home right here with yours truly.
GRACE: Yay, Jane!
VELEZ-MITCHELL: (INAUDIBLE) many, many shelter dogs (INAUDIBLE)
GRACE: Well, we`ll meet your dog in a moment, but I`m about to have a bond forfeiter. Someone is trying to break out.
Let`s quickly to tonight`s dog tracking. There you go, Jack. Here he comes.
A tiny puppy named Midge joined an Ohio sheriff`s department as one of the world`s smallest detectives. Midge, a Chihuahua/rat terrier mix, weighs in at 5 pounds. Midge focuses on drugs. Pet detective Midge`s weapon? A keen sense of smell. Go, Midge, go!
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: Welcome back, everybody. Thank you for being with us. Tonight, we are focusing on real-life pet detectives, animals from the wild kingdom that solve crimes. And we`re taking a look at all types of animals.
You`re a pig!
HANNA: Yes, this is not some pig...
GRACE: Actually, he is a hog.
HANNA: This is...
GRACE: And you have bad table manners. You need to wipe -- yes, OK.
HANNA: This, Nancy, is a warthog. I just got back from Africa...
GRACE: Yes!
HANNA: ... with our show, "Into the Wild," and this -- this warthog has...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNA: ... incredible smell. You were talking about smelling...
GRACE: You mean sense of smell or stinky smell?
HANNA: Stinky smell. No, no. Well, a little of both (INAUDIBLE) smell. But this smell of this animal...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNA: Be careful of your fingers because, I`m not kidding, they have teeth...
GRACE: No. I know.
HANNA: They`re like scissors.
GRACE: Oops!
HANNA: They have little teeth up there like scissors.
GRACE: I just got gummed.
HANNA: But the warthog, if you notice, it`s kind of ugly, you think, that -- some people think...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Well, I`m kind of getting used to it.
HANNA: But pigs are very intelligent, OK? Hogs and pigs are very intelligent. I saw an act once with pigs, and it was unbelievable.
(CROSSTALK)
HANNA: No, that`s with pigs. Pigs jumped up and went down slides and rode bicycles, an incredible act. Now, the warthog has a little tail. You can`t see it back there, but -- hold that up, will you, please?
GRACE: Look at his long hair!
HANNA: See this little tail? It`s like an antenna. Don`t know if you can see it or not. Hold it up there, if you would, so they can see that. See that little tail?
GRACE: Yes.
HANNA: That tail stays flat. When the animal`s alarmed, it takes off, it puts that tail up as a warning to other little warthogs, like this (INAUDIBLE) straight up like this, real hard...
GRACE: OK...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNA: ... other little warthogs that something`s coming. And they`re very, very fast. The warthog actually is a very difficult animal. Lions love warthogs, and other animals in Africa, but you have to be very careful because their teeth are like scissors.
GRACE: Are they angry animals?
HANNA: Angry?
GRACE: Yes.
HANNA: No, not really. They`re not angry...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: What do they -- OK, this one is eating apples and carrots, but what else do they eat when they can`t get apples and carrots fed to them?
HANNA: They root (INAUDIBLE) tubulars (ph) down on the ground, underneath the bushes and plants and that kind of thing. They`ve very social creatures...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: I don`t know how, with these table manners.
(LAUGHTER)
HANNA: Well, they -- you know, have you ever seen a warthog this nice?
GRACE: Not this close up.
HANNA: No. You haven`t. People think of warthogs as, like, one of the ugliest animals in Africa, but...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: ... but he`s really -- and look, he`s got a little mohawk!
HANNA: Right. Right. That`s exactly right.
GRACE: OK. OK, Jane, have you ever met a warthog?
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I have actually had encounters with pigs, and they are...
GRACE: Well, you know what? I...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: ... extremely intelligent animals.
GRACE: You`ve had encounters with pigs? Is there anything you want to share with us?
(LAUGHTER)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, actually, because I`m an animal activist and I go to rescue organizations...
GRACE: Oh, there she goes! I was wondering how long it would take! Go ahead, Miss PETA!
(LAUGHTER)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I go to groups like Animal Acres here in Los Angeles, where they rescue farm animals that have been abused and they allow them to live the way animals should live. Pigs are incredibly intelligent animals, as intelligent as dogs. They have an incredible sense of smell. As you`ve just been seeing there, they are sentient creatures with feelings. They are being used by some in some test cases to sniff out drugs and...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Oh, drug pigs!
VELEZ-MITCHELL: ... law enforcement...
GRACE: Have you heard of that?
(CROSSTALK)
HANNA: Yes. Yes.
GRACE: Hold on just a sec, Jane. Have you heard of that?
HANNA: No, no. She`s -- Jane`s right, as far as their smell. They could easily -- if they were taught about drugs or heroin or marijuana or whatever, they could -- I think, really, a pig could be a neat animal. I don`t think if you could...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: So those of you that have never met a warthog -- what`s his name?
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Oh, it`s a girl. And you`re beautiful. You`re beautiful.
(LAUGHTER)
GRACE: Quick break, everybody. Let`s go to tonight`s "Cat Tracker." In Columbus, Ohio, Tommy the cat is a local hero. Tommy`s owner fell from his wheelchair and could not call 911, but police did get a call from the home, although no one used the phone. When police arrived, Tommy was lying by the telephone. Somehow, this miraculous cat called 911, pushing the right buttons.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: Tonight, we are live with members of the animal kingdom. We`re talking about real-life pet detectives, animals of all sorts -- dogs, tracker dogs, scent dogs, drug dogs, even a cat that called 911. The tiniest drug dog in the world, Midge is only nine pounds.
Right now, I`d like to introduce you to -- what is its name?
HANNA: Monty python.
GRACE: Right.
(LAUGHTER)
GRACE: I`m not a snake person, and I`m detecting a bulge.
HANNA: Well, no, it might have eaten something that...
GRACE: Did that used to be a rabbit?
HANNA: I don`t know what it was.
GRACE: A wittle wabbit?
HANNA: I don`t know what it is. But -- but you...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: ... Britney Spears. She can hold a snake. Now, what were you saying about losing your hand?
HANNA: No, no. This part of my fingers here -- in 1972, I was working with a snake about twice this big, and I was taking the -- it was shedding. See, this one`s shedding? You got to be very careful when a snake sheds...
GRACE: Oh, because...
HANNA: ... because their eyes get covered, and they don`t know -- they protect themselves. And he just grabbed that part of my hand. But what you got to know about snakes, their smell is great, but they have 200 teeth like fishhooks, these snakes do. And this -- their teeth (INAUDIBLE) up in their jaws. So when they bite, the hooks go into you, and you can`t pull your hand out because it has to relax its jaw muscles for about 20 to 30 minutes, and then you can remove your hand.
GRACE: If this bites, why is it here?
HANNA: No, not this one! I didn`t say this one bit. That was the one I was working with in the wild.
GRACE: How do you know it`s not this one? Can you do a snake line- up?
HANNA: No, you never know. That`s a good point. You never know that. You never know that.
GRACE: How many defense attorneys could this thing digest?
HANNA: A lot.
(LAUGHTER)
GRACE: I mean, there are lumps, people. There are lumps. This thing is clearly -- it`s like it ate a bowling ball, and it`s, like, going...
HANNA: But they can get up to 30 to 32 feet...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: How long is this one?
GRACE: This is about 12-and-a-half feet. This is from the Niabi zoo up in the quad cities in Iowa. So it`s a beautiful -- this is a beautiful snake, isn`t it? Well...
GRACE: I keep seeing pocketbooks and shoes.
HANNA: No, no, no, no, no. Not anymore.
GRACE: No, no, no. That`s wrong. That`s wrong.
HANNA: But this is a Burmese python from Asia. And these animals are -- lay eggs. They`re not live bearers. They lay their eggs, and they circle around and they twitch every 20 or 30 seconds to heat the eggs up. Hatches -- or hatch (INAUDIBLE)
GRACE: This is from where?
HANNA: ... forty days. The Niabi Zoo, quad cities in...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: And what is the -- what is the -- this is the python?
HANNA: The python, yes. You have the python, the boa constrictor and the anaconda, your constrictors. You know the anaconda, the big old TV show...
GRACE: I saw the...
HANNA: Oh, you saw the...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: No, I saw the trailers for the movie and...
HANNA: Yes. They like the water. This likes the land.
GRACE: OK. Good. SO this is -- how long did you say?
HANNA: This is about 12 feet.
GRACE: You know, it seems so much bigger.
HANNA: Yes, but it`s not. You see how this lays here? That`s its means of defense mechanism. You talk about how an animal hunts or crime solvers, or whatever you call it. But this -- the smell -- not the eyesight, it`s just they lay there like a log. So if you have a young antelope, a young antelope that doesn`t really know much, and they just walk up thinking it`s a log. And the snake strikes in, like, a split -- you can`t even film it, it happens so fast. It strikes and circles around its prey and it squeezes. Every time you take a breath, it squeezes. So then you can`t breathe and...
GRACE: So this is the snake that actually can...
HANNA: The eyeballs pop out, and he swallow it whole.
(CROSSTALK)
HANNA: Does the python squeeze?
HANNA: Oh, yes.
GRACE: I thought the boa constrictor squeezed.
HANNA: They squeeze, too, and the anaconda squeezes. All of them squeeze.
HANNA: How can a snake eat a whole baby antelope?
HANNA: Oh, they can do it. I`ve seen them eat a larger antelope in Africa.
GRACE: You mean swallow...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNA: Sometimes the antlers get stuck in the mouth. But see, their jaws -- their jaws unhinge, you follow me? They get -- this snake could probably -- he could probably -- (INAUDIBLE) a guy in Pittsburgh got eaten four years ago by his pet python in his basement. They found half his body hanging out. He couldn`t swallow the whole body. So you got to be careful when they get this big.
GRACE: I don`t like the way you two are looking at me!
(LAUGHTER)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HANNA: Hold it up higher, where the milk comes out with no air. That`s it. There we go. Up there like this. There we go. Oh, you`re good. You want to come to the zoo and work?
GRACE: Yes.
HANNA: See, he loses all of his weight. But the African lion -- you`re right, though. The females do al the hunting, and then the male sits back and eats the kill.
He`s a male. It`s not like a regular animal where they have a certain time of year...
GRACE: Welcome back, everybody. Tonight, a very special show with my favorite guests ever, wild animals and Jack Hanna. He is director emeritus at the Columbus Zoo. And he has his own show, "Jack Hanna: Into the Wild." He even met his wife, his life`s mate, through a donkey.
Now, wait a minute. What are those? Am I supposed to guess?
HANNA: See, you guessed a buzzard, right? It`s not.
GRACE: Well, when I saw the beak, I thought buzzard. Now I`m guessing condor?
HANNA: No, we didn`t -- these, everybody, are red-tail hawks. People don`t realize this. These are only four weeks old. A red-tail hawk, as you know -- remember in New York City you some red-tail hawk outside of the hotel? They tried to move it and all that kind of stuff?
GRACE: Yes. Pale Male...
HANNA: Is that right? That`s right.
GRACE: Right, that was his name.
HANNA: But these birds -- this is what amazes me -- these birds are only four weeks old. Can you imagine?
GRACE: You`re not supposed to touch birds, are you?
HANNA: Well, the bird flu, right, that`s...
GRACE: No, I thought, because, if they smell the human scent on each other -- guys, they`re cuddling. They`re nuzzling.
HANNA: Aren`t they something?
GRACE: Can I touch one?
HANNA: Oh, yes. This is the first time we`ve had the red-tail hawks. We use these for educational programs...
GRACE: Wait, wait, wait. Their feathers feel like silk.
HANNA: Isn`t that amazing?
GRACE: Oh, they`re cuddling. They`re cuddling.
HANNA: See the little tails? Now, they sit up -- I don`t know if the camera can see their feet, how big their feet -- this animal grows quicker than almost any animal there is, Nancy.
You`ve got to remember something: The American bald eagle is born and is full size in about probably about 12 to 14 weeks, his full size, not the color of the bald eagle. These animals here are only four weeks old and they gain literally ounces every day, every day just a major amount of weight every day.
And then the animals have to fledge, which means fledge and go out and fly. Once these little babies -- see the little baby, the little down here, isn`t that amazing? It`s like a...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: These are four weeks old?
HANNA: Right. And the mother will come and catch rats and mice and bring them to them, tear the thing, and then feed the little birds.
GRACE: Now, what are their characteristics of these?
HANNA: Well, the eyesight. You know, we talk about defense mechanisms and this type of thing. The eyesight -- this bird is probably six to eight times greater than yours. Some people say that a bald eagle can read a newspaper at the end of a football field.
GRACE: You mean better than 20/20 and 20/18?
HANNA: Yes, a little bit better. Because without their eyesight, they have nothing. When they`re soaring up in there, the bird of prey, and they come down about 125, 150 miles an hour, and grab their prey with those talons, then that`s how they have to learn how to hunt.
GRACE: Please remember, when you grow up and you`re a predator, that I`m your friend.
HANNA: No, they`re not going to hurt you. A predator, Nancy -- also, their beaks. You see their beaks? You know that`s used for tearing. A parrot doesn`t have a beak like that. So this beak is used for tearing meat, so that`s a bird of prey.
GRACE: What do you feed them in captivity?
HANNA: Well, right now Suzie Rapple (ph) here from the Columbus Zoo, she has to grind up mice.
GRACE: OK, now I know why I went to law school. It`s all coming back to me. Now, who is this little creature?
HANNA: This is Chucky the groundhog.
GRACE: You`re cute.
HANNA: Aren`t they cute? They`re born, Nancy, without any fur and they`re born -- it looks like a little skin, a little mouse or a rat when they`re born. And they`re born usually around April or May. And, remember, the groundhog goes asleep probably around November or December, when it gets cold, and he comes up around -- what is -- when is Groundhog Day, February, March whenever it is. February what?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: February 2nd.
HANNA: No, it`s not. It`s too early.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: February 2nd.
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: It`s "ish."
HANNA: Yes, the groundhog goes back to sleep, because he knows it`s too cold then, so he goes back to sleep.
GRACE: You`re not a morning person.
HANNA: And the groundhogs are pretty good at eluding -- you talk about crime. If somebody is trying to come after a groundhog and kill her, some predator, they go and they burrow. But they`re very intelligent. They have different burrows. And they hide in this burrow, and yet, right before, they might have been over in this burrow. So, you know, they fake out the predators.
GRACE: You fake them out. What`s this one`s name?
HANNA: Chucky.
GRACE: Suzie (ph), what do you have?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is a baby fisher.
HANNA: A baby fisher. This is a baby fisher cat? But not a cat.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is not a cat. It`s in the weasel family, but...
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You know what? You got to watch it here.
HANNA: Oh, that`s right. You hold it. I`m sorry.
GRACE: What is the difference between...
HANNA: Have "National Geographic" right here on the show.
GRACE: ... that and a kinkajou? Oh, were they going to have a -- OK, an incident.
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He`s just starting to look.
HANNA: You`ve got to remember something. The fisher cat...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Fisher. Fisher.
HANNA: You were asking something...
GRACE: What`s the difference between that and a kinkajou?
HANNA: Well, a kinkajou is from South America, a honey bear. There`s no -- this is out on the Western coast. Now, the interesting thing about this animal, everyone, is this is the animal, one of its main diets is the porcupine.
GRACE: Oh, that`s not very nice.
HANNA: No, but how would this animal do that? When this animal gets grown, pound for pound it`s one of the -- this animal will go after everything, basically, it can eat, even pound for pound.
GRACE: Can I hold it?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Sure.
GRACE: Is it going to try to eat my jacket?
(CROSSTALK)
HANNA: Don`t put him with the groundhog. Let me have the groundhog.
Now, the fisher, Nancy, it`s very important, because the fisher cat was almost hunted or trapped to extinction back in the 1920s, all right? What happened to the porcupine population? The porcupine population in the West, Washington State, exploded because all the fishers were gone. And then the porcupines took all the trees down.
GRACE: Hey, hey, hey, you. Don`t go down there, please.
HANNA: No, they can go inside your jacket. He just wants...
GRACE: That`s not where he was going.
HANNA: Oh.
(LAUGHTER)
GRACE: You`re rude. Did you know that`s a criminal offense? OK, go ahead. What type of...
HANNA: But they`re an animal that have very, very sharp teeth. It`s almost like a weasel in some ways. But they`ll take down just about anything they can. It`s like a...
GRACE: A wolverine.
HANNA: A wolverine, exactly, like a wolverine. A wolverine will try to go after an elk, if they have to. These animals will do the same thing. But the porcupine -- they actually circle...
GRACE: What did you say it is? I`m sorry.
HANNA: A fisher.
GRACE: A fisher cat?
HANNA: No, it`s not a cat, though. It`s just called a fisher. It`s in the weasel family. It will circle the porcupine like this real fast, and then try and bite him in the bottom. And then the porcupine is real soft.
GRACE: OK, it`s going down my back, people. You might want to catch him.
(CROSSTALK)
HANNA: Look at this. Now, you can hold this, Nancy.
GRACE: Bye.
HANNA: This is beautiful here. As a matter of fact, recently you might have read about the albino kangaroo that was just born. This is an albino wallaby. Not very many of them.
GRACE: He`s beautiful. Wait, let me -- let me see.
HANNA: This comes from the Niabi Zoo, again, Quad Cities. Look at that.
GRACE: He`s got pink eyes.
HANNA: Exactly, albino, see, just like albino snake. That`s why the white lions, if you noticed, didn`t have -- they have the recessive gene. These animals...
GRACE: Look at the little hands.
HANNA: Aren`t they something?
GRACE: Is this a boy or girl?
HANNA: Well, right now it`s too early.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s a girl. It`s a girl.
HANNA: It`s a girl.
GRACE: Look. It`s beautiful.
HANNA: What is this? You know what this is, a marsupial. When this animal is born, it comes out of the birth canal. It looks like a lima bean.
GRACE: It`s shy.
HANNA: It comes out on the outside of the tummy, Nancy, and then goes into the pouch, all right, where it`s raised. It attaches to the nipple and stays there six months right there in the pouch.
GRACE: In the pouch.
HANNA: That`s why it`s a marsupial.
(CROSSTALK)
HANNA: The wallaby can have three babies at a time, Nancy, three babies. It can be coming out of the pouch, going in the pouch, and breeding at the same time. Can you imagine that? Three babies, different stages of life at one time. The wallaby, by the way, is a kangaroo. People say, "Oh, wallaby and kangaroo are different." The wallaby is a kangaroo. It`s just smaller. There are about 30 different types of wallabies...
GRACE: Now, where does it come from?
HANNA: Australia. This is from the Niabi Zoo, again...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Now, where will this one go when it grows up? It`s trying to cuddle.
HANNA: They have a beautiful Australian habitat up there, so he`ll be hopping out. And, see, in the zoological world, when the mother pushes one out prematurely, it will die in the wild. When the zoological parks -- because they`re raised in these pouches. She`ll push them out, because the other one is trying to get in the pouch. So a lot of times, as I said, they`ll have three babies at one time they`re trying to take care of.
GRACE: You just got back from Kenya, correct?
HANNA: Yes, yes.
GRACE: Did you observe the lions there?
HANNA: Oh, yes, we observed lions in many different places, in the Serengeti, in the migration. We were with the gorillas in Rwanda (INAUDIBLE) country Rwanda. We went a lot of places.
GRACE: OK, when we come back, we`re going to be joined by Lucky the turtle. Will you quickly tell the story about what he does every morning?
HANNA: Oh, Lucky the tortoise. At the Columbus Zoo, Lucky -- he comes out of his little enclosure every morning, goes down the hallway 30 feet, a left turn 10 feet, a right turn 10 feet, sits in front of the refrigerator until we feed him two tomatoes, then he goes back to where he lives.
(LAUGHTER)
True story. We love Lucky.
GRACE: We`ll be right back, everybody. Stay with us. Jack Hanna with us, director emeritus of the Columbus Zoo. His show, "Jack Hanna: Into the Wild."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HANNA: Oh, wow. Jeez.
GRACE: Oh, god.
HANNA: Wasn`t that something?
AL CICERE, AMERICAN EAGLE FOUNDATION: Hey, Nancy.
GRACE: Wow.
HANNA: Hey, Al. This is Al Cicere, a very close friend of mine. And he`s the head of the American Eagle Foundation, and this is Challenger. And I`m going to let Al tell you a little bit about this, because this is - - this to me is what our country represents.
GRACE: Is that raw meat in your hand?
CICERE: Right, he`s eating a piece of quail meat. It was one of his favorite treats. And Challenger is the first bald eagle in U.S. history trained to free fly during the national anthem.
(NEWSBREAK)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We`re never the smoking gun in a case, but we`re definitely able to help with other evidence to say that, yes, that this person was at this spot. You know, generally they`re making a claim, "Oh, I was in Mexico or I was somewhere wherever else," and we`re able to say, "No, you weren`t."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Welcome back, everyone. Real-life pet detectives, our furry and scaly friends, from the animal kingdom are with us tonight. Here on the set with me, a very special guest -- you know him well -- Jack Hanna. He is with the Columbus Zoo. He also has his own show, "Jack Hanna: Into the Wild."
Also with us, investigative reporter and pet lover Jane Velez- Mitchell. And Jane is a new mother. Do you have your baby with you?
JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER: I do, Nancy. Here he is, Cobo. And he`s just a sweetheart who was recused from an animal shelter here in Los Angeles.
GRACE: Hey, hey, hey.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes?
GRACE: Go teach him to solve crimes, then bring him back.
Also with us, Elizabeth Wictum. She is the supervising forensic scientist at UC Davis veterinary genetics laboratory.
Thank you for being with us, Elizabeth. Elizabeth, first to you. It seems like "CSI" is everywhere, but your lab is different. How does your lab function?
ELIZABETH WICTUM, FORENSIC SCIENTIST, UC DAVIS: Well, our lab only does animal DNA testing. Human labs only do human. Our laboratory does a variety of species. We do dogs, cats, deer, elk, sheep, goats, pretty much you name it.
GRACE: Now, how does what you do, how is that any different from other crime scene investigation labs?
WICTUM: Well, of course, the obvious difference is that we do animal DNA. And we only do DNA; we don`t do ballistics or any of the other disciplines.
And so we deal a lot with trace evidence, trace biological evidence. And we also do work for the general public. If somebody wants to find out if a neighbor`s dog killed their cat, for instance, we could do that.
GRACE: You know, the epiphany that animal DNA and hair from animals could be used in criminal cases is a very recent discovery.
Speaking of analyzing hair, let`s take a look at Jack Hanna`s hairy armadillo.
HANNA: Have you ever...
GRACE: No, I never.
HANNA: I wonder if she`s ever had animal DNA from a hairy armadillo.
GRACE: Have you ever had DNA or hair from a hairy armadillo?
WICTUM: Not yet.
GRACE: That`s Jack Hanna`s question to you.
HANNA: I`ll get you some.
GRACE: You may very soon, because I think we`re about to have a crime.
HANNA: Anyway, this is, everyone, a hairy armadillo. It`s a very prehistoric animal. You can hold him up there a little bit.
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: I think he wants to stay on that side of the table.
HANNA: They don`t have teeth. No, he wouldn`t hurt. They don`t have teeth.
GRACE: You said he would bite.
HANNA: I was joking. The armadillo, by the way, is the only animal that we know of in history, way back when leprosy was prevalent, that carried leprosy. But the armadillo...
GRACE: Good to know.
HANNA: ... is from the dinosaur era. And you can see that they role up into a ball. This is the hairy armadillo.
GRACE: Are you sure it doesn`t bite?
HANNA: No, it doesn`t. It has no teeth. It has no teeth.
GRACE: OK, I want to touch it.
HANNA: OK, you can touch it.
GRACE: Do not bite.
HANNA: No, this is a means of defense.
GRACE: Look that way.
HANNA: No, but see there? It`s armor-plated. We`re talking the dinosaur era. In some form or another, this was way back then. And they`re really a different type -- their eyesight`s very bad. Their smelling...
GRACE: He hissed.
HANNA: No, he`s breathing. Their smell and their hearing...
GRACE: No, he went...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNA: Their smell and their hearing are some of the finest of any animal in the world.
GRACE: What does it look -- I see it`s got his...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNA: It`s called a hairy armadillo, see here? The non-banded armadillo from our country doesn`t have hair like this. The three-banded armadillo from Brazil, and then the giant armadillo.
GRACE: Is it going to eat the eggs?
HANNA: No, it doesn`t seem to like them.
GRACE: Is that why it`s wiggling? What does it normally have?
HANNA: Well, bugs. It loves, like, little insects and worms; that`s what he eats, mainly.
GRACE: You know, you brought up -- when you said "bugs," it reminded me of something.
I want to go to Jane Velez-Mitchell, investigative reporter. Jane, the new discovery of forensic entomology came into play -- especially you and I covered the Danielle van Dam case, where the defense argued to the jury with a forensic entomologist that the larva -- maggots -- on this child`s body -- he wanted to make the jury believe that the child had been discarded at a time that the perpetrator, David Westerfield, was under police surveillance.
In other words, Westerfield could not possibly have discarded the body, based on the age of the larva. So we`re seeing a huge surge in forensic entomology.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Absolutely. And DNA evidence from animals is just as significant as DNA evidence from human beings. There are many examples. Look at the tragic case of Imette St. Guillen, recently in New York City. Cat hairs and rabbit hairs found at the crime scene are extremely crucial evidence that could ultimately result in a conviction.
GRACE: Jane Velez-Mitchell, you`ll be happy to know that our next guest appears to be a vegetarian.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Whew, good. Two of us.
HANNA: And he doesn`t have hair. But he does have -- Jane, this is a porcupine, obviously. And these are the quills, but you`ve got to be very, very careful.
(CROSSTALK)
HANNA: But see that`s what -- the porcupine`s quill -- I wish I could show you, but I don`t want to right now -- but be careful, Tom.
GRACE: Can he really shoot a quill?
HANNA: No, they don`t shoot a quill, but the minute the quill touches you and goes in you, there`s a barb on the end of that quill. Even the cameras here in studio cannot pick it up. There`s a little barb there you cannot see with the human eye.
GRACE: On which end is the barb?
HANNA: Right on the very end that I`m touching. But the big quills are back here.
So if this animal is alarmed, that quill would release from his body - - it doesn`t throw them -- but would go into your hand or wherever and cause an infection. And it can cause a severe infection.
For example, if a cougar or a mountain lion takes down a porcupine, he knows that underside here -- that`s why Tom`s holding him here -- he knows under there it`s very soft, so he tries to turn the porcupine over. Meanwhile, if the quills get in the cougar`s face or mountain lion, it could die of infection.
GRACE: Now, wait a minute. You say that it doesn`t throw a quill.
HANNA: No, the minute you touch it, and that quill -- if you`re attacking a porcupine or trying to get him like a cougar, that quill will come out in you, because you`re grabbing him like this, so it`s going to come out in your hand -- or in the animal`s mouth...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: He`s got very good table manners, unlike the warthog.
HANNA: Right. But this animal is, basically, a vegetarian. He eats leaves, and barks, and things like that.
GRACE: You said basically a vegetarian?
HANNA: Yes.
GRACE: Does he eat fingers?
HANNA: No. No. No. No. No.
GRACE: Good.
HANNA: No, but they have good, sharp teeth. But they`re an animal that was very, very vital to the West.
GRACE: Why are their eyes almost on either side of their head? You know, like ours look forward, and a lot of animals are on the side of their head.
HANNA: Why is that, Tom?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, that`s the difference between...
GRACE: Does that mean you don`t know the answer?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... predator...
HANNA: Some people say I`m a walking encyclopedia of misinformation. So I`m going to let Tom answer that.
GRACE: Well, I saw him shaking his head.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, what it is, is the difference between a predator and prey. Most prey animals will have eyes side to side and they`re looking always to make sure that there`s nothing hunting them. An animal that is a predator, like a lion or a tiger, they have the eyes forward so they are able to see. It gives them more of an opportunity to hunt, more success.
GRACE: You knew. You just wanted to make sure he knew.
HANNA: Exactly. And next time I`ll ask that question -- your eyes are forward. We`re predators.
GRACE: Right, so I`m the predator in this scenario.
HANNA: That`s right.
GRACE: To Elizabeth Wictum -- she is with the UC Davis veterinary genetics laboratory -- you know, what you`re doing is really incredible to all of us novices. We`re amazed. What case sticks out in your mind, Elizabeth, over the years?
(CROSSTALK)
WICTUM: There`s one in particular that really stands out. It was a case we did about 10 years ago before we had a dedicated forensic laboratory. But it demonstrated that there was a real need for animal forensics and also that the tool was a very powerful tool.
And in that case, there was a woman working in her farm yard. And a man pulled in to ask for directions, and he attempted to sexually assault her, but she fought him off. And she then described the vehicle to police, but she wasn`t able to pick the owner of the vehicle out of a lineup.
So she recalled that the dog, her dog, had urinated on his tire prior to the attack, so they took a swab from the tire. And we matched the DNA there to her dog and thereby we placed him at that scene.
GRACE: I`ve got a very anxious witness. What is that?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: An agouti.
GRACE: An agouti. So we`re going to take a quick break, and we`ll try to go over his questions with him.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: On this Memorial Day, we stop to honor our very bravest, the men and women who sacrificed their lives for our country, American heroes.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Let`s remember Army Sergeant Amanda Nicole Pinson, just 21, St. Louis, Missouri -- Army Specialist Carlos Gonzales, just 22, Middleton, New York -- let`s stop to remember Army Sergeant First Class Randy McCaulley, 44, Indiana, Pennsylvania -- Army Specialist Frederick Carlson, just 25, from Bethlehem, Pennsylvania, killed Iraq -- three tours of duty, an American hero.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: At a distance, their headstones look alike. Yet every son or daughter, mom or dad who visits will always look first at one. And we make this pledge to you: America will always honor the character and the achievements of your brave generation.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... had the qualities to be a very good Marine, an excellent Marine. He was a great cop and a great and good friend, a good man.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My son, not only my son, but all of those heroes that fell, all of the wounded that are in hospitals and lost limbs and so forth and so on, they did not die in vain. They died honorably.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was the kind of guy that we`d take fire. People would be shooting at us, and he`d never panic. He always stayed calm, relaxed, and did his job.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He grew up and ended up wanting to fly helicopters, and did so, and fought for our country.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Didn`t turn out that she came home the way we wanted her to. She`s always made us proud of everything she`s ever done. But I think making the ultimate sacrifice for her country, that she absolutely loved, was probably right up there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good night, friend.
END
