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The Situation Room
White House Signals Willingness To Talk With Iran; Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton Officially Running For Reelection; Similarities Between Haditha Massacre And Vietnam; Internet-Based Movement Aims At Electing Bipartisan Ticket In 2008
Aired May 31, 2006 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks very much, Ali. To our viewers, you're in THE SITUATION ROOM where new pictures and information are arriving all the time. Standing by, CNN reporters across the United States and around the world to bring you today's top stories.
Happening now -- a significant shift in U.S. relations with Iran. The Bush administration says it's willing to join direct talks on Tehran's nuclear program. It's 4:00 p.m. here in Washington. I'll ask Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice about this new offer and the strings attached.
Also this hour, troubling reports for the commander in chief. Did some U.S. Marines intentionally slaughter civilians in Iraq? The president weighs in on the Haditha incident and what he might do about it.
And a crowning moment for Senator Hillary Clinton. It's 4:00 p.m. in Buffalo, New York, where Democrats are embracing senator Clinton's reelection campaign. But will American voters join the love fest in 2008?
I'm Wolf Blitzer. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice says the ball is now in Iran's court. She made the dramatic announcement today that the U.S. would reverse course and take part in direct talks with the Tehran government. But there's a catch. The Bush administration says Iran must suspend its disputed nuclear program immediately.
Right now the president is pushing for a diplomatic solution while keeping his other options open. Our White House correspondent, Elaine Quijano is joining us now live with more on what is going on. Elaine.
ELAINE QUIJANO, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: A senior administration official told me just a short time ago that in fact this does not represent in their view a strategic shift by the United States but rather a change in tactics.
He says that President Bush did not in fact give the final go ahead for this decision until this morning. This is, though, something that the president and others have been working on for quite some time. As you noted, after months of letting the Europeans in fact take the lead when it comes to talks with Iran, President Bush believes it is now time for the United States to take that lead role.
Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice making that announcement this morning said that as long as Iran suspends its uranium enrichment program the U.S. would in fact be willing to come to the negotiating table for multilateral talks.
Why now? The United States feels there's consensus and momentum within the international community and by putting its weight behind the talks that will move the issue forward.
It is also clear though that the president wants to demonstrate he's not taking a unilateral approach to Iran.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: My decision today says that the United States is going to take a leadership position in solving this issue and our message to the Iranians is that, one, you won't have a weapon. And, two, that you must verifiably suspend any programs, at which point we will come to the negotiating table to work on a way forward.
I thought it was important for the United States to take the lead, along with our partners. That's what you're seeing. You're seeing robust diplomacy. I believe this problem can be solved diplomatically and I'm going to give it every effort to do so.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUIJANO: President Bush emphasizing he's looking to diplomacy to solve this problem. Still being worked out the details on a package of incentives and possible sanctions. Secretary Rice in fact is headed to Vienna to finalize those details. She'll be meeting with the five members of the U.N. Security Council, plus Germany.
One key question remains whether China and Russia, which had strongly opposed sanctions against Iran, whether or not those countries have changed their minds. I can tell you the president, other officials, have been on the phone with heads of state and we're told that officials here believe there is, quote, a consensus that has emerged around that position that sanctions could possibly be necessary. Back to you, Wolf.
BLITZER: Thank you, Elaine. Elaine Quijano at the White House.
The secretary of state says it's time to know if Iran is serious about negotiation or not. Just a little while ago, I spoke with Her over at the State Department about the administration's new willingness to join direct talks with Iran, something the Bush administration has long refused to do.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: Here's what the president said shortly after 9/11, on countries that support terrorism: he said, "America has a message for the nations of the world. If you harbor terrorists, you are a terrorist. If you train or arm a terrorist, you are a terrorist. If you feed a terrorist or fund a terrorist, you are a terrorist and you will be held accountable by the United States and our friends."
You were the president's National Security adviser when he said that. Does this look like the United States is making concessions to what you would regard as a terrorist regime?
RICE: The United States is supporting an international consensus that's been developing for the last year-and-a-half that Iran must not be allowed to get a nuclear weapon, that Iran has but one choice and that is to abandon its nuclear weapons ambitions, or it can face the path of isolation. That's what the United States is supporting here.
BLITZER: But you understand your critics on the right will say that you've blinked.
RICE: Let's be very clear, Wolf. The United States is holding to conditions that have been set for some time with Iran, conditions that we have been supporting in the negotiations with the European three, that Iran must first suspend verifiably and fully its enrichment activities.
We do not want Iran to continue its march toward a nuclear weapon or an industrial capability, industrial production-scale capability, by the end of the year. We want Iran to come back to negotiations, negotiations that we have been supporting, and that we would now be prepared to join if Iran suspends.
But let me be very clearly what this is not. This isn't some sort of grand bargain. This isn't an offer of normalization of relations. This isn't an offer of let bygones be bygones and we'll try and establish a new relationship. This is a very specific choice that is being given to Iran: abandon your nuclear weapons ambitions, or face isolation. And we need it, and we need now to sharpen that contradiction and to make it possible to know whether Iran intends to negotiate seriously or not.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: You can hear the entire interview with Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice. That's coming up in the next hour right here in THE SITUATION ROOM.
European allies are applauding President Bush's new overture toward Iran, and perhaps none more so than Britain's Tony Blair. A European diplomat tells our John King that getting the U.S. involved with talks with Iran was a top priority for Tony Blair during his meetings with the president last week. A U.S. official says the administration had been moving toward that position for some time, but he doesn't dispute that Blair's influence helped sway the way with President Bush.
Now to the conflict in Iran. For the first time, President Bush is talking publicly about allegations that U.S. Marines massacred civilians in the city of Haditha last year. Sources tell CNN that military investigators strongly suspected a small number of U.S. Marines went on a rampage after one of their own was killed in a roadside bomb.
Mr. Bush says he finds those reports, quote, troubling. But he says he's confident the military investigation will be thorough.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: Marine Corps is full of men and women who are honorable people, who understand rules of war. And if, in fact, these allegations are true, the Marine Corps will work hard to make sure that that culture, that proud culture will be reinforced and that those who violated a law, if they did, will be punished.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: We'll have a full report from the Pentagon on the latest on the Haditha investigation, plus reaction from Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice when I interviewed her at the State Department earlier. She spoke about the Haditha incident. All that's coming up in our next hour right here in THE SITUATION ROOM.
Meanwhile, it was another very bloody day in Iraq. Our Zain Verjee is joining us from the CNN global headquarters in Atlanta with some of the details. Zain.
ZAIN VERJEE, CNN ANCHOR: Insurgents mount equal opportunity offenses. Today their bombs killed ordinary Iraqis, elected officials, even an Iraqi sports reporter. Eleven people are dead. In Mosul a car bomb strikes a police patrol wounding 19. In the Deyala province, a bomb strikes the mayor's office, killing the mayor. And in Baghdad gunmen shoot and kill a sports anchor for Iraqi state satellite TV.
Meanwhile a fresh Pentagon report predicts that Sunni insurgent strength will remain steady through this year. We're going to bring you more on that report in our next hour.
Also in Iraq, the new prime minister vows to take on would be evil-doers with an iron fist. Iraqi Prime Minister Nuri al Maliki is declaring a state of emergency in Basra for a month. Al Maliki says his government is going to beef up security. Basra, about 240 miles from Baghdad, had been calm since the war began but increased sectarian tensions have caused a recent spike in violence.
She's now with loved ones. CBS News correspondent Kimberly Dozier's family and boyfriend are now in Germany. They are able to visit her at her bedside. An Official says Dozier is acknowledging them although she's heavily sedated. Dozier is being treated at the U.S. hospital in Germany after Monday's car bombing in Iraq critically hurt her and killed two of her CBS news colleagues.
Today the U.S. military says soldiers who fired into a crowd in Monday's bloody incident in Afghanistan did so in self-defense. An official says the soldiers fired after shots were fired at them. Monday's incident started off when a driver of a U.S. military truck accidentally rammed into pedestrians in Kabul. U.S. military officials say one person died in the crash, prompting widespread riots.
President Bush says the Central Intelligence Agency will succeed at its mission and make Americans safer. Mr. Bush made his comments this afternoon when he attended the ceremonial swearing-in of General Michael Hayden as the new CIA chief -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Zain, thank you for that.
On our "Security Watch" today, some political figures from New York and Washington right now are livid about the Homeland Security Department's new spending priorities. Officials say the two cities targeted in the 9/11 attacks are getting less money this year than in 2005.
New York City still gets the biggest chunk of counterterrorism money, $124 million, but that's down $83 million from last year. Washington, D.C. gets $46 million, $31 million less than last year. One reason for the reduction, the overall pot of cash is smaller -- $740 million in counterterrorism grants are being doled out this year. That's down $125 million from last year.
And more cities are getting a slice of the money. The Homeland Security Department added Memphis, Ft. Lauderdale, and Orlando to the list, citing a need to spread funding to other communities facing potential terror threats.
New York Republican Congressman Peter King, the chairman of the House Homeland Security Committee, is calling the new spending plan -- and I'm quoting now -- "absolutely indefensible and disgraceful." He goes on to say, "as far as I'm concerned, the Department of Homeland Security and the administration have declared war on New York." Strong words from Republican Congressman Peter King. Stay tuned to CNN day and night for the most reliable news about your security.
It's now official. Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton is running for reelection. Yes, we all knew that, but New York Democrats now have formally made their nominee official. That happened today, and that only added to the speculation about Senator Clinton's presidential ambitions.
Our Mary Snow is at the State Democratic Party Convention in my hometown of beautiful Buffalo, New York. Mary, how did it go?
MARY SNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, it is beautiful here today in Buffalo and as you said, lots of speculation. Little suspense that New York Democrats would back Senator Clinton for her reelection bid. However, this was the most closely watched event here in Buffalo, of course, with all that speculation focusing on whether Senator Clinton would drop any hints about her political future.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SNOW (voice-over): They didn't talk about a future in the White House. 2008 wasn't even mentioned, but with lyrics like ...
(MUSIC) SNOW: ... it did raise an image. With speculation growing about Senator Clinton's intentions, the senator kept her silence about any White House aspirations, and stayed focus on her 2006 reelection in the Senate. She started her day by predicting the future in November's elections.
SEN. HILLARY CLINTON (D), NEW YORK: You have to believe that when the dust clears in November, New York is going to have a Democratic government from top to bottom, and we're going to show the rest of the country what that means.
SNOW: As she officially accepted her party's nomination, it was clear that Senator Clinton was in the limelight. Her husband sat in the audience without addressing the crowd. She outlined her vision and energy policy, healthcare, education, the war in Iraq. Clinton did not name President Bush, but targeted him.
H. CLINTON: Because I believe in a government that makes decisions based on facts. And, sadly, that seems to be an unusual idea in Washington these days.
SNOW: Former President Clinton didn't speak publicly, but clearly looked at home with the crowd. I asked him if he thought Democrats in general were revitalized.
WILLIAM CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We just need to keep working on what Hillary tried to do today, being sure people know not just what we disagree with, that the current economists and the administration has done, but what our people would do if we elected them.
SNOW: Some in the crowd were more outspoken about Hillary Clinton's future.
SHELDON SILVER, N.Y. STATE ASSEMBLY SPEAKER: I think she's definitely ready to be president of this country, and she'll pull the same surprise that she pulled here in New York, nationally.
SNOW: Others were not so sure her popularity in New York could carry over to the rest of the country.
LEE CLARY, BLACK RIVER, N.Y.: I think she'd make a great candidate. There are others out there that I'm looking at, too, so whether I would support her or not at this time is hard to say.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SNOW: As for this reelection campaign, Senator Clinton has about $20 million cash on hand. She really doesn't have a strong opponent here in New York. Still, not wasting any time. Later today, she and former President Clinton are hosting a conference call with campaign supporters -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Mary, get some Buffalo chicken wings before you leave town. I recommend the Anchor Bar. Thank you, Mary Snow on the scene for us. Jack Cafferty is on the scene for us, always in New York. They sell Buffalo chicken wings in New York City? It's 400 miles from Buffalo.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Why would you -- if you were looking to garner some national attention from the news media, why would you go to Buffalo?
BLITZER: That's the second -- that's the queen city of New York state. It's the second largest city in New York state.
CAFFERTY: All right. Calm down.
BLITZER: And it is the only city in New York state that has an NFL football team.
CAFFERTY: Settle down, I was just kidding. President Bush has said the Abu Ghraib prison scandal was the administration's biggest mistake in Iraq. Well, not anymore. Military investigators now strongly suspect a small number of Marines snapped after one of their own was killed by a roadside bomb last November in Haditha.
They went on a rampage, according to reports, and murdered 24 Iraqi civilians. The Marines originally said the civilians were killed by a roadside bomb. Meanwhile, there are now two investigations underway, a criminal probe that could lead to murder charges against the Marines involved, and an investigation into whether there was a cover-up.
Here's the question: What's the potential fallout of the alleged massacre at Haditha? E-mail your thoughts to CaffertyFile@CNN.com or go to CNN.com/CaffertyFile -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Thank you, Jack. Jack Cafferty in New York.
And coming up here in THE SITUATION ROOM, we just talked about Hillary Clinton, but is there another Democrat who can knock her out of the race if she decides to run for president? Candy Crowley has been looking into this story.
And on the Republican side, John McCain seems to be the early favorite, but he's far from alone. We'll break down the fields in the next race for the White House.
And later, much more on our top story, the possibility of talks with Iran over its nuclear program. That's the topic in today's "Strategy Session." Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: Welcome back. As our Mary Snow just reported, this is a big day for Senator Hillary Clinton. The New York Democratic Party has officially nominated her to seek a second term, but everyone is talking about the other campaign she may or may not take on.
Our senior political correspondent Candy Crowley is here. She's covering all of these political races, 2006, 2008 down the road. Senator Clinton, Candy as you know, clearly the marquee player among the Democrats, but there are plenty of other potential candidates out there as well.
CANDY CROWLEY, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Plenty of them, Wolf. You take seven former or current senators, three current or former governors, one retired general. You add it all up and you get this month's snapshot of the '08 Democratic field. By that we mean people who either seem to be or have said they are considering running for president.
The most recently added is former Senate Democratic leader Tom Daschle who will be scouting out his presidential possibilities in New Hampshire, Iowa and Michigan next week. There are still people who think Senator Clinton may not run in '08. But if she does, the rest of the field, according to many in it, will be competing to be the not Hillary Clinton candidate.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CROWLEY (voice-over): This is the season for dreams and delusions. that time in the presidential cycle ...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: I was going to say, Candy, is there anyone who stands out among these dozen or so candidates?
CROWLEY: At this point all we really can do is take the traditional yardsticks: name recognition, money and buzz. Certainly the Democrats' '04 candidate John Kerry, in terms of name recognition and money, not to mention e-mail list. Senator Kerry has millions left from the last campaign, has raised millions more since then and, this is what counts, handed out money to more than 100 candidates this cycle.
Kerry's former number two, John Edwards, though he left the Senate, also remains pretty visible in the presidential pool, pushing his anti-poverty campaign and appearing at fundraisers for a variety of Democratic candidates.
Edwards is in Florida today helping out some candidates. All told his office says that Edwards has helped raise $6 million this cycle for other candidates. The problem for both Kerry and Edwards, of course, is that familiar faces can look like the past to a party wanting to look to the future.
Which brings up, two, are they ready for prime time players who are kicking up chatter. Former Indiana Governor, current Senator Evan Bayh has lately spent time each month in either Iowa or New Hampshire. His most recent financial report showed he had $8 million sitting in his re-elect campaign coffers and he's not up for reelection until 2010.
And being watched very carefully, former Governor Mark Warner, generally seen as fitting the Clinton template, a successful southern Democrat with cross-party appeal. Add to that, Warner has proven he can raise money, lots of it, with the big boys.
BLITZER: Alright, let's go to the other side of the aisle, the Republican side. John McCain, I take it, is dominating the field. But what do you think?
CROWLEY: Well, interestingly, it really is kind of the same dynamic as in the Democratic Party. Lots of people thinking about it and one guy on the top of the heap.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CROWLEY (voice-over): This is the season for dreams and delusions, that time in the presidential cycle when the button bins runneth over.
RICH GALEN, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: There are senators and governors from all over who wake up every morning and hum "Hail to the Chief" to see if they can make it fit.
CROWLEY: Chief among those trying it on for size is John McCain, the only one who doesn't think he's already running.
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: I think I'll make that decision in the year 2007.
CROWLEY: He has untouchable creds as a war hero, significant star power and a presidential round already under his belt, hoping to hurdle conservative suspicion that he's not really true blue, McCain has publicly patched up a nasty 2000 rift with the Reverend Jerry Falwell. But his role in a bipartisan group of 14 lawmakers formed to avoid Senate fights over judges may defy forgiveness of the political sort.
BAY BUCHANAN, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: He has established himself as an individual that has worked against social conservatives too many times. The judges is a perfect example. He broke our hearts with that gang of 14 of his. And we won't forget that.
CROWLEY: Also wrestling with the party faithful, ex New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani, a rock star on the campaign circuit, but it may only work when the campaign is for someone else.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When it comes to giving a nomination, it's hard to imagine they'll give it to a man who is pro gay rights.
CROWLEY: Giuliani stresses fiscal conservatism, but even his supporters think it would take a tsunami size washout this fall for Republicans to rethink the anti-abortion, anti-gay template for presidential nominees.
SEN. BILL FRIST (R-TN), MAJORITY LEADER: Mr. President, I ask for the --
CROWLEY: Of those who do fit the mold, a covey of lawmakers is interested in breaking the Senate curse. Majority Leader Bill Frist, Senator Chuck Hagel, Senator Sam Brownback and off-mentioned in conservative circles, Virginia Senator George Allen.
GALEN: He's been a governor, so he's got some skill sets in terms of managing, which is why senators typically fail. They love to play with semicolons and they get stuck in the weeds of the campaign.
CROWLEY: Beyond the Beltway boys, there is first and foremost Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney, who must deal with concerns particularly among Evangelicals about his Mormon religion. He's otherwise blessed with an impressive resume, good looks and great geography.
BUCHANAN: I consider him a sweep. I think he's polished and he has -- he will have the money. He will be perceived as somebody who can win outside of Washington, somebody who has governed. And he hits right there next to New Hampshire.
CROWLEY: Also in play or at least in print, New York Governor George Pataki and Arkansas Governor Mike Huckabee, not a household name but neither was Georgia Governor Jimmy Carter until he started showing up in Iowa. This is the season when you never know who could pop up next.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CROWLEY: More hopefuls may yet join in. But the '08 dynamics are pretty much frozen until after '06 plays out. Who wins, where and why are critical elements as up to 24 men and women look to make their final decision to run or not to run.
BLITZER: Good reporting, Candy, as usual. Mary Snow had some good reporting as well. Candy Crowley and Mary Snow, as you saw, part of the best political team on television. CNN, America's campaign headquarters.
Up next, much more on the alleged massacre by U.S. marines in Haditha. We'll take a closer look at another incident involving U.S. forces that happened at another place at another time in another war.
Plus, should Secretary of State Rice sit down and talk with top officials from Tehran? The Iranian nuclear crisis is front and center in today's "Strategy Session." Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: Welcome back to THE SITUATION ROOM. I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. Let's get back to one of our top stories. President Bush is promising punishment if it's proven that U.S. marines broke the law and massacred civilians in the Iraqi city of Haditha. For many Americans who lived through the Vietnam War, this incident may seem disturbingly familiar. Let's bring in our senior analyst Jeff Greenfield -- Jeff
JEFF GREENFIELD, CNN SENIOR ANALYST: Wolf, consider these facts. Americans in combat in a faraway country fighting against an enemy that may lurk behind every wall and every home. After one of their own is killed, something snaps. Civilians die and the truth about what happened appears to have been deliberately concealed. That may have happened in Haditha, in Iraq. It is clearly what happened in another time, another place, another war.
GREENFIELD (voice-over): By the spring of 1968, some half-a- million Americans were fighting in Vietnam and dying at the rate of nearly 400 every week.
The enemy could be around the next turn in a road or inside an apparently peaceful village. So, when Lieutenant William Calley and the men of Charlie Company, 11th Brigade, Americal Division, entered the village of My Lai, they were, by official reports, angry, frustrated.
When they were told, this is what you have been waiting for, search and destroy, they went on a frenzy of killing. Men, women, children, some 500 of them, were killed.
A Vietnam veteran named Ron Ridenhour heard of the killings from members of Charlie Company. He spent months telling his story to Congress, the White House, the Pentagon. By the fall of 1969, Lieutenant Calley had been charged with murder. He claimed a superior officer had ordered the killing.
But it wasn't until November 1969, a year-and-a-half after the massacre, that a young reporter for Dispatch News Service named Seymour Hersh broke the story in newspapers across the country. "LIFE" magazine published these pictures a month later.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICHARD NIXON, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: What is the best way to end it?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GREENFIELD: By then, the tide of public opinion on the war had shifted.
UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTERS: Hell no, we won't go!
GREENFIELD: President Nixon had already embarked on a program of Vietnamization, lessening U.S. presence. And a military commission suggested that one key reason for the massacre was that, as the war progressed, many career soldiers had either been rotated out or retired or died, leaving scores of draftees whose fitness for leadership in the field of battle was questionable, at best.
But Iraq is very different. There are no draftees. And Marines pride themselves on a particularly rigorous commitment to discipline. And, in a world of ubiquitous media, professional and amateur, questions about Haditha began to surface relatively quickly.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GREENFIELD: What the facts of My Lai and the allegations of Haditha may have in common is the special complexity that involves a war where the people we are fighting for and the enemy occupy the same space.
There was little talk in World War II about the morality of, say, firebombing Dresden, or Germany, or Tokyo, where countless thousands of civilians died. They were the bad guys. In a war like Iraq, those bullets that flew in Haditha may have inflicted particular damage on the very cause those Americans were there to support -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Jeff Greenfield, thank you very much.
Today, in our "Strategy Session," the president speaks out about the investigation into the events at Haditha. Will this quiet some of the political outcry?
Joining us now, Peter Beinart. He's an editor at large at "The New Republic" and author of a new book, "The Good Fight: Why Liberals -- and Only Liberals -- Can Win the War on Terror and Make America Great Again." Also joining us, Terry Jeffrey, the editor of "Human Events."
Congratulations, Peter, on the new book.
PETER BEINART, EDITOR-AT-LARGE, "THE NEW REPUBLIC": Thank you.
BLITZER: We are going to get to that in a moment.
In the context, though, of the Haditha investigation, which is still ongoing, the president spoke out in response to a question earlier today. Listen to what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: If in facts these allegations are true, the Marine Corps will work hard to make sure that that culture, that proud culture, will be reinforced, and that those who violated the law, if they did, will be punished.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: What do you think of that strategy the president has now, dealing with clearly a potentially explosive human tragedy?
BEINART: I think that's pretty much the right response.
Americans are capable of doing this. We knew this from My Lai. We have known it throughout history. What can make America different from our enemies is the fact that we acknowledge it and investigate it openly and remedy our mistakes. That is what makes us different from our enemies.
BLITZER: What do you think, Terry?
TERRY JEFFREY, EDITOR, "HUMAN EVENTS": Well, I think Peter is right.
But I also think there are a number of fallacies being advanced on the back of the incident in Haditha, Wolf.
Obviously, we don't know exactly what happened. We can't assign culpability to anybody there yet. The president is right. If U.S. Marines in fact committed murder, they should be held accountable, just as if they committed a murder here in Washington, D.C.
However, it doesn't follow from a few Marines potentially having done something bad in Iraq that our policy in Iraq is wrong or should be changed. Nor does it follow that the 130,000 other U.S. servicemen serving their honorably and heroically would be any way besmirched by that. Nor does it follow that this is a new Vietnam because there is a My Lai incident in Vietnam, and, now, maybe, perhaps, there was a similar incident in Haditha. That doesn't mean the wars are the same thing.
BLITZER: What do you think?
BEINART: But the larger point is that fighting an insurgency in a population that has turned hostile is morally corrupting to the American troops.
It's true, the vast majority of our troops are doing an amazing job under incredibly difficult circumstances. I say this is as someone who supported the Iraq war and thinks I was now wrong, that, in fact, putting ourselves in this kind of situation, with a population that is hostile, in fact, is morally corrupting and extraordinarily difficult for the soldiers themselves. And I think that's something we need to think about before we do this kind of thing again.
BLITZER: One very prominent Iraqi politician, a secularist, a Sunni, Adnan Pachachi, a former foreign minister, says this.
He said, "There must be a level of discipline imposed on the American troops and change of mentality, which seems to think that Iraqi lives are expendable -- this coming from a strong supporter of the U.S.-led war, Adnan Pachachi.
JEFFREY: Well, he is a Kurd, if I'm not mistaken.
BLITZER: No, no, no. He's a Sunni.
BEINART: No, he's not.
JEFFREY: OK. He's a Sunni.
Well, I would say this, actually, to the new Iraqi government, Wolf. Haditha is very deep in the Sunni Triangle. It's way up in northwestern Iraq. At this time, when there's a new government on the ground in Baghdad, it's theoretically a coalition government -- there are Sunnis and Shias in it -- that Maliki, the new prime minister, had said that they're going to be able to control the security of 16 of 18 provinces by the end of this year, we should expect them to be patrolling Haditha in the future, not U.S. troops.
And the Shias ought to be able to go to Sunni territory like that and act humanely with their Iraqi brothers.
BLITZER: Peter, the president and the secretary of state made a major decision now, potentially to open up direct talks with Iran on its nuclear program, if Iran meets certain conditions, like stopping its enriched-uranium program, which a lot of experts believe they will never do. But listen to what the president said today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: I thought it was important for the United States to take the lead, along with our partners. And that's what you're seeing. You're seeing robust diplomacy. I believe this problem can be solved diplomatically. And I'm going to give it every effort to do so.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: You don't disagree with him on this, do you?
BEINART: No, I don't.
I think one of the lessons -- and I talk about this in my book -- from the Cold War about containment, which is what we're really trying to do with Iran -- we are trying to contain Iran, keeping it from getting a nuclear weapon -- is that you have to be patient. You have to faith that a democracy can outlast a dictatorship, because they may crumble from within, and we won't.
And I think this is the right kind of patient diplomacy that we need, to see whether we can, in fact, create some diplomatic deal that will stop them from taking the next step...
(CROSSTALK)
BLITZER: Do you have a problem with this decision that the secretary of state announced today?
JEFFREY: I think it's a good one, Wolf.
And I think, actually, there's a line of consistency here in the Bush administration's approach. All along, I think they have been trying to keep the five permanent members of the U.N. Security Council in line, plus Germany, to put serious economic and diplomatic pressure on Iran.
This keeps China and Russia on board. According to the reports today, China and Russia would agree to serious economic and diplomatic action against Iran, if Iran doesn't cooperate.
Now, as you said, it's a big if that they are going to stop their uranium enrichment. If we get that if, it's a huge victory. If we get the Russians and Chinese behind a diplomatic and economic effort, that's a huge victory...
(CROSSTALK)
BLITZER: Here's the provocative title of your book, "The Good Fight: Why Liberals -- and Only Liberals -- Can Win the War on Terror and Make America Great Again."
In a nutshell, why can't conservatives also win that war on terror? Why can only liberals win the war on terror?
BEINART: Because I don't think conservatives believe that America has to live up to the ideals that it preaches.
Conservatives say, human rights and democracy are something that happens only out there, a standard that America doesn't have to live up to itself. The liberal tradition says, not America as a model for the world as it is, but America's struggle to become better, to not do things like Abu Ghraib and Haditha, that is what inspires the world. And that's been distinctly missing from George W. Bush and Dick Cheney.
BLITZER: Terry Jeffrey is a good conservative.
You can't win the war on terror, Terry.
JEFFREY: I don't think the United States is going to win the war on terror by inspiring the kind of Islamic fundamentalists that have joined al Qaeda.
I also don't think we are going to win it by a global crusade for democracy, which was started by Woodrow Wilson, and, unfortunately, has now been embraced by some Republicans.
We are going to win it by going after protection of our interests in the most logical and the most firm way possible.
BLITZER: We will leave it there, because it's a good discussion for another time. Unfortunately, we're out of time right now.
Peter, congratulations on your new book...
BEINART: Thank you.
BLITZER: ... "The Good Fight."
BLITZER: Peter Beinart, a good friend of CNN.
Up next, hurricane starts -- hurricane season starts tomorrow. Will this year be as bad as last year? We have got a new forecast that's just out.
Plus, is New Orleans sinking?
That story and much more when we return -- stay with us. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
Want to thank Terry, too.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: Let's check back with Zain from the CNN Global Headquarters with a quick look at some other important stories making news -- Zain.
VERJEE: Wolf, 17, that's how many named storms a noted hurricane forecaster predicts for this year's Atlantic hurricane season, which starts tomorrow.
William Gray of Colorado State University once again predicts nine of those 17 storms this year will become hurricanes, five a Category 3 or higher. Gray says there's an 80 percent chance another major hurricane will hit the U.S. and a 69 percent chance that one will hit the East Coast.
It's a report that gives voice to a complaint of many minorities: Racial discrimination is ever-present in the U.S. home mortgage market. A study out today says African-Americans and Latinos are 30 percent more likely to get higher rates for home loans than white borrowers, despite similar credit scores and risk factors. The study is from the Center of Responsible Lending.
And, Wolf, take a look at this, some rather disturbing surveillance video. It shows an apparent kidnapping in Alabama. A 34-year-old Birmingham lawyer pulls into a parking lot near her apartment. She gets out of her car. And, as you see in this picture, a gunman apparently forces her back into the car, and then just speeds off.
The lawyer's name is Sandra Eubank Gregory. Police say that her ATM card has been used about three times since the kidnapping. Right now, teams of police are looking for the woman and for the suspect -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Let's hope they find her OK.
Thank you very much, Zain, for that.
The Veterans Affairs Department is taking swift action against personnel connected to that security breach involving some 26.5 million veterans' records. This includes dismissing the senior data analyst who lost the data, accepting resignation from his boss, and placing another high-level official on administrative leave.
Abbi Tatton is standing by with more -- Abbi.
ABBI TATTON, CNN INTERNET REPORTER: Wolf, Secretary Jim Nicholson has also just added another position, a new special adviser for information security at the agency, who will be designated to try and improve computer security at the department.
But the personal data of 26 million veterans is still missing. And now the department faces a lawsuit, a lawsuit that demands compensation of $1,000 per person affected.
Look at the plaintiffs in the lawsuit. One of them might be familiar to you. This is Iraq war veteran Paul Hackett. He was the Democratic congressional candidate in that special election in Ohio last year. You will see him there. If you look at the lawsuit, you will see that it alleges that the department was deliberately indifferent in its handling of the case.
We talked to the Department of Veterans Affairs. They wouldn't comment on pending litigation, though they have said in the past that there is no evidence that the data was used illegally -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Thank you, Abbi, for that.
Coming up, a last-ditch effort in South Dakota to throw out a state ban on most abortions -- we will have the latest on this key battleground in the "Culture Wars."
And Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice opens a new door to Iran. We will take a closer look at her dramatic announcement today, what it may mean for the nuclear standoff with Tehran. My full interview with the secretary of state, that's coming up here in THE SITUATION ROOM.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: In today's "Culture Wars": the battle over abortion.
The South Dakota secretary of state is now processing petitions from opponents of a state ban on most abortions. The ban is set to go into effect on July 1. But petitioners hope to repeal the ban by putting it up to a vote in November.
Once again, let's bring back our Internet reporter, Abbi Tatton -- Abbi.
TATTON: Wolf, over 38,000 signatures collected by an abortion- rights coalition who oppose this law, they want to give South Dakota voters the chance to vote on the law. The group is called the South Dakota Campaign For Healthy Families.
Now that they have collected these signatures, they're turning them over to the secretary of state's office. They tell us it's going to take about two weeks to process all these signatures and deem whether they are valid or not. If they find out that more than about 16,000 of the signatures are valid, then a referendum will be added to the November ballot.
Some anti-abortion activist, like Leslie Unruh, who heads up the South Dakota-based Abstinence Clearinghouse, says that South Dakota residents support this ban, and they will make that clear in November -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Abbi, thank you.
Up next, the horror in Haditha -- what's the potential fallout if it was indeed an unprovoked massacre by U.S. Marines? Jack Cafferty will be back with your e-mail.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: Let's go up to New York and Jack Cafferty with "The Cafferty File" -- Jack.
CAFFERTY: Thanks, Wolf.
Military investigators now strongly suspect that a small number of Marines snapped after one of their own was killed by a roadside bomb last November at Haditha, and that they went on a rampage and murdered 24 Iraqi civilians.
The question we asked is: What's the potential fallout of the alleged massacre at Haditha?
Here's some of what you wrote us. We got a lot of interesting mail.
Bill in Quarryville, Pennsylvania: "I think it will be a recruiting tool for the terrorists. It puts a black mark on every American soldier who is laying their life on the line for us every day and performing their duty with the utmost dignity. I think this was bound to happen when you keep rotating war-fatigued soldiers back to the front lines."
Martha in Hollywood, Florida: "Sadly, I suspect the fallout will be much the same as that of Abu Ghraib, outrage initially, and then everyone forgets and just gets on with their lives. America sleeps and just doesn't pay attention anymore."
Pascal wrote this: "Unlike Abu Ghraib, where slaps on the wrists were handed out to the lowest-level prison keepers for what was systemic, corrupt torture authorized at the highest levels by U.S. policy-makers, Haditha has the potential for a P.R. victory for U.S. integrity, if the culprits are given capital union and public shame. As much as possible should be handled in Iraq.""
Walter in New Port Richey, Florida: "Jack, I hope and pray there's none. The political hacks who sent our men there should be tried. I'm a World War II veteran who served in the Pacific and Korea, and we don't talk about so-called atrocities. It was war. And we don't play by rules that were set by those phonies who never served in combat. We don't make criminals out of troops doing their duty."
And, finally, Chase in Dallas wrote this: "I am most concerned with the damage to the American soul. When we accept using war with a preemptive strike against another country that did not pose an imminent threat to us, and we treat the loss of civilian life there as necessary collateral damage, in the name of democracy, we have done damage to our own conscience" -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Lots of good letters coming in...
CAFFERTY: Yes.
BLITZER: ... e-mail coming in. Jack, thank you.
Still to come, is the time right for a third-party presidential candidate? Some people think so. Bill Schneider is standing by to explain why. And also coming up in the next hour here in THE SITUATION ROOM, my full interview with Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice on the Bush administration's new approach toward Iran and the allegations of a massacre by U.S. Marines in Iraq.
Also, is she changing her tune about running for president or being the NFL commissioner? I will ask her.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: On our "Political Radar" this Wednesday, the Republican and Democratic parties are gearing up for a wide-open presidential race in 2008. But there's a new campaign to go beyond the usual suspects and the standard two-party system.
Let's bring in our senior political analyst, Bill Schneider -- Bill.
WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: "Things fall apart; the center cannot hold," William Butler Yeats wrote. But that was in 1919, before the Internet.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SCHNEIDER (voice-over): Iraq, immigration, the deficit, gas prices, unsolved problems. Meanwhile, Washington bickers and postures. Remember the $100 gas rebate?
SEN. RICHARD DURBIN (D), ILLINOIS: What does $100 buy you? Two tanks of gas, if you're lucky?
SCHNEIDER: Enter Unity08.com. A new party? Not quite. It's an Internet-based movement aimed at electing a bipartisan ticket in 2008, a candidate from one party for president and the other party for vice president.
ANGUS KING (I), FORMER GOVERNOR OF MAINE: The whole idea is to take all the votes that would have gone to the other parties and win the election. I mean, that's the -- that's the purpose. This -- we're not in this as spoilers.
SCHNEIDER: He's Angus King, former independent governor of Maine.
KING: The people just want the problem solved. And that was the approach I took.
SCHNEIDER: Voters see politics as the enemy of problem-solving.
KING: The general public stands back and looks at all the fighting and the negative ads and stuff and says, you know, who are these people? What are they -- why are they doing this?
SCHNEIDER: Sound familiar? ROSS PEROT (I), FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: But, in Washington, you have a combination of theater, images, magic acts, and illusions.
SCHNEIDER: The market for an independent candidate is greater now than at any time since 1992, when Ross Perot got nearly 20 percent of the vote.
Unity08 is being started by King and Republican and Democratic political operatives from the Ford-Carter era. Voters will choose the Unity08 ticket by voting over the Internet. A presidential campaign is a horse race. Does Unity08 have a horse, a candidate for president they can rally behind?
KING: A horse is hopefully coming to us, that we are not starting with -- with a horse.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCHNEIDER: Unity08 is relying on the fact that America is an entrepreneurial society. If there's a market, in this case, for a new kind of political voice, there's bound to be a product -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Bill, here's a question. Have we ever had a president and a vice president of a different party?
SCHNEIDER: Once since 1800, and that was in 1864, Republican Abraham Lincoln and Democrat Andrew Johnson. But you know, Wolf, it didn't work out so well. Lincoln was murdered and the Republicans in Congress impeached President Johnson.
BLITZER: Bill Schneider reporting for us. Bill, part of the best political team on television. CNN, America's campaign headquarters.
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