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American Morning

Iraq's National Security Adviser Discusses Ongoing Violence; Pilgrim of Peace

Aired July 13, 2006 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back, everybody. I'm Soledad O'Brien.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: It's good to have you back, Soledad.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: It's good to be able to hear me.

MILES O'BRIEN: How's your voice? You're doing okay? Keep the warm water going.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Eigthy-two percent, I'm alright, I'm here.

MILES O'BRIEN: I'm Miles O'Brien. We're glad you're with us this morning.

Lots to cover this morning, including this, one step forward, perhaps in Iraq. The peaceful southern province of Muthanna, that's near the border with Saudi Arabia, is now officially under Iraqi control. British and Australian forces handing over authority to their Iraqi counterparts today. Elsewhere, the sectarian violence rages on, of course. One-hundred civilians dead just since the weekend, as a result of all that violence. Iraq's national security adviser Mowaffak Al-Rubaie is standing by, he joins us from Baghdad.

Good to have you back on the program, Mr. Al-Rubaie. We are told that in this relatively peaceful province, there are still persistent problems with militias, militias that claim allegiance to Muqtada Al Sadr, the Shia leader. How concerned are you that now that this handover has occurred, there will be peace in this province?

MOWAFFAK AL-RUBAIE, IRAQI NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: Well, our assessment for the level of the threat in Muthanna is very low. And the Iraqi security forces can handle this easily with no problem at all, because they have been trained, equipped, and they are fully prepared to take on any challenge in the province. And if need be, we will have the Iraqi army to support the local police or even the national police to support the local police. And even if our police or the national army is overwhelmed, then we can call upon the coalition to help us.

But with this particular province, and I believe this is a huge step forward in the Iraqi taking control of the security of the country, and this is the beginning of the 18 provinces we are going to take over in the next few months, I believe this is a huge step forward in Iraqis taking control of the fate of their country. MILES O'BRIEN: Well, certainly, the picture there is very different than in the so-called Sunni triangle. Yesterday we spoke with Senator Jack Reed, just back from I think it was his eighth trip to Iraq, and he was talking about how -- and he's a West Point graduate, former army ranger. Incidentally, we mischaracterized his vote on the war on Iraq. We said he voted for it, and he voted against it. But he described it as a low-grade civil war, and then he went on to say this. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JACK REED, (D) RHODE ISLAND: On both counts, both in providing security and providing services and an economy that works. They are lagging far behind what is necessary.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

MILES O'BRIEN: He's pointing the finger at your government, and he's frustrated with the pace of progress there. What do you say in response to that?

AL-RUBAIE: Well, the government is a newly formed government, and remember, this is a government where it just started a couple of months ago, and I believe it is doing the right thing, and we are going through a difficult time. There's no doubt about it. We have a lot of sectarian violence. We have the insurgency. We have the terrorists and foreign fighters coming from outside Iraq. So we do have difficulty. But I can tell you, we are doing the right things. We are not looking at this problem from the security point of view or strictly security point of view. We are looking at it as -- in a comprehensive plan of economy. We need certainly -- and the prime minister have already the day before yesterday has announced a package of economic measures for economic reforms.

He's going to announce the foreign investment law, so we're looking at it as also political. We're outreaching to the insurgents, but we are having the national reconciliation and dial-up program of the prime minister. We've got a very, very good response from the insurgents and from those who were not included in the political process. We're getting a very, very good response, and the prime minister has appointed people to make the focus of the outreach from the Sunni insurgents. So we're doing the right thing, and we are on the right track.

MILES O'BRIEN: On the right track, but you, surely, you can understand that frustration. Isn't it at all justified?

AL-RUBAIE: Well, I can understand the frustration, and nobody wanted this violence, but it's not our choice. And if we are presented with this, we will take on, and we will take on our responsibility and we'll challenge anybody who will take on, anybody who will challenge the central authority. This is a parliamentary institutional government, constitutional government. This is the first government ever in the history of Iraq which was constitutionally elected and this is a parliamentary constitutional system in Iraq. Now, if you challenge this, then you are illegal. Whether you are a militia, whether you're an insurgent or a terrorist or foreign fighter. And we are -- there is no way we will go back with this, and the way forward is winning, and winning and winning. And I believe there's no alternative but to win this war, and this is -- we're not fighting only on behalf of Iraq. We are also fighting on the behalf of the rest of the region and of the rest of the world, because we're cracking the global terror in this country.

MILES O'BRIEN: You mentioned the rest of the region. As you look beyond your borders this morning, you see rising tensions, fighting in Israel to the north and to the south, and some would suggest that the violence which persists in Iraq and the instability there, has created an atmosphere that has encouraged that instability elsewhere. What do you say to that?

AL-RUBAIE: The instability or the insurgency, we're not new to this. We believe that this is not going to be -- well, we're not going to finish this in the next few weeks or even in the next few months. We believe that it will take a couple of years, probably, for this country to go back to normal. But we had -- just look at two years ago. June two years ago we did not have a single soldier. We did not have a single policeman. And now we have more than 150 in our Iraqi army well trained, they're taking responsibility, taking, assuming security responsibility here and they're, assuming wherever it is possible and freeing the coalition forces from their commitment in Iraq, gradually but surely.

And totally depends on the conditions whenever they are available. Now the conditions today in our Muthanna has been fulfilled. The level of threat is low. The Iraqi police and the Iraqi security forces can take or can assume the responsibility. They have taken this responsibility, and this is, I think it's a landmark. It's another milestone in our struggle to get to democracy, to freedom, and to assuming full responsibility by the Iraqi security forces.

MILES O'BRIEN: Alright. I'm sorry, sir --

AL-RUBAIE: To free the coalition forces to go back home.

MILES O'BRIEN: We're out of time, I apologize. Mowaffa Al- Rubaie, Iraqi National Security Adviser, thank you for your time. Soledad?

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: President Bush is warning Israel not to weaken the Lebanese government in their response to yesterday's kidnappings of two Israeli soldiers. The warning came after Israel bombed Beirut's main airport. And this morning the Israeli government is saying that no targets in Lebanon are immune. Joining us this morning from Jerusalem is Israel's foreign ministry spokesman, Daniel Taub. Nice to see you Mr. Taub, thank you very much for being with us.

DANIEL TAUB, ISRAELI FOREIGN MINISTRY SPOKESMAN: Good morning.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Let's begin with an editorial in the "New York Times," which usually has very strong support for Israel. They essentially say that the military's response that we have seen from Israel so far does not work, it doesn't make Arabs mad at Hezbollah, it doesn't make Arabs mad at Hamas. What it does is solidify those groups in fact among Arabs. You agree?

TAUB: Well, I think we agree on the aim here. The aim has to be to try and stop the terrorists, to try and stop the insurgents, to try and stop these people that went over in an unprovoked act of aggression, went over our international boundary, killed young Israelis, kidnapped others and so on. And the question is really, how do we move ahead? Now on the one hand, we're very much in sympathy with people to say we need to show restraint, we need to reach out our hands in peace and be forth-coming. We've done that when we pulled out of the entire Gaza strip. We have a government that's been elected to do the same thing in the West Bank. But our experience shows that that works when you have moderates, when you have people that you can speak to. It doesn't work when you're dealing with terrorists.

It doesn't work when you're dealing with people like the people that we're dealing with, like the Hezbollah and the Lebanese government is supporting them that have in an unprovoked way attacked Israel and show that they understand absolutely nothing but the language of force. The way to end this is quite clearly for the government of Lebanon to do exactly what the international community, what the secretary general of the U.N. has been asking him for years, to exert Lebanese authority over the south of Lebanon and to stop these attacks. But when he doesn't do that, unfortunately, we have no other choice than to do it ourselves.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: So you blame, clearly, the Lebanese government, you don't blame Hezbollah for the kidnappings?

TAUB: We absolutely blame Hezbollah. Hezbollah are a vicious terrorist organization, but they're more than that. They're also a part of the Lebanese government, and we know that the Lebanese government is hand in hand with them, providing them with the facilities and the resources to do this. And beyond that, we have a wider circle of Iranian and Syrian support. So unfortunately, we were really talking about an axis of jihad and terrorism here that we really have to deal with. At the moment what we're trying to do is we're trying to undermine the capabilities of Hezbollah, and we're trying to bring about a situation where Lebanon will do exactly what the international community has been asking it to do, which is exert its sovereignty and its authority like any responsible state throughout the whole of the country.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: The Israeli reaction in the last 48 hours or so has been, as you've destroyed the main power plant in Gaza. Dozens of innocent civilians have been killed, really on both sides. A family of nine killed in Gaza yesterday. Beirut's airport has been bombed. The French foreign minister says that the response that you are showing, in fact, is disproportionate to the kidnappings. Is he wrong?

TAUB: The question isn't whether it's disproportionate to the kidnapping. The question is whether it's disproportionate to the threat that Israel faces, and the threat that we face is unfortunately not just the kidnapping, terrible as this is. It's a threat that is faced at the moment by half of the residents of the Galilee region who are in their bunkers and bomb shelters because they're being attacked by missiles coming from across the Lebanese border. We're talking about an entire country which is in a sense been taken hostage by terrorist organizations. We're talking about weaponry, which is the secretary general of the United Nations has documented in his reports, is flowing into Lebanon to be used against Israel by the Hezbollah. We're talking about the steps that any democracy would take in order to protect its civilians in those circumstances, and the answer, no, it's not --

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: I'm sorry for interrupting you there, but I just want to say President Bush would say that in fact, the risks here by those actions, though, is to undermine that democracy that you're speaking about. This is the president who was speaking at a press conference just a little while ago in Germany. Listen to what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We've been working very hard through the United Nations and with partners to strengthen the democracy in Lebanon. The concern is that any activities by Israel to protect herself will weaken that government. We have made that -- or topple that government.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Are you concerned that, in fact, by these attacks, you're weakening and getting ready to topple that government?

TAUB: We are concerned. Obviously, we're in a situation where there are no ideal courses of action. Every possible course of action has potential fallout. We're not in a situation we wanted. We're in a situation that was forced on us by an unprovoked act of aggression. And along with those concerns, and they're very genuine concerns that action against -- that impacts on the lives of civilians, actions that destabilizes could be very negative. We also have to weigh up a separate basket of factors, which is the fact that if terrorism and if unprovoked violence goes without a sufficient response, it will simply encourage copying of that violence in other places and at other times, and we and no country can afford to allow that to happen.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: You talked a few minutes ago about Syrian support as well. Are you planning air strikes against Syria?

TAUB: I'm not going to go into any operational arrangements. I think its quite clear the degree of Syrian involvement here. At the moment, what we're focused on is trying to undermine the capability of Hezbollah itself and trying to make sure that Lebanon is the country with ultimate responsibility here, exercises its sovereignty and does exactly what the entire international community, along with the United Nations, has been asking of it, to disband, to disarm Hezbollah. To exercise its authority to send its forces into the south of the country and make sure no attacks against Israel or any other country are perpetrated from its territory. SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Hezbollah says this military campaign is not going to work, they're not going to release these two soldiers. Where does this end?

TAUB: At the moment, what we're doing is everything that we can, both to ensure the release of the soldiers and to ensure that the capabilities of Hezbollah, to carry on these brutal and unprovoked attacks are prevented. That's what we're working to do at the moment. We're doing it with as much intelligence and restraint and thoughtfulness as we can, taking into account the very, very complex scenario in which we find ourselves. As I say, we are not in a situation of our own choosing. We're in a situation which was forced on us. And in that situation, I think even if we don't have all the right answers, we're asking exactly the same questions that any democratic country in this situation would be asking themselves.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Israeli foreign ministry spokesman Daniel Taub joining us this morning. Thank you for your time.

TAUB: Not at all, thank you.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Ahead this morning, we'll turn back to some domestic issues, including that huge wildfire that's now threatening hundreds of homes in California's Yucca Valley. We're going to talk to a firefighter on the scene, see if they're making any progress there.

And we've been telling you all this week about how to storm-proof your home. What about the dangers waiting when you check the storm damage after the storm? Some safety tips are ahead on AMERICAN MORNING. We're back in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Almost from the time he was paralyzed by an assailant's bullet, New York City police officer Steven McDonald has been preaching forgiveness. 20 years have now passed since his life was changed forever. McDonald's been taking his message of peace around the world. CNN's faith and values correspondent Delia Gallagher has more. This remarkable story, because really, a bitter, bitter ending is really what could be expected.

DELIA GALLAGHER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely. And you know, Soledad, when an act of violence affects a member of your own family, it changes lives and raises the question of how to cope, and in many cases, how to forgive. You're about to meet one New York City police officer who did just that and is changing lives of others in the process.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GALLAGHER: It happened 20 years ago this week.

DET. STEVEN MCDONALD, WOUNDED 20 YEARS AGO: I was staring down the barrel of a small gun.

GALLAGHER: But Detective Steven McDonald remembers it like it was yesterday.

STEVEN MCDONALD: The first bullet shot me in the head, above my right eye. And the power of that threw me backwards, as I fell backwards I believe that the second shot, he shot me in the throat and then as I laid on the ground, he stood over me, and he fired a third shot, and it rested in my left arm.

GALLAGHER: A young New York police officer, McDonald was on patrol in Central Park when a 15-year-old boy shot him and ran.

STEVEN MCDONALD: I closed my eyes. I don't remember much after that, but I was very frightened. The worst nightmare of a police officer. I felt right away that I was dying.

GALLAGHER: He survived, but doctors said he'd be paralyzed for the rest of his life. His newlywed wife, Patty Ann, then three months pregnant, collapsed from the news.

PATTY ANN MCDONALD, STEVEN MCDONALD'S WIFE: I felt like I got punched in the stomach.

GALLAGHER: McDonald, unable to move or speak at the time, could do nothing to comfort his wife.

STEVEN MCDONALD: I was trapped inside this broken body.

GALLAGHER: Doctors told Patty Ann to leave her husband and put him in an institution, but two decades later, she's still at his side.

Did you ever consider it? His advice, the doctor's advice?

PATTY MCDONALD: Oh no, no, no.

GALLAGHER: The McDonalds have stayed together, thanks in part to their faith.

STEVE MCDONALD: The plan was that God would take this terrible act of evil and make something good out of it.

GALLAGHER: That faith also led the McDonalds to forgive the teenage assailant. They made that choice on the day their son Connor was baptized.

PATTY MCDONALD: We have the feeling of revenge. I mean, we've seen people through the years, and it, it just wears at you and wears at you, and to be able to give that up and not dwell on it. After Steven was injured, I mean, my emphasis and focus of all my energy went to him and being at the hospital every day and just encouraging him to get better.

GALLAGHER: Now, McDonald brings his message of forgiveness to communities torn by violence. He and his family have traveled to Ireland, Bosnia and Israel. And he also speaks closer to home at inner city schools. The McDonalds say they have good and bad days. They still pray for a miracle cure for Steven's health, but believe even without it, that good can come from tragedy. CONOR MCDONALD, STEVEN MCDONALD'S SON: God gave my dad a mission and gave my mom a mission and gave myself a mission, and we've just got to go with it.

(END OF VIDEOTAPE)

GALLAGHER: And Steven McDonald still works for the New York Police Department and in fact has just been promoted to first detective. So congratulations to him on that.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: What happened to the 15-year-old kid who shot him?

GALLAGHER: Well, he was caught. He was arrested and served nine years in jail. And in fact, Steven McDonald told me that he had hoped that upon this boy's release, he would be able to work with him in these schools and traveling with him. But in a strange twist of fate, he was killed three days after his release, in a motorcycle accident.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Wow, wow. That would have been a powerful message, the two of them together, wouldn't it have been?

GALLAGHER: Yes.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Interesting. Delia Gallagher, thanks Delia.

GALLAGHER: Thank you. Andy's "Minding Your Business," coming up next. We're back in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN: Welcome back, everybody. We're getting this word just in. A Lebanese rocket has hit the Israeli town of Safed, seven people wounded in that attack, we're told. This follows of course what happened yesterday when one person was killed, one Israeli killed, 20 others wounded in attacks brought on by Hezbollah, other missile attacks in northern Israel. The latest, really, in the escalation between Israel, Lebanon, and the Palestinians as well, attacks and then counter attacks, all beginning with the now kidnapping of three Israeli soldiers. We will continue to cover this story throughout the morning and discuss the implications and if there are any long and short-term solutions as well. That's coming up. This latest word, a Lebanese rocket hitting the Israeli town of Safed, seven people wounded there. Miles?

MILES O'BRIEN: Andy Serwer's here with a look at business. And even if you don't follow World Cup soccer very much, you probably know Zinedine Zidane.

ANDY SERWER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well done.

MILES O'BRIEN: Mr. Head butt.

SERWER: Yes, the French soccer star, you may remember, who head- butted an Italian player in the World Cup final and was thrown out. A huge story, obviously in France, in Europe, and all over the globe. On the front page of the "Wall Street Journal" this morning, a story about him. And what was actually said or transpired --

MILES O'BRIEN: Here we go. Oh, oh, man!

SERWER: Horrible little shot there. He apologized yesterday in France for this. But in the meantime, head-butting has become all the rage on the internet. Maybe not a surprise here. There's a head- butting game now featuring Zinedine Zidane. Look at this! It's called "The Real Butthead" this is called Miles.

MILES O'BRIEN: Is that on addicting games, or is that another one?

SERWER: It is actually.

MILES O'BRIEN: My son spends a lot of time.

SERWER: And check this out. On you tube. There is this video that is just the hottest thing there. A million people have seen this since Tuesday. It's called a new way to solve problems. A million people -- yeah.

MILES O'BRIEN: So if we all did this, we would solve problems? Is that it?

SERWER: Yeah, yeah.

MILES O'BRIEN: It could be misconstrued, potentially, if you did that to a stranger.

SERWER: I don't want to see what happens. Okay good, I'm glad it was turned on him.

MILES O'BRIEN: I was glad I went that way.

SERWER: Exactly.

MILES O'BRIEN: Well there is a potential business there. We're not sure what. And what's coming up next?

SERWER: We're going to be talking about Harvard University. More Welchers, not just Larry Ellison, Soledad, so, some more problems for the Alma mater.

MILES O'BRIEN: Oh, okay.

SERWER: Couldn't have been you, right?

MILES O'BRIEN: Alright, the day's top stories are ahead after a break. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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