Return to Transcripts main page

Glenn Beck

Is Terrorist Profile Changing?; JetBlue CEO Discusses Airport Security, New Energy Options

Aired August 16, 2006 - 19:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: Tonight`s episode of GLENN BECK is brought to you by Li`l Terrorist. Dress your tiny terror tot in the latest fashions and accessories from Li`l Terrorist, available in fine caves everywhere.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GLENN BECK, HOST: Tonight on the program, we are going to show you how we can be free of foreign oil in 10 years. And I`ll also tell you why Hezbollah was exactly right when it claims it won the war with Israel.

But first, another terror scare today. Details are still a little unclear, but there was a flight en route from London to Washington, D.C. It was diverted to Boston after an on-board "incident" involving a female passenger.

The initial report said the woman was carrying a screwdriver, matches, some Vaseline and two notes referencing al Qaeda, one in Arabic, one in English. Seems pretty specific. But since then, federal officials have now come out and said, "No, no terrorism link here. Nothing to see here, people. Move on."

Well, whatever did happen, we will find out as the story continues to unfold. But it does reinforce what I`ve been saying all along, that the days of ordinary profiling are over.

If this woman happened to be involved in al Qaeda, she was a 60-year- old woman. One of the people suspected in last week`s London terror plot was another woman, this one with a small child.

Look at this headline from the "New York Post" today. She was planning on smuggling a liquid explosive in her 6-month old child`s baby bottle, and her and the baby on their way to death.

Never used to be this way. Now radical Islam is turning women into monsters, as well. What kind of people are these?

You know, I am so sick of people telling us, "Oh, you need to try to understand them." You know what? I will never understand them. I will never understand the mentality of blowing up my 6-month old baby in order to advance some psychotic religious cause.

You could drag me into the gas chamber, and I still would never even conceive of doing what these animals were planning to themselves, to other people, and their own children. And that`s in a Holocaust situation.

These people aren`t in that, no matter what they might say. They`re being told to die and to take out as many innocent people as they possibly can with them in order to turn the world into a single Islamofascist entity. That`s how evil this is at the core.

How are any of us supposed to understand that? You know what? I don`t want to understand that. That`s why this is no longer the war on terror. It`s -- it`s too small in its scope. A war on terror, that`s just something to be contained. World War III, that`s what it is. And our enemies, which are all around us, need to be destroyed, not contained.

So here`s what I know tonight. Time is running out, man. The world is changing rapidly, and the tactics of our enemies are changing faster than we are. We need to get ahead of them.

Where are the dollars that we have spent to pay people to think like al Qaeda? Where are the people who said, "Oh, you know, they might be using Gatorade and baby formula to kill us?" Where are those people? We need to stop playing catch-up before it`s too late.

I also know our enemies aren`t just al Qaeda, Hezbollah and Iran. We are surrounded by people who sympathize with them, people who may be watching this show tonight and plotting a new, innovative way to kill us. The only ones that don`t really seem to get that are us.

Here`s what I don`t know. I don`t know if I fully understand the scope of how evil these people are. When I saw this, it really kind of moved me. When a woman can in her right mind strap an explosive to her 6- month-old baby, I mean, you know, these people make Genghis Khan look like a Girl Scout.

And finally, I don`t know how do you identify the terrorist that might be living next door? I mean, you always hear this: "I never knew. I think that they were great." When they`re using babies and soccer moms to kill us, you know we`re going to have to change our thinking pretty darn quickly.

Counterterrorism expert Craig Gundry.

Craig, how do you do it? I mean, how do you -- I mean, the profile is changing, right?

CRAIG GUNDRY, COUNTERTERRORISM EXPERT: Well, for al Qaeda, yes, but bear in mind, what we`re talking about here isn`t necessarily a new phenomenon. We have seen different terrorist groups using women in the past. Part of the problem that we have is that everybody falls into this mind-set of just categorizing the kinds of terrorists we`re dealing with today based upon a certain type of ethnicity or a certain type of sex.

BECK: All right. I -- I have seen over and over again here just in the last week. People from these mosques are like, "I had no idea. They seemed like the greatest Muslim ever."

Help regular Muslims, the good Muslims profile. How does a good Muslim who`s going to mosque with somebody on Fridays, you know, say, "Wait a minute; that`s not a good Muslim?" What are they looking for?

GUNDRY: If you look at previous incidents that we`ve had over the last couple of years where people have identified people in mosques, it`s usually been because of extreme rhetoric, people associated together in small groups sort of insular from the rest of the community in the area.

BECK: Are you with me that it seems like we`re always playing catchup and, if so, what is next? What should we be banning today?

GUNDRY: I do agree with you. We are constantly playing catchup. And that`s the major problem. But mind you, it isn`t just so much a matter of trying to predict what may be done in the future that hasn`t been done. A lot of what we`re seeing right now is simply a reorganization, as it were, of tactics that we`ve seen terrorists use in the past.

BECK: Like what?

GUNDRY: Well, for example, the use of females in order to circumvent security or in order to make security personnel more relaxed. The use of liquids, for example, being concealed inside of a bottle or something like this. I mean, we`ve seen this.

BECK: OK. So if we`ve seen it, I mean, why are we the dumbest people on the planet? Why -- why didn`t we ban liquids before?

GUNDRY: Well, part of the problem is that we have a tendency to only respond to the threat scenario that`s right before us. You know, whatever the flavor of attack was in the last attack, we often adapt our counter measures accordingly.

And there`s a variety of different reasons why we do it like this. I mean, naturally everybody in the -- in the security community tends to be very responsive, but even when we try to be proactive, there`s often only so much that we can do to deal with threats that are only theoretical.

BECK: You know, El Al, we had a guy on from El Al yesterday, former security there. And those guys know how to do it right, and he said, you know, you`ve got to look at the profile. You`ve got to look people in the eye, and don`t worry about their skin color. But you have to have some spider senses going on inside.

Do you see us getting to a security system like El Al?

GUNDRY: I think we`re inevitably going to have to. I don`t think we have much of a choice. Bear in mind, there are certain elements of the El Al system that have previously been dismissed because they may violate civil liberties or they may not be politically correct.

BECK: I`d just like to be able to get to my, you know -- my house or to my business appointment in one piece. I mean, you know, it`s a privilege to fly. It`s not a right to fly. You know, I saw that we had moved this -- you say that it`s a civil rights.

Here`s one thing that really -- maybe it`s just me that thought this, but when I saw the bomb lady here and she wanted to kill her, you know, 6- month-old, and they said that they`d moved the baby on to her parents, I thought to myself, "Geez, you know, in the old days my grandparents would have baptized that baby and that baby would be being raised by Jerry Falwell right now."

It`s really hard not to just start singling people out and saying, "Look, dirt bag, back off." Because you start to see people in these groups.

What else should we be looking for besides the stereotypical guy or woman?

GUNDRY: This is the difficulty we face, both in law enforcement and the intelligence community, is trying to find the needle in the haystack. And a lot of the intelligence that we`ve encountered in the past, that has led to arrest has come from the community itself. It`s also come from other means, too, such as communications intercepts and things like this.

So it basically boils down to being aggressive in our intelligence effort and trying to cultivate that relationship with the community.

BECK: But Craig, the idea that we`re being aggressive is a joke. Have you ridden on a train in the northeast? I mean, I don`t want to get into helping terrorists out, but I mean, they don`t need a lot of help there. There`s just huge holes.

GUNDRY: Sure, we could sit here all day long and talk about different threat scenarios and vulnerabilities that have been identified but haven`t been addressed yet. But...

BECK: What`s the biggest smuggling block, in 10 seconds? Why are those vulnerabilities left to remain open?

GUNDRY: A lot of it boils down to cost effectiveness, what is -- what we perceive as being most effective at reducing the threat today, from what we`re willing to spend. That`s both monetarily, as well as in terms of inconvenience.

BECK: All right, Craig. Thanks a lot. Appreciate it.

An exclusive interview coming up with the head of JetBlue. What is he doing to help beef up airport security and a way we can be energy independent within 10 years. It will blow your mind how easy it is, coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BECK: This is from the London Times. The government in London is discussing with airport operators plans to introduce a screening system that allows security staff to focus on those passengers who pose the greatest risk. What? That`s a radical idea! What are you, out of your mind! What kind of ridiculous system do you have in place now?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BECK: We usually don`t do this, but my next guest has so much to say that he merits two segments. He`s actually the first guy to do that. He also happens to be a friend of mine who I happen to see in church every Sunday, so of course, I`m giving him preferential treatment.

Founded six years ago, JetBlue has changed the way we fly, focusing on customer service and -- my favorite -- the little tiny TVs on the seats. And leather seats and everything else.

JetBlue was one of the few airlines that actually made a profit in the aftermath of 9/11. Now, on the heels of the London terror plot, the airlines are at a crossroads again. Once again, they`re standing right there.

David Neeleman, CEO of JetBlue, in a minute believe it or not, we`re actually going to solve the oil crisis with a genuine, tangible solution that will have us in oil that we haven`t purchased from somebody in an Arab nation. It will blow your mind how easy it is.

But first, David, what is stopping us from actually having secure airlines. There was a -- there was a story that I just read before I walked in the studio. A 12-year-old boarded a flight today with no ticket and no passport. How does that happen?

DAVID NEELEMAN, CEO, JETBLUE: Well, you know, I think in our case, it would be a little more difficult, but you know, we`re literally moving millions of people back and forth every day.

Since 9/11 there`s been a lot of advancements, and I can`t tell you all the stuff that happens behind the scenes. But, you know, the bags are being taken care of in a way that they weren`t being done before 9/11.

The security checkpoints now are completely different, are manned by more capable people. You know, this latest threat that we had in London now, there`s extra attention being paid to carry on bags as far as liquids and gels. So you know, I think it`s one of these things that it needs to evolve, and it takes a little bit of time.

But I -- you know, I have a lot of confidence that we have people there that are thinking about these things. And I think there was a reaction...

BECK: We seem to always be behind.

NEELEMAN: Well, we were behind, but then the pendulum swings a little bit too far. You know, the day of the directive on the -- on the gels and liquids, the first pronouncement said that pilots can`t bring toothpastes on the airplane. And these are the people actually flying the airplanes.

BECK: Right.

NEELEMAN: And so they backed off of that. So it`s one of these things where that the pendulum has to swing back and forth many times. You know, I happen to believe that, you know, there was a lot of focus on the cabin of the airplane because of what happened in 9/11 and that it needed to be more focused on the bags, and then we got focused on the bags. And now we`re back to the cabin again. So it`s -- I think the tactics of these terrorists are ever evolving so we need to evolve with them.

BECK: OK. Tell me quickly because we have so much to cover. Quickly, what would have happened to our airlines if this plot would have - - if we would have dropped 10 planes out of the sky over New York City? What would have happened to our airlines today?

NEELEMAN: It would be -- it would be catastrophic. It would be very, very difficult obviously. You know, thankfully -- you know, and you never know exactly how far advanced the plan was and if this concoction would have actually worked. You know, because obviously there`s a lot of people out there trying to think of things to do.

Fortunately, with what we had happen last Thursday and where we are today, you know, the difference in travel is almost completely unnoticeable. I mean, you`d have to be in a cave if you didn`t know to not know you can`t bring a gel or a liquid on the airplane today, and if you don`t do that, you can go through security almost faster than you did before, because they`re checking carry-ons.

BECK: What do you think airline security is going to be like five years from now you?

NEELEMAN: I think it`s going to be, certainly -- I don`t know if you`ve gone through these puffer machines where they actually blow air on you, and that`s -- obviously there`s a reason why they`re doing that, for explosive type of devices.

And you know, I think -- I have great hope in the commercial enterprise of America to say who can make a machine that can catch the most amount of stuff and sell it for the most amount of money?

BECK: Right.

NEELEMAN: And I think that you have a lot of scientists that are saying, you know, let`s figure out ways -- there was an article just yesterday about this thing that can actually give you a nude screen. You go through and you`re completely naked to the person looking at you to see if there`s absolutely anything on your person.

BECK: Some people I don`t really think we should see naked. Most of the people in line, I`m jut saying no thanks.

NEELEMAN: There are so many advances. But -- and there`s a commercial reason to do it.

BECK: Right.

NEELEMAN: And there`s a lot of money behind the government to do it, and so I think it`s just going to continue to advance.

BECK: OK.

NEELEMAN: I obviously have a huge interest in telling you that travel is safe.

BECK: Sure.

NEELEMAN: Because I`m in the industry.

BECK: I was just thinking that.

NEELEMAN: And a little bit of a vested interest here. But I`ll tell you, the hassle factor is way down. I got an e-mail from a neighbor today saying, "How many hours do I need to get there in advance?"

I said, "Get there an hour in advance. You`ll have no problem getting through security."

And that`s what I want to let people know.

BECK: OK. I want to get into the capitalism solves everything. Because it`s a challenge that I have been saying for I don`t know how long: where are the Rockefellers?

But first, I have to ask you a question. There`s a story that`s out about, currently, the charges are that you guys fired a pilot because he was Muslim. That`s what he`s claiming. He`s suing JetBlue. Do you have any comment on this?

NEELEMAN: Well, first of all he was never working for us. And you know, that`s important. And the legal department has told me hey, don`t comment on this. But I will tell you that we don`t discriminate based on ethnicity or religion. That was not the reason.

He had a conditional offer and it was rescinded for reasons other than his religion or his ethnicity. It didn`t have anything to do with it. You know, kind of the next day we had this whole thing going on.

BECK: Right.

NEELEMAN: So it wasn`t the greatest timing. But I can tell you, that`s the most I can say about it. The lawyers are in control now.

BECK: OK. Coming up, we`ll have more with David Neeleman from JetBlue. There was a -- there was an unbelievable moment where we were talking, and he said you know, the oil thing, not really that hard to solve. And he`s got people lined up, companies that will blow your mind that can make us energy independent within 10 years. Coming up. Hang on.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: The best moments in life often happen at night. What if you could have even more of those magical nocturnal memories? Coal, we can make it night 24/7.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: Last week Glenn had questions for Miss America. What you didn`t see were the questions she had for him.

JENNIFER BERRY, MISS AMERICA: Which word best describes you: sexy, smart, or talented?

ANNOUNCER: Want the answer? Watch Glenn`s podcast, "Ask Glenn". Download it on iTunes or at CNN.com/Glenn.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BECK: We`re back with the CEO of JetBlue, David Neeleman.

I have been issuing a call for I don`t know how long. Where are the Rockefellers that can smell the money on oil? I am so concerned -- we`re going to be crippled with sending all this money over to the Arab nations buying our oil. They`re going to cripple us.

NEELEMAN: Yes.

BECK: You -- we were talking about this between church and after church and you leaned over and said, "Got the solution." You`ve been working on it. Tell us the solution.

NEELEMAN: Well, the United States has been blessed with the largest coal supply of anywhere in the country and the world. We have more BTUs in the United States of coal than all the OPEC countries combined.

There`s a technology that`s proven that`s actually being used today in South Africa and China, building plants. We can take this coal. We can sequester the CO2, put it back in the ground, and make liquids.

In fact, today front page, "Wall Street Journal", there`s a big story on it. And that it`s something that can rid us on our dependence on foreign oil.

BECK: OK. We`ve talked about this. I know this governor of Wyoming is all over this, actually, but you`ve taken it a step further. Who have you talked to?

NEELEMAN: Well, I`ve been to leading folks in the Senate, senators and congressmen. I`ve even visited some folks in the White House. I`ve been to the Energy Department and talked to them about it, and, you know, it`s -- what we`re trying to do, I`m trying to do, is create a bill that simply says this.

This can be created for a dollar a gallon from coal. About -- less than half of what we`re paying today.

BECK: Right.

NEELEMAN: All I want to do -- the really difficult part of it is it takes an enormous capital investment.

BECK: Right.

NEELEMAN: You know, to build a plant it`s $5 to 6 billion to make 80,000 barrels a day, but the total cost is about $1 a gallon.

The concern is from the G.E.`s of the world who own this technology, that if the price were to come down below, say, $35 a barrel, down to $25 because the Saudi Arabians or somebody decided to pump it, they would lose their investment.

So I`m trying to pass -- get some legislation that just says that these people will be protected somewhat on their investment so that if the price were to go down and they can immediately start building these plants, within 10 years we can be energy independent.

BECK: OK. So who do you have lined up? Do you have anybody that`s willing to step up as a partner with the government to build the plant?

NEELEMAN: Well, there`s 28 states that have coal.

BECK: Right.

NEELEMAN: Everything`s political, as you know, and so I`ve been to see lots of senators who have coal in their states and explained to them that this little economically depressed area of your state could become like Dubai, you could build these plants that could be environmentally friendly. And you know, there`s interest, and they`re looking at it.

And you know, there`s just not the urgency. I mean, I have urgency because every time the price of oil goes up 10 cents it costs me $50 million. And I`m not doing it for me personally.

BECK: Right.

NEELEMAN: I`m really concerned about this country.

BECK: David, you and I talked about this before. That it is -- we -- we`ve got rid of our strategic oil reserves for the Navy. Gone. How do you survive in World War III? How do you fuel our military? You don`t, man.

NEELEMAN: Our military is fueled by two things. It`s fueled by nuclear, from nuclear submarines and aircraft carriers. And it`s fueled by jet fuel and diesel, which is what you make from coal.

And so if we just built 10 plants we`d have almost a million barrels a day that would be being produced just with 10 plants, and we can make a lot more with the coal reserves that we have. And then it becomes our strategic petroleum reserve.

BECK: OK. We have a way for you to actually get involved in this. We`re out of time now. Tomorrow on the program on the program on radio please listen. David`s going to join me on the radio in hour number two. We`ll talk about this and give you a call to action, how you can help, coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BECK: All right. Welcome to "The Real Story," where we take a look past the headlines and bring you the part of the story that the media just isn`t talking about.

I want to start quickly about an amazing story out of St. Louis, and I have to be honest with you, I don`t really have a real story on this one yet, but let me tell you exactly what I do have so far. A couple of days ago, I was tipped off by a television viewer that police had found what he called an improvised explosive devise, an IED. They found it in an Army recruiting office.

Now, you`ll probably know that IEDs are what insurgents are using to kill our soldiers in Iraq. There was nothing about this story in the news, and so we started making some phone calls. After a lot of "no comments," we finally got somebody to go on the record with us.

According to Richard Beckett (ph) from the St. Louis recruiting battalion, a recruit found two containers filled with fuel and an igniting device. The bomb squad was called. The device didn`t explode, and that`s all we know. Nobody else will tell us anything about it. We`re going to keep making calls on this story, and we will find out who was behind this and what their real motives were. We`ll keep you posted.

Next, there is the story out of Australia today that their government has turned down a proposal to cut greenhouse gas emissions because, according to their prime minister, it would, quote, "cripple their resource sector, cause jobs to disappear, and impose even higher fuel prices." No!

You want to know the real story here? This is the real story behind gas emissions and global warming. No one wants to make personal sacrifices. Nobody wants to make personal sacrifices to defeat something we`re not even sure if we`re responsible for it. Even the people who are supposedly heading up the charge on global warming, the leaders who are out there everyday, you know, "Robot Al," "We`ve got to change our lifestyle," come on, sacrifice for the greater good? You got it. I`m there. If you are, you`re nothing but hypocrites.

Want an example? Look no farther than the poster child for global warming of personal sacrifice, Al Gore. He wants us to live in what he calls a "carbon-neutral lifestyle." OK. Well, if he`s really concerned about global warming killing all of us -- 10 years, it`s a ticking time bomb -- he sure doesn`t show it in the way he lives.

Al reportedly not only has three homes, totaling over 15,000 square feet, but he also hasn`t signed up for a simple program offered by his existing power utility company to convert his homes to wind energy. It would only cost him two cents more a kilowatt hour, and he wouldn`t have to make any other changes to his home.

The Gore camp said that he is, quote, "Looking into it," so, you know, you`ve got to wonder, what, I mean, is he worried about the couple of extra cents? I mean, times must be pretty tight in the Al Gore household these days. I`m just saying.

Oh, by the way, the Bush administration has already converted, used the same program to convert some federal buildings in Washington to the green energy.

The bottom line here is that everybody wants to help, everybody wants to be there, but nobody really wants to be inconvenienced while they`re doing it, and that`s the truth. So until you`re willing to power your own house via the hamster wheel and throw a wind turbine on top of your car, stop being hypocrites and stop the pointing the finger, will you?

And finally, the big headlines today are all about how Hezbollah is claiming victory in their recent war with Israel, which I think is hysterical because, while they were fighting the war, they were like, "We`re just a poor, little, innocent terror group that`s being picked on by big, bad Israel. Help us, help us."

So how do you go from, "They`re picking on us," to, "We won," overnight? Well, let me give you the real story. And before you start sending me all sorts of hate mail, let me explain this fully. The real story today is that Israel has, indeed, lost their first war to Hezbollah. I say that for a couple of reasons.

First, did anybody notice they didn`t get their kidnapped soldiers back? Remember them? What happened? Wasn`t that the whole reason they went to war in the first place?

And second, Hezbollah not only still exists, but I believe they`re stronger than ever because they`ve proven they know how to use the biggest weapon in their arsenal: the media.

All right, now let me explain the disturbing part. Here`s why I think they really did lose. A few quotes from the news today about Israel. One, quote, "Demands mounted for the military chief`s resignation." Two, new surveys show, quote, "low approval ratings" for leaders, even though the ratings for Prime Minister Olmert "soared to 78 percent in the first two weeks of the offensive." And finally, quote, "Calls mounted for setting up a commission of inquiry into how the war was run."

Oh, do any of these sound familiar to you? They should, because the Israelis are starting to sound just like us. Israel lost this war because they`ve become a reflection of us: a country that is too scared -- I should say -- a country that is led by a bunch of politicians who are too scared to fight with whatever it takes to win, a country with politicians so caught up in public opinion that they`ve got one eye on the battlefield and the other eye on the television set.

You can`t fight a war worrying about what people are going to think of you, and you definitely can`t win one. Vietnam taught us that lesson, and now, congratulations, Israel, you`ve got your own Vietnam, a Vietnam of your very own. Welcome to the club, guys, the one club that doesn`t let its military fight and win and lets its politicians yak and lose.

So let me ask you a question: Deep down in your gut, do you really still think -- I mean, when you think about the nukes in Iran, do you think, "Oh, leave it to Israel. They`ll be a big brother in the Middle East. They`ll do whatever it takes to keep a nuke from developing there"? No. How can you feel that way? They`ve just proven to be us, more importantly proven to their enemies, to our enemies, that they are a paper tiger, a country that`s too worried about their image to finish what they started.

I got to tell you, the horrible thing about this is, today I know how our allies must feel about us. I`m sorry to say it, Israel, but your new Americanized way of worrying about your image has lost the war for you. And, unfortunately, I think that spells huge trouble for all of us down the road.

Mark Perry is co-director of Conflicts Forum. Mark, am I wrong on this?

MARK PERRY, CO-DIRECTOR, CONFLICTS FORUM: You`re wrong on some of it, but I think your initial judgment is absolutely correct.

BECK: OK, what am I wrong on?

PERRY: Well, this isn`t a P.R. campaign; it`s not a basketball game; and it`s not because we didn`t take the handcuffs off of Israel and let them do what they want. And we lost in Vietnam not because the civilians betrayed the military but because we shouldn`t have been there in the first place.

BECK: Right, OK.

PERRY: And the reason that...

BECK: Mark, you and I are not going to agree on anything. I mean, I would like to say, "I remember when I was a cute, little, innocent guy, too," but the real story is here: You agree with Hezbollah. You`re in business with Hezbollah! You won`t call them a terror group. I will. And it`s frightens me that we do agree on the one thing, that Israel lost the war.

You say that it`s not a P.R. thing. Bull crap it`s not. You tell me this: What was the whole thing with Hezbollah coming out today and saying, "You know what? If you lost your home, we`re going to go ahead and we`re going -- free furniture and free rent for a year." Where`s that money coming from, Mark?

PERRY: Any good government would do that.

BECK: Yes, where`s the money coming from?

PERRY: They`ve got plenty of money. And I`m sure they`re getting...

BECK: Where is the money coming from?

PERRY: Iran and Syria.

BECK: Iran and Syria!

PERRY: Well, where are they supposed to get it from, Israel? You think they`re going to get it from us?

BECK: Oh, Iran and Syria, well, they`re good guys there.

PERRY: Maybe you should have a monologue and not debate me.

BECK: You know...

PERRY: We know we`re they`re getting their money. They`re rooted in their communities. People believe in them. They`re absolutely at the top of their game. They have a lot of popular support on the ground, and that`s why they won this war. It doesn`t have anything to do with P.R. They fought well, and they fought for their homes.

BECK: Yes.

PERRY: We can call them international terrorists as long as you want.

BECK: How is it you can have -- Mark, how is it you can actually have one day people saying, "We`re being picked on by this big country. We can`t defend ourselves," and the next day say, "We won. Victory for us"? How can you do that, if it`s not a P.R. war?

PERRY: The same way that the Vietcong and the Vietnamese did it. The same way that the Nicaraguans did it. The same way that all of these countries did it. The truth of the matter is, in the post-World War II environment, the people with the tanks and airplanes are not winning. You have to have popular support on the ground. Hezbollah did.

BECK: It`s a media war, my friend. OK, do you think a...

PERRY: Well, if it was a media war, Israel would win.

BECK: Oh, really?

PERRY: Yes.

BECK: That`s not the Jews run the media, is it, Mark?

PERRY: No, it`s not the Jews run the media. Those are your words.

BECK: Uh-huh. Tell me, do you believe that a superpower can actually win a war in today`s world?

PERRY: Probably not.

BECK: Why?

PERRY: Because I think diplomacy is what people want; diplomacy is the thing that will prevent wars. We`ve got this backwards. It used to be that, when diplomacy failed, you went to war. Today, when wars fail, you have diplomacy. I`m hoping in the next four weeks that`s what we`ll have. We`ll have the Americans and the Israelis engagement with a group that has legitimacy on the ground. Because they`ve been elected by their people, they have legitimacy on the ground. That goes for Hamas, and Hezbollah, the Muslim Brotherhood, Jamaat-e-Islami in Pakistan. It`s time to talk and stop fighting.

BECK: Right. So what does -- how do you deal with a group of people where, you know, you`ve got the, you know, disarm, but they don`t disarm, and then they hide behind U.N. peacekeepers? How do you trust a cease-fire here with people who really are not that trustworthy?

PERRY: We don`t know whether they`re trustworthy or not because we`ve never had even a cup of coffee with them and haven`t talked to them.

BECK: Right.

PERRY: And maybe if we did, we`d find out whether they were trustworthy. And if we found out that they`d broke agreements, then we`d have an excuse to for an attack. But two abducted soldiers that we destroyed an entire -- Israel has destroyed an entire country for? And now Israel announces that it will have negotiations with Hezbollah to get them back? Why don`t we roll the clock back 30 days and start with negotiations instead of ending with them? We`d save a lot of lives.

BECK: Yes, you know, I can see your point on there. Don`t agree with really any of it, Mark, except Israel did lose the war. Thank you very much. Appreciate your time.

PERRY: My pleasure.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BECK: Miss Statutory Rape or "Miss Teen USA," as it`s also known, is the competition that pits the barely legal versus the border-line legal versus the definitely not legal. The winner was -- hold your breath on this one -- 18-year-old Kate Blair from Montana.

Yes, that`s right. That`s your new Miss Teen USA winner. She loves the environment, music, sports, and is legal in almost every county in this great land. There she is, Miss Statutory Rape!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BECK: As a dad, man, I watched that, and I`m thinking to myself, would you ever let your teenage daughter on this? Do you know how many weirdos are watching? Now, let`s change gears for a second.

Sometimes you lose your keys, maybe even your wallet, but I`m pretty sure that if you had 700 boxes of videotapes, including the little flick I like to call the first moon landing ever, you might keep an eye on it. Not NASA. No, they`ve admitted to losing tons of original recordings, including their 1969 greatest hit, "One Small Step for Man" by Neil Armstrong. Yes, where did I put that lunar landing tape?

NASA says, quote, they`re "looking for the paperwork to see where the tapes last were." So I`m sure they`re going to turn up any day now.

But just when you thought that losing years of priceless material is enough to make your head explode, our conspiracy theory friends have come up to tell us that this is just more evidence that the moonwalk actually took place on a Hollywood soundstage.

Aron Ranen has a documentary called, "Did We Go?" Did we go? Did we go?

Aron...

ARON RANEN, WWW.MOONHOAX.COM: Well, Glenn, what do you think? Do you think we landed on the moon?

BECK: Yes.

RANEN: Now, how do you prove it? What`s your evidence?

BECK: Well, I will tell you this, Aron -- and I`m really bummed, but Mr. Aldrin is in the hospital, but I talked to him about an hour ago. I called Buzz up in the hospital and I said, "Hey, Buzz, can you be on the show tonight?" And he`s like, "In the hospital, can`t talk long." And I thought, "Conspiracy!"

I asked him ,"Did you walk on the moon?" And he said, "Yes." I said, "Have you heard this theory from this guy?" And he said, "Yes, I have." I said, "Does it hack you off? You were on the moon walking around." And he said, "No, you can`t let people like that hack you off. No, I walked on the moon."

So I`m going to trust Buzz, or I could trust you.

RANEN: Well, I mean, let`s say you trusted your television set, really, didn`t you? That`s how most of us believed it.

BECK: No, no, I got it from Buzz. I got it from Buzz.

RANEN: I mean, for instance, let`s think about what you believe on TV. I`m actually nowhere near this bridge. This is a screen...

BECK: Oh, my gosh, is this the magic of television?

(CROSSTALK)

RANEN: Yes.

BECK: Oh, my.

RANEN: So a grainy moon landing? I mean, Glenn, to me it`s incredible that we can keep track of Egyptian pots from 2,000 years ago but we lose tapes made only 40 years ago.

BECK: Wait a minute. There is a very good explanation: It`s the government. You tell me how -- I`ll give you two things on the government. One, tell me the thing that the government has done right. OK, they`re keeping tapes? No, not so much. Second of all, do you really think, with "The New York Times" of the world, that the government could keep this secret for this long?

RANEN: Well, let`s remember, first of all, there was a Cold War going on...

BECK: Right.

RANEN: ... and us landing on the moon sent a real strong message to the Soviet Union that we could plop a nuke bomb right there. OK, I hear what you`re saying.

BECK: No, I mean, come on, man.

RANEN: Hey, listen, watch the film, "Did We Go?" You`ll see where I actually traveled.

BECK: What happened to the missing -- like the Challenger guys? Where are they? Have we rented families to weep?

RANEN: Well, I`m just an expert on the moon landing. And what I can say -- and I know you have a tape there -- is I tracked down Gene Krantz, who`s the director, the flight director of Apollo 11...

(CROSSTALK)

RANEN: He admitted to me the tapes are missing.

BECK: All right, go ahead. Play Gene Krantz please.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GENE KRANTZ, FLIGHT DIRECTOR, APOLLO 11: I haven`t seen anything that indicates the telemetry data is even in existence. And as I said, even if we had it, we don`t have the machines to play it back.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But your own research shows the telemetry data is missing?

KRANTZ: That`s right.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BECK: Wow.

RANEN: It`s missing. How am I going to prove it? You know, I was -- this film, "Did We Go?" at moonhoax.com, was commissioned by the state of Ohio in anniversary of the 30th anniversary, and I couldn`t prove it. I mean, if I can`t get a hold of those telemetry tapes, those original videotapes, how are you going to prove it? Moon rocks fall in Antarctica. I sent a laser beam to the moon.

BECK: Let me do this. You also have another clip that I saw.

RANEN: An interview with Buzz Aldrin.

BECK: And I thought you were a nut job, and then I saw this clip, and I thought, "Huh?"

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where were you on June 20, 1969?

BUZZ ALDRIN, ASTRONAUT: I was on the surface of the moon.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BECK: Huh?

RANEN: Well, did you see the twitch, the little mouth twitch? I mean...

BECK: The what twitch?

RANEN: The mouth twitch, after he said, "I was on the surface of the moon"? You`re the expert. You interview people all the time. Is he lying, Glenn, or is it just -- you know, it`s like Peter Pan. They just want us to believe in the moon landing like Peter Pan. And I just won`t accept that.

BECK: Aron, I do have to tell that I believe you.

RANEN: Thank you, Glenn.

BECK: All right. You bet, Aron. There are a lot of people out there that, for whatever reason, I mean, they dig this conspiracy stuff. I say let`s start cashing in on it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: Conspiracy fans, get ready for this special one-time offer. Available for the first time, genuine, 100-percent authenticated fake moon rocks. Be the first on your block to own one of the real fake moon rocks used on the Hollywood soundstage where the moon landing actually took place.

And, if you act now, we`ll throw in this exact scale replica of the second gun used in the Kennedy assassination. If you`re a second-gunman theorist, you`ll love adding this firearm to your collection.

But wait, there`s more! Still wondering why Darrin One was mysteriously replaced by Darrin Two? Of course you are! Now, relive this legendary TV cover-up with these commemorative dinner plates, as well as this set of steak knives.

And, if you call within the next 20 minutes, we`ll throw in, at no extra charge, this Mel Gibson "Conspiracy Theory" action figure. Just wind him up, sit back, and watch him blame the Jews for practically everything. Call now, preferably from a pay phone so the call can`t be traced. You can`t be too careful.

Hey, who are you? Who let you in? Get your hands off me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BECK: Right to hate mail. The first one comes in from Pinky -- yes, Pinky -- in Bakersfield. She writes, "I do not know what made CNN hire this fool named Glenn Beck. Seriously, is CNN trying to ruin journalism? This man isn`t a journalist; he`s a moron. I do not pay to hear someone and their idiot opinion."

Pinky, you ain`t paying for this show, so relax. And by the way, this idiot`s opinion is this idiot`s job. I take the news and tell you what I think about it. I ain`t a journalist. I wear that as a badge of honor, by the way. And if someone gave you the impression that I was, they owe you an apology.

Here, let me prove it. Did you see this video that was out? It was a driver, he`s getting an award. If you look behind him, a fan sneaks up, jumps into the car, and goes for a joyride. Eventually, he stops, and, you know, he gets out, and they just beat the snot out of him. And while they`re dealing with him, his partner jumps into this tow truck and he tries to steal that. Then, they beat the crap out of him, too.

It`s great video. Now, some sources have said that this was serious and that everybody was arrested. Others say this is a prank, man, played on the driver by one of his sponsors for a commercial that they were filming. Journalists would make a call, pound the pavement. You know, they`d find out which one was true.

Me? This just in: It was a prank played on the driver. That settles that.

Bob from Alabama writes, "Glenn, I was going to subscribe to your magazine, `Fusion,` but according to you, you know, we`ll never see the September issue. The world`s going to end 8/22, you know? Do you have the zip code for Heaven?"

Bob, remember, not me saying the end of the world is coming, it`s, you know, crazy people with bombs and they believe that it is. I think it`s worth pointing it out.

But let me ask you this: If the world does end and you have to answer for the life you`ve lived, do you really want to do that without a subscription to "Fusion"? I heard waiting in line in Heaven is really long, and the magazines have been there since the place opened, so I`d order today and be prepared, if I were you.

Before we go, let me just say thanks to our interns, Adam and Ali. They`re leaving us today, and they`ve really been tremendous. And I`m going to write a great letter of recommendation for them, and they like it here. Good judges of -- they don`t? I say good riddance. Really, see you. Beat it, you bums.

We`ll see you tomorrow on the radio show. Don`t forget David Neilaman (ph) is going to be on. We`re going to talk about the oil, and you`ve got to hear the full plan and how you can get involved to get us energy free in 10 years. See you tomorrow.

END