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ANDERSON COOPER 360 DEGREES
Pope's Comments Ire Muslims; Police Search for Abducted Baby; Teen Escapes Dungeon
Aired September 18, 2006 - 20:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening again, everyone.
Tonight: With parts of the Muslim world going up in flames and much of it up in arms, a showdown between the United States and Iran.
ANNOUNCER: He's a president on the ropes.
He's a radical on the rise.
The leaders of Iran and the United States on a nuclear collision course -- and now the whole world is watching.
Regrets and rage -- the pope says he's sorry.
Across the Muslim world, people say, sorry just isn't enough.
And held in a bunker, out of sight, beyond hope -- but, when the kidnapper fell asleep, she sprang into action.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She's strong-willed. And she is just glad to be home.
ANNOUNCER: So, how did she do it?
ANNOUNCER: Across the country and around the world, this is ANDERSON COOPER 360.
Reporting from the CNN studios in New York, here's Anderson Cooper.
COOPER: And thanks for joining us.
We begin tonight with the U.S. and Iran.
Just blocks from here, at the United Nations, a showdown is brewing -- so, all the angles now on Iran's president and the president of the United States. They will be addressing the U.N. General Assembly tomorrow -- Iran sticking to its nuclear program, a peaceful one, it says -- President Bush, convinced that Iran is building a bomb, pushing economic sanctions and hinting of war.
But how good is the intelligence? Or is this Iraq and WMD all over again? Tonight, we will examine what we want to know what Iran is up to or what they're not up to.
And war plans -- how would we attack Iran with American forces tied up in Iraq and Afghanistan? Experts are saying, even the best- case scenario doesn't look so hot.
We begin, however, with a looming showdown.
Here's CNN's John Roberts.
JOHN ROBERTS, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): He's a full seven inches shorter than President Bush, but, at every opportunity, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad just loves to poke the president in the eye.
MAHMOUD AHMADINEJAD, IRANIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): Access to peaceful nuclear energy and power is the right of the Iranian people.
ROBERTS: Whether it's his open defiance of the White House on Iran's nuclear program or cozying up to such foes of the U.S. as Venezuela's Hugo Chavez on Sunday, Ahmadinejad has successfully ridden the tide of growing anti-Americanism in the Muslim world.
Ray Takeyh is author of "Hidden Iran: Paradox and Power in the Islamic Republic."
RAY TAKEYH, AUTHOR, "HIDDEN IRAN: PARADOX AND POWER IN THE ISLAMIC REPUBLIC": Well, I think he's appealing to a larger audience, beyond the Western capitals, and, frankly, even beyond America, to the Muslim capitals, to the Muslim streets, suggesting that there is a new defiant leader that is willing to stand up to the United States.
ROBERTS: And, in doing so, Ahmadinejad hopes to drive a wedge this week between the U.S. and its allies at the United Nations, who might feel just a little pushed around by the White House.
AHMADINEJAD (through translator): The United States is turning the Security Council into a basis for imposing its policies.
ROBERTS: The strategy appears to be working. Just today, France backpedaled on its support for sanctions if Iran did not agree to give up its nuclear program.
But how did the mudslinging between Tehran and the White House get so bad? Certainly, Ahmadinejad's denial of the Holocaust and insistence that Israel be wiped off the map were part of it. Some people also fault President Bush for what they call increasingly Islamophobic language that alienates Muslims.
Zbigniew Brzezinski dealt with Iran as President Carter's national security adviser.
ZBIGNIEW BRZEZINSKI, FORMER NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: And he talks all the time about the jihadists, Islamic fanatics, Islamic terrorists, the caliphate that is going to be set up. Suppose the president was talking about the IRA terrorists in Northern Ireland, you know, the Irish terrorists, and instead was calling them all the time the Catholic terrorists, the papist terrorists, the terrorists who are trying to set up a papacy. It would certainly offend many Catholics.
ROBERTS: There's no question among experts and analysts that Ahmadinejad wants to remake Iran into the Middle East's dominant power. Whether nuclear weapons are a part of that strategy is an open question. But as worrying as Iran's intentions are, so, for some people, is what President Bush has in mind.
BRZEZINSKI: And the president sometimes creates the impression that, come what may, he's going to address this issue decisively in the next two years, which I suspect means only one possibility, war, because to resolve this issue may take longer than two years, to negotiate seriously.
ROBERTS (voice-over): Brzezinski believes that Iran may be as much as a decade away from developing a nuclear weapon, if it goes down that road.
But one of President Bush's Bush's biggest worries -- and he doesn't like to talk about this publicly -- is that, if Iran doesn't agree in the near future to give up its nuclear program, Israel may launch a preemptive strike. And, if that were to happen, everyone that I have talked to about it predicts the consequences would be disastrous.
John Roberts, CNN, Washington.
COOPER: It's really not -- not like knocking out Iraq's nuclear program, which is what Israel did several years ago.
CNN chief international correspondent Christiane Amanpour sat down with Iran's president last year during the visit to the U.N.
She joins me now.
What -- what role does -- does he see for -- for Iran in -- on -- in the world? I mean, clearly, he wants a big role for Iran.
CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, he does.
And it's interesting that you mentioned last year's interview, because it was during that interview, and then, shortly after, at the U.N. that he announced that Iran was going to continue with its nuclear program. And, as you know, they insist that it's for peaceful purposes.
But, more than that, they insist they have the right, under all the international treaties, to go ahead and continue this nuclear program. What's interesting is that Iran really has had a resurgence in the last five, six years. After 9/11, with the United States having got rid of two Iranian enemies, first, the Taliban in Afghanistan, and then Saddam Hussein in -- in Iraq, Iran is feeling empowered. And it does genuinely feel that it is a legitimate power in the region and that...
COOPER: They certainly have a lot of money.
AMANPOUR: Yes, and not that -- not just that -- money, oil, population, military, history. And it wants to -- if you like, it wants to be taken seriously as a player.
COOPER: So, they -- that's one of the reasons, I guess, why the president wants to sit down with President Bush. President Bush doesn't want a face-to-face. Does -- does the Iranian president want a face-to-face?
AMANPOUR: You know, this is complicated.
The -- the whole issue of Iranian and American relations has been going on since 1979, when they were broken during the revolution, after the hostage crisis. Iran and the United States have talked selectively over the last few years, notably over Afghanistan. Iran cooperated with the United States in the -- getting rid of the Taliban and then in the post-Afghan political structure.
COOPER: ... doing a lot of anti-narcotic work.
AMANPOUR: Yes. And, then, Iran was going to talk to the United States specifically about Iraq.
Now, those have been postponed. But the whole -- the whole debate now in many foreign policy circles is, should the United States engage Iran in -- in negotiations over all the issues, all the outstanding issues?
And that is the big question -- many people coming down to the feeling that all the other things that has been tried have failed, and perhaps it's time now to engage.
COOPER: Although that engagement is tricky. I mean, the -- the -- the U.S. has tried to sort of stand with a united front with their allies, saying Iran has to give up development of their nuclear program at this point just to engage in talks.
But now it sounds like France may be saying, well, perhaps you don't have to actually give up the program for talks to start.
AMANPOUR: Well, some have suggested that that tough precondition essentially was to end game. I mean, to give up the nuclear program, to suspend enrichment, is the end -- end result. So, making that a precondition to begin with perhaps was a nonstarter.
Having said that, over the last few days -- weeks -- Iran has been negotiating with the E.U. about suspending enrichment, at least for a period of time, so that negotiations with the United States can continue. Those -- apparently, those talks are ongoing.
COOPER: What's the president like, Iranian?
AMANPOUR: He is different from the former president, the reformist president, who everybody sort of wanted to like, and -- and brought a whole new face of Iran to the world.
This president is -- he has a sort of a wry smile when he deals with -- certainly with foreign correspondents and -- and -- and interlocutors. He has a debating quality about him, so that, when you ask him a question, whatever it be, including the inflammatory rhetoric that he said about the Holocaust and other such, he wants to debate. He wants to -- to make, to -- to -- to sort of broaden the debate...
COOPER: So, he's...
AMANPOUR: ... beyond the initial parameters.
COOPER: He's well aware of the perception other people have of him and his role in the world?
AMANPOUR: He is.
AMANPOUR: He's aware. And -- and -- and -- but I think he's trying to get his point across.
COOPER: Interesting. Christiane, thanks. Appreciate it.
When it comes to Iran, there is no denying the sense of deja vu. Just like in the run-up to Iraq, there's a bitter dispute now playing out over intelligence over what we -- or anyone, for that matter -- really knows about what the Iranians want to do and are capable are doing.
The U.N. top nuclear inspector, Mohamed ElBaradei, says he is not sure Iran wants the bomb. Republican legislators on the House Intelligence Committee say they do know. And each side seems ready to go to war with one another.
Reporting on that for us, CNN's Brian Todd.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In a scathing letter, the International Atomic Energy Agency accuses the House Intelligence Committee of misleading the public in a well-publicized report last month about Iran's nuclear program.
Take this caption: "Iran is currently enriching uranium to weapons-grade."
The IAEA says Iran is nowhere near that capability, enriching uranium only 3.6 percent, when 90 percent is needed to make a weapon.
Congressman Mike Rogers, who had a key role in that report, says the IAEA is splitting hairs.
REP. MIKE ROGERS (R-MI), HOUSE PERMANENT SELECT COMMITTEE ON INTELLIGENCE MEMBER: If you take the caption with the text that is right along with the report, it says that we don't believe that they have gotten there. But the point of that whole section is, they're trying to enrich uranium to weapons-grade.
TODD: A claim consistently denied by Tehran -- but what's unleashed the most fury, an incident where an IAEA inspector was pulled out, at Iran's request.
ROGERS: Iranians said, take him off the program, and they said, OK.
You can't have Iran getting to pick who is their inspectors.
TODD: The House report says the IAEA has unspoken rules -- quote -- "barring IAEA officials from telling the whole truth about Iran's program."
The IAEA's letter calls that outrageous. The IAEA was also in the middle of a dispute over Iraq's weapons program before the U.S. invasion. The Bush administration criticized the agency for being too cautious and led a failed effort to oppose the reappointment of agency chief Mohamed ElBaradei.
Is this happening all over again?
DARYL KIMBALL, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, ARMS CONTROL ASSOCIATION: This is a very troubling instance here, this report, of U.S. policy- makers, in my view, trying to push the intelligence community to find evidence that they believe supports their suspicions and their end policy goals.
TODD (on camera): Congressman Rogers disputes that, too, saying, this report was bipartisan and was reviewed by the intelligence community. U.S. intelligence officials we contacted would not comment on the House report or on the IAEA's letter.
Brian Todd, CNN, Washington.
COOPER: Well, there's a one-word reason why Iran poses such a huge problem to the U.S., and that is oil. Here's the "Raw Data."
Iran has an estimated 90 billion barrels of oil in reserve. It shifts about four million barrels of oil around the world every day, accounting for about 5 percent of the global supply. You will not see a drop of that oil here in the U.S., because it has been banned since the 1979 Iranian revolution.
Still, if there's a war, it will affect oil prices here and across the globe -- one analyst predicting oil could cost $130 a barrel if Iran stopped its production. Of course, all that oil money helps Iran with their foreign policy, which, obviously, in Lebanon, has some pretty disastrous consequences.
The big word, of course, is if. What if it came down to war. Is the U.S. military ready for the potential showdown? We will take a look at the battle plan in a moment.
Another big story linked to the Middle East tonight: Pope Benedict XVI has said he is deeply sorry for the reaction to his comments about Islam. Muslim anger is still very much on display around the world, however. A nun has been shot. We will take a look at her killing as linked to the pope's comments.
And a young girl, a teenager, kidnapped, held in an underground bunker, uses a cell phone, a text-messenger, to escape her tormenter -- that story when 360 continues.
COOPER: We have been talking about the showdown between the U.S. and Iran at the U.N. tomorrow. Long term, however, Mr. Bush has not ruled out a military option, if Iran can't be convinced to give up its nuclear program through diplomacy.
We wanted to know what a war with Iran might look like. So, we asked CNN's senior Pentagon correspondent, Jamie McIntyre, to investigate.
JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SENIOR PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The objective: stop Iran from being able to enrich enough uranium to make enough a nuclear bomb.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Imagine a Middle East within Iran with a nuclear weapon threatening free nations.
MCINTYRE: The military option: preemptive airstrikes by American stealth bombers, strike aircraft, and cruise missiles, using the latest bunker-busting munitions, in an air assault lasting several nights and dropping thousands of bombs.
GENERAL JOHN ABIZAID, COMMANDER, U.S. CENTRAL COMMAND: I'm not going to answer about confirming or denying any plans that -- that we may have. I can tell you we can deal with any problem that comes up militarily in the region. MCINTYRE: The potential targets: more than two dozen nuclear facilities spread across Iran, some secret, some deep underground, and some in populated areas that would have to be hit multiple times.
COLONEL SAM GARDINER, U.S. AIR FORCE (RET.): Most people that have a sense of the Iranian nuclear program, say it has two parts, the part we see -- and that's the part that we can target. And then there's probably a part we don't see.
MCINTYRE: The best-case scenario is, Iran simply rebuilds and military action is needed in another two to five years -- worst case, Iran retaliates, sponsors terrorism, attacks U.S. troops in Iraq, disrupts oil shipments to the Persian Gulf, pushing gas prices to record highs, and inflames anti-American sentiment in the Muslim world.
TRITA PARSI, PRESIDENT, NATIONAL IRANIAN AMERICAN COUNCIL: In the rest of the Middle East, we're working very hard to win the hearts and minds of the people. In Iran, we just need to make sure we don't lose it. By the first bomb, we will lose it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think, at the end of the day, we may very well end up deciding that we would rather live with a nuclear Iran, and deter them from using the things once they get them, than do the things we have to do to prevent them from getting it.
MCINTYRE (on camera): Pentagon sources say all of the planning for possible military action in Iran comes under the category of prudent and routine contingency planning, nothing more at this point.
And the possibility of a ground invasion is even more remote, considering the U.S. military has its hands full in the two countries that flank Iran, Iraq and Afghanistan.
Jamie McIntyre, CNN, the Pentagon.
COOPER: Well, Iran, of course, has become a major player in Iraq. And, in Iraq tonight, there's been more bloodshed, more sectarian violence.
The Bush administration will not say it's a civil war. But, today, U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan weighed in on the possibility.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KOFI ANNAN, U.N. SECRETARY-GENERAL: If they can address the needs and common interests of all Iraqis, the promise of peace and prosperity is still within reach. But if current patterns of alienation and violence persist much longer, there is a great danger that the Iraqi state will break down, possibly in the midst of the full-scale civil war. (END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: Michael Ware joins from Baghdad now with more on Annan's comments and the possibility of civil war.
What do you think, Michael? Based on what you have been seeing on the ground, do you think Annan is right?
MICHAEL WARE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, we're very, very close to it, if we're not already there, Anderson. I think now it's just a matter of semantics.
I mean, yesterday morning, there was 14 more tortured and executed bodies that were found on the streets of the capital. That, in Baghdad terms, is a low day. That's a good day. It brought the week's total to 198 bodies found. That's up from 150, all attributed to the sectarian violence. That doesn't account for the bodies that are found by the families and removed independently.
That's also not accounting for conflicts in the numbers between Iraqi government authorities and U.S. military authorities. I mean, people are dying here in droves. They're being hauled from their homes, hauled from the streets, shot in drive-bys. They're being beheaded, and they're being tortured, all in the name of sectarian violence -- Anderson.
COOPER: Yes, why the torture? I mean, you -- when you -- when you read about how some of these people were -- were kidnapped, and then how their bodies were found, I mean, people with power-drilled -- you know, their -- their heads were power-drilled in. I mean, why torture people like that?
WARE: It's not just their heads. They're finding drill marks throughout their bodies, suggesting that they're starting down and working their way up.
It seems that these people are experiencing an excruciating death, almost beyond imagination. It's brought me to ask some members of some of these militias about the torturers. Can you imagine who these men are? They must have a cell or a bloodied room somewhere, where all they do is bring in victim after victim, and just torture them to death.
Why? It's not to extract information. It's not for any military purpose. They are just torturing them for the sake of torturing them. This is about provocation. This is about religious fervor and hatred gone berserk.
So, they're just torturing them to send a signal to other members of their sect. It's just pure, bloodied provocation -- Anderson.
COOPER: And -- and it's Shia vs. Sunni, Sunni vs. Shia. I mean, it goes -- they're -- both sides torturing one another?
WARE: Absolutely. It goes both ways. And, at the end of the day, in the very, very beginning of all of this, you have to give the credit, ultimately, to one man that not only the U.S. forces could not stop, but who, by default, they created. And that's the now dead leader of al Qaeda in Iraq, Abu Musab al-Zarqawi.
Zarqawi laid this out more than two years ago. In a captured letter to Osama bin Laden, we saw it for the first time. He said: Let's provoke the Shia. Let's go out there and antagonize them. Let's butcher them. Let's force them to rise up against the Sunni. It is only this that will awake the sleeping giant, the Sunni beast. And then we will rise up in the great holy war.
It's all down to Zarqawi -- Anderson.
COOPER: And his bloody legacy continues.
Michael Ware, appreciate it. Stay safe, Michael.
Also, in parts of Iraq today, more demonstrations over the pope's comments on Islam last week. The pope has tried to calm the anger that's erupted in recent days. He even issued an apology of sorts, an apology about the reaction, really. But a lot of Muslims say he hasn't gone far enough. We will talk about that coming up.
Plus: the hunt for a baby girl named Abby, brutally abducted, her mom stabbed with a knife -- tonight, the latest on the search for this little girl -- when 360 continues.
COOPER: Some of the images there of protests today in the Iraqi city of Basra -- that's in the south of the country, of course -- a crowd up to about 150 demonstrators burning an effigy of Pope Benedict XVI, chanting "No to aggression" and, "We gag the pope."
Many Muslims are still outraged over the words spoken last week by the Roman Catholic leader, words that criticized some of the teachings of the Prophet Mohammed. Some Muslim clerics say the pope launched a new Christian crusade against Islam.
But the Vatican insists it is a misunderstanding. And even the pope himself is trying, though maybe not succeeding, to make amends.
COOPER (voice-over): Pope Benedict XVI issued an apology yesterday over remarks he made five days ago, remarks many Muslims found offensive.
POPE BENEDICT XVI (through translator): I am deeply sorry for the reactions in some countries to a few passages of my address at the University of Regensburg, which were considered offensive to the sensibility of Muslims.
COOPER: But it seems his apology just isn't enough. Violent demonstrations broke out in Kashmir, Italy, and Iraq, where al Qaeda issued a threat against the pope and the church, saying: "We shall break the cross and spill the wine. God will help Muslims to conquer Rome. May God enable us to slit their throats and make their money."
On the West Bank, Catholic Churches were burned. Protesters took to the streets of Indonesia, London, Egypt, and Iran, where the country's supreme leader expressed his regret at the pope's harsh words.
AYATOLLAH KHAMENEI, SUPREME LEADER OF IRAN (through translator): What has concerned me is that, as a result of such remarks, Muslims and Christians will become more pessimistic towards each other. It makes Muslim and Christian nations spiteful towards each other.
COOPER: The pope made his controversial comments during a speech in Germany last Tuesday. It was supposed to be a call to open a dialogue among the faiths. But he enraged Muslims when he quoted a 14th century Byzantine emperor, who accused Islam and its leader, the Prophet Mohammed, of promoting violence.
POPE BENEDICT XVI (through translator): "Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhumane, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached."
COOPER: Muslim outrage spread quickly, and may already have turned deadly. In Somalia, a 65-year-old nun was shot to death outside a hospital in Mogadishu, along with her bodyguard. The motive for the shooting isn't clear, but some fear it was linked to the fury over the pope's remarks.
The Muslim Brotherhood have refused to accept the pope's words. A spokesman said, "It's a good step in the right direction, but it's not an apology."
Catholic analysts say, if it wasn't an apology, it was at least a sufficient explanation.
GERARD O'CONNELL, VATICAN ANALYST: It's an expression of sorrow that his words have given offense. He doesn't actually say, "I apologize for what I said." He's -- he's saying that, "What you have taken offense at is not what I actually meant. So, there is a misunderstanding between what I said and how you are reading it."
COOPER: Pope Benedict had been set to visit Turkey in November, a trip intended to improve relations with the Muslim community. The government there says, if he doesn't offer a proper apology, it might be better he stayed away.
COOPER: Joining me now is CNN faith and values correspondent Delia Gallagher, and Reza Aslan, author of "No God But God: The Origins, Evolution, and Future Of Islam."
Thanks, both, for being with us. Delia, let's start off with you.
First of all, what was the pope trying to say? I mean, he was using that as a -- that was a quote from someone else.
DELIA GALLAGHER, CNN FAITH AND VALUES CORRESPONDENT: Yes.
COOPER: But his point was actually kind of provocative, to say the least.
I mean, in the larger scheme of things, this -- the speech was entitled "Faith, Reason and the University." So, it was even against the West and against modern society, which believes that reason has no place in faith and in religion.
And, in the beginning, he uses this example of -- of -- an example of when violence can sort of take place in the name of God as an example of something not being reasonable in religion.
COOPER: But he...
GALLAGHER: And, so, that's what he's quoting.
COOPER: But, in talking about sort of holy war and jihad, he was saying that -- that, in -- in Catholicism, reason is at the core, whereas, in Islam, it -- it is not, that the -- the transcendency of God is at the...
GALLAGHER: He -- he raises the question, exactly. And this is what is provocative.
I mean, we have to understand that what we're arguing about is not the pope's position on Islam. He doesn't enter into that. He -- what -- what happened and what caused offense, I think, is, he raised the question of that exact connection. Is there a connection in the very essence of Islam which is irrational, or which allows for the idea that violence could be pleasing to God? And he does raise that question.
COOPER: Certainly raises -- certainly, a -- a provocative question to raise, and perhaps not raised in -- in the most appropriate of ways.
REZA ASLAN, USC CENTER OF PUBLIC DIPLOMACY: Well, Delia's right. There's no question that the pope's comments were taken completely out of context, but of course context is really irrelevant when it comes to these jihadists and these extremists who are looking for any reason to further the propaganda that the Islamic world is under siege.
COOPER: So you're saying this is basically used by jihadists, by whoever wants to, you know, needs a scapegoat to focus their anger toward? ASLAN: No question. Now that said, this isn't the first time that the pope has made certain provocative comments about Islam.
Of course, as Cardinal Ratzinger he was severely critical of John Paul II's tireless efforts to promote Muslim-Catholic understanding. He repeatedly called for a Catholic revival to offset what he perceived as an Islamic revival in Europe and actually pressed for a renewal of Christian evangelism in the Muslim world.
And, of course, most famously of all he has been severely critical of Turkey's entry into the E.U., not on political economic rounds, but on the grounds that Turkey is a Muslim country and in this pope's view, Europe is a Christian coalition of countries.
GALLAGHER: You know, Anderson, I think that that's an important point that Reza brings out. Because as cardinal, you know, he had 26 years under John Paul II who did a lot to work with the Muslim community. But Cardinal Ratzinger...
COOPER: In Assisi he famously brought together different religions.
GALLAGHER: Exactly. And that's a very good point, because Cardinal Ratzinger then said we have to be careful when we bring interfaith groups together to pray, because we give the impression that we are all praying to the same god or this idea of every -- every religion is equally true.
And he, as the head of the Catholic Church, of course, believes that his Catholicism is the truth. And he believes he has to argue for that. So he makes a very important distinction. You'll see it in all of his writings and as pope. That dialogue has to be something, not just what you believe is true and what I believe is true.
But let's figure out is the real truth. He believes there is a real truth that you can arrive it.
COOPER: Reza, though, a lot of people see these pictures that we're seeing now of people demonstrating and burning effigies, and you know, there are incidents of violence we saw, you know, after those Danish cartoons were published. And ask, you know, why can't a religion be made fun of? I mean, in the United States, you know, this happens all the time.
You know, that artist, you know, put a crucifix in a vat of urine, and while it caused upset and outrage, no one was killed over it. Why in the Muslim world does this explode into violence, explode into such outpourings?
ASLAN: Well, of course, it's only exploded into violence in a very few places. That's important to recognize. No question that Muslims around the world have been -- have been concerned and angered over these comments.
Look, you know, the fact of the matter is that we are, as the president repeatedly reminds us, embroiled in a war of ideology. There are people out there who think that there is this cosmic battle taking place between the forces of Christianity and the forces of Islam.
And this kind of rhetoric just feeds into that and gives them exactly the kind of ammunition that they need to convince even moderate Muslims that their faith, their values, their practice is under attack. That there's some sort of, as I said, crusade, a renewal of a crusade taking place. And you know, it's a powerful message.
COOPER: We've got to go. Very quickly, Reza, do you think the pope should apologize, not for the reaction to his comments but for his comments?
ASLAN: The pope is the spokesperson, not just of 1.5 billion Christians in the world, but essentially he is the mouthpiece of the risen Christ on earth. He has to be very careful, particularly in light of his predecessor's work to not, you know, break away, that all the work that has been done towards Muslim-Catholic relations. I think he does need to apologize a little bit better than he has.
COOPER: And Delia, do you think he will?
GALLAGHER: No, I think he will further those efforts with Muslims, but I think he feels that he's made his apology. And it was a very rare thing to see any pope make a personal apology.
COOPER: It was sort of the apology of like, "I'm sorry about the way you feel about what I said" as oppose to what I said.
GALLAGHER: Right. But I'm not sorry about what I said because I believe, essentially, what I said.
COOPER: It was an interesting discussion. Delia Gallagher, Reza Aslan, appreciate it. Thanks.
GALLAGHER: Thank you.
COOPER: Of course, before he was Pope Benedict XVI, he was Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger as we're talking about. Even then he had a thing or two to say about Islam, things that would probably get him in more trouble today. We'll have that in a moment.
Plus, how a cell phone became the key to freedom of a kidnapped teenage girl. Her remarkable story when 360 continues.
COOPER: Muslim outrage over comments made by the pope may be his first major battle as pope. But Benedict is no stranger to opposition. In fact, he faced an awful lot of it back when he was known as Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger.
Once again, here's CNN's faith and values correspondent, Delia Gallagher.
GALLAGHER (voice-over): Before Joseph Ratzinger became Pope Benedict XVI, he was often called Cardinal No for his tough stand on many issues confronting the Catholic Church. He said no to the ordination of women, no to married priests, no to homosexuality.
In a way, his views had just as much influence as those of his predecessor, Pope John Paul II, over the direction of the Catholic Church in the last 25 years. He was the church's faith and morals watchdog, John Paul II's chief theological adviser.
JOHN ALLEN, CNN VATICAN ANALYST: I think basically that the pope felt that as long as he had Ratzinger, then the church's faith was going to be safe.
GALLAGHER: Joseph Ratzinger is 79, born in Bavaria, Germany, in 1927, the son of a policeman. He came of age during the Hitler years and, in his memoirs, he admitted that, while he was in seminary, he was enrolled in Hitler youth. But he says he stopped attending meetings. He also briefly served in a German anti-aircraft unit during World War II.
In 1951, he was ordained a priest. He spent years in academia teaching dogma and fundamental theology. He has been described as an intellectual, strong willed and independent, but often unbending to public opinion. And that, says one Vatican analyst, may have contributed to his controversial comments about Islam in last week's speech.
GERARD O'CONNELL, VATICAN ANALYST: Normally when John Paul II was pope, every speech he made on Islam was vetted, looked over by the experts on Islam in the Vatican. Right now there's no such expert.
GALLAGHER: But before Benedict was pope, he was sometimes criticized for his views on Islam. Only 10 years ago he wrote that Islam had difficulty adapting to modern life.
Just last year he accused Muslim leaders in Germany of failing to steer their youth from what he called "the darkness of a new barbarism."
And in his document, "Dominus Jesus," or "Christ is lord" he said there is no salvation outside the church, which has been interpreted as meaning only Catholic Christians can be saved, a stance his boss pope John II had to publicly soften.
But since his election as pope, Benedict has made some moves to help shore up the bridges built by his predecessor with the Muslim community. And church analysts say, given time, that is hopefully what he will continue to do.
O'CONNELL: This is a new pope. He's 17 months in office. You had John Paul II for 26 years, visit 23 Muslim countries and built very strong links with the Muslims around the world. And helped, in the words of several leaders of several countries, helped to calm the spirits. Benedict has succeeded him, said I want to continue the same dialogue.
COOPER: So the lesson in all this for the pope is what?
GALLAGHER: Well, I think what we've seen here is this really is a man who is more of a theologian than a diplomat. And he isn't somebody who believes that whatever sort of the cost is going to be, it's important to get the truth of what he sees the matter to be out. And perhaps that will be a lesson for him, that maybe he needs to become a little bit more of the diplomat.
COOPER: Interesting. Delia, thanks. Appreciate it.
Tonight the search is on for a baby girl who's been kidnapped. She was taken from her home. Police have a sketch of the suspect. We're going to show it to you. The baby's mother was slashed. That's the little girl right there. The mother was slashed from this home -- taken out of this home. We'll have that story coming up. Be right back.
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COOPER: Hollywood's greatest murder mystery may finally be solved.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was too twisted for words.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She was surgically bisected in half. The body was washed clean. All blood was washed off. She was carefully posed. She had been tortured for extended hours.
COOPER: The Black Dahlia, she was killed nearly 50 years ago. Now countless suspects later, a son comes forward to say his father was the killer. We'll have that story in the interview ahead on 360.
Tonight there is another crime that is unsolved. Someone somewhere tonight know where this little girl is. Take a look at her picture. Her name is Abby. When she was barely a week old she was allegedly abducted from her home in Missouri by a woman who slashed her mother's throat.
Police believe Abby is still alive, and they are hoping someone will recognize either this picture or the suspect so that they can find Abby.
CNN's Jonathan Freed has the story.
JONATHAN FREED, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Three days after little Abby Lynn Woods was abducted from her rural Missouri home, finally a face to put on the suspect. Investigators say the composite sketch shows a woman between 30 and 40 years old, roughly 5'8", weighing 200 pounds, with dark hair, pulled back under a baseball cap.
SHERIFF GARY TOELKE, FRANKLIN COUNTY, MISSOURI: The victim wasn't completely happy with the sketch, but this is the best that that she can come up with at this point. So you know, it's not 100 percent. And any time you have a composite sketch like that, you know, you need to be flexible.
FREED: The baby was just a week old when her mother was attacked on Friday in Lonedale, Missouri, about an hour southwest of St. Louis.
Police say 21-year-old Stephanie Ochsenbine was stabbed with a knife and had her throat slashed by a stranger who knocked on her door and asked to use the phone. Once inside, she said she was there to take the baby.
The mother was unconscious for a short while and then managed to walk 300 yards to her neighbor's house for help. Abby's father, who police say was at work at the time of the attack, is helping the mother recover at home.
The grandparents are leading the media charge, pleading for Abby's safe return.
RAYLENE OCHSENBINE, BABY'S GRANDMOTHER: Stephanie's heart is breaking. She's in agony. She is totally destroyed, totally destroyed. If you have a heart at all, give her back.
KEN OCHSENBINE, BABY'S GRANDFATHER: You don't want to know this feeling. It's -- you just don't want to know it, because it hurts and it's upsetting. It's really messed with our lives.
FREED: Police say family members are cooperating with the investigation, but would not categorically rule them out as suspects.
(on camera) Do you have any reason to doubt the mother's story at this point?
TOELKE: Like any investigation, we see to cooperate and verify information wherever we receive it. And since this is such a fluid endeavor and we get information all the time, it's very difficult for us to say definitively one way or another.
FREED (voice-over): Police also released a photo of a scarf found outside the family's home, hoping someone will recognize it. The suspect is believed to have been wearing a scarf.
(on camera) Investigators say the phones have not stopped ringing since the sketch of the suspect was made public. They say they don't have too many strong leads but insist they're making progress.
Jonathan Freed, CNN, Union, Missouri.
(END VIDEOTAPE) COOPER: From one kidnapped child to another. A girl spent days inside an underground cell. Her story and the way she escaped when 360 continues.
COOPER: In South Carolina tonight a teenage girl is back at home after a horrific ordeal. Police say she was abducted by a man who sexual assaulted her and locked her in an underground bunker. How she escaped is a testament to modern technology and her sheer will to survive.
CNN's Drew Griffin reports.
DREW GRIFFIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Her parents heard not one word until last Wednesday evening when Madeline Shoaf saw a blinking message on her cell phone and knew it was her 14-year-old daughter Elizabeth.
MADELINE SHOAF, MOTHER: "Hey, Mom, it's Lizzie." She told me exactly where she was down the road, which road it was. And put down where the big trucks come out. Get the police.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She's in a hole.
SHOAF: She's in a hole.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And something about a bomb.
SHOAF: Yes. Get the police.
GRIFFIN: Lizzie Shoaf was sending that text message from a stolen cell phone, stolen, she tells police, from her captor, Vincent Filyaw, as he fell asleep inside this underground bunker where she was being held.
Police traced the phone to Filyaw and, with Elizabeth's description, along with cell phone location techniques, found the girl early Saturday morning, alone and alive inside the underground bunker, where she had been held captive for 10 days. It was only a mile from her home.
SHERIFF STEVE MCCASKILL, KERSHAW COUNTY, SOUTH CAROLINA: Through probably the happiest 20-something fellows you ever saw Saturday morning when we got a look at that young lady. I know I just felt like the world had been lifted off my shoulders when she walked out of there alive.
GRIFFIN (on camera): The sheriff said this girl had as much to do with rescuing herself.
SHOAF: She sat there and said I found the phone.
GRIFFIN (voice-over): Filyaw was caught a day later walking along the side of the highway, dressed in camouflage clothing and carrying a pellet gun, allegedly after a failed carjacking.
Wanted since last November for the alleged rape of his 12-year- old stepdaughter, Filyaw had been running from the law for months, but not very far. According to the sheriff here, they searched his home, couldn't find him and thought he had fled.
But Filyaw was digging holes in the ground, as many as five, fully stocked bunkers, the sheriff says, he using to elude capture. It was in a heavy stocked bunker he is accused of taking the 14-year- old and sexual assaulting her.
MCCASKILL: Just from what we've been able to father she was just living in this hole in this bunker in the ground, sleeping there on a little makeshift cot or bed that Filyaw had made down there. And, of course, he was feeding her. He had food and stuff, so he was feeding her.
GRIFFIN: In yet another bizarre twist, the 14-year-old victim and her family were in court this afternoon as Vincent Filyaw was officially charged. A judge would not allow pictures of the girl, who sat huddled with her mother behind the man who allegedly held her captive. He was denied bond.
Filyaw appeared with no attorney, and his only comment to the court was that his family had nothing to do with his crimes.
VINCENT FILYAW, ACCUSED OF KIDNAPPING GIRL: I just would like to say that nobody in my family was involved in this in any way.
GRIFFIN: Filyaw's girlfriend also has been arrested and charged with aiding and abetting. She is the mother of a 12-year-old girl whom police say Filyaw sexual assaulted last year.
Drew Griffin, CNN, Camden, South Carolina.
COOPER: Today's "Shot" coming up. But first, Erica Hill from Headline News joins us for this 360 bulletin -- Erica.
ERICA HILL, HEADLINE NEWS ANCHOR: Hi, Anderson.
Scare on the grounds of the U.S. Capitol today after an armed man crashed an SUV through a barricade. Police say 20-year-old Carlos Green slammed the stolen vehicle into a construction site on the east side of the building. Green then led them on a chase through the building before being captured. Police say he had crack cocaine on them.
This was the worst breach of security at the Capitol since a gunman killed two police officer there eight years ago.
Police in Maine say a couple kidnapped their 19-year-old daughter to force her to have an abortion, because they were upset she was pregnant. Katelyn Kampf says her parents tied her up, forced her into their car and attempted to drive her to New York, but she escaped. The parents now face kidnapping charges, and they've been ordered to stay away from their daughter.
DEA says it's found a 400-foot drug tunnel between the U.S. and Mexico. The underground passage connected two homes. It was equipped with lighting and wooden beams. So far no arrests have been made.
And off the coast of Indonesia, a team of researchers say they've discovered a shark that walks on its fins. The shark is one of 52 newly discovered species including, Anderson, 24 new types of fish, too. Yes, walks on its fins. You know.
COOPER: That makes no sense. It walks on its fins?
HILL: But to the fin walking shark, it does.
COOPER: All right. Erica, time for today's -- time for "The Shot" today. We've got, what have we got? A painted pachyderm. You seen this?
HILL: I haven't seen it. I heard about it, but my goodness.
COOPER: The paint job caused quite a controversy of the weekend in L.A. Tai the elephant is given a nontoxic coat of spray paint to appear in an art exhibit. See if you can figure out why, as I read this Erica.
He was supposed to draw attention to the issue of poverty in this country, but animal activists argue that the paint job simply degraded the elephant. In fact, the city of L.A. now says it will no longer issue permits for such events like this in the future.
Tai's owner denies the elephant was never been abused. She said Tai has done many moves and is used to make up.
But you know why they did the elephant? It's an elephant in the room. See? You can't ignore it.
HILL: You can't ignore the elephant in the room.
COOPER: There you go.
HILL: See. You're much wiser than I, my friend.
COOPER: Actually, I read about it over the weekend in the paper.
HILL: At least you're honest.
COOPER: Yes. Erica, thanks.
HILL: See you later.
COOPER: So from the elephant in the room to the elephant in the room.
The simmering showdown with Iran over nuclear program, the President Bush and others believe could be a nuclear weapons program. A rare inside look from a man who was dealing with Iran when Iran first became our enemy nearly 30 years ago.
Also, the truce in Southern Lebanon and some signs that Hezbollah could be losing support in the region.
And the spinach scare, more people getting ill. A lot of questions about how to stay healthy. Some answers when 360 continues.
COOPER: A cold case, a bad movie, the real story behind the Black Dahlia murder when 360 continues.
COOPER: Tracing the killer strain of E. coli. The path from the fields to spinach and possibly into other foods that you feed your family, other foods you may think are safe.
ANNOUNCER: Danger on your dinner plate. Tonight, another warning about E. coli and fresh spinach. What's being done to keep your family safe?
Middle east crisis over, or is it?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hezbollah is still there.
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