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The Situation Room
Musharraf to Publish Book; Interview With Charlie Rangel
Aired September 22, 2006 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JOHN KING, CNN ANCHOR: Thank you, Lou. And to our viewers, you're in THE SITUATION ROOM where new pictures and information are arriving all the time. Standing by CNN reporters across the United States and around the world to bring you tonight's top stories.
Happening now, is Pakistan's president playing by the book? It's 7:00 p.m. here in Washington where Pervez Musharraf says he stands with President Bush against terrorists but tonight new questions about Mr. Musharraf's claims, his deal with tribal leaders and his publishing deal.
Also this hour, President Bush's devilish attacker and his unlikely defender. Is Hugo Chavez being applauded back in Venezuela tonight? We'll have a live report. And I'll ask Democratic congressman and President Bush critic Charlie Rangel why Mr. Chavez got him so mad.
And inside al Qaeda in Iraq. A masked commander gives his first TV interview and a frightening report on the terror network's deadly power.
Wolf Blitzer is off tonight. I'm John King. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM
We begin tonight with urgent concerns about the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and the toll they are taking on U.S. military forces. Experts warn troops are stretched dangerously thin and increasingly desperate for the equipment they need to fight the war on terror.
CNN Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr has the details.
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: John, the security operation against sectarian violence in Baghdad is having some success in part.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
STARR (voice-over): The top U.S. commander for Baghdad is putting the new Iraqi government on notice about cracking down on militias and death squads.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I consider that issue a problem that the government must deal with immediately.
STARR: Major General Thurman (ph) says he needs 3,000 more Iraqi army troops in the capital immediately but are some Iraqis still reluctant to fight?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Some of the soldiers due to the distance did not want to travel into Baghdad.
STARR: The United Nations special investigator on torture says the violence is quote, "out of hand." Manfred Nowak told reporters the situation is so bad that many people say it is worse than in the times of Saddam Hussein. But Human Rights Watch estimated that during the 25-year reign of Saddam's Baath Party rule the Iraqi government murdered some quarter million of its citizens.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have a sense from them that most Baghdad residents do not feel safe traveling outside of their neighborhoods because of the current security situation.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
STARR: And while the violence has dropped in the areas of Baghdad that U.S. troops are patrolling, it's clear that many residents remain afraid of the torture and killing outside their front doors -- John.
KING: Barbara Starr for us at the Pentagon. And tonight tough questions for Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf are unanswered. He and President Bush faced reporters at the White House today. They were grilled about an alleged U.S. threat to bomb Pakistan back to the Stone Age. The allegation is stunning, but Mr. Musharraf's response was surprising.
Our Brian Todd is investigating President Musharraf's commitment to the war on terror, but first here is our White House correspondent Suzanne Malveaux -- Suzanne.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well John, Pervez Musharraf of course survived several assassination attempts. He seized power in a bloodless coup seven years ago. He is a leader of a nuclear state and of course is the leader of one of the most important U.S. allies in the war on terror but as this controversy also reveals he has a relationship with President Bush that is quite complicated.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MALVEAUX (voice-over): President Bush and Pakistan's leader Pervez Musharraf took turns flattering each other over their commitment to the war on terror.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I admire your leadership.
PRES. PERVEZ MUSHARRAF, PAKISTAN: I trust President Bush.
MALVEAUX: Their alliance was forged out of necessity following the September 11 attacks. Mr. Bush desperately needed Musharraf's cooperation to go after bin Laden and the Taliban in Pakistan's neighbor Afghanistan. But Musharraf now says he was coerced into cooperating. In an interview for CBS' "60 Minutes" Musharraf said after 9/11 the U.S.' then deputy secretary of state, Richard Armitage, threatened his intelligence chief that Pakistan would face America's wrath if it did not help fight the terrorists.
MUSHARRAF: The director of intelligence told me that he said be prepared to be bombed. Be prepared to go back to the Stone Age.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Richard Armitage said you should be prepared to be bombed back to the Stone Age.
MUSHARRAF: Yes.
MALVEAUX: When asked about the alleged threat with Mr. Bush by his side Musharraf said...
MUSHARRAF: I'm launching my book on the 25th and I'm honor bound with Simon and Schuster not to comment on the book before that date. So...
(LAUGHTER)
BUSH: In other words, buy the book is what he's saying.
MALVEAUX: For now Musharraf's loyalties lie with the royalties. As for the alleged threat, Mr. Bush said he knew nothing of the exchange.
BUSH: And Secretary Colin Powell came in and said President Musharraf understand the stakes and he wants to join and help rout out an enemy.
MALVEAUX: The man accused of making the threat, Richard Armitage, said Musharraf's story is totally false and he told him so when the two men met Thursday.
RICHARD ARMITAGE, FORMER DEPUTY SECRETARY OF STATE: And I said it never happened. I wasn't authorized to say such a thing and I wouldn't.
MALVEAUX: But the post-9/11 message was clear and tough.
ARMITAGE: This was black or white. That Pakistan was either with us fully or not.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MALVEAUX: Now John, of course, it's a prickly relationship between these two leaders. It was earlier in the week Mr. Bush irked Musharraf when he told our own CNN's Wolf Blitzer that if he saw Osama bin Laden they'd go after him with or without permission from the Pakistani government. Today both leaders tried to downplay that risk, saying that they are cooperating in the hunt for Osama bin Laden -- John.
KING: Suzanne Malveaux at the White House, thank you Suzanne. And that news conference, along with other recent remarks by both leaders is raising questions about possible rifts in the war on terror.
CNN's Brian Todd is here with that part of the story -- Brian.
BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: John, the question stemmed from what CNN is told about the reality on the ground versus what we hear publicly from Presidents Bush and Musharraf.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BUSH: Thank you very much. Please be seated.
TODD (voice-over): He has the president's trust in the hunt for bin Laden.
BUSH: And when he says if we find or when we find Osama bin Laden, he will be brought to justice. I believe him.
TODD: But is Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf cutting side deals that hurt the war on terror? Take the agreement between Pakistan and tribal leaders near the Afghan border who are sympathetic to the Taliban.
MUSHARRAF: There will be no al Qaeda activity in our tribal agencies or across the border in Afghanistan. There will be no Taliban activity in our tribal agencies or across in Afghanistan.
TODD: But U.S. military officials on the front lines tell CNN Taliban fighters have launched more rocket attacks in cross border raids on U.S. forces and their allies in Afghanistan since the deal was reached in early September.
PETER BERGEN, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: They are concerned that behind this peace agreement because part of the agreement means that Pakistani forces will go out of these areas is that al Qaeda and militant groups with an al Qaeda agenda you know will reorganize.
TODD: So what's the real reason behind the deal? Analysts say when Pakistani forces battle the Taliban, the Pakistanis get their heads handed to them.
STEVE COLL, AUTHOR, "GHOST WARS": His case to President Bush is let me give this a try. If I can secure their cooperation, they will seal the border more effectively than my army can.
TODD: Which leads us back to Osama bin Laden and the public differences Musharraf has had with President Bush. If the trail leads to Pakistan, who goes after him? Here's President Bush's take.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Would you give the order to kill him or capture him?
BUSH: Absolutely.
BLITZER: Go into Pakistan?
BUSH: Absolutely. TODD: Here is President Musharraf.
MUSHARRAF: Let's not get involved in how it ought to be done, by whom it ought to be done. There's total coordination at the intelligence level between the two forces.
TODD: And in the view of CNN terrorism analyst Peter Bergen.
BERGEN: In practice, the United States will go in if there is actionable intelligence about bin laden or they will either go in with cruise missiles or they go in with Special Forces and CIA personnel on the ground.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
TODD: And a former top CIA official tells us the U.S. would go into Pakistan without asking permission and would seek forgiveness after the fact -- John.
KING: Brian Todd, thank you very much tonight, Brian. And on Tuesday Wolf Blitzer interviews Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf right here in THE SITUATION ROOM.
Now this just in to CNN, word of a tornado touching down in Illinois not far from Chicago. Let's go straight to the CNN Weather Center in Atlanta and meteorologist Rob Marciano has all the latest details -- Rob.
ROB MARCIANO, CNN METEOROLOGIST: That's right, John. Cook County in Illinois just to the north and west of Chicago proper we have a tornado warning. Not only do we have tornado warnings, we've had at any one time throughout the afternoon 15 tornado warnings going on and we have about that right now. But we have a trained spotter reporting a tornado on the ground north and west of Chicago right near about Evanston as you head north and west of town.
Not only that, this (INAUDIBLE) by the way has been producing heavy rain with hail maybe up to three inches in diameter, but beyond that back towards the airport, we are getting reports from the state police on 294 that they are stopping traffic because of reduced visibility and then what's behind that, this severe thunderstorm heading off towards the north and east. That has some heavy rain, as well, with a trainspotter reporting some hail and winds gusting 60 to 70 miles an hour. We have these severe thunderstorm treading (ph) lining up around western parts of Chicago and heading right over the northern parts of town. Rotation with -- at 6:11, we're looking for this rotated thunderstorm being over Elmhurst.
If we widen this view out briefly, John, you can notice this is not the only area across the country, a severe weather outbreak with tornadoes, anywhere from Chicago almost all the way down to the Gulf of Mexico. Six tornado watches out for a good chunk of this evening, so it's busy for just about everybody, but the main point right now is that Chicago just north and west of town in a highly populated area there is a tornado on the ground. You should take cover.
KING: Busy night at the Weather Center. Rob Marciano, thank you for that and we will continue to check in as developments warrant. Thank you, Rob.
And Jack Cafferty joins us now from New York. Hi, Jack.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: John, thank you. Tonight we're going to take a leap across the pond to England. A new poll over there shows that almost half of the people would be willing to give up sex if it meant they could live to be 100 years old. Researchers found 40 percent of Brits say they would stop having sex in order to make it to the century mark.
Forty-eight percent of women say they would pass on the hanky- panky versus only 31 percent of men who felt that way. So because it's Friday and because we've already talked about torture in Iraq and alleged U.S. bombing threats against Pakistan after 9/11, we're going to lighten up a little.
Here's the question. Would you give up sex if you could live to be 100 years old? E-mail your thoughts to CaffertyFile@CNN.com or go to CNN.com/CaffertyFile. Please keep in mind there are some limitations as to what we can read in the way of responses -- John.
KING: You want to use this thing and send you an e-mail or you just want my answer now?
CAFFERTY: Well, you are going to have to answer it at some point. Now is fine.
KING: No.
(LAUGHTER)
KING: Coming up, inside al Qaeda in Iraq. They say they want to die more than U.S. troops want to live. Find out how the terror organization has managed to spread itself like a virus through local insurgency groups.
Plus, one of the president's fiercest critics comes to his defense, Congressman Charles Rangel. He is live in THE SITUATION ROOM (INAUDIBLE) Hugo Chavez for coming to Harlem and to debate a New York councilman who was cheering Chavez on.
Plus new health problems for Nation of Islam leader Louis Farrakhan. We'll have an update on his condition. Stay right here. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: Zain Verjee joins us with other news making headlines right now. Hi, Zain.
ZAIN VERJEE, CNN ANCHOR: Hi, John. An embarrassed astronaut is recovering at home after collapsing at a welcome home ceremony today. Heide Marie Stefanyshyn-Piper toppled over twice while speaking to a crowd in Houston today. NASA officials say she is just suffering from the effects of space travel. She returned to earth yesterday morning after almost two weeks in zero gravity.
At least 23 people are dead and half a dozen others are in critical condition after a high tech train crashed in Germany. Engineers were testing a magnetic levitation train today when it just slammed into a repair vehicle that had been accidentally left on the track. On board were employees of the train company, a nursing company, and a local utility company.
More health problems for the Nation of Islam leader Louis Farrakhan, in a letter posted on the Web site of his church, Farrakhan says that he is battling infection, an inflammable connected to prostate cancer. As a result, the 73-year-old leader is canceling all appointments, but he says his absence will prove that the Nation of Islam is stronger than any one person -- John.
KING: Zain Verjee in New York for us tonight. Zain, thank you very much.
And now to another battle of minds and military might. In Afghanistan, 19 workers are dead apparently after Taliban fighters ambushed them. That's just one example of the fierce re-emergence of the Taliban in that country. Coalition troops are hunkering down trying to take them out. Here is Bill Neely.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BILL NEELY, ITV NEWS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over) Dusk and on the roof of the most attacked British base in Afghanistan they watch and wait. It's not a question of if, but when.
(on camera): The troops here have been expecting an attack for about an hour. It usually comes from the woods over there on the horizon. The Taliban firing mortars or rocket propelled grenades, sometimes both.
(voice-over): It's pretty stressful.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is stressful. Yes. The apprehension before an attack is quite significant. But we find that once an attack starts, most of the soldiers resort to doing their job and focus solely on that.
NEELY: Within seconds it came.
(SHOTS)
(SHOUTING)
NEELY: In fact, the Taliban had attacked from the opposite direction.
The first priority to locate the direction of the attack, the second to strike back. This is a powerful Javelin missile.
(SOUNDS)
(on camera): Well, that didn't take long, the Taliban attacking with machine gunfire. The troops now are replying in kind.
(voice-over): The Taliban had hit two lookout positions. The troops fired mortars, machine guns and artillery until the Taliban attack was over. No injuries, but other attacks have proved deadly.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There was no warning. We just got hit with...
NEELY: Lance Corporal Luke McCullough (ph) was killed here by a mortar two weeks ago. His colleague is frank about saying it.
CORP. TREVOR COULT, ROYAL IRISH RANGERS: It's the worst I have ever been to. It's like World War I, living in trenches, constantly being attacked. It's just -- it's quite hard going for the guys.
NEELY: And he should know. He's just won the Military Cross for service in Iraq.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Here you're actually having to fight each day, to get back into camp, fight to get out of camp. It's quite hard going compared to Baghdad. That wasn't as bad as here.
NEELY: Beneath where we spoke, troops live in bunkers underground. Letters from home have just arrived and re-supply helicopters. It's a big morale boost in a very small, very dangerous place. The luckier ones live in brick buildings, morale is high but it is hardly home. They sleep where and when they can. Beyond the bunker walls the threat.
(SHOTS)
NEELY: British and Afghan troops try to deter it, working together with mortars...
(SHOTS)
NEELY: ... the target about a mile away. And they use bigger Russian-made weapons. At night it is quiet over Sangan (ph), but it's a base in the very heartland of the Taliban where troops can never let their guard down and where the next attack is often only a day away.
Bill Neely, ITV News, Sangan (ph), southern Afghanistan.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KING: Those British and Canadian troops are largely fighting the fierce reemergence of the Taliban in southern Afghanistan. Now NATO hopes to have 2,500 extra troops there to help them.
Still to come tonight in THE SITUATION ROOM, inside al Qaeda in Iraq. We'll take you on a dangerous mission to find out how they've taken over insurgent groups. The anti-Bush tirade by Venezuela's Hugo Chavez, fair or foul. Two political figures from New York take on the question and take on one another. Stay right there. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: Tonight a disturbing portrait of al Qaeda in Iraq growing stronger and deadlier even after the death of its leader Abu Musab al Zarqawi. CNN's Michael Ware takes us inside the terror network.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MICHAEL WARE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Until now most communications from al Qaeda in Iraq have been carefully crafted videos like this one...
(SHOTS)
WARE: ... showing the shooting down of a U.S. Apache helicopter.
What is unprecedented about this video is we hear from al Qaeda in English...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just to let you know, that our lives are nothing beside our religion. We will bomb everything.
WARE: Insurgent groups and the U.S. military now say al Qaeda has become the darkest core of Iraq's insurgency.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just to let you know that we have to die as you have to live.
WARE: An organization so secretive that despite seized documents, intelligence and interrogations the U.S. military still struggles to know how it works.
COL. SEAN MACFARLAND, U.S. ARMY: We don't have a 100 percent understanding of that and the enemy tries very hard to keep us from understanding.
(SHOTS)
WARE: There have been successes, cells disrupted, leaders captured and most stunning of all the founder of al Qaeda in Iraq, Abu Musab al Zarqawi, executed in the U.S. air strike. The reality on the ground suggests the U.S. military is far from crippling the deadly network.
Abu Halil Al-Iraqi (ph) is a top commander from a powerful alliance of local Islamic insurgent groups. In his first television interview, he tells CNN Zarqawi's death brought change but not what the U.S. had in mind, instead younger, even more radical al Qaeda leaders.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Al Zarqawi is one person and al Qaeda is thousands of people.
WARE: Local Sunni insurgent groups more moderate than al Qaeda and Iraqi nationalists mostly from Saddam's former military agree al Qaeda is becoming stronger. Listen to this nationalist insurgent commander. He says al Qaeda's decentralized structure, seemingly endless money, and growing support in and out of Iraq is overpowering local guerrilla groups.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Al Qaeda's leadership is different, but as an idea it has expanded because most other groups pressured between U.S. forces and al Qaeda have had leaders killed or captured and al Qaeda took over their fighters.
WARE: That's an assessment shared by many in the U.S. military. American commanders like Sean MacFarland confront the al Qaeda-led insurgency every day.
MACFARLAND: What we're trying to do here is counteract a strong presence of al Qaeda that's intermixed with some lingering Baathist influence.
WARE: Four months ago, Abu Halil's (ph) insurgent group was distancing itself from al Qaeda. Now, he says there's no difference at all.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Al Qaeda works within the resistance and is part of the resistance.
WARE: The Sunni groups say fear of civil war with Shiites in control of the Iraqi government and unchecked Iranian interference is driving them to al Qaeda.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (through translator): They came to Iraq saying they'd free us of tyranny and dictatorship, but that hasn't happened, because the U.S. increased the power of the Shia religious organizations, gave them the government and we regard this as giving power to Iran.
WARE: If so, it is Zarqawi's most enduring legacy, his plan all along to spark sectarian conflict and draw Sunni insurgents to al Qaeda's cause. The insurgents say al Qaeda's hard line is gaining traction where there was little before.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (through translator): When the nationalist forces become weak, that leaves al Qaeda as a strong force in the area.
WARE: Yet the U.S. military is still hoping disillusioned moderate Sunnis reject al Qaeda.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Al Qaeda is herding them back toward us, so to an extent the Sunnis may be trapped between the devil and deep blue sea.
WARE: But Sunni insurgents know one day the United States will leave Iraq and they believe al Qaeda will not. Michael Ware, CNN, Baghdad.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KING: Just ahead, a congressman often critical of the president says no outsider has the right to do the same, Democrat Charles Rangel of New York on Hugo Chavez.
Also, does his story accurately reflect history, more on the president of Pakistan's new book?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: To our viewers, you're IN THE SITUATION ROOM where new pictures and new information are arriving all the time. Happening now, his trip to the United States is over, but his verbal assaults on President Bush are not. President Hugo Chavez back in Venezuela tonight, launching a fresh round of attacks. We'll talk about it with a President Bush critic who's now an unlikely defender.
Also growing concerns tonight that wars in Afghanistan and Iraq are stretching U.S. military forces dangerously thin. The Taliban and al Qaeda in Iraq proving far more formidable than imagined. Are troops close to reaching the breaking point?
And Pope Benedict making a dramatic gesture in the face of Muslim fury. He's repeatedly apologized for quoting medieval writings calling evil. Now he's inviting Muslim ambassadors to his Summer palace, hoping to quell the anger.
Wolf Blitzer is off today. I'm John King. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
Venezuela's president is back home after his highly publicized trip to the United States and tonight Hugo Chavez is launching a new round of verbal attacks on President Bush. CNN's Rick Sanchez is live for us in Caracas with the details.
RICK SANCHEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well another one of those bull horn blasts that Chavez is so known for, John. This time he's criticizing U.S. policies when, interestingly enough, comparing them to his own. He said of the Bush administration's policies and his war on terrorism that the war on terrorism has actually created more terrorism around the world. Blasting again at the Bush administration on something that they know is very important to this administration.
The Chavez policy here, though, has been talking about how much he's helping the poor, one of the things that we found out today when we were out on the countryside talking to some of the people. Obviously we went to Caracas Country Club to talk to some of the people who have been in the power in the past. John, they are not happy at all with Hugo Chavez. They say that the economy that they helped build in this country is being ruined now by Hugo Chavez.
So, then, obviously enough, we wanted to talk to some of the people at the lower end of the economic rungs. What they say is that they favor Hugo Chavez seemingly more from a perception standpoint. They all will tell you we love when he blasts the United States. We love about his policies about protecting the poor. We love the things he does. But it seems to be more symbolic than anything else for most of them.
And here's why, John, when I asked many of them specifically for you, how has Hugo Chavez changed your life? How has his policies affected you, it was really tough finding people who could say, well, my life has improved. So economically speaking the situation here for Hugo Chavez, while he goes around and blames the United States and certainly points out the things that the United States has been criticized for in the past. He really hasn't been able to nail down the kind of economic promise that he's often talked about. John, back to you.
KING: Rick Sanchez live for us in Caracas as President Chavez returns home. Interesting time to be there. Rick, take care.
Hugo Chavez angered Democrats and Republicans alike this week by calling President Bush the devil. Now some conservatives are fighting back by urging Americans not to buy Chavez's most valuable asset, Venezuelan oil. could it work? Our Internet reporter Jacki Schechner has the story, Jackie.
JACKI SCHECHNER, CNN INTERNET REPORTER: John, probably not is the answer. But we started to see the call to boycott Citgo bubble up online yesterday. And today it is popping up on some of the top conservative political blogs. Why Citgo? Well it is owned by a company called PDV America, which is is a wholly-owned subsidiary of Venezuela's national oil company. We spoke to Citgo today and they didn't have any comment on the call for a boycott.
We did find some information on Snopes.com, which is a website dedicated to urban legend and often debunking it. They say they have been getting e-mails calling to boycott Citgo, or boycott Citgo, which would be buying oil and gasoline from them to protest U.S. foreign policy since January of this year. We actually found a blog post that dated back even father than that. And they say that while this isn't likely to have any economic impact one way or the other, it's a symbolic gesture and those are the sorts of things we see online, John.
KING: Jacki Schechner, thank you for tracking that.
More on this story just ahead. Democrat Charlie Rangel, a congressman from New York, often a fierce critic of President Bush, he thinks it was out of bounds for Hugo Chavez to call Mr. Bush a devil while here in the United States. He will join us in just a few minutes with a New York councilman Charles Barron, who is among Mr. Chavez's supporter when he made an appearance this week in Harlem. That debate, that discussion just a few moments away.
But in our CNN Security Watch tonight the Commerce Department has lost track of computers that might contain your personal information. CNN Homeland Security correspondent Jeanne Meserve has details.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MESERVE (voice-over): More than half of the missing laptops were used by temporary census workers to compile sensitive personal information like salary, educational level and occupation. Some of the computers had no encryption but the Commerce Department says there were password and protections.
DAVID SAMPSON, DEPUTY COMMERCE SECRETARY: Not even the field workers who collect the survey data can access that data once that survey has been completed. And we know of no instances in which any data has actually been breached or misused.
MESERVE: But experts say the threat of data theft exists even on computers with encryption.
LILLE CONEY, ELECTRONIC PRIVACY INFORMATION CENTER: It's like the key to your home. If you lose that key you can't be sure that someone won't find that key, won't make copies of that key and use that key.
MESERVE: In a resent congressional survey, the Commerce Department's information security program got a D-plus. That grade and the missing computers, indications that cyber-security has not been the priority it should be, one member of Congress says.
REP. TOM DAVIS (R), VIRGINIA: In a digital age we still have an analog government. And we are not taking all the precautions that we need to take.
MESERVE: Last May a Department of Veterans Affairs computer containing data on almost 27 million veterans was stolen. It was later recovered. And in July a Department of Transportation computer was stolen with information on 133,000 Florida residents.
But one of the most amazing things about the current case is that 113 of the missing computers were not stolen. Commerce just didn't get them back when workers were terminated.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KING: That is CNN Homeland Security correspondent Jeanne Meserve there. And as always stay tuned to CNN day and night for the most reliable news about your security.
Up ahead tonight, Congressman Charles Rangel furious at Hugo Chavez for his comments about President Bush. We'll speak to a New York City councilman who was there cheering Chavez on. Stay right here. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: Angry and provocative words from the Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez are still echoing in New York tonight, particularly in Harlem. That's where Mr. Chavez accused President Bush of being, quote, a sick man. Democratic Congressman and frequent Bush critic Charlie Rangel fired off an angry response to Mr. Chavez, effectively saying don't dis the president in my backyard. Congressman Rangel joins us now along with New York City councilman Charles Barron, who was at the Harlem meeting where Mr. Chavez spoke.
Let me start with you, Congressman Rangel, with this simple question, this is the United States of America, we have a freedom of speech. I assume it applies to our citizens as well as our visitors. You might not like what he said, but why not, why can't Hugo Chavez say whatever he wants about the president of the United States?
REP. CHARLIE RANGEL (D), NEW YORK: Let me make it abundantly clear that we may agree or disagree with the president of the United States and I think any American has a right and enjoy the privilege of being critical, but it's absolutely wrong for a foreigner to come into the United States of America and insult our one president.
This is one country, whether we're Democrat or Republicans, and to come here at the invitation of our people and insult the president of the United States, you insult the flag, you insult the president, you insult the country, and you insult my constituents.
KING: Congressman you stand by.
Councilman Barron, please join the discussion. But first, I want to pause for just a second so our viewers can see you weren't just someone in the crowd when President Chavez spoke. He obviously knew who you were, spoke of you as a brother. I want our audience to listen to this for just a second.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRES. HUGO CHAVEZ, VENEZUELA: (SPEAKING IN FOREIGN LANGUAGE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: Councilman Barron, a comrade of President Chavez in his words. I want you to address Congressman Rangel's point. And as you do so, are you uncomfortable at all showing solidarity with a man who recently met with the president of Iran, who has talked about wiping Israel off the map, said things like he doesn't think the Holocaust happened?
CHARLES BARRON (D), NEW YORK CITY COUNCILMAN: I have no discomfort whatsoever in supporting who I think is one of the greater humanitarian efforts across the nation and that's President Hugo Chavez who is providing oil for those who are in Harlem and in other parts of America.
But let's make it very, very clear. He was at the United Nations talking. That is international territory. That's where you supposed to be critical of presidents. And this is the same president that Charlie Rangel has been critical of, all of us have been critical of.
This is a president that was selected and not elected. This is a president that bombed Iraq based upon lies, the death and destruction of innocent Iraqi people. This is a president who was playing golf while our people were dying in New Orleans.
So for someone to characterize him -- and I think those are demonic acts. I think the criticism is legitimate. Charlie knows it's legitimate. It doesn't matter where he makes the criticism. Is it legitimate?
And this is not a foreigner. This is a leader of a nation, and this is a same leader that Pat Robertson said should be assassinated, the same leader that the Bush administration, many believe, participated in a coup d'etat for a duly elected leader in his country. The criticism is valid.
KING: Congressman, let me ask you this question.
RANGEL: Let me ...
(CROSSTALK)
KING: Hang on one second. I want you to say whatever you want to say, but I also want you to address the point about the humanitarian assistance. Because President Chavez, whether it is for publicity purpose or just to help poor people, has given oil to some of your constituents in Harlem. He has done the same in Boston. Should the people in the United States accept that help, or should they say no, we're not going to accept help from a man that calls our president the devil?
RANGEL: The man that is being calling the devil is buying billions of dollars every day of Venezuelan oil. Seventy percent of the oil exported comes to the United States of America.
And so until the president gets so uptight that he feels offended that he's not buying the oil, we'll take another look at the discounted oil we're getting from Venezuela and ask the president to make an appeal for United States oil companies that are making obscene profits to do what the government of Venezuela is doing.
But given us -- generously given us discounted oil doesn't mean that you have to right to come into our country and our community and insult our president. Now, what he does Councilman Barron is 100 percent right. What these people do at the United Nations they have an international right to do and say what they want.
And it's no question that President Bush has made a lot of criticism of world leaders, the evil axis in North Korea. But I am saying this: no one would ever think that we could go to Venezuela and attack the president of Venezuela and be able to do it. It's wrong to do and it's insulting.
BARRON: But Charlie, not only did the United States go to Venezuela, they participated in what the world knows in a coup d'etat, that this president was duly elected in this country. The United States ...
KING: Councilman, can I jump in, Councilman, for one second? I want to ask you a question relevant to what Charlie Rangel just said.
BARRON: Sure.
KING: Again, you're obviously very comfortable standing up and defending Hugo Chavez. I wonder if you worry at all though -- you have every right, and we're glad you're on this program saying whatever it is you feel. Do you feel confident a citizen of Venezuela could stand up and say Mr. Chavez, President Chavez, I think you are a devil. I don't think you should be in power?
BARRON: Listen he had citizens of Venezuela that was against him. They had a coup d'etat against them. Of course they can. This is not a country that is not having any democracy. They had an election. And they voted for a constitution. He has a right to criticize the president.
And Charlie is correct. How could the president of the United States go around talking about the axis of evil and mention evil. You just put a D on evil and you get devil. It's kind of theological position that leaders all over the world. Reagan called Russia the evil empire, and, Charlie, they still dealt with Russia on an economic level. So that has nothing to do with it.
He is correct in his criticism. He's a great humanitarian. It's not just the United States. Charlie, it's in Africa, too, he has given oil. The Caribbean, Europe as well as Asia, he's doing this all over the world. Bush and Blair should follow Hugo Chavez. We'd have a more humane world.
RANGEL: I really don't see how -- this is the United States of America. We don't have any other country. Whatever problems we have, it's like a family. And we do have serious problems in our family in America. But I am not prepared to say -- indeed, I resent an outsider not in our family criticizing not only the president of the United States but doing it in the community because he was generous with oil.
BARRON: Yes, but ...
KING: I want to ask -- Councilman, let me jump in for one second. I want to ask you one more question about this, because obviously you are very confident in your position. I want to ask you about something else Hugo Chavez said. This is on September 15, and he was speaking to Mr. Ahmadinejad, the president of Iran.
And this is a speech he gave in Cuba about Ahmadinejad. He said, "Iran is under threat. There are plans to invade Iran. Hopefully it won't happen, but we are with you under any scenario. We" -- meaning Venezuela -- "are with you."
Now, this may be a hypothetical on top of a hypothetical, but if there was to be a military confrontation involving the United States against Iran, whether you supported it, whether Charlie Rangel supported it or not, young kids from Harlem would be part of that mission just like they are part of the missions in Iraq and in Afghanistan. Are you comfortable standing by a leader who says if there is a dispute between the United States and Iran, he stands with Iran?
BARRON: First of all, I feel very, very comfortable being with Hugo Chavez because I think he's a humanitarian. The discomfort I have is with George Bush. He's the one that is creating war, death and destruction around the world. And the pretext of going into Lebanon is to bait Iran into some kind of confrontation because five percent of the world's population -- the United States -- uses 25 percent of the world's energy.
And I think that they need to get more oil. That's why they are in Iraq. That's why they want Iran in this war. And that's why they despise Hugo Chavez. This is not about what you just mentioned. President Bush, I think, is out of control in this world.
We need to stop it before it gets even worse and I think Hugo Chavez is correct in his analysis. He's not looking for war. He's looking for peace and trying to eradicate poverty. Tell Bush to heat up Harlem. Tell Bush to heat up Boston, and maybe we won't have to use Hugo Chavez.
KING: Congressman Rangel, you get the last word.
RANGEL: What makes America so great is that the councilman is able to express himself in this country as eloquently as he has, and sincerely believing in what he does. And whatever problems we have with Bush and this administration, you can bet your life that Hugo Chavez is not a part of the solution. Whatever he wants to be critical about Bush, and America let him do that in Caracas, Venezuela. But don't do this in my family, in my country and in my congressional district.
KING: Gentlemen, we need to ...
BARRON: You can do it at the United Nations, Charlie, where the world meets.
(CROSSTALK)
KING: I need to call a time-out, gentlemen. Congressman Charlie Rangel, Councilman Charles Barron, we thank you both for joining us tonight on THE SITUATION ROOM. Thank you both for your time and for your eloquence and your energy. We appreciate it very much, gentlemen. Thank you both.
Up ahead, the president of Pakistan dodges a key question in the war on terror because of a book deal. And President Bush follows up with a sales pitch. A strange moment at the White House that is raising a lot of questions. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: Now, who would have dreamed we would see presidents plugging books at high-level meetings? The first plug came from President Hugo Chavez at a speech at the United Nations this week. CNN's Tom Foreman now looks at a second chapter of high-level marketing -- this one today at the White House. TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: John, there are these very serious accusations out there of the U.S. threatening to bomb Pakistan back to the stone age, and yet the answers that came at the White House today were most surprising.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
FOREMAN (voice-over): The questions are serious, did Washington threaten Pakistan into the Afghanistan war? Would Pakistan have opposed the Taliban on its own? But the answer from the Pakistani president during his visit to the White House sounded more like a head of marketing than a head of state.
PRES. PERVEZ MUSHARRAF, PAKISTAN: I am launching my book on the 25th, and I am honor bound to Simon & Schuster not to comment on the book before that day.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: In other words, buy the book is what he's saying.
FOREMAN: A presidential plug is priceless, of course, with Musharraf's new book going on the racks this coming week and already appearing on some Web sites. Simon & Schuster will not say how much they paid him for "In the Line of Fire," but like a major league author, even after he left the White House, he kept pitching.
MUSHARRAF: So you'll have to buy the book and read it.
FOREMAN: Perhaps there is just something in the air that has world leaders hawking books right now. Or the Pakistani leader simply has reading on his mind.
Asked about conflicts with India he recited a quote.
MUSHARRAF: Because I always believe that one should never suffer from paralysis through analysis.
FOREMAN: That's from a book by another leader who knew about controversy: Richard Nixon.
World leaders often write about their experiences, but only after they leave office.
BUSH: Buy the book.
FOREMAN: So for international relations, it certainly seems like a new chapter.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FOREMAN: One more celebrity book to look for this weekend: Pluto, "I Was Once a Planet, Too."
KING: Tom Foreman. Just the right touch on that story. Let's find out now what is coming up next hour on "PAULA ZAHN NOW." Hi, Paula. PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: Hi, John. Thanks so much. Tonight, we're going to go in-depth and look at the United Nations' relevance after a very long week of speeches and some serious anti-American rhetoric. I'm going to ask a top story panel if the U.N. is still necessary and what the U.S. gets out of it.
We're also going to look at whether tonight's top story for consumers is also the top story in politics. Is it just a coincidence that gas prices are down sharply and the national election is just six weeks away? As you know, John King, a lot of theories brewing out there about that. And we'll debate all of them coming up at the top of the hour.
KING: Looking forward to it. It's an interesting question. Paula, thank you very much. We'll see you in a few minutes.
And still ahead here, would you give up sex to live a long life? Most of Brits surveyed say they would. Jack Cafferty is finding out what you think. Your answers just ahead. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: If you'd been watching, you know the question, and Jack is in New York now with "The Cafferty File. "
CAFFERTY: Thank you, John. A new British poll out shows that 40 percent of the people there would be willing to give up sex if it meant they would live to be 100 years old. The question is, would you?
John King is already on record as saying absolutely not.
Scott in Downs, Illinois -- "I think my wife's made that decision for me. I'm going to live a long, long time unless she watches your show."
Vincent in Texas -- "I wouldn't give up sex if I could only live to be 38, and I'm 37 right now."
C in Scottsdale, Arizona -- "I'm 52 years old, I haven't had sex in 10 years, and I feel like I'm 100. Does this count?"
Ben in Washington -- "A long life is worth nothing if you don't live it. I may not live to be 100, but I'm going to live my life in the most pleasurable way possible."
Donna in Oregon writes -- "No, I'd rather keep having sex and live to be 110."
Sara writes from Ashland, Oregon -- "That 40-something percent of British women who said they'd gladly give up sex to live to be 100 -- well, that's because they've having sex with British men. I wouldn't give up a happy, safe adult romp with a West Coast surfer, a sophisticated New Yorker, a Texas cowboy or a Midwestern honey for all the decades between 80 and 100. Oh, yeah, and the men here in Oregon are terrific too."
Sharon writes -- "Cafferty, would I give up sex to live to be 100 years old? No! I've already lived longer than I figured I would, and at my age sex is the only free thing I can still enjoy."
Phil in Port Charlotte, Florida writes -- "Check with me when I'm 99."
And Ralph in New York writes -- "I can't answer now, Jack, I have a headache."
If you didn't see your e-mail here, go to CNN.com/caffertyfile. You can read some more of these online -- John.
KING: You say more of them, Jack. I bet you can't put all of them online.
CAFFERTY: Well, no, but I mean, it's a family show. We got hundreds of these, and most of them are cute and in the vein that we kind of expected. You know, it was just a fun question.
KING: I answered your question. Now you answer your question.
CAFFERTY: Absolutely not.
KING: Amen. We stand together, Brother Cafferty and I.
CAFFERTY: There you go.
KING: Have a great weekend, Jack, and thank you for joining us.
And don't forget to tune into "Late Edition" Sunday morning at 11:00 Eastern. It is, of course, the last word in Sunday talk.
Among our guests, the Afghan President Hamid Karzai and the Iraqi President Jalal Talabani. Have a great weekend. Up next, "PAULA ZAHN NOW."
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