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Lou Dobbs Tonight
War on Terror: Strategy for Afghanistan; Dems in Disarray?; Talking With Our Foes
Aired February 28, 2007 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KITTY PILGRIM, HOST: Coming up, our special report, "The War Within." Tonight, the battle to retake our streets from drug cartels and drug addicts.
We'll have an exclusive report.
Also, new charges that federal prosecutors betrayed two Border Patrol agents and ignored the crimes of an illegal alien drug smuggler.
And the escalating crisis in our public school system. A shocking new report. The president of one of the organizations that commissioned the report joins us.
All that and more straight ahead.
ANNOUNCER: This is LOU DOBBS TONIGHT, news, debate and opinion for Wednesday, February 28th.
Sitting in for Lou Dobbs, Kitty Pilgrim.
PILGRIM: Good evening.
One day after Vice President Dick Cheney visited Afghanistan, President Bush met with congressional leaders to discuss his strategy to defeat radical Islamist terrorists. The United States and NATO allies are bracing for a spring offensive by Taliban terrorists in Afghanistan.
Meanwhile, the Democratic Party remains sharply divided over its strategy to oppose the president's troop buildup in Iraq. House Democrats have decided not to cut off money for U.S. troops in Iraq.
Suzanne Malveaux reports on the president's efforts to build a bipartisan consensus on the war in Afghanistan.
Dana Bash reports on evidence of disarray in the Democratic Party over the war in Iraq.
And Zain Verjee reports on the Bush administration's changing policies towards some of this country's most dangerous enemies.
We turn to Suzanne Malveaux first -- Suzanne.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kitty, it really was the first of its kind. President Bush, the vice president, both in attendance here, as well as the leadership, the Republican and Democratic leadership. All meeting together here to improve consultations when it comes to the war on terror. The official name of this group, the Congressional Global War on Terror Consultative Group.
Now, they're trying to improve relations between the White House and members of Congress, and today they did not focus on Iraq. Very controversial, as you know. But instead, on Afghanistan.
Afghanistan, however, is truly a mission that has a lot of problems. Five years later, requiring more American troops, as well as dollars. And President Bush is asking Congress for nearly $12 billion in the next couple of years to carry out that mission. And that is a figure that reflects the serious problems the United States is facing there; namely, a Taliban resurgence that's expected to get worse in the spring, a dramatic increase in the violence, the suicide bombings there, and a troop shortage that has NATO members really split over what to do next.
Now, I talked with both Republicans and Democrats coming out of this meeting and taking all of that into account. They say at least there's a clear mission, as well as a clear enemy. So they are, for the most part, behind the White House in their strategy.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R), MINORITY LEADER: It was a good example of an area where there's broad bipartisan agreement. It was a very amicable meeting. I think there is strong support on both sides of the aisle for what we're doing in Afghanistan and the effort to do more to combat the resurgence of the Taliban there.
REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA), HOUSE SPEAKER: The president, and the spirit in which he opened the meeting, of hoping that we can work together in a bipartisan way, was the spirit in which the meeting was conducted. And I think a good start to a dialogue with the president that had been absent, quite frankly, in sharp contrast to what is happening in Iraq.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MALVEAUX: And Kitty, also, Speaker Pelosi said the one think that Democrats are pushing for is more money for reconstruction projects in Afghanistan. Republicans saying they want the same but they're not quite sure about the dollar figure, that amount.
As you know, Kitty, the next time this group gets together, they talk about Iraq. It is going to be much more controversial. Perhaps even contentious, if you will. There is very little agreement when it comes what to do next there -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: Thanks very much, Suzanne Malveaux.
Well, House Democrats are struggling to present a united front on the issue of the war in Iraq. Democrats are sharply divided on whether to restrict funding for the war. The Democratic leadership tonight is trying to develop an alternative plan to oppose the troop buildup in Iraq.
Dana Bash has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
DANA BASH, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): California Democrat Lynne Woolsey sums up the mood of the Democratic majority on Iraq in one word.
REP. LYNN WOOLSEY (D), CALIFORNIA: Tense.
BASH (on camera): Because?
WOOLSEY: Because we aren't unified.
BASH: And why is that?
WOOLSEY: Well, because we have a huge tent.
REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA), SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: ... 246. The nays are 182.
BASH (voice-over): Just two weeks ago, House Democrats were unified in opposing the president's plan to send more troops to Iraq. But now, Democrats are openly divided on what to do next.
REP. JOHN CLYBURN (D-SC), HOUSE MAJORITY WHIP: We are what America is. We are searching for consensus. We are searching for an honorable way to address a dishonorable situation that we find ourselves in.
BASH: Senior Democrats say an early problem was this...
REP. JOHN MURTHA (D), PENNSYLVANIA: We're trying to force a redeployment not by taking money away, by redirecting money.
BASH: Congressman John Murtha pitching a plan on an anti-war Web site to bring U.S. troops home from Iraq by setting conditions on funding the president can't meet.
Conservative Democrats said no way.
REP. JIM COOPER (D), TENNESSEE: I'm not sure its in our troops' interests to attach too many clauses and legal fine print to this. The troops need the money. They needed it yesterday. Let's get them the money so they have a maximum chance of completing successfully their job.
BASH: So now Democratic leaders are pushing a proposal with less political risk. Instead of cutting or withholding war funding, it would set military readiness standards. If those aren't met, the president would have to sign a waiver and explain why.
But caution is a tough sell to anti-war liberals.
WOOLSEY: I believe that a lot of Democrats still believe that a label of not protecting the troops would be devastating to them in their next elections. And I think they are so wrong.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
BASH: Democrats point out over and over that public opinion is stronger than ever against the Iraq war, but turning that into a consensus on how to confront the president and force an end to the war is proving extraordinarily difficult for Democrats -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: Thanks very much, Dana Bash.
Insurgents have killed another one of our troops in Iraq. The soldier was killed by small arms fire in Baghdad.
Seventy-nine of our troops have been killed in Iraq this month, 3,162 of our troops have been killed since this war began. 23,677 troops have been wounded, 10,427 of them so seriously, they could not return to duty within three days.
Insurgents today killed at least 10 people in a car bomb attack against a Baghdad market. Another 21 people were wounded. Insurgents have frequently targeted crowded markets in Baghdad and other cities.
The Iraqi government today said it hopes a regional conference on the war next month will help end the violence. The United States will likely hold talks at the conference with Iran and Syria. Two countries the United States accuses of sponsoring terrorism. The Bush administration is also preparing for talks with another adversary, North Korea.
Zain Verjee reports on the Bush administration's changing foreign policy strategy.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ZAIN VERJEE, CNN STATE DEPT. CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Reaching out to old foes the U.S. has been freezing out, Iran and Syria, and gently warming up to the reclusive North Korea. The State Department says U.S. and North Korean negotiators will meet one on one in New York next week. The plan is to set a path forward toward diplomatic relations.
U.S. officials say, don't get high hopes.
SEAN MCCORMACK, STATE DEPT. SPOKESMAN: Don't expect anybody to come out the front door on March 6th waving piece of paper with breakthrough agreements. That's just not the kind of meeting that this is going to be.
VERJEE: But it is progress. A deal was struck with North Korea earlier this month. North Korea agreed to freeze its nuclear program and allow inspections in return for millions of dollars in aid and the potential of normal relations with the U.S.
Normal relations with Iran and Syria seem much further away. The U.S. has not dealt directly with Iran, accusing it of trying to build a nuclear bomb. Washington accuses Syria of backing Hezbollah and trying to destabilize the fragile democracy in Lebanon.
The U.S. is not ruling out possible talks with its foes on the sidelines of a regional conference next month on Iraq. It says it will only talk about Iraq, nothing else.
Some experts say this is a reversal of U.S. policy. Others don't see it that way.
CLOVIS MAKSOUD, FMR. AMB. LEAGUE OF ARAB STATES: I don't think it comes to a reversal. I think it's an accommodation of some of the suggestions of the Baker report. I think it begins to open up towards the realistic approach which has to be regional, more or less similar what took place in the North Korean situation.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VERJEE: U.S. officials tells CNN that it's also about satisfying the critics, both at home and abroad, that have really been pushing Washington it talk to its foes. The Bush administration wants to show them that it's doing diplomacy, that it is engaging -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: Zain, what are some of the other reasons the U.S. is interested in talking to Iran and Syria?
VERJEE: Well, the primary reason is really about Iraq. They see Iran and Syria as being in a position that can stabilize and help the situation in Iraq. The other reason, too, U.S. officials have told us, that it's an opportunity to hear out both Iran and Syria without making any concessions that may come back to bite the U.S. -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: Thanks very much, Zain Verjee.
Still to come, explosive new charges of lying and cover-ups in the case of two Border Patrol agents in prison for doing their jobs.
Also, millions of illegal aliens in this country take a step closer to citizenship, and your government is only too willing to help them do just that.
We'll have a special report.
And "The War Within." We'll give you exclusive inside access to a major drug operation.
Stay with us as we ride along with federal agents as they take down key players in Mexican drug cartels.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PILGRIM: New developments tonight in the case of imprisoned former Border Patrol agents Ramos and Compean. The two are serving lengthy prison sentences for shooting and wounding an illegal alien drug smuggler.
Casey Wian reports that shocking new documents now show how the prosecutor deliberately targeted the Border Patrol agents instead of a repeat drug smuggler.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CASEY WIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Congressman Dana Rohrabacher holds the latest evidence suggesting former Border Patrol agents Ignacio Ramos and Jose Compean were unjustly prosecuted by the Bush administration. The men are serving 11 and 12 years in prison for shooting and wounding an illegal alien drug smuggler who was given immunity to testify against the agents by Texas U.S. attorney Johnny Sutton.
The once-secret document shows Sutton's office was told by the DEA that Oscar Aldrete-Davila was implicated in a second drug smuggling incident while he was under immunity but before the agents' trial. The evidence that Aldrete-Davila was a serial drug smuggler was kept from the jury that convicted Ramos and Compean.
REP. DANA ROHRABACHER (R), CALIFORNIA: Evidence now emerging suggests that Sutton's office was notified by the DEA of Davila's direct involvement of a second offense. Sutton chose to disregard the information, despite the evidence provided by the DEA.
WIAN: Rohrabacher even accused Sutton of lying by misleading jurors and the public about Aldrete-Davila's drug smuggling history.
Sutton released a statement saying, "The U.S. Attorneys Office cannot comment about matters that are under seal or ongoing investigations. This office will pursue criminal charges where there is prosecutable criminal activity and competent evidence to prove it."
Supporters of Ramos and Compean want the men freed while an appeals court considers their case. And they want President Bush to personally intervene and pardon the former agents.
A House pardon bill now has 85 Republican co-sponsors. And this week, for the first time, two Democrats joined the effort -- Tim Holden of Pennsylvania and Bart Gordon of Tennessee.
REP. BART GORDON (D), TENNESSEE: It looks to me like the government has gotten the cops and robbers confused here. We have a terrible problem on the border. And I'm very concerned about it.
WIAN: A full 20 percent of the U.S. House of Representatives is now on record supporting a pardon of the agents.
ROHRABACHER: We're going to get to the bottom of it. These men will be freed.
Thank you very much.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WIAN: Even in San Bernardino County, California, where a local newspaper reporter and a Border Patrol supporter first brought national attention to the case, the board of supervisors passed a unanimous resolution this week asking President Bush to consider a pardon for the agents at the earliest opportunity -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: Thanks very much, Casey Wian.
That brings us to our poll question tonight.
Now, do you agree with Congressman Dana Rohrabacher that U.S. attorney Johnny Sutton lied concerning sealed evidence in the trial of Border Patrol agents Ramos and Compean? Yes or no?
Cast your vote at loudobbs.com and we'll bring you the results a little bit later in this broadcast.
Updating you now on the backlash from states over new ruling for issuing driver's licenses. The new rules are part of the Real ID Act passed nearly two years ago.
Now, states didn't want to pay for it and complained to Washington about following the new law. Well, today, Homeland Security chief Michael Chertoff said he may give states more time and more money to help.
Now, this law requires states to improve security features on driver's licenses by next summer and make sure everyone has a license in this country legally. Now, this plan is expected to cost $11 billion.
A Florida state legislator wants the term "illegal alien" banned from state documents. State senator Frederica Wilson from Miami says she finds the term offensive and she says, "An alien to me is someone from outer space."
Now, the term "illegal alien" appears in federal government publications and documents, and even in this recruitment ad for the National Guard. Webster's dictionary defines "alien" as relating, belonging or owing allegiance to another country or government.
And we use "illegal alien" on this broadcast. It is accurate. It is the term the government uses. And any other term is designed to cloud the issues involved.
The Senate Judiciary Committee holding hearings today on immigration reform. It's a plan that critics say amounts to illegal amnesty -- amnesty for illegal aliens. Now, the White House favors many of the points on the Democrats' plan, and as Lisa Sylvester tells us, Republicans and Democrats are both waiting for the Bush administration to have its say.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LISA SYLVESTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): The one thing the Bush administration, congressional Democrats and Republicans agree on is the current immigration system is broken. Fake Social Security cards are so abundant, it's a joke.
SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM (R), SOUTH CAROLINA: Can I get a Social Security card illegally by midnight tonight? MICHAEL CHERTOFF, HOMELAND SECURITY SECRETARY: I don't know if you could, but I think probably...
GRAHAM: Don't sell me short.
SYLVESTER: Lawmakers wanted to pin down Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff and Commerce Secretary Carlos Gutierrez on their position on immigration. Democrats pushing so-called comprehensive immigration reform expect the White House to do more heavy lifting after last year's failed efforts. That means convincing Republicans, many of whom don't buy the sanitized phrase, "earned legalization," but see it as blanket amnesty.
CHERTOFF: I think the president's been crystal clear he does not want to have an amnesty program. So...
SEN. CHARLES GRASSLEY (R), IOWA: My answer to that is, if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a duck.
SYLVESTER: Secretary Gutierrez said the White House is on record favoring a guest worker program and legalizing the 12 million-plus illegal aliens.
Chertoff added that whatever program Congress approves, it has to be workable, noting the U.S. government's failure to follow through on enforcement measures after the 1986 amnesty.
CHERTOFF: I think that frankly there was a lot of public skepticism built up over 20 or 30 years of what many people in the public view as lip service.
SYLVESTER: Some, like Senator Tom Coburn, are not convinced a guest worker, an amnesty program, is even necessary.
REP. TOM COBURN (R), OKLAHOMA: Why does it make sense to have an influx of an additional workforce when we have 10 million Americans that aren't employed today and real wages for those people at those entry-level jobs aren't rising?
SYLVESTER: The new Congress is taking up immigration where the old Congress left off, with the same battle lines drawn.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SYLVESTER: Even though there is a Democratically-controlled Congress, what happens on immigration in the House and Senate could ultimately be decided by swing Republicans. On one hand, pressure from the White House to support the comprehensive approach. On the other, they're hearing from constituents who oppose anything resembling amnesty for illegal aliens -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: Thanks very much, Lisa Sylvester.
Coming up, "The War Within." Controversy over random drug testing in schools.
And we ride along with the DEA as they raid a key U.S. cell of a Mexican drug cartel.
Jury deliberations and the sixth day in the CIA leak trial of Lewis "Scooter" Libby. We'll have a report.
And the FBI says they found $90,000 of alleged bribe money in his freezer, and now that same U.S. congressman is given a seat on the Homeland Security Committee.
We'll have a report.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PILGRIM: Outrage today over the appointment of Congressman William Jefferson to the Homeland Security Committee. Jefferson has been investigated for bribery by the FBI. And as Andrea Koppel reports, House Republicans are not happy with Jefferson's appointment.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANDREA KOPPEL, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): FBI agents raided the congressional office of Louisiana Democrat William Jefferson in May of last year, alleging they'd found $90,000 in bribes stuffed in his freezer. Democratic leader Nancy Pelosi had had enough.
PELOSI: Our House Democratic Caucus is determined to uphold a high ethical standard. We set it. And now we are doing it.
KOPPEL: What she did was to force Jefferson to forfeit his seat on the powerful tax-writing Ways and Means Committee. The Louisiana lawmaker denied the allegations and said he'd been unfairly singled out.
REP. WILLIAM JEFFERSON (D), LOUISIANA: It is more of a scapegoat thing for the convenience of an argument that Ms. Pelosi wants to make to gain an advantage in a political debate.
KOPPEL: That was then.
This is now. Congressman Jefferson has been re-elected to a ninth term. Nancy Pelosi is speaker of the House. And even though the FBI's investigation continues, she has just given Jefferson a new assignment on another high-profile House committee, Homeland Security.
Unapologetic about the apparent flip-flop, Pelosi explained Jefferson is from Louisiana, hit hard by hurricanes Katrina and Rita.
PELOSI: And I removed him from the Ways and Means Committee, that something to do with the accusations made against him. Homeland Security does not.
KOPPEL: Republicans say Jefferson will have access to sensitive and closely-guarded intelligence and accuse Pelosi of being, at best, inconsistent. REP. ROY BLUNT (R), MINORITY WHIP: And the idea that Homeland Security is somehow less important than the tax-writing committee, I think is a ludicrous idea.
KOPPEL: A Pelosi deputy, South Carolina's Jim Clyburn defended the move and said Jefferson has not been charged with a crime.
REP. JAMES CLYBURN (D), MAJORITY WHIP: There are still allegations here. And how many allegations have been leveled against Republicans that they don't seem to be removing from any committee?
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KOPPEL: Now, Republicans are promising to try to block the appointment when it comes up for a vote, perhaps as soon as tomorrow, Kitty. But even then they privately admit they don't have the votes to keep Jefferson off Homeland Security -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: Andrea, you say Jefferson's not been charged yet, but where do we stand on the investigation into Jefferson?
KOPPEL: Well, our colleague, Kevin Bonn (ph), one of the producers at CNN, checked with the FBI today. They said that they are continuing the investigation. That's all they'll say. But the implication is, or the indications we've gotten, is that there could be some movement next month -- or rather in April.
We also know that two of Jefferson's associates, one of them a former close aide of his, are going to be sentenced to prison tomorrow. One of them admitted to bribing Congressman Jefferson -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: Thanks very much, Andrea Koppel.
Time now for some of your thoughts.
And Kathy in Oregon wrote to us. And she wrote, "Is it just me, or do other people think it odd that we are finally building a fence on our southern border while there are seven huge tunnels still open for business?"
And Joanie in Michigan, "If Senator Ted Kennedy, the Democratic Congress, and President Bush reward illegal aliens with amnesty, then who will do those jobs that Americans won't do? Oh, yes, more illegal aliens will swarm in here to fill the void, hoping to receive yet another amnesty."
And Dee in California writes, "If Congress investigates the trial of border guards Ramos and Compean, they should investigate who in the office of the attorney general in Texas should go to jail in their place."
Do e-mail us at loudobbs.com. We'll have more of your thoughts a little bit later in the broadcast. And each of you whose e-mail is read here will receive a copy of Lou's book, "War on the Middle Class." Coming up, "The War Within." The DEA raids a Mexican drug cartel's U.S. distribution site, and we'll take you inside the raid.
We'll also have a report on the controversy over random drug testing in public schools.
America's students lack the basic skills for college and the workplace. Grim new details in a new report.
And did Scooter Libby knowingly lie to federal investigators? That's what the jury is attempting to decide as it end its 6th day of deliberations.
We'll have the latest.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PILGRIM: After six days of deliberations, still no verdict in the perjury trial of former White House aide Lewis "Scooter" Libby. Now today, jurors resolved on their own a request they sent to the judge yesterday seeking clarification on the count. Libby faces charges he lied to prosecutors about how he learned the identity of a CIA operative.
Richard Daley has won his sixth term as mayor of Chicago. The mayor easily defeated the lesser-known opponents, winning more than 70 percent of the vote. Daley also overcame a city hall corruption scandal involving two former aides. He is now in line to surpass his legendary father's record as Chicago's longest-serving mayor.
The Roman Catholic diocese of San Diego filed for bankruptcy protection earlier today amid claims of years of sexual abuse by priests. The filing came just hours before the diocese was to go on trial in the first of more than 140 lawsuits. It says the filing was necessary in order to compensate all of the victims.
San Diego is the fifth diocese in the country to file for Chapter 11.
Now "The War Within". It's our special report on this country's ongoing battle against drug and alcohol.
Now, tonight, we have an exclusive look at an early-morning raid by drug enforcement agents in Los Angeles.
As Kelli Arena tells us, the targets are members of a vicious drug cartel based in Mexico.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KELLI ARENA, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): As the city of angels sleep, the DEA is gearing up. Final preparations for an early- morning raid on a suspected U.S. branch of a lethal Mexican drug cartel. CNN was granted exclusive access. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Walk around to the front. Make entry at the front door right here.
ARENA: Silently the team moves in, surrounds a house in East L.A. It's a scenario simultaneously playing out in 15 cities from Southern California to Chicago, the culmination of nearly two years of investigative work.
Here in L.A., they get their woman, Latisha Cervantes Lopez (ph). The DEA believes she's the head of a distribution cell for the Cesar Salazar drug cartel. Officials say she's in the United States illegally.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She's responsible for breaking down the drug shipments that were transported across the southeast border into the U.S. into smaller shipments and distributing to other careers.
ARENA: There are other adults in the house during the raid and children, one baby only months old.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: These people push these drugs, do it around their own children. And that's something that has to be stopped.
ARENA: As agents search the house, a drug sniffing dog is sent in to assist.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When we made our initial search, he did show interest and alert in a couple of areas.
ARENA: In the end, a small amount of marijuana is seized.
Including today's raids, the DEA says this investigation has netted more than 700 pounds of meth, 4,000 kilograms of cocaine, 27,000 pounds of marijuana and more than $45 million in cold hard cash.
The man allegedly responsible for getting those drugs into the United States, Victor Emilio Salazar. Indicted by a grand jury, he's believed to be in Mexico.
Agents say his runner stashed the drugs inside wheel walls and hidden compartments and trucks to make their way across the porous southwest border to Los Angeles. Agents say the drugs are then repackaged and sent all across the country.
JON GOLDBERG, DRUG ENFORCEMENT ADMINISTRATION: We targeted this organization at all levels. From the command and control structure, to the people up top who call the shots, down to the street dealers who peddle the poison down on the streets.
ARENA: More than 400 people have been arrested so far in Operation Imperial Emperor, dealing a serious blow to Cesar Salazar's operations. But the satisfaction only lasts so long.
SARAH PULLEN, DRUG ENFORCEMENT ASSOCIATION: There's a lot of them out there and obviously there will be people who will want to take the place who we arrested today.
ARENA: Kelli Arena, CNN, Los Angeles.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PILGRIM: Some schools are now taking the issue of teenage drug use into their own hands with random drug testing. This practice, however, is not without controversy. And some say it's an invasion of privacy.
Christine Romans reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): For about 20 students a week in this school, the most important test they'll take is a drug test.
LAUREN GALINEY, HIGH SCHOOL STUDENT: I wasn't worried. I just went down and couple minutes out of class and it wasn't a big deal.
ROMANS: But for social workers and other counselors who work with kids, it is a big deal. Even though the Supreme Court ruled that random student drug testing is legal, they say it's an invasion of privacy and a breach of trust.
SHERRI MORGAN, NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF SOCIAL WORKERS: You also deter students from developing the kinds of trusting relationships with adults. So that they feel that they could come with them when they haven't identified a problem that they're aware of.
ROMANS: The National Association of Social Workers and half a dozen other groups are on record with their concerns. But supporters of drug testing say keeping kids off drugs is paramount.
CALVINA FAY, DRUG-FREE AMERICA FOUNDATION: We have to start pushing back. We cannot stand by. If we had any other epidemic going on in this country, we would be doing everything we could to protect our children, and we have a drug epidemic.
ROMANS: Individual schools like Hunterdon Central in New Jersey report remarkable results. And a 2003 study in Oregon schools, published in the "Journal of Adolescent Health", found, quote, "The drug testing policy may have led to significant reductions in drug use among athletes."
But a 2003 University of Michigan study found, quote, "There was virtually no difference in drug use rates between those schools that had random drug testing and those that did not."
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ROMANS: In the five years now since that Supreme Court ruling, more than 400 schools receive federal funding for random drug testing, and new districts are signing up every day. While public schools are limited to testing only students in extracurricular activities, private schools can test all students with no restrictions.
PILGRIM: Christine, you mentioned the American Academy of Pediatrics is against this. What's the thinking on this?
ROMANS: They've been opposed to non-voluntary drug testing in schools way back since 1996. The idea being that you're breaking down barrier -- or breaking down trust in the breach of trust between adults and students.
And kids, we've heard over and over today that kids, they're complicated. They're complicated creatures, and just giving them these random drug tests can create some kind of a push back.
But what we're hearing from some of these districts is that it is really is working. It is working on some of these kids. And the kids who are on the margin who might just be dabbling, it is a deterrent for some of these kids. They say, "You know, I'm not going to. It's just not worth it for me. I'm not going to do it."
PILGRIM: Thanks very much. Very interesting report. Christine Romans.
In Bethlehem, Pennsylvania, a middle school principal facing charges of selling crystal methamphetamine out of his school office. Fifty-year-old John Acerra was arrested yesterday at the school, and police say they found meth on his desk. Now, Acerra allegedly dealt the drug after school and on weekends, and it is not known if Acerra sold the drug to any of his students.
Just ahead, a disturbing new report on the state of our education system. John Podesta will join me with more on which states scored the highest and the lowest.
And then the battle on the Hill. Democrats retool their anti-war plan. Three of the nation's best political minds will join me to discuss that topic and more. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PILGRIM: Grim details tonight on America's failing education system. A new report on this critical topic was commissioned by groups from opposite ends of the political spectrum. And among the report's findings, a lack of reading and math skills in pre-high school students, and graduating students are generally unprepared for college or the work place.
Joining me now is John Podesta, president and CEO of the Center for American Progress and former White House chief of staff under President Clinton.
Thanks for being with us, sir.
JOHN PODESTA, PRESIDENT/CEO, CENTER FOR AMERICAN PROGRESS: Nice to be with you, Kitty.
PILGRIM: You know, I looked at this report, and it's fascinating because it really goes state by state. But you decided -- you look at nine categories in preparedness. And yet, you decided to grade this on a curve because, if you didn't, every state in the nation would receive a "C" or lower.
Are you -- are you really for grade inflation on this report?
PODESTA: Well, I'd say a couple of things about that. First all I think the one that's probably the most disturbing finding of the report is that there's no state in the country where fourth graders and eighth graders in math and reading, where the -- there are a majority of students in those states that are proficient in math and reading in the fourth and eighth grade. So that's a pretty grim statistic.
But I think there is variation amongst the states. And one of the things we wanted to do in not assigning an overall grade and in grading on a curve, if you will, against these criteria is to show that, where people and where leadership, both at the political level in the schools and amongst parents, where there was leadership, that you did have variation.
So that you see a state like Massachusetts scoring very high. You see other states going low.
PILGRIM: Let's take a look at Massachusetts. Let's take a look at a good one and one who did very badly. Massachusetts got an "A" for overall academic achievement. State also received an "A" for return on investment. That's how much money you spend per child, which is $11,181 per student each year.
Seventy-two percent of the state's ninth graders receive a diploma in four years. What's Massachusetts's doing right? What is it effective?
PODESTA: Well, I think they've had, again, a sustained effort. It's been bipartisan. It's been over a long time to really try to do the kinds of reforms that the accompanying joint platform that we put out with the Chamber of commerce recommended, which is to put better teachers in the classroom, focus on high-poverty schools.
Try to be innovative in the way that students use their time, provide more time in school. And they've just had a very strong sustained effort at that, and the results show.
PILGRIM: Let's look at New Mexico. And it did very poorly. It has an "F" for academic achievement. It scored 16 points lower know that the national average for fourth graders. New Mexico also received an "F" on return on investment. Three hundred twenty-one thousand public school students. The state spends $6,447 per student a year.
Only 57 percent of the ninth graders graduate from high school in four years, and the national average is 70 percent. What's going on in New Mexico?
PODESTA: Well, you know first of all, it's a high poverty state. It has a very high percentage of minority students in the schools there.
But you know, I think they obviously need to try to do better by all those students. And I think that every one of those students needs to have a chance to succeed in a modern economy and a 21st century economy.
Recently, I think they've taken some steps to expand preschool to provide more accountability. They did a little bit better if you look at the overall grades on the kinds of system-wide improvements that need to happen with respect to teacher testing and those sort of things.
So I think they're on the right track. But it's going to take time, and they're going to need to, you know, sustain that commitment to it. The governor's put a lot of efforts into trying to get kids in college and to really focus on preschool. Those are important reforms. But obviously, New Mexico's lagging.
PILGRIM: We have a statement from the New Mexico secretary of education. Let's read it. Education reform in, "New Mexico has been substantive. Genuine reform takes time and New Mexico will see the return on investments, like colleges and career alignment initiatives, tougher standards, and increased classroom relevance and rigor."
It's a sort of we'll try, we're doing better sort of statement.
You know, your report recommends four priorities. And I have to say maybe there's another one, too, because we looked up the national teacher's salary, the average, and it's $49,000 a year. You recommend better teaching, more innovation, better management and better data. And we would probably lump in there probably better pay for teachers.
PODESTA: Right.
PILGRIM: What -- the one thing that we don't understand is better data. Could you explain that a bit?
PODESTA: Sure. I think that -- that on the data side, you need to be able to see how kids are progressing. And what methods are working better, what teacher are being effective in helping kids learn the skills that they need to succeed in school as they progress.
And the states vary with respect to how much information that they can produce in terms of what's happening within each district, within each school, and particularly with respect to students so that we can really see progress move forward.
I think we've seen some improvements in that over the last four or five years. But I think more -- genuinely, more needs to be done so that we can align teacher performance, pay to improve student performance, and a variety of other things to find the best new innovations that are going to work and then try to replicate those across the board.
PILGRIM: Yes. PODESTA: With respect to that teacher salary point, the Chamber joined us in calling for higher starting salaries for the teachers. And you know, that's an important feature of our current system. We need to pay teachers better.
PILGRIM: I really just have this one follow-up. In 1983, education nation at risk report, and yet the U.S. Chamber of Commerce is just looking at this now. Why the lag on this? This is so important.
PODESTA: Well, that's probably -- you know, I come from the other side of the political spectrum. So that's probably a question better put to the Chamber.
But I think it's important that the Chamber -- that the U.S. Chamber, at national level, has gotten on board. They pulled their membership. And training and education, top the list of things that -- public policy concerns that their members are concerned about. Because small business, big business need a trained work force if they're going to succeed in the global economy.
PILGRIM: Well, we can only say it's about time this was regarded seriously. Thank you very much, John Podesta, for joining us to discuss it. Thanks.
PODESTA: Thank you.
PILGRIM: Coming up the top of the hour "THE SITUATION ROOM" with Wolf Blitzer -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Thanks, Kitty.
This is a steady drumbeat from the White House, accusing Iran of fueling the chaos in Iraq. Is there a growing chance of a military confrontation? I'll ask the former chief of Middle East intelligence at the Pentagon, retired U.S. Army Colonel Pat Lang.
Also, my interview with the No. 2 U.S. commander in Iraq. I'll ask him about the security crackdown in Baghdad and how long it will be before we all know whether or not it's working.
And we'll show you how achieving one dream led to fulfilling another for an American Olympic champion, now reunited with his father.
All of that coming up right here on "THE SITUATION ROOM" -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: Thanks, Wolf.
A reminder now to vote in tonight's poll. And our question is do you agree with Congressman Dana Rohrabacher that U.S. attorney Johnny Sutton lied concerning the sealed evidence in the trial of Border Patrol agents Ramos and Compean? Yes or no? Cast your vote at LouDobbs.com. We'll give you the results in just a few minutes. Still ahead, Democratic Congressman William Jefferson is the subject of a federal corruption probe. He's now in line for a seat on the powerful homeland security committee. Three of the country's best political analysts will tell us what could be behind this controversial appointment. And we'll discuss a whole lot more than that. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PILGRIM: Joining me now are three of the best political analysts in the country: Republican strategist Ed Rollins, columnist for the "New York Daily News" Errol Louis, and Democratic strategist Robert Zimmerman.
Gentlemen, thanks for being here.
We have a lot to cover. You know, the House and now the Senate talking about Iraq and what they should do as a response to the current policy. Where do you think we stand on Capitol Hill in terms of getting some momentum on this?
ROBERT ZIMMERMAN, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: I think what the political leadership is trying to do is build a consensus. Of course, first there was the non-binding resolution, as a strategy of building a bipartisan support. It didn't work, because there wasn't -- they weren't able it get the 60 votes in the Senate that they needed.
So now the Democrats are trying to respond to the need to change the strategy in Iraq and respond to the message from the 2006 election, which was to change the strategy in Iraq.
ERROL LOUIS, COLUMNIST, "NEW YORK DAILY NEWS": I think they've got to start making a different kind of an argument. I don't think they're going to get those 60 votes anytime soon.
PILGRIM: Yes.
LOUIS: There's a guns versus butter argument that I'm surprised has not been brought up. I mean, we have a devastated major American city, New Orleans, that's just sitting there in need of billions of dollars.
There's a housing crisis. There's an insurance crisis. Things that really cost a lot of money.
And the spending packages that are being sent up to the Hill are very, very high. And we know that the public wants out of this war. The Democrats have got to show some leadership, I think, and point to a way out.
ED ROLLINS, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: I think the Democrats wanted to show a quick fix, or at least a quick show of strength. And obviously, with the Senate being as close as it is, they weren't able to do that.
I think the view of this six or nine months is down the road before they're going to be able to control some of the funding, which is at the appropriation process, probably does slow it down a little bit and give some time.
The president is going to get his way in the short run here and, hopefully, some progress is made. If there's no progress made in the next six, nine months the country is going to lose more and more support, and without the support, it's not worth staying there.
PILGRIM: You know, Nancy Pelosi was on "LARRY KING" last night. Let's take a listen on what she said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PELOSI: I think he is receiving advice that is wrong, has been from the start. I think they thought when they went in the first day, that it was going to end in one strike.
They did not know what they were getting into. They do not know the damage that they have caused. And I think his judgment is severely impaired on this war with all due respect to the president and his good intentions.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PILGRIM: Harsh words, hindsight a little bit, too, right?
ZIMMERMAN: Also reality. Remember it was Vice President Cheney who attacked John McCain personally last week. Last week he also attacked Speaker Nancy Pelosi. Attacked -- really attacked her patriotism because she proposed alternative strategies in Iraq.
And I think that Pelosi is showing leadership by really -- by not just taking on the administration but by trying to provide alternative strategies. And I think that's really the mission of the Democratic Congress to respond to the message of the message of 2006 and to hold the Republicans who refuse to stand with them accountable.
PILGRIM: Let's listen to something else she said along that point.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PELOSI: That we need a new direction and we have proposed to him what shaped -- what form that new direction could take. But we'll not say to our troops, "You're over there, you're cut off."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PILGRIM: But yet there seems to be such indecision on Capitol Hill.
LOUIS: Well, sure, I mean, how do you show a new direction that doesn't involve getting those troops out of there? The Pelosi position, I think, is going to be, for the short term, as Ed suggested. It's something you can kind of get away with. But in the long term it's not a strategy. I think also the word impaired, in some ways it's just a euphemism. It's really being kind. This is an administration that's said it knew what it was doing, meant what it was doing, happened to be wrong and is losing on the ground in many ways.
But I don't think that they went in there blind. I think they went in and didn't turn out the way they wanted.
ROLLINS: In fairness to the administration and to the military, they did go in and topple him quickly. They did basically put in a government that hasn't necessarily worked. And I don't think -- I think that a lot of mistakes were made along the way.
But if they just would have gone in, toppled him, put a Constitution in place and walked away, you know, you'd still have all of the chaos that's there. We're trying to straighten out and trying to basically create a stabilized position. And I think to a certain extent that's where we're paying a very, very heavy price.
In no way, shape or form say there weren't mistakes, but I predict that Democrats would have done it or Nancy Pelosi would have been president, the same kinds of difficulties in this thing would have still occurred.
PILGRIM: The problems are systemic. Let's look at domestic politics, so much fun all the time. And Democratics' choice for nominee of 2008. And we always have these polls. And right now we have Hillary Clinton up 36 percent; Barack Obama, 24 percent; Al Gore 14 and John Edwards 12.
We do these polls every -- let's do Republicans together. Republicans. Rudy Giuliani, 44; John McCain, 21; New Gingrich 15 and Mitt Romney 4 percent.
Any thoughts on the current lineup?
ROLLINS: The critical thing here is Giuliani has really become the front-runner by polls in every other measurement at this point in time. And I think McCain, who had been the front runner for a year has faltered, and the guy who really has not stepped up to the plate is Romney.
And I think that people took a look. I didn't quite find him satisfactory and I think the amazing thing is the Washington establishment that backed McCain underestimated a power that Rudy's leadership and heroism has across the country.
LOUIS: You've got to wonder what Al Gore's doing in there. The man says he doesn't plan to be a candidate for any public office ever again in life. But there he is. And polling surprisingly well for a guy who doesn't want to run.
AT the same time, you've got front runners who are, I think, given the nature of the primary schedule with these big states all moving up earlier and earlier, star power's going to account for much more than it usually does in the primary process, for better or worse.
ZIMMERMAN: I think it's premature. I would never underestimate the great primary caucus -- primary participants in Iowa, Nevada and New Hampshire. The early caucuses in Iowa and Nevada always have an impact. New Hampshire creates great momentum. Now Errol's point is well taken, that in fact, the big states, come on the heels of New Hampshire. That changes the dynamic of it.
PILGRIM: And it might be just a rush at that point.
ZIMMERMAN: Or New Hampshire -- that's the Rollins theory, which I think bears a lot of review, is that New Hampshire might move right ahead.
PILGRIM: You know, we're almost out of time, but one of the interesting things is the sort of change in Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton. Back in December/January, Barack Obama had 20 percent, Hillary Clinton had 60 percent of the black vote. Now Barack Obama has 44 percent and Hillary Clinton has 33 percent. Quite a shift there. What's going on? Any thoughts?
ROLLINS: Numbers are small. I think the reality whenever you're taking 8 or 10 percent of the population, it's hard to measure that.
Certainly, there's a momentum going to him. And I think people are taking him as a very serious candidate. And certainly African- American communities take him as a very serious candidate. But I don't -- I don't think you can sit here and say all of a sudden, every -- every black voter is now moving away from Hillary.
PILGRIM: Too early.
ZIMMERMAN: Also, it's always a mistake to assume the African- American community, like any community, votes as a monolith. They don't. And I think this is great that there is such strong competition for the African-American vote. It helps the process.
LOUIS: And clearly Obama is going to do extremely well as people find out who he is. I think the early polls where Clinton was ahead reflected not so much a black/white thing but just the fact that Obama was not a known quantity.
PILGRIM: Yes, name recognition. All right. Ed Rollins, Robert Zimmerman, Errol Louis, thank you very much.
And still ahead, the results of tonight's poll and your thoughts.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PILGRIM: Ninety-eight percent of you agree with Congressman Dana Rohrabacher, who said that the U.S. attorney, Johnny Sutton, lied in the trial of border agents Ramos and Compean.
Thanks for being with us tonight. "THE SITUATION ROOM" starts right now with Wolf Blitzer.
BLITZER: Thanks, Kitty.
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