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Nancy Grace
Dismembered Wife`s Husbands Found, Charged With Murder
Aired March 05, 2007 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Tonight, breaking news. After weeks of suspicions and massive manhunts, a torso believed to be that of 34-year-old Tara Grant has been discovered, police braving sub-zero temps to conduct the search by foot, by tracker dog, even snowmobile to track a killer.
And tonight: Pot for tots? Caught on videotape, the story emerges out of Texas, toddlers ages 2 and 5, barely walking, and smoking marijuana and getting high on video. Fort Worth police stunned. The two toddlers repeatedly stumble and fall to the ground. Where is Mommy during all of this? Can you say foster care?
And also tonight, fitness superstar Richard Simmons not only fights fat, but now he`s fighting for children on Capitol Hill. Work it, Simmons!
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. Here we go.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Chatoria (ph) says she first saw the video on TV and couldn`t believe her brother, 17-year-old Demetris McCoy, and his buddy, 18-year-old Vanswan Polty, would teach or force her children to smoke pot. McCoy`s great-grandmother couldn`t believe the video she first saw on TV.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It was really shocking, you know, because I didn`t know what to think. I didn`t know what was going through his mind to do that.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`ve never seen anything like this, quite so disturbing. Our children count on us to protect them. These individuals did everything but protect those children. They have scarred them, and it`s (INAUDIBLE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening, everybody. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us tonight. First, murder in Michigan.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We were very confident that Mr. Stephen Grant was the number one and the only suspect in this particular case, and the one that`s going to be accountable for the murder of Tara Lynn Grant.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Should you be a suspect in this investigation?
STEPHEN GRANT, HUSBAND OF MISSING WOMAN: I don`t know. They have to look at me, and I understand that. I`m sure there`s a lot of suspects in the case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For at least eight hours, he evaded a massive search effort through an extremely rural section of the Lake Michigan shoreline appropriately called Wilderness State Park.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We could find places (INAUDIBLE) we could follow the tracks (INAUDIBLE) see where he`d lay down, get up and run again, lay down, get up and run (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was forthcoming with a lot of information and very detailed in his descriptions of exactly what took place. And he did indicate exactly the method in which he caused her death, how he actually dismembered her body, and that he did, in fact, take her out (INAUDIBLE) out by Stony Creek (ph) and discarded the body itself. He went out back to that area prior to us searching and retrieved that particular body part.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) torso?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Correct.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was a Ziploc bag found in the wooded area not far from the defendant`s home which contained latex gloves, baggies, metal shavings and human blood.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, he`s currently charged with open (ph) murder, which encompasses first-degree murder, as well.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: The torso of 34-year-old Tara Grant has been discovered. This is after weeks of suspicion and one of the biggest manhunts in Michigan history.
Straight out to Mitch Hotts with "The Macomb Daily." Mitch, what happened?
MITCH HOTTS, "MACOMB DAILY": Well, Steve Grant disappeared Friday night from his home in Washington township in suburban Detroit, as police were searching his home. They later discovered the torso, the mutilated remains of his wife in the garage. Steve took off that night, led police on a chase through upper Michigan, the northern end of the lower peninsula, where he was later found without shoes or a coat in 14-degree weather, and was finally taken into custody. And this morning, he did make a statement of responsibility in his wife`s death.
GRACE: Let`s take it from the very beginning, Jean Casarez. What happened at the beginning?
JEAN CASAREZ, COURT TV: At the very beginning, he reported his wife missing on February 14. And now at the end of the week, a search warrant was executed on the home. He then left in a pickup truck, drove about 225 miles. At 6:30 in the morning yesterday, he was discovered because law enforcement helicopters found his footprints, and there he was in a shirt and pants and socks in 14-degree weather. Meanwhile, that`s when the torso was found in the garage of his home.
GRACE: To clinical psychologist Dr. Andrea Macari. Andrea, first of all, the guy has been formally charged right now. But my question to you is, in addition to killing, dismembering -- what does that say psychologically?
ANDREA MACARI, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, it`s all about power and control and dehumanizing her. Think, he views her not as a living soul with hopes and dreams but rather a pile of body parts. And also, this is going to help him in terms of separating himself from the crime that he committed. He`s able to emotionally detach if he looks and just sees an arm and a leg and not her full person.
GRACE: OK. Let`s unleash the lawyers. Joining me, Jason Oshins out of the New York jurisdiction, high-profile lawyer Anne Bremner out of the Seattle jurisdiction.
Elizabeth, did I just see the defendant in a wheelchair? Can I see that again, please? Then he stands up and gets in the paddy wagon. Why is he being rolled around in a wheelchair?
Anne Bremner, why is he getting the star treatment? There`s nothing wrong with him.
ANNE BREMNER, TRIAL ATTORNEY: Well, he had hypothermia, Nancy. He was out in 14-degree weather with just -- just in his -- with nothing really on. And the fact is, he was hospitalized. This is a serious condition. And just because he`s accused of something doesn`t mean he`s not entitled to medical care.
GRACE: Excuse me. Do you not see him stand up and get into the paddy wagon?
BREMNER: Well, I don`t have a monitor right here, Nancy. But if he`s standing up, then it may not be -- he might not...
(CROSSTALK)
BREMNER: ... may not be as limited. But the fact is, is that, you know, here`s somebody that we -- I have serious issues about whether or not he even had the capacity to come in and give a statement, given his condition.
GRACE: I`m supposed to feel sorry...
BREMNER: It`s serious.
GRACE: ... for him because after he kills and dismembers his wife, they find the torso in the home...
BREMNER: That`s so creepy!
GRACE: I`m supposed to feel bad because he goes on a run through the snow without his shoes on.
BREMNER: Well, no. But the fact is, Nancy, he`s entitled to medical care. And as you know, as I know, there`s a search warrant issue in this case and also an issue with respect to his confession at this point. That`s just...
GRACE: Oh, really?
BREMNER: As a defense attorney-...
GRACE: And what would that be, Jason Oshins? What`s the search warrant issue?
JASON OSHINS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, that`s -- that`s really going to be the crux of this case, is whether or not the -- the local prosecutor and the police had enough evidence to obtain that search warrant that the judge signed. And obviously, that`s, you know, the fruit from the poisonous tree. If you can knock out that search warrant, you could potentially blow up this case.
GRACE: Wa-wa-wa-wait, wa-wait! They find the woman`s torso. Don`t you people get it? There`s not a head or legs attached!
OSHINS: Well, I don`t think that`s the exact timeline on that. I think first they obtained the search warrant, they found some parts -- body parts in the garage, and then from there in conducting their search, obviously, they found more body parts, but...
GRACE: Let me jog your respective memories. Think back to law school, the theory called "inevitable discovery."
BREMNER: But Nancy, on that, the fact is, the search warrant was based on a Ziploc bag that had some body parts and human blood and something from a tool and die store, but it was never connected to this suspect. They go in the house, and then they get the torso. And so it`s not inevitable discovery because they had no basis to go in absent a legitimate search warrant as an exception to the 4th Amendment...
GRACE: Hold on.
BREMNER: ... to get in there with a warrant. So you know, there`s an issue there.
OSHINS: Thank you, Anne.
BREMNER: Thanks. My pleasure!
GRACE: Let`s get the facts, Jean.
CASAREZ: Anne is right. They found a Ziploc bag in the wooded area near the home. It had plastic gloves, plastic bags, blood intermingled on them, and metal shavings from a tool and die shop. And guess what? He works at a tool and die shop.
GRACE: And you were saying, Jason Oshins?
OSHINS: Yes, but -- but...
GRACE: But, but, but, but...
OSHINS: Nancy, what we`re talking about...
GRACE: ... but, but, but what?
OSHINS: ... is directly connecting it to him. Listen, this is going to be the only chance, or the best chance, I think the defense has. And you`ve got to go full-bore to try and knock out that search warrant.
GRACE: Let`s take a listen to what he said earlier. Roll the video, Liz.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police still say that you are not a suspect in this case. Do you feel that you are not a suspect in this investigation?
GRANT: I have no idea. I mean, I know what I was told on the night of the 14th, and that`s all (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Should you be a suspect in this investigation?
GRANT: I don`t know. I mean, they have to look at me, and I understand that. I`m sure there`s a lot of suspects in the case.
Tara knows of my relationship with the woman that sent those e-mails. It`s not a relationship that`s untoward or anything like that. It`s simply a very old friendship.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Well, as I recall -- out to you, criminal profiler Pat Brown - - the friendship is a woman who appeared on line with which he said he wanted to get naked.
PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER: Oh, yes, Nancy.
GRACE: That doesn`t seem like an old family friend to me.
BROWN: Well, I don`t know that she wasn`t an old family friend, but he didn`t look at her that way. And he was using actually sex predator language with her. He said he wanted to give -- he wanted a sponge bath from her because she was a nurse, and he wanted her to do a naked photo session. Well, I`ve been on line pretending to be a younger person than I am, and sex predators would use those exact lines with me. So my guess is, back on that home computer, he`s been out there getting lots of porn and going on line and trying to get his little sex rendezvous. So he`s got a lot more going on than just his claim that he was upset with his wife.
GRACE: Let`s go out to the lines. Jill in Florida. Hi, Jill. Jill, are you with me?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, I am. I`m sorry.
GRACE: Hi, dear. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I just had a really quick question -- yes, I am.
GRACE: What`s your question, dear?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, OK. Really quick. They stopped him -- they stopped the husband a few weeks ago, and he said, I know you`re stopping me for my wife. I`m just trying to figure out why they didn`t pursue him a lot sooner than that.
GRACE: Good question. Out to you, Mitch Hotts from "Macomb Daily." What can you tell us?
HOTTS: They had no reason at that point to keep Mr. Grant in custody. At that point, Nancy, he was being arrested because he had outstanding traffic offenses. He lacked a valid driver`s license. They took him into custody. He did make those statements about his wife, but they just legally could not hold him at that point.
GRACE: Out to the lines. Let`s go to Julie. Hi, Julie.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy.
GRACE: What`s your question, dear?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My question is, I`m wondering if the two small children were home when this took place.
GRACE: Joining me right now, I`m hearing in my ear, is the -- from Macomb County sheriff`s department, Sheriff Mark Hackel. Sheriff, thank you for being with us.
SHERIFF MARK HACKEL, MACOMB COUNTY, MICHIGAN: Thanks, Nancy. Thanks for covering the case early on, too.
GRACE: You know, I only wish, Sheriff, that we could have made a difference and possibly found her while she was alive. That may have been impossible. What is your theory tonight as to how this went down?
HACKEL: Again, we had all hopes that -- early on, when we were given the information or tasked to find Tara Grant, and we were very hopeful that she just left for the time being and, you know, just needed some time away and that she was actually a willing participant in leaving the family situation here.
But that turned on us as time went on. We started to recognize, obviously, there`s something -- something going on here. There was some kind of a problem with the husband. He is not involved in this process of trying to locate her, and in fact, right after he obtained his attorney, the day after he brought this to our attention, wanted no contact with us and would not provide us any information on her whereabouts.
GRACE: Now, when was the day he quit cooperating?
HACKEL: He came in Valentine`s Day, February 14, to make the report at 10:00 o`clock in the morning, walked out of our facility, and our detectives quickly looked at the information that he provided us thought, We need more information, asked to come out to the house to interview him further about the missing person, that being his wife. And he gave very basic information. They had an argument, that she had decided to leave, went down the street and got into a black car, which we obviously made a determination there was no such black car. But at the time, we`re trying to work off of this information, thinking there is still a possibility she may have left willingly.
And as time went on, obviously, we realized that very next day, he got an attorney and would absolutely have no contact with us whatsoever in providing us any information in this particular case.
GRACE: Sheriff Mark Hackel is with us from the Macomb County sheriff`s department. Sheriff, do you ever blame yourself and think, Oh, if I could have just gotten her sooner, maybe I could have saved her life? If I had done A, if I had done B, there would have been a different outcome?
HACKEL: No, there`s no question about it. The day she came home from San Juan, Puerto Rico, February 9, is the day that he actually committed this murder. And he even -- he confessed to that just last night to us. We were very certain of the fact that she was deceased or she was dead, and he murdered her February 9 and didn`t report her for five days. He actually reported it on the 14th of February. So we`re confident he had killed her prior to actually coming in and reporting that to us.
GRACE: You know what? I think you`re absolutely right. The fact that no one had seen her after that evening seemed to suggest that is the day that foul play went down.
And joining us right now is a very special guest. This is Alicia Standerfer. This is Tara`s sister. She`s joined us several times to speak out on behalf of her sister. Thank you for being with us tonight.
ALICIA STANDERFER, MURDERED WOMAN`S SISTER: Thank you for having me, Nancy.
GRACE: Alicia, at the very beginning, you knew, you stated publicly, no way is she gone on a vacation for alone time. Why were you so convinced?
STANDERFER: I was convinced for two simple reasons. My sister, in 12 years of working for the corporation that she worked for, she never missed a day of work, Nancy, not one day in 12 years. And the other reason is because every single time that she had to travel for work, she called her children at least one time a day, if not more often. Those two things convinced me that she did not leave her house on her own free will.
GRACE: Alicia, when you hear about his hospital treatment and that he gave this statement, how does that make you feel? What is your reaction?
STANDERFER: I`m sorry. I didn`t hear everything you said. I apologize.
GRACE: I`ll start at the beginning. When you heard about this statement that he gave the sheriffs, what is your reaction?
STANDERFER: His confession statement?
GRACE: Yes.
STANDERFER: I was just blown away. First of all, the fact that, you know, throughout this whole process, he never, ever wanted to talk to, you know, the police. He did want to talk to the media, but he never wanted to talk to the police. And then all of a sudden, after he`s been apprehended, now all of a sudden, he wants to talk. I was absolutely blown away, as was my entire family.
GRACE: Sheriff Hackel, is that true, he would speak to the media but not to the police?
HACKEL: Well, we recognized it early on, so we encouraged that -- in other words, even through his attorney, who was not very pleased with us, I guess, in our investigation, and actually admitted that we were being too aggressive in this particular case. And again, I`ve never been accused of being aggressive in going after a missing person before. And that was stated early on, that he was very protective of his client. His client was very protective. And even Stephen Grant himself portrayed himself more as a victim in this case right from the early onset, as opposed to somebody who was missing his wife, or obviously, the mother of his children.
So as this case progressed, we started recognizing there was a concern with this guy, and to find out that, actually, after he talked to the media for so long, now all of a sudden wanted to talk to us after his apprehension, we were very -- we were very glad that he finally laid it out for us exactly what he did. But we already had the evidence in place. And again, there was no question about it. His statements coincide with the evidence we have in this case, and there is no question in our mind he is the person that actually committed this murder.
GRACE: How, Sheriff, did he portray himself as the victim?
HACKEL: Well, he kept saying that we were picking on him. On our traffic stop, it was a pretext stop. When we went to the house to go talk to him, to follow up on the actual complaint of a missing person, we were being too aggressive in our questioning. And he even said to the detective, as the detective was ready to leave, You suspect that I`m going to be considered a suspect in this case? And the detective says, Well, sometimes I guess that does happen, husbands are looked at. He said, Do you think I need an attorney? And the investigator says, If you think you`re guilty of something or you did something wrong, maybe you should get an attorney.
And the very next day, he did. And from that day forward, he claimed that he was the number one suspect, when we never said that. And it was very surprising that he would say that publicly or to the media. And a lot of the information -- we encouraged him to talk more to the media, since he wasn`t talking to us, had a lot of contradiction in statements while he was talking to the media, as opposed to the things he had told us early on in this investigation.
GRACE: Very quickly out to Susie in Michigan. Hi, Susie.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hey.
GRACE: What`s your question, dear?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We were just wondering what kind of parental rights he has now? Can he contact the children at all or anything like that?
GRACE: Good question. Alicia, is he in contact with the children? Alicia, are you with me? Is he in contact with...
STANDERFER: Yes, I`m here.
GRACE: Is he in contact with the children?
STANDERFER: No, he is not.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We were very confident that Mr. Stephen Grant was the number one and the only suspect (INAUDIBLE) case, and the one that`s going to be accountable for the murder of Tara Lynn Grant. He did indicate exactly the method of which he caused her death, how he actually dismembered her body, and that he did, in fact, take her out in a fielded area out by Stony Creek and discarded the body itself.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s presumed innocent at the time. We intend on going through and bringing this man to justice.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Police search for a killer by foot, even by snowmobile, even using tracker dogs through thick snow in Michigan. Tonight, a man behind bars for the murder and dismemberment of a 34-year-old mother of two. The torso of Tara Grant has been discovered.
Out to the lines. Jack in Oklahoma. Hi, Jack.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hello.
GRACE: Hi, dear. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was wondering how Michigan stood as far as capital punishment?
GRACE: Well, I`ve got some bad news for you, Jack. No DP in Michigan. Correct me if I`m wrong, Sheriff Hackel. Isn`t that correct?
HACKEL: That is correct. It`s life without parole, in this particular case, for first degree. But you`re absolutely right. There is no death penalty here in the state.
GRACE: So no matter how many people you kill, no DP in Michigan.
HACKEL: Yes. Again, that`s something that has to be passed through the legislature. And you know, although my personal feelings might differ, for the most part right now, there is no death penalty.
GRACE: Sheriff, I don`t blame you.
Let`s go out to Dr. Daniel Spitz. He`s the Macomb County medical examiner. He`s a friend of this show, an expert, renowned expert in his field. Dr. Spitz, thank you for being with us.
DR. DANIEL SPITZ, MACOMB COUNTY MEDICAL EXAMINER: Thank you.
GRACE: You performed this autopsy. You looked at this body. What did you find?
SPITZ: Well, I originally saw the torso when I went out to the Grant home on Friday evening. And we did a preliminary exam there. That was followed up with an autopsy the following day. That autopsy identified really no significant -- well, some degrees of trauma, but nothing as far as the cause of death. The additional remains that were found in the nearby park was what led to the conclusion that Tara Lynn Grant was, in fact, strangled and that she had other blunt injuries to the head and face indicative of an altercation that preceded the actual strangulation.
GRACE: Dr. Spitz, the body parts being in the snow, did that actually aid you in determining cause of death -- COD.?
SPITZ: Yes, the fact that her body was in a cold environment outside was very helpful. It preserved the remains and allowed me to determine cause and manner of death.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think he had a lot of people fooled. I think he had a lot of people fooled as to, you know, whether or not he actually committed the crime. And again, I watched him on the news. I listened to people, you know, their friends and family, relatives talking about it. I still think there`s a lot of people that maybe just don`t -- even though they`re convinced that he did commit the crime, they still just can`t believe it, based on what they knew about him.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: After a massive manhunt by Michigan police, finally, a man behind bars. And the torso of Tara Grant has been found.
Out to Melissa in Texas. Hi, Melissa.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. How`re you doing?
GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You know, I had read and heard from reports that he had dropped the dogs and the kids off at his sister`s house...
GRACE: I`ll find out.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... and took off.
GRACE: Is that true, Mitch Hotts?
HOTTS: The police were searching the house Friday evening. They had their eyes on him. At some point, he took the family dog, walked to a neighbor`s house, convinced the neighbor to drive him over to his sister`s, where the children were. He left the dog. He said farewell, or he had some greeting with the children, and then departed.
GRACE: Mitch Hotts joining us from "The Macomb Daily."
And to Dr. Spitz. So I understand, then, are you saying it was blunt trauma you believe is the cause of death, or strangulation?
SPITZ: No. Clearly, the cause of death is strangulation. What I was saying is that there are other injuries to the remains that are indicative of an altercation that took place during, or maybe preceding the strangulation.
GRACE: Jean, tomorrow?
CASAREZ: Formal arraignment. He is now being charged with first- degree murder and dismemberment of a corpse.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED CORRESPONDENT: This home video shows a two and a four- year-old boy smoking pot in the living room of their great grandparents in Wintaga (ph), while their mother Shatoria Russell (ph) was asleep in her room with a toothache. Shatoria says she first saw the video on TV and couldn`t believe her brother, 17-year-old Demetris McCoy and his buddy, 18- year-old Vanswan Polty (ph) would teach or force her children to smoke pot.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED POLICEMAN: He`s inhaling. And this isn`t the first time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Fort Worth police are stunned. What does she mean, she can`t believe they gave her children pot? She was right there in the home. I can`t believe she`s not behind bars tonight. They`re her children, ages two and five. They`re the ones with the big pat doobie in their mouth, on video. Out to Melissa Vargas with the "Fort Worth Star Telegram." What happened?
MELISSA VARGAS, REPORTER, "FT. WORTH STAR TELEGRAM": Police were at the home of Demetris McCoy to serve a search warrant when they found the digital camera that had the video of the kids smoking pot.
GRACE: Take a listen to what the mother had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was hurt. I can`t believe that my brother did that. It was wrong. He shouldn`t have gave them whatever he gave them.
QUESTION: Are you angry?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, I am. But I don`t think he should do hard time. I think he should be like on probation or something like that. I don`t think he should have to stay years and years away. Yes, I was in the room, because my tooth and stuff, it was hurting. I had take my (INAUDIBLE) when I take them, I sleep. I didn`t know what was going on, because I was sleeping. It wasn`t my fault, and I think my kids should be here with me (INAUDIBLE).
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: I`ve got to go to the control room. Elizabeth, did I just hear, I think he should have probation or something? Did she just say that?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think that`s what she said, Nancy.
GRACE: This is a mother who`s asleep. Asleep in the back, while her -- there they are. Her children have two big fat doobies rolled up and are smoking them. One child two, one child five. If you keep watching the video, they begin stumbling and falling down. And in fact, you can hear the adults say, pass the weed. He wants it, talking about the two-year- old. And to you, Trenny Stovall child custody advocate. The mom says, I don`t want him to go to jail for it. Why isn`t she in jail?
TRENNY STOVALL, CHILD CUSTODY ADVOCATE: That`s exactly my question. I don`t know if I can say this, but I am really pissed about this. This is ridiculous. She shouldn`t be responsible, her brother shouldn`t be responsible, like they say in the movies, somebody needs to go to jail for this. These children were endangered. She`s a parent. This is called neglect.
GRACE: Right there, in the home, a two-year-old and a five-year-old being videoed -- did you see that blunt? This thing looks like about five inches long. Jean, give me some more facts.
JEAN CASAREZ, CORRESPONDENT, COURT TV: First of all, two people are in jail right now, a 17-year-old who is the uncle of the children and an 18- year-old Vanswan Polty, who was the one that was participating in it all. They are being held on $150,000 bail. They have both been charged with injury to a child. Now, counts are speculative, though, against the mother at this point. And also, the person operating the camera. Somebody was shooting those pictures. They think a 16-year-old.
GRACE: Jean, I`m getting corrected in my ear by dean. It`s a 2- year-old and a four-year-old. A 2-year-old and a four-year-old, out to the lines. Kathy in Tennessee, hi, Kathy.
CALLER: Hi, Nancy. Love your show. I was wondering how much time do you think that they will give to these -- they`re over 18, right?
GRACE: Yes. One is -- how old are they, Jean?
CASAREZ: One is 17 years old and one is 18. And they`re facing 10 years, maximum.
GRACE: Out to Dr. Jennifer Shu, pediatrician and co-author of "Baby and Child Health." Look at this. It`s a huge blunt this baby has, two and four years old. What can that do to a child, Dr. Shu?
DR. JENNIFER SHU, PEDIATRICIAN, CO-AUTHOR OF BABY AND CHILD HEALTH: Right away, Nancy, it can make you feel dizzy and giddy. As you can see, they`re laughing. It can also impair your memory and the way kids learn. It can affect their behavior, causing depression, anxiety, and personality changes later on down the road. It`s smoking, inhaling a substance contains carcinogens, just like tobacco. So there`s tar, there`s carbon monoxide and other items in there, so that can irritate the lungs, cause couching, bronchitis, trigger asthma and later on down the road, with a lot of use, it might lead to lung cancer.
GRACE: Here`s what police had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED POLICEMAN: On the videos, we found disturbing images. There was videotape of a session where these two males were providing marijuana to a two-year-old and a five-year-old. And they were essentially trying to get them high. They`re laughing. The children are stumbling, they`re falling down. They`re significantly impaired. It was just horrible video. The young child, the two-year-old, he`s got this hoarse cough. He`s holding the blunt, what they call the blunt, he`s holding it like he`s done it before. He`s inhaling. And this isn`t the first time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Elizabeth, let`s take a look at that again. It was hard for me to believe that you would video -- happen to have a video camera the first time this happened. And you see the child, look at that. He breathes it and holds it in. Can you see that, Jean?
CASAREZ: Yeah. Yeah. And you know what I think is interesting here is that they discovered this tape, it was a fluke, because they had executed a search warrant, because they thought stolen property was in the home. And they took this tape and they just happened to look at it.
GRACE: Let`s go out to Marissa Gonzalez, spokesperson for the child protective services there in Texas. I guess you`re spinning like a top tonight.
MARISSA GONZALEZ, SPOKESPERSON, CHILD PROTECTIVE SERVICES: I sure have been.
GRACE: What do you think they should face and what about charges for the mother?
GONZALEZ: You know, I don`t know about criminal charges, because we don`t deal with that aspect of it. But I do know this is definitely not a safe place for these children.
GRACE: And where are they tonight?
GONZALEZ: The children are in foster care tonight. But we will be looking for appropriate family members to care for them.
GRACE: With this particular case, have there ever been any problems before in the home?
GONZALEZ: No. We`ve never been involved with the family before.
GRACE: Did all of these people live in the home, Marissa?
GONZALEZ: That`s my understanding, that these two young men and the two little boys, their mother and the great-grandmother.
GRACE: Did anybody have a job?
GONZALEZ: I don`t know. I believe the great grandmother says she was working at the time that this incident happened.
GRACE: I notice it`s broad daylight, and everybody`s either home smoking dope or they`re asleep. I`m very concerned. Out to Anne Bremner, Jason Oshins. First to you, Anne Bremner, what`s the defense?
ANNE BREMNER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: The first defense would be to attack the search warrant like we`ve talked about in the prior segment, if there`s a basis, or the search wouldn`t be on the scope of what was described in the warrant. Beyond that, this is like reefer madness. Are they going to say at least we didn`t give them crack, at least we didn`t give them meth? I mean the fact is that at least you have one that`s a juvenile still, reckless use, misspent youth, you know, basically that this was something that was really stupid to do in terms of sentencing.
GRACE: Your defense is it was stupid? Not going to work. Jason Oshins, what about a charge against the mother?
JASON OSHINS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Investigators got to look to see if this is the first time. You can clearly see these youngsters holding that in what would be the proper form of holding that marijuana cigarette. So obviously you want to look into the more details of that, and listen, properly the children are with protective custody. Clearly she herself is a very young girl. And that environment, you don`t want those children there.
GRACE: I guess not. But are you telling me you don`t think criminal charges are appropriate?
OSHINS: Well, if it`s only this isolated incident, Nancy, then obviously it`s --
GRACE: Hey, those two kids were no stranger to a blunt. Out to the lines -- what? Quickly.
OSHINS: The issue is, Nancy, had she seen it before?
GRACE: OK. It`s right down the hall. How could you not know? Fred in California. Hi, Fred.
CALLER: Hi, how are you doing?
GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?
CALLER: I wanted to find out, was the mother had anything to do with doing the filming of that tape?
GRACE: Good question. Out to you, Melissa Vargas. Did she?
VARGAS: Police have said that -- well I`m sorry, not police, her sister has said, no, she was in her room sleeping. So that`s all I know.
GRACE: How she slept through all that. To Melan (ph) in Iowa. Hi Melan.
CALLER: Hi Nancy. I was just wondering if those kids are going to be taken away from the mother?
GRACE: They`re in foster care tonight. Do you think it will be permanent, Trenny?
STOVALL: The mother has a chance of getting the kids back. But she`s going to have to show improved. This is neglectful behavior. She had a responsibility to make sure that her children were in proper care and she did not. Those teens should not have been in the care - those babies should not have been in the case of those teenagers.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
RICHELLE CAREY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hello I`m Richelle Carey and here`s your "headline prime" newsbreak.
A disgruntled employee is dead after opening fire at a printing plant in Signalville (ph), California. The man shot three coworkers before turning the gun on himself. His victims are seriously injured. Officials say the man was upset that his hours were cut at that plant.
At least 38 people were killed in attacks in Iraq Monday. The worst violence was in downtown Baghdad where 28 people died when a suicide car bomber destroyed a book market. Another nine people were killed when insurgents launched attacks on Shiite pilgrims headed to the holy city of Karbala.
If you`ve been stuck on an airplane recently waiting to take off? You`re not alone. A government report finds passengers of more than 7,000 flights last year spent two to five hours waiting on the tarmac. Recent complaints are prompting congressional hearings and talk of a Federal law that would limit that wait time.
That`s the news for now. Keep it here. I`m Richelle Carey.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED CORRESPONDENT: I know you`re also a huge fan of television. You enjoy watching television. Do you watch the Nancy Grace program here an "headline prime"?
RICHARD SIMMONS: You better stop it right now.
UNIDENTIFIED CORRESPONDENT: She happens to be a big Richard Simmons --
SIMMONS: You better stop it right now. Don`t do this.
UNIDENTIFIED CORRESPONDENT: Richard Simmons, we would like to introduce you to --
SIMMONS: No, I can`t. Oh, no. Please. No.
UNIDENTIFIED CORRESPONDENT: Welcome to the program.
SIMMONS: Oh, my God! Oh, my God! Oh, my God! Hi. You`re so teeny. Oh, my God!
GRACE: I have to tell a story about you.
SIMMONS: Oh, my God, she`s sitting next to me. I thought I would never meet her because I never committed a crime.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: One of the highlights of my career. We all know Richard Simmons fights fat. But that`s not all. And I`ve got to tell you what he`s doing. He`s fighting Capitol Hill for children. I am so proud of somebody willing to fight and make a difference in this world. Out to my friend and colleague, Richard Simmons. What are you doing on Capitol Hill?
SIMMONS: Well, Nancy, about a year ago, somebody asked me what my legacy is. And I said one thing I want to do while on this earth is to get our children more fit. There are so many schools in the United States that have no PE. Some have it once a day for 15 minutes and this is just wrong. Our kids are overweight. They`re out of shape. They`re diabetic. They`re taking medication for antidepressants. So what I did was I created a questionnaire on my website, richardsimmons.com, a questionnaire that you could fill out if you were a parent, a teacher, a superintendent. I collected almost 60,000 that everybody around the country sent in to me. I went to Capitol Hill last week and I met with Representatives Wamp, Kildee, Kind and chairperson George Miller.
I said, we have to get PE back in the school system and we have to do it now or our kids will get more overweight, more depressed, more out of shape and may not live long enough than their parents are living. So I went there, I met with everybody, I got to take the tour, I got to meet with these representatives, and we have a bill. It`s called H.R. 1224. And it`s strengthening physical education. I want this in the no child left behind act. And the vote`s coming up in May. Right now on my website, richardsimmons.com, you can find the name of your congressman, a letter that we wrote that you can send to the congressmen, and now I`m going to lobby this bill until every child in the United States has fitness in school to feel better about themselves, get their grades up, let their mind work. You know, next year, in China, Nancy, every child in China has to take 30 to 60 minutes of exercise every day. That`s what I want for this country. And I`m going to go back for a congressional hearing. And I`m going to make this happen.
GRACE: Hey, Richard, were you overweight when you were a kid?
SIMMONS: I was 200 pounds in the eighth grade. I didn`t play PE, because it was playing sports. Not everyone can play sports. If you look at a stadium, a football stadium, you have a bunch of people dressed up with helmets, then you have 50,000, 60,000 people watching. Everyone wasn`t made to play sports. My idea is, just what you and I need to work out, we need cardio strength training, and we need stretching. So there are --
GRACE: Hey, Richard, it`s not just about being overweight, and your physical health. What that does to you as a child to be the different one, the one that everybody makes fun of. That has lifetime -- hold on. To Andrea Macari. It has lifetime effects, doctor.
MACARI: Absolutely. We know about the physical effects, but the psychological effects are very global. Depression, anxiety, social withdrawal, body image issues. I have a patient right now, 13, who because of her obesity went on a diet and is now anorexic and experiencing horrible effects from it. This is a big issue. Good job, Richard.
SIMMONS: Thank you, ma`am. I have a lot of eating disorders in my life. I was rejected from PE. I was always made fun of. And then to lose weight, I took diet pills, 30 laxatives a day. I learned how to throw up. I ended up 119 pounds, anorexic and bulimic. What I`m saying, if you get rejected at school in the sports, I`m bringing in certified aerobic instructors in the schools in the United States to teach cardio, strength training and stretching but to their music, Nancy. When I go teach, I bring the Justin Timberlake, I bring the Christina Aguilera and the Rianna (ph) and Beyonce. They can`t stop moving. Our kids -- Thomas Jefferson said this, a kid that is fit learns better. And he is right. When you`re taking care of your body and you feel positive, and you feel good about yourself, then you`re going to want to study more. And that`s what I want to do.
GRACE: Another thing, it`s got to be the right kind of exercise program. It can`t be like a game of dodge ball, where a kid stands there and gets a ball thrown at their head.
SIMMONS: These are classes.
GRACE: I`m speaking from personal experience about getting the ball thrown at your head. Hold on, out to Janet in Nevada. Hi Janet.
CALLER: Hi, how are you Richard? I`ve loved you take it off with Richard button. I want one that gives way back. I just want to thank you for your positiveness and for all that you`re doing for the kids.
SIMMONS: Well, remember, you can go to richardsimmons.com and it`s right there. You just send it to your congressman. There`s a little letter. There`s a whole website. And I would ask everyone listening to get your mother, your father, your grandfather, your aunt to write the congressmen and say, we want our children fit.
GRACE: And the only way they`re going to respond, Jean Casarez, is if they think they may not get reelected. Let`s just be real about this. You have to point out you`re a constituent and you vote. Jean, I wanted to ask you about the eight -year-old that weighed 218 pounds.
CASAREZ: This is a case that just came out of England, and I wonder how Richard Simmons feels about this, an eight-year-old boy, 218 pounds. Social welfare workers actually developed a case around the mother of this. She almost lost custody. But they have reached an agreement. And I`m wondering, does he blame the mother, or is it the school system?
SIMMONS: Oh the blame, the blame game. You know, I get hundreds of e- mails every month from women who have children who are 200, 300, 400 pounds. Yes, I mean, if you have an overweight parent, the kid is going to learn, they`re a Polaroid camera, they see everything mom eats and they want to eat it. Who do we blame this on? We can`t blame it on the schools. But where the schools are, they spend a lot of time there and the kids need to get fit.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
To headline prime`s Glenn Beck. Hi, friend.
GLENN BECK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Almost since the day I started doing my show, I`ve been asking those in the Muslim community who don`t support Islamic extremism to speak out, and I would let their voices be heard nationwide. Well, tonight I`m in St. Petersburg, Florida, for a meeting of those very minds, the secular Islam summit, a diverse gathering of men and women committed to reforming and rethinking Islam for the 21st century. You`re going to hear the best of them, next.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BILL CLINTON, FMR. PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The problem with childhood obesity is worse than the part of the country where we grew up. While the rate is 16 percent nationwide, in the south it`s 20 percent, and in some southern states it`s 25 percent, partly because of the close correlation with lower incomes.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Poverty, children living in poverty. Becoming obese, and suffering for the rest of their lives. What can we do to protect our children? Richard Simmons is fighting the fight. He`s trying to make a difference. Let`s get down to the brass tacks. What can we do to help you, Richard?
SIMMONS: You have to understand, the no child left behind act that`s been around for five years pushes science, math and now reading. I want to extend it just one more topic and that is fitness. You can go on richardsimmons.com. The bill is there, House of Representatives 1224. You can fill it out, send it to your congressmen. I want to thank again Representatives Wamp, Kildee, Kind, Chairperson George Miller, all the people on Capitol Hill. I`ll be going back this month and next month to get a congressional hearing, to get our kids fit. Don`t forget about our children.
GRACE: Greg in New York, hi, Greg.
CALLER: Hi, Nancy. Good evening.
GRACE: What`s your question, dear?
CALLER: Actually, I just wanted to make a quick comment to Richard to applaud his efforts. Anything that can be done to improve our children`s self-esteem is something that really needs to be pushed. And I hope that more people support his efforts.
SIMMONS: Thank you, sir. God bless you. Thank you.
GRACE: We`ll be watching Richard Simmons.
Let`s stop to remember Army private first class, Justin Paton, 24, Lansing, Michigan killed in Iraq, a hospital tech before enlisting. He loved the outdoors. And leaves behind a grieving sister, Stormy, and brother Adam. Justin Paton, American hero.
Thank you to our guests, but most of all, to you for being with us. Nancy Grace signing off for tonight. See you tomorrow night. And until then, good night, friend.
BECK: Coming up next, the effort to reform radical Islam heats up in Florida. I`m Glenn Beck with the news and views you are not going to hear anywhere else from the secular Islam summit. Next.
CAREY: I`m Richelle Carey with your headline prime news break. Michigan authorities say Stephen Grant called them Sunday night to quote, clear his mind about killing and dismembering his wife. Macomb County sheriff says Grant also told him the couple`s two small children were home at the time.
Lorenzo Gilyard was accused of killing 13 women between 1977 and 1993. Most were prostitutes. Kansas City, Missouri authorities, say DNA evidence will tie the suspected serial killer to the crimes. Gilyard could face life in prison if convicted.
And an Indiana man and his eight year-old daughter are dead after their small plane crashed into a Bedford, Indiana house. Authorities say the house belonged to the man`s in-laws and the crash may have been intentional. No one on the ground was hurt. That`s the news for now.
END
