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CNN LARRY KING LIVE

The Secret Revealed

Aired March 8, 2007 - 21:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BOB PROCTOR, PHILOSOPHER: This is the great secret environment.

We're all working with one power.

One law -- it's attraction.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LARRY KING, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight, inside The Secret -- the phenomenon taking the country by storm. The book so in demand, it's selling out faster than they can get it back in the stores.

Can you really have it all, get whatever you want -- love, money, you name it -- by thinking about it?

Millions say yes. Some say not so fast.

What do you believe?

You're about to meet some world renowned best-selling authors and teachers who say they're so successful because they know The Secret.

They'll answer your calls and e-mails, too.

It's all next on LARRY KING LIVE.

We'll be talking with many guests tonight featured in the DVD and the book, "The Secret." It's number one everywhere. It's sweeping the world. And it's really just started that sweep.

We begin with the John Assaraf.

John, as a teenager, led the kind of life that could have earned him a life behind bars or a place on a slab in a morgue. Today, he's a "New York Times" best-selling author, the force behind a number of multi-million dollar corporations and is cofounder of OneCoach.

What is The Secret?

JOHN ASSARAF, FOUNDER, "ONECOACH," FEATURED IN "THE SECRET": The Secret is really based on something called the law of attraction. And we can go to science to understand that everything in the universe has a frequency. Everything vibrates.

And The Secret is all about making sure that you're thinking the right thoughts so that your body vibrates in the right way and so you attract what you want into your life.

KING: No disputing that it's huge. The book and the DVD are selling like hotcakes. The press is paying a lot of attention.

Here's a small sample -- watch this -- of the media blitz.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP FORM "THE OPRAH WINFREY SHOW," COURTESY HARPO PRODUCTIONS, INC.)

OPRAH WINFREY, HOST: It's making its way around the world and the buzz keeps building. It is The Secret and see why people everywhere are talking about it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP FROM "THE TODAY SHOW," COURTESY NBC)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Secret is gaining momentum. The DVD has sold more than a million copies and this month the book hit number one on the "USA Today's" best-seller list. But not everyone is sold on The Secret.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP FROM "THE EARLY SHOW," COURTESY CBS)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let's take a look at the hottest self-help program in years. It claims that we can achieve anything we want in life if we believe in it hard enough.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: Why are people, John, responding so powerfully to this?

ASSARAF: Well, I think people are resonating with it, number one, and I think you've got people on both sides of the camp -- those who believe in it and resonate with the it and those who say it's absolutely ridiculous.

And all we can go to is every time that there's a phenomenal breakthrough about to happen in mankind, there are people who take advantage of it and people who want to say this is crazy and run for the hills.

KING: Why do you think some people are so critical, though?

ASSARAF: Well, I think anything that we introduce any new information, to our brain, for example, we will actually deny it or go into a state of absolute shock. So we don't even want to be a part of it. And I think people have not done enough research. I've done research on this for over 25 years. We teach it to business owners all over the world. The other teachers do it.

We have actually used The Secret to build The Secret.

KING: Are you saying it can't miss? ASSARAF: Well, I think there's a misnomer out there, and that is that you only have to think positive thoughts. You've got to think positive thoughts, you've got to feel what those thoughts give you and then you've got to do something that very few people talk about and that's you've got to actually take action. You've got to do something...

KING: It doesn't come into your house?

ASSARAF: Absolutely not. If you wait, they'll come and take your furniture.

KING: "Newsweek" magazine did a lengthy article entitled "Decoding The Secret" and the article said, in part: "On an ethical level, The Secret appears deplorable. It concerns itself almost entirely with a narrow range of middle class concerns -- houses, cars, vacations, followed by health and relationships, with the rest of humanity a very distant sixth."

How do you react?

ASSARAF: Well, you know, it's not even worth reacting. You know, this morning when I knew that I was going to be on the show, we had about 200 of our business owners on -- on a call. And I asked them to send us an e-mail about how the secret of the law of attractions worked in their life.

Within 10 minutes, we had 57 people who e-mailed us saying here's what's happened in my life. In my business we have raised money. We've had more clients. We've had better health.

And so I've got to go to the results as opposed to what the critics are saying, because it's worked in my life and I know it works in people's lives.

KING: Does all of it deal with self? Can I want world peace?

ASSARAF: Absolutely. There's a lot of studies that will show that when people actually gather together and they focus on peace together, there's actually a decline, for example, in the Middle East peace in Lebanon. There's actual studies that show that when people get together and our brains will entrain, we'll send a powerful magnetic force into the field.

KING: An e-mail question from Jess in Winnipeg, Manitoba: "How does The Secret explain tragedies like September 11th and Katrina?"

ASSARAF: I think whenever we have tragedies like September 11th or Katrina, we have to look at the higher order of how the universe operates. Number one, the universe operates by exact precision and law. And that is something in between god and the universe.

What we have to understand is when we're looking only at the physical event, OK, we're missing something that's a much bigger organism at work, and that's the natural laws of the universe. And there are both good and there's bad in everything, in every way. So we can't just look at the one side of it. It's not a mono- dimensional universe we live in.

KING: So if you were focused, if you were into the attraction...

ASSARAF: Yes?

KING: ... but you were on the 103rd floor of the World Trade Center, that didn't mean anything?

ASSARAF: Absolutely it didn't mean anything. And what I'm not suggesting is that the people that were in the World Trade Center, which was an atrocity -- willed that upon themselves. But in the bigger scheme of how the universe operates -- if you look at every other species on Earth, we live, we die, we have birth and death. And that is just part of life. And sometimes things happen in ways that are not to our tastes and not suitable.

KING: Did you mean they willed that upon themselves?

ASSARAF: No, no, absolutely not. No, no.

KING: They did not will that?

ASSARAF: They did not will that upon themselves. But in life, in general, there are things that happen that aren't great. And we have to look at a higher order of how the universe operates, and let's go to a higher understanding, is what I'm saying.

KING: Can you use the law of attraction to harm somebody?

ASSARAF: I don't believe that you can use the law of attraction to harm somebody.

KING: Why not?

ASSARAF: Well, I think -- I think any time you are sending negative energy out from yourself, it has to come back to its original source. And so if you're starting to will negative things on people, I think that you will actually be willing things upon yourself. That is my belief.

And being grateful for what you have and really making a difference in other people's lives and doing charitable work is how you actually invoke the greatest law of the universe, which is the law of attraction.

KING: That's an Eastern philosophy, isn't it?

ASSARAF: It is.

KING: And you get what you give out?

ASSARAF: Yes. Absolutely.

KING: If you give out hate, you get back hate? ASSARAF: Absolutely. We know that we are made up of energy and we know that we can actually measure a thumb (ph), we can measure the frequency by which our brain and our heart sends out that frequency. We are just learning more about the scientific side of it. We don't have triple blind studies to really show that.

But if you think about this. If you take a seed and you plant it underneath the soil, how is that the seed will attract to it everything that it needs for the vibrational fulfillment of whatever the potential was in that seed?

It's through the law of vibration.

KING: John Assaraf will be back with us later in the program, as we investigate the concept of The Secret.

Coming up next, see if you can grasp this -- celebrating gives you more to celebrate.

According to our next guest, Lisa Nichols, it's definitely not double-speak.

Here's a preview.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, COURTESY WWW.THESECRET)

LISA NICHOLS, AUTHOR, MOTIVATIONAL SPEAKER, FEATURED IN "THE SECRET": Excitement, joy, gratitude, love -- imagine if we can feel that way every day. When you celebrate the good feelings, you'll draw to you more good feelings and things that make you feel good.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP FROM "THE TODAY SHOW," COURTESY NBC)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now there's a new self-help book and DVD that claim to know the secret to success and happiness.

PROF. ROBERT THOMPSON, SYRACUSE UNIVERSITY: The Secret promises this heaven on Earth in one fell swoop by simply desiring something, by simply wanting it. It's amazing how we really are a nation of, at best, great optimists, at worst, real suckers.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: We now welcome Lisa Nichols, a motivational speaker, advocate of personal empowerment. She's a teacher of The Secret, the law of attraction.

What do you make of what we just heard?

NICHOLS: Well, you know, Larry, it's -- it's not surprising. When we have something that breathes so much hope and so much faith into a people, you have to have those who say it can't be so. When we empower individuals to really take their own destiny in their hands, that's new. You know, as John said, it's something new, it's something hard -- a pill that's hard to swallow for some.

KING: But isn't hope something always appealing to somebody? I mean the snake oil salesman sold hope...

NICHOLS: Yes. Yes.

KING: ... take this and you'll be all right.

NICHOLS: Right. Right. Right. Absolutely.

I think that hope is something that we are deprived of, in many ways, and we come from a society that really breathes life into fear- based thinking. And so when you think possibility and creation and that I can drive my future, all of a sudden people have to say wait, whoa, whoa, we can't do quite that because we're so used to being driven, we're so used to being told how we can think.

And so when you give someone the power to design your own destiny, for some, that's just too much to digest.

KING: How did you get it?

NICHOLS: You know, I lived it. I lived it first. I didn't study quantum physics. I didn't study the background. I didn't study any of that. In my life, it was called no matter what. No matter what, born and raised in South Central, Los Angeles, having three fights a week to get home from school, you know, being labeled academically challenged, being considered poor by a lot of people. I didn't know I was poor, but society said I was.

And knowing the -- like no matter what, that I had a right to be joyful.

KING: An e-mail question from Donna in Baltimore: "How do you explain the person who wins the Lotto but says he never, ever believed he'd win versus somebody who practices the law of attraction every day to attract large sums of money, truly believes he'll receive it, who can feel it, see it passionately, but gets no results?"

What is he doing wrong?

NICHOLS: Well, the Lotto winner is lucky, period.

KING: Luck is around, too?

NICHOLS: Yes, luck is around. And some people get lucky. And, again, many of the Lotto winners -- I think 100 percent of them, actually -- you know, are in more debt than they were before they started, because they weren't prepared for that.

But the person that believes in that they'll get wealth, are they applying action to it?

You can't just believe it, you can't just sit back and think it's going to happen. You have to get up and do.

You know, on "The Secret" you see Jack Canfield visualizing a $100,000 bill on the ceiling. Well, it was in the shower, as he was getting dressed, on his way to go to work to make that happen, that he got the idea of how to create that form of wealth.

So it's not just a hokey-pokey, sprinkle fairy dust, you know, come with a magic wand concept. It is something where, when you ask the universe to give you something, you ask god to give you an idea, you have to do something with that idea.

KING: The new issue of "People" magazine has an article entitled: "The Secret: Salvation Or Hype?"

How would you answer that?

NICHOLS: You know, I believe that...

KING: Which one?

NICHOLS: I believe that -- that The Secret breathes hope. And what I do know is that in Proverbs it talks about "so a man thinketh, he is." In Matthew, it says "if you ask and you believe in your prayers, then you will receive it."

So it is, one, absolutely from the base of what god has planned for us, that we have the right to live an abundant life. That's not non-negotiable. That's a fact.

Now, if we choose to have that life, that's on us.

Now, I believe that when we choose to live a life of abundance and joy, peace, happiness, then that feels much better than if we choose to life a life in scarcity.

And you'll have doubters.

KING: You have strong Christian faith.

Does that conflict with this?

NICHOLS: No, for me it doesn't because I searched this to make sure that god was all through it. I mean, my commitment to god is stronger than anything.

KING: Let's get a call in.

Virginia Beach, Virginia, hello.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hello.

I have a question.

I have gotten the video and I've watched it and my question actually is directed at Lisa, because I noticed quite a few times on the video she said that health can be guaranteed, relationships can be guaranteed and she used the word guaranteed a lot.

And my question is what about young children?

A child who is too young to make choices or think positively or attract anything, and they come down with cancer or they're beaten by their parents or something like that? How do you explain that that can happen when they have not put out any kind of energy?

NICHOLS: Sure. Sure. Absolutely.

As John mentioned earlier, there are some things in the universe that happen that we may not like, we may not love and seem so incredibly unfair. That's one of those things. And like John mentioned, it's balancing. I know that with children, many times, as a child, they don't ask for anything to come upon them. They don't ask for anything to occur in their lives. They pretty much are simply inside of an experience.

So in that -- in that case, they're not attracting that to them, necessarily. They're not creating that reality for themselves. But those are the things that happen.

You know, I believe that we all have muscles. We have patience -- we have the opportunity to develop our patience muscle. We have the opportunity to develop our surrender muscle.

I've talked to many people who have had a situation with a health challenge and they were actually grateful for it because it taught them something, that we're not all meant to be fit and healthy with two arms, two legs and -- you know, that's just not how, you know, the universe works, that we are learned -- we are taught compassion. We're taught acceptance. We're taught forgiveness. We're taught release. We're taught surrender through a myriad of experiences.

And so I believe that in those circumstances, we're taught different lessons and different muscles in us are being developed. And so while I don't think children bring that on themselves, I think that's an opportunity for us as a society to increase our compassion.

KING: Do you think you can prolong life by thinking in the world of attraction?

NICHOLS: I think you can enjoy the journey much better, Larry, when you are in side of positive feelings, you're inside of a good vibration, you're inside of a good energy. I know people who think so powerfully and send out such a great energy that they're enjoying every moment of their life, while I've seen others that they have such a negative energy that 50 years is too long when you're not happy.

Thirty years is too long when you're not happy. The day seems like it's 48 hours in a day when you -- when you have a negative energy around you versus when you have a powerful energy, you can't wait to get up. You can't wait to be inside a relationship.

So while, you know, prolonging life, I'm not sure. But I do know that you can enjoy the journey much better when you're in positive energy.

KING: Thanks, Lisa.

NICHOLS: You're welcome, Larry.

(INAUDIBLE).

KING: Lisa Nichols.

She's a part of The Secret.

When we come back, how the so-called Secret can bring more than just material things.

And, as we go to break, just some of what our next guest, James Ray, will have to say in the next segment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES ARTHUR RAY, PHILOSOPHER: How can you ever expect anyone else to enjoy your company if you don't enjoy your own company?

And so, again, the law of attraction or The Secret is about bringing that into your life. And you've got to get really, really clear.

Here's the question I wanted to ask you to consider -- do you treat yourself the way that you want other people to treat you?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: A diamond ring, a husband, a new job -- ask, believe, you will receive.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't have a doubt that it works.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is just new age packaging of century old snake oil.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is The Great Secret of life.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The title is very smart, very smart. If this appeals to something very universal in people and I think, you know, no one ever went broke overestimating the unhappiness of the American people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: Strong stuff.

James Ray joins us now.

He is the author of "The Science of Success: How To Attract Prosperity and Create Harmonic Wealth Through Proven Principles."

He's in Phoenix, Arizona and he is addressing some 3,000 people awaiting to hear his lecture. And they're all cheering him now. We hope they calm down a little so we can hear James.

What do you make of the critics, James?

JAMES RAY, AUTHOR, "THE SCIENCE OF SUCCESS," FEATURED IN "THE SECRET": Well, you know, it's interesting, Larry, because any time a new idea comes to the fore, it goes through three phases. It's first ridiculed. Then it's violently opposed. And then it's finally accepted as self-evident, normally after the opposition dies.

And so what we're really doing here is bringing forth a new way of thinking and behaving that some people haven't considered before. So I -- I'm really -- I'm not surprised at all.

KING: We have an e-mail from Dan in San Antonio: "Why do so many people fail when they try this? I've been using The Secret ever since I saw it. I stay positive, but I continue to struggle with what I'm using it for.

Is there anything I can do to enhance my positive thinking?"

RAY: Well, you know, some of those that have talked before -- and you and I have discussed before, Larry, it's got to be more than thinking. If you're just thinking, you know, if we became everything we thought about, then when I was in high school, I would have become a busty cheerleader, quite frankly. Because I really thought about them quite a bit.

But the bottom line is you've got to -- you've got to go three for three. You've got to have your thoughts, your feelings and your actions all firing and in alignment.

And what I would say to our caller is that there's probably one of those components missing. You look at anybody who's not creating what they desire and deserve, and they're missing one of those components. You've got to go three for three.

And when you do that, you've really creating the live you deserve.

KING: Frankly, James, are you a little surprised at all the furor, pro and con, over this book and tape?

RAY: I'm really not, Larry, because, as I said earlier, when a new idea comes to the fore -- I mean you go all the way back in history to when Copernicus said that we revolved around the sun. He was condemned to hell for that, at that particular time. And yet now, today, it's accepted as self-evident.

And so what I believe is that people fear things that they don't fully understand. And so I -- I know that in a world of dualistic behavior, in a dualistic plane, which we live in, in the third dimension, there's always going to be just as much positive as negative. And so if you're doing wonderful things in the world, there's going to be people in opposition. That's just how it works.

And so I get excited when there are people asking questions, because it means we can dive to a deeper level of understanding.

KING: James, if everybody practices The Secret and everybody attains success, who's going to clean up the garbage? Who's going to drive the bus?

RAY: Well, you know, that's really an interesting question because I think that in many cases what we assume here, as we watch The Secret through certain filters, is that it's all about materialism and acquisition.

I submit to you that you can go after the money and you might get rich. But it doesn't mean you'll be wealthy. And so what I talk to people about is creating a life of what I call harmonic wealth. And this is a harmonic state of well-being in the five key areas of your life.

So, financial, relational, intellectual, physical, spiritual. And when you're in that harmonic resonance, if you will, a harmony in those areas, you could be driving a bus and that's exactly what you're here to do.

KING: Ah.

RAY: And you're truly wealthy and fulfilled.

KING: OK.

Two candidates are running for president of the United States. Both believe in The Secret. Both use the power of attraction.

Are they going to finish in a tie?

RAY: Well, you know, if they're watching the DVD, I guess we'll find out, as the election approaches. But, again, I think what we have to understand, Larry, is that there are certain things that we're all designed to do. Not everyone I'd designed to be president of the United States. Not everyone is designed to be Larry King. Not everyone is designed to be James Ray.

We all have a special purpose and a mission to fulfill in this lifetime. And part of my passion is helping people really understand what true wealth is, that state of well-being, finding their unique gifts and then using The Secret to create the life that they -- that, really, they're meant to create and meant to live in this lifetime.

KING: I've got it.

Let's get a call from Lincoln, Maine.

Hello.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi.

My name is Dawn. I have a quick question for James Ray.

KING: Go ahead.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'd like to know why his seminar costs $995. What happens to all the poor people?

KING: OK, James, why...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't...

KING: ... why is it so much?

RAY: Well, you know, it's a great question. Here's the thing that I firmly know is true in this universe. It's a -- it's noble to charge for your services if you're providing a fortune (ph) and value. And so I believe in the world that we live in, you are compensated in direct correlation to how much value you're providing.

If you look at, you know, she mentions $995 -- it's actually $997. But -- my harmonic wealth weekend. However, what you get is -- in return for that, I guarantee, is 10 times more than the investment that you make.

You see my question I'm always asking is how can I provide tremendous value to the world?

And guess what?

I've been blessed immensely by -- by focusing on providing value.

KING: James Ray...

RAY: And that's what I would like people to do, as well, in everyone.

KING: Thanks so much, James.

We'll see you again soon.

James Ray, part of The Secret.

RAY: Larry, it's great to be with you.

KING: Up next, some scientific questions about the so-called law of attraction.

We'll ask a well known psychotherapist if it could actually hurt people instead of helping them.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP FROM "OPRAH," COURTESY HARPO PRODUCTIONS)

RAY: We have an absolutely unlimited power within us and it's really an exciting time, Oprah, because it's a time when spiritual positions and science are now in total agreement.

WINFREY: Yes. I think this is so exciting because, as I said, I've been talking about this in one form or another all but -- since 1785 (ph) on this show.

RAY: Oh, no.

Where has she been?

WINFREY: And when I heard about The Secret, I watched "The Secret" and I was so excited because I thought now it's sort of reached mass appeal.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KING: Last night, we asked you, do you believe if you set your mind to something, you can actually make it happen?

You were a positive group. Eighty-eight percent of you text voted yes.

Joining us now in New York is Dr. Robi Ludwig, psychotherapist, author and host of TLC's reality show, "One Week To Save Your Marriage."

First of all, what do you make of all this in "The Secret?"

DR. ROBI LUDWIG, PSY.D. PSYCHOTHERAPIST: Well, I think it's a repackaged idea. You know, the power of positive thinking is really an old idea that's been around for a long time. And there's something to be said about focusing on the positive. You are going to feel better in life.

But it's interesting how it's creating this backlash, because feeling positive is not the only way to get what you want out of life. And I think, in part, that's a dangerous idea to have.

KING: So you would say to people use The Secret or not use The Secret?

LUDWIG: I would say if you want to read it, read it, and take whatever you want from it, take what resonates for you. And if you don't like an idea, don't use it. But, you know, really everybody has to choose what works for them. There is no one road to success for or to happiness. And any book that gives that impression is going to get attacked. And be incorrect.

KING: One psychologist said 10 percent of self-help books are rated by mental health professionals as damaging. And this is probably one of them. You share that view?

LUDWIG: No. I mean, I don't think it is damaging if people use it correctly. There probably should be something written in there that says use what you want.

But for example, if someone has a horrible illness, that's just sometimes a part of life. Listen, we all have to go somehow in some way. And if you give someone the idea that through pleasant thoughts and watching funny movies that's enough to cure one's self, then it is dangerous if people interpret it that way.

Listen, you have to go to doctors who know what they're talking about and medication is recommended, you need to follow through with what is traditional while hopefully you work on your emotions is, you know to make your life a little bit easier. But to say it is your fault for everything that is happened in your life, that's a very provocative and I think incorrect idea.

KING: Is there a type of person who would benefit from this?

LUDWIG: Well, I think it is probably good for somebody who might feel disempowered to realize that there are things they can do in their life so they don't have to feel victimized. But if you take control of your life, and you start to think about that you want your life to look like, that certainly can help you get there. So I think for some people, you know, knowing that they can think about that they want, and if they have good feelings, then maybe they can get there, that is certainly a very pleasant way to go through life and for some people that can help them get to their destination.

KING: Why do you think it's hooked so many people?

LUDWIG: Because I think many people are dissatisfied in some area of their life. That's part of the human condition as long as we are living, there is always going to be something that we want, that we don't have. And I have spoken to some of the most successful people who will say, you know, I just keep feeling I should be doing more and having more.

I think that's just part of life. And for some people, they will do anything that will help them to feel better. We like to feel good. And the bottom line is, in life, we're going to have a lot of different feelings. They don't always feel good. Even if you are a positive person.

KING: I remember Norman Vincent Peale and the power of positive thinking. How can you knock that how can you say that's bad to positively think?

LUDWIG: I don't think there is anything bad about it. I'm a big fan of Norman Vincent Peale. I think hissed whys were brilliant way back in the day. Here is where it is damaging.

People blame themselves, I think, quite naturally, so if you put out information and you say, you need to be positive in order to have a great life and people are like, well, I don't know how to get positive, I don't know how to get that feeling, it could get certain people to give up. And in fact, that's not really true. You can have a lot of different emotions. You can feel hopeless while pursuing your dream as long as you don't let that hopelessness interfere with your strategy and your persistence.

KING: Thank you very much. Dr. Ludwig will be returning with us at the end of the program and John Assaraf will return as well.

By the way, Joanne Carson, Johnny Carson's second wife will be with us tomorrow night with some extraordinary taped footage.

Bill Maher on Monday. And next Thursday night, one week from tonight, the former governor of Massachusetts, Mitt Romney will be here. Coming up, think this secret stuff is all in your head? Well, so does best-selling author Bob Proctor but in a positive way. Here is a preview as we go break.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BOB PROCTOR, "THE SECRET": One law, it is attraction. The secret is the law of attraction. Everything that is coming into your life you are attracting into your life. And it is attracted to you by virtue of the images you're holding in your mind.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KING: Joining us now is Bob Proctor, "New York Times" best- selling author, lecturer and counselor. He's been described as preaching the gospel of positive thinking and maximizing human potential. What is going on? What do you make of all this?

PROCTOR: I think it is a great thing. I've been in the business now for 38 years. I've been studying it for 47 years. And over the past 25 years, there has been a real spiritual transition I think taking place in the world. And I think this is just sort of pushing off into a new dimension.

KING: Were you surprised that "Secrets" did so well?

PROCTOR: I think everybody is surprised it did so well. I thought it would do very well.

KING: Couldn't have predicted number one everywhere.

PROCTOR: No, no. You couldn't have. But it has done so well. I think Rhonda Byrne has done a magnificent job putting an idea across that a lot of people have been working with for a long time.

KING: Our tragedies -- Is 9/11 an interruption of the concept?

PROCTOR: I don't understand why 9/11 happened. But I do know this. That all down through history, things like that have happened. And we automatically assume that death is a bad thing. Death is a transition. It is much the same as birth. And I think people move on to the next phase of an eternal journey.

KING: Let's get a call for Bob Proctor. Glen Burnie, Maryland. Hello.

CALLER: Hi. How are you.

KING: Hi.

CALLER: Mr. King, I would like to ask your guest, I guess not so much a question, but how would I go about -- I would like to write a book about depression and I was attacked (ph) ... KING: I think that's kind of off topic. I would rather you write in about that rather than the concept of doing a book a little off the topic. Maybe I guessed wrong. I'm sorry. Write to me, I'll put you in touch with the proper person on handling and writing a book.

An e-mail question from Donna, Gainesville, Virginia. "What can you do if a wife believes in practices the law of attraction but the husband does not? And if like is supposed to attract like, why do so many marriages involve opposites?"

PROCTOR: I think people are attracted for all kinds of crazy reasons when they're young. If a person -- if one person is focused on the positive, and the other one is focused on the negative, you can't see them as being focused on the negative. When people come to me with that, I tell them to write out 10 good things about their spouse and focus on those.

There are positive things in the spouse too. If you're focused on what the spouse is negative, you're in a negative vibration yourself.

KING: What if you want to do something maybe that - refer to the lady -- that you don't have the talent for. What if you want to write a book but you're not a good writer.

PROCTOR: Then you probably get help. I wrote a book. I don't think I'm a great writer but I got help. We train people, we teach people, we have Secrets symposiums where we teach this to people. It is not just law of attraction. People have to start to understand themselves. Most people don't understand themselves.

Inscribed over the Arc of Apollo for the past 2,000 years are two words, "Know Thyself." The average person on the street thinks they are their name or their body. They don't know themselves. We go right through our educational system and learn very little about ourselves.

KING: Define attraction as it applies to "The Secret." What is attraction.

PROCTOR: Attraction is a law and you attract things into you. Your brain is an electronic switching station. When you think you activate brain cells. And those brain cells set up a vibration. You have got an electrical system in you that is second to none.

KING: That's a scientific fact?

PROCTOR: Absolutely. They're measuring brain waves. The brain is an electronic instrument. And our body is an electronic instrument. And we put our body into a vibration. Our mind and body. And whatever vibration is dictates what we attract. People focused on the negative will always attract it.

You will find people set goals off getting out of debt. That's the worst thing in the world a person can do. They should set up an orderly debt repayment program and then focus on prosperity.

KING: What do you do, Bob, with bad days?

PROCTOR: I think everybody has bad days. I think you eliminate the bad as quick as you can and get focused on what is good.

KING: But that's ...

PROCTOR: It is -- you can train yourself to do it. I used to have all bad days. Now I pretty well have all good days. I have bad parts in them but I don't focus on the bad. I get rid of it. But I completely changed the way my mind operates and I did it through education, through studying and going to people ...

KING: How long did it take you to get that?

PROCTOR: It's taken me 47 years but it's got better over the 47 years. Like, you know, you're asking earlier, will this -- you know, will this length in your life, I'll be 73, I got more energy than most people at 23 and I have got no intentions of slowing down. I don't think we have to slow down. I think we should calm down. We should control the vibration. We should be relaxed.

KING: Bob, I thank you so much. It's always good seeing you. Bob Proctor, "New York Times" best-selling author, lecturer and counselor, he has been described as preaching the gospel of positive thinking and as you can tell by being around him, maximizing human potential.

We try to do that here at CNN, don't we? Anderson Cooper who maximizes potential every night at 10:00 Eastern is the host -- the segues are harder and harder.

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: I tell you.

KING: He hosts AC 360. What is up tonight?

COOPER: Larry, tonight on 360, breaking news concerning those mobile homes sitting idle in Arkansas. The victims of recent tornado strikes say they need them. Tonight FEMA has responded. You might be surprised what they're saying. All of those thousands of homes sitting empty. We'll talk about that plus the Democrats taking a stand on Iraq. Does it really mean anything? They took control of Congress vowing change there. Many are wondering if it is all talk. We'll look at their announcement today and what it really means for the future in Iraq. We're keeping them honest.

And an extraordinary story, a woman who spent years in a near coma, then wake up, talks with her family, you'll get to see her and hear her for yourself. The really strange thing is Larry, she just days later slipped back in a coma. Doctors do not understand why. A strange story. All that and more at the top of the hour.

KING: Still more rules of attraction when we come back. Don't forget, Anderson Cooper at 10:00 Eastern, 7:00 Pacific. And our guest Joe Vitale offers some food for thought about the way complaining negatively affects what you achieve in your life. Don't go away.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE VITALE, HYPNOTIC MARKETING: Everything that is around you right now in your life, including the things you're complaining about, you've attracted. Now I know at first blush that will be something that you hate to hear. You're going immediately say, I didn't attract the car accident. I didn't attract this particular client. I didn't particularly attract the debt. I didn't attract whatever it happens to be that you're complaining about. And I'm here to be a little bit in your face and to say, yes, you did attract it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KING: We're back. In this parade of folks involved in "The Secret," Joe Vitale joins us, once broke, despite (ph), and living on the streets, now one of the world's top marketing specialists, founder and president of the Hypnotic Marketing Institute, a "New York Times" best-selling author. What is your explanation of this phenomenon?

VITALE: I don't know what the explanation is but I sure love it. I think this movie this book can awaken the world. I am so glad to see it. I am so privileged to be part of it. I think there is a lot of controversy around it now because a lot of people have been hurt over the years. They tried to believe in something that didn't work out. Now they got something that is telling them this is going to work all the time.

KING: E-mail question from Chris in Bismarck, North Dakota.

"Joe, I understand you were recently sick. I agree with the secret and I know I attract what happens in my life. How is it you attracted your illness and why did you do that?"

VITALE: That's a great question. First of all, I had an emergency appendectomy. And I did indeed attract it. I would have denied it the day it happened because going to the emergency room, never been in the hospital, never been in the emergency room, no fun whatsoever. I attracted it. Why did attract it? I needed a vacation. I was working too hard. I'm traveling too much, writing too much, I wasn't booking my own vacation. I remember telling people, if I don't book a vacation, something bad is going to happen. I programmed it. I made it happen.

KING: Let's take a call. St. Louis, hello.

CALLER: Hi. This is Mary.

KING: Go ahead.

CALLER: I'm just curious, where does God come into the whole "Secrets".

KING: Good question. VITALE: God is all of us. God is the secret and everything about it. This is a law from God. I heard some people talking earlier this might be a principle, may be exceptions to t I say the law of attraction is like the other three -- three great laws in the world. Law of gravity, there is the law of everybody loving Italian food and the law of attraction. These are all from God. This is not separate this is all one. And we are part of it.

KING: But do you attract -- the young girl who was killed in Florida, her killer was found guilty yesterday, did she attract that?

VITALE: We are attracting everything to ourselves. There is no exception. I hear previous people talking about there is luck, there is some exceptions here. No. We attract everything. But we're doing it on unconscious level, Larry. That's what is going on. We have to awaken to our own conscious power.

That's why this boo, this DV, my work, all of John's work, the other people on the panel that are coming here today is so important. We are realizing that we can wake up and create the reality we want.

KING: Can an addict be helped by this book?

VITALE: Absolutely. Addicts are helped by that book. There are many people -- there is hundreds of thousands of people who are watching this movie. Some of them are watching this 200 times because they're finding this is the -- this is the food that they want to change ...

KING: But your body is still addicted if you're an addict.

VITALE: Your mind is more powerful than your body. And there are some people who say your mind is entirely your body. It is not located in your brain. Your mind is actually your whole physical body. So when you change your mind, you change your body.

KING: Do critics carry any weight with you.

VITALE: Do critics carry any weight ...

KING: Have you read anything where you said, now that make a little sense?

VITALE: Well, you know, there was one critic that said that the movie was missing the idea that it doesn't talk about taking action. I told him I agree with you, the movie does not talk very much about taking action in order to get results. But the movie is telling you one secret of the universe. It is not telling you all the secrets of the universe. That's why we're going to have a sequel to this thing. There will be some other one ones.

KING: The secrets to ...

VITALE: Am I giving you breaking news here?

KING: Yeah, give it to me. VITALE: I may be speaking out of turn.

KING: Go ahead. What the hell?

There's going to be a sequel?

VITALE: Would you think there wouldn't be. I'll tell you this. I'm attracting a sequel. So we're going to have a sequel one way or another.

KING: "The Secrets 2." what can you add?

VITALE: There is other secrets.

KING: More secrets.

VITALE: Oh, absolutely. I only told -- we only know about the law of -- the whole book, the whole DVD is based on the law of attraction. That is one secret. That is one focus. There are other secrets including the law of right action.

KING: See you when that comes.

VITALE: I look forward to it.

KING: Always good seeing you. Joe Vitale, another great part of an interesting concept that is sweeping now the world, "The Secrets." We'll be right back. Tomorrow on LARRY KING LIVE, the Johnny Carson none of us knew described by his former wife. Plus some classic footage that hasn't been seen in years.

And then Monday, Bill Maher spends a hour of real time taking a cynical look at the issues of the day.

And later next week, Republican presidential hopeful Mitt Romney. All that and more on LARRY KING LIVE.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KING: We're going to close out the show with Dr. Robi Ludwig returning, the psychotherapist and John Assaraf, one of the most successful businessman and a part of the secrets concept. But first we took our King-cam on the street to talk to ordinary folk about "The Secret." Here is what some of them told us.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think it is an old philosophy. I think it has been repackaged and they call it the secret.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Kind of, you know, hocusy, wizardry in the beginning.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Once you're conscious of if you're thinking negative or positive, you can start creating the positive things. Because who wants to create negative. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My only criticism so to speak is just that question around your responsibility.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you want a big house, all you have to do is think you have a big house and you're going to get it but quite frankly it is not going to happen.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I do find that in doing it, it helps us to move into manifesting more of what we want.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: Obviously there is extraordinary interest in this. John Assaraf and Dr. Ludwig are back with us. John, if everyone learned the secret, would Robi be out of business?

ASSARAF: I don't think Robi would be out of business. I think there is plenty of work for Robi and for everybody else. The key with "The Secret" is it gives people a start. The thing we didn't talk about tonight is really what happens in the brain when we're thinking positive thoughts. And I would like to address that for a second. Every time we have a positive thought, we actually release a positive chemical in our brain. When we think a negative thought, we actually release a negative chemical. That really does harm to the body.

So I think if we stay in a positive modality, not that we are not going to have a negative thoughts, but if we stay in a positive modality chances are we're going to attract more in our lives, we're going to be happier and things will work out better for us.

KING: Want to comment, Robi?

LUDWIG: I think that there is a lot of truth to that, but there also is a place to have one's negative emotions. That's part of life too. And I think to deny it and suppress it can sometimes create a rebound effect.

So if we give people the idea it is not OK to have the negative emotions and only OK to have the positive emotions, that's not the right message either. There is a place for both. Having said that, I think if you can train yourself to try to feel as good as possible under circumstances, it is just a better way to go through life.

KING: You agree?

ASSARAF: I agree. One of the other laws, Joe was referring to is called the law of polarity. In nature you have to have positives with negatives. The key is not to dwell on the negatives. There are definitely things that are going to happen in our lives, just like the tide goes in and the tide goes out. That's a natural course of nature and how life is.

To think that doesn't exist is deluding ourselves. The key for us is the more we can be in a positive vibration, the more we are going to get what we want.

KING: Wouldn't it be great, though, Robi, to eliminate negative?

LUDWIG: I don't know. Because sometimes the negative is a really important teacher and we grow sometimes and learn way more from things that are painful than positive experiences. I think we need to find a way to have all of our emotional experiences and still figure out how to get what we want.

KING: The late great Johnny Mercer wrote you got to "accentuate the positive and eliminate the negative." Los Angeles, hello.

CALLER: Yes. I'm a behavioral psychologist and I have a question for Mr. Assaraf.

KING: Sure.

CALLER: He keeps talking about the brain. I would like to know if he is a neuroscientist or fez done any research that he's published in peer reviewed journals that support his claims. He keeps talking about that he does research.

ASSARAF: Actually, that's a great question. I've had so many experiences with the law of attraction and our clients had so many experiences. I was retired for the last six years and I did my own research on books that were published, reports published, white papers that were published to understand what was happening in my life, what was happening in the lives of our clients and how we were able to achieve the success we were achieving. I studied other people's works. I read voraciously, I research voraciously other people's works. And there is more than enough evidence, scientific evidence at a quantum physics level or physics level and neuroscience level to suggest this is true.

KING: Do we know a lot about the brain, Robi?

LUDWIG: We're always learning more about the brain. But I think people are very curious and now we have wonderful equipment that can measure what is going on when the brain is exposed to certain situations and certain thoughts and ideas. So we're constantly learning about the brain.

KING: You think you'll convert the skeptics, John?

ASSARAF: No. Our goal is not to convert the skeptics. When somebody is set on anywhere own mind set it doesn't make a difference what you tell them. They're going to be in denial. What somebody wants a solution, somebody wants to eliminate the way they are receiving their life, that is when they're open to suggestion.

KING: Robi, what would you call yourself? Would you call your set of a skeptic?

LUDWIG: I don't think I'm a skeptic. I think that I'm a person who believes in working on themselves understanding themselves, having a range of emotion and working towards what you want in life. I think that there is enough for everybody. I don't know if I would describe myself as a skeptic. But one always needs to be cautious and question in life.

KING: Can we say though if the secret helps you, it helps you?

LUDWIG: Absolutely. If it helps you and you find it helpful, then it works for you. Terrific.

KING: Whatever works.

LUDWIG: Whatever works.

KING: Thanks Robi.

LUDWIG: Thank you.

KING: And thanks, John.

ASSARAF: My pleasure, Larry.

KING: Good seeing you again.

We'll be doing lots more programs on this fascinating subject. "The Secret" and as we've learned tonight, "Secrets 2" is coming.

Something always happens here that you learn that you didn't know before.

Tomorrow night Joanne Carson, Johnny Carson's second wife with some incredible footage of shows you have not seen since the 1950s.

Monday night Bill Maher. Next Thursday night, former Governor Mitt Romney will be with us. That is it for tonight. We now turn things over to New York, Anderson Cooper and AC 360. Anderson?

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.voxant.com

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