Return to Transcripts main page
Body of Missing 6-Year-Old Georgia Boy Found on Roadside/Homicide Experts Reportedly Consult on Anna Nicole Death
Aired March 15, 2007 - 20:00:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Homicide experts called in on the mystery surrounding the sudden death of covergirl Anna Nicole Smith. Repeat -- homicide experts called in. Smith, as you know, pronounced dead 2:49 PM, Feb 8. Can her autopsy report establish a clinical time of death much earlier, possibly even the early morning hours that day? Does the investigation turn back to the timeline? Just who was in that luxury casino hotel room at the time Anna Nicole Smith went unconscious? Seminole, Florida, police now formally meeting with Bahamian officials, honing in on the 39-year-old model`s computer. The DNA battle over the covergirl`s 6-month-old baby girl heats up as one of the would-be dads actually files a lawsuit against Fox News Channel host Bill O`Reilly, claiming fraud.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): Bahamian detectives arrived at the Hard Rock hotel after a full day meeting with the Seminole police. Their visit to south Florida comes exactly two weeks after Seminole police chief Charlie Tiger paid a visit to the Bahamas as part of his probe into the death of Anna Nicole.
(on camera): Do you think there could be a connection between these two deaths, sir?
(voice-over): Tiger didn`t answer our questions, but sources say the two departments are comparing notes, in part, we`re told, because the autopsy results of Anna Nicole and her son are, quote, "remarkably similar."
JACK HARDING, PRIVATE INVESTIGATOR: He was really concerned about his mother, someone taking control over his mother`s life, and that was Stern. He was afraid of Stern and that he was feeding his mother drugs, that he was acting like some kind of Svengali and that his mother was receiving some kind of mind-bending drug.
Daniel said he felt like he was a loose cog in the wheel. He was concerned about the lifestyle of his mother and the drugs that are around her. He did tell me that he had a nightmare, and this is what spurred him into talking to me, and that the nightmare was he saw his mother in a coffin.
It`s too soon to be a coincidence.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening, everybody. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us tonight. First to breaking news. Police confirm as we go to air tonight the body of a 6-year-old boy who vanished near his Georgia home has been found.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`ve been with the department for 24 years. I talked with some staff that`s been with us for 33 years, some retirees, and we`ve never had a child abduction. So it`s rough. Look at the folks out there. They (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The family`s not going to be the only one to take this hard. Just look around you. All these people are here. You would never think that (INAUDIBLE) and that he wasn`t come home alive!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: At least now we know what we didn`t know. We can bring closure, but we don`t have (INAUDIBLE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Again, repeat, as we go to air, we learn the body of the 6- year-old little boy has been found.
Straight out to CNN reporter Amanda Rosseter. Amanda, what happened?
AMANDA ROSSETER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: As you know, the little boy, 6- year-old Christopher Michael Barrios, disappeared from outside his mobile home park exactly one week ago tonight, and 200 to 300 volunteers have spent the last week searching around the clock for Christopher until this afternoon, Nancy.
About 4:00 o`clock this afternoon, a DNR ranger -- Department of Natural Resources ranger -- spotted an object off the side of the road. When he went to check it out, he found that it was the body of little Christopher, just 10 to 15 feet off the side of the road, just two miles from his home here behind me. And his uncle later told us this afternoon that his body was found in a garbage bag. The police chief, though, wouldn`t confirm how Christopher died.
Now, you know, they have four suspects here in custody, three from the same family, a set of parents and a grown son -- that grown son is a registered convicted child molester here in the state of Georgia -- and a fourth man. All four of them lived near Christopher`s home here at the mobile home park, and the police chief did confirm for us that all four would probably be upgraded to murder status.
We heard in that sound bite a little bit earlier the police chief saying nothing like this has ever happened here before. That`s what we`ve heard from so many people here this afternoon, neighbors simply saying, We can`t believe this has happened in our tight-knit community. He was like a son to us -- Nancy.
GRACE: Really? Nothing like that has happened in the community before? With me, Amanda Rosseter there in Brunswick, Georgia. She is a CNN reporter.
But I happen to have in my mind the sentencing form on the chief suspect in this case. It seems as if something did happen in the area before with the same suspect, two counts of child molestation. He got straight probation.
Take a listen to what police have to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We looked (ph) at the officers. We went around. We said, We`re satisfied he`s not here. If he`s not here, we`re still convinced he`s somewhere nearby. So with the staff, our tactic was, Let`s expand. Let`s start looking out further and further, but very meticulous and very careful. Well, that tactic paid off. Thirty minutes ago, about two miles from here, which is further than we thought, Christopher was found.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have no more suspects.
QUESTION: Sheriff, will you confirm this is a homicide?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. We will treat this as a homicide. We believe they were involved (INAUDIBLE) abduction, and they are the only ones, at this point, we believe, involved.
QUESTION: What time did you find him, Chief?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: About 4:00 o`clock.
QUESTION: And it was easy to tell that it was him?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Not at first, no. It took a little bit of looking. It took a little bit closer examination.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight, I`m taking a look at the sentencing, the formal document sentencing in 1997 the chief suspect in this case, George Edenfield, now age 32, to straight probation back in 1997 on two counts of felony child molestation. Judge A. Glenn Taylor (ph), Jr., you are in contempt!
I`d like to also point out that this guy got 10 years straight probation to run concurrent. That means on each boy victim, 10 years probation to run at the same time. And this is in Glynn County. That encompasses Savannah and Brunswick.
So it seems to me, Amanda Rosseter, something like this has happened in the area before. What can you tell me about the other three people, Amanda, that are being held tonight?
ROSSETER: Well, what we know, Nancy, from the police chief -- what we`ve been hearing all week is that, of course, the son Edenfield was arrested first on the 9th, and then his mother quickly followed behind, and then his father, as well, with this Donald Dale, as well, who they call Donnie Dale. We know that all four of them obviously lived near little Christopher.
And we understand that police may have been upset with the parents for misleading them. In fact, one of the charges against them was giving false statements. So that was one of the things because they keep -- they kept leading the police to one area to search and then another area to search, something that the police felt was simply a waste of time -- Nancy.
GRACE: Man, you`re not kidding because the longer you wait, the more difficult it`s going to be to determine cause of death, once that body decomposes.
Out to Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst. Bethany, what`s disturbing to me is, just like in the Jessie case down in Florida, where everybody in the home should have know that a 9-year-old little girl, Jessie Lunsford, was being held, this whole family is, like, (INAUDIBLE) Nobody knew anything.
BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST: Oh, well, of course not. And you know, over half of abduction homicide cases, the perpetrator meets the victim within a quarter mile of the victim`s home, and then the murder occurs within a quarter mile of the victim`s home.
This family was covering up for a long, long time, and if their idea of covering up for a crime was saying that a body was buried in the woods, what else are they covering up for? Was this guy molesting other kids in that trailer park? Had he already been molesting this little boy for a long, long time? Was his pattern of molestation becoming more severe and more sadistic, and it reached a point where the collusion became so chaotic and so extensive that the family literally participated in the homicide? It`s really terrible.
GRACE: Also joining us tonight, Wayne Jeffers (ph), reporter with "The Brunswick News." Welcome, Mr. Jeffers. Question. The home of David Edenfield was searched, items taken out. What was taken?
WAYNE JEFFERS, "BRUNSWICK NEWS": We`re not exactly sure what was taken out right now. The police chief is not saying much, but that although no motive has been established, the Glynn County police chief is saying that the four will soon probably be charged with murder.
GRACE: You know, that`s an interesting point -- Wayne Jeffers joining us from "The Brunswick News." Everyone, this has been an intense manhunt for a 6-year-old little boy, and now it looks like police have rounded up an entire family. We are expecting upgrades on charges.
Let`s unleash the lawyers. Joining us, high-profile lawyer out of the Seattle jurisdiction, Anne Bremner, and New York attorney Michael Mazzariello, host of "Closing Arguments" on WGNY.
First to you, Anne Bremner. Upgrading to murder -- explain. Do you think they all actually murdered the little boy?
ANNE BREMNER, TRIAL ATTORNEY: You know, I find that very unlikely. And I was thinking with the chief suspect, once a pedophile, always a pedophile. But Nancy, once a pedophile, always a murderer? Not necessarily so. But the fact is, some kind of conspiracy before or after the fact, as you know, could lead to being charged as the principal, and that`s kind of what I`m thinking could come to mind.
GRACE: Explain, Michael.
MICHAEL MAZZARIELLO, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I agree with Anne that acting in concert, when one person knows what`s happening and allows it or participates in it, they`re all going to be charged, Nancy.
GRACE: Let`s go out to the lines. Dana in Oklahoma. Hi, Dana.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. I just want to say that my family and I absolutely love you.
GRACE: Thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But my question is, you know, we have tracking devices for vehicles. Why can`t we have some type of tracking devices for sex offenders? You know, when they`re suspected of something like this, we can be able to locate them at any time and find out, you know, where their surroundings are and be able to keep track of them better than what`s going on just by paperwork.
GRACE: Dana in Oklahoma, you`re right. You can get a Lojack for your car. You can have a chip in your iPod to find it. But you can`t track a sex predator. Well, according to Judge A. Glenn Taylor, Jr., chief judge there in the Brunswick judicial circuit -- yes, these judges are elected, I know for a fact. You`re in contempt tonight, Judge! You gave this guy straight probation in 1997. You gave him 10 years straight probation. Not only was he violating his probation, being around children, he never did a single day of jail time. In that case, two little boy victims.
I`m want to go to Pat Brown, criminal profiler. Let`s talk about it. Why didn`t this guy -- why wasn`t he under sex register supervision?
PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER: Gosh, you would have thought so, Nancy, but I guess this judge just didn`t have any children nearby where this guy was going to live, so he didn`t care. I`ve had that actually said to me by a police chief once. He said, Hey, the offender isn`t in our town anymore. I said, What, you`re saying it`s OK to kill people in the next town? And apparently, that is a lot of the attitude.
GRACE: Let`s go out to the lines. Patricia in Florida. Hi, Patricia.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. How are you tonight?
GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m ticked. We -- the headlines in our paper a week ago were they found John Couey guilty. The headline right above it stated that a judge in Orlando dismissed all charges against a serial rapist who had been found. He had served 16 years, but they let him out. How many more of these babies are going to have to die before these judges get their crap together?
GRACE: You know, Patricia, just a couple of hours ago over on Court TV, I interviewed Mark Lunsford about the death sentence on John Couey, and I could hardly get through the interview listening to him talk. I don`t know. I don`t know when Washington will finally hear, or your legislature, Patricia, or mine in Georgia and New York.
Back out to you, Amanda Rosseter, CNN reporter. She is joining us there on the scene there in Brunswick. Amanda, how did they find this body? Was there a tipster?
ROSSETER: You know, that was one of the questions that we asked the police chief this afternoon because, as we mentioned earlier, the four suspects kept leading them to different areas where they would go and search. They would say, You need to go look here, you need to go and look in this field. And all of those volunteers spent all of that time over the past seven days looking here and looking there. And I said, Is this one of the areas that the suspects sent you to? And he said, No, this was just a good old-fashioned broadening out your search work. And the DNR ranger who was happening by saw that object by the side of the road.
And as I mentioned, this was a road that led down to a construction company. This was on private property. And some of the construction workers that we spoke with this afternoon basically said, We probably drove by him several times this past week. He was 10 to 15 feet off the side of the road.
GRACE: Before we take you down to the Bahamas and to Florida on the Anna Nicole Smith case, I want to ask Dr. Bethany Marshall one last question. Doctor, we heard that the little boy was covered up, partially covered up. What is it? Is it instinctual, is it guilt that makes people cover up, whether a blanket, whether it was soil, leaves, anything, cover up the body or the face of a victim?
MARSHALL: Well, I would like to think that they were concerned about the body, but really, the truth is that this little boy had no value to the perpetrator. He was also in a garbage bag, Nancy. Who else -- Cynthia Nixon was in a garbage bag. There was Jessica Lunsford was in a garbage bag. I find that more significant, that these victims are treated like trash because that`s all they are to these perpetrators. They are yesterday`s garbage, and they`re thrown out.
GRACE: Repeat, breaking news regarding this little boy. His body has been found as we go to air. The 6-year-old has been the focus of an intense manhunt there in Georgia -- Brunswick, Georgia. Now we learn that a man who is a sex offender, a convicted sex offender, who got probation, and his family, behind bars tonight. We`ll continue updating you throughout the program as we learn more information.
But right now, switching gears to Anna Nicole Smith, believe it or not, still a mystery. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HARDING: He was really concerned about his mother, someone taking control over his mother`s life, and that was Stern. He told me that he was afraid of Stern and that he was feeding his mother drugs. He did tell me that he had a nightmare. The nightmare was he saw his mother in a coffin.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: From Florida to the Bahamas, the plot seems to thicken as we now learn that homicide experts have been meeting on this case. Not only that, but Bahamian police meeting with Florida police. What does it mean?
Down to Nassau, Bahamas. Standing by, Court TV correspondent Jean Casarez. Jean, what`s happening?
JEAN CASAREZ, COURT TV: Well, the latest is that tomorrow morning, there`s going to be a hearing right here at the supreme court of the Bahamas that`s behind my shoulder. At issue, of course, paternity and guardianship, custody. You`re going to have the players here. Larry Birkhead wants it to be determined once and for all in a Bahamian court that he is the father, but the question is, Can the judge even order a paternity test here in the Bahamas?
GRACE: And also, to David Caplan, joining us tonight, deputy New York bureau chief with "Star" magazine. David, it has been reported that police are also investigating the possibility that the clinical time of death was much earlier, much earlier than the pronouncement at around 3:00 PM back in February. Explain.
DAVID CAPLAN, "STAR" MAGAZINE: Absolutely. Police are looking at this because they`re a little suspect because they found the drugs in the room, and they believe that it`s possible that given the amount of drugs, that she could have died earlier. Plus, you know, there are also reports that Howard K. Stern arrived earlier than he did.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: You have claimed that you are, in fact, the father of 5-month- old Dannielynn. Is that true?
PRINCE FREDERICK VON ANHALT, ZSA-ZSA GABOR`S HUSBAND: Well, I didn`t claim. I only said, you know, there`s a court ruling now, and two guys claim they are the father, and I don`t think it`s true.
GRACE: Sir, is it true that you have said that you think you might be the father of Dannielynn?
ANHALT: I said everything is possible.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My client is the father of Dannielynn Marshall Stern. There is a proceeding to overturn a legal presumption. My client`s on the birth certificate.
DEBRA OPRI, ATTORNEY FOR LARRY BIRKHEAD: I have one person to represent, and that`s Larry Birkhead. I have one life to save, and that`s Dannielynn. And that`s my mission. So it`s a battle and we are waging it, and Howard K. Stern -- he better duck because I`m coming!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: In the midst of homicide experts meeting and Bahama police meeting with Florida police, is this turning into a homicide investigation? If so, why? The only court-ordered hearing is tomorrow morning in the Bahamas. Jean, what do you expect?
CASAREZ: Well, what we expect are the players. We expect that his lordship Judge Stephen Isaac (ph) will be presiding. It is a closed proceeding. We cannot go in. But we can try to hear what the lawyers say when they come out. There is a gag order, so you`ve got to read between the lines. But the ultimate issue at stake is the paternity. Who is the father? Is it the person on the birth certificate? By Bahamian law, that is the father. Or can you rebut that presumption, Larry Birkhead says, by saying, No, take a blood test. I am the birth father.
GRACE: And how often, Jean Casarez, are paternity tests ordered in the Bahamas?
CASAREZ: Very rare, Nancy, because according to Bahamian law, the court directs the applicant to get a blood test. Now, you and I would say, The court directs? Well, that`s an order, right? No. Under Bahamian law, a direction is just that, directing, advising, requesting. What does that mean? Howard K. Stern, as the guardian, physical guardian of the child at this point of time, can not consent to allow his child to get tested.
GRACE: Also coming up in a Bahamian courtroom is an inquest, a coroner`s inquest into the death of 20-year-old Daniel Smith. That`s also on the court docket.
Joining us tonight is Jack Harding. He is a PI who says the boy, Daniel Smith, met with him, voicing concern. Welcome, Mr. Harding. Thank you for being with us. What happened?
HARDING: Well, as I said, Danny came to -- well, he called me and I visited him at a coffee shop. And I asked him why he wanted to meet me there, and he said that he didn`t want other people to know that he was talking to a private investigator. I asked him, Do you feel that someone is following you or what? And he says, Sometimes I do. And he says he has friends around that he didn`t want them to know about it. But he had a fear of -- I said -- of -- of...
GRACE: A fear of what?
HARDING: Of the attorney, her boyfriend. I can`t even think of his name right now.
GRACE: Howard Stern.
HARDING: Howard Stern.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HOWARD K. STERN, ANNA NICOLE ATTORNEY/COMPANION: Anna Nicole was on prescription medication at different times. When you say drugs, I don`t want to give the impression that she was using anything illegal.
JUDGE LARRY SEIDLIN, BROWARD COUNTY: Was -- was she abusing these drugs? Was she taking too many of them?
STERN: Look, I`m not a doctor.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) methadone prior to the last five months?
STERN: She did.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And are you aware that methadone is a narcotic?
STERN: I know it`s a prescription medicine. It may or may not be narcotic.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Homicide experts are meeting regarding the Anna Nicole Smith death. What does that indicate? Joining us now, Aidan Pickering, investigative reporter, and David Caplan, as you know, deputy New York bureau chief with "Star."
Aidan, what can you tell us about the investigation?
AIDAN PICKERING, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER: Well, Nancy, this is a tough one. Does it mean that because police are meeting with homicide prosecutors that that means that this is a homicide investigation? The police insist absolutely not, at this stage. It is not a homicide, it`s a death investigation, and these are the prosecutors that you would meet with if you had a legal question.
And the theory goes -- and this is something that was reported on TMZ -- that one of the questions that they have is what to do about a laptop computer found after Anna Nicole death, that supposedly belonged to Anna Nicole? And do they have the right to go in without a search warrant, or do they need to get a search warrant to inspect e-mails on that laptop computer? And one theory is that some of those e-mails contain some of the communications between Anna Nicole Smith`s doctors and Anna Nicole Smith about prescription medication.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DAVID CAPLAN, "STAR" MAGAZINE: Seminole police are interviewing Big Moe, Anna Nicole`s bodyguard, and, as we said, he is telling police that Anna Nicole was in a cloud of drugs, actually for months. Plus, more interestingly enough, he was saying Howard K. Stern was acting very peculiar the day that Anna Nicole Smith died, even the days leading up to her death.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Welcome back. Is the focus of the death of Anna Nicole Smith taking a more sinister turn? Joining us, Aidan Pickering, investigative reporter out of L.A. And in addition to Aidan, David Caplan with "Star."
To you, David Caplan, the whole theory regarding the methadone along with the Demerol, just how much methadone has there been reported found in her skin?
CAPLAN: You know, "Star Magazine" has spoken to sources close to the investigation who, quote, said her body tissue was loaded with methadone. We`re waiting to get the exact milligram count, but we also heard related, though, to the Demerol that police are investigating looking into whether or not 75 milligrams of Demerol were injected into her prior to her death, in fact, two minutes within her death.
GRACE: Now, how can you state within two minutes of her death? She was pronounced dead, I believe, at 2:49 p.m. on February 8.
CAPLAN: These are sources close to the investigation telling us this.
GRACE: Now, are you saying time of death, 2:49? Because two minutes before that, she was making her way to the emergency room and in an emergency vehicle. Are you talking about clinical death?
CAPLAN: Yes, we`re talking about clinical death. And as we said, the time of death here is very sketchy. We`re hearing altering times and that police are looking now whether or not the initial time of clinical death has been altered since then.
GRACE: Joining us right now is the expert in his field, Dr. Joshua Perper. He is a chief medical examiner in Broward County. He is a published author of "When to Call the Doctor." And he performed the autopsy on cover girl Anna Nicole Smith.
Dr. Perper, thank you for being with us.
DR. JOSHUA PERPER, BROWARD COUNTY MEDICAL EXAMINER: You`re very welcome.
GRACE: Dr. Perper, is there any truth to the allegations that she had so much methadone in her skin and Demerol, as well?
PERPER: As I said before, I`m not going to comment on any kind of type of findings, which would be toxicological or otherwise. And I believe that there`s a great deal of speculation which doesn`t have roots in fact.
GRACE: Dr. Perper, what is the difference between the pronounced time of death and the clinical time of death?
PERPER: The clinical time of death is when the person stops breathing and the heart stops. And the irreversible type of death is when resuscitation matters or attempts are unsuccessful. And forensic pathologists are able to make a determination based on postmortem findings what time occurred or lapsed since the death.
In this particular case, the death occurred within a very short time because the body was warm and, obviously, there were resuscitation attempts made which otherwise they wouldn`t have been made.
GRACE: Dr. Perper, you and I were talking on a previous night regarding the fact that she was inside her hotel room there at the casino under the covers in her bed where she had been sleeping. How much would the body temperature lower as she died under those circumstances? It`s not as if she were out in the elements.
PERPER: Well, again, this is information which I`m going to release later on. But as I said initially, the temperature was 105 degrees, and my understanding is that it was lower thereafter.
GRACE: Dr. Perper, is it true that methadone is retained in the skin?
PERPER: Methadone can be taken by mouth or it can be injected.
PERPER: There are a variety of -- it can be taken by enema. So there are a variety of ways in which somebody can take methadone.
GRACE: So to you, David Caplan, what do you mean by Anna Nicole`s body tissue was overloaded with the opiate substance methadone?
CAPLAN: Well, our sources told us that the methadone was still sort of in her body tissue after her death, and that it was very evident there were large doses of methadone in there. It was still present in her system, traces of it.
GRACE: And Dr. Joshua Perper, I know that, for instance, you can take a hair sample days later and determine whether or not drugs have been used. Is that true with skin tissue?
PERPER: It can be determined whether she used Demerol days prior to death or not. Demerol can be found still in the body, and it can be detected in the hair. But it`s irrelevant to the cause and manner of death. In other words, the fact that somebody took Demerol doesn`t mean that she died of Demerol. Somebody took methadone in the hair, the presence in the hair doesn`t indicate that she died -- this is in general. I`m not addressing this case. Just to say that the presence in the hair is irrelevant as to the cause of death.
GRACE: Dr. Perper, if she had been taking methadone and someone gave her Demerol or she self-injected Demerol, I guess that could result in an overdose. I never considered the combination of methadone and Demerol.
PERPER: As a general statement, a person can die of combined drug intoxication if more than one drug is taken at the time. And, as a matter of fact, we see often people who die of a combination of drugs. That`s not unusual. Whether this happened in this case, that`s another question.
GRACE: Right, and very often unintentionally, totally unintentionally that can happen.
Now, back to you, to Aidan Pickering, regarding the computer, from what I`m gathering from your statement, the issue that`s being consulted upon is whether the computer can be open and searched, yes, no?
AIDAN PICKERING, "INSIDE EDITION": Yes, that`s exactly right. And, remember, there are two computers now that we`re talking about. There`s the computer that was taken from the home, Horizons home in the Bahamas. That eventually ended up back with the police authorities in Florida, but this is a second computer. This is the laptop taken from the Hard Rock Hotel where Anna Nicole was staying.
PICKERING: This is according to a report on TMZ today. And this laptop supposedly contained some communications between the doctors and Anna Nicole Smith. And supposedly authorities are interested in that, but the question is, are they allowed to simply open up the computer and start looking at the stuff or do they need a warrant?
GRACE: Very quickly, let`s unleash the lawyers, Anne Bremner, Michael Mazzariello.
Anne, it reminds me of a case I prosecuted against a drug trafficker. Drunken doorman at his luxury high-rise got his FedEx and opened it. And guess what was in there, Anne Bremner?
ANNE BREMNER, TRIAL ATTORNEY: No idea.
GRACE: I remember the guy`s street name was Charlie Tuna.
BREMNER: No way.
GRACE: The doorman opens the guy`s FedEx, and in it is a brick just like this, like a cement slab, of uncut, pure, angel white cocaine. I believe it would sell on the street for about $20 million. It wasn`t the police`s fault that a private citizen had opened up the FedEx, so I got the evidence in. So what`s the difference here?
BREMNER: Well, you`re a great lawyer, Nancy, first of all. That`s the difference. But, second, there`s the right to privacy, basically, and you`ve got also police involvement. So they are going to have to get a warrant. And I always say, "Get a warrant, get a warrant, get a warrant."
GRACE: And to you, Michael Mazzariello, agree or not?
MICHAEL MAZZARIELLO, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I disagree. I think it`s a crime scene. I think that she was the owner of it, and I don`t see anyone fighting it. Who`s going to fight it and say it wasn`t theirs? So you have to have...
GRACE: OK, I agree with you. I second that motion.
Out to Pat Brown, criminal profiler, Pat, it`s the theory of felony murder, that`s what we`re talking about. It`s simple Trial 101, felony murder, the fact that simply when a death occurs during the commission of a felony. Here, the felony could very well be felony use of pharmaceuticals.
PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER: Well, it could, but that`s the difficulty. The cause of death may be easy, but the manner of death may be difficult. Everybody is acting badly, so it depends, are they just enabling or are they killing? That`s the real question.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Frederic, there are numerous reports, including to the A.P., where you do state you are the biological father. Did you have an affair with Anna Nicole Smith?
FREDERIC VON ANHALT, CLAIMS TO BE BIOLOGICAL FATHER: We knew each other, and we became very close. You know I`m married. I have a wife. I love my wife. I don`t want to upset my wife. So this is a new situation, and I don`t know how to behavior in this situation, I have to tell you the truth. I would like not to comment on the whole thing, if I had an affair or not.
I know who the father is, but there is a court case going on now, and I would like to stay out of it. If the court ruling goes in the right direction, that means, if it doesn`t go to Larry Birkhead or to Howard Stern, then I stay out of it. If it goes to Howard Stern or the other side, then I jump in, and will tell a couple of things, and then there will be a new investigation, and there will be a complete different picture out there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That is Prince von Anhalt, also the husband of Zsa Zsa Gabor, former glamour girl here in the U.S. on the big screen and small.
Out to you, Aidan Pickering, investigative reporter, apparently the prince is suing FOX`s Bill O`Reilly. Why?
PICKERING: Well, where would we be without another lawsuit in this case. Nancy?
GRACE: I don`t know. I would be out of business, that`s where I would be.
PICKERING: Me, too. What happened in this case is that Prince von Anhalt went on Bill O`Reilly and he said he was going to do a polygraph. O`Reilly, you know, put him up to it, and he said, "OK, I`ll do it." And then apparently von Anhalt turns up, but then he doesn`t want to do it, and then he kind of doesn`t participate.
So O`Reilly went on the air that night and said the guy is a fraud. Well, he`s now suing O`Reilly. Von Anhalt has filed a libel suit in the courts here in California, and he`s suing him for $10 billion. So let`s see where that one goes.
GRACE: OK, let`s unleash the lawyers on this one. Anne Bremner and Michael Mazzariello, it`s my understanding that Mr. O`Reilly said he was a liar and it was a fraud. Now, let me get this straight, because you know I`m a criminal trial lawyer, Anne Bremner. When you file a claim of libel or slander, don`t you get deposed under oath? Won`t von Anhalt get deposed on this?
GRACE: Will he finally -- you saw me trying to pin him down. Won`t he finally have to answer questions about paternity? Didn`t he offer to take a DNA test claiming he was the father of this baby?
GRACE: And the father of $475 million that comes with the baby?
BREMNER: Absolutely. He`ll have to be under oath, Nancy, answer questions under oath, and it will all come out in this case.
BREMNER: Ruh-roh is right.
GRACE: OK. And to you, Michael Mazzariello, here`s the deal. Either he is having an affair with Anna Nicole Smith and thinks he is the father, which makes him an adulterer to his wife, or he lied about it and he is not having an affair and claimed he was and wants to get his paternity test. And would that be a fraud on the court?
MAZZARIELLO: And I think that`s a fraud on the court, and I think that everyone should just grow up here, Nancy, and take the DNA test, and find out who the father is, and have a little respect for the deceased here.
GRACE: I just want to find out if O`Reilly is going to do the questioning during the deposition himself, OK? I want to find that much out.
OK. Affectionately termed "the prince," we`re talking about the Prince Frederic von Anhalt, the husband of Zsa Zsa Gabor.
Out to the lines. Julie in Missouri. Hi, Julie.
CALLER: Hi, how are you?
GRACE: I`m good, dear, what`s your question?
CALLER: I heard in an interview where Larry Birkhead said that he had (INAUDIBLE) during his visit. And could they get DNA from that? And also, because he seemed a lot more confident about being the birth father since then. And by the way, you`re lovely.
GRACE: You know what? Would you tell that to the defense bar? Thank you, Julie.
Out to you, Jean Casarez, joining us from Nassau, Bahamas. I had not heard that, the whole spit up DNA theory.
JEAN CASAREZ, COURT TV: No. Well, I`ve heard the spit-up. Larry Birkhead publicly said that, when he saw the baby that one time, that the baby threw up on him. But I think Larry Birkhead is trying to do this the right way. I don`t think he wants to go before a judge right here in Nassau, Bahamas, to get DNA without the consent of anyone that should be consented to. So I don`t think that`s the option.
GRACE: So down there, Jean, you are apparently breaking news. What is it?
CASAREZ: Well, Deborah Rose, who is the lead attorney for Virgie Arthur in the guardianship action, she told Court TV News that Virgie Arthur is going to be in person here tomorrow in Nassau. You know, they`re counterclaiming their guardianship action.
The lead action at this point is Larry Birkhead`s civil fraud case, saying you, Howard K. Stern, fraudulently put your name on the birth certificate, but there is a counterclaim for guardianship. And she told us today that they want custody of the child until the real father is determined.
GRACE: You know, that is breaking news, Jean. So not only do we have these various men all claiming they`re the baby`s father, biological dad; now you`ve got Virgie Arthur in on the action, wanting grandparent guardianship until parenthood is determined.
CASAREZ: That`s right. And the way I interpret that is, I think she and Larry Birkhead are working together now because if, in fact, she, as next of kin, could become the guardian of this child, in a second she`s going to consent to that child having a DNA test.
GRACE: Man, you`re not kidding, Jean Casarez. And, also, Jean, what can you tell me about Bahamian social services?
CASAREZ: Well, I spoke with the director of social services here in Nassau. And she said, first of all, that they have not launched an investigation because no one has filed a complaint.
She said, though, the supreme court of the Bahamas directed her, the last time they had a hearing, for her to conduct a background check on all of the parties. We`re talking about Virgie Arthur, Larry Birkhead, and Howard K. Stern.
She`s been doing that, by talking to the parties, by making some home visits, by also talking with agencies in the United States to truly do that background check. And she said that the supreme court wants her report as far as she has gotten in it tomorrow at the hearing.
GRACE: To you, David Caplan, on the issue of the laptop, I don`t want to gloss over that. David Caplan, New York bureau chief with "Star." What do you think is on the computer? As we were told earlier, there`s two computers, including the one in the room where we believe she died.
CAPLAN: This computer could be a gold mine. I`m hearing that there are waybills from doctors sending her drugs. She kept copies of them on her computer, plus, correspondence, e-mails between Anna and her doctors. She was very hands-on when she got these prescriptions. And this is going to give investigators a great insight into the frequency of how often she took medication, the type of medication, the doses. So it really is a gold mine, and that`s why investigators want to get their hands on it.
GRACE: To you, Dr. Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst joining us tonight. It seems as if the laptop is really turning into a modern-day diary.
BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST: It`s a modern-day diary, and I think it could be important in terms of a forensic psychiatric investigation because, you know, people write things in their e-mails, and they think they put a private password on it, and no one is going to get to it, and they never imagine that people will, so they put very private things in there. And what I want to know is, was she bonded to her daughter? Did she have suicidal ideation or was there a future-mindedness to the e-mails?
Had she heard the reports -- I`m sure she did -- that people were saying that Howard Stern had supplied drugs to her son, Daniel, and that had contributed to his death? And if so, was she angry at him? And how did she handle him? And these are very important questions that speak to her state of mind that I think it will be very important in this little computer diary.
GRACE: And to you, Dr. Joshua Perper, would something she had written in her diary affect your thought on cause or manner of death?
PERPER: Oh, her state of mind is certainly significant. That`s something which you always look in every investigation.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VIRGIE ARTHUR, ANNA NICOLE SMITH`S MOTHER: I was so upset when my grandson died, and I tried to tell everybody that he didn`t voluntarily die, and I tried to tell my daughter that she was going to be next to die.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: She certainly did. That is Virgie Arthur, Anna Nicole`s mother, the grandmother of Daniel, also dead at 20. Out to you, Pat Brown. You got Daniel at age 20 dead of methadone and other drug mixture. Now, Anna Nicole dead of allegedly methadone and other drug mixture. Why is the case turning criminal, or is it?
BROWN: I don`t know that it is, Nancy. I think they`re trying to not leave any stone unturned, but here is the biggest problem: Anna Nicole was a druggy. Anna Nicole had ideations of suicide. She`s said so. Anna Nicole had lots of bizarre behavior.
Now, that`s going to be hard, then, if she does die of an overdose of drugs, to prove somebody else did it. So that is going to be the trick. Is it really somebody else involved? And it`s very difficult to prove unless there`s some real hidden information we don`t know about.
GRACE: Agree or disagree, Bethany?
MARSHALL: Well, I think the coffin dream says it all. Daniel had the dream about her being in the coffin. May have been a prescient dream, but she was in a coffin, even as she was live. She liked downers. She was somnambulistic. She slept all day. She was seemingly on her way out.
GRACE: We`ll find out in the weeks that come. Tomorrow morning, Jean Casarez there in the courtroom, there at the courthouse in the Bahamas as the paternity case goes forward. Thank you to Jean and to Dr. Perper.
Tonight, let`s stop to remember Army Private First Class Darrell Shipp, 25, San Antonio, killed, Iraq. Headed to college, he e-mailed home regularly by Web cam, loved drag racing, retro-fitting cars, especially his Ford Mustang, got multiple trophies racing. He loved bass guitar and playing with his band, Celebrate Tuesday. Darrell Shipp, American hero.
Thank you for inviting us into your homes. NANCY GRACE signing off. Good night, friend.