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Governor Appoints Review Panel to Examine Virginia Tech Massacre; Congress Grills Attorney General Alberto Gonzales

Aired April 19, 2007 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: And the next hour of the NEWSROOM begins right now.
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Don Lemon, live at the CNN world headquarters in Atlanta.

WHITFIELD: And I'm Fredricka Whitfield.

NBC shared it. A lot of us aired it. But did we really need to see it? Media critic Howard Kurtz joins us to talk about the multimedia manifesto left by Cho Seung-Hui.

LEMON: And the Virginia Tech massacre as viewed by the rest of the world -- second thoughts about the Second Amendment.

You are live in the CNN NEWSROOM.

It is the top of the hour, and we want to tell you about a press conference that should get under way shortly from the governor of Virginia, Tim Kaine. As you know, he flew back from Asia. He was there visiting Asia and flew back after this tragedy. He's expected to hold a press conference from Richmond, Virginia, within the hour. As soon as that happens, we will bring it to you right here in the CNN NEWSROOM.

Now let's get you up to date on the aftermath of the Virginia Tech massacre.

WHITFIELD: One of the wounded students was released from the hospital today. That's some good news. Three more could be discharged later on today or even tomorrow.

LEMON: And NBC is defending its decision to air photos and video it received in a package from the gunman. The network says the images help explain the motive for the crime.

WHITFIELD: According to the postmark, the package NBC received was mailed at 9:01 a.m. That information helps further establish a timeline for Monday's events.

LEMON: And, Fredricka, the first two shootings occurred at West Ambler Johnston Hall at 7:15 a.m. That means Cho Seung-Hui stopped to mail the package after the first attack, but before he began the second attack at Norris Hall at 9:45 a.m.

Now, Cho Seung-Hui's so-called manifesto has provoked plenty of talk. But police say it has provided no new leads for their investigation into the Virginia Tech massacre.

CNN's Brianna Keilar is standing by in Blacksburg with the very latest for us.

And, Brianna, I want to ask you, how are students reacting to the airing of this so-called manifesto from Cho?

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, Don, a lot of them are just very tired of seeing the video. Some of them say it served a purpose, but it doesn't serve a purpose now, and it's just become gratuitous.

Also, we heard during a press conference today from the head of Virginia State Police, Steve Flaherty. He said that he wasn't happy with the decision by NBC to release that video. NBC responded, saying that they took careful consideration in determining what went to air. They didn't rush it to air, and they consulted with local authorities.

And they justified their decision by saying, we believe it provides some answers to the critical question, why did this man carry out these awful murders?

Joining me now, Matt and Brittany, a senior and a junior here at Virginia Tech.

So, you heard that statement. And this is what a lot of people are saying, that it did serve some purpose.

Brittany, do you think it did?

BRITTANY SHANKS, VIRGINIA TECH STUDENT: Yes. I definitely it -- I understand why the news stations were playing it, and I think it might have answered some questions or maybe why he even did it in the first place.

But now I think it's just getting a little bit repetitive. And it hurts to watch it, even -- I didn't know anyone that was harmed, but it still hurts me to watch it.

KEILAR: Now, you do know someone who knew someone. And this definitely had an impact on them. Can you tell me about your experience, Matt?

MATT ODHNER, VIRGINIA TECH STUDENT: Well, we were just hanging out, actually, just spending time with each other last night. And the video was aired. It was the first time I had seen it, actually.

And my friend just kind of broke down crying right there in front of us, all of us. And we just didn't know what to do. So, we just changed the channel. And it was -- I mean, it's really hard, you know? It's just the kind of thing, it just -- you are looking into the eyes of the guy who did this. So, it's just hard for everyone, I think, when you see that over and over again.

KEILAR: And, as we said, some people have said that it does serve a purpose. And a lot of us had questions. I mean, the big question that comes out because of something like this is, why would somebody do this?

Did it answer any of those questions for you, Matt?

ODHNER: Well, I mean, I don't think you are going to understand, really, why the guy did this. But it -- it helps to show that this kid was just full of fury, I mean, just rage, and was not a stable person at all.

So, it does -- I mean, it does serve a purpose kind of to give you a little bit of understanding. But, you know, obviously that question is never really going to be answered or justified. So...

KEILAR: This is, obviously -- oops -- Donovan (ph), the dog, is actually walking off with my microphone there.

(LAUGHTER)

KEILAR: But you brought your dog by. So, that's sort of a tradition here at the drill field. This is a very, very tight campus. Everyone is very close.

ODHNER: Extremely.

KEILAR: Extremely, you say.

And how -- how are people hanging in there? How are they coping together?

SHANKS: I think we are just -- a lot of people, a lot of my friends went home. But my mom came down and spent time with me. And I still have some friends that stayed. And I think people are just hanging out and getting together and talking about it, and coming to the drill field together and looking at things.

KEILAR: We heard today that the victims of this horrible tragedy are going to be giving -- given posthumous degrees.

But, then, also just talking about the students who are coping with this, you guys are going to have different options for how you proceed with your academic year. It's only, I think we are, what, a few weeks shy of the end of the school year?

ODHNER: About three.

KEILAR: About three weeks shy?

Have you guys decided what you are going to do? Are you going to finish out school? Are you going to finish out classes?

ODHNER: Yes. I mean, I'm a senior graduating. So, there's -- I mean, I kind of have to. It's -- right now, we're just kind of hearing about -- they are still determining what they are going to do. We just got sent an e-mail about an hour ago that said that they would probably leave it up kind of class to class making decisions.

So, we won't know, I think, until Monday, pretty much, how we're going to handle it.

KEILAR: And I know you have been getting a lot of support from your teachers, right, Brittany.

SHANKS: Mm-hmm. Yes, definitely.

I got probably an e-mail from all of my teachers, just asking to check in, like, send me an e-mail back or call just to make sure that you are OK. And these are classes that have over 300 students. And they are checking on every single one.

KEILAR: You guys hanging in there all right?

SHANKS: Yes. I mean, it's good to have my mom. Like I said, my mom is down here. And it's good to have family and friends around. So...

ODHNER: Yes. It's -- the only thing that really helps is just being around friends, which is kind of why I stayed here. I didn't want to go home and just be all the way up in Philadelphia, away from everyone. I wanted to be with fellow Hokies.

KEILAR: Well, Matt and Brittany, thank you so much for taking the time to talk with us. We really appreciate it. And, of course, our thoughts and prayers are with you and your friends.

ODHNER: Thank you very much.

KEILAR: All right. All right. Thanks very much -- all right, back to you guys.

LEMON: All right.

And, Brianna, you know what? It's -- we get a lot of insight from those interviews that you do, when we -- when you interview folks live there.

And we want to get you now to Richmond, Virginia, Governor Tim Kaine updating the situation at Virginia Tech.

(JOINED IN PROGRESS)

GOV. TIM KAINE (D), VIRGINIA: ... today, as we talk about the after-review of the incident at Virginia Tech and what we intend to do to look, in an independent and objective way, at all that has occurred.

As I indicated when I spoke with you before in Blacksburg, when I arrived in Virginia Tech on Tuesday afternoon, I spoke with president Charles Steger about the compelling need to do a review of the incident surrounding this tragic shooting.

President Steger said he completely agreed, had already spoken with his board about that, and asked me to prepare to lend or appoint law enforcement expertise to that effort. This morning, I received a letter from president Steger and the rector of the board of Virginia Tech, Jacob Lutz, asking me to take over supervision of this review, so that the university can focus on the two primary tasks that are currently before it, first, rallying around the victims and their families and those who are injured and recovering, and, second, completing the school year.

They don't need to have the additional burden of the after-review of these events distracting them from those core missions. I think that was a wise request. And I have agreed to do this. I am now appointing an independent review panel to look at all the circumstances surrounding this horrible event, so that we can examine everything that happened and hopefully learn from it.

The panel will review all of the events. And I would basically say that the topics for review by the panel will fall into three primary categories, first, everything we know about the young man who was the perpetrator. What was his interaction with the mental health system? What kind of treatment did he receive or did he not receive? What were the warning signs? Who was warned? What was done?

What did -- what did he do to acquire these weapons? How did he learn to use the weapons? We need to find out everything we can about this young man.

Second, we need to find out all of the circumstances surrounding the shooting, those hours on Monday morning, from the first incident until the individual committed suicide. And, so, minute by minute, to the best of our ability, we will work to determine all of the circumstances and events surrounding the shooting.

And, third, we need to delve into all the circumstances surrounding the response, the law enforcement response, the emergency medical response, the coordination of medical care at the various hospitals to which victims were taken, the response of our medical examiner's office, and the -- dealing with the victims and their families. And those are the three areas, in broad scope, that I have asked the commission to examine as we go forward.

In choosing someone to lead the commission, I have asked a person of great reputation and career in Virginia, Colonel Gerald Massengill, retired superintendent of the Virginia State Police. I indicated yesterday it was my intent to appoint Colonel Massengill to such a commission. I have asked him to lead it, now that the task is mine, because he has an unmatched record of success in the state police, but also working in very, very difficult circumstances that would be similar to this.

Colonel Massengill was chief of the state police during the sniper incidents in Northern Virginia, very complicated, multi- jurisdictional instances, and also during the 9/11 attack on the Pentagon, and was significantly involved in after-action reviews of both of those incidents.

It is a great gift to the commonwealth that Colonel Massengill has agreed to step forward immediately, without hesitation, to lead this independent review panel.

There are other members as well that I have sought out and that have agreed to serve in this capacity, five other members that I will mention now, and then two other areas of expertise in which I suspect that we will name members shortly.

Second, Tom Ridge, the first U.S. secretary of Homeland Security, previously served as governor of Pennsylvania and member of Congress, has agreed to serve. Secretary Ridge brings great public safety, broad public safety expertise to this task.

Gordon Davies -- Gordon Davies was the longtime head of the State Higher Ed Council. I think it's very important , as we look at these security issues, to recognize that they aren't just generic issues. They are security issues in the context of a college environment, that place where youngsters go to experience independence, often for the first time in their life, where they are learning and growing and expanding their horizons.

Anything we do, any recommendations we make have to take account of the unique aspect of a college campus. And Gordon Davies' long career in higher education in Virginia and Kentucky will serve the panel well.

Roger Depue -- Roger was a 20-year veteran of the FBI, most recently with the FBI as administrator of the FBI National Center for Analysis of Violent Crime. He's written extensively about perpetrators of mass crimes such as this. And he has agreed to serve. That will be extremely helpful.

Bela Sood -- Bela Sood is a psychiatrist who is chair of child and adolescent psychiatry at the Virginia Treatment Center for Children at VCU. Bela Sood is acknowledged, probably, in Virginia as the preeminent adolescent psychiatrist, has written extensively on issues of adolescent depression. She has a tremendous knowledge of the mental -- both mental health issues with adolescents, but also the mental health system in Virginia, temporary detaining orders, the court involved -- court procedures for those with mental illness, and will serve well.

And, finally, Dr. Marcus Martin -- Dr. Marcus Martin is the assistant dean for the School of Medicine at the University of Virginia. His expertise is in emergency room medicine. The work of the different hospitals in the area are critical and have to be examined as part of this independent review panel. And Dr. Martin will bring that expertise to the table.

There are two other areas of expertise that I'm in dialogue right now. And I would suspect, very promptly, I will make two other appointments to the panel, first, someone who has worked in the field of services to crime victims. And, second, I am looking to appoint a retired judge that has significant expertise in the issues surrounding the legal statutes regarding mental health in Virginia.

That would make a total of eight members to the commission, which has the expertise necessary to marshal this job, without being so large as to be unwieldy.

It is my hope that this commission will work promptly. The timing of the commission really needs to be up to the commission, as they convene and meet and talk about their work.

But, in speaking with Colonel Massengill, it will be our expectation that recommendations from the commission would be available before fall, before the school season starts again on college campuses around Virginia and around this nation.

We want the process -- and, again, that will be hashed out by the commission members when they first convene. But our goal is -- and Colonel Massengill and I share this -- that this be independent and objective, and that it be as public and transparent as possible.

We want people to have confidence in the -- in the findings and recommendations of this commission. And, to the degree that we can be as open as possible, we believe that will help accomplish that goal.

With that, I will now offer Colonel Massengill a chance to say a few words. Then, we would be glad to take your questions.

Thank you.

COLONEL GERALD MASSENGILL, FORMER VIRGINIA STATE POLICE SUPERINTENDENT: Governor, let me start, let me preface any comments I might have by -- from the heart, thanking you for the trust that you have placed in me.

I realize that the undertaking that I have been given is an awesome one, and one that's important to, not only Virginians, but people across this nation.

I think what -- what I would like to say about the process will be somewhat -- somewhat echoing some of the things the governor just said. It's awfully important to me that this process be filled with integrity. And, of course, that -- that starts with the members that have been put on this panel. And I hope that you can see, from the background and the experiences that these people are going to bring, that we will have the integrity necessary to address all of these issues.

And they are many. There are many questions out there that need answers. I would say, in that vain, too, those answers, although you, me and probably most Virginians would like to see them come promptly -- and, certainly, that's what we would hope for -- it's more important, I think, that it -- those answers come after a deliberate process has been put forward to make sure that we know what the facts are, to make sure that we know what questions to ask.

All the areas that the governor spoke to, I'm in total agreement, need addressing, need looking at. And let me say, folks, as sincerely as I can say it, because I know, any time that you have -- call it whatever you want to call it -- an after-action report, a critique, a post-incident review, you are looking behind what other people have done. That's not the purpose of this particular review. This is a case study of a very tragic incident that has occurred, unfortunately, in Virginia. We're not trying to second-guess anyone with any decision or with any action that was taken.

But, at the same time, I want it clearly understood, our purpose is to address those things that need to be brought forward, and strategies, policies, processes, whatever it might be, that would make Virginia safety -- safer.

So, while we are not going out there to second-guess people, we are going out there to, as the governor said, find some lessons to learn. And that's what this is all about, the pre-planning and all of those phases that deal with emergency response and medical response.

The role of different individuals, were those roles proper? And were the policies in place to give all of those people that had to make these difficult decisions the guidance necessary to see that decisions were made?

LEMON: That is a former chief of the Virginia State Police, Colonel Gerald Massengill, speaking there. The governor has appointed him the head of this independent review panel that he has set up to look at the case here, what happened at Virginia, what they knew about the gunman, he said, what they knew about his past, and how they handled the situation.

On that panel, of course, it's important to point out, Tom Ridge, who was the first secretary of homeland security and former governor of Pennsylvania, will also be on that independent review panel. And they expect to have recommendations, they say, before the start of next year, before the start of the fall semester.

We have been following the situation happening in Yuba, California, breaking news happening there, schools on lockdown because of a man who is apparently -- or was on a rampage. We are going to check to see if he's still on a rampage, made some very threatening comments.

Let's get you to Undersheriff J. Paul Parker from Sutter County Sheriff's Department.

Is this man still on the loose, sir?

J. PAUL PARKER, SUTTER COUNTY, CALIFORNIA, UNDERSHERIFF: Yes, sir, he is.

LEMON: He is.

Tell us about the suspect and what he did.

PARKER: Yesterday evening, at about 7:30 in the evening, a Jeffery Carney called -- 28 years of age -- called his family members and a local pastor and made statements to them that he was going to make Virginia Tech look mild in comparison, that he was armed with an AK-47 and some improvised explosive devices, and that he wanted to commit suicide by cop.

We, in turn, took that information, began an immediate search for the subject. We included the surrounding four law enforcement agencies, which has branched out since then. And we also, yesterday evening, contacted the local school districts just to make them aware of the situation.

LEMON: So, he made these threats yesterday evening? What gives you any indication that he is serious about this? Have you seen him? Has anyone spotted him? Has he done anything that may seem out of the ordinary, besides making these comments?

PARKER: He has been arrested several times just lately on some domestic violence issues, which we look at very closely. We also have reason to believe that he's been consuming methamphetamine.

And, listening to some of the voice messages last night, it -- it is apparent that he may be actually exhibiting some symptoms of methamphetamine psychosis. So, this is something that we cannot ignore.

LEMON: And, again, armed, you believe, with an AK-47 rifle, right? And he said also that he had improvised explosive devices, and poison, as well, Undersheriff?

PARKER: That was the information that was relayed to that -- to us. And, until we find out different, we will run on those assumptions.

LEMON: All right, Undersheriff J. Paul Parker, thank you very much for that.

If we can get the picture -- that's a picture of the suspect they are looking for right now. Again, they can tell you -- they have been telling you that he's lost a little weight since then -- but that's what he looks like -- because of that methamphetamine use -- Fredricka.

WHITFIELD: Well, now back to Blacksburg, Virginia, where the campus of Virginia Tech is still reeling.

Our Anderson Cooper is there.

Anderson, you have had a chance to talk to a lot of people on campus. People are trying to cope in so many different ways. What are you learning and hearing there?

ANDERSON COOPER, HOST, "ANDERSON COOPER 360": Well, certainly the big news today is the governor's announcement just a few moments ago that he is going to take over entirely this independent review of exactly what happened.

There are so many unanswered questions. It's one of the things we are going to be focusing on tonight on "360" at 10:00, some of the unanswered questions about the gunman, about Cho. We are talking to relatives of his in South Korea today. We're hearing from family members for the first time, who said that he was very quiet as a child, one relative saying that he was diagnosed with autism. All of those things, we are investigating. It is not clear if that is true at this point. We are trying to verify as much information as possible.

There is still so much unknown about what happened on Monday. Also, one of the things that this independent review is going to be looking at is the response by officials here, and also trying to figure out exactly why Cho selected the locations that he did. That's one of the things that we're investigating, as well, Fredricka.

But it is a day of continued mourning. You know, often, the first day or two, there's a certain amount of adrenaline which kind of gets people through. Now the shock is wearing off. The reality is very much setting in, and people here very much just trying to come to grips, as best they can, with what happened here -- Fredricka.

WHITFIELD: Difficult times and still difficult days ahead.

Anderson Cooper, thanks so much.

Folks will be watching tonight, 10:00 Eastern, "ANDERSON COOPER 360" -- much more of the NEWSROOM right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: U.S. Attorney General Alberto Gonzales back in the hot seat. He answered some pretty blistering questions under oath this morning about the controversial firings of eight federal prosecutors. And now he's back for more.

Let's go to Capitol Hill and Andrea Koppel.

Is it equally sizzling in that chamber?

ANDREA KOPPEL, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I would say it is absolutely snap, crackle and pop sizzling, Fredricka.

And what's been most striking to me, watching this now for the last number of hours, is that the line of questioning, the tough questioning, isn't just coming from Democrats. It's coming from many Republicans on this committee.

In fact, just a few moments ago, one Republican, Tom Coburn of Oklahoma, actually called for Gonzales to offer his resignation. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. TOM COBURN (R), OKLAHOMA: To me, there has to be consequences to accepting responsibility. And I would just say it's -- Mr. Attorney General, it's my considered opinion that the exact same standards should be applied to you in how this was handled.

And it was handled incompetently. The communication was atrocious. It was inconsistent. It's generous to say that there were misstatements. That's a generous statement. And I believe you ought to suffer the consequences that these others have suffered. And I believe the best way to put this behind us is your resignation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KOPPEL: Needless to say, some jaws dropped when Senator Coburn made that comment.

And, really, we have seen now, for the last four hours or so, Fredricka, almost every single Republican expressing skepticism, expressing doubt, leading people to believe they are just not buying what Gonzales is saying, that these eight -- these eight U.S. attorneys were fired, were let go, for the fact that they did not perform their jobs the way that they should have.

And the question that Democrats have raised coming into this hearing was whether or not they were let go for political reasons, whether or not they were let go because they were being too aggressive in some cases in prosecuting political individuals, Republicans, like Duke Cunningham in California.

And, so, this was a make-or-break hearing for Alberto Gonzales. And we will know, probably in the next few hours, what the consensus of the Republicans on this committee has been.

WHITFIELD: And is there a feeling that everyone is getting in their questions today, that this potentially could go into a second day of questioning?

KOPPEL: Not yet. I think that -- I think that there's the possibility that the attorney general could be called back at a future date.

But I think, at this stage, they -- they hope to wrap things up by the end of the day.

WHITFIELD: All right, Andrea Koppel, on Capitol Hill, thank you so much.

LEMON: All right, well, he took the time to make it and send it, but should we use it on our air to show it?

Straight ahead in the CNN NEWSROOM, media critic Howard Kurtz, he weighs in on the killer's final words.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: On the right-hand side of your screen you are seeing live pictures of an intensive search under way out of Yuba City, California.

The search is on for 28-year-old man by the name of Jeffrey Thomas Carney. Police are responding to what they believe to be some very serious threats that he made. Such that it has led to Yuba and Sutter Schools to be on lockdown. And so the search is under way for this man, Jeffrey Thomas Carney as schools remain on lockdown. Police are asking for the public's cooperation. If anyone is to see that man to contact authorities right away.

Also, we've been following the testimony happening in Washington, Alberto Gonzales. Joining us now from the White House, our White House Correspondent Suzanne Malveaux who has some new and very interesting information on that.

Suzanne?

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Don, earlier today we got the White House official reaction from Tony Fratto saying that Gonzales has been doing an excellent job of explaining his side. That he's been very consistent, that he's been willing to answer tough questions, take responsibility and bring more context to the process. He also said that the president still has confidence in Alberto Gonzales. But I have to tell you, people who we have spoken to, White House insiders, those involved in discussions with members, senior staff behind me in this building, as well as outside, are saying that Gonzales is in trouble.

These are from multiple sources, very consistent here, Don. They are saying so far, I just want to read a couple of things describing the testimony as -- from two senior White House level aides, going down in flames. Not doing himself any favors. That this was predictable. One prominent Republican describing the testimony this way as watching, clubbing a baby seal.

Clearly, these people are saying, look, this all hangs on one person and that is the president. Also, sources saying that, look, this is very troubling. They don't understand the tactic that Gonzales used here. One of them saying that it simply seemed as if he was saying, I know what I did, but I don't have any other information besides that.

People inside the White House are described as being shocked. That he did not win over any Democrats, perhaps lost a few Republicans as well. That everyone is putting their best face forward here, but they are not optimistic and essentially the White House, Don, is in a wait and see mode. In the next couple of days to see how members of Congress and the public look at Gonzales in these hearings. And whether or not this is going to have further fallout.

But there are no decisions made by this president. It is certainly up to him whether or not Gonzales stays or goes, but the people inside of this administration believe that he is in deep, deep trouble.

Don?

LEMON: Suzanne Malveaux reporting from the White House. Thank you, Suzanne.

WHITFIELD: Back to the Virginia Tech tragedy. NBC network and others are taking some heat for releasing and airing new images of the Virginia Tech shooter, Cho Seung-Hui. Virginia Governor Tim Kaine commented just moments ago about those images.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TIM KAINE, VA GOVERNOR: I think there's a sense of overkill. I'm a parent. I've got three kids who watch TV. I think any parent would have a sense that there is overkill in this. In ways that I am not sure serve a valuable purpose. I don't own a TV network, and I don't own a newspaper so I don't spend too much time, you know, worrying about things I can't control.

But as a parent, I believe that some of it has been overdone in ways that I don't think serve any valuable purpose.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Those comments from the governor just moments ago and later on throughout the evening in the "Situation Room" and again on "Anderson Cooper 360" more evaluation of those images and the fire that's been sparked as a result.

LEMON: Let's continue to talk about that. Images of Cho Seung- Hui's wanted, people wanted to see it. Many of the victims' classmates, friends and family say that's exactly why CNN and other networks shouldn't air Cho's pretaped confessions and his photos.

We asked a media critic, "Reliable Sources's" Howard Kurtz, to weigh in on this one. He joins us from Washington. I was reading what you wrote this morning in the "Washington Post," Howard. And it starts by saying, "was it a public service to air the words of hate filled diatribe of Cho Seung-Hui last night after his final mailing showed up at the network, or was NBC giving a mass murderer what he wanted?"

What did you --

HOWARD KURTZ, MEDIA CRITIC: A lot of people angry out there saying that NBC and the other networks are giving a psychopath what he wanted by airing too much of this hate-filled, profane video and the pictures and the statements and all of that. It was all over television last night and this morning as others followed NBC's lead and picked up those images.

NBC faced a difficult journalistic dilemma this. material was clearly newsworthy at a time when so many people were wondering what was going through this madman's mind. They tried to resolve it by airing just a small portion of the material he had mailed to NBC. But that, nevertheless, has really infuriated a lot of folks.

LEMON: I'm going to read NBC's response to that. I have to say this morning and, you know, in the "New York Times," you know, the cover of the "New York Times," it's not just television. Also this morning, too, Howard, the very own "Washington Post," the cover of your newspaper. We have a picture of that. Had it on the front cover as well. Then again on your web site. And then "USA Today" had it as well. The "Atlanta Journal-Constitution." So it's not just television here. Are you saying it's just television's fault?

KURTZ: No. No. No. Absolutely no question that every single newspaper that chose to put those images on the front page as opposed to putting it inside the paper was using its medium to do the same thing. To thrust this in the face of people who might be reading the paper or passing a newsstand or whatever.

The reason television has attracted most of the heat, NBC in particular, since they controlled this material and could have chosen to release it or not. Is simply that the video is more powerful than moving pictures and listening to the words of Cho are more powerful, more disturbing. And I sympathize with NBC's dilemma.

If it were up to me, I would have shown maybe a snip-it. To show as much as they did and all the other networks did in joining in. Really, I think, rubbed a lot of people the wrong way. That's why I've talked to lots of executives who said we're pulling back. We're not going to turn this into video wallpaper. Because they realize many people are offended.

LEMON: And Howard, do you have to think that no matter what you would have done as a news organization if you chose not to air it or not put it on the cover of your paper you'd still get some criticism about it?

KURTZ: Oh, absolutely. If NBC went the other direction or some cable network said we're not going to join in the stampede. We're not going to play this game, a lot of people would say, you aren't discharging responsibility as a news organization. As distasteful as this is, it's huge. It's a huge national tragedy. We want to know more about the sick, twisted mind of this killer.

LEMON: Just as a matter of fairness. NBC News responded, Steve Capus, the President of NBC News said, "we believe in part. We believe it provides some answers to the critical question, why did this man carry out these awful murders? The decision to run this video was reach by virtually every news organization in the world, as evidenced by coverage on television, on web sites and also in newspapers."

So that is their response to that. I want to get to, we've been getting response from our viewers about this. As I'm sure your readers at the "Washington Post" have been responding. I have to say, most of them have not been positive. Jessica is a college student in South Carolina. Howard, I want you to respond to this. Students who lost their lives didn't get a chance to say their final good-byes. Why are we letting the sociopath who took their lives and futures from them say his?

KURTZ: Well, that's a very good question. It is frankly difficult to answer. On the one hand there's this natural journalistic and human curiosity about what drove this crazy lunatic to snuff out the lives of 32 people at the Virginia Tech campus. On the other hand, I do think that now that he's had his 12 hours or 18 hours of having his video played, the focus journalistically ought to return to those who lost their lives, their friends, their family members.

I think generally television and the media have done a sensitive job in deal with that.

LEMON: OK. We are running out of time here. Here's what people are going to say. Even if it shows at the very least the pain that this very disturbed individual was going through and the possible consequences of that, if it goes unchecked. Some people are saying that is the reason that that video should have aired.

KURTZ: Well, you know, it's newsworthy. I don't think there's any debate about that. Every single news organization reached the same decision. It doesn't mean we have to turn our outlets into a platform for a lot of this stuff. It's disturbing. It's chilling. And I am not surprised so many people are angry today.

LEMON: Howard Kurtz, media critic. "RELIABLE SOURCES" and also the "Washington Post," thank you very much.

KURTZ: Thank you.

WHITFIELD: What happened at Virginia Tech has also provoked this question: how safe are the nation's college campuses? It's something students, faculty and parents across the U.S. are asking this week.

So consider this, the Virginia Tech campus. Police force consists of 39 officers and 19 staff members serving and protecting more than 25,000 students.

CNN's Chris Lawrence sampled security at other college campuses across the country.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHRIS LAWRENCE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): On Cal State Fullerton's campus, plainsclothes and undercover officers patrol 24 hours a day. Each car carries assault rifles, and if one building is attacked, a public address system immediately warns everyone on campus.

LT. TOM GHERLS, CAL. STATE FULLERTON POLICE: We know if you are hearing the loud speaker, you are in proximity to the incident that's taking place.

LAWRENCE: The school beefed up security after a janitor on campus killed seven people in 1976.

(on camera): Cal State Fullerton is an open campus -- except for the dorms in which you need a special magnetic key card to get inside.

(voice-over): We contacted other schools across the country, the size of Virginia Tech or bigger. Ohio State's 44 officers are armed and go through actual police training. Same with Arizona, and they also carry tasers. Penn State's officers serve on regional bomb squad teams. Florida state have the most. Sixty-three officers who come armed with guns and tasers. For emergencies, FSU is installing a new P.A. system, and more than 4,000 subscribers have signed up for Penn State's emergency text message service. In fact, dozens of schools are spending about $1 per student to allow administrators to alert students through their cell phones. No schools we spoke to use a lockdown system on classroom doors, including USC. They say, there's rarely an emergency to warrant one.

CAPT. DAVID CARLISLE, USC PUBLIC SAFETY: In fact, Los Angeles Police Department would tell you that USC's University Park campus is probably the safest 150 acres in all of Los Angeles.

LAWRENCE: So safe, nearby Beverly Hills has a violent crime rate more than twice as high.

Chris Lawrence, CNN, Los Angeles.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: A fundamental right or fundamentally wrong? Ahead in the CNN NEWSROOM, how America's gun policies play in the rest of the world.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: All right, let's get you live now. At the bottom of your screen, you see two live pictures there from our affiliates in Yuba City, California. And what they're showing you is a town and some schools that are on lockdown because of a gunman who is on the loose who made some very threatening claims.

Now, here's what the Sheriff's Department tells us, CNN, that the schools in Yuba City, California, were ordered into lockdown after police there -- after they warned a man had threatened to go on a killing spree in schools saying that he would make the slayings in Virginia Tech look mild. They believe he is armed with an AK-47 rifle, improvised explosive devices and also poison.

Here is a description of that suspect, Jeffery Thomas Carney that they're looking for. Take a really good look at him. Twenty-eight- years-old, 6'1, 190 pounds, but he is not that size anymore. Police say he has lost some weight over the past couple of weeks since this picture was taken because of meth use. Brown eyes, short brown hair as you can see there. So take a good look at that man.

If you see him, make sure you call police. They believe he is armed and dangerous and he's the reason that Yuba City schools are on lockdown.

WHITFIELD: So, is it a fundamental right or is it fundamentally wrong? Straight ahead in the NEWSROOM, how America's gun policies play in the rest of the world.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: Monday's shootings at Virginia Tech have reignited the debate over gun control in this country. And it has also gotten a lot of people around the world taking aim at U.S. culture. One word keeps cropping up: violent. Here's CNN's Senior U.N. Correspondent Richard Roth.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

RICHARD ROTH, SR. UNITED NATIONS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Around the world, shock at the university massacre. But once again, disbelief at how easy it is to get a gun in America. London --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think the right to bear arms is stupid because it just means that people can go out and buy guns.

ROTH: And in Rome, at the university where one of the murdered professors once taught --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have crazy people here, but they have not guns. They have knives.

ROTH: Even an ally in the war in Iraq can't stomach U.S. gun policies.

JOHN HOWARD, AUSTRALIAN PRIME MINISTER: The gun culture that is such a negative in the United States would never become a negative in our country.

ROTH: Some of America's most acclaimed movies like "High Noon" have showcased America's gun culture and how it flourished in the wild west.

JOHN JACOBS, AUTHOR: People had to take care of their own security, their own defense. And, of course, hunt their own food. So that guns were early on a basic part of life.

ROTH: Hollywood's John Wayne portrayed American settlers driving west, conquering Indians and wild animals. A distrust of government authority in a rugged individual style took hold. But even before that, America's founding fathers enshrined the right to bear arms in the second amendment of the Constitution.

CHARLTON HESTON, ACTOR: From my cold, dead hands!

ROTH: Actor Charlton Heston, who once received the 10 commandments, vowed never to give up his gun or rights when he led the powerful National Rifle Association.

JOHN VALLECO, GUN OWNERS OF AMERICA: We have the second amendment right to bear arms and one of the principal reasons for that right is to defend ourselves.

PAUL HELMKE, BRADY CAMPAIGN AGAINST GUN VIOLENCE: The second amendment is the only amendment to the U.S. constitution that has the word "regulated" in it. Obviously, it contemplates at some level some regulation.

ROTH: The gun has changed American history. But even after assassinations and school bloodbaths, America's affection for guns is unabated. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I would recommend either a 9 millimeter or 45.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Very nice.

ROTH: This recent visitor, Borat, was blocked from buying a gun as a foreigner. But the laws are not restrictive enough to stop homegrown violence. 30,000 people die each year from firearms in the United States, far more than any other country.

REBECCA PETERS, INTL. ACTION NETWORK ON SMALL ARMS: America was a frontier society. But so are other countries, you know, Canada, Australia, Latin American countries, African countries were frontier societies, too. And that was a long time ago.

CLINT EASTWOOD, ACTOR, "DIRTY HARRY": Go ahead. Make my day.

ROTH (on camera): From movies to the streets, Americans have gotten used to the gun. And these sporadic rampages by lone gunmen are now part of American life.

Richard Roth, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: And it's time now to check in with CNN's Wolf Blitzer.

WHITFIELD: Standing by in the SITUATION ROOM to tell us what's coming up -- Wolf.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks very much, guys. We're back here in Washington in the SITUATION ROOM, and we're following all the latest developments in the Virginia Tech massacre, including the growing controversy over those chilling videos and pictures left behind by the gunman. Some students and victims, relatives, very angry those pictures are being broadcast. We're going to hear from them.

Also, the Attorney General Alberto Gonzales under fire on Capitol Hill over the firing of those eight federal prosecutors. We have details of the very, very contentious hearing.

Plus, the Defense Secretary Robert Gates makes a surprise visit to Baghdad as the city reels from spiraling violence that's left more than 200 people dead.

All that coming up in a few moments right here in the SITUATION ROOM. Back to you.

WHITFIELD: All right, we look forward to that. Thanks so much, Wolf.

LEMON: Closing bell and a wrap of all the action on Wall Street straight ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) LEMON: Come on, Liz Mercurick (ph). Turn around, turn around, you're on TV -- the back of her head.

WHITFIELD: I see the back of her head.

This is a woman in charge. Supervising producer Liz Mercurick who has been here for 25 years, today we celebrate with her and congratulate 25 incredible years. Girlfriend, you rock.

LEMON: Liz, give us a good look, look right in the camera. Give us a wave.

WHITFIELD: She's so shy.

LEMON: Congratulations and happy anniversary. She is really the glue, right, that holds this place together, Liz.

WHITFIELD: Yes, she's incredible, making great decisions every day on the kinds of news that you end up keep seeing on our air.

LEMON: Happy 25th, Liz Mercurick. And speaking of numbers, 25, Stock Market close to that today, Susan Lisovicz?

SUSAN LISOVICZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, can I offer my props to Liz?

LEMON: Oh, yes, absolutely.

LISOVICZ: Because I started out as a writer at CNN in the 1980s, and I had the pleasure of knowing her then and knowing her now, and it's well deserved.

WHITFIELD: We'll be celebrating your anniversary too then, Susan.

LISOVICZ: Right, Liz? You know, you know what it was like then when no one knew what CNN was.

LEMON: Well, now everybody knows. And it's thanks to you, people like you and to Liz Mercurick, right?

LISOVICZ: That's right, I mean she -- the -- really the infrastructure, the foundation of CNN. It's the people that work here.

(BUSINESS HEADLINES)

LISOVICZ: Meanwhile, the closing bell rings and the DOW has made it, 14 out of 15 winning session. Now it's on to Wolf Blitzer in the SITUATION ROOM.

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