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Nancy Grace

Virgie Arthur Tries One More Appeal in Bahamas

Aired April 26, 2007 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. In another unexpected twist, the parties square off for a legal showdown in the case of covergirl Anna Nicole Smith and her 7-month-old baby girl, the only heir, Dannielynn Smith, that baby set to inherit nearly half a billion dollars. And it`s growing. They were all set to jet off to the U.S. with Larry Birkhead, the biological dad. But no so fast. Now, in a last minute standoff, it appears that the maternal grandmother is putting up a fight. Just hours ago, Anna Nicole`s mom, Virgie Arthur, files a last-minute appeal to keep the plane from liftoff.
And tonight: Kidney dad -- a judge allows a Kentucky dad out of jail on one condition. He was in on robbery and dope charges. He was out to save his son`s life, to donate a kidney to his dying son. Instead, he goes on the lam with his girlfriend, headed to Mexico.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What do you have to say to your son (INAUDIBLE) You promised him a kidney and...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: With nothing to say to the son he deserted, Byron Perkins (ph) and girlfriend Leanne Howard (ph) were escorted back to the U.S. Authorities say they`ve been hopscotching around Mexico, doing odd jobs to keep under the radar. But their luck ran out.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Unfortunately for them, they came back to a place where everyone was looking for them. They had been there last year.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Perkins, nicknamed "the most hated dad in America," busted in Mexico, back in the U.S., in a heap of trouble, a dad who cried in front of a judge, who let him out of jail last year so he could donate a kidney for his son, Destin (ph), a son who desperately needed a kidney to live. Perkins fooled them all and took off running with his girlfriend.

It was only after CNN ran the story that tourists in Mexico recognized him and called police. The couple had run up a hotel and bar bills and skipped out on those, too. For over a year, U.S. marshals searched for the odd couple and finally caught up with them in Puerto Vallarto.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us tonight. First, an emergency hearing over the baby girl, the only descendant of covergirl Anna Nicole Smith.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Dannielynn may soon be coming to her new home in the United States with her new dad. A judge cleared the way for Birkhead to bring his baby home, with one condition: He has to bring her back in June for a full custody hearing. (INAUDIBLE) according to TMZ.com, says Anna Nicole`s mother, Virgie Arthur, objected and may appeal. Sources tell TMZ it may be too late, and Birkhead wants to leave within the next few days.

VIRGIE ARTHUR, ANNA NICOLE`S MOTHER: All I care about and all I`ve ever cared about is the safety and wellbeing of my little granddaughter, Dannielynn. And I look work forward to working with Larry, raising my granddaughter and doing what is very best for her.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Larry Birkhead and Howard K. Stern, after all these court battles, it was really surprising to me what Larry Birkhead told "OK!" magazine about Howard. He said this, Even Howard`s been helpful. It seems unlikely, but he`s been a great help.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What do you think Anna Nicole would think at this moment?

LARRY BIRKHEAD, ANNA NICOLE`S FORMER BOYFRIEND: I think she would be proud that I fought.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: A legal emergency hearing set for in the morning in a Bahama`s courtroom. It seems like just one month ago, the mom of Anna Nicole Smith was fighting tooth and nail to keep her daughter`s remains and those of her grandson from going to the Bahamas for burial, but now we learn this emergency hearing is to keep the granddaughter from leaving the Bahamas. What`s going on?

Out to Rob Chilton with "OK!" magazine. Rob, what`s happening?

ROB CHILTON, "OK!" MAGAZINE: Just when Larry thought that he had won and he had got his baby and was about to go back to the USA and he thought, It`s over, it`s done, it`s finished, This nightmare is over, another twist in the tale. You know, Virgie comes back to haunt him yet again. So it`s just another twist in this incredible, incredible story.

GRACE: Joining us tonight, a very special guest. Larry Birkhead`s sister is with us, Judy Birkhead. Judy, welcome back.

JUDY BIRKHEAD, LARRY BIRKHEAD`S SISTER: Thank you.

GRACE: You know, we thought that the chapter had been closed on the custody and most likely -- paternity and most likely the custody of Dannielynn Smith, the only heir to Anna Nicole Smith`s fortune. Not so. What happened?

JUDY BIRKHEAD: Well, I can`t really comment a lot on what`s going on because it is a closed proceeding. What I can tell you is that we`ve prevailed all along, and we have no doubt -- we have a strong faith, and we know that no matter what happens, we`re going to come through this OK and she`s going to come home.

It`s just sad that we have to go through this fighting because I know Larry had no intentions of keeping Virgie out of the baby`s life, and still doesn`t, and it`s sad that we have to prolong her going on with her life and having a normal -- a normal life she could have because of this. It`s just sad.

GRACE: Out to Tom O`Neil, senior editor with "In Touch Weekly." Tom, what is it that Virgie Arthur wants?

TOM O`NEIL, "IN TOUCH WEEKLY": Well, for starters, she doesn`t want to give up the spotlight. I think we`ve created a celebrity nightmare here. Come on, Nancy. This is not a very sophisticated woman. And all of a sudden, she`s in the spotlight, and she`s got her friends and her family and her attorneys egging her on, egging her on. We know she doesn`t have a leg to stand on, legally anyway. The only judge that matters here is Larry Birkhead, and she is alienating him.

GRACE: You know, the specific terms of what she wants, Rob Chilton with "OK!" magazine, this emergency hearing filed for tomorrow morning`s hearing in a Bahamas courtroom -- it`s my understanding that she wants is joint guardianship with Larry Birkhead. That`s not going to happen in the United States. There`s no grandparents` rights. She also wants sole guardianship in the event Larry Birkhead passes away.

We also know that she wants some type of control over the Howard Marshall estate. That`s where the $475 million comes in. And she also wants Birkhead to join with her in a lawsuit.

Let`s go out to the lawyers, Susan Moss, Darryl Cohen and Dan Horowitz. Out to you, Daniel Horowitz. What is she thinking? What does she want? What does she hope to gain by this emergency hearing?

DANIEL HOROWITZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, she only has the faintest amount of legal power in the Bahamas. In the United States, she`s just out of the court. But I want to know who`s funding her. Where are the hundreds of thousands of dollars coming from for this frivolous lawsuit that only hurts this baby and hurts the people who love her, her two fathers? Howard is also somebody, I think, who loves this child, as well. And they`re in agreement. The fathers are in agreement. Virgie is just somebody making trouble.

GRACE: Take a listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A major development in the custody case over Anna Nicole Smith and Larry Birkhead`s baby Dannielynn. Dannielynn may soon be coming to her new home in the United States with her new dad. In the Bahamas, the judge cleared the way for Birkhead to bring his baby home, with one condition: He has to bring her back in June for a full custody hearing. This is according to TMZ.com. It says Anna Nicole`s mother, Virgie Arthur, objected and may appeal. But sources tell TMZ it may be too late, and Birkhead wants to leave within the next few days.

LARRY BIRKHEAD: I hate to be the one that told you this, but I told you so! Thank you very much. There`s certain things that I can`t talk about, but this is one that I`m happy to talk about and -- my baby`s going to be coming home pretty soon. You know, it`s all up in the air. Nothing`s really determined, except parentage, and I`m the father. And it`s been a long road and I`m just happy to, you know, have this behind me and just to be able to start a life with my daughter.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Just when we thought this baby actually had a chance at a normal life -- out to you, Darryl Cohen. Darryl, does she have any legal leg to stand on? How -- I mean, can anybody just walk into court and demand guardianship?

DARRYL COHEN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, obviously, she can, but does she have a legal leg to stand on? No. She doesn`t even have an artificial leg to stand on. All she`s doing is she`s got the spotlight. I don`t know if she`s spending (ph) attorneys` fees or not. I have a feeling these lawyers may be doing it for the publicity, as well. I don`t know. But certainly, this case has long legs. I don`t know why she`s doing it. She`s hurting her chances of ever having a place in that -- her granddaughter`s life, and it makes no sense to me, other than she`s in the spotlight.

GRACE: Well, another thing we learned, Rob Chilton with "OK!" magazine, is that, apparently, she`s taken voluminous notes at every single hearing and showing up with a photo, a camera, taking photos outside the proceedings of the guards around the courthouse. Many believe it is the preparations for a book.

CHILTON: Yes, I think we should be expecting "Virgie: My Story" to hit bookshelves pretty soon. I mean -- and you know, (INAUDIBLE) probably going to be a big seller, you know? And I`m sure Larry is working on some kind of book. And you know, there`s going to be a lot of money-spinning (ph) deals in this. We`ve already have seen this week there`s a film being shot of Anna Nicole Smith`s life, you know? So yes, I`m sure Virgie has collected all her notes, and I`m sure she`ll, you know, try and spice it up, make it very juicy and try and sell a lot of copies of this story.

GRACE: Out to Mike Brooks, former D.C. cop and former fed with the FBI, who`s been in the Bahamas on the case. This latest stunt by Virgie Arthur, a lot of people can`t believe it. But remember, as Anna Nicole Smith`s body was en route to the burial, it all came to a halt there in that hot Bahamian sun while she filed another emergency appeal. Remember that?

MIKE BROOKS, FORMER D.C. POLICE, SERVED ON FBI TERRORISM TASK FORCE: Oh, absolutely, Nancy. I was at the cemetery. We had another reporter from CNN at the church. And everything just -- OK, stop. We got this court order. So you know, and I`m going, you know, Why did you do that, Virgie? I`m saying to myself.

But I sat next to her, and I`ve seen her take notes. She takes a lot of notes. I`ve seen her in the coroner`s inquest. I sat next to she and her husband, James, in the court of appeals and spoke with them. And basically, she was telling me, Nancy, that she wanted at least just to be a grandmother and to make sure that Dannielynn was OK. But now we`ve got this -- she wants joint guardianship. Now, there is joint guardianship in the Bahamas. It is allowed. But I seriously doubt if that`s going to happen.

GRACE: With the grandmother?

BROOKS: Well, it can be with whomever. I can be with the grandmother. It can be with the father. It can be with, you know, a guardian ad litem and the father. It can be whoever the court says it can be. But I seriously doubt that this is going to happen, Nancy.

GRACE: An emergency hearing set for tomorrow morning in a Bahamian courtroom. the mom of Anna Nicole Smith now insists baby Dannielynn not leave the Bahamas.

Out to the lines. Claude in Canada. Hi, Claude.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. I like your show.

GRACE: Thank you, dear. What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I would just want to know, how come she, Virgie, keeps on stopping every motion with the court? I`m just -- I don`t understand that.

GRACE: You mean how can she do it financially?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Not financially, but every situation, with the body, the release of the body, whatever it is.

GRACE: Claude?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes?

GRACE: Claude, I remember when I prosecuting, I actually got a motion filed by an inmate demanding damages, thousands of dollars of damages, for crumbled cookies served to him at the jail.

I think that pretty much sums it up, Susan Brown. How can she keep filing motions? As long as her lawyers have an imagination, she can file motions, Susan.

SUSAN BROWN, LARRY BIRKHEAD`S ATTORNEY: That`s true. However, there were sanctions levied against Mr. Stern by the appellate court, and the same thing may happen here.

GRACE: What do you mean?

BROWN: Mr. Stern was sanctioned for filing what they deemed to be a frivolous motion in the appellate court in the Bahamas. Who knows? Hopefully, there will be similar sanctions in this case.

GRACE: Susan...

BROWN: Enough`s enough.

GRACE: Susan Brown is the attorney for Larry Birkhead. She`s joining us tonight. Was Birkhead set to leave tomorrow to come back to the U.S.?

BROWN: I don`t want to get into such personal specifics. I`m concerned about the gag order. You may want to talk to Judy about that. But certainly, Larry had plans to return to the U.S. with his baby.

GRACE: With us is Larry Birkhead`s sister, Judy Birkhead. It`s our understanding he was leaving and taking the baby to head to Kentucky to see his family.

JUDY BIRKHEAD: Well, he has -- things are up in the air right now, but he had some things that he needed to do before he came home. We have family that -- my dad has not seen the baby yet. His mom has not seen the baby yet. My sister. Angela (ph), in Houston and her children, Justin (ph) and Chloe (ph), haven`t seen the baby. So of course, he wants to come home and will do that as soon as possible. We`re looking forward to it. But unfortunately, with all of this going on, it`s just hindering his plans.

GRACE: Out to Susan Moss, family attorney, child advocate. What do you make of the newest motion?

SUSAN MOSS, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: Well, if this child leaves the Bahamas, then Larry Birkhead will have a very strong argument that the Bahamian court should decline jurisdiction and that this should all be kicked to California. That would be devastating for Virgie Arthur because in Bahamian courts, at least she has a chance. In California, she does not.

But you`re very right. This is all about the money, honey. You know, there`s no Ronald McDonald house for Virgie Arthur. She is paying to stay in the Bahamas for months and months on end, and it`s all because she wants a chance to get to this child`s millions.

GRACE: Do you think, Rob Chilton with "OK!", that someone is funding her?

CHILTON: Well, I mean, nothing would surprise me in this case. You know, there`s been so many incredible truths and revelations that have been unearthed, it wouldn`t surprise me if there is something slightly shady.

GRACE: What about it, Tom O`Neil?

O`NEIL: (INAUDIBLE) publicly she had said her friends and her family have been supporting her. Howard K. Stern has said the same, where he`s getting his money. Nobody`s claiming or admitting that they`re getting money from outside media sources paying them for their stories, so they claim it`s all clean.

GRACE: Out to the lines. Ginger in North Carolina. Hi, Ginger.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy.

GRACE: How are you, dear?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Good.

GRACE: What is your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My question is, what, if any, legal consequences would there be if Larry Birkhead just took his child and carried her home and did not comply with Bahamian law and return back there for any kind of hearing?

GRACE: Ginger in North Carolina, I understand completely. I don`t believe any of our parents had to get a court order to take us out of state. Here`s the rub. It`s my understanding, Mike Brooks, there is still an order in place, which was originally set in place to keep Howard Stern from leaving the island with the baby, that says the baby cannot leave the island. Is that still in place?

BROOKS: As far as I know, Nancy. But you know, to get out of the -- to get out of the Bahamas, you need a passport. Does this baby now have a passport? I don`t think she does because you have to have a birth certificate to get the passport, and the birth certificate that`s still in the Bahamas, unless it has been changed, you know, unbeknownst to us, still has Howard Kevin Stern`s name on the place for the father.

GRACE: Leading me to my next legal point, Susan Brown. This is Larry Birkhead`s lawyer, I understand that your client, Mr. Birkhead, is seeking to legally alter the baby`s birth certificate. How do you go about doing that?

BROWN: Well, I`m not sure how you go about it in the Bahamas, but I believe with the court orders in place -- again, I want to be careful not to violate the gag order -- it`s a pretty simple matter of taking the court order to the public records office, vital statistics, whatever they`re called, and getting an order changing the birth certificate. It shouldn`t be too complicated. I don`t know what orders were actually issued by the court, but certainly, he`s the father. Nobody is disputing that now.

GRACE: Well...

BROWN: Not Virgie, not Howard, not anybody.

GRACE: We`ll all be right back. Right now, we have just learned that an emergency motion has been filed in the Bahamas to stop a photographer Larry Birkhead from finally coming home to the U.S. with baby Dannielynn. As you know, that 7-month-old baby girl set to inherit a $475 million estate. She is the sole heir to covergirl Anna Nicole Smith`s fortune. We`ll all be right back, taking your calls

But very quickly, to tonight`s case alert. New lead in the mystery surrounding the disappearance of a bank exec who vanishes into thin air. A man fitting Keith Gores`s (ph) description spotted at a local marina. That`s where Gores`s car was found abandoned. His wife convinced her husband suffering from dementia or amnesia, that morning. Before he went to work, Gores sat on the sofa thinking it was Saturday. When he got to town, he didn`t recognize a long-time co-worker, and then asked for directions to his local health club of 20 years, just three blocks away. If you have information, call St. Francis police, 414-481-2232.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It was taken in the Bahamas on Saturday. It was a really, really hot day. I was down there for the shoot, and so we had to keep covering Dannielynn in sun block and things like that to protect her. It went really, really well. As you can see, it`s on a private residence, so we had them in the pool, in the sea. It was just beautiful.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: That`s one of the reporters that took that photo spread of Larry Birkhead reunited with his baby girl, Dannielynn.

Out to the lines. Mona in Pennsylvania. Hi, Mona.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy.

GRACE: What`s your question, dear?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Can they use the videotape from when Anna Nicole Smith said she did not want her mother to touch her daughter?

GRACE: They did use it in court. I believe that was a tape of Anna Nicole Smith talking to "Entertainment Tonight," and it was actually played in court. I wonder if it will be played tomorrow morning. What about it? To you, Susan Brown. You`re Larry`s attorney.

BROWN: I don`t think it can be played because it`s an appellate court, and an appellate court is stuck with the evidence before the trial court, unless they handle things dramatically different there. So I don`t think that`s going to come in. But I think the fact they gave a quick hearing is a very good sign for Larry`s position, just like they gave a quick hearing in Florida and then let Anna Nicole`s body go. I don`t think Virgie`s appeal has any merit whatsoever. She`s a grandmother, she`s not a parent. Dannielynn has a parent, and that parent should be allowed to take his baby home.

GRACE: Back to Judy Birkhead. This is Larry Birkhead`s sister. I want to found out a little bit more about Dannielynn. I know you`ve been there with her, and you`re in very close touch with Larry Birkhead. What was their first night together like, that they actually got to spend together under one roof as a family?

JUDY BIRKHEAD: It was wonderful. I wish he was here to tell you himself. He got a chance -- he got a chance to see what fatherhood is all about. He woke up with her. He fed her, loved (ph) on her. And he took care of her. He -- it was great. It was heart-warming, and I just can`t even tell you how excited he was when we talked with him about it.

GRACE: Judy, who is helping him take care of the baby?

JUDY BIRKHEAD: He has a nanny, and of course, the nanny that was there is, I believe, still there. They`re doing a transition. But his nanny is there. And of course, Howard is in the home. But Larry mostly is taking care of the baby himself. He changes her. He gives her a bath. He feeds her. He does everything that a daddy would do. And he fell right into the fatherhood role very well. I`m proud of him.

GRACE: So it`s Birkhead, Stern and the baby all together under one roof?

JUDY BIRKHEAD: No, they`re not -- Larry`s not staying there. He goes and he watches the baby. He plays with her. He takes care of her during the day. He puts her to bed in the evening, and he`s there when she wakes up in the morning.

GRACE: So OK. Where does Birkhead stay? Stern`s still in the house with the baby?

JUDY BIRKHEAD: Yes.

GRACE: OK. I don`t think that`s what I really expected, Bethany Marshall. I thought that once he was named the biological dad, he would get the baby.

BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST: Well, but maybe -- I mean, Judy`s bringing out what`s so important, is that there`s a loving family there to receive this child. And now that there`s a loving family there, it might have a modulating influence on the whole situation, which may be that it has brought out a better side of Howard Stern, a more parental side, a more loving side, a more appropriate side.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BROOKE ANDERSON, CNN HEADLINE NEWS: The exclusive first photos of Larry Birkhead and baby Dannielynn together. "OK!" magazine was the first to score the pictures. Take a look at Larry Birkhead and Anna Nicole Smith`s daughter. This comes after seven months of court battles between Birkhead, the late Anna Nicole and Howard K. Stern, finally ending with the DNA proof that Larry was, indeed, the baby`s father.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: That is Headline News`s Brooke Anderson reporting. And tonight, it`s not over yet. Just when you thought the baby and the dad would ride off into the sunset, forget about it. Virgie Arthur, the biological maternal grandmother, has filed an emergency hearing for tomorrow morning, trying to stop that plane from taking off.

Out to the lines. Barry in Texas. Hi, Barry.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy.

GRACE: What`s your question, dear?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Will the fact that Virgie never hired an attorney to get -- or attempt to get Daniel away from, by her own admission, a drug-addicted mother in the 13 or so years they were estranged have any bearing on her argument?

GRACE: Very likely no. I don`t think she`s going to have a leg to stand on, Barry -- grandmother`s rights. Very quickly, Rob Chilton. Is it true she stood up Larry Birkhead for a visitation the past weekend?

CHILTON: Yes. We heard that Virgie was supposed to visit Dannielynn for her -- you know, a weekend visit, but did not show up. Now, if that`s the true, then you know, it doesn`t put her in a very good light. Doesn`t really show she`s a caring sort of grandmother, which...

GRACE: Well, that goes back to Barry of Texas`s question. That could very well come into court.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SIBILA VARGAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Dannielynn may soon be coming to her new home in the United States with her new dad. A judge cleared the way for Birkhead to bring his baby home with one condition: He has to bring her back in June for a full custody hearing. This is according to TMZ.com, which says Anna Nicole`s mother, Virgie Arthur, objected and may appeal. Sources tell TMZ it may be too late and Birkhead wants to leave within the next few days.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: That`s Headline News` Sibila Vargas reporting. Just when we thought that Birkhead was going to take off with his biological daughter, 7-month-old Dannielynn, the only heir to the cover girl Anna Nicole Smith`s fortune of an estimated $475 million, sources say they were set to leave tomorrow, an emergency hearing scheduled by mom, grandmother Virgie Arthur. She does not want the child to leave the Bahamas; this, after months of arguing her daughter`s remains shouldn`t go to the Bahamas. So the world`s upside down in the Bahamas once again.

Out to the lines, Rosemary in Missouri. Hi, Rosemary.

CALLER: Hello there. Thank you. I`d like to inquire, since Anna Nicole was never able to actually receive her inheritance, how do they believe that the daughter will get it?

GRACE: Well, I think I have the answer to that. She was in the midst of a fierce battle over her late husband, Howard K. Marshall`s estate. It had gone all the way to the Supreme Court, and the U.S. Supreme Court said Anna Nicole Smith could continue her battle. That was a very good sign for her side.

As it stands right now, the battle is still ongoing. But take a look at it, Rosemary. Both sides that were so contentious and battling it out in court are all dead. Now, there are rumors that a settlement is in the works. Believe me, Rosemary, there`s plenty of money to go around.

I want to go back to this report. Back out to you, Tom O`Neil with "InTouch Weekly," can you clarify for us, is it true that Virgie Arthur stood Birkhead up for a scheduled visit this weekend?

TOM O`NEIL, "INTOUCH WEEKLY": Yes, isn`t that something? The sources on this are excellent, by the way, so if this comes into testimony tomorrow, it could be devastating for her, because I could imagine the Bahaman courts want this to go away. So if Larry leaves with the baby and says, "Look, this is now a matter for the state of California," fine. But also, now, he`s got Howard on his side. That`s the most interesting development here. Yesterday, Nancy, when they left that court, Howard and Larry got into a car together. Debra Opri was right: They`re in cahoots.

GRACE: Well, you know, there have been so many alliances throughout this. First of all, it was Birkhead and Virgie. It`s my understanding he`s very surprised that that has changed. It`s very, very confusing how these two ended up in an alliance seemingly against Virgie Arthur. What can you tell us, Rob Chilton?

ROB CHILTON, "OK" MAGAZINE: Larry told "OK" exactly that in his interview. He said that he was shocked and surprised to suddenly hear that Virgie was, you know, up against him. I`m sure he feels betrayed, stabbed in the back, by this woman, you know, this very sort of lovely, very sort of grandmother-looking woman, all of a sudden saying, "Actually, Larry, no, now I`m against you, and I want this, this and this and I want it now."

GRACE: Well, it`s very interesting what her claims are. As far as the baby leaving the Bahamas and whether Stern will follow her, take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HOWARD K. STERN, FRIEND OF ANNA NICOLE SMITH: As far as me staying in the Bahamas, I`m going to stay in the Bahamas regardless. I`m not going to leave Anna or Daniel here alone.

As far as I`m concerned, Larry can come over to the house and spend as much time with her as he wants right now. I`d like there to be a gradual transition period for her so there`s no harm caused to her.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: You know, it`s very surprising that we`re learning tonight -- out to you, Mike Brooks -- that the baby is still in the custody of Howard K. Stern. She`s still leaving there at Horizons.

MIKE BROOKS, FORMER D.C. POLICE: I guess that`s the best place, because we talked -- we just heard from Larry`s sister that the nanny is still looking after her. Now, remember, the nanny is the mother of Shane Bishop. Now, recall Shane Bishop was the former immigration and labor minister there in the Bahamas who helped fast track her residency there in the Bahamas.

Now, Howard, is he going to be able to stay in the Bahamas? That`s also a question that remains, Nancy. We don`t know, because they want him to stay there unless at least the coroner`s inquest, because he`s going to be one of the major witnesses. And that next hearing on that is May 22nd in the courts in the Bahamas.

But does he have residency there? Does he have another house to go to? He has another house in an area called Coral Harbor, which is down on the southeast part of the island, but sources have told us that the house right now is not ready for primetime yet, not ready to be lived in. And, you know, if Horizons is pulled out from under his feet, where is he going to go?

GRACE: Let`s go back to the lawyers, and take a look at this wish list that Virgie Arthur has come up with. As you all legal eagles know by now, Virgie Arthur, Anna Nicole Smith`s mother, the baby`s grandmother, she wants joint guardianship of the baby. If Larry Birkhead dies, she wants sole guardianship. She wants control over the Howard K. Marshall estate she believes her daughter was going to inherit.

She wants to join in -- I hear you, Darryl Cohen -- she wants to join in a lawsuit for wrongful death with Birkhead. I think I can figure that one out. She doesn`t have standing, so she wants to glom onto somebody that does have standing to sue. Virgie did not show up for visitation. Will that affect any of this?

Go ahead, Darryl Cohen. Take a crack at it.

DARRYL COHEN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, first of all, I think she`s been following Yogi Berra too long. It ain`t over until it`s over, and I see this as nothing but a flat tire that they`re going to repair and let him go. I don`t think Virgie has a chance on this earth to win any of what she`s asking for. She has no legal standing. She`s following the court of public opinion. She loses. Thumbs down.

GRACE: Well, hold on, Darryl. Hold on. Let`s explain legal standing. For instance, if Darryl Cohen goes out on the street, leaving CNN Headline News center, and gets run over, then I suddenly want to sue? Forget about it. I don`t have standing. Maybe his wife or his children, sure. Him, they can all sue, but not me. So for her, Darryl, to want to glom onto the baby or Birkhead`s lawsuit, how could that work?

COHEN: I don`t think it can work, Nancy. But I think she`s doing the book. She`s going to do the movie deal. She`s going to do so much, make so much money off of this. And it`s obvious, if she made -- she stood somebody up for visitation, doesn`t tell me very much. Obviously, it wasn`t a traffic problem in the Bahamas on Sunday.

GRACE: Yes, you`re right about that. Now, another thing. We tried tonight to get a statement from Virgie`s camp. We were unsuccessful.

You know, but throughout, she has always given the appearance, Bethany Marshall, of being very loving toward Anna Nicole Smith. Smith, obviously, did not feel the same way back. But this kid is being used like a football. We know Birkhead`s the father. Why is it still in the house with Stern?

BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST: Hey, you know what? There`s a saying in my field: Scratch a neurotic, you get a borderline. Scratch a borderline, and you get a neurotic. And that means, where there`s a little craziness, there`s usually a lot of craziness.

All that picture-taking on her part, it could be that she`s planning to write a book, or it could be that she`s suspicious and mildly paranoid, that she feels Larry Birkhead is a very bad person. She doesn`t trust him. She feels that can`t trust what she can`t control, unless she sees it, hears it, smells it, touches it, she doesn`t think it`s going to go very well, which is kind of scary, considering she`s made some very bad choices in her life. She married a guy years ago who molested her own children, according to Donna Hogan, but she doesn`t trust anyone else other than herself. So underneath this warm exterior is a cold, calculating person who doesn`t trust.

GRACE: Well, I do know this. Sources say she is snapping photos all over the courthouse in preparation for her book. But, hey, she`s just a squirrel trying to get a nut, OK? This lady`s got to make a living. I`m just wondering what this baby has to do with it.

Out to Linda in Pennsylvania. Hi, Linda.

CALLER: Hi, honey.

GRACE: How are you? What`s your question?

CALLER: My question is, doesn`t Howard representing Anna in Howard Marshall`s lawsuit for his half of her estate, isn`t he entitled to part of this settlement that this kid`s going to get?

GRACE: Yes, he certainly is, Linda in Pennsylvania. As the executor and as the lawyer on that case, one of the many lawyers, he`s entitled to a contingency fee. A lot of their legal work was done on a contingency, the belief that they would recover in the end. So, yes, he`s in for a cut of that, if it ever happens.

You know, this speaking of trying to keep him there in the Bahamas, remember, he`s an American citizen. And under our Constitution, Sixth Amendment, you have a right to travel freely across borders. So that is going to be an issue in this, as well.

We`ll all be right back. Stay with us.

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(NEWSBREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Last fall, we visited with Destin after he got a new kidney from an anonymous donor. Back then, he said this about his dad, and his mom says nothing`s changed.

Do you think you could ever forgive him?

DESTIN PERKINS, NEEDED FATHER`S KIDNEY: Forgive him? Probably not. It`s a pretty bad thing that he did to me.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Now that his dad`s been captured, Destin says he`d like a chance to ask his father why? And how can you live with yourself?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Well, let`s hope he has plenty of time to think about it behind bars. He is now voted the world`s worst dad, to top it all off. A Kentucky judge allows a dad out from behind bars on robbery and dope charges to save his own son`s life, to donate a kidney to his dying son. And, instead, he goes on the lam, heads to Mexico with his sleazy girlfriend. Oh, yes, she`s got dope charges, too.

Where does that leave the little boy? Out to Ed Miller with "America`s Most Wanted," who is this guy?

ED MILLER, REPORTER, "AMERICA`S MOST WANTED": Well, Nancy, he is without a doubt king of the deadbeat dads. As you said, he`s charged with all of these different charges, armed robbery...

GRACE: Hey, hey, Ed, for the girlfriend, you lay down with the dog, you wake up with a flea. She`s in the same ilk, the same bag as him.

MILLER: Absolutely right. Also, what does that say to you? What kind of woman would run away with a guy like this, a guy who would do that to his son? I mean, let`s face it. What does that say about her?

GRACE: I want to get back to him. What`s the story?

MILLER: All right. The story with him is, as you recall, about a year ago, he told a federal judge that he would donate his kidney to his son to save his life`s son, and he went through the first batch of medical tests. He did not have an electronic monitoring device on his ankle because doctors said that would interfere with the test, so he was allowed...

GRACE: I knew it. I knew it. I`m so glad you told me that. I said, "How in the world did they let this doper, this alleged doper, walk out of jail without an ankle bracelet on?" Now I get it.

MILLER: Well, the big, the big thing is -- I can understand now not the electronic bracelet so much or the ankle bracelet, but the fact that there was no court monitor. No one was there checking in on him. So the first time he went for the test, he came back, and it was a perfect match.

And the big crime here, he filled his son`s head with false hope, because you`ve got to remember, this was a boy who was dying. His mother had donated a kidney to him. He went through this, and the child rejected that kidney. So this was really the last hope, and the father`s kidney was a perfect match. But what happened? He ran away.

GRACE: I want to go out to Jennifer Fitzgerald, the lead investigator with the U.S. marshals. Welcome. Thank you very much for being with us. It`s real honor to have you with us, Jennifer. How did the arrest go down? How did they find this guy and his girlfriend?

JENNIFER FITZGERALD, LEAD INVESTIGATOR, U.S. MARSHALS: Apparently, the Mexican authorities had received a tip that they were staying at a hotel in Puerto Vallarta. They set up and did surveillance, and we were able to catch them when they came out of the hotel.

GRACE: Where were they found in Puerto Vallarta?

FITZGERALD: In downtown Puerto Vallarta at a hotel. I do not know the name of the hotel.

GRACE: Doing what?

FITZGERALD: Just casually walking out, enjoying the weather.

GRACE: Just enjoying the weather on a lifetime vacation. I wonder if he even knew if his kid was dead or alive.

FITZGERALD: As far as we know, there had not been any contact with the family. While he`s been on the run, I believe his father has passed away. His mother`s ill. And we don`t believe that he even knows any of this.

GRACE: To Dr. Joshua Perper, you all remember Dr. Perper from the Anna Nicole Smith autopsy and investigation, also, author of "When to Call the Doctor," Dr. Perper, it`s great to talk to you again. I want to ask you about this kidney screening. It apparently takes days and days. How does it work?

DR. JOSHUA PERPER, BROWARD COUNTY MEDICAL EXAMINER: Well, today, you don`t have to be a relative in order to have kidney screening, because that of a variety of drugs which permit to depress reaction against kidneys from a foreign donor, but, ultimately, the best donor is a relative. And usually some of the patients have to wait up to two years...

GRACE: Oh.

PERPER: ... until they get a matching transplant.

GRACE: Well, this kid couldn`t make it two years, Dr. Perper. What happens to the body upon kidney failure, Dr. Perper?

PERPER: Well, the kidney, number one, has a function in treating the body of poisons, but it`s much more than a filter, because it also controls blood pressure, also controls the blood chemistry, and controls the production of blood. So it`s an endocrine organ, so eventually, when somebody`s liver failure, he can be given dialysis, which is a temporary treatment until he can get permanent treatment, such as a kidney. And this child was fortunate to get a transplant.

GRACE: Bethany Marshall, to go through the rest of your life thinking your dad actually would leave you for dead...

MARSHALL: You know, the best thing for this kid could be some education about sociopaths, because criminals are often sociopaths, and sociopathy is a profound disorder of detachment. This doesn`t mean they want to go live in the hills and avoid people. It means sociopaths view others as objects to exploit. They have no value other than what they can offer the sociopath.

So this sociopath, this criminal, deadbeat dad, he exploited the judge. He exploited the doctor. He exploited the people at the prison. And, ultimately, he exploited his own son. And if this son lets the dad come back into his life, the dad will exploit him again and again, because this kid is only a mark to his father. That`s all he is.

GRACE: Susan Moss, what are we going to do with this guy?

SUSAN MOSS, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: Well, I can tell you that this is absolutely outrageous. He is a coward. Only a coward would run away and let his child die, and I can tell you that no judge is going to give you any leniency for this guy, and certainly none is deserved.

GRACE: Please, Judge, throw the book at him and his girlfriend.

To you, Ed Miller, why was this guy on the U.S. marshal`s top 15 most wanted?

MILLER: Oh, what a great question, Nancy. I`m so glad you asked it. You know, following this story, there was an incredible public outcry to get this guy. He was the most hated man in America. And the best part about that is that, because of the attention to this story, America did find a kidney for this boy. So the good news here is, when the boy finally does get to see the father face to face, he can say, "Hey, Dad, I don`t need your stinking kidney. I got another one."

GRACE: You know, Ed Miller, we`ve pretty much seen it all between the two of us, felons, but this one really takes the cake. How is the little boy?

MILLER: Well, he is doing much better, thank you very much. And he keeps saying over and over again, he still loves his father. He just wants to know why. And, by the way, you know, when we caught him, the man, the father did say to our cameras that the message he had for his child was, "I do love you."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: Kidney dad is released from jail under one condition, to help his son save his life by a kidney transplant. What does he do? Heads straight to Mexico with his girlfriend.

Out to the lines, Amy in Ohio. Hi, Amy.

CALLER: Hi, Nancy. I`m excited to get to talk to you. I`m a big fan. I watch you all the time.

GRACE: Thank you, dear. What`s your question?

CALLER: I had a question. Since he was a perfect match for his kidney to give to his son, and he took off, if the son had actually died from not receiving his kidney...

GRACE: Oh, good legal question.

CALLER: ... could he have charges pending against him?

GRACE: I`ll throw it quickly to Daniel Horowitz in San Francisco. What about it, Daniel?

DANIEL HOROWITZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: No, Nancy, there`s no obligation in the United States to help somebody. You can walk by somebody who`s injured on the ground and let them die...

GRACE: What about him being under court order and him assuming the duty? Forgot about that, didn`t you, Daniel?

HOROWITZ: Nancy, he`s not assuming the duty to give up his kidney. He could have pulled back any time and gone back to jail. Even though it would be morally wrong, there`s no legal obligation.

GRACE: Daniel, thanks for more good news from the West Coast.

Let`s stop just a moment, our legal discussion, to remember Army Sergeant Jason Swiger, just 24, South Portland, Maine, killed Iraq. An Army paratrooper on the third tour of duty, enlisted straight from high school, he followed the family military tradition. Fun-loving, he loved writing, drawing, singing and working on his favorite car, the Mitsubishi Lancer. He always made time to visit students of his former high school military history class. A newlywed, he leaves behind grieving widow, Alana, three sisters, two brothers, loving mother Valerie. Jason Swiger, American hero.

Thank you to our guests, but most of all to you, for being with us. See you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.

END