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Midwest Flooding; Tornado Damage; New Jersey Terror Arrest; Herod's Tomb; Pumped-Up Price

Aired May 08, 2007 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Missouri fighting flood waters today. Forecasters warning that coming disaster might well rival the historic flood of 1993.
TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: Gas prices pumped up to record highs. Oil companies soaking in record profits. What's going on here? We ask an expert on this Tuesday, May 8th. You are in the CNN NEWSROOM.

At the top this hour, misery across the Midwest. Spring storms hammer the region with a vicious one-two punch. Greensburg, Kansas, a town in ruins. Families there in limbo. Cadaver-sniffing dogs now scouring the rubble for those still missing from the deadly tornado. President Bush will tour the damage tomorrow.

Meanwhile, flooding has forced hundreds of people from their homes in Kansas and Missouri. Weather experts are already making comparisons to the floods of 1993. Some of the costliest in U.S. history.

We begin with rising waters and rising anxiety in Missouri. The governor has declared a state of emergency and National Guard troops are now immobilizing. CNN's Sean Callebs is along the banks of the Missouri River.

Sean, good morning to you. Man.

SEAN CALLEBS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Tony.

Really, the haze has finally let up. And this is the first time we've had a really good view of the Missouri River. We've been out here for hours and hours now.

I want to take you out to this tree. We've been using this as a benchmark, and I'll be careful walking out here, throughout the morning. And really we have seen the water come up, I would say, six inches within the last hour. And this is about the time where authorities have told us to really watch to see if the river does begin to crest. They expect it's going to crest at 28 « feet. Right now it's about 26 feet. So just use that tree, you can see it's going to go up a couple more feet. It's going to continue to eat away at that area where's it's jumped over the banks.

Another camera we have pointed out to the middle of the Missouri River. Look at all that debris that is floating down there right now. Logs. So far this morning we've seen a hot water heater, a refrigerator come down as well. We know that police were out here with a radar gun, actually yesterday, checking this speed of this. It was going about 14 miles an hour. That's significantly faster than normal. Usually it's flowing in a nice, lazy fashion, somewhere between four and six miles an hour.

There are evacuations here in this town. We also know that just down river, a couple miles or so, there are people out sandbagging an area as well. There is a waste water treatment plant down there. And that area right now is threatened. Indeed, if the water goes up to 28 feet, it could be compromised and they would be forced to hand pump sewage out over a levy. And certainly no one wants to get involved with that, Tony.

And we also know there are more evacuations to the north. We just found out in Andrew County, that's some new information we just got, Tony. We're checking with emergency management officials in that county to see how significant those evacuations are. But we're told that there is water in some homes up there.

HARRIS: Yes. Hey, Sean, we understand that the National Guard is mobilizing. Let's hope they're not needed. But it's good to know that it sounds like they will be on standby if they are, in fact, needed.

Sean Callebs for us this morning.

Sean, thank you.

COLLINS: Greensburg, Kansas. Nearly all of it obliterated by a ferocious weekend tornado. The federal government is dispatching trailers to house the homeless. And President Bush will see the damage for himself. CNN meteorologist Rob Marciano is seeing it for himself as well.

Tell us the very latest on what you're seeing here, Rob. It's just every time we go to you we see the devastation behind you and it never gets less surprising.

ROB MARCIANO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: No, it doesn't. It's stunning. It's actually staggering to be here and to see it. And we've been here three days now and the awe never goes away. And to see what the power of mother nature can bring is truly humbling.

And when you take a close-up look at some of the damage and analyze, you know, exactly what's happened, you really appreciate the power of really just moving wind. This is, obviously, a, you know, broken branch. But a closer inspection shows that the bark is ripped off. And it's ripped off by nothing but air. Wind moving at over 200 miles an hour, just peeling the bark right off of this branch.

And you see evidence like that all over town. Obviously, behind me, splintered trees. I mean where trees aren't actually up rooted, you have them completely defoliated and debarked in some cases.

And then you've got huge pieces of farm equipment and cars that have been tossed around like toys. Buildings and homes that have been well established for tens of years, in some cases over 100 years, completely destroyed or wiped off their foundation. And you look around, you think, boy, what was it like to be here Friday night. And even as a weather enthusiast who gets fired up about storms, I mean, this is just completely horrifying and terrifying to me to think about what these people went through Friday night.

The good news about the state of Kansas is that the soil is set up that basements are pretty prevalent here as opposed to a place like Oklahoma where many of the homes are just built on slabs. And when you get a big tornado rolling through Oklahoma, there's no basement to go to. And I think because of the big-time warning that they had, 20, in some case 30 minutes ahead of time before this storm rolled in, people could take the warning and dive into their basement. Some people even left town.

And because of that advanced warning and the ability to take cover, it's really a miracle to me, Heidi, that more lives weren't taken. Nine lives lost here tragically. But I think it certainly could have been a lot worse. And every day when we come here and the sun comes up and we see this damage, it is humbling, to say the least. And I think about nine lives, although tragic, it easily, easily could have been much, much more.

Back to you.

COLLINS: Yes, no question about that. When you look around, I'm sure you feel very small when you think of the massive mass of storm that went through there. Unbelievable.

All right, Rob.

MARCIANO: No doubt about that.

COLLINS: Thank you, Rob. We'll talk to you soon.

HARRIS: Let's get a check of weather conditions around the country right now. We've got wildfires to contend with. Obviously the flooding in the central Plains. There he is, Reynolds Wolf, in the Severe Weather Center for us.

Good morning, Reynolds.

(WEATHER REPORT)

HARRIS: Well, you have seen the sheer terror twisters bring and the havoc they cause. Now get more in a special report. At cnn.com, view a special storm chasers gallery and see the science behind the fury. Just go to cnn.com/tornado.

COLLINS: Alleged terror plot in New Jersey foiled. Sources tell CNN, six men have been arrested, accused of planning to attack Fort Dix. CNN's Brianna Keilar is joining us now from Washington with the latest on this.

Brianna, at this point, what do we know about the arrests?

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Heidi, the U.S. attorney's office in New Jersey say the six men are Islamic radicals. Sources tell CNN, the men were planning to shoot soldiers and Fort Dix in New Jersey. Fort Dix is about 80 miles southwest of New York City.

And the Associated Press is reporting the men were arrested as they tried to buy automatic weapons in a sale that was set up by law enforcement authorities. Sources say an informant played a key role in this investigation. Sources also telling CNN, the men had been doing surveillance of Fort Dix and planning for a while.

And that they'd also trained in the Pocono Mountains there in northeastern Pennsylvania. Apparently, according to these sources, they played paint ball to practice. They test fired weapons. And apparently there is videotape and audio tape of some of this training.

And, of course, this really begs the question, how significant was this threat? Well, it's important to keep in mind sources are questioning the capability of these suspects. The sense being that they are not hard core terrorists. Now we are expecting to get more information as the day goes on. Also we're expecting for charges to be filed against the men today. The A.P. reporting, Heidi, that they will be charge with conspiracy to kill U.S. servicemen.

Heidi.

COLLINS: All right. And what do we know at this point about where the suspects are from? We were hearing a couple different things.

KEILAR: Well, we're hearing that they're from former Yugoslavia. We're hearing that from a spokesperson for the U.S. attorneys office there in New Jersey. We've also heard that some of them are related to each other. That coming from a federal law enforcement source.

COLLINS: All right, Brianna Keilar on top of the story for us.

Brianna, thank you.

HARRIS: Changed by 9/11. A commodities trader trades in his job for a mission. From Ground Zero, to boots on the ground, in the NEWSROOM.

COLLINS: Shelling out big bucks for gas. What's behind record high prices at the pump? We'll have answers. We don't know if you'll like them, but they're coming up next, ahead in the NEWSROOM.

HARRIS: And that man, Bishop T.D. Jakes (ph), described as America's best preacher by "Time" magazine. He joins us to talk about his new book "Reposition Yourself." And more, coming up in the NEWSROOM.

COLLINS: A river of hot lava. Look at that. Pouring down an Italian mountainside. Amazing pictures, coming up in the NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: And welcome back, everyone. I'm Tony Harris. You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

Ahead, four Arab-Americans getting big laughs on stage. They poke fun at Muslims in this era of terror.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Wait, you're supposed to take off your jacket. But I'll do a body search for you. Ooh. Yes. Middle eastern George Clooney.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: Hey, now. "Axis of Evil," comedy troupe, in the NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COLLINS: The royal treatment for the royal couple. It's the last day in the U.S. for Queen Elizabeth and her husband, Prince Philip. Wow, beautiful. Last night, President Bush hosted the couple at a white-tie state dinner. A first, in fact, for the Bush presidency. The 134 invited guests including members of Congress, diplomats, celebrities like Kentucky Derby winning jockey Calvin Borel. There he is. During the dinner, the royal and presidential toast.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: So on behalf of the American people, I offer a toast to your majesty, to your royal highness, and to our staunch allies, the valiant people of the United Kingdom.

QUEEN ELIZABETH: Mr. President, I raise my glass to you and to Mrs. Bush, to the friendship between our two countries, and to the health, freedom, prosperity and happiness of the people of the United States of America.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: The queen arrived at the White House Monday morning to a day of pomp and pageantry. We saw this. (INAUDIBLE).

HARRIS: Yes.

COLLINS: Today she'll visit the World War II Memorial, the Children's National Medical Center and NASA's Goddard Spaceflight Center outside of Washington. The queen and her husband will host the president and first lady at the British embassy for dinner tonight. Then jet back to England.

HARRIS: It is not quite the holy grail, but it is an archaeological search of biblical proportions. Some scholars say this is the tomb of Herod the Great. He plays a large role in the Bible and the search for his tomb has taken more than 30 years. How about 35 years. CNN's Ben Wedeman is in Jerusalem with a closer look. Ben, good morning to you.

BEN WEDEMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, good morning, Tony.

Well, the archaeologists from Hebrew University, who found this tomb, say it is possibly the most important archaeological find in the Middle East since the discovery of the Dead Sea scrolls in the late 1940s. These archaeologists spent the good part of the last 30 years scouring a dusty, rocky hillside in the West Bank. And it was only three weeks ago that they found what they believe is proof positive that this is, indeed, the tomb of Herod the Great.

Of course, Herod the Great was the last Jewish king of Judea. He was the builder of the second temple. And he featured prominently in the New Testament as the man behind the so-called massacre of the innocence, which sent Joseph and Mary with the young Jesus into exile to Egypt. And, therefore, he, obviously, is a very important historical figure.

Now, it was only three weeks ago that they found what they believe is the sarcophagus or rather fragments of this sarcophagus of Herod the Great. What is missing in all of this, Tony, in fact, is proof, really rock positive, because they have no -- they have yet to find any inscriptions. But the archaeologists believe that looking at this sarcophagus fragments that this is most likely the tomb of Herod the Great.

Tony.

HARRIS: Yes, proof positive. We always ask for that. But I'm wondering about confidence here. How sure? How confident of this find are these archaeologists, Ben?

WEDEMAN: They are pretty confident. And we have to keep in mind, it's just coming a few months after the controversy that was whipped up by the discovery of what was described as the lost tomb of Jesus. So there's always a lot of skepticism.

But these are very respected archaeologists from a very respected academic institution. They say that there's a variety of indications, for instance, coins within the tomb that were found. The mosaics at the tomb. Various other fragments that do point in the direction of the likeliness that this is Herod's tomb. But there are skeptics out there and so the archaeologists are still digging on and digging into this hillside hoping they will find final proof.

Tony.

HARRIS: Let's see where this goes. It is absolutely fascinating. Ben Wedeman for us in Jerusalem.

Ben, thank you.

COLLINS: Drivers paying out the wazoo for gas. How high will price goes. And what Americans see down the road. A lot of that going up, in the NEWSROOM. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: Look, at some point, you know, profits will be taken off the table. Chip will be taken off the table, Heidi. So far, it's happening. It's just gravity. Time to cash in. So the Dow, as you can see, down . . .

COLLINS: Hey, you're moving up.

HARRIS: No, no, no, no. You take chips off. You see where things settle and then you move back in. The Dow down 70. The Nasdaq down 18. Oh, just about an hour into the trading day. We will check out all of the business headlines this morning with Susan Lisovicz right here in the NEWSROOM.

COLLINS: Well, many drivers think it is just plain ridiculous. Gas surging to a record high. $3.07 a gallon for self serve regular. Now a new poll finds most Americans think things will only get worse down the road. In the CNN/Opinion Research Corporation poll, 79 percent of Americans think it's likely gas prices will hit $4 a gallon this year.

Why so high? Well, a good question for our next guest, Brad Proctor. He's the founder and CEO of gaspricewatch.com.

Brad, thanks for being with us today.

You know, instead of getting all technical about how on earth this might be happening, I want to ask you just some basic questions here. Tell us why prices are so high. I mean, it seems like there really aren't very many indicators out there that would explain it right now.

BRAD PROCTOR, GASPRICEWATCH.COM: Well, you know, that's the anomaly. You know, oil prices are down, but gasoline prices are up. Refining capacity, while down, it was a lot worse after Katrina. We had 25 percent of the refineries out, but we weren't -- you know, we hit this price about then before.

So really it comes down to, I think because the industry can do it. We're still -- we have about 10 cents more room to be able to grow based on past performance so by Memorial Day. So you may see another 10 cents or so come into the system.

COLLINS: So this is back to the age-old supply and demand?

PROCTOR: Well, yes, I guess so. And what I mean by that is we've been taught that when the refining capacity is tight, and then the price goes up. Well, you know, the refining capacity is tight, but it's nowhere as tight as it's been in the past when we've hit this number. We have an extra 10 percent over the past.

So we've been told that the price of oil is the major impact, but yet the price of oil is lower than it's been in the past when we've been near this price. So, you know, it's -- the industry's kind of in a new position today than it's ever been before. COLLINS: What about Hugo Chavez. I mean, some of his nationalizing may have had an effect or is that just going a little bit too far?

PROCTOR: You know, if you really want to look back, typically events affect the price of gasoline and the price of oil. And the most recent event that occurred was last week when Venezuela, via President Chavez, decided to nationalize its oil fields. And that literally took about $30 billion off the table from the oil companies. That's what they had . . .

COLLINS: Well, that's a lot.

PROCTOR: That's a lot of money that was invested by those major oil companies. So all of a sudden that negated a lot of that capital. So the issue becomes, how does that impact them from profitability. And it's just interesting to see, at that same moment, we see the highest price we ever see for gasoline. So, you know, while gas prices are high, oil prices are low.

COLLINS: Yes. Interesting. All right. So give us the outlook for the summer. Will the prices keep going up or stay steady or maybe possibly go back down?

PROCTOR: Well, again, based on past performance, we should see about another 10 cents between now and Memorial Day. Typically after Memorial Day, it drops off. But, of course, all cards are off the table if we see a hurricane come through or, you know, even today we're getting some news from Nigeria about some pipelines being blown up. You know, those kind of things really ripple fast through the markets. So we may see some quicker increases.

COLLINS: OK. I want to show you another poll that we have here from CNN and Opinion Research Corporation. If we can put that graphic up on the screen here. This is a question that asks whether or not gas prices are reasonable or unreasonable. You see 81 percent of people sampled hear say no way, the prices are just plain unreasonable.

Is there anything Congress can actually do or maybe even the president to lower prices? I mean, when people ask that question, I always think that, you know, it is a business. I mean, we're talking about a business here.

PROCTOR: Well, yes, it is a business. They're in the business of making a profit. The question may become, and some may ask, is it an unreasonable profit in the face of what's happening? Congress has looked into this every year for the last couple years and they've come back and said, well, we don't see any price gouging. Maybe some very limited things that occur. But nothing on a grand scale. No collision between the oil companies. The biggest issue is, this is a traded commodity. The fact that markets impact what this is, that has the highest impact on what that price is on any given day.

COLLINS: Yes. And so as long as people are driving their cars and they're not riding their bikes or horse or scooters, it's probably going to continue to go that way. We certainly appreciate your time.

PROCTOR: Yes, Heidi.

COLLINS: Go ahead.

PROCTOR: Thank you very much.

COLLINS: You can finish your thought, Brad.

PROCTOR: Oh, I was just going to say, the industry's really good at reacting. The idea is, if we start conserving, you know, you'll see that refinery capacity go down. So, you know, that magic number will continue to stay where it is. They're very good at this. They don't want to put, you know, excess capacity in there and then be able to sell gasoline for $2 a gallon. They want to keep those profits up. So they can react.

COLLINS: Yes, and the question will be, when will the consumer react and really they really make those changes in their lives.

PROCTOR: And what can they do, yes.

COLLINS: Yes. All right. Well, we will continue to watch this story, of course, because we're all consumers.

Brad Proctor, founder and CEO of gaspricewatch.com.

Thank you, Brad.

HARRIS: Bishop T.D. Jakes described as America's best preacher by "Time" magazine. He joins us to talk about his new book. There he is. "Reposition Yourself." Much more right here in the CNN NEWSROOM.

DON LEMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm Don Lemon in Greensburg, Kansas. They're trying to get gas, electricity, water, utilities back up, as well as get residents in to gather up some of their belongings. I'll tell you what progress, if any, is being made, coming up in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COLLINS: Storm survivors, where do they go from here? Will things ever be the same? Serious questions for the people of Greensburg, Kansas, as they survey the damage and look to the future. The town still in shock from a massive tornado that left homes, businesses, churches and schools in shambles.

But already some signs of recovery. FEMA trailers for displaced families are starting to roll into town. And tomorrow, President Bush arrives to tour the damage and offer some comfort to tornado victims. The true scope, though, of the damage of Greensburg, pretty hard to believe unless you're there on the ground to see it yourself.

CNN's Don Lemon is there. He is joining us now from Greensburg.

You know, we were talking last hour, Don, about those trailers. And even though they're there for some temporary comfort, it's certainly isn't home.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Oh, absolutely, Heidi. And stay with me, don't go anywhere, you know -- because I want to talk to you a bit about this. You can imagine, these people are devastated. But guess what they're excited about, Heidi?

COLLINS: What's that?

LEMON: They want to see the president.

COLLINS: Yes, I imagine.

LEMON: They want to see the president. They're happy that the president is coming to see them because they all saw Katrina, right, Heidi, they all saw that and they saw the slow response. We all know about that. No secret to that. And they're thinking if the president's coming, then they may have some momentum at getting this town built. Can you understand that?

COLLINS: Yes, I mean, always like to see the leader of the country at a time that is so devastating to them.

LEMON: Yes, absolutely. So they know, they realize that maybe help is on the way because the president is coming. That would be a good thing. Help is on the way. T.D. Jakes always says that, you guys are going to talk to him in a little bit.

But here's what's going on here, Heidi. This is a gas meter here, a gas line that feeds into one of the places we're standing next to. The electrical line that feeds into it. They want to get this back up and running as soon as possible. But there are hazards under all of this. Live electrical lines, gas lines running through this place would not be a good thing for them right now. As well as -- those FEMA trailers trying to get people places to stay. So that is the big concern, trying to get as much as, I guess you can say, normalcy to this place as possible, if that's even possible, within the next few months, even, Heidi, the next few years.

We spoke to -- just a man just -- not long ago. He and his partner both truck drivers. They were delivering their day stock to a store here in town when all of those winds and the tornado came through. They hunkered down in a freezer. Here's their story. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LARRY LOPEZ, STORM SURVIVOR: We walked inside, lights went out. And we all decided to go and hide right where this door's at of that refer (ph) unit -- walking.

LEMON: So everything just went up around?

LOPEZ: Roof went out -- it paused. I guess we were in the eye. And then when the second portion went up, the whole wall went out and took off.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This truck was parked right there.

LOPEZ: We were holding on to this. That's the only thing we were holding on to.

LEMON: You were holding on to this shelf?

LOPEZ: All of us. It was about maybe six -- all that unit was full of people.

LEMON: And so you saw everything flying up around you?

LOPEZ: Yes.

LEMON: What did you think?

LOPEZ: We're gone. People prayed and cried and everything, until it stopped.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: And sadly, one person with them did not make it into the freezer. He ran into the bathroom. It was the closest place that he could go to find some shelter. And Heidi, he did not make it.

COLLINS: Oh boy, all right. Don Lemon reporting for us from Greensburg, Kansas. Such a tough story, appreciate it, Don.

LEMON: Yes.

HARRIS: Going to (ph) check the weather now?

COLLINS: Yes.

HARRIS: Let's go over to Wolf in the severe weather center. Reynolds, good morning to you.

(WEATHER REPORT)

HARRIS: Bishop T.D. Jakes, he is one of the best known spiritual leaders in the country, pastor of the Potter's House in Dallas, and the man behind MegaFest, an annual revival that draws thousands. There he is at work. Bishop Jakes has written a new book, it is called, "Reposition Yourself, Living Without Limits." He shares both spiritual and financial insight.

Bishop Jakes joins us from New York. Bishop Jakes, great to see you sir, thanks for your time this morning.

BISHOP T.D. JAKES, AUTHOR, "REPOSITION YOURSELF": A pleasure to see you. Thank you, thank you so much.

HARRIS: Boy, let's talk about the book first. And then, I have a couple of Katrina-Rita related questions for you. What do you mean by "Reposition Yourself?" I love the title.

JAKES: Well, you know, the exciting thing about life is that we have opportunities to change our situations. And the book, "Reposition Yourself" is really encouraging people to explore those options, not to get stuck. So many people are stuck emotionally, spiritually, financially and they're in a rut. They don't know how to get out. And I begin to share some tips and sound advice, how to adjust with the many changes in life.

HARRIS: How about fear? So many people are afraid to make the kinds of changes in their lives that you talk about in the book.

JAKES: Yes.

HARRIS: How do people, first of all, over come the fear? How do people maybe, first of all, know that it's time to make a change?

JAKES: Well, first of all, when it comes to the fear, I think we wrestle with fear and with guilt. We're trained, many of us, by our parents and other societal influences to stick to things no matter what.

HARRIS: Yes.

JAKES: And sometimes we don't even examine the fact, am I happy, am I living an abundant life, am I really enjoying what I'm doing or am I just working for the money, am I just coming home because this is where my shoes are.

HARRIS: Yes.

JAKES: You know what I mean? We don't take the time to really examine the many options. And people who explore their options do better in marriage, do better in life, do better with raising their children. I do think that there's a fear factor that has to overcome.

And many, many times, the way that you can tell when you have maxed out is when you stop growing, when you stop being excited, when you stop being challenged by your life, either professionally and personally. It's time to re-evaluate how you can reposition yourself to live an abundant life and to live without the limitations that people and circumstances often place on us.

HARRIS: When it's clear to you and the folks who love you that you're just going through the motions?

JAKES: Right, right. It does become a tasteless experience, both in the work life and in the private life. We're losing our marriages in unprecedented rates. People are really going into depression and stress at unprecedented rates. Many times it's because you don't make the small adjustments that can yield a huge result in your life.

HARRIS: You are a keen observer of the news. Any words of comfort for the folks in Greensburg, Kansas, the folks in Missouri now who are going through so much right now?

JAKES: You know, my heart goes out to those families who have been devastated through the recent tragedies. I want to encourage them to hold on to God and to hold on to their faith and to hold on to each other. I think that there is a camaraderie that's built amongst people who are going through this kind of crisis that only they understand and further the strength that you garner from each other.

We're praying, we're supporting, we're there for them in every way possible -- the nation is praying for you during this time of tragedy.

HARRIS: Bishop, the front page of the "USA Today" just yesterday, the headline for Katrina victims, financial pain endures. Here we are 20 months after Katrina and Rita. Gulf coast residents, as you know, continue to really struggle.

JAKES: Yes.

HARRIS: There is one bureaucratic bottleneck after another keeping the money from the people who really need it. How disappointed are you with the federal, state, and local government response to people in real need?

JAKES: I am deeply disappointed and frustrated. To me, it's inexcusable that we allow this kind of bureaucracy to stop people who desperately need help from getting it in time. And we've had a lot of press coverage, we've drawn a lot of attention to it. And still it's bottle necked in a way that's reprehensible.

For those of us who admire this great nation, we're shocked and we're devastated. This is one of the few times that we've had a big tragedy close enough to see firsthand how bureaucracy can cloud up the waters and muddy up the waters from people who desperately need help right now. Our nation should be ashamed.

HARRIS: You were with the president, it was in Mississippi, wasn't it?

JAKES: Yes.

HARRIS: September 2005, as I recall.

JAKES: In Baton Rouge.

HARRIS: In Baton Rouge, OK -- in Louisiana, OK.

So you, there, here's the picture, side-by-side with the president. Have you talked to the president since and have you voiced your frustration with the response?

JAKES: I have voiced my frustration with the response on a lot of levels, not with the president but on a let of levels. When I was there, I was deeply concerned, and subsequently worked on a committee, appointed by President Bush and President Clinton, to work with the Faith family, bringing in counselors, helping people with post traumatic syndrome disorders, trying to help them work through the process.

But I never thought in my wildest dreams, going through all of that, that we would still be here today. It's really disturbing.

HARRIS: All right, let me take you on for just a moment here. People take a look at that picture. We'll re-rack it and show it again. And there are a lot of folks who thought that the president might have been using you to provide some cover for himself and the federal government at a time when this administration was getting hammered over the response to Hurricanes Katrina and Rita.

Is there an opportunity -- first of all, do you buy that assessment? And beyond that, do you have an opportunity now to call the president and say, let's cut through all of this, let's get the help that the people who need it?

JAKES: Well, you know, first of all, I can't really address the president's intention. I would like to think that he was concerned for people who were hurting and in need. I can address my intention. My focus there was to have an opportunity to suggest to him not only ways that we could help the people throughout the Gulf, but the many, many people that were in our church and other areas looking for help and restoration. We were able to institute some changes for those people who were disbursed around the country and around the world.

I have not spoken to him recently about this issue, but I have worked in the Gulf extensively with the victims themselves, to see ways that we could get help. I think it's bigger than just a federal issue.

HARRIS: It is.

JAKES: And I think it's bigger than just a president's issue. On all levels, we just have real dysfunction that we need to look at in this country.

HARRIS: Just a couple of quick points here. You saw the -- you heard the comments from Don Imus a couple weeks ago about the women's basketball team from Rutgers. Your thoughts -- Don Imus, first of all.

JAKES: Well, I made a statement -- I made a public statement about it. I thought it was reprehensible. Very, very discouraging to see somebody in that light and with that much visibility using the power of the microphone in such a destructive way. They didn't solicit any hostility. There wasn't an argument for that kind of rage. And it is discouraging.

But I think beyond Don Imus, we really need to look at a trend in this country that we're losing all civility. All politeness, all manners have gone out of the way. It's almost like a huge "Jerry Springer" show in this country and we really need to stop it on all levels.

HARRIS: Bishop Jakes, great to see you. The best with the book.

JAKES: Thank you.

HARRIS: And if you come through Atlanta, stop by. JAKES: I'll do it.

HARRIS: We're hospitable people here.

JAKES: God bless you sir, I look forward to it.

HARRIS: So come on and see us. All right, thanks for your time.

JAKES: Bye-bye.

COLLINS: Well, boys like their bugs but this kid was bugged by spiders. They moved into his ear. And don't call him Spider Boy, either.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I want to be Spider-Man, Jr. Because you know, if (ph) it's not close, but two spiders in my ear, what's next?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: OK.

COLLINS: Fifteen minutes of fame, that's what's next. Spider- Man Jr., in the NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: Live breaking news, unfolding developments, see for yourself in the CNN NEWSROOM.

COLLINS: On Wall Street, we're seeing something we haven't seen in a while. Susan Lisovicz is at the New York Stock Exchange. What's going on, Susan?

(BUSINESS HEADLINES)

HARRIS: A historic new beginning for Northern Ireland today. An end to decades of sectarian violence. Protestant and Catholic leaders come together to form a joint government. The British and Irish prime ministers on hand to witness it. Outside the Parliament building, protests. Three police officers injured and several arrests made.

COLLINS: River of fire. A famous volcano puts on quite a show. Gorgeous. Watch it boil and bubble, coming up in the NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: He watched a terrorist destroy his workplace, then he exchanged his career for a calling.

CNN's Hugh Riminton reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have no electricity here. HUGH RIMINTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Every soldier has his reasons. Jack Androski's go back nearly six years.

JACK ANDROSKI, SOLDIER: A guy went to work that morning, rode his bike to work that day, didn't get to ride his bike back that day. Life for me changed, being at World Trade Center and I changed my life. Or I began to make the changes in my life to end up where I am with you right now.

RIMINTON: He won't talk about that day. But he will talk about the - man he was, a commodities trader, loving New York, loving the money he was making. Not yet 30 years old then, with two masters degrees, the world at his feet.

(on camera): Your rank is corporal, right?

ANDROSKI: I'm a corporal. Corporal promotable, I'll be sergeant June 1st.

RIMINTON: Congratulations on that.

ANDROSKI: Thank you.

RIMINTON: How much money were you making as a commodities trader compared to with what you're making now?

ANDROSKI: I make less.

RIMINTON (voice over): But the work matters more to him now.

ANDROSKI: We changed the route for safety measures ...

RIMINTON: Central to the new Iraq strategy is get down the with the people, win them over. Turn them away from supporting the terrorists. So every day, Jack risks his life to listen.

(on camera): It's been a somber few days for this battalion. In the last three days, they've lost three people. Others have been terribly wounded, which make's today's mission in comparison in here seem almost surreal. A Sunni community leader, once a football field.

ANDROSKI: If he wants this, we can push this through ...

RIMINTON (voice over): Encouraged by the response, he brings out his big plan. Rebuilding a local shopping area. Jack sees problems.

ANDROSKI: It will never pass unless we know these shops will sustain this park.

RIMINTON: But he also brings ideas.

ANDROSKI: But if this became an association, the Adul (ph) Park Association, we could provide them, you know, small micro-grants.

RIMINTON: Sunnis are the natural support base for al-Qaeda in Iraq. If the war can be won, it means winning their trust. "The Americans have changed. They're 90 percent better than they were at the beginning of the war," says this man. "Everyone is sick of the violence. If people can get a taste of comfortable life, they'll wanting to live in peace."

Jack's role is all the stranger, given he opposed the original invasion.

ANDROSKI: The initial invasion I thought was wrong. I thought there should have been a diplomatic solution. I thought the focus should have been on Afghanistan.

RIMINTON: But with America here, he felt a duty to put his skills to use.

(on camera): You see the U.S. army as a positive change agent in Iraq today?

ANDROSKI: I see the U.S. army as the dominant player of change in Iraq.

RIMINTON (voice over): Jack Androski now believes in a strange way 9/11 liberated him, to live where his heart really was.

(on camera) Would you count yourself as an optimist?

ANDROSKI: I would consider myself a soldier.

RIMINTON (voice over): A soldier who believes less in his gun than in his notebook.

ANDROSKI: Sir, thanks a lot. I really appreciate it. I'll write that stuff up for you and we'll have some discussion points next week to follow up on.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COLLINS: Great story.

Oprah Winfrey's school for girls in Africa. Just one of many stories making headlines on the continent and here at home. Coming up, a firsthand view from Jeff Koinange. His Reporter's Notebook, coming up in the CNN NEWSROOM.

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