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Conversation With Presidential Candidate Ron Paul; Story of Iraqi Man Who Survived Own Kidnapping

Aired May 27, 2007 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: Gay bashing, out in the open in front a video. We'll tell you where.
You heard them spar, question. Are we all more passionate than ever about politics?

He's a maverick Republicans. He's our Sunday spotlight.

And Lindsay Lohan, this time really in trouble with the law. Details in the CNN NEWSROOM.

And hello again, everybody. I'm Rick Sanchez here in the CNN NEWSROOM. Found out some new video that's coming in from really all over the world, but the first place we want to take you to is Venezuela.

Thousands of people started clashing with police. There, you see some of the water cannons that police had to bring out. That was about an hour ago when last we checked. We've been monitoring the situation all night long.

It's about a television station that President Hugo Chavez wants to shut down in about two hours. But really, it's a whole lot more than this. It's really about a government that's been taking over many parts of the private sector there in Venezuela. And those who are opposed to Hugo Chavez have been reacting with protest. We're going to give you a lot more on this. We're going to be filing a live report from Caracas in just a minute or two.

First though, more overseas news, big news in fact. And make no mistake, it impacts us right here in the United States big time. Diplomats from the United States and Iran are going to be sitting down at bargaining table in just a couple of hours. This is the highest level talks between our country and Iran since 1979. That's 27 plus years. The topic, Iraq, and what will come of it. Your guess may be as good as mine, but I can tell you this. We're going to get a report from the only Western reporter in Tehran in just a little bit.

OK, now to Iraq. And we have new pictures to show you there. U.S. troops acting on a tip overnight, stormed an al Qaeda hideout. They reached 42 Iraqi people who had been kidnapped, held there for months, and reportedly tortured.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LT. COL. CHRIS GARVER, U.S. ARMY SPOKESMAN: Some of the hostages had been held as long as four months. There is evidence of torture. And some had broken bones. Some stated that they had been hung from the ceiling. And one boy in the group stated his age was 14, as the evacuation of these prisoners was going onto the treatment facility.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Well, kidnappings are nothing new in Iraq. People vanish and turn up dead across the country every day. Really sad and violent reality of the ethnic and religious strife there. One Iraqi man was lucky enough to survive his own kidnapping two years ago. Here's CNN's Ryan Chilcote with his story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

RYAN CHILCOTE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): They threatened to kill him.

ARSHAD MOHAMMED, HELD HOSTAGE IN 2005: They put the pistol in my head. I told them just I want to say...I witness that is there no god but Alla. And then if you want to kill me, I'm ready.

CHILCOTE: Fourteen thousand dollars, $6,000 under the average price the police quoted me on his freedom. Arshad, like many here, says kidnapping is as big a problem as the violence. Many Iraqis have fled. Many like him have stayed on to fight.

MOHAMMED: All of Iraqis families, I mean as you know, they are frightened for them. They cannot go to their job. They cannot do anything.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: Now the numbers. And those heartbreaking numbers that we hate to report, but they're the harsh tally of this war. The U.S. military reports the death of two more U.S. soldiers Sunday. That brings the total American death toll for this month alone to 103. Since the war started 3,454 U.S. military personnel have died.

In about four hours from now, the U.S. diplomats going to be meeting for the very first time in 27 years with their Iranian counterparts as we have fore mentioned. But just ahead of these historic talks, the Iranians are hurling a major accusation at the United States, saying that they have uncovered a matrix of U.S. run spy rings.

CNN's Aneesh Raman is the only Western journalist in Tehran. I asked him about these latest accusations. Here is his take.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANEESH RAMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: This caught a lot of us inside the country off guard. I mean, Iran has made allegations like this before, but this is the first time it has officially protested to the American government via the Swiss ambassador in Tehran. We know very little. Yesterday, the Intelligence Ministry said occupying forces of Iraq have been backing spy networks in Iran. Today, the Foreign Ministry leveled the charge directly at the U.S. They are only saying government officials that agents have been found in the south, southwestern, and central parts of the country. And then more information is forthcoming.

We don't know, and what we're waiting to see is whether this is linked to the recent arrest and imprisonment of (INAUDIBLE), the American-Iranian scholar who is being held under suspicion of working against the government here. That is what many observers are waiting to see if Iran links those two, or if in a broader sense, if they're now posturing ahead of the talks on Monday, Rick.

SANCHEZ: Exactly. And I'm wondering what effect this might have on those talks tomorrow? And will this be an opportunity for them to try and go in a different direction?

RAMAN: Yes, well, both sides have told us that not only are they not going to raise the issue of detainees, there are at least five Americans being held in various forms of custody in Iran, and five Iranians being held by the U.S. in Iraq. They've said they're not going to bring up this issue. And they said that basically, they're only going to limit their discussion to Iraq. And Iran's only going to air its grievances.

At the same time, keep in mind the context of this meeting, you have U.S. warships in the Persian Gulf. That is a separate track of diplomacy. Gun boat diplomacy, if you will. And Iran has its own second track in these sort of statements.

So both sides are couching these talks with other avenues that they can pursue in case they fail. But certainly, the Iranians I'm speaking to are hoping that the two sides can come together, find some common ground, and use this as a basis for future meetings.

SANCHEZ: You know, I'm going to ask you this question again. I know every time you and I have a conversation, I ask you this question, because it's something that's been so important in the past. Is there still an opening for U.S. or other Western nations to be able to somehow reach out to the moderates in Iran that we hear so much about? Or are they too closeted right now?

RAMAN: No, there is. And we saw in the elections last December that the moderates really won big in the city council elections throughout the country. There is, from what I can tell, a majority of Iranians that want the West and Iran to find a way to decrease the tensions.

The problem is there are just innumerable almost issues between U.S. and Iran. And the nuclear one really is the sticking point. Not just Iraq, but the nuclear issue. Until that gets resolved, really everyone here says nothing else can get resolved.

SANCHEZ: Aneesh Raman, the only Western reporter in Tehran.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: All right, let's take you now from Tehran to Caracas. We told you a while ago about Venezuela, something that was supposed to happen in a couple of hours. Let's take some tape.

This is what's going on, thousands of people taking to the streets and they've been protesting in the streets of Venezuela all day long. It's getting real heated right about now. Government troops went into the country's most popular television network and started seizing cameras and other equipment. These are live pictures that you're looking at now. You can see the police and the SWAT teams out on the streets.

President Hugo Chavez is going to force the network off the air for good at midnight. A lot of people who not only support the TV and radio station, but also who are anti-Chavistas are out on the streets in full force. He's refused to renew the broadcast license. He's going to be replacing it with programming that shows - seem to promote more socialist policies. In other words, this is a television station point of fact that has been critical of him.

Let's do this. As we look at the pictures, let's go to Carlos Guillen. He's a radio reporter in Venezuela. He's joining us live from Caracas. Carlos, what's the situation there now? And I ask you that, knowing that there have been reports that as we get closer to midnight, it might get more violent.

CARLOS GUILLEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, clock is passing by. And so far, people is on the streets gathering in protest against this shutting down of the signals, the final link of the license of the TV station (INAUDIBLE). So far, people - the police use water cannons and tear gas for thousands of demonstrators protesting the government decision not to renew the broadcast license of the television station RCTV, which is to be shut off at midnight.

SANCHEZ: But this is really bigger, isn't it? This is really about the nationalization of part of the petrol industry, about land reform where people's land is being taken away, and given to peasants. Isn't this just a small part of a larger argument?

GUILLEN: So far, the government is in the argument that this TV station was involved of a coup state that was happening in 2002 that put Hugo Chavez out of his place by two days. So far, the argument is that they were part of a coup state. And that's why he is not renew that TV station license to be on air by midnight.

So far, right now, people that's been in part and using civil defense alarm. You may hear right now this at the bottom of this conversation...

SANCHEZ: Right.

GUILLEN: ...in protest to that situation. Meanwhile, in the west side of Caracas, people supporting Chavez are gathering and celebrating the non-renewal of that license to RCTV. So far, people are using (INAUDIBLE) different alarms to protest that decision of Hugo Chavez.

SANCHEZ: All right, there's the different video. You see the one on the top right there. That's the video of police when they first came through with the water cannons. You'll see the water cannons shooting now.

The video on the bottom is actually part of the video that we got earlier in the day as well, when police had to go in a couple of different angles of the people who were there on the streets. And the video you're looking at there on your left is video of what's going on live.

Our thanks to Carlos Guillen. He's our correspondent. He's going to be following the situation there. Should anything develop, or should it become more of a real riot, so to speak, we'll take you back there immediately.

Coming up, more protests. A gay parade turns ugly, real ugly.

Speaking of ugly, remember this beating? Now the victim meets his assailant, face to face.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's hard to lie to my kids for the first time, you know, telling them that I might not make it home.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: The best birthday gift of all, mom, in the flesh, a soldier's story.

He says he's the only real Republican. Decide for yourself, when you hear presidential candidate Ron Paul in our Sunday spotlight.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez.

Want to take you up to the video wall now, because we've got some new hot videos that have been coming in, probably none as exceptional as the one I'm about to show you. This is a planning for a gay pride parade in Moscow. Look what happens. Right here.

You see that spokesperson right there getting punched? He was only arguing for the right to be able to have a gay rights parade. They'd already been told they probably weren't going to give it to them. They came to see if they can meet with the mayor. Instead, they were met with counter demonstrators.

Here's another piece of video I want to show you now. Take a look at this video if you can now.

That's unbelievable. So many people really just getting struck by the counter demonstrators. And what's maybe most interesting about the story is that some of the authorities, the police themselves rather than trying to either break it up, or take away some of the counter demonstrators seem to be, in fact, in some pieces of video joining in, the kind of story I'm sure we'll be hearing about a lot more in this case.

Now let's talk about the Cannes Film Festival, because here we have a controversial film as well. This is a story of a young girl who wants to have an illegal abortion and what she has to go through to do it. It's an amazing story. I'll let you listen to just a little bit of it here.

It's amazing, because it's really beat out just about everybody else. It's controversial, of course. And we'll be following it.

Speaking of what we'll be following, stay with us, because when we come back, you've heard all the stories about all the foreclosures all over the country. Well, what happened when somebody wants to get back at the people who want to foreclose on their house? They took some pigs and set them loose. And that's what they do. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That door right over there, the red frame door, they were looking right out of that, three of them, three little pigs in the house.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: They blew the house down all right. These three pigs were locked in a house in Oregon for several days by a guy who was angry that his home was going into foreclosure. So he wanted to get back at these guys. You know what he did? He wanted to trash the place. Boy, did he. He got the pigs. And the pigs got in the house. He locked them in the house. And apparently, authorities are now looking for the disgruntled homeowner because of what the pigs did to the home. Should be looking for the pigs.

Remember this disturbing surveillance video we showed you? 91- year-old Detroit man being savagely beaten in the face by a suspected car hijacker. Kind of story, I know, makes you mad to watch it, right? Well, Leonard Sims finally got a chance to confront his alleged attacker in court.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEONARD SIMS, BEATING VICTIM: He started punching and said he wanted for a light for a cigarette. And before I could answer, he started punching.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: The suspect faces a potential life sentence if convicted - there he is - alas on all the charges. Wish we'd seen a little more of him. Lonny McCullum doesn't want to be the mayor of Greensburg, Kansas anymore. The town was virtually destroyed by that huge tornado that we told you about earlier this month. Now McCullum has resigned, saying he isn't - it isn't what the city needs as it plans to rebuild. The city council disagreed, says he's just on sabbatical at least for now. Apparently, the mayor was tired of hearing complaints about the best way to rebuild the town.

The usually serene Sunday afternoon at the White House was interrupted by the roar of hogs, leaders in Rolling Thunder, a motorcycling group that raises awareness about Americans listed as prisoners of war and missing in action are on their annual Memorial Day ride around the nation's capitol. They rode right up to the president's doorstep, then headed inside for an Oval Office meeting.

One little girl got a big surprise at her birthday party.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hey, how are you?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Military mom Carolyn Deal surprised her daughter, Taylor at a birthday party yesterday in Charleston. Deal is a tech sergeant with the U.S. Air Force. She got back from Iraq Friday, kept it a secret so she could surprise her kids.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CAROLINE DEAL, MILITARY MOM: It's hard to lie to my kids for the first time, you know, telling them that I might not make it home.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Well, Deal's ex-husband, who's also an Air Force sergeant, helped plan his daughter's surprise.

Coming up, few people were surprised when Jordin Sparks won the latest "American Idol." Right? Well, now, millions of people are in search of the next "Super Boy." Call it the idol effect in China. Kind of low rev, though.

Plus, the passion behind politics. Why are so many of us getting so worked up in political debates? I mean, you know, family reunions, dinner tables, work? It's all coming right up right here, as analyze this in the CNN NEWSROOM for you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back. We're in B control now, because we're going to have a little fun, right, Rog? Yes. Here's a pop culture riddle for you with an international twist. What far east talent show attracts millions of viewers, just like "American Idol" with contestants who are, shall we say, just as interesting as like Sanjaya? Impossible, right? Well, here's CNN's John Vause with the answer.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN VAUSE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Humiliation, it seems, knows no borders. Regardless of country, regardless of language. Here in China, 100,000 wanna-bes and some never really should haves, have tried out for the title of "Super Boy," and all male talent quest now down to the final 12, where just like the international "Idol" series, viewers get to choose the winner.

Contestants are chosen from six different provinces like these 50 from Chung Chu. This is a war zone, the (INAUDIBLE) service says as competing Super Boys jump in and out of tanks.

While these contestants from Sheng-zi Province are portrayed as ancient Chinese warriors about to do battle. The "Super Boy" series is a spin-off from the widely popular "Super Girl." When it first went to air two years ago, more than 400 million watched the grand finale.

Jane Zhang was the runner-up that first year. This former student, who once sang in a bar, now has the number one selling album and performs to sold out concerts.

"So much has changed to my life," she told me. "So many strangers just want to meet me now. It feels like everything around me is alive."

Her record producer says Super Girl and Super Boy have permanently changed China's music industry.

"The audience wants to be involved," he says. They choose a contestant they like, and then they want to buy their albums.

Call it the "Idol" effect, a fast road to fame for a few, a cringing moment for so many others.

John Vause, CNN, Beijing.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: And we thought we'd cornered the market on the untalented.

Coming up, she's a big star and she's really popular, especially among girls. Now, though, Lindsay Lohan is in trouble again, this time serious trouble. She's facing possible DUI charges and the question. Is she a bad influence?

Also, he's a Republican who wants American forces out of Iraq. You hear what I said? Republican who wants forces out of Iraq. Ron Paul, he is our Sunday spotlight, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Want to tell you something that we're going to be doing from now on, especially on Sunday nights. As we get more into the political season, there's a high interest in political news. So we're going to be running.

See that crawl right there? See that right there? It says join us for a special salute to our troops on Memorial Day? We're going to try and specialize in political news. That's going to be a ticker, that's what it's called believe it or not. And we're going to call it a political ticker from now on on Sundays, as we bring you the news.

And speaking of politics, forget those first impressions when you hear the word "Republican," because Ron Paul could be the most unconventional Republican that you're ever going to see.

For starters, he'd like to abolish the Homeland Security Department. He recently mixed it up with Rudy Giuliani over the U.S. foreign policy and the Iraq War. Well, wait until you hear what else he has to say about that particular topic.

Texas Congressman and presidential contender Ron Paul is in Houston tonight. He's also our Sunday spotlight.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: Rudy Giuliani wants you to take back what you said. Have you thought about it? Have you decided you're going to take it back?

REP. RON PAUL (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Yes, I've thought about it and I've decided I'm not going to take it back, because there's no reason to. I think he's the one that's confused.

SANCHEZ: Well, let's talk a little bit about Iraq, because that was certainly the big subject that's elevated your prominence of late.

PAUL: Right.

SANCHEZ: I'm going to let you argue with the president of the United States, because he held a news conference this week. And he said some very important things. And I get the feeling you're going to be very much against.

We're going to start with what the president says when he's asked about whether it's time to start getting some of the troops out of there. Here's what the president says.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: You're asking me how much longer? We have yet to even get all our troops in place.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Yet to even get our troops in place. How do you respond to that?

PAUL: Well, that worries me, because he has had now how many years to do that? Four years to get them in place, four years to have a victory. That worries me. It worries me about the spread of this war into Iran. There's a lot of conditions there that could worsen. So that's why I'd like to get our troops out of harm's way. I didn't want them to go there in the first place.

SANCHEZ: Hold on. You know what the president would say to you? In fact, I am going to let him say it. He doesn't want politicians, his words, telling the military what they need to do. Let's roll the president. Go ahead.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, U.S. PRESIDENT: And so therefore, the decisions I made are all aimed at getting us to a different position, and the timing of which will be decided by the commanders on the ground, not politicians here in Washington.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Politicians in Washington. I think he's referring to you, congressman.

PAUL: Well, there is a little bit of truth to that. There was one appropriations bill that I voted against which micromanaged the war and that was one of my reasons for voting against it.

He is commander of the troops. But we have a lot to say about the policy and we have everything to say about the funding. So Congress is still very, very important. And unfortunately, I think one of the reasons why we're in this mess is because we didn't follow the Constitution and have an up and down vote on declaration of war.

SANCHEZ: John Edwards said something interesting this week. He said in fact that the war on terror is nothing more than a slogan, a bumper sticker, that it's not really a strategy. Here's what the president says about that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BUSH: This notion how this isn't a war on terror, in my view, it's naive. Doesn't reflect the true nature of the world in which we live. The lessons of September 11th are these. We have got to stay on the offense.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: That's an argument that has gotten a lot of print this week. What's your take on it?

PAUL: Well, terrorism is a tactic, it's not an enemy, it's just a tactic that the various enemies use. So you can't have a war against a tactic. That's where the policy is flawed.

SANCHEZ: So you agree with John Edwards then, that this is more of a slogan than a tactic. PAUL: Well, you have to define the enemy. It would be much safer to say we have a reason to attack and eliminate the al Qaeda because they were responsible for 9/11. But we're not doing that. That was one resolution I supported wholeheartedly and funding, to go after the al Qaeda. But we forget about the al Qaeda, we allowed them to go into Pakistan, we're friends with Pakistan, we finance Pakistan.

They're a military dictatorship and they have a nuclear weapon. And we do nothing. We allowed that to happen at Tora Bora, to go over and start a needless war, undeclared war in Iraq. So the policy is seriously flawed.

SANCHEZ: Let me stop you there.

When you say a needless war in Iraq, there is still the question as to whether or not Iraqis want us there. I know there's been several polls taken. Let's hear what the president says about this and then we'll get your take on the other side, sir.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BUSH: We're there at the invitation of the Iraqi government. This is a sovereign nation. Twelve million people went to the polls to approve a constitution. It's their government's choice. If they were to say leave, we would leave.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: How do you respond to that?

PAUL: Well, I think that's very good. Because they're about to do that and I think that's encouraging that he's come around to that point because the majority of the legislators in Iraq now are very sympathetic to our leaving. There is a coalition building between the Sunnis and Sadr and they are talking about nationalism and they are talking about getting us out.

And the Republican leadership, including those in the Senate are very seriously considering if they ask us to leave, we will leave. And I think that is very, very good news.

SANCHEZ: And if you were president of the United States, you would pull the plug the very next day?

PAUL: I would. I would write an order and say no more policing on the streets, no more Humvees walking on the streets just becoming victims.

SANCHEZ: Would you be worried about the bloodbath that would take place and certainly the victimization of the Sunnis in this case since they really are the smaller number here?

PAUL: I'd be concerned. But there's reason for the Sadrites, the Shiites and Sunnis to get together because they don't like Iran, they'd like to get rid of them, and they don't like the al Qaeda. There was never any al Qaeda or Iranian influence in Iraq until after we got in there and messed it up.

So, I'm much more optimistic about what would happen. Look at the tremendous things that happened with Vietnam since we left. Yes, there were a lot of problems. But they're a trading partner. We invest in them.

Look at how we do with China. We didn't have to fight and kill Chinese. Of course, we tried to do that in Korea. But now, we trade with China and depend on them. They're our banker. So I think a lot of good things could come of it. The biggest important thing is Americans wouldn't be killed any longer.

SANCHEZ: You sound like a pro forma 1930s isolationist. Are you?

PAUL: No. I'm not an isolationist. I'm a non-interventionist because the founders of this country that I listen to carefully were very much - they were not protectionists at all, they were free traders, they wanted trade and travel and friendship.

SANCHEZ: In fact, that's the point. You say you're the true Republican when it comes to the Republican candidates.

PAUL: Right. And Robert Taft was an example that I used. He didn't want to be in NATO. And there was a strong element in this country that didn't want to go with World War I and World War II.

Even the presidents advocated peace, we'll never take you to war in Europe. And I like that old saying, no, don't go to war in Europe and don't go to war in the Middle East.

It's best for Americans to stay at home, mind our own business and become a wealthy, prosperous country, set a good example, and they'll want to emulate us. We can't force our ways on other peoples through the point of a gun.

SANCHEZ: Congressman, we're going to have to leave it there. Certainly a delight talking to you, sir. Thanks so much for being part of our "Sunday Spotlight."

PAUL: Great.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: By the way, be sure to join us for our presidential debates right here on CNN June 3rd, Democratic debate, June 5th, Republicans go at it once again. And you'll see there Mr. Paul once again, Congressman Paul, I should say, the best political team on television will bring it to you. That's right here only on CNN.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think we're seeing a polarization that is about as strong as it's ever been in America.

(END VIDEO CLIP) SANCHEZ: Well, if you don't like what they say, then you obviously don't like me. Why has politics gotten so passionate? How about Rosie and one of her colleagues on "The View" a few days back. Why do we take politics personally? We're going to find out. We're looking into this and we're bringing in experts.

Also, let's put it this way, if Lindsay Lohan ever finds a role as a felon, she may be able to draw on real life experiences.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: All right. We want to talk about something that's really interesting because it probably affects every one of you. If you noticed when you get together with a lot of your friends or your family of late, you don't want to talk about George Bush, don't want to talk about the Iraq War because you're afraid of what it might turn into, an argument.

The Iraq War has gotten a lot of people, usually calm people shouting at their friends and neighbors of late. And it fueled passions this week between Rosie O'Donnell and her fellow talk show host Elizabeth Hasselbeck on "The View." This spat got us to thinking. Are politics getting more personal today in America?

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ROSIE O'DONNELL, "THE VIEW": You just said our enemies in Iraq. Did Iraq attack us?

ELIZABETH HASSELBECK, "THE VIEW": No. I'm saying al Qaeda ...

O'DONNELL: Did Iraq attack us, Elizabeth?

HASSELBECK: Iraq did not attack us.

SANCHEZ (voice-over): A political blowup between Rosie O'Donnell and Elizabeth Hasselbeck. Their views out in the open on daytime talk show "The View." And it got personal.

O'DONNELL: I have told you I support the troops

HASSELBECK: I have said the same for you.

O'DONNELL: I asked you if you believe what the Republican pundits were saying ...

HASSELBECK: Did I say yes?

O'DONNELL: You said nothing, and that's cowardly.

HASSELBECK: No, no, no.

SANCHEZ: The real argument began days earlier when O'Donnell said quote, "655,000 Iraqi civilians are dead, who are the terrorists?" After saying that, she was pounced on by conservative blogs and pundits. O'DONNELL: Do you believe I think our troops are terrorists, Elizabeth?

HASSELBECK: I don't think ...

O'DONNELL: Yes or no. Do you believe that? Say yes or no.

HASSELBECK: Excuse me. Let me speak.

SANCHEZ: So why did Hasselbeck and O'Donnell make a conversation about Iraq so personal?

DREW WESTEN, AUTHOR, "THE POLITICAL BRAIN": It became not just about what are your views on Iraq, but do you -- are you a good person? Are you a bad person? And in politics, it's pretty hard for things not to go there fairly quickly.

SANCHEZ: The psychology of politics does get personal, even among average citizens. That's what experts tell us.

WESTEN: Think we're seeing a polarization about as strong as it's ever been in America.

SANCHEZ: Drew Westen has written "The Political Brain."

WESTEN: Most of our feelings towards the parties and towards conservatism or liberalism are really very gut level feelings that we've learned at home by listening to our parents talk and by hearing them give us life lessons what it means to be a good person.

SANCHEZ: Here's another example this week, Senate (ph) Minority Leader John Boehner's strangely tearful plea over funding for U.S. troops in Iraq.

REP. JOHN BOEHNER, (R) HOUSE MINORITY LEADER: I came here to do something. And I think at the top of our list is providing for the safety and security of the American people. That's at the top of our list!

WESTEN: Politics ultimately boils down who's going to take care of you and your family, which you can't help but have strong feelings about and it boils down to questions of right and wrong and fairness and unfairness.

And it's impossible not to be emotional about those things. That's why we get passionate about politics. And so if we see someone else as having a completely different view of what's right and wrong, it's hard not get enraged at them and it's hard not to feel that at some level they're morally defected. And that's where we are now.

SANCHEZ: That is personal stuff and so is the politics of our times.

HASSELBECK: They're your thoughts. Defend your own insinuations.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: We want to check further into this. So we looked for some science to try and back up some of these theories. Here's what we found out. According to Professor Westen, he had run a study just before the 2004 election.

Here's what he did. He compared the brain scans of people who are conservative and liberal. He gave them statements about their candidate and then he read them a statement that clearly contradicted that statement, something totally out there that he knew they were going to be against. He saw that parts of their brain would light up, the parts that deal with distress when they heard those statements.

The rational parts barely even registered. Isn't that interesting?

Well, we're all business in the NEWSROOM tonight. All this week CNN's Don Lemon is going to be hitting the streets in what could be the world's next economic superpower. We're going to tell you what you don't know and need to know about a country you probably talk to everyday when you pick up the phone. We'll tell you more about it when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: This is the times we live in. And I'm sure that most of you can relate to this. When you call about just about anything, airline reservations, the service rep is going to have an Indian accent, almost to be sure. It's the same when you try and get your credit card company on the line, your computer line for tech support.

Who are the people that you are talking to halfway across the world? And is it part of what economists are saying is the fastest growing economy in the world? Are some getting left behind as a result of this even in our country? Good questions, huh?

CNN anchor Don Lemon has just arrived in India's capital New Delhi and he gives us his first impression.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: This is probably one of the most crowded places you'll see on earth. This is New Delhi. And just getting through traffic here is amazing. People walk through this traffic just like I am walking through. This is a typical park, it's about 6:00 on a Sunday evening here.

And it's called India Gate, there is a war memorial here to all the fallen Indian soldiers. Much like Central Park, people are hanging out. Over here you have got people on the swan boats with their families. It's all about families. So they come to this park on a Sunday afternoon and they hang out with their families and go back to where they live.

But this is typical India, typical New Delhi, very crowded. Just across town, just about a 30 minute drive, you can see it's quite a different environment, quite a different atmosphere here. This is the heart of Old Delhi. Everyone talks about this new burgeoning information economy. Well, this is the old economy.. These are shopkeepers and families. People come here to be able to afford to take care of their families, to send children to school and even vacations. The shopkeepers tell me they make enough money in order to survive and to have a nice lifestyle.

How long have you owned this store?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thirty-five years.

LEMON: Thirty-five years. How do you do?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Fine.

LEMON: You do fine?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

LEMON: How many kids in your family?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are two - one brother, one sister.

LEMON: Yeah.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And I also married, have two children, one girl and one boy.

LEMON: And you all can live on money from the store?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

LEMON: Yeah.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

LEMON: So you do OK?

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: We're lucky enough to be able to join Don now. He's live there in India. There is going to be a little bit of a delay.

But hey, let me ask you, Don, are people walking around with cell phones talking to us all the time over there? Do you get a sense of this information revolution that's taking place?

LEMON: You do get a sense, Rick, of the information revolution but you also get a sense, too, as well, of the poverty. One point two billion people here in India. Imagine that compared to the U.S. which is 300 million people.

And when you think about here in Delhi, everyone wants to be a part of that. That's why we have so much investment and so much growth here. People want to invest and they are trying to improve the infrastructure.

And I should say it's 13 to 14 million people in Delhi alone. When you compare that to New York City, which is like 8 or 9 million people, everyone wants to be a part of this and why there's so much growth and so much investment.

So yes, you do see rich - you see people on cell phones, you see the technology driven young people but you also see the dire poverty as well.

SANCHEZ: But the fact they're serving so many of us in this information age has to have had an effect on them economically. There must be some betterment, right?

LEMON: Absolutely. But, Rick, I want people in the U.S. to understand this. We talk about outsourcing because obviously they can get people to work for less wages here. That's only about two percent of the growth contributed to the growth here in India. There are other things, resources and development, and what have you, investments from other countries that will contribute to the economy more so than just outsourcing. It's not just outsourcing, it's economic development. It's development of infrastructure and all of those other things that make up the economy that gives its economy about a nine percent growth every year.

SANCHEZ: That's amazing. Only two percent. One would have thought it would have been a higher number. Don Lemon, thank you so much.

LEMON: Only about two percent.

SANCHEZ: We're going to be looking forward to your reports from India in the several coming weeks.

Now, the Hollywood rap sheet and a bad girl who can't stay off the page for what else? Being bad.

Beverly Hills police arrested actress Lindsay Lohan last night after citing her on suspicion of driving under the influence. There is more to the story, though.

Lohan reportedly lost control of her car, hit a curb and then needed some hospital treatment. And it doesn't stop there. Police are also saying that they found a substance in Lohan's car that they've initially identified as cocaine.

Well, I don't know much about art but I know what I like. I like French fries. But this guy likes French fries just a little too much. Jason Baalman, he plays with his food and creates art somehow. His brushes, McDonald's French fries. I know, it's goofy. His medium, what else? Ketchup.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JASON BAALMAN, FRENCH FRY ARTIST: It's not as friendly as paint but like anything else, it's learning to adapt a medium. (END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Uses French fries with ketchup to paint. OK. Jason is getting national attention thanks to a ketchup painting video posted now on YouTube. We should have known.

Domestic violence, it's ugly, it's personal and a lot of people don't get involved if they see it. But this woman that you're about to meet is getting involved on a personal, social and cultural level. That's why she's our CNN Hero. And you're going to meet her next in the NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: And welcome back, everyone. Time for one of my favorite segments here on CNN. Everyday all over the world there are people working to make life just a little better for somebody else or maybe a lot of people. All too often their stories just don't get a whole lot of attention.

So this year we here at CNN are going to be doing something about that. We are going to be shining the spotlight on people whose dedication does in fact make a difference. Today, a courageous woman struggling to save lives in a place most Americans associate with only fun and sun. Lydia Cacho Ribeiro is today's CNN Hero.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: One more time looking at me.

LYDIA CACHO RIBEIRO, RUNS BATTERED WOMEN SHELTER: Mexico is a macho country and if you understand that, you understand everything else. It's a cultural thing. Owning your wife and your kids is a cultural issue, and we are working on changing cultural views and that takes a long, long time.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): I would come home from work and he would say didn't I tell to you come at a certain time, and he would slap me or kick me. He even did it in front of the children.

CACHO RIBEIRO: The med (ph) work that is helping women be rescued from violence and even for death is our institution, we are their friends, their sisters, their mothers. We are here to tell them that we are not alone.

My name is Lydia Cacho Ribeiro. I am human rights advocate. We created a shelter for battered women, and this shelter is a high security shelter. When a woman comes to the center, we give them free services, social work, medical services, psychological help. They get trained for work, and the kids go to school. They are rebuilding their own lives.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): They rescued from where I was living. They have done so much for me after I had given up on myself. CACHO RIBEIRO: We just decided that there was something needed, that was far beyond talking about violence and all the things. We had to do something about it. We have success. Last year the local congress passed a law in which violence against women is a crime.

It saddens me that it's seen as an extraordinary task because I believe that everybody else could do the same thing and Mexico would be very different.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: I thought I'd give you some information now. There is a lot more about Lydia Cacho Ribeiro and her organization that you can find. If you want to help her out, just go to our Web site and we'll link you in there and you can also nominate somebody that you think, like her, deserves the CNN Hero award for trying to do something to help others. Not because they want attention for it, just because they've been doing and we were lucky enough to have one of their friends contact us and tell us about them.

All the details at cnn.com/heroes. I'm Rick Sanchez. Thanks so much for being with us. We try to bring you as many of the specials as we can on this Memorial Day weekend. We hope they have had an effect on you and now all we want is for you to have a wonderful and safe Memorial Day with your family tomorrow.

Good night everybody and thanks for being with us.

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