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London Bomb Defused; U.S. Terror Concerns; Vehicle in Hyde Park Contains Explosives; Farmed Seafood Added to List of Tainted Chinese Imports

Aired June 29, 2007 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: And here's what we know in London, where the terror threat level was severe even before today. Police have closed a road near Buckingham Palace and are going over a vehicle they describe as suspicious. Now, there was one other suspicious vehicle alert earlier. That turned out to be a false alarm.
Now, if they're being overcautious, well, there's good reason. Just hours earlier, the bomb squad defused what appears to be a powerful car bomb outside a nightclub. It was loaded with nails, gasoline and gas canisters.

Now, here's the suspected car bomb, a silver Mercedes being hauled off the street for further inspection.

Let's get straight to Senior International Correspondent Nic Robertson, who's live in London for us -- Nic.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Don, two investigations, two suspect vehicles at this time. The police have removed that silver Mercedes from outside the Tiger nightclub. The other investigation going on in the Hyde Park area of a vehicle there, a suspect vehicle, it's not clear, the police have said, whether the two investigations are linked at this time. But the police have been on a very, very high lookout for the potential for another attack after discovering that silver Mercedes in the early hours of the morning.

That bomb making them look elsewhere, not only in London, but in other cities around the country. The police have said that they've stepped up their patrols, they want to reassure the people. In fact, we heard just here a few hours ago from the deputy assistant commissioner, Tariq Ghaffur, doing just that, trying to reassure the people of London that the police are on top of the situation.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TARIQ GHAFFUR, ASSISTANT POLICE COMMISSIONER: What I want to do is to reassure Londoners that we're doing everything possible to actually make them safe. We put huge amount of reassurance patrols on our boroughs. There are a significant number of events that are taking place over the weekend in London. We are reviewing the plans for those events to make sure that safety and security is number one priority in relation to that.

(END VIDEO CLIP) ROBERTSON: Now, terrorism experts here, lead counterterrorism officials here, the leading policemen here, have all been saying for some time that they've expected another attack of this type in the future. They've been concerned that the public have not been perhaps as aware and as attuned to the situation as they have been.

They've called for people now to be very vigilant. They've called for people, if they have any information about anything suspicious they may have seen in the past day or so, to provide that information to the police. But the message is that one of reassurance.

However, a lot of people here do have a question, and that is, how could this bomb get into the center of London, be parked outside a nightclub, when the police and the intelligence services are on such a high alert for the possibility of attack? So, a lot of people have that question on their mind. But right now, Londoners, it appears, for the most part, continuing to enjoy a Friday evening, almost, almost as if nothing has actually happened -- Don.

LEMON: Yes. And Nic, that's a good question, especially with all those CCTV cameras there now. You said that they're calling for calm, and you kind of touched on this part a little bit, but is there any indication this there might be additional bombs out there? Is this incident over, or do police even know at this point?

ROBERTSON: Well, so far the police have stayed away from linking this attack to al Qaeda. However, there have been several indications that it may have links to al Qaeda.

The home secretary here said that the country faces a very significant threat from international terrorism. The -- Peter Clarke, the head of the investigation here, has said that there have been attacks planned against nightclubs here before, referring to the case of Duram Barat (ph), an al Qaeda terrorists now serving a 40-year jail sentence in the U.K. for planning attacks. That attack was planned against the Ministry of Sound nightclub in London.

So, the comparisons being drawn by senior officials here that there may be links to al Qaeda. And if it is linked to al Qaeda, then certainly the concern of the police and security officials are that al Qaeda generally strikes multiple locations at around about the same time to cause maximum effect. And for that reason they are spreading this investigation very wide and very seriously right now -- Don.

LEMON: Senior International Correspondent Nic Robertson.

Thank you, Nic.

PHILLIPS: It's too early to tell who's behind the events of today, but we're nearing the two-year anniversary of attacks by Muslim extremists that killed 52 people on London's transit network.

CNN's chief international correspondent, Christiane Amanpour, has done extensive reporting on Britain's Muslim community, and today on CNN's "AMERICAN MORNING" she discussed the growing influence of radicals inside that area.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: You know, what is it about England, which for so long had such a big and constructive group of immigrants? British Muslim immigrants, by and large, come from Pakistan, Bangladesh, India, all of those places which used to be, so-called, the colonies. And by and large, the vast majority of the immigrants who are actually British citizens, second and third generation, are constructive, peaceful, moderate types. But over the last several years a couple of things have happened.

Politics and world politics and the politics of war have radicalized a group that was prone to be radicalized. And there is a sense that unlike here in the United States, where Muslims are much more assimilated, where their standard of life is quite high and a very good average here, where they consider themselves Americans and wanting to, you know, contribute to the American ideal and the American economy, the Muslims in Britain, to an extent, feel much more ghettoized, much less empowered, much less, you know -- with much less opportunity, whether it be in housing, in education, and in the job force.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: Well, intelligence officials say that they've been tracking an estimated 1,600 Islamic militants in Britain.

LEMON: Well, cities throughout the U.S. are also stepping up security, from Washington to New York and Philadelphia. More police officers are on the streets. The U.S. Department of Homeland Security says it considers the terrorist scare in London a localized incident, but it's watching closely.

CNN Homeland Security Correspondent Jeanne Meserve is in Washington with the latest for us -- Jeanne.

JEANNE MESERVE, CNN HOMELAND SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Hi.

Whenever there is a terrorist threat or a terrorist event overseas, of course there are reverberations here. This is no exception. Right now officials saying no change in the threat level here and no radical changes in security levels.

Let me read you a bit of a statement from Richard Kolko of the FBI here in Washington.

He says, "It is early in this investigation. All appropriate leads will be followed. At this time, we have no specific information or any threats related to this incident here in the U.S."

We have checked with many U.S. cities. Some are making no changes at all in their security posture. Some are making some changes, but in part because of the approaching July 4th holiday and the celebrations that that will bring. One exception, New York City, which is indeed taking some additional precautions. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RAY KELLY, NYPD COMMISSIONER: We've increased the deployment of our critical response vehicles focusing on tourist sites, to a certain extent, Times Square, Herald Square, the theater district. We are increasing our coverage in the transit system, certainly for this rush hour this afternoon.

We have checkpoints that we've instituted, vehicle checkpoints on bridges, and some located in Manhattan. We're checking parking garages as to the owners, and we're doing it ourselves to look for suspicious vehicles.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MESERVE: Now, all of this could change, of course, if the investigation uncovers any leads or links to anything here in the United States. At this point in time, they haven't found it.

Back to you.

LEMON: All right. So, Jeanne, much like London, with those CCTV cameras, many of the big cities in the U.S. -- Chicago, New York -- they have all these cameras, but there are so many vehicles in our lives.

How can authorities possibly hope to keep tabs on them all even with -- even with those cameras?

MESERVE: Well, you know, vehicle bombs are something they've expected here. It hasn't happened. They've been somewhat surprised.

There have been efforts to learn more about them. They've studied the technologies that are being used in Iraq, talked about possible deterrent measures that can be taken, and how to investigate once one of these things goes off. But it's very problematic.

What they can do is try and keep vehicles away from certain areas. Certainly in Washington, you see big barricades around the major buildings.

On July 4th, when they have the celebration here, vehicle traffic will be kept well away from the points where large crowds will be gathering. But the fact of the matter is, vehicles are everywhere. You cannot possibly search them all.

Some of the experts I'm talking to today say really what this comes down to is intelligence. They have to find out about plots ahead of time and detect them. Of course, it's unnerving to know that in London they had no inkling about this plot.

Back to you.

LEMON: No idea. Thank you.

Jeanne Meserve, our security correspondent in Washington. PHILLIPS: Plenty of clues, but who left them? We're going to ask a terror analyst what groups are on her list of suspects after London police thwart an attack.

LEMON: We'll also talk to a California college student who happens to be studying in London this summer.

PHILLIPS: And another debate under the Democrats' belt. Candy Crowley has a recap.

You're watching CNN, the most trusted name in news.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(NEWSBREAK)

LEMON: Back now to our top story.

A California college student studying in London got a first-hand look into the London bomb investigation. His name is Tim Martinez, and he took some pictures of what he saw, and he sent us an I-Report, and he joins us now by phone from London.

Tell us what you saw and when you saw it. Explain these pictures to us.

TIMOTHY MARTINEZ, I-REPORTER: OK. So, I went sightseeing today, and I ended up at the Piccadilly Circus where the bomb was initially at, and they had the whole scene blocked off.

LEMON: And so, how did you manage to get anywhere near this? Tell us about the police presence and what have you.

MARTINEZ: Well, the police presence was pretty tight around there. They had the street blocked off for, like, a good -- there was a good radius around there. And they had it roped off so you couldn't really go, and you couldn't see much either.

LEMON: All right. Well, Tim, I know this is your first time abroad and you're studying over there. And you said that folks are used to this.

Unfortunately, we can't spend that much time with you because we have some breaking news. But thank you for joining us and sending in your I-Report. And be safe.

MARTINEZ: OK. Thank you.

LEMON: Kyra.

PHILLIPS: More on the Britain bomb plots right now.

Paula Newton joining us from London. Breaking developments on a second car that authorities have come across.

Paula, what did you find out? PAULA NEWTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, this car on Park Lane, actually, Kyra, was first parked near Trafalgar Square overnight. What happened is, it was towed, essentially by city officials, who said, look, this car is parked illegally. It was parked underground at Park Lane, in that area that's now been cordoned off in London.

What's been -- the workers who were there in the underground car park said that it started smelling of gas. And when they heard what had happened this morning at Piccadilly Circus, they decided to call in the authorities.

Police and security sources tell CNN that what they have found in the vehicle is of grave concern. And the reason is they have found component parts that are very similar to the vehicle that is at Piccadilly Circus.

For sure, fuel, perhaps much more. We are waiting to hear more from our sources.

In the meantime, they continue to try and figure out if this is linked whatsoever to what's already gone on at Piccadilly Circus, but police and security sources continue to stress to us that this car at Park Lane is of concern to them, that they cannot say that this is a false alarm in the least. And Kyra, I've got to tell you, that's really going to unnerve people in this city if they have found potentially a second car bomb.

PHILLIPS: And Paula, we were talking possibly even a third, then we were told, no, that's not the case. So, now we've confirmed two. But do authorities believe there could be more?

NEWTON: They, of course, do, only because that has been the pattern. And that's why they're telling everyone to remain vigilant, keep your eyes open. They continue to investigate.

Police sources tell CNN as well that they have a lot of intelligence now on this investigation. We knew that from early morning. They had so much DNA from that car, so much forensic evidence, all that CCTV footage. They continue to sift through it.

You know, we were waiting for some kind of an image now from the CCTV footage. What tends to happen in these cases, Kyra, sometimes is if they believe they've got some really good leads, they actually won't release the footage if they believe they don't really need the public's help. So, on this story, it's stay tuned.

Police and security sources now very concerned about this car at Park Lane. I should mention, Kyra, it's only about a half-mile from the American embassy. All of this is leaving many, many people in this city very, very twitchy. Again, to remind everyone, it was parked originally very close to Trafalgar Square.

PHILLIPS: All right. Paula Newton working the story for us since the early hours.

Sure appreciate it, Paula. We'll keep checking in with you. LEMON: And more details when it comes to what Paula just reported. This information new into CNN.

A U.S. -- senior U.S. official, CNN has learned, also confirms that that second car they say is linked to the first car that they found with the explosives inside, and they had similar explosives. This is now coming from a senior U.S. official, so the two appear to be linked. Paula reporting from sources overseas who are saying that, and now CNN has just learned that a senior U.S. official is also reporting the same information.

We're going to keep on top of this breaking news story throughout the day right here in the CNN NEWSROOM.

PHILLIPS: And more on that scheme that was short-circuited by London police. Terror experts sifting through suspicions to come up with possible suspects as we get this late -- developing news, rather, from Paula Newton, who's working the story. We'll also get a take from one of the analysts.

We'll have more coming up from the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Sometimes the first people on the scene become CNN's I- Reporters. This one is a college student from California studying in London, got a first-hand look into the London bomb investigations.

His name is Tim Martinez, and he took some photos of what he saw. And he sent us that I-Report, and he joins us again.

Before we got that breaking news, we were talking, Tim. Sorry about that interruption there.

The breaking news was that the second vehicle that you saw and took pictures of, what was happening there in Piccadilly Circus, actually they believe is linked and had the same type of device in it.

So, what do you think now knowing that you were close to it?

MARTINEZ: Well, I'm really scared now, because I didn't know that there was a bomb right near where I was.

LEMON: You are with a group of students who are studying over there. Tell us what you guys are doing and your reaction now that you're hearing all of this. I would imagine that people there, as you said to me, are used to these type of things, bombings and that kind of thing, but being from the U.S.

MARTINEZ: Yes. Well, we're stale little freaked out right now because it was close to where we are right now. And we've never been here before, none of us have. So we're just following the story closely, like the news and the Internet.

LEMON: What are you going to do now? Do you plan on changing your habits there or being more cautious? What do you guys plan to do now that this is unfolding while you're there in London?

MARTINEZ: Well, we're going to let it continue on and see what else they uncover, but it's not going to really stop us from, like, having a good time over here, because we're not going to change our route and everything. We're just going to be more careful and cautious of our surroundings.

LEMON: You're from California, so it's pretty early out there. Maybe some folks have not gotten up.

MARTINEZ: Yes.

LEMON: Some people wake up at the crack of noon. We know how that is.

MARTINEZ: Yes.

LEMON: So, I want to know -- but some of the folks who are from the East Coast, and also parts of the central parts of the U.S., they have spoken to their parents.

What's the reaction so far?

MARTINEZ: Well, relief, obviously, because they're happy that everyone's OK over here.

LEMON: OK. Well, listen, we are glad you're safe, and we're certainly glad that you sent these pictures into us.

And as we always say here at CNN, we want you to stay out of harm's way, but send us your pictures and your videos if you can, and be safe while you're doing it.

We want to thank Tim Martinez, who is in London, and he sent in those I-Report pictures.

Go to CNN.com/ireport, and you, too, can become a CNN reporter if you send in some pictures.

Thanks, Tim.

MARTINEZ: Thank you.

(BUSINESS REPORT)

LEMON: Well, and speaking of food being safe, seafood lovers beware. Catfish, shrimp and other farmed seafood from China now on a growing list of potentially tainted or defective products that could be hazardous to your health.

CNN's Jason Carroll reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JASON CARROLL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): It's a nationwide alert that once again has brought Chinese imports into question. This time it's seafood.

The U.S. Food and Drug Administration blocked Chinese shrimp, catfish, eel, basa and dace. Basa is similar to catfish, dace is more like carp. None will be permitted into the United States until the importer can prove it's safe.

DR. DAVID ACHESON, FOOD AND DRUG ADMINISTRATION: They have to prove to us that they do not contain certain drugs that we have concern about.

CARROLL: The concerns came when FDA inspectors found imported seafood contaminated with unsafe food additives and antimicrobials which are used to kill things like bacteria.

Ian MacGregor owns a fish market and says he's prepared for the fallout.

IAN MACGREGOR, THE LOBSTER PLACE: You know, this type of thing, there tends to be I think significant reactions to it. So I'm sure our customers are going to be saying for a long time, "Make sure my shrimp's not from China."

CARROLL: And that's not all to be concerned about. The FDA warned people to stop using toothpaste imported from China after tubes tainted with a dangerous chemical were found.

Earlier this month, it was Chinese tires and toys that had safety violations. And in March, U.S. pet manufacturers began recalling dog and cat food after animals ate pet food with ingredients imported from China. Consumer advocacy groups say the FDA needs more inspectors and the authority to do more.

CAROLINE SMITH DEWAAL, CENTER FOR SCIENCE & PUBLIC INTEREST: FDA needs to have a comprehensive program for insuring the safety of imported foods. And this includes not only checks at the border, but also checks in the country of origin.

CARROLL: As for seafood, the FDA says it tested out five percent that comes from China. Critics say that number should be much higher and say there should be one agency overseeing imports.

URVASHI RANGAN, CONSUMER REPORTS: The variety of different products that are imported into this country are inspected by a variety of different agencies. And when it comes to food, there's even more hairsplitting.

CARROLL: For example, the FDA generally handles food, but it's the USDA that handles meats and poultry. The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration dealt with those faulty tires from China. As for imported toys, that falls under the U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: And we have one footnote for you. Industry watchers say the U.S. imported $1.2 billion in fish from China in 2004. PHILLIPS: Well, a nefarious scheme short-circuited by London police. Now terror experts are sifting through suspicions to come up with possible suspects.

We'll get one analyst's take next in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: One London bomb plot foiled. Now apparently, according to our Paula Newton who's working this story out of London, another car bomb has been found. She's bringing us the developments, rather, as she's working her sources, of course, on this story.

Paula, what have you found out about this?

PAULA NEWTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, a few hours ago we learned there was another car that was being investigated about a mile and a half from the original location at Piccadilly Circus. It's very close to Hyde Park, for people who are familiar with London.

With that car, though, overnight police and security sources tell CNN it was actually towed from a location close to Trafalgar Square to the location that it's at now.

It involves an underground parking garage. We actually believe that it was towed by city officials who just assumed it was parked in the wrong place. Doing what many city officials do when they see a parked car that shouldn't be parked there. Workers at this compound then called police and said look, this car is smelling like gas. That was after they saw what had happened this morning. Police went down there.

Police and security sources again telling CNN that the components that they found in this car closely resemble what they had found in the car in Piccadilly Circus. Obviously, it's been quite unnerving for them to have to make this kind of discovery. They're stopping short of saying that it is actually another car bomb.

They're investigating to see exactly if there was anything tethered to it, if it was just bomb making supplies or what exactly was going on with it. But suffice it to say, Kyra, it's not -- it's definitely concerning to them and not what they wanted to find out about this second car. You know, we spoke earlier about how the fact there would be more and more alerts throughout the day of people flagging up suspicious cars.

Unfortunately, what ended up happening here, is they actually have found some component parts of a bomb that they feel are very suspicious to them, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: So, the first car found near a nightclub where hundreds of people were. The second one, you were saying, close to the embassy. So, are there key areas in London that authorities are responding to and seeing if there's anything suspicious around certain buildings or areas that are busy?

NEWTON: Most definitely. And they're looking for very iconic scenes here. And if they are trying to target these areas, Piccadilly Circus, like we've said many times today. You know, Piccadilly Circus is to London what Times Square is to New York. Then you take Trafalgar Square, where originally where this vehicle was parked.

Again, quite iconic and you don't have to stretch your imagination too far to figure out why they'd want to hit those kinds of targets. But again, not saying too much, this car was parked sometime in the overnight hours and landed in this compound. They're not saying too much because like the first situation, Kyra, a lot of it just isn't adding up to them.

And it's taking -- I learned this morning from hearing from sources that when they had actually opened up the car at Piccadilly Circus, we learned it was detonated -- sorry -- that is was disabled manually, something that's incredibly unprecedented. That kind of leads you to believe that they didn't actually know what they were dealing with until they actually opened the car door.

With this car now that's parked at this area in Park Lane, they aren't taking any chances and basically the robots seem to be doing most of the work right now. We do expect to hear more in the following hours from Scotland Yard.

But again, police and security sources telling CNN that this second car has been found to have some component parts, the same type of components that they found in the car at Piccadilly Circus.

Kyra?

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: All right. Our Paula Newton, live from London. Thanks, Paula.

LEMON: The big question is, what might investigators be doing right now? Who is responsible for all this? Laura Mansfield, a terrorism and counterterrorism analyst and author. She is on the phone with us and she joins us from Greenville, South Carolina.

Laura, of course in the past couple of years we've heard about all of these terror plots, all of these men who have been arrested. According to analysts and people we've spoken to, we can't count these people out as being possibly responsible for this latest round of terrorism.

VOICE OF LAURA MANSFIELD, COUNTERTERRORISM ANALYST: Absolutely. In 2004, there was a plot in London busted up by the British authorities that involved plans to attack clubs, nightclubs, airplanes, shopping malls and other -- basically what you consider as soft targets.

LEMON: This was Operation Crevice that you're talking about, where they raided a neighborhood in England. And they found explosives or at least all this fertilizer, we're looking at the video tape from that, tons of fertilizer they were planning to use. At least according to investigators, to try to blow up targets in Europe.

MANSFIELD: Exactly. Interesting enough, several of the individuals who were associated with, or investigated in conjunction with Operation Crevice, and they were later placed on home office monitoring have disappeared. I think six gentlemen have gone missing in the last six months to a year. One of them had links to Zarqawi.

It's pretty hard to not take a look at what's been -- this vehicle borne IED that's been described in London this morning, and not see similarities between that and the car bombings we've seen in Baghdad over recent years. And you have to wonder if perhaps this individual was someone involved in planting this bomb received some training from Iraq. Perhaps, you know, on the ground training, and then you also have to look to the Internet on this, because there are ...

LEMON: Yes.

MANSFIELD: ... plenty of instructional material out there on the Web on how to create these things.

LEMON: Yes, I want to talk to you about that. Because it is -- and here's how it plays out, because London, just in the past couple years really has had a problem with terrorism. A lot of the terrorism suspects that they've gathered have been really preyed upon, they say, by radicals, clerics who come into the country and they recruit these people as well.

And, also on these Web sites that you're talking about, Laura, some of which we came across today, that anyone can easily go to, it teaches them how to make a bomb on these Islamic Web sites.

MANSFIELD: Sure. Absolutely. There are also documents out there for the Jihadists in how to go about recruiting someone. Their personal characteristics that they look for to find people who are vulnerable to recruitment into the Jihad. It's amazing the material that's out there.

LEMON: There's one too, which was very interesting, called -- it's a Nemo Web site which uses a cartoon where you can go into that and find out what you should do if you want to become a terrorist. All types of information. Explain this web site to us, and how easily there's access to this. After you do that, why are these web sites still up and why doesn't the government take them down?

MANSFIELD: Well, the Nemo files, it's not a specific Web Site it's actually emerged on several different Web Sites. They first surfaced about a year and a half ago. And it has details on how to do everything from, you know, reassembling automatic weapons, to how to make explosives devices, how to take, you know, a patio or barbecue grill propane tank and turn it into a bomb. And all this stuff is ...

LEMON: So, Laura, why is this site still up, then?

MANSFIELD: Well, part of the reason it's still up is as soon as the authorities take it down, it pops up somewhere else. The Jihadists maintain copies of it and they just load it on another server somewhere else.

LEMON: You're saying that this one has been up though for a year and a half.

MANSFIELD: Well, the files have been up for a year and a half. I believe that specific -- yes, that specific Web Site has been up for well over a year and a half. And I believe the files that I was looking at this morning were up from at least March of 2006.

LEMON: Real quickly, Laura. Does this, though, serve investigators in some way if they leave these sites up that maybe they can track some of it back to the people who are putting this out?

MANSFIELD: I imagine that's part of it and I imagine some of it has to do with the fact that the Web Sites are just out -- some of the Web sites are just out of the jurisdiction of U.S. authorities.

LEMON: Okay, real quick. This is my last question to you. What about -- there has been some talk about that Muslims in Europe and especially in the U.K. might feel that they're more ghettoized than they are here in the U.S. And that may mean that they're more prone to the recruitment of radicals. What do you say about that?

MANSFIELD: Well, I think there is something to that. The American way of life is very seductive, and it's much easier to assimilate here than it is in the U.K. people tend to -- it's more, I hate to say.

LEMON: My last question to you -- there has been some talk about that Muslims in Europe, especially in the U.K., might feel that they're more ghettoized than they are here in the U.S. and that may mean they're more prone to the recruitment of radicals. What do you say about that?

MANSFIELD: Well, I think there is something to that. The American way of life is very seductive, and it's much easier to assimilate here than it is in the U.K. People tend to -- it's just -- it's more -- -- it's more -- I hate to say more open, but in a way it is more open. In the U.K., many of these groups have -- ethnic groups have gone into almost enclaves, sections of town and they have become ghettoized. Some of it's by choice, some of it's just the U.K. (ph) and that's the way things are there. And I believe that is a factor, but bear in mind that some of it is these -- some of these individuals are being targeted for recruitment because they are in that specific situation.

The Jihadists are specifically targeting those individuals who feel disenfranchised. I have an article on the Web site called "Islama," radical Islam a haven for (INAUDIBLE) some merit to that.

LEMON: All right, OK, Laura Mansfield, terrorism expert who's also worked with the British government to try to root out terrorism. We thank you for joining us today in the CNN NEWSROOM.

MANSFIELD: Thank you.

PHILLIPS: In Iraq, five more American soldiers are dead in a roadside bomb attack, seven others are hurt. The U.S. military says it happened in southern Baghdad. The combat patrol was attacked by rocket-propelled grenades and small arms fire right after the explosion. Ninety-eight U.S. troops have been killed in Iraq so far this month. The overall death toll for U.S. forces in Iraq stands at 3,575.

The Defense Secretary, the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff talking to reporters about the fight for Iraq.

CNN Pentagon Correspondent Barbara Starr was among the reporters there just minutes ago. Barbara, anything interesting?

BARBARA STARR, PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, absolutely, Kyra. That attack that you just talked about in which five soldiers were killed, seven wounded yesterday in a complex IED attack that also included small arms and rocket-propelled grenades. That was the first question to Defense Secretary Robert Gates about that attack because while IEDs have always been the number one killer of U.S. troops in recent months in Iraq, these IED attacks are growing more deadly in the recent weeks and months.

Secretary Gates said he is now making an all-out effort to get the government and industry to start more quickly producing a new generation of IED-resistant armored vehicles, if you will. They are called MRAPs (ph), mine-resistant armor protection vehicles. He talked about how concerned he is about this. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROBERT GATES, DEFENSE SECRETARY: Lives are at stake. For every month we delay, scores of young Americans are going to die. And so, I think that's the biggest incentive of all. These manufacturers are patriotic, they're working hard to figure out a way to cut the timelines on this, but I think that a significant flow is probably a few months off.

But right now, I want them there fast enough that we're actually flying some of these vehicles to Iraq.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STARR: So, once again, an all-out effort to get armored protection, a new generation of armored protection to the troops in the field, just like we've heard over the recent years with those advanced armored vests, with the advanced armored humvees.

Now, struggling to try and get enough of these new armored vehicles that we are going to be hearing a lot about, getting them to the troops in Iraq -- Kyra?

PHILLIPS: All right, Barbara Starr from the Pentagon, thanks.

Race and politics at Howard University's Democratic presidential debate. We'll have details straight ahead from the CNN NEWSROOM.

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PHILLIPS: The eight Democratic presidential candidates squared off last night in their third televised debate and there was not one question about Iraq. The location was historically black Howard University, and the focus was race relations in America.

CNN's Senior Political Correspondent Candy Crowley was there.

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CANDY CROWLEY, SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The most diverse field of presidential candidates in history met on the campus of historically black Howard University to talk about race in the 21st century.

JOHN EDWARDS, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Slavery followed by segregation followed by discrimination has had an impact that still is alive and well in America.

CROWLEY: They talked about racial inequities across the board. But first, they talked about the Supreme Court decision barring the use of race in assigning students to public schools. Joe Biden called for a new president to correct the conservative tilt of the Bush court.

SEN. JOE BIDEN, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: They have turned the court upside down, and the next president of the United States will be able to determine whether or not we go forward or continue this slide.

CROWLEY: They talked act racial disparities and health care.

SEN. HILLARY CLINTON, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Let me just put this in perspective. If HIV/aids were the leading cause of death of white women between the ages of 25 and 34, there would be an outraged outcry in this country.

CROWLEY: They talked about gaps between blacks and whites in education, employment opportunities and justice. SEN. BARAK OBAMA, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: The criminal justice system is not color blind. It does not work for all people equally, and that is why it's critical to have a president who sends a signal that we are going to have a system of justice that is not just us. But is everybody.

CROWLEY: Iraq was barely mentioned except in the context of how much it was costing, money that could be spent elsewhere.

REP. DENNIS KUCINICH, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Stop funding war. Start funding education. That's where we get the money.

CROWLEY: African-American voters are the most loyal and one of the largest voting blocks in the Democratic party. So, the debate at Howard was a must attend for these candidates.

(on camera): Nobody took any major hits. At the same time, there was no breakthrough performance. On this night, most of the candidates pretty much agreed on pretty much everything.

Candy Crowley, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: Once again, CNN is raising the bar on the presidential debates. Monday, July 23rd, the Democratic candidates square off in a CNN/YouTube debate. Anderson Cooper hosts this first of its kind event. Live and interactive, on TV and online. You can see the Republican candidates debate on Monday, September 17th only on your home for politics, CNN.

LEMON: An unsettling story gets even stranger. Hours before investigators found the bodies of Chris Benoit and his family, the wrestler's write-up on Wikipedia mentioned the death of his wife. Who posted it and how did they know?

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PHILLIPS: Worldwide web tangled up in the double murder-suicide case of pro wrestler, Chris Benoit. He believed to have killed his wife and son at their Georgia home before hanging himself.

A Wikipedia user in Connecticut admits to getting on to Benoit's Wikipedia page and writing about Nancy Benoit's death some 14 hours before authorities found their bodies. The user said he heard rumors about her death and put it on the site. It turns out he was right. He has posted an apology on that site, calling it a terrible coincidence.

Yesterday, authorities searched a doctor's office not far from Benoit's home, they were looking for information about visits and prescriptions. They did not make any arrests.

LEMON: Now to California where there's big progress in the battle against a wildfire near Lake Tahoe. Fire crews have contained about 70 percent of the 3,100-acre blaze, thanks in part to a second straight day of calmer winds. Some roads in the area have been reopened and some evacuees are being allowed back home, or what remains of their home.

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UNIDENTIFIED HOMEOWNER: It's sad but it's not the end of the world. You know, it's not hitting me as hard as I thought, but it's sad. Twenty years. The whole neighborhood, it's just stuff. That's all it is, is stuff.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Since it broke out last Sunday, the fire has destroyed more than 250 homes.

Well, there's no relief in sight for a water-weary Texas. The National Weather Service is forecasting more rain today for already flooded areas. So far, storms have been blamed for 11 deaths in the state.

In Oklahoma, more of the same. Rain continues to fall, causing more flooding in areas already soaked by more than two weeks of record rainfall.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was coming down through the driveway and it was right up over the -- where the bead is on the car tires, running down there just like a river.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm sick and tired of it. About to mildew down here.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Well forecasters say the rain could continue to fall through the middle of next week.

(WEATHER REPORT)

LEMON: Given the boot, an Amtrak passenger kicked off the train and left in a remote area, and now a dispute over exactly what happened.

PHILLIPS: A potentially deadly car bomb defused by London police. Now a second car is found with some of the same materials. The latest on a developing story, straight ahead, from the CNN NEWSROOM.

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PHILLIPS: A St. Louis man who went missing after he was kicked off an Amtrak train over the weekend has been found safe. Sixty-five- year-old Roosevelt Sims says he was kicked off a train outside Williams, Arizona. The area, remote with no running water. And Sims was found walking along a road late last night. Amtrak says Sims appeared drunk and that's why he was kicked off the train. But his family says that's not true.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRIAN MASON, BROTHER KICKED OFF TRAIN: They thought he was drunk, intoxicated. But actually he's a diabetic and we just found ...

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PHILLIPS: Amtrak says the conductor waited with Sims at the stop in Williams, but Sims ran off when police showed up. Sims is in good condition despite several days on the road.

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