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New Front in Terror War?; St. Louis Arch Closed; Sheehan Shirt not Hidden
Aired July 22, 2007 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight, the U.S. military heading to a new front on the war on terror? We know the order, number one, Afghanistan. Then two, Iraq. Then three, Iran? No, move over, Iran. The new talk is Pakistan.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Working real hard. (INAUDIBLE) offering to work as closely with intel and with kinetic effects as he is comfortable working with us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Kinetic what? Could it mean we might use artillery strikes? We'll tell you what we're finding out tonight that you need to know.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Listen, Robert and the kids are stuck in the arch.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: This famous landmark gets slammed shut on tourists. They're trapped. So much for the gateway to the west.
Overseas, trouble in both France and England. Tragedy in one, a huge and watery inconvenience in the other.
In dog bone politics tonight, the woman who suggested she would Bobitt her husband if he cheated, and it appears he did, is now putting the blame not on him but, you guessed it, on the media.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Most any other marriage this would have been a private issue between a husband and wife, very private. Obviously, it is not here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Then there's Cindy Sheehan. She accuses us, as in CNN, of covering up her message. But tonight, we uncover the truth.
And do Americans even know how much money is being spent on Iraq? (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A hundred billion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Higher.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One hundred fifty.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Higher.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Two fifty.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Higher.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Three hundred billion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Higher.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: In case some nosy reporter asks you, we'll tell you what it is.
Oh, and a heralded CNN/Youtube debate tomorrow, but we've got our own tonight. Sort of. It's here, it's now from the CNN NEWSROOM.
And hello again, everybody. I'm Rick Sanchez. We find ourselves once again here in "B" control, where we bring you news. War in Iraq, war in Afghanistan, and now talk of fighting maybe in Pakistan.
Background, Pakistan is probably where bin Laden is, where his number two Zawahiri is. They hate President Musharraf and they're going after him. And the U.S. may need to go in and help.
The Pentagon's top officer was put on the spot about a possible Pakistan deployment, not by a congressman, not by a reporter, but by somebody with a much stronger personal investment in all of this, an Army wife. Listen to the chairman of the joints chiefs answer the question. Here's her question. Will my husband go to war in Pakistan?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEN. PETER PACE, JOINT CHIEFS CHAIRMAN: We're working real hard with President Musharraf, offering to work as closely with intel and with kinetic effects as he is comfortable working with us. And we're working through that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Kinetic effects. We checked. Kinetic could very well mean using artillery to fire into Pakistan. Boots on the ground, no. That's what the general says. Absolutely not. Certainly not at this point, but does it rule out something else?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) PACE: If he needed support of fires, or he need some kind of other air support, if he were to ask that, we would certainly sit down with him and see how it's going to be used.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: All right, let me try and set the record for you, because I think it's important sometimes to get a geographic perspective on this. Roger, go ahead. Put up the shot that we're talking about here. These are the three guys that we're talking about. Musharraf, you see him on the right of your screen; Zawahiri, you see him in the middle; bin Laden, you see him on the left.
Now let's go ahead to the map and show you where these guys could possibly be. This is Google Earth. And we're going to go in right into the area that we're talking about. You see the line there that separates Afghanistan with that part of Pakistan? Well, Wahiristan, that strange word that you see there with the north and south, that's the mountainous region where supposedly both bin Laden and Zawahiri possibly are. That's also the area the United States has never gone into or at least as far as we know fired into. But you see the part there where Afghanistan is. That's where cities like Jalabad are. That's where Bagram Air Force base is. That is where quite possibly we are learning today from experts that we have spoken to, the U.S. could use launches to possibly use hellfire missiles or long-range missiles. Possibly use drones to go into that area and either go after al Qaeda or maybe even go after bin Laden and Zawahiri themselves, and somehow try and bail out President Musharraf of Pakistan.
So what does the White House say about the potential for any military action in Pakistan? Is it even on the table at this point? Definitely. Here's what we're hearing. Here's CNN's White House correspondent Ed Henry.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
HENRY (voice-over): The president's top aides say U.S. military action in Pakistan's tribal areas is on the table to target al Qaeda in the Taliban.
FRAN TOWNSEND, WHITE HOUSE HOMELAND SECURITY ADVISER: No question that we will use any instrument at our disposal to deal with the problem of Osama bin Laden, al Zawahiri, and al Qaeda. HENRY: The White House is on the defensive after a new government report declared Pakistan has become a safe haven for al Qaeda.
SEN. RICHARD DURBIN (D), ILLINOIS: After putting massive resources into a war in Iraq, we have lost sight of the goal of capturing Osama bin Laden and closing down al Qaeda.
HENRY: Mr. Bush is walking a tightrope. He's been praising Pakistan even though a deal that President Pervez Musharraf cut last year with tribal leaders has helped al Qaeda regain momentum.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRSEIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Musharraf is a strong ally in the war against these extremists.
HENRY: Now Pakistani leaders are irked by the talk of U.S. military strikes within its borders.
KHURSHID KASURI, PAKISTAN FOREIGN MINISTER: The Pakistan army can do the job much better and the result will be that there will be far less collateral damage.
TOWNSEND: I understand their anger but of course Wolf, the president has made perfectly clear that job number one is protecting the American people. There are no tools off the table and we use all our instruments of national power to be effective.
HENRY: The tensions come with Pakistan already in flames as militants retaliate for Musharraf, ordering an attack on the pro- Taliban red mosque. The chaos may force Musharraf to finally crack down in the remote tribal regions where U.S. officials believe al Qaeda has regrouped and bin Laden may be hiding.
TERESITA SCHAFFER, CENTER FOR STRATEGIC AND INTL STUDIES: At this point he's still being pushed by the militants. They still have the initiative but he may decide if this continues that he doesn't have any choice any longer.
HENRY (on camera): U.S. officials say they're committed to working with Musharraf. And they can't push him too hard. If his government falls, an extremist regime could take over and get its hands on Pakistan's nuclear weapons. A nightmare scenario.
Ed Henry, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SANCHEZ: Let's go through this for you a little bit more. If, and obviously it's a big if, but if the United States military decides to send troops to support Pakistan against al Qaeda, they're not going to be starting an offensive. They're actually going to be joining an offensive. The peace deal between Pakistan's army and the Islamic groups on the Afghan border is no more. And the fight is back on between these two.
Just this weekend, Pakistan forces reportedly killed 19 militants in scattered gun battles there. Same militants are setting off bombs near military convoys and attacking troop positions, a relatively calm period in the border region. That's around that area you may have heard of before, Quetta. It's lasted less than a year.
Now would be even talking about this tonight if Osama bin Laden was out of the picture? No. If he was in prison, on trial, or dead, we wouldn't. Who knows? But the fact is he got away. Why? Because CIA officials on the ground asked the White House for help, but they didn't get it.
Here's our terrorism analyst now, the best in the business, Peter Bergen.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PETER BERGEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Mistake number one, a big one, letting Osama bin Laden go. U.S. Special Forces had bin Laden cornered in the Tora Bora mountains of Afghanistan in late 2001. The CIA commander on the scene asked for more forces to catch al Qaeda's leader, but was turned down. And bin Laden escaped.
Mistake number two, getting distracted. The United States ousted the Taliban and chased al Qaeda into Pakistan, but then it shifted the focus and manpower to Iraq, leaving just a handful of U.S. operatives to catch bin Laden. Art Keller hunted al Qaeda in Pakistan just last year, when he was with the CIA.
ART KELLER, FORMER CIA OFFICER: To use a medical analogy, it's like quitting a course of antibiotics too soon. You just leave a reservoir of infection even stronger to come back after you.
BERGEN: They are now more Americans on the ground in Pakistan, but the damage has already been done.
Mistake number three, misunderstanding the enemy. The Bush administration hoped that Iraq would draw terrorists to one place, making them easier to kill. The so-called fly paper theory.
But the opposite happened. Iraq has strengthened al Qaeda. It's now a training ground for terrorists from around the world.
KELLER : People are going there to learn the tactics and then come back.
BERGEN: Certain irony?
KELLER: yes, it is. It seems like the reverse of the way the war on terror was supposed to work.
BERGEN: Take suicide bombings, for example, once unheard of in Afghanistan, now they happen at least once a week. I met a failed suicide bomber in Kabul, who survived when his vest didn't blow up.
Do you still hope to be a shaheed (ph), somebody who martyrs himself when you get out of here?
"Of course."
That's mistake number four, the so-called Iraq effect, letting al Qaeda spread its ideas and methods around the world.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SANCHEZ: CNN terrorism analyst Peter Bergen, who studied bin Laden.
Coming up, taking the gateway to the West just got really ugly. 200 people are trapped.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: First time up the arch.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Yes, this is a tourist attraction gone all kinds of wrong. That's next.
Also, I thought my interview with Cindy Sheehan was fair, but she didn't think so and complained to the press about us. What she said that isn't true.
Also, they represent a group that could push the election one way or the other, the youth vote. We've got six of them standing by live tonight. Do they even know they're on camera right now? We're going to talk Iraq, abortion, religion and a whole lot more. All this, right here on the CNN NEWSROOM. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Listen, Robert and the kids are struck in the arch.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: This famous landmark gets slammed shut on tourists. They're trapped. So much for the gateway to the west.
Overseas trouble in both France and England. Tragedy in one, a huge and watery inconvenience in the other. In dog bone politics tonight, the woman who suggested she would Bobbitt her husband if he cheated, and it appears he did, is now putting the blame not on him but, you guessed it, on the media.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
Most any other marriage this would have been a private issue between a husband and a wife, very private. Obviously, it is not here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Then there's Cindy Sheehan. She accuses us, as in CNN, of covering up her message. But tonight, we uncover the truth. And do Americans even know how much money is being spent on Iraq?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A hundred billion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Higher.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One hundred fifty.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Higher. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Two fifty.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Higher.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Three hundred billion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Higher.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: In case some nosy reporter asks you, we'll tell you what it is.
Oh, and the heralded CNN YouTube debate tomorrow, but we've got our own tonight. Sort of. It's here, it's now, from the CNN NEWSROOM.
And here we go with part two. I'm Rick Sanchez here in "B" control. It could, we understand now, takes months before Southern and Central England are back to normal somehow. The flood waters are finally starting to recede tonight, but not the problem there.
Let's look at it from the skies first. You can see how serious the situation is in the U.K. Some areas got a month's worth of rain in just a couple of hours. Look at that. Getting anywhere is impossible. Royal Air Force helicopters are working around the clock. They're trying to rescue people. The flash flooding shut down a water treatment plant. So even though there is water everywhere, drinking water, it's in short supply.
Back here, it's been raining so hard just west of Colorado Springs, that mud slides are now thundering down part of the mountains there. You're looking there at a small mining town. It's an Alpine, Colorado, mud slides causing some serious damages there. Dozens of homes have been covered. Roads are closed. And more than a hundred people have been evacuated. County officials say it's going to take a lot of work to try and bring this community back to what it was.
And the people there have been through quite a lot over the last couple of days. Meteorologist Jacqui Jeras has been - in fact, you and I spent the last couple of days talking about this and what they've been dealing with, not only there, but in parts of Texas. By the way, is this part of the same system?
(WEATHER REPORT)
SANCHEZ: Jackaroo, we thank you.
Tourists trapped inside a famous St. Louis landmark. Some 200 strangers flopped down their money and got far more than they bargained for last night. My wife would have gone crazy. They were headed 630 feet up to the top of the gateway arch, when the power went out. She hates elevators, Roger, leaving everybody stranded and in the dark inside this place. That's when things got really interesting. This is an unbelievable report. Watch this. This is from Julian Grace from our affiliate KMOV in St. Louis. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JULIAN GRACE, KMOV NEWS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Saturday night at 9:00, emergency vehicles rushed to the gateway of the west.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, that's clear.
GRACE: Once on the ground, firefighters stormed inside the arch, trying to get 200 people stuck in the south and north tower out.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Granny, listen, Robert and the kids are stuck in the arch.
GRACE: While crews worked inside, family members and friends worked the phones outside, trying to get in contact with loved ones stuck inside.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We came to the top of the arch and we are stuck here.
GRACE: Julia was only left with the voicemail on how her friends could not get down out of the building. Then two hours passed and family and friends just waited and waited for this whole ordeal to be over. Then finally, the doors flung open and the celebration started. While there was some who were glad to place their feet on solid grounds, others had complaints about how this whole ordeal was handled.
JULIA JEWELL, TOURIST: Well, if you want to get out that bad, jump. But that comment should not have been made.
GRACE: A day later, crews told everyone about what caused the mishap. They say a cable broke, which shorted out the electricity, causing a power outage, which resulted in 200 people being stuck in the arch.
PEGGY ODELL, SUPT., JEFFERSON MEMORIAL: All the safety measures for the tram kicked in. They stopped in place. They stayed where they were.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SANCHEZ: Oh, to be a fly on the wall in that thing. Well, that was Julian Grace from our St. Louis affiliate KMOV. Biggest problem of the night was the inconvenience in the tense moments, right? Other than that, rescue crews said they treated two people because they were so stressed out. They had to take them in and try and help them out.
Coming up, a senator gets caught up in this web of the alleged D.C. madam prostitution scandal. We're going to tell you why embarrassment may be the least of his worries, at least when it comes to his wife.
And then later, there they are, ready to go. I'm going to have a live candid conversation with six young people on the eve of the CNN/YouTube presidential debate. These are Youtubers you're looking at, or so we think. We'll explain. They will, maybe. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: We welcome you back. I'm Rick Sanchez. Dog bone politics. Now a segment with a bite. Cindy Sheehan, she told us here last week that she plans to run against House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, and that she's going to Iraq. News items, right? Legitimate.
But she also wore a shirt that said "impeach Bush". We decided not to make a big deal about the shirt, so in the future, we wouldn't be used as a billboard ad by everybody we interview who wants to wear some kind of clothing with a message.
But we did not cover it up in any way. Well, here's what she told the "Atlanta Progressive." After my interview with her, "At CNN, I did an interview with Rick Sanchez. While taping, they scrambled 'Impeach Bush and Cheney.' Like it's obscene."
"What's obscene is," she goes on to say, "CNN and their cheerleading for this war and administration."
Take another look. Sorry, Ms. Sheehan, despite what you may think, we scrambled absolutely nothing and hid absolutely nothing. And "The Atlanta Progressive" didn't contact CNN to verify Sheehan's claim by the way.
In journalism school, I was always taught not to use the word "claim" when speaking about somebody unless you think that someone is wrong. Wrong, as in Cindy Sheehan in this case.
Louisiana Senator David Vitter has a lot on his mind these days. And a lot of it has nothing to do with politics. Vitter has owned up to reports that his phone number appeared on records of a prostitution scandal. His wife, Wendy, publicly forgave her husband. And that had to be a huge relief for the senator.
Why, you ask. Well, back in 2000, Wendy Vitter told an interviewer that if her husband ever cheated on her, she would be like Loreana Bobbitt. In her words, ready, "I'm walking away with one thing and it's not alimony. Trust me, ouch!"
You might notice one thing missing when you look at the top three candidates in the latest New Hampshire presidential primary poll. There's no white male. The poll was conducted for CNN and WNUR at the University of New Hampshire.
State Democrats, at least for now, favor Hillary Clinton with 36 percent, a woman. Barack Obama brings in 27 percent, African-American male. Bill Richardson, who is Hispanic, has 11 percent.
We should note, however, that John Edwards, who is a white male, right, is right there with just 9 percent. Thought you'd find that interesting. Hundreds of thousands, millions, billions, how about trillions? There is a new congressional report out. And it details just how much the United States is spending in the war on Iraq. So far, Congress knows, but shouldn't the American people know, as well? After all, it's your money. Here now what you say.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SANCHEZ: How much money is the Iraq war costing you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A lot.
SANCHEZ: A lot?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
SANCHEZ: Do you think it's more than a billion?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Probably.
SANCHEZ: Do you think it's more than a hundred billion?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, yes, I guess it would be that, but I don't know for sure.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Billions and billions.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'd say $6 billion.
SANCHEZ: $6 billion?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think it's over a hundred billion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A hundred billion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Higher.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One hundred fifty.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Higher.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Two fifty.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Higher.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Three hundred billion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Higher.
SANCHEZ: What does that mean?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How much cost the Iraq War?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Five hundred.
SANCHEZ: Close.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Four hundred and seventy-five.
SANCHEZ: You went down. It's higher.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Higher? 525.
SANCHEZ: That's still close.
567 billion buckaroos. The CNN/YouTube Democratic debate is coming up tomorrow night. But tonight, we get a preview. What would you ask the presidential candidates were you given a chance? Or should I say what would these six young people ask them. Where are they? There they are. Three of them anyway.
What you say, that's what we call our segment when we go out and talk to people. Well, we brought them in this time. It's live. It's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: We welcome you back. I'm Rick Sanchez. Time to count down the hottest video picks of the day. And this one is truly hot. We are going to begin in Rome with number four. Yes, this isn't that Rome. It is Rome, Georgia. And what is interesting about this fire is firefighters there say they have never had to use so much hose before to try to put out a fire, that's partly why it is so fully engulfed. There you see the hose right there. They say the hydrant was so far away, it's as far as they have ever had to go to try to get water to put out a fire in that city.
Number three, let's take you to France now. The problem here is that there was a bus that was going up a hill it was not supposed to be on because the gradient was so particularly steep. Well, apparently nobody told the bus driver that. He went over the embankment. There you see what's left of it. Twenty-six people have died in a tragedy that they are still dealing with tonight there in France. We'll be checking on it.
Number two, remember I-Reports you saw right here first on CNN about this gas explosion that took place with all the steam coming out of the ground in New York City? Well, you saw it over and over again what could possibly be underneath all that steam? Now we know, in fact you're looking at it. There it is, it's a truck that ended up like in a sinkhole. The problem, how are they going to be able to finally get that out of there? Well, they figured out a way to finally get that out of there. We're going to show you.
There it is. They had to bring a big giant crane. Maneuver it in through New York City, get it in there, and literally pull the truck out vertically. And, of course, New Yorkers just love what it did to their traffic patterns there.
Video number one now, Colombia, this is scary. Imagine being on this plane. It was taking off, it was an Aero Republica, an Embraer, there were about 59 people on board when suddenly they weren't able to get up or get any altitude on take off. So instead they continued, broke through the runway and ended up with the nose of the plane right there into the sea. Imagine that situation. The good news is nobody was hurt. When we come back, what is a YouTuber, anyway? Well, there they are. They are ready and waiting to tackle some grown-up questions. No! Don't use that word "grown-up." They don't like that. Stay there, the war, Pakistan, religion. And who are the upstarts going to vote for anyway? And why? This is going to be good. Stay with us.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MIRACLE JONES, GEORGIA STATE UNIV.: Hi, my name Miracle Felice (ph) Jones. I'm a 19-year-old student here at Georgia State University. My main belief is that our soldiers at home and abroad need to be taken care of never way possible. What I look for in this upcoming election is a candidate who has an extensive plan of how to take care of our soldiers, that's including having a good health care system when they return home as well as their being able to be hired for jobs and their families being taken care of while they are overseas fighting for our country.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: All right. Settle down, boys and girls. Welcome back. Tomorrow night only on CNN you're going to be seeing something rare in politics and in journalism. But, hey, it's the YouTube generation, right? Americans have videotaped their own messages on YouTube to pose to the folk whose want to be the next president of the United States. And you see some of those entries right there on your screen now.
Now granted, some of them have been a little freaky. CNN is going to air them in a debate from Charleston, South Carolina, tomorrow night with the Democratic presidential candidates. But remember it's real people asking real questions. Not phony baloney stuff.
So basically you, the viewer, are going to be running the show. But tonight we invited some of our own guests to talk face to face about the future of our country. And these are the people who literally are the future of our country. Look at these young faces. Five college students. One high school senior.
We welcome you all. How are you guys doing, good? Ready to go? All right. We're going to talk about the -- first of all, let's -- gimme a wide -- stay on a wide shot, Roger (ph). We're going to get a sense about who is who here. If you're a Republican, raise your hand. Two Republicans over here.
You're a Democrat, raise your hand. We've got two Democrats. If you're independent or not sure raise your hand. That would be you, Andrea (ph), and you, too, young man, right?
You ready to go, Patrick? Start with the Iraq War because I know this is something that interests everybody. And before we do anything else, let's listen to a couple of the candidates, right? Osama -- uh oh, Barack Obama is first. Here we go. Barack Obama's comments. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D-IL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Too many lives have been lost, too many billions have been spent, for us to trust the president on another tried and failed policy opposed by generals and experts, opposed by Democrats and Republicans, opposed by Americans and even the Iraqis themselves.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Now we old folks are talking about this all the time, but this really affects you guys. I mean, it's your generation that is paying with blood in many cases, who are being called to duty.
I want to start with you, David. I know you have some very serious ideas about this. Your feeling, though, what you just heard Mr. Obama say.
DAVID KIRBY, STUDENT, UNIV. OF GEORGIA: Well, I think that he has some valid points. And that there has been money that we've spent. We have lost some lives. My own brother is over there right now, so I can certainly understand the feelings of families that are over there right now.
SANCHEZ: Would you like to bring him home right now if you possibly could?
KIRBY: I care more about the American people as a whole. I understand that my brother voluntarily enlisted into the military. And I would love for my brother to be here today. But I also understand that there's a mission that needs to be accomplished.
SANCHEZ: You do believe that. You think we should be in Iraq.
KIRBY: I do.
SANCHEZ: Convinced of that.
KIRBY: Absolutely.
SANCHEZ: Do you think we should have been there -- what do you say to those, hey, there were no WMDs, hey, there was no tie to 9/11, why did we go?
KIRBY: I think that it's easy to look back and try to say, what if. We acted on the intelligence that we had. And I think that you know all of us are saying, well, what if we knew then...
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: What did you say? You said, that's not true.
DANIYAL INAMULLAH, STUDENT, EMORY UNIV.: That's not true. We didn't...
(CROSSTALK) SANCHEZ: Daniyal, go ahead.
INAMULLAH: We didn't act on any sort of intelligence. We acted because of 9/11. Although it was a tragedy, Bush and Cheney...
SANCHEZ: So why are we in Iraq, Daniyal?
INAMULLAH: They took advantage of it and they gained popularity out of that.
SANCHEZ: But what do you say about all those CIA documents that the Bush administration presented, saying, look, we have evidence of this, this, and this.
INAMULLAH: Nothing was ever proven. There was no WMDs. There was no link between 9/11 and Iraq. It is ridiculous that we're there.
SANCHEZ: So you think it was bogus war?
INAMULLAH: Yes.
SANCHEZ: And you, Melissa?
MELISSA HURLEY, STUDENT, EMORY UNIV.: I think that we shouldn't really focus on what has happened in the past. I think we should just be responsible and try and figure out how to get everybody home.
SANCHEZ: To that, let's license to John McCain. Because he has got a similar comment about this. Let's go ahead and pick that up, Roger, and then we'll get some of the reaction on the back end of this. Here now, John McCain talking about what you, Melissa, were just mentioning.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R-AZ), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If we leave Iraq and set a date for withdrawal, it is now going to be a very difficult challenge for us and we could see a disastrous situation because I do believe that al Qaeda has now made it part of their global effort to destroy everything we stand for and we believe in.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: And here's the point. Even if al Qaeda wasn't there when we originally went in. They there are now. So what do we do? Bail and leave al Qaeda in control?
Miracle, to you.
JONES: I think that we should stay there and fight. Right now if al Qaeda and all these other terrorists have infiltrated Iraq, then we need to stay there and fight and we need to get the right equipment for our soldiers. We need to get the right plan, the right generals there to fight. Right now we don't have that.
SANCHEZ: Well, but then, maybe here's the question I should ask you. We mentioned a little while ago when we started this conversation that you guys are of the age where you can be called to go. Raise your hand if you're ready to go? Raise your hand if you're ready to go to Iraq tomorrow.
JONES: I'm not allowed to go because I have medical issues that...
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: Is there anybody who is going to raise their hand and say they are ready to go to Iraq?
KIRBY: If my country needs me tomorrow, if they call me, if they draft me, then I will go.
SANCHEZ: You said it's the right war. So are you ready to go?
KIRBY: If my country need me to go, I will go.
INAMULLAH: Hey, if one Republican senator can send their kids in, I will go, too.
SANCHEZ: Thank you so much. We appreciate that, guys. We are going to be talking about a lot of other stuff. Interesting comments. And you guys are young, too. That's what is amazing about this. We are going to continue the discussion. A couple of other topics that we're going to tackling, the idea of authenticity on the campaign trail. That's what they say that they are looking for.
Also, morality on the campaign trail. Religion, is it overused? People who wrap themselves around the flag. All of this when we come back, the next discussion. Stay with us. We're talking to YouTubers and they're talking to you.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDREA BONO, STUDENT. GA. PERIMETER COLLEGE: Hi, my name is Andrea Bono. I'm 20 years old. My parents are originally from (INAUDIBLE) but I was born in New York. I'm currently a student at Georgia Perimeter College majoring in political systems. I'm employed at the Latin American Association and my hobbies include reading and watching movies.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: There you have it, part of the YouTube generation. Andrea, thanks so much for being here. You know, tomorrow is the big CNN/YouTube debate, but tonight we wanted to bring a couple of these YouTubers in here so they can have a conversation with you, so we can kind of get a sense as older people what these young folks are talking about these days.
One of the biggest concerns for them is, am I going to be able to get a job when I graduate from college? After all, with everything going on with outsourcing, some of the problems that we have with foreign debt in this country, problems with the deficit, all the bills that are going to be racked up as a result of the war on terror, they are starting to question whether there's going to be anything left in the pie for them.
Here now, Rudy Giuliani on his promises if he's president.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RUDY GIULIANI (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: One of the ways I could help you take care of your college loan, believe it or not, is to reduce taxes so that more jobs would get created, better paying jobs would get created, and you'd have an opportunity for an even better job.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: I know that you guys have to be concerned about the possibility that you are not going to be able to find any kind of work because of everything going on. Not to mention when you get into the conversation about Social Security, about Medicaid, Medicare.
I mean, let's start it with you, Patrick, what do you think of this situation? And what do you think is ahead for you?
PATRICK FITZMAURICE, HIGH SCHOOL SENIOR: Well, I'm concerned, because I got my first paycheck the other day and they showed me everything they took out. Took out stuff for Medicare, Social Security tax, federal income tax.
(LAUGHTER)
SANCHEZ: Welcome to the real world, right? It's only going to get worse, my friend.
FITZMAURICE: So I'm all for lower taxes and I actually like the idea of the FairTax, which is out there, which would take away the income tax and all those other little taxes.
SANCHEZ: Well, we were talking just a little while about the situation in Iraq. You saw how much money is being spent, most of it being borrowed. That means Mr. Adult here is not paying for it, you guys are going to be paying for it, because what you borrow you eventually have to pay. And the generation that is going to pay it is you, my friends. To that you say what? Go ahead.
KIRBY: I think that -- you mention the cost of the Iraq War. But one thing that we're not talking about is Medicare. The unfunded liabilities for Medicare based on the 2005 Medicare trustees report was $2.3 trillion. That's four times the cost of the Iraq War to date. In order for us to raise taxes to cover that, it's going to cost us 815,000 jobs annually over the next 10 years.
SANCHEZ: Are you concerned that none of that pie is going to be left for you there, Miracle? He make a great point, you know. JONES: I think there's a lot of uncertainty in the future. And I think that's why I like candidates like Romney who have business backgrounds, are good candidates because they have plans of how to invest, how to have students have different health care situations for us because with the Iraq War, the jobs decreasing, and outsourcing there has to be plans at home.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: And you think Romney is the guy who can take care of that. Melissa, you want to get in on this.
HURLEY: I think that another issue that we really need to think about is Social Security, because we are going to be paying into Social Security our entire lives. But the chances of us really seeing it because of the Baby Boomers is slim to none.
SANCHEZ: And that rankles you, right?
HURLEY: Yes. We are going to be paying into something that we're never going to see unless something really changes. So...
SANCHEZ: Are you convinced that you're not going to be able to see it? I mean, you already...
HURLEY: There's a good chance. I mean, there is a really good chance that it's not going to be around for us. And I mean, drastic changes need to be made to it in order to protect us. And I feel like nobody thinking about us, and thinking about the future. I think they are leaving a lot of problems to us to handle and they are not doing anything to protect us from these issues in the future. So...
(CROSSTALK)
KIRBY: President Bush tried to address that before with his Social Security plan which was blocked.
INAMULLAH: Yes, but that was a terrible plan. That plan was privatizing Social Security which means that people would be responsible for their own Social Security. The government is supposed to provide for the people. It is not supposed to get the people to do it by themselves.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: You're afraid that it is based on investment. Oh my God, all of a sudden everything goes down the tubes in the economy, so does Social Security, right? That's your concern.
INAMULLAH: Yes, not everyone is an investor.
JONES: But at least it was a plan. But the government is not supposed to take care of us, we are supposed to care of ourselves. That's the problem with our country.
INAMULLAH: The government is supposed to be helping us. (CROSSTALK)
JONES: We don't put our responsibility on the government and say, you do this, you do this, you do this, and we sit back and...
INAMULLAH: Why not?
JONES: ... we sit and we pay -- because that's not what the government is for.
INAMULLAH: We work.
JONES: That's why there is no Social Security because there are so many people who take out but don't put back in.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: Hold that thought. We're going to continue in just a little bit. That's the fiscal responsibility as seen by some of you guys. Now we're going to be able to talk about the morality issue. The religion issue that we talked about just a little while ago. We'll have that on the other side of this break. Stay with us. We're going to keep at it with these young folks.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HURLEY: Hello, my names is Melissa Hurley. I'm 21 years old and a senior at Emory University. I'm a political science major who is committed to public service. I was a double bassist in the Emory Symphony. And I'm a tutor at the local elementary schools. I'm also the Social Action Committee chair of Delta Sigma Theta. In 2004 I interned for Congresswoman Denise Majette when she was running for U.S. Senate. And the following year volunteered for Ann (INAUDIBLE) bid for city council. I'm currently an intern at the Democratic Party of Georgia, and I plan to pursue a career in public service.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Well, there you have it. Hey, let's give it up for Melissa. Not bad, you go! All right. Listen, morality and religion. We see an awful lot of it of late. Candidates who wrap themselves in the flag and then talk about God this and God that. And in many cases, as we have seen in this newscast tonight, don't necessarily abide by some of God's laws. It's called hypocrisy. Are you guys, especially in your generation, given what we see in YouTube, looking for a little more authenticity in these people?
HURLEY: Absolutely.
SANCHEZ: Go ahead, Melissa. And then I'm coming back to you, young lady. All right? You haven't said enough. Go ahead, Melissa.
HURLEY: I think that a lot of candidates are spending far too much time trying to say the right thing instead of just saying what they feel. I think they are spending way too much time trying to appease everybody instead of just talking about what they truly believe in.
SANCHEZ: Do you get a sense when you are talking -- when you hear -- Andrea, when you hear these guys talk, fake?
BONO: Absolutely.
SANCHEZ: Does that word come to mind?
BONO: Absolutely. And I think religion is something that is very important, don't get me wrong. But it shouldn't be the only thing that we base on when we vote.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: Do you think -- here's a -- well, wait, stop, here's a question for you, you ready? A candidate has to make a decision between the Constitution of the United States and his religion or his spiritual basis, his God, which one do you think that he should choose?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Constitution.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Constitution.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Constitution.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Absolutely.
SANCHEZ: Raise your hand if you think God. Raise your hand if you think Constitution. Pretty much everybody believes it's the Constitution then, right?
You don't think so?
KIRBY: I said both. I think that you're...
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: But if it comes down to it -- but if it comes down to a decision, the law says this and the Constitution says something else. In fact, let me just throw it at you. Abortion.
KIRBY: Yes. Well, the government does not mandate abortion. If the government was actually committing abortions then I would say we would have a clear problem on our hands and I think that somebody should withdraw from that position.
INAMULLAH: I think the problem is just when these senators use religion to get their own benefits out of it. For example, the very people that are against abortion are for the death penalty, which is a contradiction, of course.
KIRBY: It is not a contradiction of any....
INAMULLAH: It is a contradiction.
(CROSSTALK)
KIRBY: No, the difference is...
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: If you're against killing someone, you're against killing someone, right?
JONES: No, we're against abortion because it is killing innocent life. You're for the death penalty because somebody has shed...
(CROSSTALK)
HURLEY: But who are you to decide?
(CROSSTALK)
HURLEY: But who are you to decide at what point a life isn't valuable anymore or someone deserves to die? Like, it should be everyone's choice. I'm so tired of religion dictating other people's lives. Religion is supposed to be personal. Religion is supposed to be your relationship with God...
(CROSSTALK)
HURLEY: ... and stop imposing it on everyone else.
(CROSSTALK)
JONES: But you don't have to be a religious person to be pro- life or pro-choice. That's what your opinion is based upon...
HURLEY: But when I see religious people protesting in front of the abortion clinics, showing signs of people with fetuses -- with, you know, post-abortion fetuses and stuff like that. Like, I work for the Democratic Party and there's an abortion clinic that's across the street, I see this when I'm driving out of the office and it's disgusting. This is a person's choice. Don't involve yourself in it. It's a personal choice. Stop imposing yourself on everybody else.
(CROSSTALK)
JONES: ... within their rights to protest and free speech. And just because someone is using their religion to use their free speech doesn't mean it is wrong. It's like, oh, only people who don't believe in God can protest something?
KIRBY: You know, Melissa, one thing that said that jumped out to me was that we sort of leave religion out of government all together. But if you read the writings of our founding fathers, people who shaped the very Constitution that we all believe in, they use God throughout all of their...
(CROSSTALK) SANCHEZ: They were extremely religious men, but they were also wise enough -- they were also wise enough, were they not, to make sure that religion didn't dictate our policy, correct?
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: There was a separation of church and state.
KIRBY: But not God and state. And I think that's a very important distinction. They did not...
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: By the way, I want to know -- I want to know -- before we wrap this up, I want to know how you guys are leaning. Anybody leaning toward Clinton right now -- Hillary Clinton? Raise your hand. Hillary Clinton. Barack Obama. Barack Obama, one. Senator John Edwards. No. Let's go to the Republican side, Giuliani. Giuliani, yes. Mitt Romney, Mitt Romney. Anybody -- did I -- am I missing anybody.
FITZMAURICE: I'll go with McCain.
SANCHEZ: You're going with McCain.
HURLEY: Richardson.
SANCHEZ: You're going with Richardson. That's -- and you're Hispanic. Are you going with Richardson?
BONO: I might. I mean, it just depends on how he goes with immigration. That's something that's very important.
SANCHEZ: Not necessarily, though, just because you're Hispanic doesn't mean you're going to vote Hispanic.
BONO: No.
SANCHEZ: All right. Stay where you are. We're going to be coming back in just a little bit. We'll continue a little bit of our discussion. In fact, it's almost time to wrap things up here with our YouTubers. Stay with us. You're watching CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Rick Sanchez, we'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: We welcome you back. You know what is interesting, we started the conversation. We talked a little bit about abortion and then we started talking about religion. And suddenly you guys got fired up like it was something deeply personal here. Now it's interesting, because most people agree that religion should be left out by most politicians, that too many of them perhaps even exploit it.
But I'm wondering how many of you here are religious in one way or another? That you have some kind of faith? You go to church? Raise your hand if you go to church. We've got one, two, three, four who go to church. How many just pray at some point? You pray -- you go to mosque.
INAMULLAH: Right.
SANCHEZ: Sorry.
(LAUGHTER)
SANCHEZ: So you pray, you go, you are a religious person. That's interesting. All six of you consider yourself religious and yet you don't think politicians should honor and separate the two, which is also extremely important.
One topic we didn't get a chance to talk about, I know this is a big one for you, you're from Honduras, right? There is a lot of people coming into this country from Honduras. Many of them are being sent back. I've been on some of those flights. What do you think about the immigration issues in the country and the huge polemic that exists with that?
BONO: I think there should definitely be a reform. I think that it would help us economically. I think that it would...
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: What do you do with the $12 million that are already here, do you take them and send them back the next day?
BONO: No.
SANCHEZ: You let them stay?
BONO: Yes. And...
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: But you just stop the rest from coming in?
BONO: No. I think it should be more organized. I think they should get a strategic plan together and help the people that are already here.
SANCHEZ: That's what they tried to do. We're almost out of time. Guys, thanks for being here. Thank your schools, Georgia Tech, Georgia State, Emory, round of applause for all of you, really appreciate it, OK?
(INAUDIBLE) yourselves as well. Thanks so much for being with us. I'm Rick Sanchez, trying to bring your opinions into our news. We're CNN, the most trusted name in news. We'll see you next weekend.
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