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Iraq Wins Soccer's Asia Cup; Asking College Republicans Why They Aren't Serving in Iraq; News Helicopters Crash; Pedophilia or Free Speech?

Aired July 29, 2007 - 23:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When they came down, it was like slow motion. I couldn't find anybody.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: Now the serious question. One car chase, five news choppers. One crowded air space. Why?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I come from a part of the state that fought with the union in the Civil War. I mean, my grandfather said I fought for the union. And I've - like I shot. So we've always been Republican.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: He was a southern Republican before it was cool. Will the South rise again for Democrats who get spanked there during most elections? It's our Sunday spotlight.

In Iraq, the general and the prime minister engaged in their own personal war. Uh-oh. Aren't these guys supposed to be on the same team?

They say everything is bigger in Texas, including marijuana fields. We'll give you the straight dope on this one, dude.

A self-described pedophile visiting playgrounds and bragging about it.

Also, take a closer look at the last supper. You see a hidden image there that proves Jesus fathered a child? So many people are talking about this one worldwide, it's crashing the Internet. And we'll have it in the CNN NEWSROOM.

Hello again, everybody. I'm Rick Sanchez. We're here in B control. I've got a lot of political news that we're going to be sharing with you, including news about Cynthia Mckinney.

But first, we've got some remarkable tape. This is a videotape that just came in out of California. It's around L.A., the Ventura freeway. Unbelievable accident. Watch this car. It suddenly skids, hits the side of the road, the median. And then it goes back into the road in such a way so that other cars just keep hitting it. I mean, watch this. One car after another.

That's a photographer who's shooting this by the way. He's watching this as one car after another hits it. And then, what you just saw there was part of a motorcycle. The motorcycle was being driven by a 52-year-old police officer. That police officer, part of California's Highway Patrol, has died there on the scene. As many as ten cars continue hitting this vehicle one after another until police were finally able to arrive there at the scene. It was almost painful to watch.

What we've done is we've cut it down for you as best we can. In the end finally, that's what the whole scene looked like. But as we were watching it, just seemed like one car after another hitting in the middle of the median after that one car ripped into the side. And tonight, the bad news is of course that one officer is dead as a result, as many as 10 other people may be injured. There were in the other cars that crashed as well.

We also got a tip tonight that reporters in Oklahoma were being told to gather in a field where agents would meet them and then take them to a secret destination. That's all the information that we were given.

Well, it turns out to be a bust like none that we have ever seen. A horse track complete with an illegal gambling operation was set up there. Up to 400 people were there, including families, men and women with their kids. Also, of course, dozens of horses have now been taken away. The raid took place in a secluded 100-acre site that would have otherwise been almost impossible to find right there on the border between Oklahoma and Texas.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CONSTANTIN RIEGER, OKLA. HORSE RACING COMM.: It resulted in numerous arrests. At this time, approximately 100 to my knowledge. And as the investigation continues, that will likely change, including but not limited to arrests for racketeering, money laundering, illegal gambling, illegal operation of racetrack, and other assorted arrests.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Reporter Sophia Reza of KOCO is joining us now. She was there when the raid occurred. She's joining us from a place called Thackerville, which most people I would imagine never heard of. I guess you're right there on the border between Oklahoma and Texas.

Sophia, you didn't know what you were taken to, right? This whole thing was real hush-hush, right?

SOPHIA REZA, KOCO NEWS CORRESPONDENT: It certainly was. You know, we were told to dress in jeans and in boots or tennis shoes, bring some Deet with us because we were going to be going to a wooded area out in the middle of nowhere. We were told to meet at a certain location at around 3:15 this afternoon, where we were told we were going to drive close to two hours to close to the Oklahoma-Texas state line. And then once we met at a certain location, we were then told what was happening. The only thing we knew is that it was a law enforcement activity and that it involved more than 200 law enforcement officers from Oklahoma. When we got here...

SANCHEZ: So you finally get to the scene, and there's this raid going on. These people who were there were confronted by the state police. What was their reaction when it happened?

REZA: Well, some people ran. Of course, those who were possibly allegedly involved ran. When we got here, we saw officers with their rifles drawn. They were blocking off a certain area where they were raiding this operation...

SANCHEZ: My God, look at that.

REZA: And...

SANCHEZ: I mean, I'm sorry. I'm just...

REZA: The video's amazing.

SANCHEZ: ...I was -- I interrupted you because I'm reacting to the pictures that I hadn't seen yet. I can't believe these people were able to put something like this together. It looks like something you'd see at a legit horse track. Did they just build this out of nothing?

REZA: Well, it looks certainly like that's what they did. But you know what? This whole operation, there was 400, at least 400 people here. This is something you have to understand that goes on every weekend. As you mentioned, families come. They bring their kids. Kids were here with their parents as they were being escorted by police officers, where they could be processed. So this is an operation. And we talked to a spectator who said that he didn't even know it was illegal. He just comes here to have a good time.

SANCHEZ: Yes. Well, you know, and one wonders, as one looks at these pictures, why these people didn't just go to a -- if they like horse tracks and racing, why didn't they just go to a legitimate one? Why did they have to create one in the middle of nowhere? But you know, I guess it's part of the story that we'll have to get to a little bit later. Sophia Reza of KOCO, thanks so much for joining us and bringing us up to date on that story. Wild.

Well, tonight, a lot of questions are being raised about that helicopter crash that killed two pilots and two local news photographers in Phoenix. Why were five news helicopters sharing such tight airspace over a car chase who many feel shouldn't require such exhaustive coverage to begin with?

Well, here's what the Pointe institute.com media consultant asks tonight. Let's put that up for you. This is a direct quote. "Why don't television stations use pools instead of every station sending a helicopter with a photographer into the sky for essentially the very same shot? They could just share one photographer and one helicopter." Interesting question, isn't it?

Also, preliminary information now seems to show from what we're learning tonight as we dig into the story that the pilot of one of the helicopters simply didn't know that the other helicopter was above him. And he literally just rose right into him.

Here's another issue -- whether the chase suspect should be charged on the deaths of the four people that were killed in the crash. Now, most legal experts will tell you that that is a stretch. But Phoenix police are saying they are really considering it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SGT. JOEL TRANTER, PHOENIX POLICE: And in this type of incident where we had a commission of a number of felonies and a result of those crimes, we had the tragic death, you know, due to an aircraft mishap, of two media helicopters and the tragic death of four wonderful people. You know, our investigators are taking that fully into account.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: By the way, we should also share this picture with you. Near the scene of the crash, that park where it came crashing down, both of them, people had been dropping off flowers and cards and candles as a makeshift tribute to those four victims.

Tonight, there is more evidence of a resurgence of the Taliban in Afghanistan. And it comes in the form of a plea that's really almost tough to listen to. Ten days ago, a group of South Korean missionaries, Christians, were taken hostage. Well, tonight for the very first time, we're hearing from one of them. We've highlighted one of those hostages in a photo that we put for you there. You see her right there? That's the voice you're about to hear. Her family recognized her voice today in this recording of a two-minute phone call to a Reuters reporter. She says that militias have separated the group and they keep moving them. This is her plea.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

YOO JUNG-HWA, HOSTAGE: Please save us. We don't know what will happen tomorrow. Please save us. We want to go home. We miss our family. We don't want to die.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: And they're threatening to kill her as well, she mentions, in the tape. The Taliban have vowed to kill, in fact, all the hostages one by one if their demands for a prisoner release aren't met. One was executed, as a matter of fact, just last week.

Tonight, for the very first time ever Iraq has become exactly what the U.S. envisioned. The problem is it likely won't last very long. Sunni, Shia, Kurds, all were just Iraqis today. They came together to celebrate the Iraq national soccer team winning the Asia Cup.

Iraqis went wild. Fans poured into the streets. They were chanting. They were waving flags. There's the soccer team now in their big win. They were also firing guns. Bullets hit four people that were killed. And also during the celebrations, by the way, wounded another 17. A curfew is now in effect in Baghdad as the country braces for even more celebrations. But experts are asking how long will that last?

As one victory plays out, there's a new war appearing to brew. This one is personal, and it's between the top U.S. general in Iraq and that country's prime minister.

Now here's the rub -- it seems that these guys simply don't like each other. And one source says that he once heard Prime Minister Nuri al Maliki tell General David Petraeus "I can't deal with you anymore and I'm going to ask for somebody else to replace you."

Now that's the prime minister talking to a U.S. general. The U.S. ambassador, Ryan Crocker, who meets with both men on a weekly basis, says he has a different take, he's trying to quiet the situation. "Wrestling with things that we're all wrestling with here, it would almost be strange if you didn't get a little passionate from time to time."

Staying now with the Iraq War and do a little Josh's corner. Josh Levs is joining us to talk about something that's interesting. And it has to do with Young Republicans., that's what the organization is called, getting a visit from a writer who then challenged them since they all seemed to be very gung-ho about the war as to whether or not they themselves would go and fight in this war.

JOSH LEVS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Exactly.

SANCHEZ: Or do they want to?

LEVS: Right, that's what happened. I mean, it's a man named Max Blumenthal who decided to go to a meeting of this national College Republican group. And he posed to some of these people a question that they may not have seen coming.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why are you not fighting them over there?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why am I not fighting them over there?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

BLUMENTHAL: Because I'm in college right now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I have a scholarship (INAUDIBLE). And I just didn't have any real -- I didn't have any strong urge...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't think -- you can't talk about this issue if you're not serving.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEVS: OK, so he put that and more into an Internet video that he's calling Generation Chicken Hawk. And he told us that this is what it's all about.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAX BLUMENTHAL, MAXBLUMENTHAL.COM: An ideology that says you can support this war, which is not supported by most Americans and which is wearing down the military without serving in it in any way or participating in it or making any kind of sacrifice.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: You know, it's interesting as you watch these guys. And I think most people at home would agree. That there seems to be a certain hypocritical nature to this. I mean, they're so boastful when they talk about supporting the war and yet sheepish when it comes to actually doing something about it.

LEVS: That perception is definitely what led a lot of people -- what led Max to want to even do this video. And it's one -- making a lot of people really interested.

SANCHEZ: But what about the guy who runs the -- isn't there like a top guy at the top? And I imagine as a journalist, you probably sought him out.

LEVS: Absolutely, I did. Spoke with him. And guess what? He's a veteran. 25 years old and he served in Iraq. Now he called this a political hit job. He said it's one-sided, this video that Max Blumenthal put out there. And this representative of the group also told us this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NICK MICCARELLI, CO-CHAIR, COLLEGE REPUB. NATL. CMTE.: There are many people who support stricter laws and a lot of things in this country and aren't necessarily willing to go become police officers.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Now, he seems like a straight up guy who's willing to put his muscle where his mouth is. Maybe a little different than some of the guys in this organization. But you know, it's interesting. These organizations, maybe it's me, but they're awfully young to have so much to say about something that maybe they ought to put in a couple of years first. But we'll leave that alone...

LEVS: You have something to say in college.

SANCHEZ: Well, I know, I know.

LEVS: Rick Sanchez, come on. SANCHEZ: But they're young upstarts. But is there a sense that this is the kind of organization that makes the Karl Roves of the world?

LEVS: You -- exactly. It actually made the Karl Rove of the world.

SANCHEZ: He was a member of this organization?

LEVS: Karl Rove was in this, Ralph Reed, Jack Abramoff. Some major Republican players started off in the College Republican world. So one thing Max Blumenthal is saying with this video is you know what? Some of these people someday just might be running America. So it's worth challenging them now, getting to know what their positions are, and from his perspective calling them on what he views as hypocrisy.

SANCHEZ: That's amazing. Josh Levs. Thanks, Josh.

We call that Josh's corner. What do you say?

The south hasn't shown Democrats much love in recent elections. Is that ever going to change? I'm going to ask southern Republican Lamar Alexander in tonight's "Sunday Spotlight." That's straight ahead.

An amazing scene in Arizona. A car flips into the water. Onlookers rush to the rescue. I'm going to show you what happened bit by bit. Stay here. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: And welcome back. Here's where we count down some of the best video pics of the day. And we're going to begin in Russia with women in a 100-yard dash wearing very high heels. Why? They say because they can. And because most men they say can't. At least no men that we know. It's not even easy on them. Take a look at that.

Now, let's go to number two. This is out of Jacksonville, Florida. It's an 18-year-old. He's in that vehicle you're looking at right there. Police are worried because they've been chasing him for a while. And suddenly, he does these wheelies and starts coming at the officers. See the headlights? Seem to be coming right at the police officer.

Then they lose him again. He's not on the roadway. That's because he's over there. See that fire? Apparently, he's underneath that vehicle, maybe trapped. Police officers don't know. They run in, they're trying to get him out. So they're screaming at him. In fact, listen to this conversation.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Come on!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My seat belt's... UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't care, come on!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Come on, they say. He says I can't, my ankle's stuck. Well, finally, they are able to extricate him from the vehicle. And as you might imagine, he's been charged tonight. There are the firefighters arriving at the scene. With several counts, including being intoxicated.

Number one, video number one is from Arizona. This is amazing. Two children are in this truck that's flipped over onto this roadway. There's a flood. The children are upside-down. The water's going over their heads. So one of these rescuers comes over here out of the blue, gets one child out. Watch. Now he's going to go over to the other side. And you'll see where there's yet another child, who's in a restraining seat. If they don't get him out, he's going to drown. So they're reaching in there. They're finally able to pull him out. And they take him out as well. It's a really remarkable rescue by some people who happened to be at the right place at the right time. And boy, thank goodness that they were.

I want to show you another picture now. And it's someone who's got a group of parents in Los Angeles so upset tonight. They're calling this guy public enemy number one. He's Jack McClellan, a self-admitted pedophile. He is constantly taking pictures of kids in parks and public places and then posting them online.

That's not illegal, but it is creepy. And here's what's even more weird. McClellan says he's just attracted to children, but he has never actually molested a child. He's just constantly calling attention to himself, making this a free speech issue now rather than a criminal case.

Coming up, we're going to bring you our "Sunday Spotlight." He has been a southern Republican since that title was almost a curse. And now it's friendly turf for the GOP, but is that about to change? Senator Lamar Alexander is joining me tonight to talk about the dens (ph) in the South. Come back. It's our "Sunday Spotlight."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: We welcome you back. I'm Rick Sanchez. You know, we're passionate about politics here on Sundays, especially. And tonight in our Sunday political spotlight, a seventh generation Tennessean and the only Republican from that state ever elected both as a governor and a United States senator, ran twice for president, by the way. Senator Lamar Alexander is tonight's "Sunday Spotlight."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: You're one of the old-time southern Republicans. You were a southern Republican when it wasn't cool to be a southern Republican.

SEN. LAMAR ALEXANDER (R), TENNESSEE: Well, that's right. Except I come from a part of the state that fought with the Union in the Civil War. I mean, my grandfather said, I fought for the Union and I vote like I shot. So we've always been Republicans.

SANCHEZ: What changed, though? Why are southerners now -- have such a tendency to want to be Republican and actually even not just be Republican but skew so conservative, so far -- so much further to the right?

ALEXANDER: Well, it all began with the Goldwater movement back in the '60s. Howard Baker was the first Republican elected from Tennessee in history. And generally the South has become more conservative and more Republican. Twenty-five years ago I was the only Republican governor in the South. Now there are a number.

But Tennessee is still very, very divided. We have a Democratic governor. A majority of our congressmen are Democrats. So we're an independent state.

SANCHEZ: Well, what I want you to do is give some advice to the other side. What would you tell a Barack Obama or a Hillary Clinton or a John Edwards? How did they get southerners to give them a good look where in many cases they haven't or won't?

ALEXANDER: Well, don't run off chasing New York City votes so far to the left that you're completely out of business down here. I mean, Al Gore...

SANCHEZ: But what do you mean by that?

ALEXANDER: Well, Al Gore did that on gun control, for example. In fact, his father did that. And there are just some issues in the South that are cultural issues. One of them is Second Amendment rights.

SANCHEZ: And that's an important one. How about gay marriage? Because you know, Karl Rove was seemingly politically astute when he made sure that that was on the referendum on a lot of key states. Is that -- and during the debates tonight there were three, four, five questions on that. Is that a good topic for southerners?

ALEXANDER: Well, you know, people in Nashville, where I am today, we don't walk around the street talking about gay marriage. That's not what we talk about. We talk about health care and the war in Iraq and football, what's coming up.

So traditional family values are very important to southern families as they are to me. By I would suggest that the candidates for president say where we're going in Iraq, how Americans are going to afford health care, what we're going to do about continents that are...

SANCHEZ: All right. You started -- you mentioned the Iraq thing. So let's delve into that. It looks like a huge loser right now for this administration and for Republicans. If you were a Democrat -- as a political issue. I'm talking as a political issue. If you were a Democrat, how do you hit that with and win? ALEXANDER: If I were a Democrat, I wouldn't dare touch it as a political issue.

SANCHEZ: Really?

ALEXANDER: Absolutely not. Because we've got people fighting and dying in Iraq and everybody knows that. And I think the people of this country are sick of politicians in Washington...

SANCHEZ: But wait a minute, wait a minute...

ALEXANDER: No, I'm quite serious about that. This...

SANCHEZ: Yes, but hold on. I'm going to stop you real quick. What do politicians and their bad policy have to do with soldiers? Why is it that every time somebody mentions the Iraq policy, somebody stands up on the outside and says, oh, you're not allowed to talk about that because soldiers might be dying.

Well, you know what? Don't the soldiers need us to talk about a failed or perhaps problematic policy?

ALEXANDER: The soldiers need us to have a unified message about where we're going from here in Iraq. I talked to a retired Special Forces general this week. He said our biggest problem with the war is that al Qaeda thinks we're divided. So if we spent more time on, say, supporting the Baker-Hamilton bipartisan recommendations about where we go, which I support with Senator Salazar of Colorado, and less time in all-night slumber parties and political stunts, we'd have a better country, our troops would be better supported, and the public's opinion of Congress and presidential candidates would be a lot higher.

SANCHEZ: Well, let me put you on the spot. Had you been president of the United States, knowing what we now know, would you have gone into Iraq?

ALEXANDER: I can't -- I'm not going to do hypotheticals about what went before. My job is to say where to go now. And where I think we should go now is adopt the bipartisan Baker-Hamilton recommendations with a new mission in Iraq, a long-term limited role, and more diplomatic efforts to end the war.

And if we had that, we'd have a unified mission in the Senate. If the president would be just a little more flexible and the Democrat leader in the Senate, Harry Reid, work stop playing politics, we could have 60 or 70 votes for that.

We're going to be there for a while. What we need is a new mission that we can support that would bring about half our troops home and still keep the place from becoming a haven for al Qaeda. That's exactly what Baker-Hamilton recommended. That was five Democrats, five Republicans. Why can't the Senate adopt that?

SANCHEZ: Lamar Alexander, you're a wise man and a common sense guy. And we appreciate you taking time to be our "Sunday Spotlight."

ALEXANDER: Thank you for inviting me.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: Coming up, what is Da Vinci telling us about Jesus? There's a new analysis of his "Last Supper" that many of us grew up looking at over our dinner tables. This is the hottest thing on the Internet. In fact, it's so hot it's crashing Internet sites. We're going to take you to this, tell you about what they're saying they see there.

Also, what's the story with presidential hopeful Joe Biden and the YouTube gun guy? Two guys questioning each other's sanity. Which one is right? The meat of the matter is coming up in our next segment. We call it, ruff, ruff, "Dogbone Politics."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: "Dogbone Politics" tonight. When all else fails, blame the media. Former Georgia Congresswoman Cynthia McKinney is going after The Atlanta Journal-Constitution. She is accusing the paper of libeling her last year in office in its editorials and in a news article. The editorial page editor just won a Pulitzer, in fact thanks in part to some of the pieces she wrote on McKinney.

A Democratic challenger knocked McKinney out of office in last year's party primary. Cue the dogs.

(SOUNDS OF DOGS BARKING)

SANCHEZ: Shoot 'em if you got 'em. That could be the motto for an upcoming political fundraiser in New Hampshire. The Manchester Republican Committee has invited members to what it calls a machine gun shoot. That's right, a machine gun shoot featuring everything from Uzis to M-16.

The organizer says -- we didn't make this up, folks, "it's a fun family day." The local Democratic chairman calls it downright offensive. Fido?

(SOUNDS OF DOGS BARKING)

SANCHEZ: Guns are also on the mind of a guy that you might have seen at the end of our CNN/YouTube debate tonight. Remember this guy? Then he takes out this thing? Everybody got a little frightened. You see the candidates kind of walk away. Jared Townsend (ph) asked the Democratic hopefuls if they would protect his baby, otherwise known as a semi-automatic rifle he held up to the camera at the time.

Senator Joe Biden didn't mince words. He questioned whether Townsend was mentally qualified to own a gun. Townsend responds now, telling The L.A. Times that Biden's remark was "kind of off kilter." Who is off kilter?

Coming up, Alberto Gonzales, facing even more heat in Washington. What's next for the attorney general? Well, it's Gonzo-gate part, what, seven? Our bloggers from the left and from the right come out swinging on this one and other issues. That's straight ahead right here in the NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: We welcome you back. I'm Rick Sanchez. What we want to do now is try and bring you some reaction to some of the stories that we've been talking about, especially the political stories. There's a battle in Iraq between the top U.S. general and the prime minister. They don't seem to be able to get along.

And there's also a war of words over Alberto Gonzales on Capitol Hill. Tonight we invited bloggers from the left and from the right to slug it out over this week's hottest political stories.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: You have these two guys feuding in the midst of all these problems with Iraq. How does this bode for the Bush administration? Robert, start us off.

ROBERT BLUEY, BLUEY BLOG: Well, I mean, I think that you're absolutely right. General Petraeus does mean business and he's there to get the job done. And he has got a deadline. He knows he has to show progress by September and he's not going to mess around. He's going to put the pressure on the Iraqi government to get some work done and...

SANCHEZ: Hey, Jane, is this a problem or not a problem for the Bush administration?

JAME HAMSHER, FIREDOGLAKE.COM: I think it's a huge problem. They've said that benchmarks in Iraq have to be met by the Iraqi government. It doesn't look like it's going to happen. There's feuding between the people who are tasked with carrying it out. It's a mess.

SANCHEZ: But at the same time doesn't it show that this guy's a tough guy? And that's exactly what the Bush administration would want to show.

HAMSHER: Yes, but none of the benchmarks are being met.

SANCHEZ: So in the end it's, what have you done for me lately?

HAMSHER: Well, the Bush administration has just bungled the whole war. I mean, having George Bush in charge of the Iraq War is like handing Lindsay Lohan the keys to your Lexus. It's a mess and...

SANCHEZ: Robert, what do you say to that?

BLUEY: Well, I mean, obviously I disagree. I mean, there have been struggles. I think they're to be expected. I mean, things haven't gone as well as anybody would like. But we have to give the surge a chance to succeed. And the truth of the matter is we're far too early in the process to make that judgment right now.

SANCHEZ: Let me go on to the next big hurdle, to use a word that you guys are coining, when it comes to the Bush administration. And that is what many of you are calling Gonzo-gate. It does appear, does it not, Robert, that somebody is lying there? You have the FBI director. You have Deputy Comey. You have investigators all saying one thing, and that is that they did go talk about the warrantless wiretaps at the hospital at Ashcroft's bedside. And then you have Alberto Gonzales saying no, we didn't.

Somebody's not telling the truth, Robert.

BLUEY: Well, I think what you have here is a Democratic witch hunt to go after anybody they can in the Bush administration. And you know, in their defense, I mean, why not? They see an opening here and they see the president's popularity dropping. So, you know...

SANCHEZ: Is that all it -- Jane, is that all it is, an opening?

HAMSHER: Well, I think it's great that Robert and Tony Snow are willing to defend Alberto Gonzales, but no other Republican would go on the Republican FOX News in order to defend him.

SANCHEZ: Is that a big problem for you, Robert, as a conservative? The fact that -- she's right, you know. The guys who were as critical as anybody else on this Gonzo-gate thing are members of the Republican Party.

BLUEY: Well, I mean, obviously you have some Republicans doing that. Arlen Specter, you know, being one. But even Arlen Specter today on the Sunday morning shows was saying we need to give Gonzales a chance, Pat Leahy's going to give him a week to clarify his testimony. So I mean, I think it's probably too soon...

SANCHEZ: But let me ask you point blank. Somebody is lying, right?

BLUEY: I don't know. I can't tell you that.

SANCHEZ: Well, somebody -- if you have three people saying A and another person saying B, somebody has got to not be telling the truth. They were all there, and they all have a different recollection of what happened? How is that possible?

BLUEY: Well, I think that what is being pointed out is that Gonzales may be parsing words, you know, there may be a distinction in the types of programs that they were talking about. So I think that, you know, obviously they're using legal language here. But it's not something that I can determine. It's not something that Jane can determine or...

(CROSSTALK)

SANCHEZ: Well, Jane, let me ask you on this, should somebody be subpoenaed to resolve this? And will the Democrats go that far, including subpoenaing not only the attorney general but maybe even using inherent contempt, which they're able to use, or even going as far as Karl Rove, who obviously is who they're trying to really get at, isn't it? HAMSHER: Well, in this situation I don't know that Karl Rove is the target. We're talking about the NSA wiretaps here and whether Alberto Gonzales told the truth. His version of events is not borne out by anyone, Nancy Pelosi, Tom Daschle, Robert Mueller, James Comey, for event after event after event.

SANCHEZ: But the question to you is, Jane, do you think the Democrats should actually put their actions where their words are? And that is actually start issuing subpoenas to get to the truth on this thing?

HAMSHER: Well, they've issued a lot of subpoenas, as you know, and the White House isn't complying with them. So I think you're absolutely right. Inherent contempt is the next option.

SANCHEZ: Interesting to see if it goes that way. Thank you both, Robert, Jane, for being our guests tonight. Appreciate it.

BLUEY: Thank you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: Now this, his home is rife with gang violence, but one former gang member is reaching back into his own community and his past to try to save others. Our "CNN Hero" is coming up right here in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Here's our favorite segment, tonight a "CNN Hero" proving that there is life after being in a gang. Now Luis Ernesto Romero (ph) is teaching others that very same lesson. Here now his story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Look right into the camera.

LUIS ROMERO, "COMMUNITY CRUSADER": I thought I was going to die at the age of 20 because somebody was going to shoot me. I was living as a gang member. In El Salvador kids get into the gangs because they don't have no other opportunities.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): When you're on the street, every moment you live you live as if it were your last, because you never know how that day will end.

ROMERO: Something powerful came up when my daughter born. So I started like checking, hey, what am I doing? What I'm going to offer to my daughter. But then I founded Homies Unidos in 1997, so I started educating myself and now you know I help others. We teach them how to empower themselves, not in smoking weed, not in violence, not doing what they do.

In El Salvador, the kids are much discriminated. If you have tattoos, if he's bald headed, but when he starts looking for a job, they don't give opportunities for him. We teach them how to do things in other ways.

(SPEAKING SPANISH)

ROMERO: They never thought they would have a bakery of their own. Now they have a bakery and they're doing their own business.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We think different. We don't think going into environments and doing killings, we do other things. Homies is saving a lot of lives.

ROMERO: We come from gangs and now we are part of the solution, so it doesn't matter how much I got to spend, how much time I got to be on it, but I need to do it for my kids and for the other kids of San Salvador.

(END OF VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: Great story, isn't it?

Coming up, take a look at this picture right here. Is there something about this picture that you see? Because a lot of other people are seeing that Jesus had a child. I know it sounds crazy. But this is crashing Internet sites all over the world, that many people are talking about this. We'll have it for you. Stay with us. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Back here at B Control -- way to go, Rog (ph). Headlines in our "You've Got to be Kidding" segment tonight. Three johns are crying foul, as in what the "cluck"? Hey, kudos to a creative judge in Ohio. Three guys own up to soliciting sex. Instead of giving them the traditional 30 days in jail, the judge ordered them to wear these ridiculous chicken suits every Friday and prance outside the courthouse for what they've done.

Here's another one. See all that green, that's a whole lot of pot. That marijuana, folks. Actually a whole field of this stuff was discovered by police in Dallas, Texas, along a stretch of I-20. We're talking about a million dollars worth, according to the DEA. It's the second time this week that they have spotted hidden marijuana plants in isolated fields.

Oh, and this. "The Da Vinci Code," it got us all thinking, now an Italian scientist thinks that he has revealed another Da Vinci secret. It's sensational that his Web site crashed after 15 million hits on it as a result.

You see here Da Vinci's "Last Supper" painting, right? With Jesus at the middle of the table? Well, an Italian scientist created a mirror image of the painting and superimposed it onto the original. You following?

He says that he was amazed to see another figure suddenly show up to Jesus' left holding the small baby. Mary Magdalene, Jesus' child? Go to the Internet but don't crash the site. Stay with CNN for the latest news, I'm Rick Sanchez. Thanks so much for being with us. We'll see you again, Saturdays and Sundays.

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