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Senator Larry Craig Seeking Withdrawal of Guilty Plea; Interview With Reverend Al Sharpton
Aired September 26, 2007 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: A judge in Minnesota will decide whether Larry Craig can take back his guilty plea. But what about his plans to quit the Senate?
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: The Idaho Republican is also having second thoughts for at least the second time about going back to Idaho. We will get the latest on the legal case and the case for not resigning this hour.
Hello, everyone. I'm Don Lemon, at the CNN world headquarters in Atlanta.
PHILLIPS: And I'm Kyra Phillips. You're live in the CNN NEWSROOM.
LEMON: What happened to four crew members of a boat missing off of Florida? New developments in that case right now.
And for the latest, we go to CNN's Susan Candiotti.
What can you tell us, Susan?
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Don -- explosive new claims from one of the two survivors who was on that vessel that was left abandoned. You remember there was one of two people who were put on a life raft, so they say. And now we have this information coming from an FBI affidavit that was just entered into court.
This information comes from an interview with the FBI between the FBI and Guillermo Zarabozo, 19 years old. He told the FBI here's what happened when they were all out on this charter fishing boat.
Said, all of a sudden, they were out at sea and some hijackers, unknown hijackers, commandeered the vessel. After they got on board, this young man says that they shot and killed the captain. He then goes on to say that the hijackers shot and killed the captain's wife, after she became hysterical, in his words.
The hijackers then said that another crew member was asked to throw the bodies overboard. When that crew member refused, he was killed. And then he went on to say that the other crew member was shot and killed when he refused to throw the bodies overboard, and then the teenager himself was asked to throw the bodies overboard. And so he did. Now, they also revealed in this FBI affidavit that they found a handcuffed key on the vessel, and that they also found a substance that they said could have been blood on the stern of the boat.
Now, remember, this young man is being held on a charge of lying to federal agents. They said that when they at first interviewed him, he claimed that he had never before seen this boat that they were towing behind them, and they knew that not to be true, since he had just come from that boat after he was found and rescued from the life raft.
Both of these subjects, he and Kirby Archer, the other man who survived at sea, he is being held on an outstanding warrant out of Arkansas for allegedly stealing more than $90,000 in cash from a Wal- Mart. So, they will remain in custody. Bond was denied, because the court agreed they are a possible risk of flight. And, so, this mystery goes on and on.
Terrible claims -- naturally, no one knows whether they are true at this time. What we do know is that those missing crew members remain missing at this time, a husband, a wife and two others -- back to you, Don.
LEMON: Susan Candiotti -- thank you, Susan.
PHILLIPS: The bomb was a fake and police in Hollywood, Florida, aren't so sure about the kidnapping either. The bank robbery was real, though. Here's what we know. A bank employee says armed kidnappers came to his home, strapped a bomb to his chest, then used him as a hostage and a weapon to rob the branch where he works.
The culprits made off with a large amount of cash and left the employee behind. But the cops say the whole story needs a much closer look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CAPTAIN TONY RODE, HOLLYWOOD, FLORIDA, POLICE DEPARTMENT: Not only the bank employee, but his girlfriend are cooperating fully with our investigators. They were here last night until 2:30, 3:00 in the morning providing statements.
Unfortunately, there are some inconsistencies in those statements. And, as such, you have to afford our investigators an opportunity to corroborate one way or the other these inconsistencies before we can truly classify the bank employee and his girlfriend as true victims, possibly participants in this bank robbery.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: The bank worker says that the alleged kidnappers included two men and one woman.
Let's get straight to the NEWSROOM, Fredricka Whitfield working details on a developing story for us.
Hey, Fred.
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey.
Well, Kyra, more problems for the suspended Atlanta Falcons quarterback Michael Vick, this time in the form of a drug testing of positive marijuana use. Apparently, his probation officer said after he was tested on September 13, a positive test of marijuana use, he -- that probation officer then went to the judge, where they now agreed to impose some stricter release conditions on Vick, which means that he will be confined to his home, his Virginia home, for a period of time between 10:00 p.m. and 6:00 a.m. on a regular basis.
Meantime, all this comes a day after learning that Virginia State will impose some additional charges which could mean facing up to 10 years in prison and a $2,500 fine. And his sentencing for the federal guilty plea agreement still is straight ahead, December 10 -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: All right, we will keep following it. Thanks, Fred.
LEMON: It took a month for a Spanish tourist to realize she may have snapped a photo of Madeleine McCann in Morocco. It took just hours for British journalists to find out otherwise.
We get the latest from CNN's Emily Chang in London.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
EMILY CHANG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Several journalists traveled to Morocco today to track down the little girl pictured in that photograph taken by the Spanish tourist. And tonight a British journalist with "The Evening Standard" newspaper here in London believes he has found that little girl, and, indeed, it is not Madeleine.
It is instead this little girl, a 5-year-old little girl, the daughter of an olive farmer who lives in that remote town in northern Morocco called Zinat. So, of course, this is very disappointing news for the McCanns. All day long, a family spokesperson has urged caution when dealing with this photograph, saying that there have been so many sightings of Madeleine since she disappeared, over 400 sightings, and all of them have come to nothing, despite the fact that many of them have seemed very legitimate.
As far as her parents, Kate and Gerry McCann, he said they have tried not to get too excited about it. They were encouraged about this photo initially, but it's been such an emotional roller coaster for them. It's been so painful. So, of course, he says they remain very focused on finding Madeleine. And, again, just the resurfacing of this photograph, refocused worldwide media attention back on this case. Everybody seems to want to know what happened to her. And we still don't know.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: That was CNN's Emily Chang reporting from London. PHILLIPS: Let's get right to congressional correspondent Dana Bash. She is in Edina, Minnesota. She just walked out of the courtroom, where Senator Larry Craig's attorneys just asked the judge to throw out his guilty plea.
Dana, I understand that attorneys may be stepping up to the mikes. And we will break away to that if it happens. But bring us up to date.
DANA BASH, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kyra, this lasted for about 45 minutes or so. And what the senator's attorneys pleaded with the -- with the judge, as we expected, was to overturn or withdraw the guilty plea that the senator put into this court and signed, agreeing and saying that he conducted disorderly conduct, I should say, in a Minnesota men's room here last month.
Now, what the argument that the attorneys made, it was really twofold, Kyra. One is -- was just sort of on a technical point, that there wasn't an actual signature from a judge, so it was not clear that the court actually observed and really checked off on this guilty plea. But the other was a more substantive argument that the attorney made, essentially saying that this conduct that Larry Craig was engaged in, that we all know about, the toe tapping, peering through the stall window, that that he says really isn't disorderly conduct, and that is why he said he wants the judge to overturn or withdraw this guilty plea.
He made it clear to the judge that he knows this is an uphill climb. It's very rare that any judge overturns a guilty plea. But he said OK. And here we are for -- let's listen to the attorneys.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... prosecutors, Chris Rins (ph), the lead prosecutor, and Ryan Wood (ph), the assistant prosecutor, also John Kudrowski (ph), who oversees non-felony prosecutions for the Airports Commission.
The state's position, as laid out in the court documents filed on Monday and in oral arguments today is compelling. The defendant unequivocally pled guilty to the crime of disorderly conduct. The plea was made voluntarily, accurately, and intelligently.
In pleading guilty to the charge, the defendant knowingly accepted responsibility and culpability for his actions in a restroom at Minneapolis/St. Paul International Airport. The defendant admitted to the crime of disorderly conduct. The defendant's overall conduct, repeatedly peering into another bathroom stall that was occupied, touching the person's foot in that stall, and repeatedly moving his hand into that person's stall area is offensive conduct that tends to arouse alarm, anger, or resentment.
The defense's arguments do not meet the standard for a manifest injustice that is necessary under Minnesota law for withdrawal of a plea. The defendant received due process under the law and had more than eight weeks between the time of his arrest and his August 8 arraignment in which to consider his legal options. He was advised to discuss any concerns with an attorney if he so chose. After careful consideration, the defendant calculatingly entered a plea of guilty to the crime of disorderly conduct. That plea was valid, and the process used was customary.
The state's responsive arguments are made today to ensure that the defendant's knowing and willful plea of guilty in this matter is upheld.
We anticipate a positive ruling from the court and look forward to the judge's decision. Thank you.
H-O-G-A-N.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Patrick.
BASH: And we just heard just -- we're listening to the prosecution team, the team that just spoke before the judge here. They were defending the fact that they believe that the guilty plea that Senator Craig signed, admitting to disorderly conduct, that that should stay intact. It should not be overturned.
Now, Kyra, one headline here just in terms of the timing of this, which is very important politically here, the judge at the very end of this 45-minute hearing or so, he said he does not expect to make any kind of decision on whether or not the senator's guilty plea will be overturned until at the end of next week, the earliest.
Now, why is that important? Because Senator Craig, of course, said that he's going to resign, intended to resign September 30. That is this coming Sunday. Now, we expect a statement, Kyra, from the senator at some point later today giving the public, giving us word on whether or not he will resign.
A source close to Senator Craig said that, if the judge, as he just said, said that he is going to keep this going and he would not give any kind of resolution to this after September 30, that Senator Craig would likely stay in the Senate, at least until then.
Now, we expect a statement on that later today. But one more point about sort of the atmospherics in the courtroom that might give us a hint, may give us a hint as to where the judge is going with this.
Billy Martin -- he's a well-known Washington attorney -- he was here in Minnesota defending Senator Craig. When he gave his argument as well as the local attorney here also defending Senator Craig, they spoke to the judge, explained to them, again, the two points. Most importantly, sort of the legal basis for this, they said, should not be taken into consideration, because he said over and over, they sort of had a discussion, the defense attorney and the judge, about whether or not disorderly conduct, which of course is what Senator Craig pleaded guilty to, whether or not the conduct that Senator Craig engaged in in the men's room whether or not that really was disorderly conduct. The judge asked and engaged the -- Senator Craig's attorney in about half a dozen questions, repeatedly challenging the legal arguments that Billy Martin, Senator Craig's attorney, was making. He did not do that with the prosecution.
But the prosecution he asked one question, more of a clarification of what he was saying. That might give a little bit of an indication as to where the judge is going here. But we won't know at least until the end of next week.
PHILLIPS: All right, Dana Bash, appreciate it.
LEMON: By all accounts it was a lovely dinner that the Reverend Al Sharpton and Bill O'Reilly shared, but for dessert, a heaping helping of controversy about the FOX News host's on-air restaurant review. Some people are calling his comments about Sylvia's, a black- owned soul food place in Harlem, racist and dangerous.
Well, O'Reilly says his comments have been distorted, and he's bashing CNN for even covering this story.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "THE O'REILLY FACTOR")
BILL O'REILLY, HOST, "THE O'REILLY FACTOR": It was an attempt to tell the radio audience that there is no difference
JUAN WILLIAMS, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Correct.
O'REILLY: Black, white, we're all Americans. The stereotypes they see on television are not true.
None of that...
WILLIAMS: I'm glad you said that.
You should repeat that so they hear it again. You said stereotypes are not true. I said you should go up there more often. It shouldn't be a foreign trip. But it had nothing to do with races ranting by anybody...
O'REILLY: Right.
WILLIAMS: ... except these idiots at CNN.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Ouch.
Well, the Reverend Al Sharpton, he is scheduled to appear tonight on his dining partner's show, but first he's here with us from Baton Rouge, Louisiana, to talk about this whole thing.
I'm just going to throw you a general -- what do you make of the whole thing, Reverend Al? First of all, thanks for joining us. I know you're in the middle of your radio show. Now, what do you make of this whole thing? AL SHARPTON, CIVIL RIGHTS ACTIVIST: Well, thank you for inviting me, Don.
I think that, first of all, I have lunch and dinner periodically with a lot of reporters, particularly those I don't agree with. The thing that was surprising to me is I have had dinner with Bill O'Reilly before in Harlem one other time, and I don't know where this was any different than that.
He says it was distorted. Clearly, the stuff that I heard yesterday while I was in Washington reported on the (INAUDIBLE) was very offensive. And I'm going to ask him tonight what he meant. I'm on his show to talk about Jena Six. We had already scheduled, and I'm going to talk mostly about Jena Six.
But I will ask him what he meant by this. And I am also curious as to if he said such statements that were that offensive as they appeared before the other parts were brought up, why Juan Williams, who was black, would not have jumped on him...
LEMON: Yes.
SHARPTON: ... as he has on civil rights leaders.
So, I don't know. I do know that I don't agree that part of what he said, that blacks are thinking now and not listening to the Sharptons and the Jacksons, I think a lot of people that are thinking listen to us. Some agree sometimes. Some disagree.
I don't think any of us are a monolith. But he said nothing at that dinner that time or the time before that was offensive to me. He did tell me the story of his grandmother that were afraid of blacks. But at the same time, I think we cannot just leave out there picture that all blacks use terms like M.F. and all blacks don't know how to run an establishment.
Sylvia's restaurant has been there over half-a-century.
LEMON: Yes.
SHARPTON: And it's one of the most successful establishments for any race in New York. I hope at the end of the day, Sylvia gets a lot of new customers from this. I will put that on the table.
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: OK, Reverend Al.
So, and that's the question. Folks are wondering, why Bill O'Reilly, who has lived in New York for a while and works and hobnobs with people of all different cultures, very well-to-do people, very well-educated people. You would think some of those people would be African-Americans. Why he -- it would appear that he would be surprised that there are African-Americans who are not calling each other M.F.-er in a restaurant.
That's the whole question.
SHARPTON: I think that is the question. And I think that's something that I would raise with him. And I think that, again, he did not act or say anything like that that night.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Reverend, he said it was meant to be a compliment.
SHARPTON: Well, I mean, again, I don't know the whole context of it. What I have read was certainly not complimentary.
And I think that, if I said that anywhere halfway like that about other races, people would not take it as complimentary, and they would jump all over me, probably some of his colleagues at FOX.
But, at the same time, I have been quoted out of context. That's why I want to ask him, what was the context?
LEMON: Right, right.
SHARPTON: Because I have been misquoted at FOX out of context.
So, I'm going to hear what is the context. And, again, I want Juan Williams to explain if it was in or out of context. I can't see why he would sit -- he's certainly not letting me get away with anything. Why he would have let Bill O'Reilly go on and on and say this.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: And, Reverend Al, I got an e-mail from someone who I respect a lot who happens to be white. And he said that it's an old way of thinking, and that there is a new way of dealing and dialoguing about race, especially when it comes to America, and people should start thinking currently, instead of the old way. And he's saying that Bill O'Reilly's way is just -- it's old-fashioned, that it's passe.
Do you agree with that?
SHARPTON: Well, I think that, if he was talking in the context of his grandmother, I think he would have agree with that.
I think there is a new way. There is a new dialogue. And I think that, when you look at even the Harlems of the world, there's new communities. And they are not -- the fact of the matter, there was a lot of whites in Sylvia's that night. And that brings up the whole question of gentrification and a whole 'nother show.
But I think that we are not talking about the Harlem or the Sylvia's or anywhere else of 1960, which is why this whole conversation looks like it's in a time zone to me. I almost wonder, are we talking about the same dinner I had, because that was nothing like the conversation that we had. LEMON: Reverend Al, you know, really, on this one, you have the power to just end it all by your appearance tonight and what you say after meeting with him.
SHARPTON: Well, I don't know that I can end it all. I think that I can ask for clarification.
I'm going to talk more about Jena Six. I happen to think the future of the criminal justice system is a little more important than me and Bill O'Reilly having dinner in Harlem.
LEMON: Yes.
SHARPTON: If we could end things like that, then I would invite him to dinner every night.
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: Reverend Al, thank you.
SHARPTON: Thank you, Don.
(CROSSTALK)
PHILLIPS: Chelsea Clinton's photograph hangs in a popular restaurant in New York's Greenwich Village , and her father, the former president, isn't very happy about it. We are going to find out what the fuss is all about, straight ahead in the CNN NEWSROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: Three twenty-one Eastern time. Here are three of the stories we're working on in the CNN NEWSROOM.
We're awaiting an announcement from Idaho Senator Larry Craig. A source tells CNN that Craig plans to stay in office at least until a Minnesota judge rules on his case. Right now, the judge is considering Craig's petition to overturn his guilty plea in an airport sex sting.
A London newspaper says it's not her. The paper reports the child seen in this picture is not Madeleine McCann, the British girl who vanished in May while vacationing with her parents in Portugal. Investigators still -- they are taking a closer look at the photo.
The huge pro-democracy protest led by Buddhist monks in Myanmar may have turned deadly. Unconfirmed reports say as many as five protesters have been killed in clashes with security forces.
LEMON: Has this ever happened to you? Stuck on the tarmac or in the terminal with nothing to do, nowhere to go, for hours? Well, flight delays are a growing problem across America. The FAA says they're up 20 percent this year. And right now the problem has the attention of a congressional panel. Hearings are being held this afternoon.
LEMON: Travelers are saying, enough is enough, and the head of the Transportation Department apparently agrees.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON (voice-over): The Transportation Department inspector general wants time limits set on how long passengers should be confined to planes on the tarmac. His recommendations follow two weather-related incidents last winter, and four other glitches since then.
On Valentine's Day this year stranded passengers were forced to sit on idle planes in New York for up to 10-and-a-half-hours. The latest figures show such delays becoming more common. In the first seven months of last year, passengers were stranded on grounded airplanes for more than five hours on 27 different occasions. In the first seven months of this year, that was up to 44.
And shorter one- to two-hour delays are getting even more frequent, for more than 33,000 in the first seven months of last year to more than 47,000 in 2007. Five major U.S. airlines, including American and JetBlue, the two carriers involved in last winter's worst tarmac delays, now have time limits on delays before letting passengers off.
The inspector general says those range from one-and-a-half to five hours. But the five other airlines still have no tame-delay policy in effect.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: All right, we have been following developments on the Senator Craig story, Larry Craig story. We heard from the prosecutors just a short while ago. It is expected that his defense attorney will lead a press conference in a short while from now to talk about this case, Billy Martin specifically. Of course, he's trying to get that guilty plea of a sex crime or solicitation in the bathroom thrown out. We will continue to follow this developing story. As soon as he comes out, we will bring it to you right here in the CNN NEWSROOM.
PHILLIPS: Earlier in the NEWSROOM, we asked you, when did military authorities begin promoting the name of Myanmar for Burma? The answer: 1989.
The Asian nation of Myanmar still called Burma by some governments, the U.S. included. A long-simmering protest movement has exploded in deadly fashion there. But that's only what we are told by people who are there. Myanmar's military leaders won't let Western journalists freely report.
But we did make a contact with a British reporter working undercover.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Initially I went to the place where the demonstrations have been starting every day at about 1:00 p.m. And the police are already there.
As soon as the columns of monks started arriving, they broke them out. They dragged them away. There was some rough handling. Some tear gas was used and some shots were also fired. Some people who were near me say that they saw two young monks fall to the ground, apparently having been shot, and that they were taken away.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And how did the crowd react to that shooting?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, people were weeping. People were kind of casting their hands in prayer. They believed that they had just seen two people die, and they were absolutely distraught.
Later in the day, there was a great deal more shooting elsewhere in the center of town. Large groups of protesters, you know, in defiance of this violence were moving around town. And long bursts of automatic gunfire were fired in the air, which sent people scurrying for shelter.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And what's the latest you're hearing on casualties?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm hearing from elsewhere that as many as seven people may have been killed. But I can't confirm that personally, because, up until today, it was entirely peaceful.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: Well, the pro-democracy movement is aimed at Myanmar's military rulers. And the country's Buddhist monks are taking on a larger role in what has been a mostly peaceful few days. But some witnesses report seeing monks being beaten and arrested, possibly killed.
Now, take a look at this amazing video. This was shot by I- Reporter Benjamin Valk inside those peaceful protests in Myanmar. This video was taken yesterday before the military reportedly opened fire on the marchers.
Witnesses tell us that the crowds at times swelled to 100,000 or more people. That's the largest pro-democracy movement in Myanmar since the late '80s.
LEMON: All right, we're going go now. We're talking about that Senator Larry Craig case. His attorney is stepping up to the mike, Billy Martin. Let's take a listen in and see what they're talking about.
Of course, he's trying to get the guilty plea overturned. Here's Billy Martin.
BILLY MARTIN, ATTORNEY FOR SENATOR LARRY CRAIG: First of all, I would like to say to all of you, I know you have deadlines. And we apologize for taking a few minutes to come down.
But we wanted to take a minute to speak with our client, Senator Craig, back in Washington. We have now had a moment to do that. And there's a very brief statement that I would make.
Some of you were inside the courtroom when we made our arguments. For those of you who were not inside the courtroom, you have had a chance to look at some of the motions and other papers we were -- we have filed.
We are arguing, and we hope that this judge, Judge Porter, will look at our argument and make a determination that, no matter what Senator Craig attempted to do to make this go away, what he did was not a crime.
We have argued that the individual conduct -- the conduct of looking into a bathroom stall to see if there was anybody in there, of going into another stall, of tapping one's foot -- while they may be consistent with what the officer says is behavior that he recognizes, Senator Larry Craig denies that he went into that restroom for anything other than to go to the restroom.
We are hopeful that the court will agree with our arguments. If the judge agrees and he allows the senator to withdraw that guilty plea, we will be back here in this courthouse to enter a plea of not guilty and convince a jury that in June, when Senator Larry Craig walked into that restroom, he had no purpose other than to go to the bathroom.
I thank you.
Billy, what does the defense say about the claim (INAUDIBLE)?
B. MARTIN: The senator, I know, will make a statement very briefly. And as some of you may have heard upstairs, the senator covers all the political areas. He's hired me to handle nothing but this criminal proceeding. And he will give a statement. And I cannot tell you what's in that statement. I don't know.
QUESTION: Hold on, Michael. (INAUDIBLE) marijuana in that case?
B. MARTIN: No. We're going to talk about Senator Craig right now.
I'm sure that in the future we'll have something to say regarding Mr. Vick. But not now.
QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) stepping down or (INAUDIBLE)?
B. MARTIN: Again, the senator will have a statement himself. I don't have the information on that.
(CROSSTALK)
QUESTION: ...how important you feel about (INAUDIBLE)?
B. MARTIN: Well, clearly, he's a very experienced judge. He knows the law of Minnesota. And he's very engaged. We're -- actually, we were hoping that he would have that type of colloquy, because we know that if he finds that there was not a valid factual basis, he will not be reluctant to reverse it. So we think that -- he listened to the arguments. We're hopeful that he will agree with us. He's a very experienced judge.
(CROSSTALK)
B. MARTIN: You know, after 32 years of law, I can never predict or anticipate what a judge will do.
QUESTION: He seemed pretty skeptical of your arguments that you were making about whether or not what Senator Craig did really was (INAUDIBLE) conduct.
B. MARTIN: Well, if there's ever a time when a lawyer does not wear their views on their sleeves, it's the judge on his robe. I think he had a lot of questions. But the facts of this case are very confusing with regard to whether they constitute a crime. Here it's just depends on whether the judge feels the totality does. And we're hopeful that, as a matter of law, he finds it does not.
QUESTION: What about the timing of this issue, Billy?
(CROSSTALK)
B. MARTIN: Yes, ma'am?
QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) Idaho and a lot of people there were (INAUDIBLE) senator here today.
Why didn't he come and speak on behalf of his people and why he's, (INAUDIBLE)?
B. MARTIN: Well, I would say this to you. Having practiced law for as long as Tom Kelly and I have, it's rare that we bring clients to legal arguments and motions. The senator is in his office in Washington working on matters that affect the people of the great state of Idaho and he's going to make a statement.
QUESTION: Is that where he's going to make the statement?
B. MARTIN: He will make the statement from his Washington office. He's at work.
QUESTION: Billy, what about -- what about the argument that you didn't file this motion on time? Is there a procedural bar to considering all of these issues?
B. MARTIN: Well, the -- Tom, do you want to address the timeliness?
And we can say -- what we would present is that the rules provide that a motion to withdraw a guilty plea can be filed years after the guilty plea.
Tom, do you want to take a minute?
TOM KELLY, ATTORNEY: There is no procedural violation. There's no time limit under the rules of Minnesota. There is no time limit under those rules of criminal procedure in Minnesota for bringing such a motion. So there is no timeliness argument. And we did not waive any procedural rights by filing when we did.
(CROSSTALK)
QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) the senator knew the facts and he decide (INAUDIBLE) the facts and was declined?
Did the senator decide to (INAUDIBLE)?
B. MARTIN: Well, the senator clearly never spoke to a lawyer before that. He thought -- and we would tell him he's dead wrong -- that these facts constitute a crime. Now, we're hopeful -- hopefully, we can undo this. But the senator was mistaken and he tried -- many of you have read that "The Statesman" -- "The Statesman" was doing an argue article on him. And you've heard all that. And the senator was trying to make this go away, just make it go away.
Did he make a mistake? He clearly did. What we will argue -- and the judge will be the deciding factor here -- we're arguing that what he did was not a crime. Now we'll wait for the judge.
Thank you very much.
LEMON: All right, Billy Martin who is Senator Craig's attorney, of course, saying that they want that guilty -- that guilty plea overturned or overruled or withdrawn, I should say. He's saying that the senator did nothing in that Minnesota bathroom. He had no intent other than to go to the restroom. He says if the judge allows this guilty plea to be withdrawn, he says he intends to be back in a court to try to convince a jury to do that.
He also said that Senator Craig will give a statement, presumably sometime today. And if he does, CNN will bring that to you live.
But, again, Billy Martin speaking about the situation of Idaho Senator Larry Craig, who was arrested and charged for what they say was solicitation in a bathroom in the Minneapolis airport.
So if we get our word from the senator, we'll bring it to you live right here in the CNN NEWSROOM -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: A little action there at the Senate Appropriations Committee. Live pictures right now.
But this is what happened just a couple of minutes ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. ROBERT BYRD (D), WEST VIRGINIA: Clear the room. Clear the room. Clear the room. Clear the room. Clear the room. That's enough of this.
UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTERS: We've had enough of the war!
BYRD: I've tolerated all I can stand.
UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTERS: Stop (INAUDIBLE)! BYRD: I stopped it before you were born. And I said stop it before you were ever born.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: (LAUGHTER)
Robert Byrd -- clear the room. Clear the room. He's laying it out there. Not very happy with the pink ladies, well known anti-war protesters showing up there at the Senate Appropriations Committee, where the joint chairman -- or the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, also the sec. dep., also, Ambassador Negroponte were talking about funds for the war.
It's been suspended. The room has been cleared. We'll follow up what happens next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: The Jena 6 prosecutor on defense. In a "New York Times" opinion piece, Louisiana District Attorney Reed Walters defends his decision to prosecute six African-American high schoolers accused of beating up a white classmate. The charges against them sparked a massive civil rights protest in the small Louisiana town last week and the debate is far from over.
Joining us now from Chicago, CNN contributor Roland Martin. And from Los Angeles, the Reverend Jesse Lee Peterson, founder of Brotherhood Organization of A New Destiny.
Gentlemen, great to have you both. I'm going to get right to it.
REV. JESSE LEE PETERSON, BROTHERHOOD ORGANIZATION OF A NEW DESTINY, WWW.BONDINFO.ORG: Thanks for having me.
PHILLIPS: It's great to have you both.
Reed Walters, as you know, he refused to give us interviews on a number of counts. I had to even attempt to do it by confrontation when I was there in Jena, Louisiana. I couldn't get much out of him in regard -- with regard to the case.
But in this op-ed piece he gets pretty detailed. And for the first time, we're hearing from him how he lays out that he's very much upset with the fact that critics are calling this a schoolyard fight.
He says: "Conjure the image of school boys fighting. They exchange words, clench fists, throw punches, wrestle in the dirt until classmates or teachers pull them apart. But that's not what happened at Jena High School. The victim in this crime, who has been all but forgotten amid the focus of the defendants, was a young man named Justin Barker, who was not involved in the nooses incident three months earlier.
According to all the credible evidence I am aware of, after lunch, he walked to class. As he passed to the gymnasium door to the outside, he was blindsided and knocked unconscious by a vicious blow to the head thrown by Mychal Bell. While lying on the ground unaware of what was happening to him, he was brutally kicked by at least six people. Imagine you were walking down a city street and someone leapt from behind a tree and hit you so hard that you fell to the sidewalk unconscious. Would you later describe that as a fight?"
Reverend, what do you think?
PETERSON: I say that this is nothing more than a bunch of black racist -- race hustlers, like Sharpton and Jackson, they NAACP and others, who are once again exploiting a black on white situation in order to gain power and wealth.
Mychal Bell, according to all the reports, has a criminal record long as his arms. He is not some little innocent black boy on his way to college to play football.
But they don't want to deal with that issue. They don't want to correct Mychal Bell, because it's bad for business.
ROLAND MARTIN, SYNDICATED COLUMNIST, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Hey, Kyra.
PETERSON: They have no sympathy for this white guy that they beat up. This guy should be in jail if these things are true. And this not about white folks going after blacks. If anything, it's blacks going after whites.
PHILLIPS: And, Roland, let me just throw one thing out, because I want you to respond.
You know, sources told me there in town that, yes, we know that Mychal Bell had four prior convictions as a juvenile. Sources told me the battery charge was slugging a 17-year-old teenage girl in the jaw.
PETERSON: Yes.
R. MARTIN: Well, first...
PHILLIPS: What do you think, Roland, because that's what critics are saying, you know, this is the wrong martyr to the cause?
R. MARTIN: Well, first of all, I just won about 20 bucks. I said it would take Jesse Lee Peterson at least 30 seconds to mention Reverend Sharpton and Reverend Jackson. He beat it by about 20 seconds.
(CROSSTALK)
R. MARTIN: But first and foremost...
(CROSSTALK)
PHILLIPS: Go ahead.
Reverend -- let him respond, Reverend. Let him respond, Reverend. Reverend, let him respond. R. MARTIN: One second.
Here's the deal. You've got have six individuals people are speaking of. The issue is not whether you should -- whether you should not prosecute Mychal Bell. The question for many people is whether or not you should prosecute them, as the D.A. initially did, for attempted murder. That was the initial issue.
Now, if you look at the whole point in terms of people that say, wait a minute, Mychal Bell had a public defender who never called a single witness. There are all kind of other scenarios here. That's what this points to.
Now, Kyra, here's the other piece. I read the piece in the "New York Times" by Reed Walters. He never addressed the question that you asked, did you go to this high school, Reed Walters, and literally threaten the students with taking their lives away with law enforcement by your side?
And so although he made that argument, he also did not speak to the larger issue of the climate in that town, that some say he contributed to.
PHILLIPS: Well, I did ask him straightforward if he felt there was racial tension in his town and he told me absolutely not. Reverend, do you agree with that? Do you agree that there is no racial tension in this town?
PETERSON: I agree with the D.A. I'm familiar with the town. I know people in the town. There are good citizens living there and they are not waking up every morning and thinking of going after black folks.
The issue here is that Mychal Bell and the five other boys involved in beating up this white boy have committed a crime. And they should be punished for that. And America should not allow these black race hustlers to continue to exploit black on white situations...
R. MARTIN: But Jesse...
PETERSON: ...for themselves.
R. MARTIN: But, Jesse, the real...
PETERSON: I think that it is a shame...
R. MARTIN: But the issue...
PETERSON: Hold on one minute, Roland. Hold on, Roland.
I think that it is a shame that adults who call themselves politicians and preachers, black people, will not or refuse to correct a violent act...
R. MARTIN: And, again (INAUDIBLE)...
PETERSON: ...based on Mychal Bell. Instead, they exploit the situation.
R. MARTIN: And, again...
PETERSON: And I think that it is bad for young blacks who don't have parents to say that Jackson and others are wrong. This is sending the wrong message.
R. MARTIN: First of all...
PHILLIPS: Roland, let's talk...
R. MARTIN: First of all, Kyra...
PHILLIPS: Roland, let's talk about that.
R. MARTIN: I'll say this. There were 20,000 other people who are protesting. So I would not sit here and say it's just Reverend Jackson and Reverend Sharpton.
PETERSON: And that was a shame.
R. MARTIN: And so -- but, first of all, you say it's a shame. But the bottom line is what people are saying is, it is a question of whether or not you have equal justice. When you do have people who, you know, are hanging nooses and then it's blown off as -- as a prank, as opposed to saying no, that is very serious. Now, I'm not dismissing...
PETERSON: Well, Roland, don't you think that white people...
R. MARTIN: Wait. No, no, no, no.
PETERSON: ...deserve equal justice, as well?
R. MARTIN: One second. One second. One second. One second. No -- and, Jesse, I have been very clear on that, that, again, I do believe in equal justice, not just for whites but also for blacks.
PETERSON: When Justin Baker deserves...
R. MARTIN: And what I'm saying...
PETERSON: Justin Barker deserves...
R. MARTIN: And, Jesse -- Jesse...
PETERSON: ...equal justice...
R. MARTIN: Jesse -- Jesse.
PETERSON: You have six black boys...
R. MARTIN: Jesse, first of all...
PHILLIPS: All right.
(CROSSTALK)
PHILLIPS: Hold on. Hold on.
Reverend, hold on a second. Roland, please finish your thought.
R. MARTIN: Jesse...
PHILLIPS: Let Roland (INAUDIBLE)...
R. MARTIN: Jesse, very clear. Only one person has gone to trial. You have decided to convict all six. Only one person was initially convicted in adult courts -- in adult court. That's the real deal.
PETERSON: Mychal Bell.
R. MARTIN: So, again, it has not been established the other five were involved in this fight. That's a fact, Jesse.
PETERSON: It has been established. And the other point that I want to make, you make a good point, that all these black young peopled showed up for a rally that was not necessary. I think the saddest commentary about that...
R. MARTIN: Well, I disagree...
PETERSON: ...is that 50 years of brainwashing black Americans about white Americans, you now have a young generation of black folks who are growing up hating the white man...
R. MARTIN: Well, Jesse...
PETERSON: ...when they have gone to school together, they are living together...
R. MARTIN: You're the parents of those kids.
PETERSON: They are dating one another. And now Jackson and others have...
R. MARTIN: Hey, Jesse...
PETERSON: ...have taught them, along with Sharpton...
R. MARTIN: Hey, Jesse...
(CROSSTALK)
PHILLIPS: All right.
All right, let me -- let me take this in a different direction.
PETERSON: ...white man.
PHILLIPS: Let me take this in a different direction.
And, Reverend, I want to point this out. And then, Roland, I'm going to let you say your piece about this.
R. MARTIN: Sure.
PHILLIPS: Reverend, I was there. I had a chance to talk with the parents that hung those nooses -- or at least a relative, either a parent or a relative. I got to talk with the white community, the black community.
There is definitely an attitude there -- there is a white supremacist presence there. There is a KKK presence there. That has been confirmed to me. I saw it. I experienced it. So, let's take this...
PETERSON: Well, you could...
PHILLIPS: ...but let's take this to a much bigger and broader discussion here.
Roland, let's step away from the Jena 6 and the criminal justice system...
R. MARTIN: Sure.
PHILLIPS: ...and talk about the education. Let's talk about the reality of the people that live there. Let's talk about the reality of the hate groups that are in that area and the reality of a mindset that does exist. We've all seen it, experienced it and talked to individuals on both sides. It's not such an easy issue, as we've been saying, not just a black and white issue.
R. MARTIN: Well, of course, not.
I mean, Kyra, you pointed out, as well as other folks that participated, that when you this are interviewing whites there, they were saying look, we get along with the coloreds here in this town. And so that is an issue that is there. We cannot deny it. We're not -- I mean, so let's not just run away from it.
Now, the question is whether or not in this case was there equal justice?
You have people on both sides. But you also have whites there who said you know what?
We don't necessarily think they should have been charged with attempted murder, but they should have been charged. I have made that point. I have never said they should get off if they're convicted.
But the question is whether you charge juveniles as adults with attempted murder. That was, again, the real primary issue when this story began to blow up and it became national.
PHILLIPS: And...
PETERSON: I also agree that there are hate groups all around the country. There's skinheads, KKK, the NAACP. The NAACP is a hate group, as well.
But the problem is, is not...
R. MARTIN: (LAUGHTER).
PETERSON: The problem is not the justice system. The problem is that the average black family is out of order. Black men are not marrying black women and helping -- raising their children and making sure that they're educated. It's about the family and...
PHILLIPS: But, Reverend Peterson...
PETERSON: ...and as long as that family...
PHILLIPS: Don't you think it's not -- it's not just the black family...
R. MARTIN: You know what, Kyra...
PHILLIPS: ...but also the white family, too, don't you agree?
PETERSON: You're right.
PHILLIPS: Because I saw ignorance on both sides.
PETERSON: You are absolutely right, it is happening to the white family, as well. But for the last 50 years, you know, the black family has been destroyed. And they are -- the government is the daddy of the family and the corrupt black leaders are the head of the folks.
R. MARTIN: You know what, Kyra...
PETERSON: And either the black...
R. MARTIN: You know what, Kyra...
PETERSON: (INAUDIBLE) black Americans are down the wrong path and that's not going to change until black folks get married and turn away from these racist black leaders and judge people...
R. MARTIN: Well, you know what, Kyra...
PHILLIPS: Roland...
PETERSON: ...based on character and not color.
R. MARTIN: Sure.
PHILLIPS: And Roland, you have written about that. You've written about the importance of black mentors to black boys...
R. MARTIN: Of course.
PHILLIPS: That is your specialty.
R. MARTIN: I'm... PETERSON: But Roland is a hypocrite.
R. MARTIN: I -- first of all -- first of all, Jesse, you can say whatever, whatever. That's fine.
PETERSON: It's true.
R. MARTIN: Just go on with your nice little (INAUDIBLE).
PETERSON: You're a hypocrite.
PHILLIPS: All right, Roland, a final thought. A final thought.
R. MARTIN: Here's the -- Kyra, here's the point blank of this here. We certainly understand the black family structure. But you have a case right here in Chicago with 200 black men, many of them who grew up in two parent homes, who had jobs, who had college degrees, were viciously beaten by Chicago cops. And they went to jail, many of them, with beaten confessions. And they were freed. The city, right now, could be on the hook for $200 million worth of settlements. Now...
PETERSON: Look, but Roland, you also...
R. MARTIN: Jesse, say it's not a -- (CROSSTALK)
R. MARTIN: No, no, no, no, no. No.
PETERSON: ...a lobby...
R. MARTIN: One second, Jesse.
PETERSON: You also have in Long Beach...
R. MARTIN: Jesse, one second.
PETERSON: ...in Long Beach, California...
(CROSSTALK)
R. MARTIN: Jesse...
PHILLIPS: I'm going to have to cut this off, guys.
R. MARTIN: Jesse -- Jesse, you can talk about it's not about justice, but when you have an African-American (INAUDIBLE)...
PETERSON: It's about the family, Roland.
R. MARTIN: ...who came from two parents, they also face injustice.
PETERSON: Roland, if they were not committing the crimes...
R. MARTIN: You want to deny it.
PETERSON: If they (INAUDIBLE) justice... PHILLIPS: All right, bottom line...
PETERSON: ...would not have committed a crime, they would be fine.
PHILLIPS: Bottom line, what has happened in Jena...
R. MARTIN: Oh, so I guess we're not racially profiled...
PHILLIPS: ...what has happened in Jena, Louisiana has obviously triggered -- it's reached a boiling point. Everyone is talking about this. It's going to go much broader. We'll be looking at the criminal justice system across the United States, no doubt.
R. MARTIN: Absolutely.
PHILLIPS: Gentleman, we'll be talking again.
Roland Martin...
PETERSON: Thank you.
PHILLIPS: Reverend Jesse Lee Peterson. Appreciate it, gentlemen.
We're going to take a quick break. More news from the NEWSROOM, straight ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Very disturbing story. Fredricka Whitfield working it for us. What do you have?
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Right.
On the college campus of St. John's university in the Jamaica section of Queens, we understand that the campus is on lockdown because, according to our affiliate, WABC's reporting, a man with a rifle or a gun, a firearm of some sort, was apprehended on campus and now the entire campus is on lockdown. We do understand that the NYPD has taken custody of this person that the campus authorities have said that they have handed over.
It's unclear what kind of weapon this person may have had, whether it was real or fake, in fact, and what this person's intention was. And, of course, they continue to look through the campus to see if there is anyone else who may be a participant with this alleged gunman in whatever activity they may have had planned -- Don.
LEMON: All right, Fredricka Whitfield. Thank you very much for that.
We're not far away from the closing bell. How's the market doing today? We'll tell you.
We're back in a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: "Planet In Peril," an incredible project here at CNN. Our cameras span the globe as part of an upcoming documentary, hosted by our Anderson Cooper.
Here's an excerpt with "Animal Planet's" Jeff Corwin.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Searching for polar bears in Northeastern Alaska isn't like looking for a needle in a haystack -- it's like looking for a haystack-colored needle in a haystack.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have this incredible terrain of ice that seems to almost go on forever. And somewhere hidden on this ice, on this white reflected snow and ice, is a white creature that we need to catch up with.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Steve Amstrup, a wildlife biologist with the U.S. Geological Survey, has been doing this for 26 years, trying to learn all he can about what polar bears can tell us about global warming.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is a nice lead here that we might be able pick up footprints on.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: His eyes are keenly trained to find what seems impossible.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, see the tracks going across there?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, my goodness. Look at that. Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There's one set of tracks and two smaller sets.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We've got a family group.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: However, finding the tracks is only the beginning.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Boy, they did a 180-degree turn here.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's down at 12:00 doc, right off the nose.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our helicopter hugs the ground as we trace the footprints through the snowy expanse over the rubbled ice until finally we spot them.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, I see the tracks. They're going along there, up along -- and there's a bear right there.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh my god.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is what it's all about, right here. We have this sow and she's got some cubs alongside and now we're going to move in. And you're about to see something absolutely incredible.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Boy. Good deal.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We've got them straight across.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. It looks good.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're right on them.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Amstrup loads the tranquilizer dot into the gun as we circle low over the mother bear to make sure we don't scare her away from her cubs. Then we lift up and she takes off, racing across the ice. Our helicopter lowers down within feet of her and Amstrup, hanging from the side of his window, aims and takes his shot.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: "Planet In Peril" with Anderson Cooper and Dr. Sanjay Gupta and Jeff Corwin -- a landmark documentary, premiering October 23rd and 24th on CNN.
The closing bell, straight ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: The closing bell is about to ring on Wall Street.
LEMON: That means it's time for Susan Lisovicz, standing by with a final look at the trading day -- hi, Susan.
SUSAN LISOVICZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: What an action packed afternoon for you guys.
(STOCK MARKET REPORT)
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