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Britney Loses Custody of Children to Kevin

Aired October 1, 2007 - 20:00:00   ET


NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Superstar Britney Spears`s alleged string of wild behavior, erratic string of wild behavior -- today the court rules that Spears loses custody. Secret court documents apparently explain the bombshell ruling. Tonight, this is what we know. The court just ordered frequent drug and alcohol testing, plus parenting classes. And now, not two weeks later, Spears loses custody.
Fresh out of a luxury Malibu rehab, late-night parties, scuffles with the paparazzi, demanding her toddler`s teeth be bleached, letting them guzzle soda -- are Britney Spears`s children really in danger, or is it all hype, with Spears`s ex receiving marital support of $20,000 a month set to be cut off November. At the heart of this legal showdown, two little boys.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Her career and her reputation could be nothing compared to losing her own children, her two sons. A court has ordered the former pop singer to give up custody of her two sons by noon Wednesday, giving her ex-husband, Kevin Federline, custody until further notice. Last month, a judge said Spears used drugs and alcohol and ordered her to get random drug testing and take parenting classes. Britney and K-Fed were divorced in July, you may recall. Their sons are 1 and 2 years old.


GRACE: And tonight, one of the single most shocking cases of child abuse uncovered, a 3-year-old little girl the victim of a brutal sex assault. It`s all on videotape. Within the last 72 hours, police finally locate the child victim with her family, Las Vegas. Tonight, an APB by Nevada police and the feds for suspect 37-year-old Chester Stiles. Listen to this, Stiles also wanted for another sex crime on yet another little girl, that little girl age 6.

The manhunt heats up as authorities reveal Stiles is a survivalist and is always armed, And the man who claims he stumbled upon this explicit videotape of this little girl out in the middle of the desert fails a polygraph. He speaks out for the first time, then he goes on the run.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is it Chester Stiles on that tape?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It is Chester Stiles on that tape. It is him.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How is this weighing on you, knowing that you`re the one who brought him to this apartment?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m disgusted. I`m ashamed. I`m embarrassed. I`m mortified.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Here`s a picture of him from (INAUDIBLE)



UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, my God! That`s (EXPLETIVE DELETED). That looks like my bed.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This looks like your bed here?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That looks like my sheets or my friend`s sheets. That looks like sheets (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who is she connected to? How would he know her?


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Through you? How? How do you know her?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She`s my friend`s daughter. If that`s the same little girl, that`s my friend`s daughter.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You seem pretty shaken up about all this right now. I mean, what`s running through your head? Police say he did things to this girl that are unimaginable.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t even want to imagine what he did to her! I don`t!


GRACE: All this apparently happening because this guy was living or staying in the home with these unprotected children.

Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. First, tonight, breaking news. Superstar Britney Spears loses custody of her two toddler sons.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Shocking news today, Judge Gordon (ph) ruling Kevin Federline will retain physical custody. During an emergency hearing, Britney Spears has lost custody of her two kids. A judge has decided Kevin Federline will get custody of their sons, Sean Preston, who is 2, and Jayden James, who is 1.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Britney has until October 3, which is two days from now, to turn over custody of the children to her ex-husband, Kevin Federline. It`s unclear, really, why custody was turned over. We do know that earlier this month, the judge ordered Spears -- finding that she was engaged in frequent and continued use of controlled substances and alcohol, he ordered her to undergo random drug and alcohol testing twice a week. And she was also ordered to meet every week with a parenting coach, and that parenting coach was supposed to observe and report back to the court. And both Kevin Federline and Britney Spears were supposed to take a "parenting without conflict" class.


GRACE: That`s right, a bombshell out of a court, a court not explaining this really, except possibly in secret documents. The bombshell, as many people predicted, Britney Spears losing custody of her two toddlers. But who`s to say Federline, the father, will be a better parent?

Straight out to Mike Walker, senior editor with "The National Enquirer." Mike, we`ve talked about this on several occasions. What do you think is in those sealed documents that should explain this ruling?

MIKE WALKER, "NATIONAL ENQUIRER": If you look at the picture of Britney coming out of her last drug test, you see this shattered look. She`s not just crying, she`s -- she`s completely -- it looks like she`s just going over the edge. The suspicion is that she failed a drug test, and that`s why this suddenly has come up because all of the other things, the hit and run, driving without a license, and all of that, the judge knew about, knew about substance abuse. We`ve seen the former bodyguard, Tony Barretto, come forward, you know, so...

GRACE: Hold on, Mike. I`ve got a problem with your microphone. I`ll be right back with Mike Walker with "The National Enquirer."

To Dayna Devon, host of "Extra." Dayna, we`re looking at video that Mike was just describing. That`s video from What do you believe is in this bombshell ruling? Two weeks ago, he orders her to have drug tests, drug and alcohol tests, and parenting classes. And the next thing we hear from the judge, she loses custody.

DAYNA DEVON, "EXTRA": Exactly. Well, it is a bombshell ruling. What we do probably suspect from all of this -- and it has been kept very secret. One thing this court has done very well is try to protect the kids. If you look at some of the pages, there are just huge black markers wherever anything about the kids is mentioned. So they are trying to keep as much under wraps as possible.

What I think that we are learning is, in fact, some way, somehow Britney didn`t fulfill the rulings of the court. So it`s not clear whether she didn`t, you know, of course, you know, fail -- if she failed the drug test or if she didn`t make some of the parenting classes. We`re not sure. We`re trying to find out. But it looks in some way, shape or form she didn`t fulfill the orders of the court.



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Britney has until October 3, which is two days from now, to turn over custody of the children to her ex-husband, Kevin Federline. We know that Kevin Federline`s attorney went to court on Friday because he was very concerned about their children`s safety with Britney Spears`s record. It`s not clear if this is permanent. It simply says until further notice.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A Los Angeles judge, we`re told, has ordered Britney Spears to turn over her two children to former husband Kevin Federline this week until further court order. Here`s what this means. She has lost physical custody of her two kids, at least temporarily. That handover is to occur Wednesday at noon local time. For weeks, you know, Spears and Federline have been fighting over custody of their children, Sean Preston 2, and Jayden James, who is only a year old.


GRACE: A bombshell in the case of Britney Spears and her ex, Kevin Federline, Britney Spears today losing custody of her two toddler children. I`ve got the order right here in my hand out of the superior court of California, county. LA. She hands over physical custody Wednesday, October 3, at 12:00 noon. It says until further order of the court.

I want to go back out to Dayna Devon with "Extra." Dayna, we`re trying to determine what is in those secret documents, the sealed documents in which the judge clearly must lay out some findings of fact as to this ruling. We know two weeks ago, he ordered her drug testing, alcohol testing and parenting classes. Next thing you know, she loses custody. So it`s got to be -- just deductive reasoning -- she either didn`t fulfill the order, as you were suggesting, or she flunked. Any indication as to which one it is?

DEVON: I don`t think there is any indication, and truly, I think, at this moment, no one truly knows. What we do know is the judge found what he said, sufficient evidence of frequent and habitual drug use. So I think you`re looking at a drug problem. He was worried about the safety of the children and probably did what he thought was in the best interests of the children at this time.

GRACE: OK, I`m going to try that microphone one more time with Mike Walker with "The Enquirer." Mike, any idea what is in those sealed documents that has caused Britney Spears, with all that money, all that fame, all that talent to lose her two children? Mike, are you with me?

WALKER: Yes. Our suspicion is simply that the judge ordered the drug testing, and looking at the picture that we published of her coming out of that drug testing with her face shattered and her in tears, the suspicion is she was told that she failed it. And Nancy, if those two kids are turned over without any fireworks between now and Wednesday, I`m going to be mighty surprised. I don`t think Britney Spears is going to give up those children easily, and I worry about that.

GRACE: Yes. I`ve got two questions. First of all -- don`t go anywhere, Mike and Dayna. First of all, to Dr. Joshua Perper. You all know Dr. Perper. He`s a medical examiner and an expert in his field. Dr. Perper, if they did a drug test on Britney Spears or a urinalysis for drugs or alcohol, could they tell her right then? She goes in, can they tell her right there whether she passes or fails?

DR. JOSHUA PERPER, BROWARD COUNTY, FLORIDA, MEDICAL EXAMINER: Yes, they can. And the point is that she has the money to have the care of the children done by someone else, but she`s a danger to the child by her erratic -- and sometimes people who are on drug have a violent behavior. So she`s definitely a danger in being in the environment in which the children are, and that`s most likely the reason for the judge decision.

GRACE: You know, Dr. Perper, I was hoping that it was, as Dayna Devon first brought up, maybe she just didn`t fulfill the requirement, she didn`t go to testing, she refused to go to testing, didn`t go to her counseling. But Mike Walker has the video of her coming out, looking crestfallen.

So with what Dr. Perper is telling me -- back to Mike Walker -- the reality is, there is a chance that she has flunked the drug or alcohol testing.

WALKER: That`s right, we think. And the problem here is that now the judge has said, You give up those kids on Wednesday. What`s going to happen between now and Wednesday? We`ve all been worried about -- and the judge is obviously worried, and good for him -- about what`s going to happen with those kids. And we heard Tony Barretto, the former bodyguard, saying that the other bodyguard in the house was worried that Britney might actually hurt the children. We`ve all been thinking this. So...

GRACE: But here`s the thing that doesn`t make any sense. Let`s unleash the lawyers, everybody, Susan Moss out of New York, Kathleen Mullin out of New York, Anne Bremner, high-profile lawyer out of Seattle.

Sue Moss, here`s the deal. If the children were in danger or the judge thought they were in danger, why would he give her until Wednesday?

SUSAN MOSS, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: I believe, actually, the children are being transferred earlier than that, And what the order says is that Kevin Federline will retain the children on Wednesday at noon. That was probably the time that the children were supposed to be transferred back to Britney.

But real simple, if you use alcohol and unprescribed meds, you lose your custody to K-Fed. The only real question is, is she even going to notice that the kids are gone? She has had such a history of alcohol abuse and of drug abuse she`s not going to see these kids for quite some time.

GRACE: You know what? You may be right, Sue Moss. Granted, you may be right. But Anne Bremner, what do we know about Kevin Federline, other than he`s getting $20,000 a month from Britney Spears? Do you think he`s going to get custody of more of her money, too?

ANNE BREMNER, TRIAL ATTORNEY: Well, absolutely. And you know...

GRACE: Why wasn`t he ordered to have drug testing?

BREMNER: Well, yes, exactly. I mean, they both (INAUDIBLE) and reprehensible at certain parts of these proceedings. And you`re right, Nancy. If they were so worried about the safety of the kids, then why are they waiting until Wednesday, the judge and K-Fed, in terms of his application? But gee, I mean, the money and the partying that he`s been involved in -- you know, Fed-Ex, remember all of that back how long ago? I just -- I think the whole thing -- if they`re looking at the best interests of the kids, I think they both need to step back and do the right thing.

GRACE: OK, Kathleen Mullin, I want you to listen. Mike Walker just brought up this bodyguard, what he had to say about Britney Spears`s parenting. Take a listen to this.


TONY BARRETTO, FORMER SPEARS BODYGUARD: The room was completely a mess. It looked like it had been partied in all night. There was food and clothing and alcohol throughout the room. I entered the room for one concern. That was for Britney`s safety. So I began to look around for any possible weapons or other things of that nature, and that`s when I observed some substance on the table next to the bed.


BARRETTO: It was a white, powdery substance, and it had a straw next to it. And in my professional training, it appeared to be a narcotic.

The behavior that she displayed during these times -- it was clear that she was under the influence -- to me, paralleled other behavior that she displayed at home. And that`s what led me to believe that she was using narcotics at home, though I`d never seen her use narcotics in front of the children.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But did you ever see her use drugs personally?


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many times?

BARRETTO: Twice, two occasions.


GRACE: OK, I`ve got a problem with him. Here`s my problem, Kathleen Mullin. Number one, when he claims -- he says he saw Britney Spears in the room with white substance and a straw and they were partying and she was drunk, why didn`t he go to the authorities right then? Why did he wait until after he was fired to go to authorities? And not just authorities, Kathleen Mullin, he went to "Access Hollywood." There he was on CNN. He went to "The News of the World" over in Great Britain. Hello? How is that helping the children?

So why didn`t he report it immediately? And why is he getting all this press out of it? So that hurts his credibility, in my mind.

MULLIN: Nancy, I agree with you on all of those counts with respect to the bodyguard. And the answer to the question is simply he joins the long line of people who have made their living off of Britney Spears`s back. Look, nobody is going to argue that at this juncture, from what we have seen as the viewing public, that Britney Spears is not in trouble. She is.

But let me add something to the mix for you. Let me be her lawyer. If I were Britney Spears`s lawyer and what you say is true, that the photo shown of her from the drug test shows that she failed and she knew that, then the inevitability is that the judge is going to come down on her and potentially transfer custody. If I represent her, Nancy, I go in there and I say to the judge, Listen Judge, we have a problem. I recognize the problem. My client wants to offer to move custody to her ex-husband until such time as she is able to more responsibly care for the children.

That answers your question about why the judge gave her 48 hours. That answers your question about why all these documents are so heavily redacted and so much secrecy behind them. Her lawyer, if he is doing this, is making a very good move for his client, and it is something, I think, that is consistent with what we know.

GRACE: OK, let me get this straight. You`re saying that, in your expertise, that she asked for custody to be removed?

MULLIN: Well, Nancy, how is it that if she tested positive and she flunked the conditions that were put on her earlier, how does her lawyer get around that? What is he supposed to say to the judge? Listen, my client is positive for drugs, but you should let her keep the kids? No. What he says to the judge is, he accepts the result that he has and he says, Look, Judge, you know as well as I do, my client is in trouble. We have a problem.

GRACE: OK. I got it. I got it. But the bottom -- Kathleen, you may very well be right, but the bottom line is either she didn`t go to the test, or Mike Walker is correct, there`s a chance she failed the drug/alcohol test, and based on the video that he was showing us, that the judge ordered custody away.

Out to the lines. Dee in California. Hi, Dee.


GRACE: How are you, dear?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m just fine. How are you?

GRACE: I`m hanging in there. What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Good. Good. Well, I`m wondering why her parents didn`t step up to protect their grandchildren before it got to be such a dangerous situation for them.

GRACE: Dee, let me fill you in on that one. Out to Dayna Devon, the host of "Extra." Didn`t she have a falling out with her parents?

DEVON: Absolutely, Nancy. She`s had a falling out with virtually everyone in her life, from her family relationships to her career relationships to every single person, virtually, she`s been involved with. So I think this was the last step. I think the court says, you know, That`s fine, if you want to destroy your own life, but when your rights start infringing upon that of your children, we`ve got to step in. And I think hooray to them for that.

So yes, I think, actually, her mother several times has tried to actually take over the kids, and she wasn`t allowed to. The only time her mother and father are actually allowed to see the kids are when the kids are with Kevin Federline. So that`s where that stands with her family.

GRACE: Back to Mike Walker, senior editor with "The National Enquirer." Explain to me what this video is again. Rosie, can we show that video again?

WALKER: Well, are you talking about when she came out of the drug testing?

GRACE: That`s what you`re telling me it is, yes.

WALKER: Well, when she came out of drug testing -- I don`t know what video you`re looking at. But when she came out of drug testing, we have the picture of her looking shattered, I mean, absolutely crushed, not just crying, but just completely gone crazy. You can see it in our publication or in "The Star." Other publications have run the picture. It`s just a picture of her being shattered.

And what`s happened to this woman is -- I mean, this is a train wreck that`s coming down -- Nancy, if you go to Google -- I tell anybody -- go to Google and look at Britney Spears, it looks like a rap sheet -- hit and run, death threats, all kind of drugs, out of control. Somebody had to do something.



BARRETTO: The behavior that she displayed during these times -- it was clear that she was under the influence -- to me, paralleled other behavior that she displayed at home. And that`s what led me to believe that she was using narcotics at home, though I`d never seen her use narcotics in front of the children.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But did you ever see her use drugs personally?


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many times?

BARRETTO: Twice, two occasions.


GRACE: That`s Britney Spears`s former bodyguard, Tony Barretto, speaking out after he is let go from working with Britney Spears -- apparently, not so worried about the children that he made a move to take them away while he was getting that paycheck. That was him on CNN, and he`s also been on "Access Hollywood," "News of the World." I don`t know where all he`s been. I don`t know how those appearances are helping the children.

Out to the lines. Nicole in Kentucky. Hi, Nicole.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. How are you?

GRACE: I`m hanging in there, dear. What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My question is -- it`s -- you know, it`s two- part. You know, we all seen when Britney and Kevin were married, he was out partying, and he left Shar Jackson when she was pregnant. What has anybody done to prove that he`s a better place for those children than with Britney?

GRACE: Well, you know, I was just talking to Mike Walker and Dayna Devon in the break about that because nobody has ordered that he get drug and alcohol testing, to my knowledge. So Mike, go ahead with your defense of Kevin Federline. I don`t know how he turned into the best parent of the year, but go ahead.

WALKER: You`re exaggerating what I said, but OK. To be fair, when Kevin didn`t know anybody was watching, when he first married Britney, even after he left her, I know from direct knowledge of people in that house that he was going to Shar Jackson`s house, hanging out with the kids he had with Shar on many occasions. When he left Britney, he would call the house, he would talk to people in the house. And nobody knew I was talking to those people in the house. And he would always ask about the boys, even when Britney wouldn`t take his calls. Now, I`m not saying Kevin is a perfect guy, but...

GRACE: OK. That`s true. You didn`t not call him parent of the year. That was a little over the top.

To Dayna Devon. Why wasn`t he ordered to have drug and alcohol testing, just like Britney Spears?

WALKER: You know, that is such a good question. I have no idea whether Kevin Federline`s a good dad or not. But what I do know is he`s been brilliant in playing this PR war. I mean, a few months ago, people were calling him the most hated man in America. Now he`s actually looked at as, like, the savior of these two kids. It`s bizarre to me.

But what he has done is he`s played this PR game very well. He didn`t drink or do drugs or do anything in public while this was all going on, and so that`s why he`s played better and that`s why he`s going to get the kids for now.



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s a huge blow, you know, that she`s been described as a train wreck, career-wise and emotionally, and this certainly is only going to add to fears that she`s just totally out of control. If the judge is finding that a mother is using drugs or controlled substances, we already know, based upon the paparazzi who follows her continuously, she goes to clubs quite a bit. There`s an issue of her driving without a license, driving with her children. It`s not clear if this is permanent; it simply says until further notice.


GRACE: Just in from -- CNN trying to confirm it, Headline News trying to confirm it -- Spears set to order to meet with a drug counselor, drug testing, didn`t do it, enroll in parenting classes, didn`t do it, sign the judge`s order, didn`t do it. We don`t know if that is why the bombshell came down today, Spears losing custody of her children.

We also have found out that she hasn`t had a valid driver`s license since 2001. Problem! I`m going to go straight back out to interventionist for A&E "Intervention" Ken Seeley. Ken, will an intervention help at this juncture?

KEN SEELEY, A&E "INTERVENTION": Yeah, Nancy, definitely it will help. You know, what`s upsetting me is hearing everyone discuss this is making it like, you know, everything is OK. Everything`s not OK with her. She`s got some serious mental and drug and alcohol problems. And coming in, the only one that I see that`s doing something healthy here is the judge, coming in and raising the bottom.

And we`re at a crucial time. I try to contact Kevin`s attorneys, because we`re at a crucial time where we could help save her. When those kids are taken out of that household on Wednesday, she`s going to be so vulnerable. That`s when we could get her and help save her life. So that`s what I`m hoping for, Nancy, is get the opportunity to save this young woman`s life and put all the other stuff aside.

GRACE: With us, Ken Seeley, interventionist for A&E`s "Intervention." I now want to go to Sharon Peters, she is a parenting coach, she`s worked with over 100 families. Spears ordered to parenting classes, called Parenting Without Conflict. How would that work, Sharon? What is it?

SHARON PETERS, PARENTING COACH: Oh, hi, Nancy. Well, basically, it would really benefit Britney at this stage. I mean, I think we all clearly know that she does not know how to parent. And it could be because of her own emotional issues and demons she`s facing, but, you know, having the children out late at night, not using a car seat, I mean, clearly, those are just basic parenting skills that most parents do.

So I guess what the judge really wants Britney to undergo is someone to go to her home, a parenting coach, and spend a couple of days. I mean, as far as I`m concerned, I would say Britney needs two weeks, someone live with her, and show her how to implement structure, boundaries, routine, consistencies, so these poor, innocent, young boys...

GRACE: Are not the victims.

PETERS: ... have some idea of what`s going on.

GRACE: ... are not the victims of poor parenting skills.

Out to Dr. Robby Ludwig, psychotherapist and host and author, Dr. Robi, do you think, had she not been music icon Britney Spears, she would have lost custody?

DR. ROBI LUDWIG, PSYCHOTHERAPIST: No, in fact, that could have helped her, her celebrity, because there`s some denial, "Hey, if she`s successful, how could she really be a bad parent?" And, also, you have to remember, in the court of law, there is a maternal preference. So for somebody to lose even temporary custody of their children means that they are really in bad shape.

My hope is that Britney, as a result of this, will hit her bottom, because she`s not going to be willing to get help until she hits that bottom. And I don`t know what that bottom is going to be for her. Hopefully she won`t have to die before she gets the proper help.

GRACE: Well, I know you`re concerned about Britney Spears, and I don`t want to see anything happen to her, but my big concern tonight, Pat Brown, are the children. Do you think that parents that are neglectful, Pat Brown, in your expertise, can ever be reformed?

PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER: Well, yes, Nancy, I do. I think if they decide that those children are worth it to them. And I think this is the whole thing the judge has done right. He`s put down a simple test, a very short test, not forever, not for the whole year, not for two years, but a short period of time, Britney act right, act like a mother caring about her children. And she flunked it dismally. So she didn`t put her heart where it should be, which is with her children, but more with just what her willfulness is and her own needs. So she`s proven that she doesn`t want to be a good mother at this point, but she could change that in the future and they`re giving her this opportunity.

GRACE: I want to thank Mike Walker with the "National Enquirer," Dayna Devon with "Extra." The rest of us will be all right back.

And when we come back, the manhunt for a suspect in the videotaped sex assault of a 3-year-old little girl. Plus, the man in possession of that tape back behind bars.




UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is it Chester Stiles on that tape?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s Chester Stiles on that tape. It is him.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How is this weighing on you, knowing that you`re the one who brought him to this apartment?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m disgusted. I`m ashamed. I`m embarrassed. I`m mortified. I regret every, every step I ever took. I feel bad for the baby.


GRACE: A 3-year-old little girl, not only molested repeatedly, but it`s caught on videotape, the molester apparently setting up a tripod there in a bedroom as he molested this little girl. The good news is, the little girl has been found alive, alive with her family. So how did she end up in the hands of a man already wanted for molesting another little, unrelated girl, just 6 years old at the time of that molestation?

To Dan Simon, CNN correspondent, Dan, explain to me this twisted series of events.

DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the woman you saw on that tape there, her name is Tina Allen, and she was in a 10-year relationship with the suspect in this case, Chester Stiles. Well, Tina Allen has two children in their 20s, and they live together in an apartment, and also living in that apartment you had the mother and this 3-year-old little girl. So Allen and Stiles, they would go over there, they would spend time in that apartment. Sometimes they would baby-sit.

So that`s how Stiles came to know this little girl. It`s not really clear how he was in a position to be alone with her. Some theorize that Tina Allen may have fallen asleep. I asked her about that. She`s really not sure, but she says it`s possible that she may have gone to run out an errand, and here`s Chester Stiles alone with this little girl. It`s just a tragic situation, Nancy.

GRACE: OK, Dan, you cut out on me at the very beginning. And I want to get the facts straight. This guy, Chester Arthur Stiles, age 37, was the boyfriend, I guess you could say, of Tina Allen, correct?

SIMON: That`s right. They were in a very long-standing relationship. You know, they worked at adjacent retail stores. They struck up a friendship. Tina Allen says she was really excited when Chester Stiles first asked her out. She thought he was handsome, 6`2", athletic. And, also, Tina Allen has five children, and she was very much looking for a father figure, somebody who could help her raise these children. She says Chester Stiles filled that role, actually, very well. In the beginning, she says, they had a very good relationship. The kids liked Chester Stiles. They would go to the park. They would go to restaurants. He was a good guy.

There were some warning signs, though, according to Tina Allen. A couple years in the relationship, she says Chester Stiles actually hit her. He thought that she may have been seeing another man. She did not file a police report. She says, now, looking back, that she was foolish that she stayed with this man for so long -- Nancy?

GRACE: With us, CNN correspondent, Dan Simon, Dan, so he is dating, being in the home with Tina Allen, with her five children. So where does a little 3-year-old girl fit in? It`s my understanding that the 3-year-old girl, the victim of this horrific sex assault, even the sheriffs in Vegas could not watch the video it was so bad, that the mom and the 3-year-old moves in with Tina Allen or they`re all in the same apartment, so he gets access to the 3-year-old girl, yes, no?

SIMON: That`s correct. You know, Tina Allen, she has a couple of children, and those two kids shared an apartment. And also living in that very crowded apartment was the mother and this 3-year-old girl. She had four people in living in one apartment and then, in a house a few miles away, you had Tina Allen and Chester Stiles. So it would not be uncommon, obviously, for Tina Allen to go visit her children and to take Chester Stiles with her. And so that`s how he came to know this little girl. And it was during one of these meetings, so to speak, where he allegedly took advantage and molested this little girl.

GRACE: You know what? To Pat Brown, there is no way that this was the first time that 3-year-old girl was molested. The girl showed no emotion whatsoever during the molestation, and it was full-blown molestation of every type, Pat, that you can imagine.

BROWN: I call it sexual assault, not molestation, which is oddly what we call it with children, this sex assault.

GRACE: Every type. Long story short, for him to have had time to set up a tripod, he didn`t just think that up that day, all right? And it`s there in the home. It`s in the home.

BROWN: Exactly. And this is one of the weird things that happens with young woman. For some reason, they do not understand the responsibility of taking care of their own children. You do not leave your children unattended with men in the home that you do not know, absolutely hands down trust. And that`s what often happens in these situations. They`re young. They`re foolish. They run around. They do what they want to. They say, OK, I`m going to go out for a couple hours, you can stay with my kids. It doesn`t really bother them. And yet this is the kind of thing that can happen, and it`s atrocious.

GRACE: Out to the Detective David Boruchowitz, the Nye County sheriff`s department. What`s disturbing me, Detective, is that now we learn there was already a warning on this guy for molesting a 6-year-old little girl. That, and I know we`re not releasing a lot of information on it, how it happened, but I can read the police report, Detective. And I see in the report that he had access to the child at night, according to this police report, which says to me he`s in that home, too.

DAVID BORUCHOWITZ, NYE COUNTY SHERIFF`S DEPARTMENT: Right. And that`s the concerning part is if, for these last couple years, he`s been out there free to do whatever he wants to do, and had he been picked up on that warrant initially, this, in theory, might not have happened.

GRACE: And, Detective, I was looking at it. That was December 2003 where he allegedly molested a little 6-year-old girl in her bedroom at night. That was practically 2004. That`s around the same time that this attack on a 3-year-old happened.

BORUCHOWITZ: Right, relatively the same exact time period.

GRACE: So, bottom line, tell me what we know, Detective, about him and about this guy who`s wandering the desert and "finds" the videotape.

BORUCHOWITZ: Well, Nancy, you know, to be honest you, at this point we know very little between the two of them. Obviously, that`s going to be a combined effort between myself and the detectives from the Las Vegas Metropolitan Police Department, is to put a tie between them. As we`ve stated from the beginning, that walking through the desert story just doesn`t cut it with us. And as the Las Vegas Metropolitan Police Department starts working on the sexual assault department of this, we`re certainly going to work hand in hand to ensure that, if there is a link, that it`s discovered and that Mr. Tuck is held accountable for any additional crimes that he may have committed.

GRACE: Take a listen to what Tuck had to say.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What did you think of the images on the tape?

MICHAEL TUCK, CLAIMS FOUND TAPE WHILE BIKING IN DESERT: Well, from the little that I`ve seen of it, it was hideous. It made me sick to my stomach.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you see the whole tape or just part of it?

TUCK: No, I didn`t. Just a very brief few minutes of it. And that`s what I needed. That`s all I needed to see.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And how did you come to have the tape?

TUCK: I came to get this tape while I was riding my bike through the desert one day, and I went to move a piece of board, and there it was, wrapped in a bag underneath the board.


TUCK: Then I took it home and later, you know, ended up viewing it. And, yes, it made me sick.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you involved in the making of this tape in any way, shape or form?

TUCK: No, no way, shape or form. All I did was find the tape and turn it over to the police. And now, you know, I`m catching all this heat. You know, like Mr. Stiles, I know you`re out there, and I know, not only are you hurting the two little girls that were on the tape, but it`s also hurting me, and, you know, you know what`s right, and I think you really should do what you need to do.


GRACE: If he`s so innocent, why did he go on the run, Dr. Robi Ludwig?

LUDWIG: You know what? I`m watching him. He doesn`t look so innocent to me. And I`m wondering, what is it that I`m sensing? I wonder if he`s involved in some type of pornography ring in some way. Because if I see a videotape that`s on the ground, I think to throw it out. I don`t take it home and view it. So there`s something that just doesn`t ring true about this man`s story.

GRACE: To Jon Leiberman, with "America`s Most Wanted," we`ve got two guys here at issue, Chester Arthur Stiles, age 37, the man, we believe, is in the video molesting the 3-year-old, who had a warrant for the very same thing at the time, and now we`ve got this other guy, Darren Tuck, we just heard from, age 26, who gives a statement and then goes on the run. He`s behind bars tonight.

What can you tell us, Jon Leiberman?

JON LEIBERMAN, CORRESPONDENT, "AMERICA`S MOST WANTED": Well, first of all, about Stiles, he`s a manipulator and a monster. He`s claimed to people he`s a Navy SEAL, he`s a survivalist. We do know and we have confirmed that he worked as an animal trainer for Siegfried and Roy for a short time in 2002 before he got fired.

But Stiles is a textbook pedophile. In fact, in the other case where he`s accused of molesting the 6-year-old, he tells that 6-year-old, according to court documents, "Don`t tell anybody about this or else you and I will never be able to do this again, and we`ll both be upset about that." I mean, that tells you all you need to know about him.

In terms of Darren Tuck, look, it appears that Tuck is a liar. Shortly before he sat down with "America`s Most Wanted," he failed a polygraph, failed a lie detector test with police, and shortly after the interview with us ended, he went on the run and was on the run for about 48 hours. So nobody`s saying Tuck had a role in making this tape or even that he was in the tape, but police say that he was showing this tape around for months before he came forward to police. So something doesn`t add up with Darren Tuck.

GRACE: Well, all I know is this, Mr. Leiberman. When I see a cop walking down Third Avenue, I don`t take off running, all right? There`s a reason you take off running when you see a cop or cops are talking to you or you fail a polygraph. There`s a reason for that. What is the reason? I don`t know yet, but we`re going to find out.

I want to go to Dr. Joshua Perper, medical examiner, expert in his field. Dr. Perper, full-blown sex attack. In every way you can imagine, Dr. Perper, on a 3-year-old child, what type of physical damage will that do to her? Is it permanent?

DR. JOSHUA PERPER, MEDICAL EXAMINER: Well, it depends on the type of the attack. There might be injuries to the genitalia. There might be injuries to the area of the anus. And there might be other injuries, if there were, for example, scars from bite marks, which aren`t likely, but injuries to the genitalia and anus are much more likely.

GRACE: Do you think that, even after this attack, as a little child she`ll be able to grow up and, say, have a family, or will she be forever unable to do that?

PERPER: Well, sometimes children block this kind of experience, and they remember later on, and this case it certainly was not very much imagination.


GRACE: Where is Chester Arthur Stiles, age 37, caught on video molesting a 3-year-old little child? I`m going to go back out to Dan Simon. What`s next, Dan Simon?

SIMON: Well, obviously, police are trying to determine the whereabouts for Chester Stiles, and everybody we`ve talked to says they`re going to have a tall order in trying to locate him. We`re told that he`s very much a survivalist, somebody who has lived in his car, somebody who could basically spend weeks in the mountains evading law enforcement if he wanted to. They`re talking to people like Tina Allen trying to see where he may go. At this point, they`ve been unsuccessful, Nancy.

GRACE: To Anne Bremner, what kind of time is he looking at if when he`s apprehended?

ANNE BREMNER, TRIAL ATTORNEY: Life, substantial time. It`s just a horrific crime. You talk about the most hated man in America in the last segment with Kevin Federline. I think he was the most hated rapper. The most hated man is right here.

GRACE: Agree, Kathleen Mullin, life?

KATHLEEN MULLIN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Yeah, I completely agree with Anne Bremner, as I usually do. He is the most hated man in America right now. If you are a thinking and feeling person, this is a repugnant, repellent accusation, and he`s going to have a lot of trouble.

GRACE: Let`s stop and remember Army Corporal William Warford III, 24, Temple, Texas, killed, Iraq. Receiving the National Defense Service Medal and the Army Service Ribbon, loved U of T Longhorns, Sundays in the park with family, giving candy and toys to Iraqi children, dreamed of being a cop, leaves behind his grieving parents, Jerry and William, widow, Shea, daughter, Abby, son, Anthony, sister, Crystal. William Warford, American hero.

Thank you for inviting us into your homes. And, tonight, a happy birthday to a Florida friend of the show, Jean. Happy birthday.

See you all tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.